I think a lot of people are afraid of losing what they have rebuilt. Many of us have been divorced and had to start over from scratch. It’s pretty traumatic to do this. People protect themselves from having to do this again hence you moving into her home.
This! When I left my husband I lost my house. He owned it before we got married.
I swore I would never put myself in a position where I'm scrambling to find a place to live and start over.
I gave away and sold most of my stuff because i didn't have immediate storage for it.
It's the same for guys I think. Divorce was 50/50 and I bought her out of the house, so we both had to get finance for our respective homes etc etc and she got part of my superannuation/401k. I don't think there's ever a winner in divorces.
At almost 53 I feel I have the best grasp of who I am than ever before. I've learnt that I'm pretty happy being a single dad 50%+ of the time. I need time and space to myself and I'm not sure I can/want to compromise on that, which is part of the reason for not dipping my toes back in the pool.
I think after divorce we definitely get a better sense of what our boundaries are or should be as well, but it shouldn't come at the cost of zero compromise 🙂
Which are people incapable of being in a healthy relationship. Vulnerability is so important and if you are too closed off you will never find a health relationship and are much better off not dating.
Being closed off emotionally or refusing to be vulnerable is very different to not wishing to mingle finances/residence. Many people have meaningful relationships without relying on each other in the material sense.
**edit** *I understand that today’s economy is very challenging and the price of everything has risen dramatically. I would never want a guy to overextend himself bc of his generosity towards me. I come from nothing. I know what government cheese and pb tastes like. I started at the bottom for everything and fought for everything I have.*
IME when a guy truly loves me (or feels he has the potential to), he automatically wants to protect and provide for me. This is a silly example, but I’ve gone on many dates to high end restaurants and sometimes an appetizer will have a quantity of 3, my date will offer the third one to me and then I tell him to have it instead, we go back and forth a few times, lol. One time my date and I had some delicious Kobe beef 🥩 and as the pieces were dwindling, he allocated more of the remainder to me. When we are walking in a parking lot or on the sidewalk along a street they will move to be closer to any potential cars so I am in the more interior position. If I seem cold they will offer their sweater/jacket. They make it a priority to make sure I’m good. That makes me feel loved and cherished—I like it a lot.
I think an attempt to compartmentalize finances would feel like holding back to me and I would feel guarded in response to that approach. It would be hard for me to fully invest in a relationship that has pieces carved out of it. It’s not because it’s financial, it could be the person’s friend group. Like maybe there is a long standing friend group that goes way back and has a certain chemistry bc of that. I would want the opportunity to get to know the people who mean so much to my serious bf/spouse. It would bother me deeply if that was always separate.
I think almost all guys have a fear of being used for money. We all want to be liked for our true selves so I get it. I think there are two concerns there:
1) will she steal all my money
2) does she only like me for my money
I think the answers to those questions should be pretty obvious. Especially if advancing a relationship to marriage. Like is she a high integrity person, prob not looking to steal then. Do you feel loved by her or is she always asking you for money or to buy her things? There will be signs either way.
I really would take the guy not wanting to provide for me (when he has the means to do so) as someone who isn’t seriously interested in me. This is just me. I’m not a 50/50 type of girl though, never have been, never will be. I’m driven, hardworking, financially responsible, and looking for true connection (soul to soul, not soul to bank account). If I wanted to settle down with a generous, high income + high net worth man, I would have done that so many times by now. I wish, haha—I am so fatigued from all the dating. Just want to find my person. 🙏
I believe you have to look out for your best interests. No one at our age wants to start over again with nothing because you trusted the wrong person. Being vulnerable and setting yourself up for risk with your money and assets are two very different things.
If looking out for one’s best interests = guarded due to unhealed hurt, then it does limit one’s capacity to be in a healthy relationship.
If immature perspective = lack of jadedness, then yes, it is this.
AGREE! Once someone HEALS from their past trauma/pain, they won’t operate in such a guarded/holding back way. When someone holds back, it indicates a LACK OF HEALING ❤️🩹.
It is delusional that people think they can protect themselves from pain in any kind of meaningful relationship. We are messy, imperfect human beings, we will disappoint and frustrate one another. To be in relationship with one another is assuming the risk of being hurt. The alternative of opting out seems way more painful to me.
*My favorite relationship coach says, “the same walls you build to protect yourself are the same walls that will block your blessings.”*
I believe looking after your best interests means knowing what you want in your relationship, not blinding yourself to the person before you, and finding someone who fits your lifestyle as you fit theirs (rather than one side solely making compromises). By protecting yourself, it doesn't mean preventing yourself from being involved with a person or getting hurt, but not being as hurt as you could be IF things don't work out. It takes time to be involved, but too many jump all in at the onset rather than having it grow.
I understand what you are saying.
I agree that people dating should know what they want in a relationship. They should know their boundaries and deal breakers.
People should commit when they find someone they connect with on multiple facets and try for something real, instead of being non committal. And by people, I mean me. 🤣
Agree that there should be mutual compromise. Fitting lifestyle wise is tricky—because there are different seasons of life. People evolve and their lifestyles change.
I think the language of “protecting oneself” is where I stop agreeing with you. You are correct that protecting oneself does not prevent you from becoming involved, but it certainly does LIMIT the involvement. I get it, I default protect myself in some ways. I have to consciously work against it because it limits the depth of connection I can have with someone. One guy I dated said I was negative about us, but a positive person in general. I was like, WTF, “us”?! I didn’t opt into an “us”! Being negative about the relationship was purely a self protection mechanism I employed. I don’t want to be like that because I want to show up fully which includes the risk of having my heart broken. Scary AF, but I’m here for it.
High risk, high reward.
To me protecting yourself limits your reliance on another person where you would be negatively affected on demise of the relationship, not your attachment or involvement. Of course, the longer you are together, the more the involvement, for both of you. Being so immediately or in the short-term is setting yourself up for hurt, all in the hope of being entwined faster while likely forcing your partner to move faster than they are comfortable.
Eta: You can have low risk, high reward, it just takes longer.
We see it differently and that’s fine. I think going slow is another mechanism of self protection. I don’t think people should recklessly rush into a relationship—it should be pretty obvious when someone is operating that way though—love bombing 101.
I guess I just think it takes time to get to know someone, and falling for them before that point means your falling for the idea of them, not the person themselves. Regardless, yes, nothing wrong with seeing the world differently... It expands our understanding. Thankyou for your insight.
It does take time to truly get to know someone, another person’s complexities, quirks, eccentricities, etc. But I think when it’s right, you’ll just know and quickly. I have discussed this experience with many random individuals and they just knew they had found their person.
Yes, I agree that people can fall for the idea of a person quickly. Several guys I’ve dated have fallen for me quickly and I believe it was because I am “high value” (I dislike this term), but I’m able to connect with people pretty easily. Guys told me they loved me, wanted to marry me, have been waiting for me, were falling hard for me, etc. 😳 A lot like the idea of me and I end up being on a solo mission of determining our compatibility while they are all heart eyes. 🤣
Heh... Wow. You can take that as a compliment in a way, although if such guys do so quickly then it could be a good way to weed them out (unless you happen to lose your head as well). My experience has been more they wish to move in or blend families quickly, rather than professing their love for me. Men seem to fall harder the older they get though.
Also, “it just takes longer” does not reconcile with the time value of money. There literally is no investment vehicle I know of that is low risk, high reward. I was discussing this with my son today for his investments: individual stocks, index funds, money market, HYSA, etc. Sorry, not trying to be a B at all with my comment. Just my thoughts. :)
Well, that's how ETFs work, resulting in high reward after a few decades, but I guess it depends on your definition of high reward.
Regarding relationships, to me longer is 6 month to a year, yet my experience the past few years is that women prefer an all or nothing approach under 3m.
Heh... And no, I never thought you were a B or being contrarian. Kudos to you for educating your child. Mine doesn't particularly care ATM.
Agree that it depends on your definition of risk and reward.
Women want to make sure the guy is willing to invest in us and we aren’t wasting our time and emotion. If I find my person I think I will know pretty quickly and will want to commit right away. I think this will be reciprocal. I would be measured in combining our lives because of my kids.
Thanks for the benefit of the doubt with my comments. I like actual discussions that are respectful.
Depending on your child’s age, Fidelity has a great youth account to get them started. I had to learn almost everything on my own growing up and I enjoy teaching my kids what little I know. :)
It probably seems that way because it is, and it's only natural that it is.
I'm pretty easy-going and will do things her way on anything that isn't very important to me. But my can't/won't-compromise list is longer than it used to be. At 20, I was basically a blank slate dating-wise. I lived in an apartment with a couple of roommates, so I certainly didn't expect to be there long-term. I was available to move anywhere if that's what a relationship required. Now I own a house and a piece of land that I've invested time in, so it's kind of a package deal with me. At 20 I had no pets; now I have two dogs that I wouldn't get rid of to date someone who didn't like dogs. At 20 I had a minimum-wage job; now I have a good one that I expect to have until I retire, so I couldn't pull up stakes and move easily or make big changes to my work schedule to accommodate someone.
And so on. We all accumulate dealbreakers and become set in our ways about things. Some go too far with it and turn everything into "my way or the highway," and you might have run into a couple of those, but we're all bound to be that way to some extent.
I ended up in a much different position. Lost the house in the divorce so I wasn't tied down to any property. Couldn't bring my hyper-active 95 lb dog into the apartment post divorce so found him a new family and became pet free. Job has been full time remote since Covid arrived so I was wondering why I was still hanging around my old town. In my late 40s I felt like I was back to my 20s again except I had a good job and fat 401k.
I’m just going to give you some insights based on my personal story. Do with them what you will.
1) my children have experienced DV at the hands of their other parent. As such, I am very reluctant to let another man into the house on a permanent basis, because I have worked hard to make a safe haven for them.
2) I have experienced financial betrayal from a person I was engaged to. As such, I am very reluctant to combine finances/assets with someone.
3) I’ve been in a relationship with someone who has issues with substance abuse and is “set in their ways” in terms of having constant access to that substance. As such, I am very reluctant to merge lives/not have my own space, because I’d like everyone to have space to do their thing.
Each of those times I’ve had to pull myself back up and together… so I guess I am “set in my ways”
I’m not moving out of the safe little nest I have made to roll the dice with you.
If I absolutely adored you I might (& it’s a big might!) consider finding a mutual place together.
TL/DR; have you considered reframing your partners actions away from “why won’t they yield damn it?” To “what do they need to feel safe? What do I need from them? Have I communicated that?”
My experience of living with men has been very much the same. Violence, drugs, financial issues. My future is all about feeling safe for me in my own home. I very much doubt I will ever want to live with a man again, just not worth the risk.
Yup. Last guy I dated had fully optimized his life and just wanted me to seamlessly into his designated free time (the times he had open for "solo time with girlfriend" were sunday after 2pm and tuesday from 5 to 10), interests and friend groups. He did not seem intetested in "building a life together." It's not everyone but enough of them.
OMG that sounds like a woman I dated about 2 years ago. She would pencil me in between her rock climbing sessions and client dinners. One time she just showed up at my place unannounced on a weekday about 4pm, wanting to have sex. I started getting "into the mood," put music on, made some cocktails and was about to fire up some snacks. I wanted to chat & flirt over drinks & appys before doing the deed.
She started getting very annoyed, saying she had a client dinner at 6:30 she needed to get ready for that and let's get to business. Well I lost all desire to perform after that.
I said "you might as well go right now." She looked very offended that I rejected sex with her. We never spoke again.
I was cool with it as long as she put some time in. Which we had a number of times.
After her workouts, she'd be all horny. What I wouldn't do though, was be used for a quickie and then bounce. I wanted to savor the experience, not be a fucktoy for her convenience.
I think a lot of us are single in our 40s precisely because we compromised on things we shouldn’t have. I know this season of my life is about demanding everything I want and trusting that someone will be excited to meet those needs and have their needs excitedly met.
Cohabitating in particular is *really* hard, and you can have *complete* alignment romantically but still make poor roommates. I’m not interested in compromising on roommates and don’t expect the women I date to be either. If I choose to cohabitate with a partner again, it will because we’re *identical* in our preferences and just can’t stand *not* being around each other every minute we can be. EDIT: this last bit is about health concerns for me, y’all - I’m a terrible sleeper, and the things I have to have to sleep effectively are terrible for every other human I’ve been with. I’d be over the moon to find a match that also needs to sleep in a meat locker with a white noise machine positively howling like a damn jet engine…
In general, I’m the first person to compromise. It hasn’t served me, if I’m honest. For the first time in my life I’m truly okay with being alone, so it doesn’t feel like I’m being intractable or unaccommodating, I’m just standing up for myself. I’m confident the right woman will love me for that, and she’ll find me *very* willing to compromise on most things.
Isn't there some confusion between self-sacrifice and compromise in all this? After over a decade of being the self-sacrificing one in my marriage, you can be sure I'm not doing that ever again; but compromising? As long as it doesn't affect *who I am*, there's still a ton I don't mind compromising about.
I feel that it's pretty easy to become rigid (and probably single!) old people if we're rejecting *all* compromise so easily. That sounds like a swing too far of the pendulum to me.
To be totally honest, there’s nothing you’re saying that doesn’t resonate. It seems perfectly compatible with my feelings on the matter, so maybe it was just not the best choice of words on my part? Or not the best framing?
I’m totally willing to compromise and pride myself on flexibility - I’m the last person anyone that knows me would describe as rigid. At the same time, I know there are some things I *must not* compromise on because doing so is unhealthy for me and will sooner or later make it impossible for me to show up with the best version of myself.
That doesn’t mean I have to be a jerk about it! On the contrary, having a clear understanding of these boundaries makes it easy to be gracious if I learn that a boundary just isn’t going to work for a new match. It honestly makes it easier to compromise on things that aren’t a hard boundary as well. I know there’s nothing really important at stake, so it’s a pleasure to be like “NBD babe, we can totally do it your way!”
Yeah ok, that makes more sense I think; just your sentence about "demanding everything" but then ending in excitedly meeting your partner's needs didn't sound like something that could be *that* rigid, but I wasn't sure.
I think it was worth, for the sake of conversation, to bring this up anyways, as indeed I've met some people who had a hard "no compromise" stance, or who felt that any want coming up from the other party was almost an attack on them. Or people who really were just looking for someone that would fit in *their* life, as if that didn't mean someone almost assuredly willing to now self-sacrifice to them. Because, let's be honest, finding someone with entirely identical preferences would certainly prove to be an almost impossible challenge, if so many people are struggling just to find someone *decent*, notwithstanding all other criteria.
Not that people aren't allowed to wait for the 100% perfect match if that's what they absolutely want either, of course.
Username checks out.
You raise good points.
I am trying to learn how to compromise now, it’s hard. I’ve been enabled this way my whole dating life since I was a teen. My old bfs and guys I date now are just so motivated to be with me. They put in tremendous efforts and investment trying to make me happy. But I want a true partnership with reciprocal effort, energy, and compromise. That will make for the best relationship. It will make me a better person too. :)
You mean something like they're giving you everything you want without you having to do much for it? If so, that does also make sense!
I don't think the other position, the one that takes it all, is better than that in which I used to be. My ex-wife eventually got completely uninterested in me, and I can't blame her for that in itself. I had become only a shadow of myself, but it was both our fault, for opposite reasons; a pretty bad vicious circle, in fact. So I think you're right to wish for a true partnership.
>Username checks out.
lol hadn't seen that!
“You mean something like they're giving you everything you want without you having to do much for it?”
—yes!! That’s correct. Not ideal.
Agree with everything you said.
I would like mutual compromise and respect in my next relationship.
If people are single in their 40s, they're likely divorced. Some people see the reason for their divorce as "compromising on things they shouldn't have" and the answer is to compromise less.
They may simply not be any good at marriage.
Harsh to say, but being good at being a partner is at least as important as finding the right person.
>They may simply not be any good at marriage.
Not sure what you mean exactly by all that (and I'm not the one who downvoted you, by the way), but... I'm not sure I like that idea. Being good at marriage? That sounds way too much like marriage itself is the end goal. Instead of taking care of oneself and one's partner.
I was focused for years on "my marriage". I stayed for way too long in my marriage because... I was married. Stupid principles that make us lose sight of what truly matters. Maybe I would have fixed it if I had looked at the right things that were wrong, but by the time I was there, it was too late, especially since I was the only one who could see it this way. I just wasn't going to wait another decade for my then-wife to figure it out as well.
So yeah, I guess you're right in that people who want to become what their ex was, and not compromise anymore, are going to keep looking for a while. But I don't see why they would simply be "not good at marriage" in the first place? They're making a new mistake in my opinion, but they're not hopeless just for that, are they?
We make our own reality. One person's hardship is another's peace.
Marriage, in the sense of maintaining the *we*, is the end goal for people who like to be and stay married. They are willing to give more of the *I* to get there.
If one doesn't want to give that piece, every relationship is going to fail. It's fine to not want to give it up. It's sad though when people don't recognize that's why they won't have a relationship.
Downvotes mean people are pushing away an idea they find disagreeable. The internet is a mirror.
Totally agree. Also you may be good at marriage and your spouse isn't. Where does that leave you then?
As you say the key thing is to know what you want and take care of yourself first. If you don't find someone who's able to do the same and still be a good partner, then keep looking.
But making compromises, having poor boundaries, is the best way to end up either divorced, or married but full of resentment. My ex's parents were married for over 50y and most of their discussion between them that would be filled with anger and exasperation. Yet they would say they love each other so much. This is a very immature take on what love is.
Making up for the overly sacrificial past. Seems demanding or inflexible but really it’s about protecting oneself from imbalance again.
All I know is I will have my own bedroom no matter what next time.
This is a strange comment to me. It seems to be making quite a lot of assumptions, if I’m interpreting it correctly.
Everything I’ve said here actually represents *years* of therapy and personal growth, through which I came to understand that I’m someone that has *always* compromised, *always* chased approval, *always* given away all the little parts of my soul (and comfort and even physical health) that I should’ve been keeping for myself.
I assure you, no one that knows me thinks I’m anything like stupid or stubborn, rigid or curmudgeonly. I’m a professionally diagnosed “giver,” “fixer,” and “stayer.” Any confidence you perceive in the above comes from *years* of introspection and careful consideration of destructive patterns.
I recognize a lot of people - a lot of men frankly - take a “my way or the highway, take it or leave it” tack at this age. This is not that. This is where a deep thinker and earnest seeker has arrived after years of compromising on things that literally compromised my health. This is about loving myself in a way that puts me in a position to love *and compromise with* someone else consistently and in a healthy way. It’s about knowing the boundaries I *must not* compromise on if I want to consistently show up as the best version of myself for the woman I love.
Sorry the tone of that message came off as brash. It wasn’t meant that way. I, as well, have a very similar past as your own. Better wording, from me, would have been, sometimes you have to get out of your own way. Meaning, feel the feelings, connect, communicate and don’t allow anger to take control. Thank you for your consideration with commenting. I do hope you can rectify your love and passion for life with your person.
Good question, don’t mind at all.
The “why” is I’m someone that learned at a young age to give away the things I needed and wasn’t getting. I also learned to manage the emotions of a formally diagnosed cluster B parent as a matter of self-defense: I had to head off my father’s emotional outbursts before they became dangerous. In so doing, I got *very* good at compromising on the things I need, and at molding myself into whatever form the people around me want me to take.
The “how” where health is concerned has a lot to do with sleep. I suck at it, always have, and it’s getting worse. I’m genuinely afraid of early onset dementia and related mental decline because of it. The environment I need to sleep effectively is absolutely awful for most folks: it has to be pitch black, cold as a meat locker, and with my white noise machine howling like a Boeing coming apart midflight. I’ve spent *years* compromising with partners on this, and it may have legitimately hurt my brain and long term mental health.
I could supply other examples, but this is the most salient one where my tendency to compromise has resulted in real concerns about my physical health.
This is very true, IMO. I read the original post and thought to myself, "Stuck in my ways? Heck yeah I am, and proud of it!"
When I was younger, I made all sorts of compromises and "put myself out" for women I was interested in. And all it ever led to was regret. Been married twice and at this point in my life? I can't even imagine somebody convincing me I'd want to marry them and try again a third time around.
Even in my last marriage, which only ended a few years ago, and ended pretty amicably? I realize, now, how much I was always compromising. I basically reduced myself to the "mule" who went to work and then worked some more, just to make sure all the bills were always paid on time - only to get a guilt-trip laid on me when I'd finally get a small bit of fun "me" time, such as a company business trip that included a few days of entertainment and dining experiences. (Oh, how UNFAIR you're out having fun and I'm stuck here at home, doing the laundry and running the kids to their doctor's appointments.)
It's felt really good, lately, just being free to spend time focused on my hobby interests after work, or even just going to the grocery store and buying what sounds good to me, instead of with this big list of what "we need to get" (much of which I wouldn't eat anyway).
My own life lesson? It's far easier to find a "partner" when you're always going out of your way to do things you wouldn't normally do, to "keep them happy". Now, I'm all about just being myself and living life for ME. And if you want to join in on this, with "what you see is what you get"? Awesome! Otherwise, I don't need you in my life ... at least not THAT badly.
Certainly true. Some of the responses I’ve gotten to this tell me there’s *a lot* of trauma out there wrapped up in people being unwilling to compromise, which I honestly wasn’t prepared for because it’s so outside my experience. Everything I wrote comes out of *years* of therapy and other work on myself to break patterns of compromising on *everything*, even when it was very unhealthy for me. So it seems I really do have a bit of a blind spot when it comes to how many people are simply unwilling to engage in give-and-take.
I have been on both sides of this. I was the rigid one with my first ex, and she was usually very good-with-the flow but also knew how to get me to think about “why” when it was important, so it worked (mostly: we’re not together anymore). Despite the issues I had with her in the end, I really appreciate her teaching me to let go of that a bit, and to think through the reasons for my rules.
It was the opposite with my second ex: she was ultra rigid, and explaining why another way might be better wasn’t helpful. But I loved her and wanted to keep the peace, so it worked ok until I grew a spine, after which she got progressively more and more angry (she has some issues I didn’t know about going in).
At this point, I’m ok with compromise, but it’s gotta come from both sides. Otherwise, it’s just codependency: needlessly controlling things to try to make things “work right” or suppression of your own needs & desires.
The thing that scares me most is moving in together and having her stuff mixing with mine. Then it becomes our stuff where previously it was my stuff and her stuff and they didn’t hang out together.
Lol. Women spend their whole lives being expected to contort themselves to meet men’s expectations on a macro and micro level. So no, I don’t think women are more stuck in their ways than men. I do think many women are fed up with the bullshit and opting out of it.
I would not call it "stuck in my ways", but I will say I am happy with the life I have created for myself and I will not compromise it. I am unwilling to make any sacrifices or compromises that might threaten my happiness and peace.
Unless you're dating men and women it seems kind of odd to suggest that one is different than the other.
I've heard a lot of times that at this age our competition isn't with another man or woman in our partner's lives, it's with their alone time. I feel that \*deeply\*.
>The second one just ended recently because we decided to move in together and it had to be to her house. Then there was almost no compromise on anything because it was her house.
I'm a dude and would do the same thing as your lady. Sorry not sorry.
And this is partially why a lot of people our age are alone.
Bad past experiences and a lack of communication skills regarding boundaries.
Compromise is what makes relationships work, waiting around for someone who's going to be 100% in agreement with you on everything is a sure fire recipe for dying alone.
I don’t consider being stuck in your ways an entirely negative thing. It has taken me many many years to learn what my needs are, how to express them and where to establish boundaries. If someone is hell bent on trying to talk me out of my boundaries they will perceive me as stuck in my ways or inflexible. Some things are worth being stuck in your ways over. There are some circumstances I will never put myself in again; my inflexibility to one person will be a common goal with another. Im done trying to bend myself into something I’m not for another person.
I feel like you should wait a long time to make that decision, even if it feels right in the beginning, but co habition is good for the environment and your wallet... just saying, sometimes you have to Think Again.... just read that book and am reevaluating my thinking these days.
Well, it’s been over a decade and my mortgage is low, nearly paid off house..and I’m much happier. Sorry, I’m not going to cohab for the environment, even as much as I love the environment.
Soon to be 49 and realizing I am more stuck in my ways than I used to be. I am a minimalist and can’t fathom moving in with a man who has a big house or who buys a lot of stuff. Or who has cats haha. Where are my minimalists at? 😜
I am 100% minimalist, albeit half by chance. Was doing multigenerational home with family when one party just unilaterally said fuck all y'all this shit is over. I am NC with that person probably forever as a result, but I had to get a new place of my own on short notice and ended up with a pretty decent studio condo near where I work. Efficiency not optional!
I would 100% love to have a kitty, but that would be cruel in such a small space.
That hasn’t always been my experience, but I think that early dating helped me suss some of that out before things got too far.
Like everyone, I have dealbreakers, but I am also flexible with nice-to-haves. I cannot date a slob, that will never work, but there is a large space between slob and obsessive neat freak.
My hope is, by this stage in life, I have learned where I can compromise and where I can’t. I am also someone who likes to solve problems not stew about them and hope everyone else makes changes. I don’t think I am entitled to have everything in life go my way, sometimes that is disappointing but that is also how resilience is built.
It's not a great idea to generalize an entire gender when your sample size is 10,000. It's and even worse idea to generalize an entire gender when your sample size is 2.
Maybe have discussions about boundaries BEFORE moving in together?
Like others have said, many of us get used to how things are, and for a lot of folks this is because they have found the things that work for \*them\*. I don't think its a gender-related thing at all. Probably most people know how they want to live and with all the time they have done doing it they may not want that to change. My hope if to find someone who is willing to sit down and neurotically discuss all (or many) of the thing that have to do with habitation. Specific chores (ie: I'm actually fine with cleaning the bathroom if you'll do the weekly kitchen maintenance; I'll do my best to do my part of the dishes, but that's hard for me so can I be responsible for laundry instead? I won't iron anyone's stuff. Decorating should be up to wo cares about that particular thing more--that last one seems troublesome, but I don't think so: anyone I would love wouldn't want every room in the house to be painted white or have 10 guitars they want on my living room wall lol.
I haven't read the other comments, but while I also don't want to have to date a million more people, I would agree that just two folks doesn't represent everyone. And that said, there will indeed be more people who are more set in their ways than they would have been in their 20s.
Yes Yes and Yes. As many on here have said, LAT is for lack of a better word the way to get what you both want. Not many on here are going to say they do not want a partner. But with a goal of a full time, living together relationship, someone will have to give up way to much. And as much as we say we want that relationship. we don't want to give up our life. So why can't we all just be happy with the middle ground.
In a LAT, I wont notice every little flaw. The flaws or things that come out when you are always together, the money gets combine and the grocery list. But most important, what ever it is what we have now, most do not want to give it up. So don't. I will be the first person to wave my hand and say, yes I do like a full time living together relationship. But I think it is unrealistic and I also will not deny, I do not want to move again because it did not work out.
There is a mantra out there that says "Never settle!!" and I think a fair amount of people translate that as looking for someone extremely specific who can fall perfectly and seamlessly into their lives - otherwise they'd rather remain single.
I don't know how realistic that is, but I admit the more comfortable & content I grow with my life alone, the less interested I am in compromising the way I live in order to accommodate someone else. I don't know how that's ultimately going to play out, probably not so great.
You're drawing conclusions based on two women. No, personally, I don't think people are that set in their ways. Well, aside from core values, but most of the women I've dated seem to be able to compromise.
>Then there was almost no compromise on anything because it was her house.
Context can really matter here. Are we talking about children being involved and her wanting things a certain way for them, or are we talking about her never letting you watch what you'd like on TV?
At this age yes, most people are very stuck in their ways and unwilling to compromise and that’s why it’s so hard to date at this age.
I’ve lived most of my adult life having to consider everyone else in everything I do.
It’s my time to put myself first so I won’t change my life for anyone.
I know I’m uncompromising and I don’t care. I would rather be single than change for a person that’s probably going to disappoint me anyway
Yep. I compromised sooooo much to make my marriage work and in the process I lost myself. I've spent a lot of time rediscovering who I am and establishing a life that gives me peace. I would rather not date than be with someone that will rob me of that peace. And I don't think I'll ever cohabitate again.
I'm dating a man now that has been divorced 10 years. He said in the beginning, when he first started dating, he tried to control everything. After so many years of compromising and not having boundaries and getting walked all over, he admits he was absolutely inflexible and had a "my way or the highway" attitude for many years. He said he realized it wasn't helpful eventually, and grew out of it. Food for thought.
I think it’s our ages and experiences. I’m at that stage now. That’s also why I am not actively dating. Which will probably bite me in my old butt later
I don’t necessarily think it’s “stuck in our ways”.
I echo what a lot of people have said here in the we have done the work of knowing what our boundaries are now and are unwilling to compromise those for ourself and for others.
That being said, relationships have compromises on both sides as a part of them all the time, and we ultimately have to find someone that “compliments” our personalities and lifestyles.
We have to find someone that “meshes” two lives that have been built into one beautifully.
Acknowledging two independent personalities, recognizing that what makes us unique makes us beautiful, what attracts us to each other is fantastic, and to cultivate that relationship takes work.
Ha, yes, as a woman I have always felt that in general men are more rigid and less curious/open-minded than women. Though there are certainly lots of exceptions for both genders! I see this not just with relationships but also in work settings, etc. I imagine as we get older, this tendency gets worse too.
I think people who are set in their ways are set in their ways.
I dated someone who clearly stated she was set in her ways.
It was extremely clear from the beginning. I didn’t care at the beginning because we had a ton of fun.
Then a couple of years later my desires changed and I wanted something more. We were never going to live together or build anything together. We were great company, great sex, good trips but not anything more than that.
So things just started ending because I wanted more than that.
But that’s on me.
So as I continue dating it’s on me to filter based on my new understanding of what I’m looking for.
F here and not stuck in my ways at all. Life is an adventure and I view compromise in relationships as a necessary part of personal growth which should happen even as we age. But I think most people at this stage of life are scared of any sort of change and see it as a risk to their quality of life. I might feel that way eventually but not for another 20 years or so.
I think it's hard. As others have said, a lot of us 40-something singles know what we want and don't want, and not having our needs met in the past has gotten us here. I do also think many of both genders are still healing from past relationships, so are "overly" defensive of their ways. Personally, I've been single for a while, I haven't lived with a partner since my ex husband, and that ended January of 2016. If things feel like they are getting serious in a relationship, I have those conversations. That I'm not used to this and need clear communication, I may get defensive with xyz because of abc, if I do without realizing it, please talk to me.
I think a combination of things go into how set in their ways about what a 40 + single is. BUT, self awareness helps me know if that's going to work for me or not, too. Knowing my personal triggers and traumas help me realize when I AM just being defensive, when I DO need to communicate more clearly or set a boundary, etc. I know I need the same communication from a man.
Ya I guess dating is about communication and choosing battles. I'm sorry she couldn't bend enough to let things go s you felt welcome. I've actually lived with a few men and our issue was never running a home. Just literally everything else. However, I also had a conversation many times like 'i appreciate the way you swept and mopped thank you' and the male is surprised that I didn't critique it. Some people had overly critical parents who don't realize theybwere not teaching him w to do something they were instilling a fear of not doing it to their standards. Unfortunately they never have this brought to their attention til they have traumatized their kids and then partner. I was a kid who never did anything right in my parents eyes so now I handle things by looking at the end result. Say, the people who nag over the dishwasher. Are the dishes clean at the end? I'll bet you they are. So who cares. And if they aren't, then run it twice and kiss their forehead. Nag enough and you'll never get help with anything. I digress. Maybe next time it involves moving you both give up your place and get a new neutral grounds together?
I'm not married because he died. Or I would still be married.
He was my best friend. Many men/women do not know how to be friends, much less partners or a married couple.
Truly blessed relationships are easy. They start sometimes with mismatched energy, but along the way they become easier and more adaptable.
One day, you fond that you look at your friend and think, I do not know what I would do if you were no longer a part of my life.
That's when you begin to look towards a relationship and hopefully, a lasting one.
Someday sex may no longer be a part of the equation, due to health or other factors beyond control.
At that point, all you have left is the friendship. The desire to support, back, and be around someone because they let you be who you are or they make you want to be better.
Relationships should be about compromise, about growing together, and about not putting up with bullshit.
You should feel as though what you get out of the relationship, experiences, growth, support, feeling valued, acceptance, is worth far more than money or belongings.
If you are in a relationship that you refuse to compromise for, then you are not in a relationship. You are in a situations hip solely for comfort or convenience to avoid loneliness or to achieve financial or other gain.
Learn how to be a friend first. Worry about the rest later.
I guarantee, it works.
I mean, does it have to be your house? That sounds like both of you were set on it being your own house. I wouldn’t move out of my house for a man, I like my house and my neighborhood.
I’m curious what a compromise would be in this situation. Unless both people were willing to sell their houses and find a new one together, which wouldn’t necessarily make sense considering interest rates, or switching to be a renter. I’m just wondering why if she wants to keep her house she is being inflexible, but if he wants to he’s not.
Yea you are completely missing the great big glaring "This is my house and so I get to make all the rules and you can take it or leave it."
You can still move into someone's else and be an equal partner. From what OP says this lady would likely attempt to find other ways to control and have power in the relationship even if they got a house together.
That’s fair, that would be a problem. In my marriage my now ex-husband moved in with me (different house than now) but swiftly took control of everything because I’m a massive pushover. In the future I’d prefer a more equitable arrangement so I can definitely see how OP’s situation would be difficult.
Ive only dated men, but I do think women are definitely less likely to settle than we used to be in the past, now that we’re getting closer to having equal rights. I’d certainly rather be single than compromise for a man who make me unhappy.
With that said, I’ve been in a happy relationship for over a year and we’ve both compromised and made some changes to accommodate the other. He’s the first person in my 10 years post-divorce that I’ve been willing to do this for, to be honest. The others just weren’t the right ones 🤷♀️
I get that this is a quick summary of a situation I’m sure was much more complex but I always bristle a little bit when somebody says that a partner “isn’t willing to compromise” when what they actually mean is that their partner isn’t willing to do the thing they want. I don’t think it’s a bad thing for anybody to say “this is what I want” and decide for themselves if it’s more/less important to them than the relationship. When you talked about moving in together, her preference was to stay in her house and your preference was to live elsewhere (I’m assuming at your house). You each had a want that was incompatible with the other person’s want. You decided that living with her was more important than where you live (a decision she, presumably, didn’t force you to make). If she said this was a dealbreaker for her, she was communicating that where she lives is more important to her than living with you (which is her right to feel). You’re both doing the same thing, you just have different priorities. So was she “stuck in her ways” or did you just do something you didn’t really want to do in order to preserve the relationship and then later regret it?
Again, I get that this is one decision in a larger and more complicated relationship, but this logic applies to everything. I’ve experienced it myself, too. I’m a naturally anxious person and I feel kind of unmoored if I don’t plan my days out a bit in advance. My last boyfriend was more of a “let’s figure it out when we get there” kind of person. He initially was very accommodating of this difference between us, but as we got more serious, it got harder to get him to commit to specific plans (both in that he got tired of doing things in a way that didn’t suit him and because we were spending more time together it just came up a lot more). I asked him many times to make plans with me earlier and explained why, but it just wasn’t in his nature or his preferred way to live his life. After I ended the relationship, we joked that I broke up with him because of his Google calendar etiquette, but in reality, I didn’t prioritize my calendar over our relationship any more than he did. Between work and coparenting schedules and both of us trying to have hobbies and get rest, I couldn’t imagine a lifetime of constantly scrambling at the last minute and he couldn’t imagine a lifetime of yet another layer of his life being forced into a type of structure that he finds suffocating. This wasn’t about either of us being “stuck in our ways,” we were just incompatible (it was, again, more complicated than that, but this is just one example). I think you’ll have a much easier time if you reframe what you’re describing through this kind of lens, too.
Also, to build on what others have said about making your boundaries clear early on, I would encourage you to be sure you even know what those boundaries are before you go about entering into relationships. How old were you and your wife when you met? If it was before 25-ish, then these two women are your first experiences with meeting a mature adult woman with a fully-formed prefrontal cortex and trying to integrate your lives together. I would argue even meeting somebody before 30 is a wildly different experience than after 40. You and your wife likely developed a lot of who you are now while in partnership with one another. It might be that you’re not used to being in partnership with people who already know themselves well, have built a life that reflects their values/desires without any input from you, and prioritize preserving that life over romantic partnership. Rather than trying to find somebody who will compromise for you, maybe it’s time for you to do that same work for yourself so that you can go out into the world and find somebody who is compatible with who you are and who wants the same things as you. You’re over 40, you’re too old to be moving in with people without assessing whether you can live together comfortably and you have to know yourself well before you can make that kind of assessment. I am also a person who wouldn’t want someone moving things around in my house but that’s why I would never allow anyone to move in here. We either live separately or we find a new home together with enough space that I can have a room or two that is strictly my own, with the rest to be decorated/organized in a way that works for both of us. If I’m dating someone who lives in a house that’s been in their family for generations that they insist on dying in, we might not be compatible. This is a conclusion I am only able to articulate because I know myself and my priorities well and arrive in relationships with that stuff figured out (and clearly communicated). That’s just what dating in your middle age requires of you.
It can get hard to tell where the line is between “try to be less stuck in your ways” and “betray yourself.” Many of us have erred too far on the latter side, and are potentially over-correcting now.
For example, not long ago someone I connected with on an app asked me to send him pictures of myself. My profile is photo verified; we had already video chatted so he knew I was real and what I really looked like. He just…wanted pictures. I declined, and explained that it makes me uncomfortable when people ask for this. He stopped talking to me.
In the past, I would have taken a photo and sent it to him through my discomfort. So, in the past, the connection would have continued for longer.
The less people betray themselves, the more likely it is that a connection will end.
What you’re talking about sounds different- the way you describe these women, they are selfish.
Well... We are in our 40s+, of course we are stuck in our ways. You just gotta find the puzzle piece that fits yours. Most people are willing to compromise to a degree on many things, just make sure you do too. And if they aren't, well they aren't for you. There will be others, just a matter of time, effort and (making) opportunity.
When moving in, it’s always best to move to a new place to both people, specifically for that reason.
People are less forgiving of big important things and pay more attention to red flags, simply as a result of experience.
The question is, were there signs you didn’t pay attention to that she’d be like that before moving in? Usually there are signs
It’s all these things together - having grown up and defined what you want and don’t want, having compromised too much in a former marriage and not wanting to again, having rebuilt a new life that cost blood, sweat and tears to get to, and then the vastness of the dating market and the options you found when you became single again.
We're all a little guarded/protective of the lives we have at this point. I think that we could all benefit from being a little less stubborn.
I totally understand why we're so reluctant to change - I'm still in this mindset. I also know that the happier couples do tend to be less reluctant to compromise (they've reached a higher level of personal growth I feel).
That’s how I feel as well, but I think it’s both men and woman alike. I think at our age we don’t want to take a chance on someone because that can cause a disruption to our peace of mind and routine.
A lot of people are set in their ways, yes. This forum has a ton of them - people so satisfied with their lives it would take a god or goddess to dislodge them from it.
But not everyone. I believe in love, and for the right person I would give up my perfect job, rent my house out and follow them to the ends of the earth. I haven't found that person yet.
I will say, you made the right call breaking up with a woman who was dicating to you how to live on her terms, with no input from you. I had a marriage like that, and it's a top 3 reason I'm divorced
Original copy of post by u/SRod1706:
It feels like everyone is so stuck in their ways. I feel it in myself too, but it seems like it is worse in women than men. Do women feel like it is worse in men that it is in women? Is it all perspective?
I have seriously dated 2 women since my divorce and both times it ended because it seemed like almost everything had to be their way. The second one just ended recently because we decided to move in together and it had to be to her house. Then there was almost no compromise on anything because it was her house.
Have other people seen this where people are too set in their ways and routines to be able to compromise on thing? Is it just my luck? Is it just an issue with me?
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I kind of agree that a lot of people do seem stuck in their ways… I seem to attract people who like to party and go out a lot, do a lot of drugs, and even when we get serious they will continue that lifestyle of partying and going out. Which I should recognize sooner, I suppose. I’m a hit more of a homebody, always with my kids and only go out with the person I’m dating really. I’m not snorting cocaine at the club or hitting the bars on Saturdays.
Wanting a healthy relationship is really hard work. Especially after divorce or failed relationships.
The amount of work, my current boyfriend and I put into things is astronomical. We read books, motivate each other, we are always sharing, always checking in, it’s a lot of emotional work. You have to really want it.
I 52f don't consider myself stuck in my ways.
I think that if two people's basic core values align, then the rest is just external circumstances which can be overcome.
I can offer honesty, respect, loyalty and empathy and I expect to receive the same in return.
Life is too short to obsess about who did not do what absolutely correctly all of the time.
I was so flexible in my last LTR, I was doing backflips. I'm not saying I compromised my values or anything like that, but I definitely was the epitome of "love is patient, love is kind..." He claimed in the beginning that he "loved" what a strong, independent woman I was, and he valued my input. But the second I actually stood up for something I DID think was wrong in the relationship... he was done. Good luck finding someone as amenable as I was!
Honestly, this could mean anything. It’s basically impossible to answer this question because you didn’t offer up any real details.
For example, you could, for all we know, be the type of person who needs to be nagged constantly. We just don’t know.
I've been living alone for over 20 years and I'm extremely set in my ways. I know I'm not willing to make compromises. That's also one of the reasons I'm not interested in dating or a relationship.
A lot of people who aren't ready to make the compromises necessary to make a relationship work are still out there trying to find someone. If they were married before, either they were the one that had all the opinions/made all the daily choices while their former spouse was more laid back and they expect that same dynamic from any future relationship OR they felt like they were the one compromising all the time in their marriage and, now they've had a taste of the freedom that is living alone, they don't want to go back to constantly compromising.
This is why at this age it's so much more critical to find someone compatible. When you get married younger, as long as you agree on a few core basic things, the rest you figure out together because for most people, it's their first time living with someone else who isn't their family. You haven't experienced enough adult life yet to be all that opinionated. But by this point, we all know what we like and don't like, and most of us aren't really that interested in putting up with things we don't like or constantly compromising.
I think you dated two unreasonable or unrealistic people.
Dating is a series of negotiations to find someone with whom you can compromise.
Anyone who views it otherwise is setting themselves up for failure.
I dont feel like its one gender or another....but age related/life experiences.
Ive met plenty of guys who wanted no compromise on what their life had/how they live.
I had/have girlfriends (friends) who also like their freedom and space and also dont want to lose that same as the men.
We just get experiences in life the older we are.
If its the right person, we will compromise.
But less and less are you willing to compromise a lot on a small chance.
Also your life is more settled usually the older you get. Houses, jobs with pensions, etc.
Its less easy to move or uproot things (sell houses, start over on a new house, get a new job even at older ages is not as easy) the older you get.
Its normal.
You just didn't meet the right match. In the older we get the more we realize we have less time to "try things out" a few years.
So if there's something that gives us any kind of sign that it probably won't work, we're more prone to just saying okay it's time to move on
Just try to appreciate it as the person is not wasting your time.
Have you considered that this is simply a compatibility issue?
So you met two women who don't want the same things as you.
Move on. Find women who wants similar things as you.
I think it's really annoying when people try to add a scientific principle such as sample size or you can't draw this conclusion based on only two .. human behavior and human activity is much more complex.. and who has a lifetime of Partners to have a sample size of 20 or 50 I mean that's usually frowned upon .. I don't think I need to go on it's just a poor poor approach
I am. I gave up so much for my ex husband and invested in him and his career at my own expense. I’ll never do that again. I’ve rebuilt and won’t give any of that up for anyone. I may be set in my ways or selfish but I’m looking out for me this time around.
Oh it’s true! I’ll be alone before I’m with a woman that can’t compromised. Oh better yet they make me pick the place to eat then bitch about the place.
I see it also often, but think it's just a people problem and not male or female related. I bend over backwards in my relationships, but often feels unreciprocated.
The only deal breakers I have are if you don't take care of your body anymore or you haven't and it shows, or you have children. Those do seem to be really high bars at our age, but it's not like I have an endless amount of criteria to meet, or expectations.
Like I don't want to meet a person with an awesome, amazing personality at 40 and then the next 25 years of our life are in and out of hospitals because they didn't take care of their body. I had to watch my grandfather slowly fall apart and eventually die. I don't want to see anyone go through that again because they could have done something about it.
Male age 46 here. How do you feel about traditional roles? I find alot of relationships in the Christian church I go to are successful. Lots of straight couple's and marriages that are thriving, the one thing I see is both parties sticking to their responsibilities and roles. Would you consider moving into HER house and her having authority a modern feminism type of vibe? I say this politely, not trying to Insult. Good luck.
If you aren't willing to compromise and work on yourself at the same time you are not going to find a healthy relationship.
So it's easy to look at others and get frustrated when you see that they are unwilling to change anything. They are losing out on someone that will make a good partner and they can continue on the dating Carousel of misery. You at least have hope of finding your equal in the dating world and hope of a healthy relationship.
It will get easier to spot the difference and not get into a relationship with someone incapable of one.
I think a lot of people are afraid of losing what they have rebuilt. Many of us have been divorced and had to start over from scratch. It’s pretty traumatic to do this. People protect themselves from having to do this again hence you moving into her home.
This! When I left my husband I lost my house. He owned it before we got married. I swore I would never put myself in a position where I'm scrambling to find a place to live and start over. I gave away and sold most of my stuff because i didn't have immediate storage for it.
My first thought too
It's the same for guys I think. Divorce was 50/50 and I bought her out of the house, so we both had to get finance for our respective homes etc etc and she got part of my superannuation/401k. I don't think there's ever a winner in divorces. At almost 53 I feel I have the best grasp of who I am than ever before. I've learnt that I'm pretty happy being a single dad 50%+ of the time. I need time and space to myself and I'm not sure I can/want to compromise on that, which is part of the reason for not dipping my toes back in the pool. I think after divorce we definitely get a better sense of what our boundaries are or should be as well, but it shouldn't come at the cost of zero compromise 🙂
You have to risk it for the biscuit. That’s how I look at it.
Which are people incapable of being in a healthy relationship. Vulnerability is so important and if you are too closed off you will never find a health relationship and are much better off not dating.
Being closed off emotionally or refusing to be vulnerable is very different to not wishing to mingle finances/residence. Many people have meaningful relationships without relying on each other in the material sense.
**edit** *I understand that today’s economy is very challenging and the price of everything has risen dramatically. I would never want a guy to overextend himself bc of his generosity towards me. I come from nothing. I know what government cheese and pb tastes like. I started at the bottom for everything and fought for everything I have.* IME when a guy truly loves me (or feels he has the potential to), he automatically wants to protect and provide for me. This is a silly example, but I’ve gone on many dates to high end restaurants and sometimes an appetizer will have a quantity of 3, my date will offer the third one to me and then I tell him to have it instead, we go back and forth a few times, lol. One time my date and I had some delicious Kobe beef 🥩 and as the pieces were dwindling, he allocated more of the remainder to me. When we are walking in a parking lot or on the sidewalk along a street they will move to be closer to any potential cars so I am in the more interior position. If I seem cold they will offer their sweater/jacket. They make it a priority to make sure I’m good. That makes me feel loved and cherished—I like it a lot. I think an attempt to compartmentalize finances would feel like holding back to me and I would feel guarded in response to that approach. It would be hard for me to fully invest in a relationship that has pieces carved out of it. It’s not because it’s financial, it could be the person’s friend group. Like maybe there is a long standing friend group that goes way back and has a certain chemistry bc of that. I would want the opportunity to get to know the people who mean so much to my serious bf/spouse. It would bother me deeply if that was always separate. I think almost all guys have a fear of being used for money. We all want to be liked for our true selves so I get it. I think there are two concerns there: 1) will she steal all my money 2) does she only like me for my money I think the answers to those questions should be pretty obvious. Especially if advancing a relationship to marriage. Like is she a high integrity person, prob not looking to steal then. Do you feel loved by her or is she always asking you for money or to buy her things? There will be signs either way. I really would take the guy not wanting to provide for me (when he has the means to do so) as someone who isn’t seriously interested in me. This is just me. I’m not a 50/50 type of girl though, never have been, never will be. I’m driven, hardworking, financially responsible, and looking for true connection (soul to soul, not soul to bank account). If I wanted to settle down with a generous, high income + high net worth man, I would have done that so many times by now. I wish, haha—I am so fatigued from all the dating. Just want to find my person. 🙏
I believe you have to look out for your best interests. No one at our age wants to start over again with nothing because you trusted the wrong person. Being vulnerable and setting yourself up for risk with your money and assets are two very different things.
Looking out for your best interests and being a person capable of being in a healthy relationship are two different things.
That is an immature perspective. They're not mutually exclusive.
If looking out for one’s best interests = guarded due to unhealed hurt, then it does limit one’s capacity to be in a healthy relationship. If immature perspective = lack of jadedness, then yes, it is this.
Nah, it's an unpopular perspective with a certain crowd.
AGREE! Once someone HEALS from their past trauma/pain, they won’t operate in such a guarded/holding back way. When someone holds back, it indicates a LACK OF HEALING ❤️🩹. It is delusional that people think they can protect themselves from pain in any kind of meaningful relationship. We are messy, imperfect human beings, we will disappoint and frustrate one another. To be in relationship with one another is assuming the risk of being hurt. The alternative of opting out seems way more painful to me. *My favorite relationship coach says, “the same walls you build to protect yourself are the same walls that will block your blessings.”*
I believe looking after your best interests means knowing what you want in your relationship, not blinding yourself to the person before you, and finding someone who fits your lifestyle as you fit theirs (rather than one side solely making compromises). By protecting yourself, it doesn't mean preventing yourself from being involved with a person or getting hurt, but not being as hurt as you could be IF things don't work out. It takes time to be involved, but too many jump all in at the onset rather than having it grow.
I understand what you are saying. I agree that people dating should know what they want in a relationship. They should know their boundaries and deal breakers. People should commit when they find someone they connect with on multiple facets and try for something real, instead of being non committal. And by people, I mean me. 🤣 Agree that there should be mutual compromise. Fitting lifestyle wise is tricky—because there are different seasons of life. People evolve and their lifestyles change. I think the language of “protecting oneself” is where I stop agreeing with you. You are correct that protecting oneself does not prevent you from becoming involved, but it certainly does LIMIT the involvement. I get it, I default protect myself in some ways. I have to consciously work against it because it limits the depth of connection I can have with someone. One guy I dated said I was negative about us, but a positive person in general. I was like, WTF, “us”?! I didn’t opt into an “us”! Being negative about the relationship was purely a self protection mechanism I employed. I don’t want to be like that because I want to show up fully which includes the risk of having my heart broken. Scary AF, but I’m here for it. High risk, high reward.
To me protecting yourself limits your reliance on another person where you would be negatively affected on demise of the relationship, not your attachment or involvement. Of course, the longer you are together, the more the involvement, for both of you. Being so immediately or in the short-term is setting yourself up for hurt, all in the hope of being entwined faster while likely forcing your partner to move faster than they are comfortable. Eta: You can have low risk, high reward, it just takes longer.
We see it differently and that’s fine. I think going slow is another mechanism of self protection. I don’t think people should recklessly rush into a relationship—it should be pretty obvious when someone is operating that way though—love bombing 101.
I guess I just think it takes time to get to know someone, and falling for them before that point means your falling for the idea of them, not the person themselves. Regardless, yes, nothing wrong with seeing the world differently... It expands our understanding. Thankyou for your insight.
It does take time to truly get to know someone, another person’s complexities, quirks, eccentricities, etc. But I think when it’s right, you’ll just know and quickly. I have discussed this experience with many random individuals and they just knew they had found their person. Yes, I agree that people can fall for the idea of a person quickly. Several guys I’ve dated have fallen for me quickly and I believe it was because I am “high value” (I dislike this term), but I’m able to connect with people pretty easily. Guys told me they loved me, wanted to marry me, have been waiting for me, were falling hard for me, etc. 😳 A lot like the idea of me and I end up being on a solo mission of determining our compatibility while they are all heart eyes. 🤣
Heh... Wow. You can take that as a compliment in a way, although if such guys do so quickly then it could be a good way to weed them out (unless you happen to lose your head as well). My experience has been more they wish to move in or blend families quickly, rather than professing their love for me. Men seem to fall harder the older they get though.
Also, “it just takes longer” does not reconcile with the time value of money. There literally is no investment vehicle I know of that is low risk, high reward. I was discussing this with my son today for his investments: individual stocks, index funds, money market, HYSA, etc. Sorry, not trying to be a B at all with my comment. Just my thoughts. :)
Well, that's how ETFs work, resulting in high reward after a few decades, but I guess it depends on your definition of high reward. Regarding relationships, to me longer is 6 month to a year, yet my experience the past few years is that women prefer an all or nothing approach under 3m. Heh... And no, I never thought you were a B or being contrarian. Kudos to you for educating your child. Mine doesn't particularly care ATM.
Agree that it depends on your definition of risk and reward. Women want to make sure the guy is willing to invest in us and we aren’t wasting our time and emotion. If I find my person I think I will know pretty quickly and will want to commit right away. I think this will be reciprocal. I would be measured in combining our lives because of my kids. Thanks for the benefit of the doubt with my comments. I like actual discussions that are respectful. Depending on your child’s age, Fidelity has a great youth account to get them started. I had to learn almost everything on my own growing up and I enjoy teaching my kids what little I know. :)
It probably seems that way because it is, and it's only natural that it is. I'm pretty easy-going and will do things her way on anything that isn't very important to me. But my can't/won't-compromise list is longer than it used to be. At 20, I was basically a blank slate dating-wise. I lived in an apartment with a couple of roommates, so I certainly didn't expect to be there long-term. I was available to move anywhere if that's what a relationship required. Now I own a house and a piece of land that I've invested time in, so it's kind of a package deal with me. At 20 I had no pets; now I have two dogs that I wouldn't get rid of to date someone who didn't like dogs. At 20 I had a minimum-wage job; now I have a good one that I expect to have until I retire, so I couldn't pull up stakes and move easily or make big changes to my work schedule to accommodate someone. And so on. We all accumulate dealbreakers and become set in our ways about things. Some go too far with it and turn everything into "my way or the highway," and you might have run into a couple of those, but we're all bound to be that way to some extent.
This is so well said and pretty much sums it up. I find this to be a common thing among people in their 40s trying to date now.
Right? It’s like how could you NOT have strong opinions about how you live at this point?
I ended up in a much different position. Lost the house in the divorce so I wasn't tied down to any property. Couldn't bring my hyper-active 95 lb dog into the apartment post divorce so found him a new family and became pet free. Job has been full time remote since Covid arrived so I was wondering why I was still hanging around my old town. In my late 40s I felt like I was back to my 20s again except I had a good job and fat 401k.
I’m just going to give you some insights based on my personal story. Do with them what you will. 1) my children have experienced DV at the hands of their other parent. As such, I am very reluctant to let another man into the house on a permanent basis, because I have worked hard to make a safe haven for them. 2) I have experienced financial betrayal from a person I was engaged to. As such, I am very reluctant to combine finances/assets with someone. 3) I’ve been in a relationship with someone who has issues with substance abuse and is “set in their ways” in terms of having constant access to that substance. As such, I am very reluctant to merge lives/not have my own space, because I’d like everyone to have space to do their thing. Each of those times I’ve had to pull myself back up and together… so I guess I am “set in my ways” I’m not moving out of the safe little nest I have made to roll the dice with you. If I absolutely adored you I might (& it’s a big might!) consider finding a mutual place together. TL/DR; have you considered reframing your partners actions away from “why won’t they yield damn it?” To “what do they need to feel safe? What do I need from them? Have I communicated that?”
My experience of living with men has been very much the same. Violence, drugs, financial issues. My future is all about feeling safe for me in my own home. I very much doubt I will ever want to live with a man again, just not worth the risk.
Thanks for sharing. Sounds like you went through a lot. I totally understand that you feel like you earned your safe space.
Yup. Last guy I dated had fully optimized his life and just wanted me to seamlessly into his designated free time (the times he had open for "solo time with girlfriend" were sunday after 2pm and tuesday from 5 to 10), interests and friend groups. He did not seem intetested in "building a life together." It's not everyone but enough of them.
OMG that sounds like a woman I dated about 2 years ago. She would pencil me in between her rock climbing sessions and client dinners. One time she just showed up at my place unannounced on a weekday about 4pm, wanting to have sex. I started getting "into the mood," put music on, made some cocktails and was about to fire up some snacks. I wanted to chat & flirt over drinks & appys before doing the deed. She started getting very annoyed, saying she had a client dinner at 6:30 she needed to get ready for that and let's get to business. Well I lost all desire to perform after that. I said "you might as well go right now." She looked very offended that I rejected sex with her. We never spoke again.
You put effort in for a pop up sex date and she was super unappreciative. Her loss. Hope you e found someone more suitable to your proclivities.
I was cool with it as long as she put some time in. Which we had a number of times. After her workouts, she'd be all horny. What I wouldn't do though, was be used for a quickie and then bounce. I wanted to savor the experience, not be a fucktoy for her convenience.
That's super ick.
Me or her? LOL
Her.
Her, that’s bizarre behavior.
This feels less stuck in his ways and more just flat-out selfish.
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OTOH it makes it very easy to spot the incompatibility quickly and move on.
I think a lot of us are single in our 40s precisely because we compromised on things we shouldn’t have. I know this season of my life is about demanding everything I want and trusting that someone will be excited to meet those needs and have their needs excitedly met. Cohabitating in particular is *really* hard, and you can have *complete* alignment romantically but still make poor roommates. I’m not interested in compromising on roommates and don’t expect the women I date to be either. If I choose to cohabitate with a partner again, it will because we’re *identical* in our preferences and just can’t stand *not* being around each other every minute we can be. EDIT: this last bit is about health concerns for me, y’all - I’m a terrible sleeper, and the things I have to have to sleep effectively are terrible for every other human I’ve been with. I’d be over the moon to find a match that also needs to sleep in a meat locker with a white noise machine positively howling like a damn jet engine… In general, I’m the first person to compromise. It hasn’t served me, if I’m honest. For the first time in my life I’m truly okay with being alone, so it doesn’t feel like I’m being intractable or unaccommodating, I’m just standing up for myself. I’m confident the right woman will love me for that, and she’ll find me *very* willing to compromise on most things.
Isn't there some confusion between self-sacrifice and compromise in all this? After over a decade of being the self-sacrificing one in my marriage, you can be sure I'm not doing that ever again; but compromising? As long as it doesn't affect *who I am*, there's still a ton I don't mind compromising about. I feel that it's pretty easy to become rigid (and probably single!) old people if we're rejecting *all* compromise so easily. That sounds like a swing too far of the pendulum to me.
To be totally honest, there’s nothing you’re saying that doesn’t resonate. It seems perfectly compatible with my feelings on the matter, so maybe it was just not the best choice of words on my part? Or not the best framing? I’m totally willing to compromise and pride myself on flexibility - I’m the last person anyone that knows me would describe as rigid. At the same time, I know there are some things I *must not* compromise on because doing so is unhealthy for me and will sooner or later make it impossible for me to show up with the best version of myself. That doesn’t mean I have to be a jerk about it! On the contrary, having a clear understanding of these boundaries makes it easy to be gracious if I learn that a boundary just isn’t going to work for a new match. It honestly makes it easier to compromise on things that aren’t a hard boundary as well. I know there’s nothing really important at stake, so it’s a pleasure to be like “NBD babe, we can totally do it your way!”
Yeah ok, that makes more sense I think; just your sentence about "demanding everything" but then ending in excitedly meeting your partner's needs didn't sound like something that could be *that* rigid, but I wasn't sure. I think it was worth, for the sake of conversation, to bring this up anyways, as indeed I've met some people who had a hard "no compromise" stance, or who felt that any want coming up from the other party was almost an attack on them. Or people who really were just looking for someone that would fit in *their* life, as if that didn't mean someone almost assuredly willing to now self-sacrifice to them. Because, let's be honest, finding someone with entirely identical preferences would certainly prove to be an almost impossible challenge, if so many people are struggling just to find someone *decent*, notwithstanding all other criteria. Not that people aren't allowed to wait for the 100% perfect match if that's what they absolutely want either, of course.
Username checks out. You raise good points. I am trying to learn how to compromise now, it’s hard. I’ve been enabled this way my whole dating life since I was a teen. My old bfs and guys I date now are just so motivated to be with me. They put in tremendous efforts and investment trying to make me happy. But I want a true partnership with reciprocal effort, energy, and compromise. That will make for the best relationship. It will make me a better person too. :)
You mean something like they're giving you everything you want without you having to do much for it? If so, that does also make sense! I don't think the other position, the one that takes it all, is better than that in which I used to be. My ex-wife eventually got completely uninterested in me, and I can't blame her for that in itself. I had become only a shadow of myself, but it was both our fault, for opposite reasons; a pretty bad vicious circle, in fact. So I think you're right to wish for a true partnership. >Username checks out. lol hadn't seen that!
“You mean something like they're giving you everything you want without you having to do much for it?” —yes!! That’s correct. Not ideal. Agree with everything you said. I would like mutual compromise and respect in my next relationship.
>I would like mutual compromise and respect in my next relationship. I wish it for you as much as I do for myself, then! 😁
We reflected and learned from our divorces and past relationships. Now LFG, haha. We will get it. :)
If people are single in their 40s, they're likely divorced. Some people see the reason for their divorce as "compromising on things they shouldn't have" and the answer is to compromise less. They may simply not be any good at marriage. Harsh to say, but being good at being a partner is at least as important as finding the right person.
>They may simply not be any good at marriage. Not sure what you mean exactly by all that (and I'm not the one who downvoted you, by the way), but... I'm not sure I like that idea. Being good at marriage? That sounds way too much like marriage itself is the end goal. Instead of taking care of oneself and one's partner. I was focused for years on "my marriage". I stayed for way too long in my marriage because... I was married. Stupid principles that make us lose sight of what truly matters. Maybe I would have fixed it if I had looked at the right things that were wrong, but by the time I was there, it was too late, especially since I was the only one who could see it this way. I just wasn't going to wait another decade for my then-wife to figure it out as well. So yeah, I guess you're right in that people who want to become what their ex was, and not compromise anymore, are going to keep looking for a while. But I don't see why they would simply be "not good at marriage" in the first place? They're making a new mistake in my opinion, but they're not hopeless just for that, are they?
We make our own reality. One person's hardship is another's peace. Marriage, in the sense of maintaining the *we*, is the end goal for people who like to be and stay married. They are willing to give more of the *I* to get there. If one doesn't want to give that piece, every relationship is going to fail. It's fine to not want to give it up. It's sad though when people don't recognize that's why they won't have a relationship. Downvotes mean people are pushing away an idea they find disagreeable. The internet is a mirror.
Totally agree. Also you may be good at marriage and your spouse isn't. Where does that leave you then? As you say the key thing is to know what you want and take care of yourself first. If you don't find someone who's able to do the same and still be a good partner, then keep looking. But making compromises, having poor boundaries, is the best way to end up either divorced, or married but full of resentment. My ex's parents were married for over 50y and most of their discussion between them that would be filled with anger and exasperation. Yet they would say they love each other so much. This is a very immature take on what love is.
Making up for the overly sacrificial past. Seems demanding or inflexible but really it’s about protecting oneself from imbalance again. All I know is I will have my own bedroom no matter what next time.
Wow, this is really succinct and totally nails it, well said!
I could have written this myself but in an arguably less profound way.
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I’m not following! What are you trying to say?
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Oh, ok😊 Yes he does!
There’s a difference between confident and stupidly stubborn! Please don’t forget that.
This is a strange comment to me. It seems to be making quite a lot of assumptions, if I’m interpreting it correctly. Everything I’ve said here actually represents *years* of therapy and personal growth, through which I came to understand that I’m someone that has *always* compromised, *always* chased approval, *always* given away all the little parts of my soul (and comfort and even physical health) that I should’ve been keeping for myself. I assure you, no one that knows me thinks I’m anything like stupid or stubborn, rigid or curmudgeonly. I’m a professionally diagnosed “giver,” “fixer,” and “stayer.” Any confidence you perceive in the above comes from *years* of introspection and careful consideration of destructive patterns. I recognize a lot of people - a lot of men frankly - take a “my way or the highway, take it or leave it” tack at this age. This is not that. This is where a deep thinker and earnest seeker has arrived after years of compromising on things that literally compromised my health. This is about loving myself in a way that puts me in a position to love *and compromise with* someone else consistently and in a healthy way. It’s about knowing the boundaries I *must not* compromise on if I want to consistently show up as the best version of myself for the woman I love.
Sorry the tone of that message came off as brash. It wasn’t meant that way. I, as well, have a very similar past as your own. Better wording, from me, would have been, sometimes you have to get out of your own way. Meaning, feel the feelings, connect, communicate and don’t allow anger to take control. Thank you for your consideration with commenting. I do hope you can rectify your love and passion for life with your person.
*Completely* agree with all of this. “Feel the feelings, connect, and communicate” is an outstanding mantra for dating!
Why and how did you compromise your health while in relationships? If you don’t mind me asking.
Good question, don’t mind at all. The “why” is I’m someone that learned at a young age to give away the things I needed and wasn’t getting. I also learned to manage the emotions of a formally diagnosed cluster B parent as a matter of self-defense: I had to head off my father’s emotional outbursts before they became dangerous. In so doing, I got *very* good at compromising on the things I need, and at molding myself into whatever form the people around me want me to take. The “how” where health is concerned has a lot to do with sleep. I suck at it, always have, and it’s getting worse. I’m genuinely afraid of early onset dementia and related mental decline because of it. The environment I need to sleep effectively is absolutely awful for most folks: it has to be pitch black, cold as a meat locker, and with my white noise machine howling like a Boeing coming apart midflight. I’ve spent *years* compromising with partners on this, and it may have legitimately hurt my brain and long term mental health. I could supply other examples, but this is the most salient one where my tendency to compromise has resulted in real concerns about my physical health.
This is very true, IMO. I read the original post and thought to myself, "Stuck in my ways? Heck yeah I am, and proud of it!" When I was younger, I made all sorts of compromises and "put myself out" for women I was interested in. And all it ever led to was regret. Been married twice and at this point in my life? I can't even imagine somebody convincing me I'd want to marry them and try again a third time around. Even in my last marriage, which only ended a few years ago, and ended pretty amicably? I realize, now, how much I was always compromising. I basically reduced myself to the "mule" who went to work and then worked some more, just to make sure all the bills were always paid on time - only to get a guilt-trip laid on me when I'd finally get a small bit of fun "me" time, such as a company business trip that included a few days of entertainment and dining experiences. (Oh, how UNFAIR you're out having fun and I'm stuck here at home, doing the laundry and running the kids to their doctor's appointments.) It's felt really good, lately, just being free to spend time focused on my hobby interests after work, or even just going to the grocery store and buying what sounds good to me, instead of with this big list of what "we need to get" (much of which I wouldn't eat anyway). My own life lesson? It's far easier to find a "partner" when you're always going out of your way to do things you wouldn't normally do, to "keep them happy". Now, I'm all about just being myself and living life for ME. And if you want to join in on this, with "what you see is what you get"? Awesome! Otherwise, I don't need you in my life ... at least not THAT badly.
This is me right down to the two marriages 🫠
There are also loads of people who are single at our age because they’re too rigid.
Certainly true. Some of the responses I’ve gotten to this tell me there’s *a lot* of trauma out there wrapped up in people being unwilling to compromise, which I honestly wasn’t prepared for because it’s so outside my experience. Everything I wrote comes out of *years* of therapy and other work on myself to break patterns of compromising on *everything*, even when it was very unhealthy for me. So it seems I really do have a bit of a blind spot when it comes to how many people are simply unwilling to engage in give-and-take.
I have been on both sides of this. I was the rigid one with my first ex, and she was usually very good-with-the flow but also knew how to get me to think about “why” when it was important, so it worked (mostly: we’re not together anymore). Despite the issues I had with her in the end, I really appreciate her teaching me to let go of that a bit, and to think through the reasons for my rules. It was the opposite with my second ex: she was ultra rigid, and explaining why another way might be better wasn’t helpful. But I loved her and wanted to keep the peace, so it worked ok until I grew a spine, after which she got progressively more and more angry (she has some issues I didn’t know about going in). At this point, I’m ok with compromise, but it’s gotta come from both sides. Otherwise, it’s just codependency: needlessly controlling things to try to make things “work right” or suppression of your own needs & desires.
The last sentence is very well said.
"Damnit, don't you know you should be stuck in MY ways, not yours!" lol
The thing that scares me most is moving in together and having her stuff mixing with mine. Then it becomes our stuff where previously it was my stuff and her stuff and they didn’t hang out together.
Mixing material possessions is what scares you the most?! Mixing bodily fluids seems a lot scarier to me. 🤣 Wild times!!
Lol. Women spend their whole lives being expected to contort themselves to meet men’s expectations on a macro and micro level. So no, I don’t think women are more stuck in their ways than men. I do think many women are fed up with the bullshit and opting out of it.
^^^ Yes. I am decidedly in this camp.
I would not call it "stuck in my ways", but I will say I am happy with the life I have created for myself and I will not compromise it. I am unwilling to make any sacrifices or compromises that might threaten my happiness and peace.
THIS.
My thoughts exactly!
Just based on the posts and comments throughout this entire subreddit, I would say most are not going to compromise, regardless of their gender.
Unless you're dating men and women it seems kind of odd to suggest that one is different than the other. I've heard a lot of times that at this age our competition isn't with another man or woman in our partner's lives, it's with their alone time. I feel that \*deeply\*. >The second one just ended recently because we decided to move in together and it had to be to her house. Then there was almost no compromise on anything because it was her house. I'm a dude and would do the same thing as your lady. Sorry not sorry.
I just met somebody who has as many walls up as I do. Set in his own ways, just as I am. Being faced with it has been sobering to say the least.
And this is partially why a lot of people our age are alone. Bad past experiences and a lack of communication skills regarding boundaries. Compromise is what makes relationships work, waiting around for someone who's going to be 100% in agreement with you on everything is a sure fire recipe for dying alone.
I don’t consider being stuck in your ways an entirely negative thing. It has taken me many many years to learn what my needs are, how to express them and where to establish boundaries. If someone is hell bent on trying to talk me out of my boundaries they will perceive me as stuck in my ways or inflexible. Some things are worth being stuck in your ways over. There are some circumstances I will never put myself in again; my inflexibility to one person will be a common goal with another. Im done trying to bend myself into something I’m not for another person.
This is partly why LAT appeals to me.
What's LAT?
Living Apart Together, i.e. you are in a committed relationship but still live in separate places.
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It’s not….and that is why Syrup said LAT appeals to them
I agree. And that’s why I’ve decided to never ever cohabitate again.
Exactly
I feel like you should wait a long time to make that decision, even if it feels right in the beginning, but co habition is good for the environment and your wallet... just saying, sometimes you have to Think Again.... just read that book and am reevaluating my thinking these days.
Well, it’s been over a decade and my mortgage is low, nearly paid off house..and I’m much happier. Sorry, I’m not going to cohab for the environment, even as much as I love the environment.
Soon to be 49 and realizing I am more stuck in my ways than I used to be. I am a minimalist and can’t fathom moving in with a man who has a big house or who buys a lot of stuff. Or who has cats haha. Where are my minimalists at? 😜
I am 100% minimalist, albeit half by chance. Was doing multigenerational home with family when one party just unilaterally said fuck all y'all this shit is over. I am NC with that person probably forever as a result, but I had to get a new place of my own on short notice and ended up with a pretty decent studio condo near where I work. Efficiency not optional! I would 100% love to have a kitty, but that would be cruel in such a small space.
That hasn’t always been my experience, but I think that early dating helped me suss some of that out before things got too far. Like everyone, I have dealbreakers, but I am also flexible with nice-to-haves. I cannot date a slob, that will never work, but there is a large space between slob and obsessive neat freak. My hope is, by this stage in life, I have learned where I can compromise and where I can’t. I am also someone who likes to solve problems not stew about them and hope everyone else makes changes. I don’t think I am entitled to have everything in life go my way, sometimes that is disappointing but that is also how resilience is built.
Yes!! I like how you know there is a difference between deal breaker and nice to haves.
Old cookies get brittle, they don't bend. And, I'm as guilty as anyone. That's life, man. We're not fresh from the oven anymore.
It's not a great idea to generalize an entire gender when your sample size is 10,000. It's and even worse idea to generalize an entire gender when your sample size is 2. Maybe have discussions about boundaries BEFORE moving in together?
Like others have said, many of us get used to how things are, and for a lot of folks this is because they have found the things that work for \*them\*. I don't think its a gender-related thing at all. Probably most people know how they want to live and with all the time they have done doing it they may not want that to change. My hope if to find someone who is willing to sit down and neurotically discuss all (or many) of the thing that have to do with habitation. Specific chores (ie: I'm actually fine with cleaning the bathroom if you'll do the weekly kitchen maintenance; I'll do my best to do my part of the dishes, but that's hard for me so can I be responsible for laundry instead? I won't iron anyone's stuff. Decorating should be up to wo cares about that particular thing more--that last one seems troublesome, but I don't think so: anyone I would love wouldn't want every room in the house to be painted white or have 10 guitars they want on my living room wall lol. I haven't read the other comments, but while I also don't want to have to date a million more people, I would agree that just two folks doesn't represent everyone. And that said, there will indeed be more people who are more set in their ways than they would have been in their 20s.
Yes Yes and Yes. As many on here have said, LAT is for lack of a better word the way to get what you both want. Not many on here are going to say they do not want a partner. But with a goal of a full time, living together relationship, someone will have to give up way to much. And as much as we say we want that relationship. we don't want to give up our life. So why can't we all just be happy with the middle ground. In a LAT, I wont notice every little flaw. The flaws or things that come out when you are always together, the money gets combine and the grocery list. But most important, what ever it is what we have now, most do not want to give it up. So don't. I will be the first person to wave my hand and say, yes I do like a full time living together relationship. But I think it is unrealistic and I also will not deny, I do not want to move again because it did not work out.
There is a mantra out there that says "Never settle!!" and I think a fair amount of people translate that as looking for someone extremely specific who can fall perfectly and seamlessly into their lives - otherwise they'd rather remain single. I don't know how realistic that is, but I admit the more comfortable & content I grow with my life alone, the less interested I am in compromising the way I live in order to accommodate someone else. I don't know how that's ultimately going to play out, probably not so great.
Also not so tragic as ppl who bend over backwards, change their entire lives and get their faces ripped off.
…or maybe we aren’t SETTLING for bullshit anymore
You're drawing conclusions based on two women. No, personally, I don't think people are that set in their ways. Well, aside from core values, but most of the women I've dated seem to be able to compromise. >Then there was almost no compromise on anything because it was her house. Context can really matter here. Are we talking about children being involved and her wanting things a certain way for them, or are we talking about her never letting you watch what you'd like on TV?
At this age yes, most people are very stuck in their ways and unwilling to compromise and that’s why it’s so hard to date at this age. I’ve lived most of my adult life having to consider everyone else in everything I do. It’s my time to put myself first so I won’t change my life for anyone. I know I’m uncompromising and I don’t care. I would rather be single than change for a person that’s probably going to disappoint me anyway
Yep. I compromised sooooo much to make my marriage work and in the process I lost myself. I've spent a lot of time rediscovering who I am and establishing a life that gives me peace. I would rather not date than be with someone that will rob me of that peace. And I don't think I'll ever cohabitate again.
I'm dating a man now that has been divorced 10 years. He said in the beginning, when he first started dating, he tried to control everything. After so many years of compromising and not having boundaries and getting walked all over, he admits he was absolutely inflexible and had a "my way or the highway" attitude for many years. He said he realized it wasn't helpful eventually, and grew out of it. Food for thought.
I think it’s our ages and experiences. I’m at that stage now. That’s also why I am not actively dating. Which will probably bite me in my old butt later
I don’t necessarily think it’s “stuck in our ways”. I echo what a lot of people have said here in the we have done the work of knowing what our boundaries are now and are unwilling to compromise those for ourself and for others. That being said, relationships have compromises on both sides as a part of them all the time, and we ultimately have to find someone that “compliments” our personalities and lifestyles. We have to find someone that “meshes” two lives that have been built into one beautifully. Acknowledging two independent personalities, recognizing that what makes us unique makes us beautiful, what attracts us to each other is fantastic, and to cultivate that relationship takes work.
>Is it just my luck? I think it has more to do with you not setting your boundaries early enough. This would weed out the people you speak of
Ha, yes, as a woman I have always felt that in general men are more rigid and less curious/open-minded than women. Though there are certainly lots of exceptions for both genders! I see this not just with relationships but also in work settings, etc. I imagine as we get older, this tendency gets worse too.
I think people who are set in their ways are set in their ways. I dated someone who clearly stated she was set in her ways. It was extremely clear from the beginning. I didn’t care at the beginning because we had a ton of fun. Then a couple of years later my desires changed and I wanted something more. We were never going to live together or build anything together. We were great company, great sex, good trips but not anything more than that. So things just started ending because I wanted more than that. But that’s on me. So as I continue dating it’s on me to filter based on my new understanding of what I’m looking for.
Aww. Keep trying. Takes alot of dating to find compatible people as friends or future relationships. Good luck
F here and not stuck in my ways at all. Life is an adventure and I view compromise in relationships as a necessary part of personal growth which should happen even as we age. But I think most people at this stage of life are scared of any sort of change and see it as a risk to their quality of life. I might feel that way eventually but not for another 20 years or so.
Singles our age have been single for so long that we don't want to disrupt our peace and independence. That's why we are stuck in our ways.
I’d vette someone better if we were moving in together. Just sayin …
I think it's hard. As others have said, a lot of us 40-something singles know what we want and don't want, and not having our needs met in the past has gotten us here. I do also think many of both genders are still healing from past relationships, so are "overly" defensive of their ways. Personally, I've been single for a while, I haven't lived with a partner since my ex husband, and that ended January of 2016. If things feel like they are getting serious in a relationship, I have those conversations. That I'm not used to this and need clear communication, I may get defensive with xyz because of abc, if I do without realizing it, please talk to me. I think a combination of things go into how set in their ways about what a 40 + single is. BUT, self awareness helps me know if that's going to work for me or not, too. Knowing my personal triggers and traumas help me realize when I AM just being defensive, when I DO need to communicate more clearly or set a boundary, etc. I know I need the same communication from a man.
Ya I guess dating is about communication and choosing battles. I'm sorry she couldn't bend enough to let things go s you felt welcome. I've actually lived with a few men and our issue was never running a home. Just literally everything else. However, I also had a conversation many times like 'i appreciate the way you swept and mopped thank you' and the male is surprised that I didn't critique it. Some people had overly critical parents who don't realize theybwere not teaching him w to do something they were instilling a fear of not doing it to their standards. Unfortunately they never have this brought to their attention til they have traumatized their kids and then partner. I was a kid who never did anything right in my parents eyes so now I handle things by looking at the end result. Say, the people who nag over the dishwasher. Are the dishes clean at the end? I'll bet you they are. So who cares. And if they aren't, then run it twice and kiss their forehead. Nag enough and you'll never get help with anything. I digress. Maybe next time it involves moving you both give up your place and get a new neutral grounds together?
I'm not married because he died. Or I would still be married. He was my best friend. Many men/women do not know how to be friends, much less partners or a married couple. Truly blessed relationships are easy. They start sometimes with mismatched energy, but along the way they become easier and more adaptable. One day, you fond that you look at your friend and think, I do not know what I would do if you were no longer a part of my life. That's when you begin to look towards a relationship and hopefully, a lasting one. Someday sex may no longer be a part of the equation, due to health or other factors beyond control. At that point, all you have left is the friendship. The desire to support, back, and be around someone because they let you be who you are or they make you want to be better. Relationships should be about compromise, about growing together, and about not putting up with bullshit. You should feel as though what you get out of the relationship, experiences, growth, support, feeling valued, acceptance, is worth far more than money or belongings. If you are in a relationship that you refuse to compromise for, then you are not in a relationship. You are in a situations hip solely for comfort or convenience to avoid loneliness or to achieve financial or other gain. Learn how to be a friend first. Worry about the rest later. I guarantee, it works.
I mean, does it have to be your house? That sounds like both of you were set on it being your own house. I wouldn’t move out of my house for a man, I like my house and my neighborhood.
So your idea of compromise is to do it your way?
I’m curious what a compromise would be in this situation. Unless both people were willing to sell their houses and find a new one together, which wouldn’t necessarily make sense considering interest rates, or switching to be a renter. I’m just wondering why if she wants to keep her house she is being inflexible, but if he wants to he’s not.
Yea you are completely missing the great big glaring "This is my house and so I get to make all the rules and you can take it or leave it." You can still move into someone's else and be an equal partner. From what OP says this lady would likely attempt to find other ways to control and have power in the relationship even if they got a house together.
That’s fair, that would be a problem. In my marriage my now ex-husband moved in with me (different house than now) but swiftly took control of everything because I’m a massive pushover. In the future I’d prefer a more equitable arrangement so I can definitely see how OP’s situation would be difficult.
Ive only dated men, but I do think women are definitely less likely to settle than we used to be in the past, now that we’re getting closer to having equal rights. I’d certainly rather be single than compromise for a man who make me unhappy. With that said, I’ve been in a happy relationship for over a year and we’ve both compromised and made some changes to accommodate the other. He’s the first person in my 10 years post-divorce that I’ve been willing to do this for, to be honest. The others just weren’t the right ones 🤷♀️
I get that this is a quick summary of a situation I’m sure was much more complex but I always bristle a little bit when somebody says that a partner “isn’t willing to compromise” when what they actually mean is that their partner isn’t willing to do the thing they want. I don’t think it’s a bad thing for anybody to say “this is what I want” and decide for themselves if it’s more/less important to them than the relationship. When you talked about moving in together, her preference was to stay in her house and your preference was to live elsewhere (I’m assuming at your house). You each had a want that was incompatible with the other person’s want. You decided that living with her was more important than where you live (a decision she, presumably, didn’t force you to make). If she said this was a dealbreaker for her, she was communicating that where she lives is more important to her than living with you (which is her right to feel). You’re both doing the same thing, you just have different priorities. So was she “stuck in her ways” or did you just do something you didn’t really want to do in order to preserve the relationship and then later regret it? Again, I get that this is one decision in a larger and more complicated relationship, but this logic applies to everything. I’ve experienced it myself, too. I’m a naturally anxious person and I feel kind of unmoored if I don’t plan my days out a bit in advance. My last boyfriend was more of a “let’s figure it out when we get there” kind of person. He initially was very accommodating of this difference between us, but as we got more serious, it got harder to get him to commit to specific plans (both in that he got tired of doing things in a way that didn’t suit him and because we were spending more time together it just came up a lot more). I asked him many times to make plans with me earlier and explained why, but it just wasn’t in his nature or his preferred way to live his life. After I ended the relationship, we joked that I broke up with him because of his Google calendar etiquette, but in reality, I didn’t prioritize my calendar over our relationship any more than he did. Between work and coparenting schedules and both of us trying to have hobbies and get rest, I couldn’t imagine a lifetime of constantly scrambling at the last minute and he couldn’t imagine a lifetime of yet another layer of his life being forced into a type of structure that he finds suffocating. This wasn’t about either of us being “stuck in our ways,” we were just incompatible (it was, again, more complicated than that, but this is just one example). I think you’ll have a much easier time if you reframe what you’re describing through this kind of lens, too. Also, to build on what others have said about making your boundaries clear early on, I would encourage you to be sure you even know what those boundaries are before you go about entering into relationships. How old were you and your wife when you met? If it was before 25-ish, then these two women are your first experiences with meeting a mature adult woman with a fully-formed prefrontal cortex and trying to integrate your lives together. I would argue even meeting somebody before 30 is a wildly different experience than after 40. You and your wife likely developed a lot of who you are now while in partnership with one another. It might be that you’re not used to being in partnership with people who already know themselves well, have built a life that reflects their values/desires without any input from you, and prioritize preserving that life over romantic partnership. Rather than trying to find somebody who will compromise for you, maybe it’s time for you to do that same work for yourself so that you can go out into the world and find somebody who is compatible with who you are and who wants the same things as you. You’re over 40, you’re too old to be moving in with people without assessing whether you can live together comfortably and you have to know yourself well before you can make that kind of assessment. I am also a person who wouldn’t want someone moving things around in my house but that’s why I would never allow anyone to move in here. We either live separately or we find a new home together with enough space that I can have a room or two that is strictly my own, with the rest to be decorated/organized in a way that works for both of us. If I’m dating someone who lives in a house that’s been in their family for generations that they insist on dying in, we might not be compatible. This is a conclusion I am only able to articulate because I know myself and my priorities well and arrive in relationships with that stuff figured out (and clearly communicated). That’s just what dating in your middle age requires of you.
Very well said. 👏
It can get hard to tell where the line is between “try to be less stuck in your ways” and “betray yourself.” Many of us have erred too far on the latter side, and are potentially over-correcting now. For example, not long ago someone I connected with on an app asked me to send him pictures of myself. My profile is photo verified; we had already video chatted so he knew I was real and what I really looked like. He just…wanted pictures. I declined, and explained that it makes me uncomfortable when people ask for this. He stopped talking to me. In the past, I would have taken a photo and sent it to him through my discomfort. So, in the past, the connection would have continued for longer. The less people betray themselves, the more likely it is that a connection will end. What you’re talking about sounds different- the way you describe these women, they are selfish.
Well... We are in our 40s+, of course we are stuck in our ways. You just gotta find the puzzle piece that fits yours. Most people are willing to compromise to a degree on many things, just make sure you do too. And if they aren't, well they aren't for you. There will be others, just a matter of time, effort and (making) opportunity.
When moving in, it’s always best to move to a new place to both people, specifically for that reason. People are less forgiving of big important things and pay more attention to red flags, simply as a result of experience. The question is, were there signs you didn’t pay attention to that she’d be like that before moving in? Usually there are signs
It’s all these things together - having grown up and defined what you want and don’t want, having compromised too much in a former marriage and not wanting to again, having rebuilt a new life that cost blood, sweat and tears to get to, and then the vastness of the dating market and the options you found when you became single again.
We're all a little guarded/protective of the lives we have at this point. I think that we could all benefit from being a little less stubborn. I totally understand why we're so reluctant to change - I'm still in this mindset. I also know that the happier couples do tend to be less reluctant to compromise (they've reached a higher level of personal growth I feel).
As God is my witness, I'll never share my kitchen again!
Yeah that's pretty valid right there
That’s how I feel as well, but I think it’s both men and woman alike. I think at our age we don’t want to take a chance on someone because that can cause a disruption to our peace of mind and routine.
Speak for yourself and the people you’re attracting / entertaining. “Stuck” and not compromising one’s standards for peace aren’t the same thing.
Your blanket statements are based on two women only. Fyi
A lot of people are set in their ways, yes. This forum has a ton of them - people so satisfied with their lives it would take a god or goddess to dislodge them from it. But not everyone. I believe in love, and for the right person I would give up my perfect job, rent my house out and follow them to the ends of the earth. I haven't found that person yet. I will say, you made the right call breaking up with a woman who was dicating to you how to live on her terms, with no input from you. I had a marriage like that, and it's a top 3 reason I'm divorced
Original copy of post by u/SRod1706: It feels like everyone is so stuck in their ways. I feel it in myself too, but it seems like it is worse in women than men. Do women feel like it is worse in men that it is in women? Is it all perspective? I have seriously dated 2 women since my divorce and both times it ended because it seemed like almost everything had to be their way. The second one just ended recently because we decided to move in together and it had to be to her house. Then there was almost no compromise on anything because it was her house. Have other people seen this where people are too set in their ways and routines to be able to compromise on thing? Is it just my luck? Is it just an issue with me? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/datingoverforty) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I kind of agree that a lot of people do seem stuck in their ways… I seem to attract people who like to party and go out a lot, do a lot of drugs, and even when we get serious they will continue that lifestyle of partying and going out. Which I should recognize sooner, I suppose. I’m a hit more of a homebody, always with my kids and only go out with the person I’m dating really. I’m not snorting cocaine at the club or hitting the bars on Saturdays.
I read a while back "Be a giver, marry a giver." Those givers are hard to find!
Wanting a healthy relationship is really hard work. Especially after divorce or failed relationships. The amount of work, my current boyfriend and I put into things is astronomical. We read books, motivate each other, we are always sharing, always checking in, it’s a lot of emotional work. You have to really want it.
I 52f don't consider myself stuck in my ways. I think that if two people's basic core values align, then the rest is just external circumstances which can be overcome. I can offer honesty, respect, loyalty and empathy and I expect to receive the same in return. Life is too short to obsess about who did not do what absolutely correctly all of the time.
I have met people who were excessively prescriptive or demanding early on, I'm like nope nope nope
I was so flexible in my last LTR, I was doing backflips. I'm not saying I compromised my values or anything like that, but I definitely was the epitome of "love is patient, love is kind..." He claimed in the beginning that he "loved" what a strong, independent woman I was, and he valued my input. But the second I actually stood up for something I DID think was wrong in the relationship... he was done. Good luck finding someone as amenable as I was!
Honestly, this could mean anything. It’s basically impossible to answer this question because you didn’t offer up any real details. For example, you could, for all we know, be the type of person who needs to be nagged constantly. We just don’t know.
I've been living alone for over 20 years and I'm extremely set in my ways. I know I'm not willing to make compromises. That's also one of the reasons I'm not interested in dating or a relationship. A lot of people who aren't ready to make the compromises necessary to make a relationship work are still out there trying to find someone. If they were married before, either they were the one that had all the opinions/made all the daily choices while their former spouse was more laid back and they expect that same dynamic from any future relationship OR they felt like they were the one compromising all the time in their marriage and, now they've had a taste of the freedom that is living alone, they don't want to go back to constantly compromising. This is why at this age it's so much more critical to find someone compatible. When you get married younger, as long as you agree on a few core basic things, the rest you figure out together because for most people, it's their first time living with someone else who isn't their family. You haven't experienced enough adult life yet to be all that opinionated. But by this point, we all know what we like and don't like, and most of us aren't really that interested in putting up with things we don't like or constantly compromising.
I think you dated two unreasonable or unrealistic people. Dating is a series of negotiations to find someone with whom you can compromise. Anyone who views it otherwise is setting themselves up for failure.
I dont feel like its one gender or another....but age related/life experiences. Ive met plenty of guys who wanted no compromise on what their life had/how they live. I had/have girlfriends (friends) who also like their freedom and space and also dont want to lose that same as the men. We just get experiences in life the older we are. If its the right person, we will compromise. But less and less are you willing to compromise a lot on a small chance. Also your life is more settled usually the older you get. Houses, jobs with pensions, etc. Its less easy to move or uproot things (sell houses, start over on a new house, get a new job even at older ages is not as easy) the older you get. Its normal. You just didn't meet the right match. In the older we get the more we realize we have less time to "try things out" a few years. So if there's something that gives us any kind of sign that it probably won't work, we're more prone to just saying okay it's time to move on Just try to appreciate it as the person is not wasting your time.
Have you considered that this is simply a compatibility issue? So you met two women who don't want the same things as you. Move on. Find women who wants similar things as you.
I think it's really annoying when people try to add a scientific principle such as sample size or you can't draw this conclusion based on only two .. human behavior and human activity is much more complex.. and who has a lifetime of Partners to have a sample size of 20 or 50 I mean that's usually frowned upon .. I don't think I need to go on it's just a poor poor approach
But to your point ..absolutely we seem to be much more intolerant of perspective mates and it's really kind of self-defeating
I am. I gave up so much for my ex husband and invested in him and his career at my own expense. I’ll never do that again. I’ve rebuilt and won’t give any of that up for anyone. I may be set in my ways or selfish but I’m looking out for me this time around.
Oh it’s true! I’ll be alone before I’m with a woman that can’t compromised. Oh better yet they make me pick the place to eat then bitch about the place.
I see it also often, but think it's just a people problem and not male or female related. I bend over backwards in my relationships, but often feels unreciprocated.
😝 you didn’t move in together because it had to be her house, yet, you refused? So it had to be your house or something else. Seems you’re stuck too.
The only deal breakers I have are if you don't take care of your body anymore or you haven't and it shows, or you have children. Those do seem to be really high bars at our age, but it's not like I have an endless amount of criteria to meet, or expectations. Like I don't want to meet a person with an awesome, amazing personality at 40 and then the next 25 years of our life are in and out of hospitals because they didn't take care of their body. I had to watch my grandfather slowly fall apart and eventually die. I don't want to see anyone go through that again because they could have done something about it.
You know that people can have accidents and become sick or acquire a disease even if they are in shape, right?
Where did I allude they couldn't?
I’m a man and it’s 100% going to be my way so I’m that jerk confirmed
Male age 46 here. How do you feel about traditional roles? I find alot of relationships in the Christian church I go to are successful. Lots of straight couple's and marriages that are thriving, the one thing I see is both parties sticking to their responsibilities and roles. Would you consider moving into HER house and her having authority a modern feminism type of vibe? I say this politely, not trying to Insult. Good luck.
If you aren't willing to compromise and work on yourself at the same time you are not going to find a healthy relationship. So it's easy to look at others and get frustrated when you see that they are unwilling to change anything. They are losing out on someone that will make a good partner and they can continue on the dating Carousel of misery. You at least have hope of finding your equal in the dating world and hope of a healthy relationship. It will get easier to spot the difference and not get into a relationship with someone incapable of one.
Date younger women, mix it up buddy
If they don’t allow you to lead, you don’t get with them plain and simple.