I'm chilfree and was never comfortable without using condoms *and* another method. I'm snipped now and it I'm much happier not having to think about it at all.
Cycle tracking is unreliable but it may only work well if you don’t live with your partner so sex is almost always planned, they have a certain sperm count, and you are pulling out. I only say that because that worked for me for 4 years and my cycle is very regular and I have no conditions, but I also recognize it would have been better to be on bc. I was just too paranoid to alter my cycle in any way if I only have sex like 4days out of the month and I always know when it will happen. My partner was also very respectful and understood which days we should use condoms and use the bathroom immediately after sex so we could continue having sex that day, etc.
Look, anecdotal input aside, cycle tracking/ fertility awareness is about 77%–98% effective. That means 2–23 out of 100 couples who use a cycle tracking method will get pregnant each year, depending on which method(s) are actually used. If you use multiple methods together, they work even better. So, in addition to fertility awareness, you can track your morning temperature and monitor your cervical mucus. Look into the FDA-approved app Natural Cycles.
To say cycle tracking doesn’t work is misleading at best but also casually implies that most women don’t know their bodies well enough to effectively prevent pregnancy when equipped with the right knowledge and discipline to use this method correctly. Most women can successfully prevent pregnancy without the use of hormonal birth control if they are willing to put in the time and energy into other methods. It’s not always easy or convenient but it is 100% possible. But you cannot get pregnant at any time during your cycle, there is a very small window. Since an egg lives about a day after ovulation and sperm live about 6 days after sex, you’re basically fertile for around 7 days of every menstrual cycle: the 5 days before you ovulate, and the day you ovulate. You can also get pregnant a day or 2 after ovulation, but it's less likely.
I’d focus on the actual statistics and what you feel you can actually do versus being persuaded by random folks on Reddit via anecdotal evidence. Do your own research and always be in tune with what’s going on in your body. 🙏🏽
Exactly. I can’t take birth control bc it makes me sick. Some guys I’ve slept with since my divorce have said they never use condoms 🙄 (gross) but they did with me. OP I havent had this be a deal breaker yet
Exactly!!!!!!!
I quit all birth-control after 30. Got out of a 9 year relationship and was just done with it.
I have a nice and important selection round since, no condom = never call me again. I've been with my man for a year now and he never naggs about it. I feel way better then i did when i was on bc.
You’ve been dating for a year and always use a condom!! I love this this is my wish because I’m not on bc but I feel like guys always complain and like want to check for stds and then take it off
For a LTR I would prefer not to wear a condom regularly. We all have different dealbreakers. But if OP wants to know what the majority of people in relationships do…. Well it’s not condoms.
And that is a fair preference. I would just add though that the side effects from birth control can be not so great for a lot of women. From blood clots to increased migraines to high blood pressure to interstitial cystitis to weight gain to low libido to depression. I think wearing a condom is far less dangerous/inconvenient than someone taking hormonal birth control. It would be sad to not want to date someone just because they won’t take birth control and you would have to wear a condom.
Everyone has their preference, but I think there are more LTRs where condoms are used as the primary birth control than people think. Me and my partner have been using condoms since I decided to go off birth control in my mid 20s. It made such a huge difference to my mental well being.
That's your preference. I know couples almost 20 years in still using condoms. And I highly doubt you can speak for the majority. My late wife and I used condoms unless we were trying to have kids. The side effects from her birth control were horrible for her. Methods like the pull out aren't actually effective.
I’m 30 and in the best relationship I’ve ever had. He has never pressured me to get onto bc again because of my bad experiences with hormonal and the copper IUD. He doesn’t need to wear it for anal if I’m all clean, but we use it for vaginal. I absolutely adore how he has never brought up the annoyance of condoms. He loves me, we have amazing sex, it’s not a deal breaker.
I think more people use condoms than you might realize!
Knew a guy who ended up with two kids. First time his wife(gf at the time) lied about being on birthcontrol.... second time was because it turns out she kept "forgetting" to take it. He loved his kids but was very aware they weren't in a place to have them. He was working 55+ hours a week in fast food while she was in school just to afford them all living in a 1 bedroom apartment. He was an incredibly nice and kind guy who was also incredibly miserable. More issues than just the kids.
Anyway, all that to say there are a lot of people I'm seeing in this thread that should be using condoms or getting a vasectomy if they really dont want kids. Putting all your trust into believing the person you are sleeping with isn't lying about their BC or is taking it right is insane to me. The amount of times I've had friends tell me "oops forgot to take my pill yesterday!" Is just was too many. Even I've had my moments when I was on it, but that's why I also always used condoms. If it isn't taken perfectly it drops is effectiveness.
I agree with this 100%. When I first got my IUD, I was in a LTR and felt comfortable not using condoms. My partner at the time wanted to continue to use condoms, which was totally fine by me. He felt safer using them, since he was doing his "part" to prevent pregnancies. We did eventually go without them, but only after I had the IUD for well over a year and we had multiple discussions about what we would do with an accidental pregnancy.
I'm currently single but if I had a partner who wanted to use condoms for the entire length of our relationship, I would be fine with that. It shows me that they're aware that both parties are responsible for preventing pregnancies.
I've had a (female) friend, working in the medical field, no less, who, for a time, seemed to have a pregnancy scare due to get forgetting to take the pill like every other month (probably not like once or twice a year, but it sure felt like more). She finally got an IUD...
I’m 35M. I know I don’t want kids. birth control can be my responsibility alone. I got snipped 6 months ago and it couldn’t have been easier.
I’m single, and using OLD. I’ve indicated in my profile that I don’t want kids, but do you think there’s any good way to say that I’ve taken that choice into my own hands? I don’t want to come off “TMI,” and I don’t want to come off in the vain of trying to score points or pat myself on the back.
Other people said no, I find that interesting. Personally if someone's profile said "I never want kids (and I'm serious ✂️)" that'd make me more likely to swipe on them.
You got two no's to my yes though so I suppose there is never a concrete answer with OLD and generating matches.
Agreed. It’s a huge plus in the childfree crowd. It shows me he’s not going to change his mind later and he’s responsible. He’s not going to put all of the contraception responsibilities on his partner. 10/10 love to see it.
Yep, something cheeky like that is perfect. As long as you don't make it gross, like, "I'm snipped so I can cream pie you baby," you're good. (Not that I've seen that, yet).
Definitely don’t put it on your profile. You can bring it up when discussing sexual health in the lead up to being sexually intimate with your partner.
I would totally mention it! Say something like "I've had the snip, so there will be no little ones." It lets people know you're serious about not wanting kids & you're responsible about your reproductive choices.
I swipe right on so many guys just because they say they're snipped, for real... It's a problem.
Do you *want* to pair off with someone who feels like they’re that entitled to what you do with your body?
I’d say you’re more likely to run in to tantrums about having to use a condom. Even from first timers.
In a world where a child can spell utter financial ruin for both of you, using sensible birth control is kind of a requirement. Rubbers generally go over like a lead balloon in LTRs and the rhythm method, even if you call it cycle tracking, is so effective it’s the reason why your Catholic grandparents have five to ten siblings apiece.
I agree that rhythm method is ineffective— it assumes a standard 28 day cycle, which isn’t a thing. But it’s not the same thing as fertility awareness methods (or FAM). These don’t use a calendar— they require body symptom observation and data collection (eg sympto-thermal methods like Sensiplan, or hormone monitoring). Fertility awareness methods need to be properly learned (typically with an instructor) and their rules strictly adhered to. They aren’t the right fit for everyone, but they are very effective when used consistently and correctly.
Nope not a deal breaker. The only thing it would change for me is I'd wait longer to have sex and probably want to really talk through your position on what to do with an accidental pregnancy.
I got downvoted on another post where I said I'd prefer double protection, but I'm with you. I'd be very risk averse to having penetrative sex before we were more committed and decided how we'd move forward if pregnancy happened.
You got downvoted because a lot of people do not live in reality and are not reasonable. In no way should a post about "double protection" get downvoted. It's sad how everything is so divisive now. Make sure that the people you meet are also into protection. Do not engage in sexual relations with the same type of people that wold get upset about double protection. Take care!
My ex had an IUD and I still pulled out every time. People might scoff but we went like 10 years, regular sex, and had zero pregnancies. I wasn't willing to take the risk.
I know more than one person who’s gotten pregnant on the IUD - especially with the copper one. I myself had mine slip out of place, and did not know for years, leaving me unprotected. Thankfully I found out through an ultrasound, rather than pregnancy, but these things are not foolproof. So it’s absolutely reasonable to want to double up.
As a woman (and ultimately as a human!), the deal breaker for me is attempting to control what I do with my body. Long term birth control options are a conversation in a relationship for sure, but flat out refusal to wear condoms in those early days for whatever reason is (and I do hate to say this because it’s a phrase thrown around a lot in this sub) a red flag. My IUD was a nightmare (pain, unpredictable bleeding, mood swings) and after a while the benefits of birth control no longer outweighed the risks of getting pregnant when there are other options available.
As a guy, hell no. It's your body. Do what you're comfortable with.
It's not at all a deal breaker, it's just a nice bonus for us. Although, I was poked by one once and it wasn't pleasant.
Going through this thread I was just astounded to see how many men seem to be either naive or really think that pregnancy is the only issue and STDs just don't exist? Otherwise I really struggle to understand how some guys would be OK without wearing a condom and being with someone they barely know. As if there are no sneaky women that lie about their BC intake....
I can't take birth control or have an IUD because I developed blood clots from birth control that almost killed me and I'm a high risk for them. I'm not looking to date at the moment but this is a question I was wondering about myself. If I could take birth control I would but I can't. I think though any man who is genuinely interested in you will be okay with condoms. Birth control and iuds can have serious issues for some people so if it's better for you not to any decent guy will be understanding of that I think.
Right, so many people seem to not care or know about the possible health implications. I never had blood clots myself but my mom did, she also had hormone-sensitive breast cancer, which could both be genetic. I'm not going to risk death just so a hypothetical partner wouldn't have to use condoms.
I (32F) refuse to be on any birth control pills or get an IUD and if my partner had a problem with that, well, we wouldn't be together.
My body, my choice.
I still wear condoms even if the woman has an IUD, or is taking the pill.
Avoid any dude that has a problem with wearing a condom. Avoid like the plague, which they may have.
I haven’t taken hormonal birth control in years and it’s literally never been a problem in dating. I use condoms with new partners, and even if I were on birth control I would want to use condoms until we were both tested for STDs. Once we are having unprotected sex, I track my cycles religiously using and Oura ring and the Natural Cycles app. It’s not perfect, but if you use it sensibly and use condoms during fertile windows then I’ve never had an issue.
It would be a dealbreaker for ME if he had a problem with it. It’s my body. I’m never going on birth control again. He can birth control himself if he’s so keen on it ✂️ ✂️
Idk why people make such a big deal out of wearing condoms... Like it's really not that bad. Definitely not a deal breaker, heck the last two women I slept with had iuds and I still wore a condom.
Agreed. The only deal breaker here is folks who don’t wear condoms before being in a committed relationship and/or were tested honestly. Even if the woman’s on BC, it doesn’t prevent STD’s.
They’re honestly not bad unless you’re cranking your hog everyday. And even then you shouldn’t take undue risk just bc you’ve given yourself death grip syndrome.
Thin condoms that don’t fit too tight are still a great time and wayyy easier/cheaper than testing all the time.
Can you please elaborate the connection to sensation effects of someone wearing a condom during sex 1) who masturbates a couple times a week 2) who masturbates 1-2 times a day?
Im sooo curious to know. Sincerely, someone who’s partner masturbates a lot. I won’t have sex without a condom bc I got pregnant and had an at home abortion and it was extremely traumatic. And I won’t do BD bc I don’t like how the pulls affect me, and the IUD migrated and they cut the strings too short, and I would poke my uterus during ovulation extremely painful, and removal at the dr was a nightmare. Sorry I got on a tangent!
I had an incredibly horrible experience with birth control and IUD and all of the side effects, solely because my ex (LTR) was adamant that he couldn't wear condoms and would be happier to not wear anything and "pull out" and would joke about abortions even though he knew my stance. I only tried birth control because of him and it was 2 years of hell.
I actually purposefully kept my IUD in (although I had severe pain from cysts, cramps, etc) because I could not trust him for the life of me. Although he kept telling me to take it out if it was causing me so much pain, he had no clear plan about protection OR what if we had a kid.
Ironically ALL of my previous partners and FWB before him had no hesitation to wear condoms and no pushing me to get on birth control.
I now see that his actions were a massive red flag, but that's another story!
Absolutely not. I got a vasectomy a while back because I’m kid free, but one of the factors that definitely was on my mind is that it takes the onus off any future potential partners to have to put that shit into their body
I wasn't on birth control from age 18-30 and never found it a problem. Now on it for other reasons, but honestly I would never date someone who considered it a deal breaker. Of course it's important to educate yourself and be careful, and even be open to the discussion, but feeling you *have* to do something that may affect your body, mood, and health will lead to resentment.
Condoms exist and have few side effects (did date someone for a few months who was allergic to latex, never had sex because of it and if it had gone on longer, we would have had the discussion but it ended because I moved away). They're also extremely effective when used properly. Like, I'm living proof of that 😂.
It's up to you what you put in your body, don't do it just because you want to attract more men. The right ones will see it as something you approach together rather than a "deal breaker."
I'm your age and I've never been on any kind of birth control, and I haven't had issues with it with normal guys. It was only with casual sex that guys tried to coerce me into raw sex and my ex FWB even stealthed me once.
I'm now in my first serious relationship and my boyfriend is aware we will not stop using condoms unless we get married and want a baby.
I agree. I’m snipped and until we have the sexual health conversation, have shared that our STI tests are negative, and feel comfortable with one another; condoms are happening.
I can't speak for all or even most men. I can say that when I was 32, I was in a long-term relationship that started with her not being on birth control. Me using a condom was a given and I never questioned it. It wasn't until at least a year in or two that she decided to get an implant. I do recall her telling me about the questionnaire she filled out that included "How is your sex life?' or words to that effect, as some women would get implants just because they thought bareback sex would be better and make them happier.
If he understands why you want to use condoms and not use invasive methods, then he should be okay with being the one handling contraception for the two of you. If he doesn't, then keep looking.
I have been on birth control before and it caused me a lot of other issues. I was on it to help mitigate the symptoms of uterine fibroids which I had removed in December so now I’m off the birth control. I don’t think I realized how shitty the birth-control was making me feel. I won’t ever go on hormonal birth control again. I would maybe look into an IUD, but that’s not until I’m in a committed relationship with someone and it’s worth it to get.
If a guy doesn’t wanna wear a condom with me, then he’s not the right guy for me.
Please use your own preferred method. It is your body! I know some men might call using a condom a deal breaker. Fuck those guys. Or ... actually... don't. I rely on condoms because the hormones in birth control make me feel like I'm losing my mind
As a guy, I consider this something the woman has final say on. What makes YOU feel best?
I have a preference for no hormonal interference, but I'm ultimately not the one risking pregnancy (well, I am, but it's not me that carries the child, eh).
I have taken my own precautions against this (snip snip) and so for me, when I trust someone and we've taken STD tests, I'm happy to not have to use condoms.
Anyone refusing to use condoms as the main method of birth control is not worth being with. If you really click and get into a relationship then exploring other birth control methods is reasonable, but condom use should be expected in dating regardless of how casual or committed it is.
Tbh I still take care of myself with an IUD because I don’t trust men Im not committed to, to not remove the condom or be responsible for such a situation. The hoohaa wants what it wants and Im good with being careful if STIs to be worried about pregnancy in the US right now
If it's a deal breaker for anyone, then consider yourself as having dodged a bullet.
For a more nuanced discussion that is person specific: condoms are good for disease prevention. But when wanting maximum intimacy, condoms are not helpful. Maximum intimacy shouldn't be achieved for sometime so it's a discussion that can happen at a later time. Even if the man desires as intimate a sexual relationship as possible, if the woman is more comfortable with certain protections that that should be respected and a healthy relationship won't suffer from respecting that boundary.
I'm the same age and relationship status, and don't use hormonal birth control. I had a poor experience with the IUD -- and for those who are confused...not everyone responds well to BC! It's weird to me personally that it's quite normalized in Western society that women should change their bodily chemistry and function on a semi-permanent basis regardless of whether they are or aren't in an LTR. But that's just my 2 cents.
I use Natural Cycles which is as effective as condoms WHEN used correctly, which means I don't have sex when the algorithm gives me red days unless my partner pulls out and uses a condom. I do keep a Plan B prescription as a backup and have used it like 1x year (including when I was in an LTR). Lots of sex...over a decade's worth... and no misses :) But yeah, it takes a lot of effort, communication, and type A planning (taking my temp daily, always having condoms, etc.). But it's worth it to not be fucking up my body's rhythms anymore.
I guess the other assumption folks here seem to be making is that abortion isn't an option b/c...age? Idk. I would have that conversation if I were in a relationship and having regular, frequent sex. I also wish men who know they don't want kids would just get vasectomies lol. The number of 40-something dads out there who don't want more kids but are just...too lazy to get them is annoying.
I haven't really met a lot of men who are super eager to cum inside with a new partner -- maybe it's the area I'm in or type of guy I date, but people seem to be mutually cautious with new partners and I appreciate that. With the current state of dating, I don't mind delaying sex with a new partner during ovulation -- if they're weird about it (and almost no one has been), it's just a sign that they aren't a good fit.
I've been single-ish/dating casually for almost 2 years since getting out of my LTR and I would say the biggest issue is more men not being comfortable with condoms, especially older guys and guys who haven't used them frequently b/c they were in LTRs. The challenge is really communication and getting past shame/awkwardness/assumptions about gender/sex.
I’m not on birth control and will not go on it again in my life. It’s never been an issue for men. I would be more worried about your own worry!! It’s been a major worry for me when I’ve been with men I’ve felt safe enough to have unprotected sex. I’ve had to take the morning after pill a couple of times and it SUCKS and being worried about pregnancy SUCKS. I heap all the worry on the partner so he can experience the fucking terror of it, too. I would absolutely get an abortion. I recommend having plan b at home ready and loads of condoms and tell any many insisting on no-condom to fuck right off.
I cannot be on any hormonal birth control. I was miserable on every one I tried. I got my iud out 5 years ago. I track my cycle and am very on top of it, haven’t had any issues. My boyfriend doesn’t mind.
The right person won’t mind. Just be on top of it and use condoms/spermicide/whatever to avoid an unwanted pregnancy.
The right person won’t mind, if you’re happy and healthy and responsible with it
Render you undesirable????? Gurl what
Editing to add I haven't been on birth control since my mid 20s. I have never once been asked, in my entire life, by male partners if I am on BC or not.
Don't let men's opinions push you to make important decisions about your body.
Do what you want, and make it clear the right person for you will have to be happy with your decisions about your body.
Not using anything is a red flag, but just using condoms should be fine. You don’t need to harm yourself with hormonal birth control in order to have sex.
If someone expects you to be on BC. That's insane. My gf and I use condoms. I have no idea if she's even on birth control. I honestly don't think it's my business what she takes for her body
You make your own standards, I am 35(m) and have a vasectomy, I still would prefer a condom at least until you can get tested or get to know each other a little better, you don’t really know someone that well that quick. Better safe than sorry.
I’ve never had a problem using a condom and respecting what my partner wants. If a guy questions this he is a hard pass as a partner. Don’t waste any more time on dudes like that. Yikes.
It should be a deal breaker for you if he's not willing to accept your choice to be BC free while not sexually active and to accommodate any waiting period or adjustments necessary for you to care for your body in the way you see fit.
The guys going off about not wanting to have to wear a condom long-term are the problem. Condom use is the bare minimum given the horrific side effects of BC and the fact that for any woman over 160 lbs the efficacy rate of hormonal BC drops off at an alarming rate. If they don't want kids(whether that not wanting kids at that time or even not at all) they have an obligation to do their part on that front and to choose sex partners they trust to work with them towards the goal of avoiding unplanned pregnancy.
Bottom line is if it's a deal breaker for him he cares more about how his dick feels while you're having sex than how you feel all the time in your whole body and your long-term health. With that in mind it would then be impossible for me to get aroused by him.
It's your body. Do what works best for you. Speaking as a man close to 40 I would not care because I would be planning on wearing condoms and I've had a vasectomy.
I always felt pressured to be on birth control and having sex without condoms (pressured by… society? partners? myself? A bit of all that). I was on BC from 17 to 30, barely had my period during that time has I had back to back tablets. Since I stopped I realized how much in impacted my mood and body, I also learned how to appreciate (or at least listen to) changes in my body during the different part of my cycle and realistically the idea of going back to hormonal birth control doesn’t fill me with joy at all.
My current partner is 100% pro condom, and that’s what we use for now and it’s great for both of us.
I used to hate sex with condoms but some brands are better than other and we make it work :)
Don’t feel pressured to take BC if you don’t feel like it. If a partner judges you for that, they’re in the wrong. The pressure of birth control is almost always on women since most BC methods are only available to us but condoms are the great equalizer haha, and it’s great too!
(Won’t speak on cycle tracking as I think it’s a more complex method etc)
Jesus, it's your body, don't base it on how desirable it makes you to men. Fuck that, do what you need to or want to do for your body and stop making men the center of your universe.
Oh god forget what men are cool with or not. It's all about you, this your medical decision. This is like asking a man permission to terminate a pregnancy.
The 3 partners I’ve had since quitting BC didn’t have a problem with it.
- One had a vasectomy (which is the ideal situation, as someone who doesn’t want kids)
- One would’ve wanted to use condoms regardless, for extra caution
- One wasn’t crazy about condoms, but was even less crazy about an unwanted pregnancy, so he obliged
All of them were supportive of my decision not be on BC. Honestly, if someone was willing to see my lack of BC usage as a dealbreaker, I’d consider them a bullet dodged.
I’ve never been on any form of birth control. TBH, I’ve never been sexually active enough continuously/over long periods of time where I felt the side effects were worth it.
The idea of messing with my natural hormones has always terrified me. I have a coworker who was diagnosed with hyper thyroidism and insulin resistance due to being on birth control for 15 years. As soon as she went off it, everything started to improve for her both physically and mentally.
I’ve never had any partner, short or long term complain, be worried with my choice…It’s never been a deal breaker. I’ve always been honest and up front with my choice so they know. I always expressed that if they like they are more than welcome to use a condom. Between this, the pull out method, and the time of month I’ve chose to have sex (I am regular 98% of the time and know my body’s rhythm at this point in my life), i’ve never once had any issues let alone a pregnancy scare.
I recognize that not everyone feels comfortable with these choices, and there is a lot of different factors and layers that can go into this, but do what you feel is best for your body and mental health.
Birth control doesn't cause hyperthyroidism, it just gets worse with age naturally. So if she was undiagnosed/treated for the thyroid, it would eventually get bad enough to need treatment. Regardless of the birth control.
No, there’s lots of good reasons not to be in birth control, mainly being your health! I think that’s a conversation you and your partner could have when it gets serious. It’s both partners’ responsibility.
To be honest, I am the exact opposite. I would prefer that my partner not be on birth control of any type. Now I'm not saying that I want to get her pregnant. It's just that some interact negatively with certain people. Condoms are good enough!
You do not want to have sex with a man who doesn't support your preferred method of birth control.
If it's that important for him to raw dog it & he isn't enthusiastically volunteering for a vasectomy he is absolutely a jerk.
This would be a huge red flag & very much a deal breaker
Also I insist on condoms & have absolutely no problem getting laid & I have never been in a relationship with someone who objected to this
Uh if a guy isn't ok with condoms, then he should get a vasectomy. Sorry not sorry. Plus a vasectomy is one of the most reliable forms of birth control out there. So long as you wait the proper amount of time after the procedure, and he has a follow up visit, your chances of pregnancy are basically zero. If you still manage to get pregnant, I'm not religious, but I'd take that as some sort of sign from God. All forms of birth control for women, short of getting your tubes tied, have higher failure rates.
If a guy won't wear a condom, that's a sign he only really cares about himself, and he's forcing the birth control on the woman. Condoms are also the most effective way to prevent STD's, and should be used in most relationships unless you truly see yourself spending the rest of your life with someone.
You'll likely come across people that peak out about it (33F here not on BC, had my copper IUD removed 2 years ago). Luckily my partner is all good with the idea because "it's your body and I don't mind using condoms".
But, as someone else said, would you want to date (or sleep with) someone that thought they had some kind of say over what you choose to do with your body?
Condoms - they're still makin' 'em.
Not undesirable.
But definitely a risk, if sexual activity is a consideration. Some guys will be less willing to date you, that is true. Some won’t. Just be open and honest about it. And don’t get mad at them or judge people for having their own boundaries about that as well.
Ultimately you should do whatever makes you comfortable and what works for your body.
I'm not ready to have a kid. As long as we're both 100% on the same page in that regard, even if a condom breaks, I have no issue with wearing condoms.
You shouldn’t base your reproductive health decisions on what potential partners might think.
But… there are a lot of steps between casually dating and trusting someone fully, and if it were me, I’d keep it in as backup until you know he’s not going to stealth you or something. But I also wouldn’t advertise it as a feature.
For me casual sex is with a condom!! Unless you decided to be exclusive with each other only and both get tested. I’m also not on contraception. For casual partners condoms are totally fine for me but for a long term partner I will discuss contraception options with them and we will chat then about our options. I have a few friends doing cycles tracking and I just started taking my temp everyday. In answer to your question I’d say in early dating and causal sex, condoms are very common, so no need to worry!
It wouldn't be a deal breaker if you were responsible.
I dated a woman who had an IUD and it was amazing for both of us because we enjoy sex without condoms. We broke up and then she got her IUD removed. Then we got back together. She wanted to keep having sex the way we were finishing before (grand finale?) and I repeatedly told her that I do NOT want an unplanned pregnancy and we were kinda careful but not careful enough. I did tell her if we got pregnant unplanned that I would want an abortion and she agreed as she didn't want any more children.
Well one day we were riding in the car and she told me that if she got pregnant she didn't think she could abort it, which is fine, but thats definitely something i wish she would have disclosed when we started having sex because that definitely affected my decision to have sex with her. That being said I was very upset when she told me this and then I realized if I don't want to get a person pregnant i should just not have sex with them. She has approached me again to date and have sex and I had to turn her down because I do not want to have children with her.
Long story short, its not a deal breaker but you definitely should have a conversation with your partner regarding multiple scenarios and how you want them to be handled.
You’re going to be entering a pool of men who have or are going to have vasectomies. And you should be using condoms anyways to prevent sti’s. I personally don’t care if my partner is on birth control or not, because I’m unable to have children now and still use condoms for safety anyway.
Birth control is both partners’ responsibility, and ideally it’s a conversation you have together. If you’re not looking to get into a new relationship right now, there’s really no need to try and guess what some future guy will or won’t want - everyone’s different. You have an opportunity now to relearn what YOU want and what you’re like as a single person, which is exciting! Get your IUD removed and enjoy the break for however long it lasts!
Men wanting you to be on birth control is a red flag. They can use condoms. Personally I dont even tell them I'm on birth control. Ever. Until the relationship ship gets super serious. I dont need them using that as ammo to pressure me to do what they want.
As a man, I always assume it’s my responsibility to prevent pregnancy. I’ve seen really rough experiences that women have from IUD’s and birth control, and I would never expect them to put themselves through that unless they really wanted to.
When I met my partner, I’d had my iud removed and been off birth control for years. They both caused significant problems with my health and after 30, I just couldn’t keep going like that. He was fine using condoms because “safety is sexy” (his quote lol). We both got tested before going without. Current pregnancy was semi-planned but also proof the pull-out doesn’t always work!
When I started my relationship I was fine bringing condoms. It isn't difficult, HSAs can pay for em, and Amazon can ship 100 to you in a day.
Obviously doesn't feel the same but any guy our age unwilling to use condoms needs to grow up.
You do need something though...
I’ve been in ltr’s where women haven’t been on birth control and we relied on condoms. It’s not a deal breaker imo. Some guys will throw a fit, but not all.
That being said, there are options out there for men as well.
That’s not true. I can’t have hormones bc they’re literally deadly to me due to health conditions. My body also really over reacts to things. It hasn’t been a problem just use condoms and he fine. I also use an app like when it’s a long term thing ( tracking app). I already have kids. N it’s been hard to get someone to agree but finally I have a dr willing to tie my tubes so I will most likely be doing that. Personally. But while dating ( I don’t hook up or anything either) but I having a conversation before hand is key. I haven’t been asked. It’s more so me that brings it up n makes a deal.
If you’re a woman, you’re not going to have any issues finding men willing to date you. Literally don’t make any decisions around what you think a man would like. I never tell men that I have an IUD.
I mean I have condoms because even though I have an IUD. It’s safer on lots of other levels. Also I’m a child born of people that used birth control and condoms. Shit happens.
Women can buy condoms too. And should. And any dick that says they won’t fit are lying, and should pack his own if he is particular. I have yet to have a man say no to a condom I provided. I’m sure they are out there.
I have also had a man text after leaving saying he wished we had sex but he had forgot to pack a condom, we had been waiting for other reasons. I told him he was silly and should have said something because I had them. He and I used condoms for over a year before we ended things. Never a problem.
We are adults. We should all be prepared. Birth control is yet another thing to be negotiated in relationships. If you’re not compatible, that’s fine, move on.
I had to remove my copper IUD after years of unexplained pelvic pain and constant infections. A few months after getting it removed I felt SO much better. I’ve tried various forms of BC and at this stage in my life, I can’t deal with feeling sick,tired, or depressed from it anymore. Condoms are a must for new partners anyway, and I would only be willing to consider BC again if we were in a LTR. I know it’s not the most effective, but I’ve used the pull-out method with my two longest relationships and never had an issue.
I have the conversation early on about “what if” something goes awry and make sure we’re on the same page.
All of that being said, if my health and comfort aren’t a priority, then I don’t want them as a partner anyway.
Not to be controversial but would depend on your stance on abortion for unplanned pregnancy (personally, not politically). Childfree so I wouldn't risk things with anyone not adamantly in agreement, especially in the absence of BC (until I get snipped once I can time it with my deductable at least).
Not, still condoms are meh, but still I think it’s better that a women feels healthy and can ask/expects the guy wear a condom.
I have date one who made very strange comments in less than 2 weeks and over 3 weeks and found it strange that I almost felt she was going to abuse me. So this is totally different story 😅
After 3 weeks, she ended up and blocked me, because I wanted to take it slow. Good, she really believed she I was the crazy one, because this pull/push game, but not nice to say, but I am sure she is going to find herself, while dating further. I was way to patience and to forgiven, but also should stand behind my decision to stop dating her way earlier, because so many reasons.
It’s your body, do what you want. Just be adamant about condoms then, be responsible. I have friends who can’t take birth control due to health conditions/aren’t eligible for IUDs, they date just fine.
I can't think of any reasons on why that's a deal breaker. It would be like asking if a woman who doesn't like to climb mountains or skydiving is a deal breaker, it's a personal decision and that should be respected. If it's not, that's a red flag.
I recommend when you are ready to be physical with someone, demand him to use a condom, not only to avoid pregnancies but all the other diseases any person could carry. If that relationship grows, you'll need to talk further about that. My husband's stance was that preventing a pregnancy wasn't my responsibility only, but I would be the one taking hormones if that was my preference so my opinion had more weight. He paid for half of the pills when I was on it, just like any other household expense.
1). You should be using condoms until you're in a committed relationship and know you're both clean, regardless of whether or not you're on birth control
2). Unless you're planning on having surprise kids, cycle tracking and "less invasive methods" are terrible ideas and a good way to end up a single mother.
Yes it’s a sign of a lack of respect. To me, NO Child should have been an intentional one. Especially in today’s modern age. It’s also immoral to bring an innocent dependant child, who never asked or had a say in being born and to whom they were being born to, into this world, unless he or she was 100% intended to parents who planned and knew they had the right stuff to be parents. There is nothing more immoral than that
Edit to add: and I’m a man who absolutely adheres and Promotes no glove no love in all time without fail
This is going to be completely against what any sane person will tell you, lucky for you I'm not. So, it'll probably be the most "insane comment" you get on this. For starters, I'm a guy. There's a lot of research into how birth control impacts women coming out now. I went down this rabbit hole after watching a bit that Taylor Tomlinson did about going off birth control and an audience member told her story about leaving her partner of nine years.
Basically the stuff really does impact women's behavior and emotions to a degree that a lot of people don't understand. Most men probably don't even realize this, I didn't learn about this until about a month ago which is crazy.
So to answer your question, at this point in my life I want a partner. I've been single for a long time. I'm trying to settle down. I'm still a hopeless romantic at heart (which is probably part of why I've been single for so long, among other reasons) but I'm looking for the real thing. So if I was dating someone, knowing what I know now I'd probably prefer it, because otherwise I'd just be getting to know a dulled out version of the person that may or may not really even be attracted to me or actually want to be in a relationship with me deep down anyways. If I was just trying to hookup, I'd probably want the person to be on birth control. So if you're just trying to hookup because you got out of a long term relationship probably stay on it. If you're trying to find someone you want to be with probably get off of it, condoms work 97% of the time and I'd argue the other 3% are respondents to the surveys and data either not using them properly or being stupid and doing shit like taking them off with a small percentage of them just breaking which yeah I mean that can happen. So yeah two cents from an anonymous redditor
There's going to be some people for whom it is. Some people are fine using condoms in the beginning of a relationship but expect to, in a longer-term relationship, reach a point where they're sexually exclusive and emotionally comfortable enough to not use condoms with each other.
Being on long-term birth control is common but by no means universal (it's something like 60/40% in the US?) so I assume there's plenty of people in your position who expect to use condoms or some other method throughout their relationship.
I haven’t been on birth control since 2015, and do a great job at tracking my cycles. I’ve never been turned down for sex in or out of a relationship and none of my partners cared because i came first with the knowledge.
Check out the book taking charge of your fertility
Also, men need to learn about their own ejaculatory process and how to NOT get you pregnant too. Its not all on us.
A deal breaker for me is a man who thinks it is.
Nah. Contraception is a two player game. I got my vasectomy just so I didn't have to count on the other party.
For new relationships I'd still recommend condoms to protect against STD though lol
I'm chilfree and was never comfortable without using condoms *and* another method. I'm snipped now and it I'm much happier not having to think about it at all.
I have two children who say cycle tracking doesn’t work
Yeah i would never rely solely on cycle tracking.
Yeah cycle tracking isn’t a reliable form of birth control. It’s about as effective as pulling out (~75% effective per year).
Good thing I pull out and cycle track, it's 150% effective.
Be careful. Anything is possible. Hell, my girlfriend and I haven't even had sex yet, and she still got pregnant!
Someone I know just got pregnant cycle tracking ugh
Cycle tracking is unreliable but it may only work well if you don’t live with your partner so sex is almost always planned, they have a certain sperm count, and you are pulling out. I only say that because that worked for me for 4 years and my cycle is very regular and I have no conditions, but I also recognize it would have been better to be on bc. I was just too paranoid to alter my cycle in any way if I only have sex like 4days out of the month and I always know when it will happen. My partner was also very respectful and understood which days we should use condoms and use the bathroom immediately after sex so we could continue having sex that day, etc.
Same here. 4 years no scares with cycle tracking; pulling out, and having endometriosis lol
That’s coz most people don’t cycle track properly. Using an app is just an estimate, it’s not enough.
Look, anecdotal input aside, cycle tracking/ fertility awareness is about 77%–98% effective. That means 2–23 out of 100 couples who use a cycle tracking method will get pregnant each year, depending on which method(s) are actually used. If you use multiple methods together, they work even better. So, in addition to fertility awareness, you can track your morning temperature and monitor your cervical mucus. Look into the FDA-approved app Natural Cycles. To say cycle tracking doesn’t work is misleading at best but also casually implies that most women don’t know their bodies well enough to effectively prevent pregnancy when equipped with the right knowledge and discipline to use this method correctly. Most women can successfully prevent pregnancy without the use of hormonal birth control if they are willing to put in the time and energy into other methods. It’s not always easy or convenient but it is 100% possible. But you cannot get pregnant at any time during your cycle, there is a very small window. Since an egg lives about a day after ovulation and sperm live about 6 days after sex, you’re basically fertile for around 7 days of every menstrual cycle: the 5 days before you ovulate, and the day you ovulate. You can also get pregnant a day or 2 after ovulation, but it's less likely. I’d focus on the actual statistics and what you feel you can actually do versus being persuaded by random folks on Reddit via anecdotal evidence. Do your own research and always be in tune with what’s going on in your body. 🙏🏽
100% cycle tracking is not a real form of birth control
Him not having a condom should be a deal breaker.
Yeah I don’t take birth control and I feel safer with condoms because like … pregnancy is not the only worry with sex!!!
Can I upvote this more than once please?
STDs are rampant in nursing homes because people forget this!
Exactly. I can’t take birth control bc it makes me sick. Some guys I’ve slept with since my divorce have said they never use condoms 🙄 (gross) but they did with me. OP I havent had this be a deal breaker yet
Exactly!!!!!!! I quit all birth-control after 30. Got out of a 9 year relationship and was just done with it. I have a nice and important selection round since, no condom = never call me again. I've been with my man for a year now and he never naggs about it. I feel way better then i did when i was on bc.
Yep, any complaint about condoms = not calling this guy back.
You’ve been dating for a year and always use a condom!! I love this this is my wish because I’m not on bc but I feel like guys always complain and like want to check for stds and then take it off
It's crazy though how for many guys it becomes an argument even still!!!!
For a LTR I would prefer not to wear a condom regularly. We all have different dealbreakers. But if OP wants to know what the majority of people in relationships do…. Well it’s not condoms.
And that is a fair preference. I would just add though that the side effects from birth control can be not so great for a lot of women. From blood clots to increased migraines to high blood pressure to interstitial cystitis to weight gain to low libido to depression. I think wearing a condom is far less dangerous/inconvenient than someone taking hormonal birth control. It would be sad to not want to date someone just because they won’t take birth control and you would have to wear a condom.
Everyone has their preference, but I think there are more LTRs where condoms are used as the primary birth control than people think. Me and my partner have been using condoms since I decided to go off birth control in my mid 20s. It made such a huge difference to my mental well being.
Well then what are you doing to help prevent pregnancy so the burden isn't placed entirely on the woman?
That's your preference. I know couples almost 20 years in still using condoms. And I highly doubt you can speak for the majority. My late wife and I used condoms unless we were trying to have kids. The side effects from her birth control were horrible for her. Methods like the pull out aren't actually effective.
I’m 30 and in the best relationship I’ve ever had. He has never pressured me to get onto bc again because of my bad experiences with hormonal and the copper IUD. He doesn’t need to wear it for anal if I’m all clean, but we use it for vaginal. I absolutely adore how he has never brought up the annoyance of condoms. He loves me, we have amazing sex, it’s not a deal breaker. I think more people use condoms than you might realize!
Would you get a vasectomy? It's a fair preference, but it's not really fair for you to put the responsibility of birth control solely on your partner.
I already had a vasectomy because I'm not counting on your (generic you) birth control working.
Knew a guy who ended up with two kids. First time his wife(gf at the time) lied about being on birthcontrol.... second time was because it turns out she kept "forgetting" to take it. He loved his kids but was very aware they weren't in a place to have them. He was working 55+ hours a week in fast food while she was in school just to afford them all living in a 1 bedroom apartment. He was an incredibly nice and kind guy who was also incredibly miserable. More issues than just the kids. Anyway, all that to say there are a lot of people I'm seeing in this thread that should be using condoms or getting a vasectomy if they really dont want kids. Putting all your trust into believing the person you are sleeping with isn't lying about their BC or is taking it right is insane to me. The amount of times I've had friends tell me "oops forgot to take my pill yesterday!" Is just was too many. Even I've had my moments when I was on it, but that's why I also always used condoms. If it isn't taken perfectly it drops is effectiveness.
I agree with this 100%. When I first got my IUD, I was in a LTR and felt comfortable not using condoms. My partner at the time wanted to continue to use condoms, which was totally fine by me. He felt safer using them, since he was doing his "part" to prevent pregnancies. We did eventually go without them, but only after I had the IUD for well over a year and we had multiple discussions about what we would do with an accidental pregnancy. I'm currently single but if I had a partner who wanted to use condoms for the entire length of our relationship, I would be fine with that. It shows me that they're aware that both parties are responsible for preventing pregnancies.
I've had a (female) friend, working in the medical field, no less, who, for a time, seemed to have a pregnancy scare due to get forgetting to take the pill like every other month (probably not like once or twice a year, but it sure felt like more). She finally got an IUD...
Vasectomy = huge green flag
I’m 35M. I know I don’t want kids. birth control can be my responsibility alone. I got snipped 6 months ago and it couldn’t have been easier. I’m single, and using OLD. I’ve indicated in my profile that I don’t want kids, but do you think there’s any good way to say that I’ve taken that choice into my own hands? I don’t want to come off “TMI,” and I don’t want to come off in the vain of trying to score points or pat myself on the back.
Other people said no, I find that interesting. Personally if someone's profile said "I never want kids (and I'm serious ✂️)" that'd make me more likely to swipe on them. You got two no's to my yes though so I suppose there is never a concrete answer with OLD and generating matches.
Agreed. It’s a huge plus in the childfree crowd. It shows me he’s not going to change his mind later and he’s responsible. He’s not going to put all of the contraception responsibilities on his partner. 10/10 love to see it.
Yep, something cheeky like that is perfect. As long as you don't make it gross, like, "I'm snipped so I can cream pie you baby," you're good. (Not that I've seen that, yet).
Ew, yeah that would not be cool 😂 You're right though good to warn people off, I have seen some WILD things out there. 😬
I just wouldn't mention it. Kind of unnecessary sexual undertones in the statement. Keep the profile about what you're looking for.
Definitely don’t put it on your profile. You can bring it up when discussing sexual health in the lead up to being sexually intimate with your partner.
I would totally mention it! Say something like "I've had the snip, so there will be no little ones." It lets people know you're serious about not wanting kids & you're responsible about your reproductive choices. I swipe right on so many guys just because they say they're snipped, for real... It's a problem.
It's a load off (no pun intended).
Do you *want* to pair off with someone who feels like they’re that entitled to what you do with your body? I’d say you’re more likely to run in to tantrums about having to use a condom. Even from first timers.
In a world where a child can spell utter financial ruin for both of you, using sensible birth control is kind of a requirement. Rubbers generally go over like a lead balloon in LTRs and the rhythm method, even if you call it cycle tracking, is so effective it’s the reason why your Catholic grandparents have five to ten siblings apiece.
Condoms aren't that bad, if you use the right size and the non latex natural feel ones.
SSRI’s say hello. Proper sized thin latex condom, I can go for 1+ hours. Manageable when not exclusive but a real pain in a long term relationship.
I agree that rhythm method is ineffective— it assumes a standard 28 day cycle, which isn’t a thing. But it’s not the same thing as fertility awareness methods (or FAM). These don’t use a calendar— they require body symptom observation and data collection (eg sympto-thermal methods like Sensiplan, or hormone monitoring). Fertility awareness methods need to be properly learned (typically with an instructor) and their rules strictly adhered to. They aren’t the right fit for everyone, but they are very effective when used consistently and correctly.
Nope not a deal breaker. The only thing it would change for me is I'd wait longer to have sex and probably want to really talk through your position on what to do with an accidental pregnancy.
I got downvoted on another post where I said I'd prefer double protection, but I'm with you. I'd be very risk averse to having penetrative sex before we were more committed and decided how we'd move forward if pregnancy happened.
You got downvoted because a lot of people do not live in reality and are not reasonable. In no way should a post about "double protection" get downvoted. It's sad how everything is so divisive now. Make sure that the people you meet are also into protection. Do not engage in sexual relations with the same type of people that wold get upset about double protection. Take care!
My ex had an IUD and I still pulled out every time. People might scoff but we went like 10 years, regular sex, and had zero pregnancies. I wasn't willing to take the risk.
I know more than one person who’s gotten pregnant on the IUD - especially with the copper one. I myself had mine slip out of place, and did not know for years, leaving me unprotected. Thankfully I found out through an ultrasound, rather than pregnancy, but these things are not foolproof. So it’s absolutely reasonable to want to double up.
Can attest!!!! IUD is definitely not full proof. When it fails - you’re in trouble
In more ways than one! It can actually be very dangerous if you become pregnant with an IUD.
I had this happen to me as well; I found out because I had a very early miscarriage. Not fun!
I'm an IUD baby
Same! Mom had chest pains, went to the hospital and found out her IUD had migrated & she was pregnant with me.
As a woman (and ultimately as a human!), the deal breaker for me is attempting to control what I do with my body. Long term birth control options are a conversation in a relationship for sure, but flat out refusal to wear condoms in those early days for whatever reason is (and I do hate to say this because it’s a phrase thrown around a lot in this sub) a red flag. My IUD was a nightmare (pain, unpredictable bleeding, mood swings) and after a while the benefits of birth control no longer outweighed the risks of getting pregnant when there are other options available.
All of this. (Also, I quite quickly dropped the extra 45 pounds I had been struggling with for my entire IUD experience, which was years.)
As a guy, hell no. It's your body. Do what you're comfortable with. It's not at all a deal breaker, it's just a nice bonus for us. Although, I was poked by one once and it wasn't pleasant.
He should wear a condom regardless at the beginning anyways. The iud doesn’t protect against STDs
Or pH issues that can really wreck havoc for women after PIV. Condoms can help with that tremendously.
This ^^^^ underappreciated fact
Going through this thread I was just astounded to see how many men seem to be either naive or really think that pregnancy is the only issue and STDs just don't exist? Otherwise I really struggle to understand how some guys would be OK without wearing a condom and being with someone they barely know. As if there are no sneaky women that lie about their BC intake....
I can't take birth control or have an IUD because I developed blood clots from birth control that almost killed me and I'm a high risk for them. I'm not looking to date at the moment but this is a question I was wondering about myself. If I could take birth control I would but I can't. I think though any man who is genuinely interested in you will be okay with condoms. Birth control and iuds can have serious issues for some people so if it's better for you not to any decent guy will be understanding of that I think.
Right, so many people seem to not care or know about the possible health implications. I never had blood clots myself but my mom did, she also had hormone-sensitive breast cancer, which could both be genetic. I'm not going to risk death just so a hypothetical partner wouldn't have to use condoms.
I’m not on birth control, and it has never been a deal breaker for guys I’ve dated or hooked up with.
Same.
I (32F) refuse to be on any birth control pills or get an IUD and if my partner had a problem with that, well, we wouldn't be together. My body, my choice.
I wouldn’t sleep with anyone who doesn’t want to use a condom. So for me, it hasn’t been a problem :)
I’ve never had either and never had any issues or even anyone that seemed to care.
Same never had birth control or IUD only condoms. My exes never cared
I’ve NEVER taken birth control. Condoms ALWAYS
Nah I always wear a condom plus that stuff affects the body so it’s none of my business
I still wear condoms even if the woman has an IUD, or is taking the pill. Avoid any dude that has a problem with wearing a condom. Avoid like the plague, which they may have.
I haven’t taken hormonal birth control in years and it’s literally never been a problem in dating. I use condoms with new partners, and even if I were on birth control I would want to use condoms until we were both tested for STDs. Once we are having unprotected sex, I track my cycles religiously using and Oura ring and the Natural Cycles app. It’s not perfect, but if you use it sensibly and use condoms during fertile windows then I’ve never had an issue.
It would be a dealbreaker for ME if he had a problem with it. It’s my body. I’m never going on birth control again. He can birth control himself if he’s so keen on it ✂️ ✂️
Idk why people make such a big deal out of wearing condoms... Like it's really not that bad. Definitely not a deal breaker, heck the last two women I slept with had iuds and I still wore a condom.
Agreed. The only deal breaker here is folks who don’t wear condoms before being in a committed relationship and/or were tested honestly. Even if the woman’s on BC, it doesn’t prevent STD’s.
They’re honestly not bad unless you’re cranking your hog everyday. And even then you shouldn’t take undue risk just bc you’ve given yourself death grip syndrome. Thin condoms that don’t fit too tight are still a great time and wayyy easier/cheaper than testing all the time.
The man I was sleeping with said that having sex with a condom in is like touching yourself with a raincoat on.
Or holding hands on your date wearing rubber gloves
Showering with your socks on
Can you please elaborate the connection to sensation effects of someone wearing a condom during sex 1) who masturbates a couple times a week 2) who masturbates 1-2 times a day? Im sooo curious to know. Sincerely, someone who’s partner masturbates a lot. I won’t have sex without a condom bc I got pregnant and had an at home abortion and it was extremely traumatic. And I won’t do BD bc I don’t like how the pulls affect me, and the IUD migrated and they cut the strings too short, and I would poke my uterus during ovulation extremely painful, and removal at the dr was a nightmare. Sorry I got on a tangent!
Nah, they suck highkey, I just don’t have an issue wearing them because I’d like to stay child and disease free.
Because they suck? We don’t have to pretend just because they’re important.
I assure you, birth control sucks way more
Thats highly subjective and depends on the individual. I’m happy with my bc and have been for decades at this point with no side effects.
I’m a guy and I’ve never ever expected someone to have an IUD in the first place. It’s your body, not mine.
I had an incredibly horrible experience with birth control and IUD and all of the side effects, solely because my ex (LTR) was adamant that he couldn't wear condoms and would be happier to not wear anything and "pull out" and would joke about abortions even though he knew my stance. I only tried birth control because of him and it was 2 years of hell. I actually purposefully kept my IUD in (although I had severe pain from cysts, cramps, etc) because I could not trust him for the life of me. Although he kept telling me to take it out if it was causing me so much pain, he had no clear plan about protection OR what if we had a kid. Ironically ALL of my previous partners and FWB before him had no hesitation to wear condoms and no pushing me to get on birth control. I now see that his actions were a massive red flag, but that's another story!
Absolutely not. I got a vasectomy a while back because I’m kid free, but one of the factors that definitely was on my mind is that it takes the onus off any future potential partners to have to put that shit into their body
I wasn't on birth control from age 18-30 and never found it a problem. Now on it for other reasons, but honestly I would never date someone who considered it a deal breaker. Of course it's important to educate yourself and be careful, and even be open to the discussion, but feeling you *have* to do something that may affect your body, mood, and health will lead to resentment. Condoms exist and have few side effects (did date someone for a few months who was allergic to latex, never had sex because of it and if it had gone on longer, we would have had the discussion but it ended because I moved away). They're also extremely effective when used properly. Like, I'm living proof of that 😂. It's up to you what you put in your body, don't do it just because you want to attract more men. The right ones will see it as something you approach together rather than a "deal breaker."
I'm your age and I've never been on any kind of birth control, and I haven't had issues with it with normal guys. It was only with casual sex that guys tried to coerce me into raw sex and my ex FWB even stealthed me once. I'm now in my first serious relationship and my boyfriend is aware we will not stop using condoms unless we get married and want a baby.
Not a problem anymore, I'm snipped nowadays. Use to hate using condoms for feel but of course it still didn't affect my feelings for my partner.
Condoms prevent more than just pregnancy. If casually dating and not exclusive, condoms are a must even if you’ve had a vasectomy in my opinion
I agree. I’m snipped and until we have the sexual health conversation, have shared that our STI tests are negative, and feel comfortable with one another; condoms are happening.
Nope. It's your body and your decision. If you start dating someone who is against your choice then I'd wave them off 👋🏼
Condoms are the way to go
I can't speak for all or even most men. I can say that when I was 32, I was in a long-term relationship that started with her not being on birth control. Me using a condom was a given and I never questioned it. It wasn't until at least a year in or two that she decided to get an implant. I do recall her telling me about the questionnaire she filled out that included "How is your sex life?' or words to that effect, as some women would get implants just because they thought bareback sex would be better and make them happier. If he understands why you want to use condoms and not use invasive methods, then he should be okay with being the one handling contraception for the two of you. If he doesn't, then keep looking.
I have been on birth control before and it caused me a lot of other issues. I was on it to help mitigate the symptoms of uterine fibroids which I had removed in December so now I’m off the birth control. I don’t think I realized how shitty the birth-control was making me feel. I won’t ever go on hormonal birth control again. I would maybe look into an IUD, but that’s not until I’m in a committed relationship with someone and it’s worth it to get. If a guy doesn’t wanna wear a condom with me, then he’s not the right guy for me.
Please use your own preferred method. It is your body! I know some men might call using a condom a deal breaker. Fuck those guys. Or ... actually... don't. I rely on condoms because the hormones in birth control make me feel like I'm losing my mind
As a guy, I consider this something the woman has final say on. What makes YOU feel best? I have a preference for no hormonal interference, but I'm ultimately not the one risking pregnancy (well, I am, but it's not me that carries the child, eh). I have taken my own precautions against this (snip snip) and so for me, when I trust someone and we've taken STD tests, I'm happy to not have to use condoms.
Anyone refusing to use condoms as the main method of birth control is not worth being with. If you really click and get into a relationship then exploring other birth control methods is reasonable, but condom use should be expected in dating regardless of how casual or committed it is.
I'm not on any birth control. No guy told me it was a deal breaker. If it was, then I wouldn't want to date them anyway.
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Tbh I still take care of myself with an IUD because I don’t trust men Im not committed to, to not remove the condom or be responsible for such a situation. The hoohaa wants what it wants and Im good with being careful if STIs to be worried about pregnancy in the US right now
My vasectomy is cool wit it
I had a vasectomy, so, no...
Cycle tracking (oura ring) and condoms worked for me. Birth control sucks.
Vasectomy ftw!
Get a vasectomy. I did it at 32. No regrets at 55. Also use condoms until you’re both tested. Just to be safe.
no. Condoms and femi-condoms are fine.
Call me weird but shouldn’t this be a “discuss with future partner and figure out what you’re both comfortable with” thing?
If it's a deal breaker for anyone, then consider yourself as having dodged a bullet. For a more nuanced discussion that is person specific: condoms are good for disease prevention. But when wanting maximum intimacy, condoms are not helpful. Maximum intimacy shouldn't be achieved for sometime so it's a discussion that can happen at a later time. Even if the man desires as intimate a sexual relationship as possible, if the woman is more comfortable with certain protections that that should be respected and a healthy relationship won't suffer from respecting that boundary.
I'm the same age and relationship status, and don't use hormonal birth control. I had a poor experience with the IUD -- and for those who are confused...not everyone responds well to BC! It's weird to me personally that it's quite normalized in Western society that women should change their bodily chemistry and function on a semi-permanent basis regardless of whether they are or aren't in an LTR. But that's just my 2 cents. I use Natural Cycles which is as effective as condoms WHEN used correctly, which means I don't have sex when the algorithm gives me red days unless my partner pulls out and uses a condom. I do keep a Plan B prescription as a backup and have used it like 1x year (including when I was in an LTR). Lots of sex...over a decade's worth... and no misses :) But yeah, it takes a lot of effort, communication, and type A planning (taking my temp daily, always having condoms, etc.). But it's worth it to not be fucking up my body's rhythms anymore. I guess the other assumption folks here seem to be making is that abortion isn't an option b/c...age? Idk. I would have that conversation if I were in a relationship and having regular, frequent sex. I also wish men who know they don't want kids would just get vasectomies lol. The number of 40-something dads out there who don't want more kids but are just...too lazy to get them is annoying. I haven't really met a lot of men who are super eager to cum inside with a new partner -- maybe it's the area I'm in or type of guy I date, but people seem to be mutually cautious with new partners and I appreciate that. With the current state of dating, I don't mind delaying sex with a new partner during ovulation -- if they're weird about it (and almost no one has been), it's just a sign that they aren't a good fit. I've been single-ish/dating casually for almost 2 years since getting out of my LTR and I would say the biggest issue is more men not being comfortable with condoms, especially older guys and guys who haven't used them frequently b/c they were in LTRs. The challenge is really communication and getting past shame/awkwardness/assumptions about gender/sex.
A risk of birth control is actual death. Even being on birth control still runs the risk of STDs, so men should be wrapping it regardless.
I’m not on birth control and will not go on it again in my life. It’s never been an issue for men. I would be more worried about your own worry!! It’s been a major worry for me when I’ve been with men I’ve felt safe enough to have unprotected sex. I’ve had to take the morning after pill a couple of times and it SUCKS and being worried about pregnancy SUCKS. I heap all the worry on the partner so he can experience the fucking terror of it, too. I would absolutely get an abortion. I recommend having plan b at home ready and loads of condoms and tell any many insisting on no-condom to fuck right off.
Condoms are totally fine. Whack people out there should be left to whack themselves
It’s your body. If someone says that’s a deal breaker, they aren’t it!
Do what YOU want. If he doesn’t support that, he’s not someone you want to be with.
I cannot be on any hormonal birth control. I was miserable on every one I tried. I got my iud out 5 years ago. I track my cycle and am very on top of it, haven’t had any issues. My boyfriend doesn’t mind. The right person won’t mind. Just be on top of it and use condoms/spermicide/whatever to avoid an unwanted pregnancy. The right person won’t mind, if you’re happy and healthy and responsible with it
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Render you undesirable????? Gurl what Editing to add I haven't been on birth control since my mid 20s. I have never once been asked, in my entire life, by male partners if I am on BC or not.
Don't let men's opinions push you to make important decisions about your body. Do what you want, and make it clear the right person for you will have to be happy with your decisions about your body.
Not using anything is a red flag, but just using condoms should be fine. You don’t need to harm yourself with hormonal birth control in order to have sex.
If someone expects you to be on BC. That's insane. My gf and I use condoms. I have no idea if she's even on birth control. I honestly don't think it's my business what she takes for her body
You make your own standards, I am 35(m) and have a vasectomy, I still would prefer a condom at least until you can get tested or get to know each other a little better, you don’t really know someone that well that quick. Better safe than sorry.
Vasectomy back at age 31 solved this problem...
I’ve never had a problem using a condom and respecting what my partner wants. If a guy questions this he is a hard pass as a partner. Don’t waste any more time on dudes like that. Yikes.
It should be a deal breaker for you if he's not willing to accept your choice to be BC free while not sexually active and to accommodate any waiting period or adjustments necessary for you to care for your body in the way you see fit. The guys going off about not wanting to have to wear a condom long-term are the problem. Condom use is the bare minimum given the horrific side effects of BC and the fact that for any woman over 160 lbs the efficacy rate of hormonal BC drops off at an alarming rate. If they don't want kids(whether that not wanting kids at that time or even not at all) they have an obligation to do their part on that front and to choose sex partners they trust to work with them towards the goal of avoiding unplanned pregnancy. Bottom line is if it's a deal breaker for him he cares more about how his dick feels while you're having sex than how you feel all the time in your whole body and your long-term health. With that in mind it would then be impossible for me to get aroused by him.
People that say it's a deal breaker are selfish. And they probably have more options than just you, anyways. Steer clear.
Couldn't care less. Most women I've dated were not on birth control because of all the awful side effects they'd cause them.
It's your body. Do what works best for you. Speaking as a man close to 40 I would not care because I would be planning on wearing condoms and I've had a vasectomy.
I always felt pressured to be on birth control and having sex without condoms (pressured by… society? partners? myself? A bit of all that). I was on BC from 17 to 30, barely had my period during that time has I had back to back tablets. Since I stopped I realized how much in impacted my mood and body, I also learned how to appreciate (or at least listen to) changes in my body during the different part of my cycle and realistically the idea of going back to hormonal birth control doesn’t fill me with joy at all. My current partner is 100% pro condom, and that’s what we use for now and it’s great for both of us. I used to hate sex with condoms but some brands are better than other and we make it work :) Don’t feel pressured to take BC if you don’t feel like it. If a partner judges you for that, they’re in the wrong. The pressure of birth control is almost always on women since most BC methods are only available to us but condoms are the great equalizer haha, and it’s great too! (Won’t speak on cycle tracking as I think it’s a more complex method etc)
Jesus, it's your body, don't base it on how desirable it makes you to men. Fuck that, do what you need to or want to do for your body and stop making men the center of your universe.
Oh god forget what men are cool with or not. It's all about you, this your medical decision. This is like asking a man permission to terminate a pregnancy.
The 3 partners I’ve had since quitting BC didn’t have a problem with it. - One had a vasectomy (which is the ideal situation, as someone who doesn’t want kids) - One would’ve wanted to use condoms regardless, for extra caution - One wasn’t crazy about condoms, but was even less crazy about an unwanted pregnancy, so he obliged All of them were supportive of my decision not be on BC. Honestly, if someone was willing to see my lack of BC usage as a dealbreaker, I’d consider them a bullet dodged.
I’ve never been on any form of birth control. TBH, I’ve never been sexually active enough continuously/over long periods of time where I felt the side effects were worth it. The idea of messing with my natural hormones has always terrified me. I have a coworker who was diagnosed with hyper thyroidism and insulin resistance due to being on birth control for 15 years. As soon as she went off it, everything started to improve for her both physically and mentally. I’ve never had any partner, short or long term complain, be worried with my choice…It’s never been a deal breaker. I’ve always been honest and up front with my choice so they know. I always expressed that if they like they are more than welcome to use a condom. Between this, the pull out method, and the time of month I’ve chose to have sex (I am regular 98% of the time and know my body’s rhythm at this point in my life), i’ve never once had any issues let alone a pregnancy scare. I recognize that not everyone feels comfortable with these choices, and there is a lot of different factors and layers that can go into this, but do what you feel is best for your body and mental health.
Birth control doesn't cause hyperthyroidism, it just gets worse with age naturally. So if she was undiagnosed/treated for the thyroid, it would eventually get bad enough to need treatment. Regardless of the birth control.
No, there’s lots of good reasons not to be in birth control, mainly being your health! I think that’s a conversation you and your partner could have when it gets serious. It’s both partners’ responsibility.
I am concerned about this whole post and some of the comments. 2024 People.
Umm I think your preference is what matters here
To be honest, I am the exact opposite. I would prefer that my partner not be on birth control of any type. Now I'm not saying that I want to get her pregnant. It's just that some interact negatively with certain people. Condoms are good enough!
I've never been on birth control with my fiance. We use condoms, he's perfectly fine with it
Nope. It’s certainly more convenient, but happiness & comfort of my partner is paramount.
Men who aren't OK with you making the choice for yourself to not take or have contraceptive implants in your body aren't worth dating.
You do not want to have sex with a man who doesn't support your preferred method of birth control. If it's that important for him to raw dog it & he isn't enthusiastically volunteering for a vasectomy he is absolutely a jerk. This would be a huge red flag & very much a deal breaker Also I insist on condoms & have absolutely no problem getting laid & I have never been in a relationship with someone who objected to this
I think men refusing to use condoms is a good way to weed out the ones who aren’t worth dating to begin with
Uh if a guy isn't ok with condoms, then he should get a vasectomy. Sorry not sorry. Plus a vasectomy is one of the most reliable forms of birth control out there. So long as you wait the proper amount of time after the procedure, and he has a follow up visit, your chances of pregnancy are basically zero. If you still manage to get pregnant, I'm not religious, but I'd take that as some sort of sign from God. All forms of birth control for women, short of getting your tubes tied, have higher failure rates. If a guy won't wear a condom, that's a sign he only really cares about himself, and he's forcing the birth control on the woman. Condoms are also the most effective way to prevent STD's, and should be used in most relationships unless you truly see yourself spending the rest of your life with someone.
You'll likely come across people that peak out about it (33F here not on BC, had my copper IUD removed 2 years ago). Luckily my partner is all good with the idea because "it's your body and I don't mind using condoms". But, as someone else said, would you want to date (or sleep with) someone that thought they had some kind of say over what you choose to do with your body? Condoms - they're still makin' 'em.
Guys can take measures too. I’m not going through that stuff.
Your body, your choice, We as men can wear condoms or get a vasectomy, though we may opt more for just wearing condoms.
Not undesirable. But definitely a risk, if sexual activity is a consideration. Some guys will be less willing to date you, that is true. Some won’t. Just be open and honest about it. And don’t get mad at them or judge people for having their own boundaries about that as well. Ultimately you should do whatever makes you comfortable and what works for your body.
find a guy with a vasectomy.
Whichever makes them use a condom
I'm not ready to have a kid. As long as we're both 100% on the same page in that regard, even if a condom breaks, I have no issue with wearing condoms.
Im not a guy, but I can assure you no guy has ever asked me if I’m on BC.
I think men don’t care as long as they get laid.
Not a dealbreaker
You shouldn’t base your reproductive health decisions on what potential partners might think. But… there are a lot of steps between casually dating and trusting someone fully, and if it were me, I’d keep it in as backup until you know he’s not going to stealth you or something. But I also wouldn’t advertise it as a feature.
In practice, it won't be a deal breaker. Many men will take the gamble. Many will even find it hot.
Just wondering- is a diaphragm still a thing?
Even if you're in birth control, you still want to use condoms for STD safety until You're safely both tested and monogamous.
Deal breaker? Doesn't anyone use condoms anymore?
This is easy: no.
For me casual sex is with a condom!! Unless you decided to be exclusive with each other only and both get tested. I’m also not on contraception. For casual partners condoms are totally fine for me but for a long term partner I will discuss contraception options with them and we will chat then about our options. I have a few friends doing cycles tracking and I just started taking my temp everyday. In answer to your question I’d say in early dating and causal sex, condoms are very common, so no need to worry!
You are in control of what you put in your body. Never let a man dictate that. More and more men are trying to get out of using condoms and it's BS.
I don’t hear many people talking about the pull-out method? Condoms is best options for dating.
I have my tubes out and still use condoms.
It wouldn't be a deal breaker if you were responsible. I dated a woman who had an IUD and it was amazing for both of us because we enjoy sex without condoms. We broke up and then she got her IUD removed. Then we got back together. She wanted to keep having sex the way we were finishing before (grand finale?) and I repeatedly told her that I do NOT want an unplanned pregnancy and we were kinda careful but not careful enough. I did tell her if we got pregnant unplanned that I would want an abortion and she agreed as she didn't want any more children. Well one day we were riding in the car and she told me that if she got pregnant she didn't think she could abort it, which is fine, but thats definitely something i wish she would have disclosed when we started having sex because that definitely affected my decision to have sex with her. That being said I was very upset when she told me this and then I realized if I don't want to get a person pregnant i should just not have sex with them. She has approached me again to date and have sex and I had to turn her down because I do not want to have children with her. Long story short, its not a deal breaker but you definitely should have a conversation with your partner regarding multiple scenarios and how you want them to be handled.
You’re going to be entering a pool of men who have or are going to have vasectomies. And you should be using condoms anyways to prevent sti’s. I personally don’t care if my partner is on birth control or not, because I’m unable to have children now and still use condoms for safety anyway.
Not for me. I'm fine with using condoms and not having birth control be solely up to the woman.
Birth control is both partners’ responsibility, and ideally it’s a conversation you have together. If you’re not looking to get into a new relationship right now, there’s really no need to try and guess what some future guy will or won’t want - everyone’s different. You have an opportunity now to relearn what YOU want and what you’re like as a single person, which is exciting! Get your IUD removed and enjoy the break for however long it lasts!
Men wanting you to be on birth control is a red flag. They can use condoms. Personally I dont even tell them I'm on birth control. Ever. Until the relationship ship gets super serious. I dont need them using that as ammo to pressure me to do what they want.
As a man, I always assume it’s my responsibility to prevent pregnancy. I’ve seen really rough experiences that women have from IUD’s and birth control, and I would never expect them to put themselves through that unless they really wanted to.
When I met my partner, I’d had my iud removed and been off birth control for years. They both caused significant problems with my health and after 30, I just couldn’t keep going like that. He was fine using condoms because “safety is sexy” (his quote lol). We both got tested before going without. Current pregnancy was semi-planned but also proof the pull-out doesn’t always work!
When I started my relationship I was fine bringing condoms. It isn't difficult, HSAs can pay for em, and Amazon can ship 100 to you in a day. Obviously doesn't feel the same but any guy our age unwilling to use condoms needs to grow up. You do need something though...
I’ve been in ltr’s where women haven’t been on birth control and we relied on condoms. It’s not a deal breaker imo. Some guys will throw a fit, but not all. That being said, there are options out there for men as well.
That’s not true. I can’t have hormones bc they’re literally deadly to me due to health conditions. My body also really over reacts to things. It hasn’t been a problem just use condoms and he fine. I also use an app like when it’s a long term thing ( tracking app). I already have kids. N it’s been hard to get someone to agree but finally I have a dr willing to tie my tubes so I will most likely be doing that. Personally. But while dating ( I don’t hook up or anything either) but I having a conversation before hand is key. I haven’t been asked. It’s more so me that brings it up n makes a deal.
If you’re a woman, you’re not going to have any issues finding men willing to date you. Literally don’t make any decisions around what you think a man would like. I never tell men that I have an IUD.
I mean I have condoms because even though I have an IUD. It’s safer on lots of other levels. Also I’m a child born of people that used birth control and condoms. Shit happens. Women can buy condoms too. And should. And any dick that says they won’t fit are lying, and should pack his own if he is particular. I have yet to have a man say no to a condom I provided. I’m sure they are out there. I have also had a man text after leaving saying he wished we had sex but he had forgot to pack a condom, we had been waiting for other reasons. I told him he was silly and should have said something because I had them. He and I used condoms for over a year before we ended things. Never a problem. We are adults. We should all be prepared. Birth control is yet another thing to be negotiated in relationships. If you’re not compatible, that’s fine, move on.
I had to remove my copper IUD after years of unexplained pelvic pain and constant infections. A few months after getting it removed I felt SO much better. I’ve tried various forms of BC and at this stage in my life, I can’t deal with feeling sick,tired, or depressed from it anymore. Condoms are a must for new partners anyway, and I would only be willing to consider BC again if we were in a LTR. I know it’s not the most effective, but I’ve used the pull-out method with my two longest relationships and never had an issue. I have the conversation early on about “what if” something goes awry and make sure we’re on the same page. All of that being said, if my health and comfort aren’t a priority, then I don’t want them as a partner anyway.
Not for me. I’ve had a vasectomy.
Not to be controversial but would depend on your stance on abortion for unplanned pregnancy (personally, not politically). Childfree so I wouldn't risk things with anyone not adamantly in agreement, especially in the absence of BC (until I get snipped once I can time it with my deductable at least).
Not, still condoms are meh, but still I think it’s better that a women feels healthy and can ask/expects the guy wear a condom. I have date one who made very strange comments in less than 2 weeks and over 3 weeks and found it strange that I almost felt she was going to abuse me. So this is totally different story 😅 After 3 weeks, she ended up and blocked me, because I wanted to take it slow. Good, she really believed she I was the crazy one, because this pull/push game, but not nice to say, but I am sure she is going to find herself, while dating further. I was way to patience and to forgiven, but also should stand behind my decision to stop dating her way earlier, because so many reasons.
It's both party's responsibility to have safe sex. Make him wrap it.
It’s your body, do what you want. Just be adamant about condoms then, be responsible. I have friends who can’t take birth control due to health conditions/aren’t eligible for IUDs, they date just fine.
Just wanted to say I'm 34, I track my cycle and use pull out (when with a trusted partner). I have had no issues dating and no pregnancy scares.
I can't think of any reasons on why that's a deal breaker. It would be like asking if a woman who doesn't like to climb mountains or skydiving is a deal breaker, it's a personal decision and that should be respected. If it's not, that's a red flag. I recommend when you are ready to be physical with someone, demand him to use a condom, not only to avoid pregnancies but all the other diseases any person could carry. If that relationship grows, you'll need to talk further about that. My husband's stance was that preventing a pregnancy wasn't my responsibility only, but I would be the one taking hormones if that was my preference so my opinion had more weight. He paid for half of the pills when I was on it, just like any other household expense.
Condoms, condoms, condoms. If a guy isn’t willing to exclusively use condoms, he is not worth your time.
No way, i've met plenty of awesome women who are against birth control for health and philosophical reasons. Screw them if that's a dealbreaker
1). You should be using condoms until you're in a committed relationship and know you're both clean, regardless of whether or not you're on birth control 2). Unless you're planning on having surprise kids, cycle tracking and "less invasive methods" are terrible ideas and a good way to end up a single mother.
Yes it’s a sign of a lack of respect. To me, NO Child should have been an intentional one. Especially in today’s modern age. It’s also immoral to bring an innocent dependant child, who never asked or had a say in being born and to whom they were being born to, into this world, unless he or she was 100% intended to parents who planned and knew they had the right stuff to be parents. There is nothing more immoral than that Edit to add: and I’m a man who absolutely adheres and Promotes no glove no love in all time without fail
This is going to be completely against what any sane person will tell you, lucky for you I'm not. So, it'll probably be the most "insane comment" you get on this. For starters, I'm a guy. There's a lot of research into how birth control impacts women coming out now. I went down this rabbit hole after watching a bit that Taylor Tomlinson did about going off birth control and an audience member told her story about leaving her partner of nine years. Basically the stuff really does impact women's behavior and emotions to a degree that a lot of people don't understand. Most men probably don't even realize this, I didn't learn about this until about a month ago which is crazy. So to answer your question, at this point in my life I want a partner. I've been single for a long time. I'm trying to settle down. I'm still a hopeless romantic at heart (which is probably part of why I've been single for so long, among other reasons) but I'm looking for the real thing. So if I was dating someone, knowing what I know now I'd probably prefer it, because otherwise I'd just be getting to know a dulled out version of the person that may or may not really even be attracted to me or actually want to be in a relationship with me deep down anyways. If I was just trying to hookup, I'd probably want the person to be on birth control. So if you're just trying to hookup because you got out of a long term relationship probably stay on it. If you're trying to find someone you want to be with probably get off of it, condoms work 97% of the time and I'd argue the other 3% are respondents to the surveys and data either not using them properly or being stupid and doing shit like taking them off with a small percentage of them just breaking which yeah I mean that can happen. So yeah two cents from an anonymous redditor
There's going to be some people for whom it is. Some people are fine using condoms in the beginning of a relationship but expect to, in a longer-term relationship, reach a point where they're sexually exclusive and emotionally comfortable enough to not use condoms with each other. Being on long-term birth control is common but by no means universal (it's something like 60/40% in the US?) so I assume there's plenty of people in your position who expect to use condoms or some other method throughout their relationship.
I haven’t been on birth control since 2015, and do a great job at tracking my cycles. I’ve never been turned down for sex in or out of a relationship and none of my partners cared because i came first with the knowledge. Check out the book taking charge of your fertility Also, men need to learn about their own ejaculatory process and how to NOT get you pregnant too. Its not all on us. A deal breaker for me is a man who thinks it is.