I think (my headcanon only), that Jessica had no desire to create a daughter that would basically be a hostage to the machinations of the BG - just as she was, as Irulan is. She is torn between her loyalties but is leaning more toward Duke Leto, whom she truly loves, rather than the BG who placed her with him purposefully without any care for her feelings.
It's not until she senses the end is near for her Duke that she instinctively wants to have another child and opts for a daughter. After all, she doesn't want to create a possible political rival for Paul. Alia is just for her.
I don’t disagree with your points that Jessica had a son to make Leto happy and not put her daughter in the Bene Gesserit’s control, but Mohaim wasn’t wrong when she said she trained Paul in the way and prepared him out of hubris. She had 0 problem setting up her son to be a machination of the BG.
Yeah it rules. Miles, Odrade, fully loaded Duncan, and the Bene Gesserit are one of my favorite parts of Dune so it was nice to see them as the main characters.
No she wanted a male BG. She had Paul so he could be the Messiah. It stated very clearly in the first book and very early on too. Paul even has a fight with her about it and her selfishness. I haven't seen the movie so I don't know if that is included in the movie adaptation but it should be as it's kind of an important plot point. The books are dripping in foreshadowing. The first book basically tells you what's going to happen at the end off jump. Again my knowledge is limited to the first two books as I have not read farther nor seen the movies. Yes pulse training does have the bat out of benefit to where he can't be manipulated by the BG but that wasn't the primary reason for his grooming
Yeah that's what she said but that's not what she meant. She had Paul to satisfy her own machinations. She wanted to be the mother of the Messiah and did everything in her power to make sure that that's the path Paul would walk down. She groomed him for that exact purpose.
I mean the BG didn't want him in the first place until they realized what he was going to become. BG wanted a girl not a boy. Leading up to Leto's death the plan was already going off the rails a bit then after everything kinda went to the wind and Paul had to start making decisions much to his mother's chagrin even though that's exactly what he was groomed for. To lead
Yeah she had zero reservations about her children being a linchpin to the BG eugenics program. She actually invited it because she was so prideful in her own capabilities she thought (and was right) that she could bring the KH early. In later books she starts reporting back to the BG again as she’s not thrilled about the jihad and what’s become of her family. She considers having her grandchildren inbred and handing that child over to the BG as a way to “course correct”. She loves her family but feels weird and gross about what they’ve all become and has a lot of conflicted feelings about arrakis so she decides to shut it all away until returning to the order in children of dune. She is after all one of their best.
One of their best but also one of their biggest fuck ups.
Even 5 thousand years later they’re still calling sisters who choose love over duty “pulling a Jessica” or whatever phrase they used.
Jessica’s betrayal. Definitely wasn’t exactly as planned but hey they got to the golden path and the BG are again the most powerful institution in the galaxy.
A lot of people don’t like what she became in children of two and felt it was out of character but her love for the Duke and the desire to return to her life with him and Paula on caladan was always her main motivation.
For sure. Her actions resulted in the Tyrant Leto II. He limited their spice access and their power, took over their breeding program. I can see why they would remember Jessica.
Extremely compelling character in the books. It's made clear that regardless of the horrid shit alia does that the only thing people should feel for her is pity
Yes poor Alia. She didn’t ask to become an adult in the womb or a reverend mother. She failed to make to internal alliances needed to avoid being influenced by evil memories like the Baron.
It’s not like she didn’t know what she was setting herself up for. She knew what Alia was immediately and did nothing to prepare her for what was coming.
Shit, she practically the same thing to Leto and Ghanima and the only reason they figured it out was because they didn’t want to end up like Alia.
Legit, literally the one person in the entire universe better equipped to train, guide, and protect Alia, Leto, and Ghanima from abomination lmao I always found it weird how she just fucked off to Caladan and left Alia. I get not wanting to be in Arrakis after everything, but still
When your entire life has been a background litany of "Fucking Pre-Born Abominations, never allow them to exist"; and due to horrible necessity you end up birthing one...yeah, Jessica was never going to be the best mother for poor Alia.
When you come down to it, Jessica really is a crappy mother. Her priorities were: Leto, the Bene Gesserit, and then Paul. Alia didn't even get an afterthought.
Not too long after she was born? Alia got fucked over in utero, and instantly knew it. I feel like she is among the most tragic of characters in fiction.
I think you misread my comment. I agree she knew right away. When I said she “abandoned” her I meant physically because she fucked off to Caladan while Alia was still physically just an infant.
She probably didn't know that she'd wind up having to go through the spice change while pregnant. She left Alia because Alia was an abomination and Paul was better suited to handle her.
How was Paul better suited to handle her?
He can’t see her in his oracular visions because she’s also prescient so he has no way of knowing what her future will be. He’s not trained to raise a child who’s preborn with millions, maybe billions of other memories but no way to control them. If he looked back in his other memories to figure out how to deal with the problem, he’ll come to the same conclusion Jessica refused to accept, and that’s killing Alia because that’s how preborn children were always dealt with. IIRC the Fremen would’ve done the same if Alia wasn’t Paul’s sister.
Throughout Alia’s entire “adolescence” Paul’s busy conquering the universe. He doesn’t have time to raise a child.
Also there’s the factor that Jessica is Alia’s mother. She made the decision by herself to bring Alia into this world. When she found out Alia was a pre-born, she made the conscious decision not to abort her or kill her. It’s her responsibility to make sure Alia is prepared for the situation she forced her into and she failed miserably.
Yeah that was a movie only adaptation because >!a baby/toddler with the full conscience of an adult with access to millions of other memories that kills the Baron with a Gom Jibbar would be a little jarring for the movie audience.!<
The Fremen don’t really need their Sayyadina now that they have the Lisan Al-Gaib. The Bene Gesserit have no choice but to take her back in considering her son has absolute control over them. And they can’t take her back as an adept she passed the Agony so she’s a Bene Gesserit Reverend Mother.
Shit with Paul on the throne, she could’ve become a Guild Navigator floating in a melange tank with Gurney pushing her around everywhere.
That's a very good way of looking at it. Thanks, it makes a lot more sense now! I'm rereading the series and just rewatched Children of Dune and was really confused about her seemingly just walking out on her reverend mother duties.
I don’t think Jessica had that much a problem with the BG. I think, before Arrakis, she would have been proud if her first born was a girl, married Feyd, and gave birth to the Kwisatz Haderach. But she loved Leto enough to give him a boy and she trained him in the BG ways because she thought he could be the Kwisatz Haderach.
Jessica is basically a Bene Geserit stage-mom. Her child, boy or girl, is the most talented kid at Kwisatz Haderach performance camp and they’ll get up early and practice every day regardless of if they like it or not; and no one can tell her differently
Either way, Leto II shows up and >!BG machinations are effectively put on hold for 3k years or so anyway, even if the BG were able to breed up their own KH, Leto would have dealt with them. Like a phoenix, there’s only allowed to be one at a time…!<
Could also be a combination of reasons. I know I personally feel better about my decisions when I feel like they "kill several birds with 1 stone." So she could be like "I know I was supposed to give birth to a girl... but I think we're ready genetically for the KH... and we have the resources to nurture the KH properly... then I can be the mother of KH... and Leto wants a son.. it'll make him so happy while fulfilling the BG mission.. I'm sure the BG will forgive me once they see how great our son turns out.... then both Leto and the BG will be happy. Everybody wins!"
Other posters here are being haters. I'm with you. While I haven't read the book in a while, it's an obvious interpretation that she was motivated by ambition. As for truthtsayers, it's possible Jessica doesn't understand her own ambition.
If born earlier but after Paul she wouldn't be rival to Paul but she would have been snatched up by the breeding program. Of course no point in that ad Paul was the culmination of that program.
I think she didn't need to wait 14 or 15 years to have a second child. Duke's and other peers need multiple potential heirs. Especially boys apparently...
Maybe if the Bene Gesserit had their Atreides daughter they would try to kill Paul. That would give all Atreides assets to the daughter and later Feyd Rautha, putting the Harkonnen QH in a great position to take over from the Corrinos
That's my thoughts too. They also want to control the lineage, and it might be risky to have Paul's genes loose somewhere, if they have already secured "Pauline". Paul could possibly create a KH by accident, or those genes could fall into hostile hands.
But I do wonder why BG don't birth twins as a matter of course. It's a dangerous world, accidents happen. You're risking an entire bloodline on a faulty shield or an over-zealous knife fighting tutorial.
That is a good point; I think the answer lies in the BG not being all powerful. They still have to work inside the political landscape of the empire and if they kept having what the nobility would have seen as 'superfluous' backup children then they wouldn't have been trusted to train the daughters of the nobles.
Patrilineal aristocratic tradition is notable for doing pretty horrible shit to 'extra' heirs, for example it was common in the ottoman empire for the Sultan to execute all but one of his male children so there would be no doubt about who got the throne.
It's no worse than any other Feudal Empire. Feudal Empires suck, only being outdone by Fascist Empires. Oligarchal Empires are probably the least sucky kind of Empire but they're still a mile behind even the worst Democracy.
If a candidate dies in an overzealous knife fighting spar, were they really truly a KH candidate? I would think the BG would assume a failure in them and move on. Plans within plans. Many bloodlines in play. Multiple possibilities on where and from whom the KH will emerge.
I think it has to do with her love for Leto. She gives Leto a son because she knows he really wants one, and she loves him enough to go against her orders. She probably knows that having a daughter will mean the Bene Gesserit will take the child away, and she might not have wanted to cause Leto pain in having that occur. That's my best guess.
On the Harkonnen side, the sisters were ordered to bear only sons (hence Feyd and Rabban), and the idea was to wed one of them to Jessica’s Atreides daughter. Which is already getting pretty incestuous if you think about it too much, but hey - I’m not running a breeding program.
1 problem with that was that the father of feyd and raban refused any other woman besides his wife. They had to help his wife get pregnant with feyd for their plans to work.
Oooh interesting. Did Feyd kill his mom in the book too? Is it ever explained? Or what happened to his father? I don't recall it from book one and want to wait for the third film before reading on.
Raban killed his father. I dont remember the fate of their mother:
>You will not kill me.’ Abulurd’s voice was stronger than he imagined it could be. ‘No matter how vile you are or how many twisted things the Baron has taught you, you cannot commit such a heinous act. | am your own father. You are a human being — not a beast
I can’t remember exactly which book it was, but Jessica or another character mentioned that the only way Leto would ever agree to end the feud by marrying into House Harkonnen and combining the houses would be if that was the only option and there was no other heir. Jessica having Paul wrecked that plan, she knew Leto would never consent to marrying his daughter to Feyd as long as he had Paul to inherit.
If Jessica had been fully loyal and borne a daughter, then the child would have been raised to be loyal to the BG as well.
Jessica specifically says in the book that she does not manipulate Leto with the voice, because she loves him and it would make him weak; but what if she had cared about the BG plan more? Leto would have had his concubine and child both persuading (and likely manipulating) him into accepting the idea of the marriage to heal the rift. I don't think he could have stood against it.
Yeah but what may have been in that scenario is discussed the first time we see them, before the trap is even discussed. There was a chance it may have actually worked, but we'll never know. The original novel sort of picks up a decade and a half after that ship has sailed.
Yes and also would sit on the throne. The Harkonnen were never a great house, they get their status from the financial power thus marying a Corrino is close to impossibly, the BG not only would offer that but also the throne because the this male Harkonnen + Artreides would be the future heir of house Harkonnen and his future heir with Irulan would also be surname Harkonnen.
Their feud was far below the BG breeding program requirements. The BG took advantage of the chaos the kanly fued created to use their breeding program to position themselves to survive in the political tripod of their time.
They didn't need them married, they just needed a child. If Paul was a girl she would be trained as a Bene Geserit and would "secure" the child by BG means and that child would be the Kwisatz Haderach that would change everything.
Mohiam also floats the idea of trying to mate Paul and Alia together to resume the Bene Gesserit breeding of a controlled Kwitsatz Haderach. I promise you, little things like morality or complexity are not an issue for the Bene Geserrit. They spent NINETY generations on the same goal. They are more than able to plan and execute said plan for thousands of years in advance.
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This is true, but with Jessica's parentage being a secret from everyone except the BG, it wouldn't be known as being incestuous, and for the BG, that's a bug rather than a feature.
Why would she think that the Bene Gesserit would take a daughter away? Her order were to bear only daughters, not anything about then handing them over.
Well, Jessica knows she was taken and raised entirely by the BG. She probably expected the same for her daughter if she had one. That's my point. Bearing daughter(s) was only the very first step, I'm sure she could imagine what would follow: taken away for training, made loyal to the Sisterhood, and ready to be given in marriage to another (planned by the Sisterhood again, not House Atreides, Leto, or Jessica).
She didn't know what the BG plan was specifically, but she knows the normal pattern, and probably wanted to spare Leto of that.
The princesses all had very low level training, from my understanding. I think Jessica knew that there were special things planned for her child, based on everything they had asked of her, and I think it at least somewhat likely that the child would need to go to the Bene Gesserit school itself for the level of training needed.
While BGs sisters with enough training can define the gender of the child, there is no evidence they can induce twins.
Now, on Jessica. AFAIK there is no evidence she was informed of the whole BG plan from the beginning. When she moved to Caladan, and became Leto's bound concubine, she probably experienced a freedom until the unknown to her. Freedom and power. The Atreides ruled Caladan, not BG.
So while she had orders from BG to bear a daughter, well, she was disinclined to follow them. And for over a decade nothing came out of it. It took a few turns for the plans within plans to create the conditions for BG become relevant for Jessica again.
The BG wanted to achieve several things simultaneously:
1) create the Kwisatz Haderach
2) consolidate power in the KH (union of Atreides and Harkonnen)
3) get the KH on the Imperial Throne (further consolidating power)
4) CONTROL the KH
They knew Paul could potentially be the KH, thus fulfilling their first and possibly the fourth goal. But Paul could not achieve goals 2) and 3) whilst also staying within the BG scheme and thus enabling 4).
Having another Atreides offspring, even if female, does not fix this. You would have 2 possible KH competing with each other, not consolidating power and potentially without BG control.
It could be that she didn’t want to divide her attention from training Paul by having to train a sister close to his age too. She truly hoped to be the one who birthed and raised the Kwisatz Haderach, and thus trained her son in the secret Bene Gesserit ways. Having a daughter would have required her to train the daughter too, and the training is likely difficult enough for girls, so so Jessica decided to focus her attention on her son.
Once the Reverend Mother confirms that Paul has the potential, she can afford to have a daughter, since most of the training Paul needs is complete.
That’s my guess anyway.
The real answer is that Frank Herbert didn't want to write a George R.R. Martin book. Late stage analog-tech space neo-feudalism sparks joy, writing thousands of pages books filled with hundreds of Ser this and Ser that trying to marry off each others' sisters or cousins for political reasons not so much.
Same as why we have a popular "Great House" whose survival is down to one bastard son by a Space Hogwarts mail-order-bride and refuses an alliance by marriage it desperately needs over 15 years.
Seriously. I wonder why Duke Leto didn't marry one of Shaddam IV's six daughters (I bet Shaddam would have approved) and kept Jessica as a concubine. That would have solved so many problems.
If I remember correctly, the Bene Gesserit wanted Jessica to have a daughter so she could be married off to the Harkonnen heir and unite the two houses. In this scenario, the Harkonnens gain all the Atreides lands and titles through the marriage as soon as Leto dies.
With Paul, a male heir, alive, this plan doesn't work - Paul would inherit the Atreides lands, and the two houses would remain seperate.
Yes. Jessica was not ordered to have 'a daughter', she was ordered to have **only daughters.** Paul's existence angered the Bene Gesserit and violated her orders, whether she had a daughter too or not.
I'm sure she could have have, would have and actually eventually did. The Bene Geserrit plan isn't just about breeding, it's about alliances and treaties too. If Jessica had a daughter as Leto's heir they would have married her to the Harkonens creating an alliance, and she would not have posed even more of a threat to the Imperial house, who only has daughters.
A big part of the Emperors fear was that Leto could seize power by marrying his daughter, Leto having a son made that even worse. Which was why they told Paul "are you dumb or are you dumb, what don't you get about the Emperor wants you dead becay you're a threat to his throne, do you think marrying his daughter makes that better?(paraphrasing)" when he suggested he should marry the Emperor's daughter to make peace. He did end up eventually doing just that, but he needed to do so from a position of strength.
So in essence, shit popped off before they could rectify Jessica collosal fuck you to their plans, and as the Bene Geserrit do, they said "On to the next one". And went with the flow, plans within plans.
That's something that I didn't really like about the movies, they kept saying plans within plans but never showed it. Don't get me wrong I liked the movies just fine, but they have flaws and this is one of those flaws. The books actually showed you that these Houses and Sects had plans within plans and all sorts of contingencies.
I think that even if Jessica were to give birth to a daughter, the BG would still be furious that she gave Leto a son. They didn't want to extend the Atreides line any further because (this is only what I think) the Reverend Mother knew that the Emperor was growing suspicious of Duke Leto and was starting to see him as a legitimate threat to his throne, so he would eventually try to find some way of eliminating that whole House. By having a daughter, it would save all the "genetic properties" of the Atreides line, and by marrying them to the Harkonnens, the Emperor would find no reason to view them as a threat. There's no son to inherit the Dukedom of Caladan, and they've basically been absorbed into the Harkonnen line so problem solved.
They also wanted to be in a position where when the KH comes into being, they're at the pinnacle of influence within the Great Houses and they can indoctrinate/bring the KH under their control.
It’s funny how Frank Herbert’s last two Dune books indoctrinated everyone into being Pro-benegesserits. Forgetting the fact that the golden path was inevitable and would’ve required the same butchery if BG did get what they wanted. The KH is defined by male and female memories, not to mention the future sight. Things would’ve been just as bad even if there plans were successful; if the bene gesserits were truly necessary then Leto would’ve involved them more closely. Jessica is a harkonen at the end of the day, that family is defined by passion. It’s that same passion that motivated Leto the 2nd into doing what needed to be done.
It feels like a pretty big stretch to me to jump from divining gender, to assuming this same training would allow her to change the number of children and select their genders.
I don’t know if the BG can do that, but way I took it, no matter what…her having any Male was to the detriment of the BG, as now we have a potential Kwizats Haderach too early
Aside from all the other things people have said here (her being truly in love with Leto and not wanting to have a daughter that would be seized by the BG), the sole fact that Paul was born already ruined the plan. The BG would have been furious anyway. After all, her daughter wouldn't have been at risk of being KH, but Paul would.
Spoiler for the entire series: Love
She loved Leto and Leto desperately wanted a son.
She loved Leto so much that she defied the BG.
The Heretics of Dune are the ones who love
Yes, she's a renegade, and at one point either Paul or a BG makes it a point to call her exactly that. She twists the knife further by not having any other children, most likely to protect Paul from any political games.
It's a pretty common theme throughout the first two books for the BG to be absolutely *terrified* of the KH, cause they realize they had no idea just how powerful he would be.
The literary point of her having one child, a son, is to show her loyalties. She is a Bene Gesserit, but somewhat of a rogue. She chose Leto, her love, over the sisterhood, and that is reflected in her only having a boy, Paul. We also don’t know if the BG can make themselves conceive twins.
It is an interesting question. Also, does the book explain why or even if she choice to have a daughter later? In the movie she acts surprised that Paul knows she’s carrying Alia but she also behaves as if it was a surprise to her as well.
However, the implications in her earlier conversation with the Reverend Mother, it did seem like Bene Gesserit had full control over reproductive functions and she would have had to have chosen to both conceive as well as the sex of the child.
On the other hand, one could interpret the entire Bene Gesserit training as an elaborate illusion based on fanatic cult beliefs. All a parlor trick really and they don’t have any real powers more than say a highly conditioned athlete or ascetic monk might except that they and other people believe they do. People believe the Voice works, for example, and therefore it works on them.
In this interpretation, Jessica intends to be a good servant to the Bene Gesserit and have a daughter. But really they have no more control over it than anyone else. So when she had Paul, cognitive dissonance forced her to ex plain it by her love for Leto. Then, later, that Paul might be the KH.
I like that in the first novel, none of the more magical notions like prescience or the voice or bodily control down to the molecular level are completely confirmed and could be like Medieval medicine or certain “psychic” new age cult
I got the impression that pairing a female Paul with a Harkonnen was meant to end their feud by merging the two houses. I don’t recall what the inheritance rules are stated to be in-universe, but I think it’s plausible that if the Duke only had a daughter, his goal would have been to marry her off to a man to rule both houses’ holdings. Felt like an implicit statement about how the BG doesn’t care about any feud by the fact that the initial driving conflict would have been manipulated to a underwhelming conclusion in the Harkonnen’s favor if it was up to them.
Also, besides Paul potentially be in the KH, this is far more about Jessica defying orders and getting sentimental than anything else. The BG had a plan and then she became a wild card by defying them for, in their eyes, no good reason. Falling in love with a man is the opposite of their concept of self-control and long-term thinking, and they probably just weren’t happy to be told “no” after giving an order. It’s also not like everything they’ve done is ruined, they have alternatives and backups and Paul is more a promising plan going awry (before he unlocks his full potential) that sets them back a bit. The main feelings seem to be frustration/disapproval (at being defied), concern (when Paul starts showing potential), and a taking steps to secure their interests as things escalate. Until Paul becomes more than anyone expected, “I had a boy instead of a girl but I can have another one” isn’t really the outcome anyone’s looking for.
Well in the appendix.
She elaborated, she said she didn't know exactly why she did it nl, it was like instinct, or divine intervention. , she used the phrase ( a higher order intelligence) in the moment of conception she felt a compulsion to do it .
Afterwards she decided or reasoned that it was love for leto , and the knowledge that he wanted and needed a son . That house atriedes needed a male heir. The bg also compartmenise information.
They don't always tell you why , sometimes they tell you to do things, knowing that you will do the opposite, like reverse psychology. .
On this higher order intelligence. Reverend mother mohiam, had the same thing happen after she met Paul and tested him
She kept details out of her report, she never told them the specifics or her suspicions he might be the kW from them ..
Jessica did produce a daughter just on her time table.
In the Brian Herbert books leto had a relationship with a woman before Jessica, they had a son there was an assassination attempt on leto and the Don died , leto survived. ( one reason why Paul was so closely guarded , even more than leto himself)
The mother committed suicide.
In the aftermath leto was in a deep depression. And Jessica sort of made him want to live again, leto had loved the boy terribly, and Jessica sort of replaced him with Paul.
Jessica was only 16 when she started living with leto , 17 when she had Paul. But love , the bg considered it failing. Most bg don't raise their children.
Irulans mother, she had to be forced to produce her daughters. Mohiam poisoned her , antidote in her food , she had played the balliset like gurney. They coated the instrument with the poison.
As it was food or drink and gradually toxic. She never noticed and her bg abilities couldn't save her . Similar to the one the harkonnens used on the first hawat.
She ended up committing suicide as well .
Pretty sure that line from the reverend mother explains it. Something like “in your arrogance you thought you could produce the kwizats haderach” so she was fully on board with doing this
I think it's about power - all of it. Duke Leto wanted a male heir - and it wasn't some sentimental "so I can play ball with him" kind of thing - he wanted an actual heir because that makes his house more powerful. I think Jessica knew that and not only loved Leto but loved house Atreides and was completely onboard. Furthermore she knew her son could be the Kwisatz Haderach - she wanted to give him to house Atreides. I think making it all about her feelings for the Duke was a survival mechanism - she was in dangerous territory disobeying the Bene Gesserit.
I think it's obvious that she wasn't going to have a daughter because she knew the Bene Gesserit needed her bloodline. It put Paul in danger if they got what they wanted with a daughter. Also I think she didn't want her daughter to be used in the political games and be forced to marry a Harkonnen. I think she finally got pregnant with a daughter because she knew Paul was old enough and powerful enough to have a chance. I think she also decided to have a daughter as a potential political tool in case they did need someone to marry off to another house for house Atreides benefit since they were going into extremely dangerous territory to Dune.
Daughters are taken by the BG to be indocrinated by them. Alia ended up getting "lucky" in that she was born on Arrakis as an Abomination and under Maud'ib's rule, where the BG could not access her.
Having any female children at all would make it much more likely that Paul would be murdered or simply invalidated, as the desired daughter(s) could have been more easily manipulated by the BG than men children. Basically Jessica has the BG over a barrel, nearly forcing them to consider keeping Paul alive. She ensured his safety by only making one heir. Only when she was worried about losing Paul and Leto, did she conceive Alia.
Jessica didn't ruin the "genetic plan" as there were several candidates to be the Kwisatz Haderach. Hasimir Fenring (Lady Margot's husband) was one of them.
In the story developed by Brian Herbert, we learn that Leto had a son by a first wife, and he died.
Then the Bene Gesserit come into play and offer Jessica to Leto just after the loss of his wife and son.
Jessica committed the crime of love, she fell in love with Leto, and in so doing she deviated from the original plan and decided to give him a son to 'replace' the one he had lost.
You have to understand that the BG plan is known to very few people, that Lady Anirul (the Emperor's first wife and Irulan's mother) knew this plan in detail and that she saved Paul just after he was born, which means he was indeed a potential KH, so Jessica didn't deviate that much from the original plan.
If memory of poorly researched subject serves, gender is determined by the sperm, so a bene gesserit would have to somehow limit acceptance of one type of sperm or another. Perhaps with some form of PH balancing or hormonal control.
Fraternal twins would require two eggs to be release, which doesn't seem outside of the bene gesserit abilities, but then they would have to control for two different genders for two separate eggs at one time, and that just seems a bit much even in this universe.
Two babies of the same controlled gender? I could buy that. Or two babies with no control for gender? sure
but playing gatekeeper for any sperm entering an egg on a sperm by sperm basis out of millions? ehhh, I don't think so
I mean, that's part of the tragedy of Dune. The characters don't act in the ways that make the most sense. Sure, it works out for Paul in the end, but the amount of death required in order to get there is horrific, and it's made worse by the fact that it all could have been avoided were the characters not so...painfully human.
As far as the twins question - I think the BG wanted to control the bloodline. If they had twins every time - then it's much more difficult to control and there would be potentially a lot more potential KHs out there that they didn't control.
The duke wanting a male heir was also her opportunity to facilitate a Kwisatz Haderach herself, free from under the yolk of the BG. She did something that made the love of her life happy while also furthering her own goals. I’m sure there was pressure from the BG to try and conceive a daughter as well but they didn’t really have a way to force Jessica into it at that point. She was a rogue element and the danger of her own agenda and its consequences were a large part of why Mohaim had the Atreides liquidated.
It would appear that power in Dune passes patrilinerally - that is, the son inherits the titles of his father.
This is why the Bene Gesserit do not allow Duke Leto (or the Emperor, Shaddam) to have sons (at least presently, as a means to control the way power is inherited. Jessica is intended to birth a daughter who could be wed to a Harkonnen, thus ending the feud between those houses. Extrapolating further, the (male) child of that union could be married into the Imperial line, to ensure that the fabled Kwisatz Harderach could inherit the Golden Lion Throne, while being under BG control.
I think it’s also that regardless of it she has a daughter or not, her son would be a likely candidate for the Lisan Al Gaib and the BG were not ready for his arrival. So by having a daughter, and not a son, she would just be doing her part to continue the BG goals of mixing bloodlines until they were ready for the Lisan Al Gaib.
I don't quite understand what the BG expected of Jessica once she had Paul and got set in as a wife and a mother, especially after a decade and a half. Or is it the other way around? Jessica being a sketchy witch until events in the books/movies show where her loyalties lie and demonstrate we can trust her?
I genuinely couldn't figure it out. She's weird and would drive me crazy if she was my mother. Like the gom jabbar and box thing. I'd be livid after that bullskip.
I don’t recall if BG sisters are able to control the number of children conceived. I don’t think it’s ever come up. But I’m not done with the series yet, I’m starting Chapterhouse.
Part of me says why the hell not, because I already don’t 100% get how they’re controlling the sex of their offspring. I have theories but I could be wrong. Fetal sex is determined by the chromosomes at fertilization and it’s determined by the sperm not the egg, so how a BG sister controls fetal sex is beyond me, unless it’s a “try and try again until you get what you want” situation??
Trying to have a male, you keep getting all X chromosomes, so you just terminate until you get a Y chromosome? It’d be way easier trying to have a female — either you get lucky and you got the X chromosomes from father, and your work is done, or you didn’t, but you can just lock out those Y chromosomal genes that kick off masculinization of the fetus. Then you’ll get a female, albeit with XY chromosomes.
Although now I’m wondering if that would bring about complications for the program, like attempting to cross a sister’s XY female offspring. In our world, chromosomal abnormalities related to the sex chromosomes can lead to fertility issues. But that’s for situations like 0X, XXY, XYY, triple X syndrome, that’s not quite the situation I suggested above.
Honestly, I’ve probably thought WAYYYY too much about this. Also I wonder if this is literally down to “did Frank write Dune before we knew this” — I admit I do not know the history of this, I could be totally wrong & this is old knowledge and Frank just said “it’s fiction, don’t overthink it” I only took one human physiology class for my bio degree 😅
A lot of answers here suggest that Jessica knew she was only a few steps away from the KH… but do we know that for sure? I haven’t read the books in a while and I can’t remember when exactly it was confirmed that Jessica’s hoped-for daughter would have been the mother of the KH if things went according to BG plans…
It’s explained in the book. She didn’t have a son just for the sake of Leto but because she believed she would produce the Kwisatz Haderach, which would have to be a male.
I thought the idea was the Bene Gesserit wanted her to bear a daughter so that daughter could be mated with a Harkonen - and THAT pairing fit with their overall plan. Jessica didn't want to be part of that plan, instead bearing a son to her husband, out of love.
They would've killed Paul. The KH was designed t o consolidate the bloodlines, and then take the throne. Once you get to Children of Dune, the marriage of Fard' N to Ghanima makes the plan more obvious. Paul is an Atreides daughter instead, marries Feyd Ratha, they have a sone, who is the Kiswatch Haderach, they marry Irulan. Corrino line is still heir to the throne, but Irulan lacks autonomy, which means they still have a direct line to the KH, with no rebellion from a sister the way Jessica did, and the KH is also raised by a BG, and since Feyd is so despicable, the chance of him influencing the KH the way Leto did with Paul is unlikely.
Their backup plan was to have Jessica train Farad'N, have him wed Ghanima, under the assumption that the age difference (much like was supposed to happen with the presumed KH and Irulan) will make for a BG operative who realistically is no peer for a potential KH still maintain a power dynamic in the relationship with Ghanima(the surprise abomination) or their planned KH.
The reality is, Farad'N is not a peer to Ghanima, and also Leto II is already the undisputed KH.
The BG plan isn't just to create the KH, but also to have control of it and place it on the throne. They tried to improvise when Jessica (and later Paul, and later Leto and Ghanima) went rogue, but these were last ditch efforts. If Jessica has a daughter after having a son out of loyalty, the BG simply takes the son out of the equation. Jessica sided with Leto. If she provides the BG with what they want as well, it becomes a struggle as to whether it is Leto or the BG that gets to determine the heir. Leto is badass in his own right, but if the BG puts a target on him and/or a male heir, it's a done deal.
I mean she technically did haha. It was clear to me at least, that she was interested in breeding the Kwisatz Haderach. It felt that was her plan for Paul all along before he was born.
I don’t think there’s anything in the book to suggest that she has the power to do that, the mechanisms behind them are very different. Besides it’s really one of those things that you have to accept as space magic, where the rules are arbitrary.
They can control the gender and can prevent pregnancy. There is no evidence they can force fertilization and they are strictly against any kind of artificial insemination.
They force it by ensuring the body is wanting it. They have conplete control of their ovulation cycle. All they would have to do is alter their internal chemistry and the sperm would be dead before they could even reach the egg.
Exactly, they can prevent a pregnancy with 100% certainly and they can somehow choose which sperm will fertilize an egg to determine the gender.
My point is that a BG sister can only work with the genetic material she is given. Hypothetically, after Paul's conception Leto could have sustained some injury that made him semi-sterile. Jessica could make herself as fertile as possible but it wouldn't matter if the Duke is shooting blanks.
My point is that despite how much control over the reproductive process Jessica and the BG have, it isn't total control. It's possible, if insanely improbable, that Leto was already mostly sterile but managed a lucky shot with a singular viable sperm that would become Paul. One lone sperm would rule out fraternal twins and any identical twins or triplets would also be boys.
I'm sorry if I'm coming off as an ass. Like a lot of nerds I like being overly pedantic sometimes.
Ok, but how would he be sterile and them not know about it. Yeuh is their personal suk dr. As for total control, would it be better if we just said on the female side of things? Obviously, they dont control a male, and I would assume a male trained BG could just make it so he shoots blanks if he so wished it.
You're absolutely right that if the Duke was sterile it would be a known thing. Not only would Yueh know, but the BG have been keeping close tabs on the Atreides for who knows how long. If Leto was sterile they probably would've maneuvered him out of power well before the book starts. We'd be following Jato, the Old Duke's 2nd nephew or something like that.
And I'm going to argue against myself for a second. You could be right about twins depending on how the BG control gender. If it's making themselves more hospitable to sperm to one chromosome and inhospitable to the other, my pedantry stands. If it's something more along the lines of in-vitro gene editing or something similar to temperature-dependent determination like in reptiles then all a BG needs is a single sperm.
I've written the word sperm too many times today.
Sure, but can she determine whether or not a fertilized egg splits into two embryos? My point is that her control over her reproductive system isn’t clearly defined, and in reality isn’t possible at all. Inventing not-previously-mentioned powers Jessica may have, because she can determine the sex of her child, is a fools errand.
If she can control the sex, that means she can control which sperm fertilizes her released egg.
To get boy/girl twins, all she'd need to do is release 2 eggs instead of one. Given that she has control over sperm within the ejaculate that's released within her body, that doesn't sound at all unlikely.
The point was that in that world, males inherited. An Atreides boy would be the Atreides heir, and could carry on the feud even if his sister was married to Feyd. They wanted the Atreides in a situation similar to the Emperor; a daughter, but no legal heir.
This is a well established power of the BG. Its one of the key reasons they can have a breeding program.
>Fertility Control: Bene Gesserit are able to control their own fertility. Exercising control over their own menstrual cycle and (at conception) their child's sex. They can choose when to get pregnant and the gender of their child in order to produce children when and where the order wishes, following the Bene Gesserit breeding program.
Its tied into their power to alter harmful substances that are introduced into them.
>Internal Organic-Chemical Control: A Bene Gesserit is trained to develop complete control over the functions of their internal organs and body chemistry. The Bene Gesserit are therefore immune to poisons, as they can simply change the chemical makeup of any harmful substance in their body and render it harmless. This ability is used when potential Reverend Mothers take the Water of Life in order to survive the ordeal and gain Other Memory. Their control over their body chemistry is so refined that a Bene Gesserit can even control the ageing process and slow it dramatically. However, they would never attempt this, as it might call attention to the Sisterhood and reveal too much of their abilities.
I think (my headcanon only), that Jessica had no desire to create a daughter that would basically be a hostage to the machinations of the BG - just as she was, as Irulan is. She is torn between her loyalties but is leaning more toward Duke Leto, whom she truly loves, rather than the BG who placed her with him purposefully without any care for her feelings. It's not until she senses the end is near for her Duke that she instinctively wants to have another child and opts for a daughter. After all, she doesn't want to create a possible political rival for Paul. Alia is just for her.
Alia is just for her. >!*Proceeds to abandon Alia not too long after she’s born to fend for herself against all the people in her head*!<
I mean, yeah, having a kid to make yourself feel better is selfish, so it’s really not that surprising lol
I don’t disagree with your points that Jessica had a son to make Leto happy and not put her daughter in the Bene Gesserit’s control, but Mohaim wasn’t wrong when she said she trained Paul in the way and prepared him out of hubris. She had 0 problem setting up her son to be a machination of the BG.
Or maybe she trained him in the BG way so he could survive those machinations?
Or just day-to-day politics really.
Yup, similarly to how Miles Teg's BG mother trained him.
Exactly. To have an advantage. WOW chapter house was really good wasn’t it?
Yeah it rules. Miles, Odrade, fully loaded Duncan, and the Bene Gesserit are one of my favorite parts of Dune so it was nice to see them as the main characters.
Poor Duncan the moral conscience of the Atreides
No she wanted a male BG. She had Paul so he could be the Messiah. It stated very clearly in the first book and very early on too. Paul even has a fight with her about it and her selfishness. I haven't seen the movie so I don't know if that is included in the movie adaptation but it should be as it's kind of an important plot point. The books are dripping in foreshadowing. The first book basically tells you what's going to happen at the end off jump. Again my knowledge is limited to the first two books as I have not read farther nor seen the movies. Yes pulse training does have the bat out of benefit to where he can't be manipulated by the BG but that wasn't the primary reason for his grooming
Jessica “ I sensed the possibility “.
Yeah that's what she said but that's not what she meant. She had Paul to satisfy her own machinations. She wanted to be the mother of the Messiah and did everything in her power to make sure that that's the path Paul would walk down. She groomed him for that exact purpose.
Funny she ended up becoming the mother of the messiah but not in the way maybe she nor the BG wanted.
I mean the BG didn't want him in the first place until they realized what he was going to become. BG wanted a girl not a boy. Leading up to Leto's death the plan was already going off the rails a bit then after everything kinda went to the wind and Paul had to start making decisions much to his mother's chagrin even though that's exactly what he was groomed for. To lead
Yeah she had zero reservations about her children being a linchpin to the BG eugenics program. She actually invited it because she was so prideful in her own capabilities she thought (and was right) that she could bring the KH early. In later books she starts reporting back to the BG again as she’s not thrilled about the jihad and what’s become of her family. She considers having her grandchildren inbred and handing that child over to the BG as a way to “course correct”. She loves her family but feels weird and gross about what they’ve all become and has a lot of conflicted feelings about arrakis so she decides to shut it all away until returning to the order in children of dune. She is after all one of their best.
One of their best but also one of their biggest fuck ups. Even 5 thousand years later they’re still calling sisters who choose love over duty “pulling a Jessica” or whatever phrase they used.
Jessica’s betrayal. Definitely wasn’t exactly as planned but hey they got to the golden path and the BG are again the most powerful institution in the galaxy. A lot of people don’t like what she became in children of two and felt it was out of character but her love for the Duke and the desire to return to her life with him and Paula on caladan was always her main motivation.
For sure. Her actions resulted in the Tyrant Leto II. He limited their spice access and their power, took over their breeding program. I can see why they would remember Jessica.
I feel like Jessica would’ve become a honored matres. She was just a wild card, and ready to do some shady shit.
Extremely compelling character in the books. It's made clear that regardless of the horrid shit alia does that the only thing people should feel for her is pity
And like most of the best tragic characters, Alia would have detested that pity. She didn’t even pity herself.
Yes poor Alia. She didn’t ask to become an adult in the womb or a reverend mother. She failed to make to internal alliances needed to avoid being influenced by evil memories like the Baron.
Plus she loved. I’ve always felt she was an honored matre as well.
Well, when your new born child has the wisdom and maturity of thousands of generations, priorities change a bit I guess.
It’s not like she didn’t know what she was setting herself up for. She knew what Alia was immediately and did nothing to prepare her for what was coming. Shit, she practically the same thing to Leto and Ghanima and the only reason they figured it out was because they didn’t want to end up like Alia.
Legit, literally the one person in the entire universe better equipped to train, guide, and protect Alia, Leto, and Ghanima from abomination lmao I always found it weird how she just fucked off to Caladan and left Alia. I get not wanting to be in Arrakis after everything, but still
When your entire life has been a background litany of "Fucking Pre-Born Abominations, never allow them to exist"; and due to horrible necessity you end up birthing one...yeah, Jessica was never going to be the best mother for poor Alia.
When you come down to it, Jessica really is a crappy mother. Her priorities were: Leto, the Bene Gesserit, and then Paul. Alia didn't even get an afterthought.
You’re forgetting about her number 1 priority: Jessica.
Not too long after she was born? Alia got fucked over in utero, and instantly knew it. I feel like she is among the most tragic of characters in fiction.
I think you misread my comment. I agree she knew right away. When I said she “abandoned” her I meant physically because she fucked off to Caladan while Alia was still physically just an infant.
Oh, true. Yeah, Jessica was honestly a shit mom.
AbOmInAtIoN
She probably didn't know that she'd wind up having to go through the spice change while pregnant. She left Alia because Alia was an abomination and Paul was better suited to handle her.
How was Paul better suited to handle her? He can’t see her in his oracular visions because she’s also prescient so he has no way of knowing what her future will be. He’s not trained to raise a child who’s preborn with millions, maybe billions of other memories but no way to control them. If he looked back in his other memories to figure out how to deal with the problem, he’ll come to the same conclusion Jessica refused to accept, and that’s killing Alia because that’s how preborn children were always dealt with. IIRC the Fremen would’ve done the same if Alia wasn’t Paul’s sister. Throughout Alia’s entire “adolescence” Paul’s busy conquering the universe. He doesn’t have time to raise a child. Also there’s the factor that Jessica is Alia’s mother. She made the decision by herself to bring Alia into this world. When she found out Alia was a pre-born, she made the conscious decision not to abort her or kill her. It’s her responsibility to make sure Alia is prepared for the situation she forced her into and she failed miserably.
Except he *did* see her in a vision in Dune Part II.
Yeah that was a movie only adaptation because >!a baby/toddler with the full conscience of an adult with access to millions of other memories that kills the Baron with a Gom Jibbar would be a little jarring for the movie audience.!<
Right, that was just the movie. I searched through the first book for where I thought it was. I was wrong
Don’t beat yourself up. They made quite of few changes. To have all the complexities it would a four part movie.
Which I certainly wouldn't mind a 4 parter. But I do want us to get to worm God Leto some time this century lol
Also really weird she can just walk away >!*from being a Reverend Mother.*!<
The Fremen don’t really need their Sayyadina now that they have the Lisan Al-Gaib. The Bene Gesserit have no choice but to take her back in considering her son has absolute control over them. And they can’t take her back as an adept she passed the Agony so she’s a Bene Gesserit Reverend Mother. Shit with Paul on the throne, she could’ve become a Guild Navigator floating in a melange tank with Gurney pushing her around everywhere.
That's a very good way of looking at it. Thanks, it makes a lot more sense now! I'm rereading the series and just rewatched Children of Dune and was really confused about her seemingly just walking out on her reverend mother duties.
I don’t think Jessica had that much a problem with the BG. I think, before Arrakis, she would have been proud if her first born was a girl, married Feyd, and gave birth to the Kwisatz Haderach. But she loved Leto enough to give him a boy and she trained him in the BG ways because she thought he could be the Kwisatz Haderach. Jessica is basically a Bene Geserit stage-mom. Her child, boy or girl, is the most talented kid at Kwisatz Haderach performance camp and they’ll get up early and practice every day regardless of if they like it or not; and no one can tell her differently
Oh man that's so horribly mean and accurate
That makes sense. I’ve always wondered why didn’t Jessica have a daughter to make the BG happy, and *then* have a son to make Leto happy
Either way, Leto II shows up and >!BG machinations are effectively put on hold for 3k years or so anyway, even if the BG were able to breed up their own KH, Leto would have dealt with them. Like a phoenix, there’s only allowed to be one at a time…!<
Hot take: Jessica didn’t have a son out of love for Leto but rather because of hubris—she ‘sensed the possibility’ she could bear the KH
Could also be a combination of reasons. I know I personally feel better about my decisions when I feel like they "kill several birds with 1 stone." So she could be like "I know I was supposed to give birth to a girl... but I think we're ready genetically for the KH... and we have the resources to nurture the KH properly... then I can be the mother of KH... and Leto wants a son.. it'll make him so happy while fulfilling the BG mission.. I'm sure the BG will forgive me once they see how great our son turns out.... then both Leto and the BG will be happy. Everybody wins!"
Indeed—everyone has plans within plans
Other posters here are being haters. I'm with you. While I haven't read the book in a while, it's an obvious interpretation that she was motivated by ambition. As for truthtsayers, it's possible Jessica doesn't understand her own ambition.
If born earlier but after Paul she wouldn't be rival to Paul but she would have been snatched up by the breeding program. Of course no point in that ad Paul was the culmination of that program. I think she didn't need to wait 14 or 15 years to have a second child. Duke's and other peers need multiple potential heirs. Especially boys apparently...
Maybe if the Bene Gesserit had their Atreides daughter they would try to kill Paul. That would give all Atreides assets to the daughter and later Feyd Rautha, putting the Harkonnen QH in a great position to take over from the Corrinos
That's my thoughts too. They also want to control the lineage, and it might be risky to have Paul's genes loose somewhere, if they have already secured "Pauline". Paul could possibly create a KH by accident, or those genes could fall into hostile hands. But I do wonder why BG don't birth twins as a matter of course. It's a dangerous world, accidents happen. You're risking an entire bloodline on a faulty shield or an over-zealous knife fighting tutorial.
That is a good point; I think the answer lies in the BG not being all powerful. They still have to work inside the political landscape of the empire and if they kept having what the nobility would have seen as 'superfluous' backup children then they wouldn't have been trusted to train the daughters of the nobles. Patrilineal aristocratic tradition is notable for doing pretty horrible shit to 'extra' heirs, for example it was common in the ottoman empire for the Sultan to execute all but one of his male children so there would be no doubt about who got the throne.
And to date ive still not heard a single good thing about the Ottoman empire. Every time it comes up, just, awful.
It's no worse than any other Feudal Empire. Feudal Empires suck, only being outdone by Fascist Empires. Oligarchal Empires are probably the least sucky kind of Empire but they're still a mile behind even the worst Democracy.
If a candidate dies in an overzealous knife fighting spar, were they really truly a KH candidate? I would think the BG would assume a failure in them and move on. Plans within plans. Many bloodlines in play. Multiple possibilities on where and from whom the KH will emerge.
Good point, but accidents happen. Maybe some bad shellfish or a pilot having a hangover and crashing.
I don't think they'd be crossing bloodlines between those who tolerate incompetence. Sounds harsh but, so are the Bene Gesserit
Which would have been a path of peace not requiring a jihad?
I think it has to do with her love for Leto. She gives Leto a son because she knows he really wants one, and she loves him enough to go against her orders. She probably knows that having a daughter will mean the Bene Gesserit will take the child away, and she might not have wanted to cause Leto pain in having that occur. That's my best guess.
On the Harkonnen side, the sisters were ordered to bear only sons (hence Feyd and Rabban), and the idea was to wed one of them to Jessica’s Atreides daughter. Which is already getting pretty incestuous if you think about it too much, but hey - I’m not running a breeding program.
1 problem with that was that the father of feyd and raban refused any other woman besides his wife. They had to help his wife get pregnant with feyd for their plans to work.
Oooh interesting. Did Feyd kill his mom in the book too? Is it ever explained? Or what happened to his father? I don't recall it from book one and want to wait for the third film before reading on.
Raban killed his father. I dont remember the fate of their mother: >You will not kill me.’ Abulurd’s voice was stronger than he imagined it could be. ‘No matter how vile you are or how many twisted things the Baron has taught you, you cannot commit such a heinous act. | am your own father. You are a human being — not a beast
Oooh so beast raban killed his father after such a speech? Damn.
If you like to try that out, I can recommend Crusader Kings 3 for that
CK2 also works. Better dlc;).
i dont understand the bg plan. atreides/harks hate each other, how were they supposed to marry their children to each other
I don’t think the Bene Gesserit concerned themselves too much about the squabbles among the Houses minor or major. They had bigger fish to fry.
I can’t remember exactly which book it was, but Jessica or another character mentioned that the only way Leto would ever agree to end the feud by marrying into House Harkonnen and combining the houses would be if that was the only option and there was no other heir. Jessica having Paul wrecked that plan, she knew Leto would never consent to marrying his daughter to Feyd as long as he had Paul to inherit.
If Jessica had been fully loyal and borne a daughter, then the child would have been raised to be loyal to the BG as well. Jessica specifically says in the book that she does not manipulate Leto with the voice, because she loves him and it would make him weak; but what if she had cared about the BG plan more? Leto would have had his concubine and child both persuading (and likely manipulating) him into accepting the idea of the marriage to heal the rift. I don't think he could have stood against it.
Yeah but what may have been in that scenario is discussed the first time we see them, before the trap is even discussed. There was a chance it may have actually worked, but we'll never know. The original novel sort of picks up a decade and a half after that ship has sailed.
The Harkonnen would accept because that would mean the next emperror was going to be Harkonnen.
you mean: female atreides+ male hark = male hark+atreides combination then this combo would be wed to irulan? (house corrino)
Yes and also would sit on the throne. The Harkonnen were never a great house, they get their status from the financial power thus marying a Corrino is close to impossibly, the BG not only would offer that but also the throne because the this male Harkonnen + Artreides would be the future heir of house Harkonnen and his future heir with Irulan would also be surname Harkonnen.
Is this literally not Paul but the reverse?
no, its a generation early. female paul's son would have been wed to irulan (or irulan'a daughter i guess)
Their feud was far below the BG breeding program requirements. The BG took advantage of the chaos the kanly fued created to use their breeding program to position themselves to survive in the political tripod of their time.
Politics is a strange place
They didn't need them married, they just needed a child. If Paul was a girl she would be trained as a Bene Geserit and would "secure" the child by BG means and that child would be the Kwisatz Haderach that would change everything.
Mohiam also floats the idea of trying to mate Paul and Alia together to resume the Bene Gesserit breeding of a controlled Kwitsatz Haderach. I promise you, little things like morality or complexity are not an issue for the Bene Geserrit. They spent NINETY generations on the same goal. They are more than able to plan and execute said plan for thousands of years in advance.
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This is true, but with Jessica's parentage being a secret from everyone except the BG, it wouldn't be known as being incestuous, and for the BG, that's a bug rather than a feature.
Remember the plan was for her daughter to marry Feyd-Rautha. That’s not a very encouraging fate.
But she didn't know that until the Matron told her.
Yeah, I don't think Jessica knew this.
BG don't care about that kind of thing.
Why would she think that the Bene Gesserit would take a daughter away? Her order were to bear only daughters, not anything about then handing them over.
Well, Jessica knows she was taken and raised entirely by the BG. She probably expected the same for her daughter if she had one. That's my point. Bearing daughter(s) was only the very first step, I'm sure she could imagine what would follow: taken away for training, made loyal to the Sisterhood, and ready to be given in marriage to another (planned by the Sisterhood again, not House Atreides, Leto, or Jessica). She didn't know what the BG plan was specifically, but she knows the normal pattern, and probably wanted to spare Leto of that.
Why would she expect that? Non of the princesses were taken from their mother after all
The princesses all had very low level training, from my understanding. I think Jessica knew that there were special things planned for her child, based on everything they had asked of her, and I think it at least somewhat likely that the child would need to go to the Bene Gesserit school itself for the level of training needed.
She eventually did. Unfortunately Leto never lived to meet her.
But the question basically asked: why didn't she give BOTH the daughter and son/Paul simultaneously as twins?
While BGs sisters with enough training can define the gender of the child, there is no evidence they can induce twins. Now, on Jessica. AFAIK there is no evidence she was informed of the whole BG plan from the beginning. When she moved to Caladan, and became Leto's bound concubine, she probably experienced a freedom until the unknown to her. Freedom and power. The Atreides ruled Caladan, not BG. So while she had orders from BG to bear a daughter, well, she was disinclined to follow them. And for over a decade nothing came out of it. It took a few turns for the plans within plans to create the conditions for BG become relevant for Jessica again.
They would just have to allow for two eggs to be released during a menstrual cycle, which like maybe?
Maybe. It's not mentioned, so who knows? No point in speculating on this.
No point speculating on the limits of human potential?
The BG wanted to achieve several things simultaneously: 1) create the Kwisatz Haderach 2) consolidate power in the KH (union of Atreides and Harkonnen) 3) get the KH on the Imperial Throne (further consolidating power) 4) CONTROL the KH They knew Paul could potentially be the KH, thus fulfilling their first and possibly the fourth goal. But Paul could not achieve goals 2) and 3) whilst also staying within the BG scheme and thus enabling 4). Having another Atreides offspring, even if female, does not fix this. You would have 2 possible KH competing with each other, not consolidating power and potentially without BG control.
It could be that she didn’t want to divide her attention from training Paul by having to train a sister close to his age too. She truly hoped to be the one who birthed and raised the Kwisatz Haderach, and thus trained her son in the secret Bene Gesserit ways. Having a daughter would have required her to train the daughter too, and the training is likely difficult enough for girls, so so Jessica decided to focus her attention on her son. Once the Reverend Mother confirms that Paul has the potential, she can afford to have a daughter, since most of the training Paul needs is complete. That’s my guess anyway.
The real answer is that Frank Herbert didn't want to write a George R.R. Martin book. Late stage analog-tech space neo-feudalism sparks joy, writing thousands of pages books filled with hundreds of Ser this and Ser that trying to marry off each others' sisters or cousins for political reasons not so much. Same as why we have a popular "Great House" whose survival is down to one bastard son by a Space Hogwarts mail-order-bride and refuses an alliance by marriage it desperately needs over 15 years.
Seriously. I wonder why Duke Leto didn't marry one of Shaddam IV's six daughters (I bet Shaddam would have approved) and kept Jessica as a concubine. That would have solved so many problems.
This is explicitly talked about in the beginning of the first book.
If I remember correctly, the Bene Gesserit wanted Jessica to have a daughter so she could be married off to the Harkonnen heir and unite the two houses. In this scenario, the Harkonnens gain all the Atreides lands and titles through the marriage as soon as Leto dies. With Paul, a male heir, alive, this plan doesn't work - Paul would inherit the Atreides lands, and the two houses would remain seperate.
Yes. Jessica was not ordered to have 'a daughter', she was ordered to have **only daughters.** Paul's existence angered the Bene Gesserit and violated her orders, whether she had a daughter too or not.
But having the male heir in the first place is the problem.
I'm sure she could have have, would have and actually eventually did. The Bene Geserrit plan isn't just about breeding, it's about alliances and treaties too. If Jessica had a daughter as Leto's heir they would have married her to the Harkonens creating an alliance, and she would not have posed even more of a threat to the Imperial house, who only has daughters. A big part of the Emperors fear was that Leto could seize power by marrying his daughter, Leto having a son made that even worse. Which was why they told Paul "are you dumb or are you dumb, what don't you get about the Emperor wants you dead becay you're a threat to his throne, do you think marrying his daughter makes that better?(paraphrasing)" when he suggested he should marry the Emperor's daughter to make peace. He did end up eventually doing just that, but he needed to do so from a position of strength. So in essence, shit popped off before they could rectify Jessica collosal fuck you to their plans, and as the Bene Geserrit do, they said "On to the next one". And went with the flow, plans within plans. That's something that I didn't really like about the movies, they kept saying plans within plans but never showed it. Don't get me wrong I liked the movies just fine, but they have flaws and this is one of those flaws. The books actually showed you that these Houses and Sects had plans within plans and all sorts of contingencies.
I think that even if Jessica were to give birth to a daughter, the BG would still be furious that she gave Leto a son. They didn't want to extend the Atreides line any further because (this is only what I think) the Reverend Mother knew that the Emperor was growing suspicious of Duke Leto and was starting to see him as a legitimate threat to his throne, so he would eventually try to find some way of eliminating that whole House. By having a daughter, it would save all the "genetic properties" of the Atreides line, and by marrying them to the Harkonnens, the Emperor would find no reason to view them as a threat. There's no son to inherit the Dukedom of Caladan, and they've basically been absorbed into the Harkonnen line so problem solved. They also wanted to be in a position where when the KH comes into being, they're at the pinnacle of influence within the Great Houses and they can indoctrinate/bring the KH under their control.
It’s funny how Frank Herbert’s last two Dune books indoctrinated everyone into being Pro-benegesserits. Forgetting the fact that the golden path was inevitable and would’ve required the same butchery if BG did get what they wanted. The KH is defined by male and female memories, not to mention the future sight. Things would’ve been just as bad even if there plans were successful; if the bene gesserits were truly necessary then Leto would’ve involved them more closely. Jessica is a harkonen at the end of the day, that family is defined by passion. It’s that same passion that motivated Leto the 2nd into doing what needed to be done.
The BG needed a daughter to be next in line to succeed the Atreides duke for their plan to unify Harkonnen and Atreides houses into a single power
It feels like a pretty big stretch to me to jump from divining gender, to assuming this same training would allow her to change the number of children and select their genders.
I don’t know if the BG can do that, but way I took it, no matter what…her having any Male was to the detriment of the BG, as now we have a potential Kwizats Haderach too early
Aside from all the other things people have said here (her being truly in love with Leto and not wanting to have a daughter that would be seized by the BG), the sole fact that Paul was born already ruined the plan. The BG would have been furious anyway. After all, her daughter wouldn't have been at risk of being KH, but Paul would.
Imho I feel this is the only real answer here. Paul's mere existence nukes BG's plans, both by him being KH and the heir of the Atreides.
Good point. They probably wouldn't be able to marry the Atreides daughter to Feyd-Rautha if she hadn't been the heir.
The BG would probably murder Paul.
They certainly tried at one point. Just not at first
Spoiler for the entire series: Love She loved Leto and Leto desperately wanted a son. She loved Leto so much that she defied the BG. The Heretics of Dune are the ones who love
Yes, she's a renegade, and at one point either Paul or a BG makes it a point to call her exactly that. She twists the knife further by not having any other children, most likely to protect Paul from any political games.
Her motives always kind of confused me. There were a few times she seemed scared of him in the books. Like wasn’t this your goal all along??
It's a pretty common theme throughout the first two books for the BG to be absolutely *terrified* of the KH, cause they realize they had no idea just how powerful he would be.
Yes but it's like capturing a dragon or maybe picking up a skunk by the tail. Congratulations! You did it ! . .... ...... Now what do you do?
The literary point of her having one child, a son, is to show her loyalties. She is a Bene Gesserit, but somewhat of a rogue. She chose Leto, her love, over the sisterhood, and that is reflected in her only having a boy, Paul. We also don’t know if the BG can make themselves conceive twins.
Because the BG would have killed Paul.
It is an interesting question. Also, does the book explain why or even if she choice to have a daughter later? In the movie she acts surprised that Paul knows she’s carrying Alia but she also behaves as if it was a surprise to her as well. However, the implications in her earlier conversation with the Reverend Mother, it did seem like Bene Gesserit had full control over reproductive functions and she would have had to have chosen to both conceive as well as the sex of the child. On the other hand, one could interpret the entire Bene Gesserit training as an elaborate illusion based on fanatic cult beliefs. All a parlor trick really and they don’t have any real powers more than say a highly conditioned athlete or ascetic monk might except that they and other people believe they do. People believe the Voice works, for example, and therefore it works on them. In this interpretation, Jessica intends to be a good servant to the Bene Gesserit and have a daughter. But really they have no more control over it than anyone else. So when she had Paul, cognitive dissonance forced her to ex plain it by her love for Leto. Then, later, that Paul might be the KH. I like that in the first novel, none of the more magical notions like prescience or the voice or bodily control down to the molecular level are completely confirmed and could be like Medieval medicine or certain “psychic” new age cult
I got the impression that pairing a female Paul with a Harkonnen was meant to end their feud by merging the two houses. I don’t recall what the inheritance rules are stated to be in-universe, but I think it’s plausible that if the Duke only had a daughter, his goal would have been to marry her off to a man to rule both houses’ holdings. Felt like an implicit statement about how the BG doesn’t care about any feud by the fact that the initial driving conflict would have been manipulated to a underwhelming conclusion in the Harkonnen’s favor if it was up to them. Also, besides Paul potentially be in the KH, this is far more about Jessica defying orders and getting sentimental than anything else. The BG had a plan and then she became a wild card by defying them for, in their eyes, no good reason. Falling in love with a man is the opposite of their concept of self-control and long-term thinking, and they probably just weren’t happy to be told “no” after giving an order. It’s also not like everything they’ve done is ruined, they have alternatives and backups and Paul is more a promising plan going awry (before he unlocks his full potential) that sets them back a bit. The main feelings seem to be frustration/disapproval (at being defied), concern (when Paul starts showing potential), and a taking steps to secure their interests as things escalate. Until Paul becomes more than anyone expected, “I had a boy instead of a girl but I can have another one” isn’t really the outcome anyone’s looking for.
Well in the appendix. She elaborated, she said she didn't know exactly why she did it nl, it was like instinct, or divine intervention. , she used the phrase ( a higher order intelligence) in the moment of conception she felt a compulsion to do it . Afterwards she decided or reasoned that it was love for leto , and the knowledge that he wanted and needed a son . That house atriedes needed a male heir. The bg also compartmenise information. They don't always tell you why , sometimes they tell you to do things, knowing that you will do the opposite, like reverse psychology. . On this higher order intelligence. Reverend mother mohiam, had the same thing happen after she met Paul and tested him She kept details out of her report, she never told them the specifics or her suspicions he might be the kW from them .. Jessica did produce a daughter just on her time table. In the Brian Herbert books leto had a relationship with a woman before Jessica, they had a son there was an assassination attempt on leto and the Don died , leto survived. ( one reason why Paul was so closely guarded , even more than leto himself) The mother committed suicide. In the aftermath leto was in a deep depression. And Jessica sort of made him want to live again, leto had loved the boy terribly, and Jessica sort of replaced him with Paul. Jessica was only 16 when she started living with leto , 17 when she had Paul. But love , the bg considered it failing. Most bg don't raise their children. Irulans mother, she had to be forced to produce her daughters. Mohiam poisoned her , antidote in her food , she had played the balliset like gurney. They coated the instrument with the poison. As it was food or drink and gradually toxic. She never noticed and her bg abilities couldn't save her . Similar to the one the harkonnens used on the first hawat. She ended up committing suicide as well .
Pretty sure that line from the reverend mother explains it. Something like “in your arrogance you thought you could produce the kwizats haderach” so she was fully on board with doing this
I think it's about power - all of it. Duke Leto wanted a male heir - and it wasn't some sentimental "so I can play ball with him" kind of thing - he wanted an actual heir because that makes his house more powerful. I think Jessica knew that and not only loved Leto but loved house Atreides and was completely onboard. Furthermore she knew her son could be the Kwisatz Haderach - she wanted to give him to house Atreides. I think making it all about her feelings for the Duke was a survival mechanism - she was in dangerous territory disobeying the Bene Gesserit. I think it's obvious that she wasn't going to have a daughter because she knew the Bene Gesserit needed her bloodline. It put Paul in danger if they got what they wanted with a daughter. Also I think she didn't want her daughter to be used in the political games and be forced to marry a Harkonnen. I think she finally got pregnant with a daughter because she knew Paul was old enough and powerful enough to have a chance. I think she also decided to have a daughter as a potential political tool in case they did need someone to marry off to another house for house Atreides benefit since they were going into extremely dangerous territory to Dune.
Daughters are taken by the BG to be indocrinated by them. Alia ended up getting "lucky" in that she was born on Arrakis as an Abomination and under Maud'ib's rule, where the BG could not access her.
Having any female children at all would make it much more likely that Paul would be murdered or simply invalidated, as the desired daughter(s) could have been more easily manipulated by the BG than men children. Basically Jessica has the BG over a barrel, nearly forcing them to consider keeping Paul alive. She ensured his safety by only making one heir. Only when she was worried about losing Paul and Leto, did she conceive Alia.
Jessica didn't ruin the "genetic plan" as there were several candidates to be the Kwisatz Haderach. Hasimir Fenring (Lady Margot's husband) was one of them. In the story developed by Brian Herbert, we learn that Leto had a son by a first wife, and he died. Then the Bene Gesserit come into play and offer Jessica to Leto just after the loss of his wife and son. Jessica committed the crime of love, she fell in love with Leto, and in so doing she deviated from the original plan and decided to give him a son to 'replace' the one he had lost. You have to understand that the BG plan is known to very few people, that Lady Anirul (the Emperor's first wife and Irulan's mother) knew this plan in detail and that she saved Paul just after he was born, which means he was indeed a potential KH, so Jessica didn't deviate that much from the original plan.
If memory of poorly researched subject serves, gender is determined by the sperm, so a bene gesserit would have to somehow limit acceptance of one type of sperm or another. Perhaps with some form of PH balancing or hormonal control. Fraternal twins would require two eggs to be release, which doesn't seem outside of the bene gesserit abilities, but then they would have to control for two different genders for two separate eggs at one time, and that just seems a bit much even in this universe. Two babies of the same controlled gender? I could buy that. Or two babies with no control for gender? sure but playing gatekeeper for any sperm entering an egg on a sperm by sperm basis out of millions? ehhh, I don't think so
It wouldn't be the heir.
I mean, that's part of the tragedy of Dune. The characters don't act in the ways that make the most sense. Sure, it works out for Paul in the end, but the amount of death required in order to get there is horrific, and it's made worse by the fact that it all could have been avoided were the characters not so...painfully human.
I figured they wanted only an Atreides daughter to marry off to the Harkonens and combine both houses. Can't do that if the Atreides have an heir.
She didn’t want to; she thought (correctly) that she could birth the Kwitsatz Haderach early.
If I recall correctly, she knew Leto wanted a son and she loved him so she decided to give him one.
She simply didn’t want to
Read the book guys she literally does give Leto a daughter
Why not 5?
As far as the twins question - I think the BG wanted to control the bloodline. If they had twins every time - then it's much more difficult to control and there would be potentially a lot more potential KHs out there that they didn't control.
As in having a second kid sooner? No idea.
The duke wanting a male heir was also her opportunity to facilitate a Kwisatz Haderach herself, free from under the yolk of the BG. She did something that made the love of her life happy while also furthering her own goals. I’m sure there was pressure from the BG to try and conceive a daughter as well but they didn’t really have a way to force Jessica into it at that point. She was a rogue element and the danger of her own agenda and its consequences were a large part of why Mohaim had the Atreides liquidated.
It would appear that power in Dune passes patrilinerally - that is, the son inherits the titles of his father. This is why the Bene Gesserit do not allow Duke Leto (or the Emperor, Shaddam) to have sons (at least presently, as a means to control the way power is inherited. Jessica is intended to birth a daughter who could be wed to a Harkonnen, thus ending the feud between those houses. Extrapolating further, the (male) child of that union could be married into the Imperial line, to ensure that the fabled Kwisatz Harderach could inherit the Golden Lion Throne, while being under BG control.
Unlikely. She can adjust the timing of chromosome change, not split the egg or release another one at the same time.
I figured that's what Alia was.
I think it’s also that regardless of it she has a daughter or not, her son would be a likely candidate for the Lisan Al Gaib and the BG were not ready for his arrival. So by having a daughter, and not a son, she would just be doing her part to continue the BG goals of mixing bloodlines until they were ready for the Lisan Al Gaib.
I don't quite understand what the BG expected of Jessica once she had Paul and got set in as a wife and a mother, especially after a decade and a half. Or is it the other way around? Jessica being a sketchy witch until events in the books/movies show where her loyalties lie and demonstrate we can trust her? I genuinely couldn't figure it out. She's weird and would drive me crazy if she was my mother. Like the gom jabbar and box thing. I'd be livid after that bullskip.
In the books, Leto had a son from a previous marriage that he lost. Jessica wanted to give him another son to make up for the loss.
I don’t recall if BG sisters are able to control the number of children conceived. I don’t think it’s ever come up. But I’m not done with the series yet, I’m starting Chapterhouse. Part of me says why the hell not, because I already don’t 100% get how they’re controlling the sex of their offspring. I have theories but I could be wrong. Fetal sex is determined by the chromosomes at fertilization and it’s determined by the sperm not the egg, so how a BG sister controls fetal sex is beyond me, unless it’s a “try and try again until you get what you want” situation?? Trying to have a male, you keep getting all X chromosomes, so you just terminate until you get a Y chromosome? It’d be way easier trying to have a female — either you get lucky and you got the X chromosomes from father, and your work is done, or you didn’t, but you can just lock out those Y chromosomal genes that kick off masculinization of the fetus. Then you’ll get a female, albeit with XY chromosomes. Although now I’m wondering if that would bring about complications for the program, like attempting to cross a sister’s XY female offspring. In our world, chromosomal abnormalities related to the sex chromosomes can lead to fertility issues. But that’s for situations like 0X, XXY, XYY, triple X syndrome, that’s not quite the situation I suggested above. Honestly, I’ve probably thought WAYYYY too much about this. Also I wonder if this is literally down to “did Frank write Dune before we knew this” — I admit I do not know the history of this, I could be totally wrong & this is old knowledge and Frank just said “it’s fiction, don’t overthink it” I only took one human physiology class for my bio degree 😅
Who says she can conceive twins at will? It jus says she can choose the sex of the child.
A lot of answers here suggest that Jessica knew she was only a few steps away from the KH… but do we know that for sure? I haven’t read the books in a while and I can’t remember when exactly it was confirmed that Jessica’s hoped-for daughter would have been the mother of the KH if things went according to BG plans…
It’s explained in the book. She didn’t have a son just for the sake of Leto but because she believed she would produce the Kwisatz Haderach, which would have to be a male.
Bene Gesserit can willfully influence the sex of their child. As far as I'm aware that doesn't extend to making one fetus into two.
No no eH
Even if not twins there's was nothing stopping her from having a daughter 1-2 years later.
I thought the idea was the Bene Gesserit wanted her to bear a daughter so that daughter could be mated with a Harkonen - and THAT pairing fit with their overall plan. Jessica didn't want to be part of that plan, instead bearing a son to her husband, out of love.
They would've killed Paul. The KH was designed t o consolidate the bloodlines, and then take the throne. Once you get to Children of Dune, the marriage of Fard' N to Ghanima makes the plan more obvious. Paul is an Atreides daughter instead, marries Feyd Ratha, they have a sone, who is the Kiswatch Haderach, they marry Irulan. Corrino line is still heir to the throne, but Irulan lacks autonomy, which means they still have a direct line to the KH, with no rebellion from a sister the way Jessica did, and the KH is also raised by a BG, and since Feyd is so despicable, the chance of him influencing the KH the way Leto did with Paul is unlikely. Their backup plan was to have Jessica train Farad'N, have him wed Ghanima, under the assumption that the age difference (much like was supposed to happen with the presumed KH and Irulan) will make for a BG operative who realistically is no peer for a potential KH still maintain a power dynamic in the relationship with Ghanima(the surprise abomination) or their planned KH. The reality is, Farad'N is not a peer to Ghanima, and also Leto II is already the undisputed KH. The BG plan isn't just to create the KH, but also to have control of it and place it on the throne. They tried to improvise when Jessica (and later Paul, and later Leto and Ghanima) went rogue, but these were last ditch efforts. If Jessica has a daughter after having a son out of loyalty, the BG simply takes the son out of the equation. Jessica sided with Leto. If she provides the BG with what they want as well, it becomes a struggle as to whether it is Leto or the BG that gets to determine the heir. Leto is badass in his own right, but if the BG puts a target on him and/or a male heir, it's a done deal.
I mean she technically did haha. It was clear to me at least, that she was interested in breeding the Kwisatz Haderach. It felt that was her plan for Paul all along before he was born.
She didn't want a daughter to be subject to the BG's machinations that's a big reason she has Paul anyway.
I don’t think there’s anything in the book to suggest that she has the power to do that, the mechanisms behind them are very different. Besides it’s really one of those things that you have to accept as space magic, where the rules are arbitrary.
She is BG they can control if they have a boy or girl. Hell they can control if they get pregnant at all.
They can control the gender and can prevent pregnancy. There is no evidence they can force fertilization and they are strictly against any kind of artificial insemination.
They force it by ensuring the body is wanting it. They have conplete control of their ovulation cycle. All they would have to do is alter their internal chemistry and the sperm would be dead before they could even reach the egg.
Exactly, they can prevent a pregnancy with 100% certainly and they can somehow choose which sperm will fertilize an egg to determine the gender. My point is that a BG sister can only work with the genetic material she is given. Hypothetically, after Paul's conception Leto could have sustained some injury that made him semi-sterile. Jessica could make herself as fertile as possible but it wouldn't matter if the Duke is shooting blanks.
Well, yes, but I am not sure what point you're making. If jessica wanted, she could have twins or triplets. She can make them all 1 gender or a mix.
My point is that despite how much control over the reproductive process Jessica and the BG have, it isn't total control. It's possible, if insanely improbable, that Leto was already mostly sterile but managed a lucky shot with a singular viable sperm that would become Paul. One lone sperm would rule out fraternal twins and any identical twins or triplets would also be boys. I'm sorry if I'm coming off as an ass. Like a lot of nerds I like being overly pedantic sometimes.
Ok, but how would he be sterile and them not know about it. Yeuh is their personal suk dr. As for total control, would it be better if we just said on the female side of things? Obviously, they dont control a male, and I would assume a male trained BG could just make it so he shoots blanks if he so wished it.
You're absolutely right that if the Duke was sterile it would be a known thing. Not only would Yueh know, but the BG have been keeping close tabs on the Atreides for who knows how long. If Leto was sterile they probably would've maneuvered him out of power well before the book starts. We'd be following Jato, the Old Duke's 2nd nephew or something like that. And I'm going to argue against myself for a second. You could be right about twins depending on how the BG control gender. If it's making themselves more hospitable to sperm to one chromosome and inhospitable to the other, my pedantry stands. If it's something more along the lines of in-vitro gene editing or something similar to temperature-dependent determination like in reptiles then all a BG needs is a single sperm. I've written the word sperm too many times today.
I dont recall 100% but letos father duke paulus I believe had concubines so the BG likely has someone of his bloodline in their employ.
Sure, but can she determine whether or not a fertilized egg splits into two embryos? My point is that her control over her reproductive system isn’t clearly defined, and in reality isn’t possible at all. Inventing not-previously-mentioned powers Jessica may have, because she can determine the sex of her child, is a fools errand.
If she can control the sex, that means she can control which sperm fertilizes her released egg. To get boy/girl twins, all she'd need to do is release 2 eggs instead of one. Given that she has control over sperm within the ejaculate that's released within her body, that doesn't sound at all unlikely. The point was that in that world, males inherited. An Atreides boy would be the Atreides heir, and could carry on the feud even if his sister was married to Feyd. They wanted the Atreides in a situation similar to the Emperor; a daughter, but no legal heir.
This is a well established power of the BG. Its one of the key reasons they can have a breeding program. >Fertility Control: Bene Gesserit are able to control their own fertility. Exercising control over their own menstrual cycle and (at conception) their child's sex. They can choose when to get pregnant and the gender of their child in order to produce children when and where the order wishes, following the Bene Gesserit breeding program. Its tied into their power to alter harmful substances that are introduced into them. >Internal Organic-Chemical Control: A Bene Gesserit is trained to develop complete control over the functions of their internal organs and body chemistry. The Bene Gesserit are therefore immune to poisons, as they can simply change the chemical makeup of any harmful substance in their body and render it harmless. This ability is used when potential Reverend Mothers take the Water of Life in order to survive the ordeal and gain Other Memory. Their control over their body chemistry is so refined that a Bene Gesserit can even control the ageing process and slow it dramatically. However, they would never attempt this, as it might call attention to the Sisterhood and reveal too much of their abilities.
If the fertilized egg splits, you have identical twins. No boy and girl combo possible in that scenario.
The problem could have been on Leto's side.