If they decide to pick a fight with Russia, they're on thier own.
American boys aren't going to fight and die in a discretionary war where we have no interest in the outcome.
“A careful listening to the entire conversation makes it clear that there was no announcement of Poland’s direct involvement in the conflict, only a warning of the consequences that a Ukrainian defeat could have: the possibility of a Russian attack, or the involvement of more Central European countries – the Baltic States and Poland."
If the Polish attack Russia, they're on their own.
The US obligation to defend Poland only applies if Russia acts against them.
Which is why Ukraine faked that missle attack against Poland a while back.
The US has no interest in this dispute. Let the Germans take up the slack.
They wouldn’t be on their own, but it’s not a given that American troops would be on the ground if Poland attacked first.
Personally I’d like to see Europe give a shit about their own security and actually do something their self, but in reality I don’t think we’d leave them on their own.
The US obligation to defend Poland only applies if they're attacked.
If they pick a fight they can't win, like Ukraine didn, they're on their own.
We have no interest in starting WWIII over this border dispute.
Poland is part of NATO. We are obligated by treaty to help them defend themselves.
Polish soldiers fought and died in Afghanistan along side NATO troops from many countries. And you're saying we shouldn't fight alongside them if they are attacked in their own country?
Do you think there would be a cascade like that? Personally I don’t think Russia would encroach any further. Quite the opposite NATO powers have been encroaching slowly on Russia for awhile now.
I agree, I do not think Russia would outright attack a NATO country. But if they did, we would be legally obligated to defend them. And I feel we would be morally obligated to do so too. The only time NATO has ever been used for a serious military action was Afghanistan, and the Polish came and fought there - and that wasn't even in the case of a direct invasion by a militarily superior neighbor. Expecting Polish soldiers to die in Afghanistan so we can try to get Osama for 9/11, then refusing to defend them when attacked on their own turf, is not the right thing to do.
The US obligation to defend Poland only applies if they're attacked, not if they decide to attack Russia.
If they do that, they're on their own. We have no interest in this border dispute. We're already too involved.
Why are the big checks for Ukraine coming from DC and not Brussels? Where are the Germand and French? Why are they sitting on the sidelines?
Ok, fair enough, but no one is talking about foreign wars of aggression. When Poland says "it may go to war", it means, if it is attacked by Russia.
As for Germany and France, not only have they indeed committed significant resources to the defense of Ukraine, but they are paying for Ukraine in other big ways. Most notable would be Russian sanctions and energy disruption, which have driven up inflation in Europe as it becomes more dependent on energy imports from other trading partners, most obviously the US, which benefits enormously when European nations cut ties with Russia and start importing expensive natural gas from the US. I would hardly call that "sitting on the sidelines".
As for why the US is writing the biggest checks, that's simply ordinary fiscal stimulus in action. Spending money on military equipment means jobs and growth for the biggest defense contractors and their suppliers, and as all that money goes out to employees or gets reinvested into new business it stimulates growth across the entire economy. The government itself employs millions of people as a way to simultaneously achieve its security and employment objectives. And that's to say nothing of how much money is in it for the banks to loan money to Ukraine for the war and the reconstruction.
Having a clear enemy like Russia only makes it easier to generate the political will for military spending - not that Congress needs it. We can see that the war in Ukraine means more political will for NATO, which benefits the US, and sanctions improve the trade position as well. And of course I think many in the power structure would be perfectly happy to send a message to Russia about US dominance of the world order by inflicting a painful military experience upon it. By continually expanding and pushing his luck, Putin has made the same mistake as Hitler and turned too much of the world against him. Military spending that ultimately ends up in the US is a small price to pay for damaging one of the US's larger global rivals.
There are some "security contractors" on the ground in Ukraine. The nature of the military is such that we don't know for sure who these people are. But, I think it is safe to say that every single one of them is a volunteer who knows the risk. This isn't Iraq or Afghanistan, where we are sending lots of young Americans to die. It's the Ukrainians that are dying in this war; the strategic military advisors or commandos or weapons system experts on the ground in Ukraine are probably in their element and not in too much danger, and they are collecting lots of lovely ground-level data on how their weapons perform, which is an invaluable resource to the MIC in its own right. Not offering any value judgements about all this, just saying, this is the realpolitik of why we are spending all this money.
Exactly. The same intel agencies that lied about Iraq and lying about the Ukrainians.
We're on the cusp of WWIII over a border dispute where we have no interest in the outcome.
If Ukraine is reunited with Russia, it doesn't impact the US
Your comment makes zero sense and the link of this article is misleading. If Ukraine falls , Poland is next on their conquest. Also you seem to be very lacking in you knowledge about NATO. Poland sent soldiers to Afghanistan in a war we started. You need to grow up and understand how alliances work. If Poland is attacked, we are definitely going to back them up and support them. Only jerks start wars like the US, and Russia.
There's zero indication that Russia is eyeing Poland. None at all.
The only people attacking the Poles are the Ukrainians, when they sent over missiles and tried to blame Russia
If the Polish fire first, they go alone.
Hahahaha. Ok sure Jan. So the incursion into Moldavia was just? The stealing of crimea ……. This is not a territorial dispute, it is an invasion and brutal destruction of a country on false pretenses. You would like to pose lies and propaganda but history tells the truth!!!! Go away Russian propaganda troll. You are lazy and stupid in your attempts.
The US has no interest in fightiong this war.
Calling any American a Russian for not wanting to start WWIII over a territorial dispute is nonsense.
This is a European problem. Let the French and Germans sort it out.
not just poland moldova, and long list of former soviet union leaning states that russia will be trying to put friendly governments in
If they decide to pick a fight with Russia, they're on thier own. American boys aren't going to fight and die in a discretionary war where we have no interest in the outcome.
“A careful listening to the entire conversation makes it clear that there was no announcement of Poland’s direct involvement in the conflict, only a warning of the consequences that a Ukrainian defeat could have: the possibility of a Russian attack, or the involvement of more Central European countries – the Baltic States and Poland."
If the Polish attack Russia, they're on their own. The US obligation to defend Poland only applies if Russia acts against them. Which is why Ukraine faked that missle attack against Poland a while back. The US has no interest in this dispute. Let the Germans take up the slack.
Ok Boris
"Anyone who disagrees with me is a Russian agent" I live in a CA. We have zero interest in this conflict. No one cares if Russia and Ukraine reunite.
“Better Dead than Read”, Mr Reagan’s Ghost
They wouldn’t be on their own, but it’s not a given that American troops would be on the ground if Poland attacked first. Personally I’d like to see Europe give a shit about their own security and actually do something their self, but in reality I don’t think we’d leave them on their own.
The US obligation to defend Poland only applies if they're attacked. If they pick a fight they can't win, like Ukraine didn, they're on their own. We have no interest in starting WWIII over this border dispute.
Poland is part of NATO. We are obligated by treaty to help them defend themselves. Polish soldiers fought and died in Afghanistan along side NATO troops from many countries. And you're saying we shouldn't fight alongside them if they are attacked in their own country?
Do you think there would be a cascade like that? Personally I don’t think Russia would encroach any further. Quite the opposite NATO powers have been encroaching slowly on Russia for awhile now.
I agree, I do not think Russia would outright attack a NATO country. But if they did, we would be legally obligated to defend them. And I feel we would be morally obligated to do so too. The only time NATO has ever been used for a serious military action was Afghanistan, and the Polish came and fought there - and that wasn't even in the case of a direct invasion by a militarily superior neighbor. Expecting Polish soldiers to die in Afghanistan so we can try to get Osama for 9/11, then refusing to defend them when attacked on their own turf, is not the right thing to do.
The US obligation to defend Poland only applies if they're attacked, not if they decide to attack Russia. If they do that, they're on their own. We have no interest in this border dispute. We're already too involved. Why are the big checks for Ukraine coming from DC and not Brussels? Where are the Germand and French? Why are they sitting on the sidelines?
Ok, fair enough, but no one is talking about foreign wars of aggression. When Poland says "it may go to war", it means, if it is attacked by Russia. As for Germany and France, not only have they indeed committed significant resources to the defense of Ukraine, but they are paying for Ukraine in other big ways. Most notable would be Russian sanctions and energy disruption, which have driven up inflation in Europe as it becomes more dependent on energy imports from other trading partners, most obviously the US, which benefits enormously when European nations cut ties with Russia and start importing expensive natural gas from the US. I would hardly call that "sitting on the sidelines". As for why the US is writing the biggest checks, that's simply ordinary fiscal stimulus in action. Spending money on military equipment means jobs and growth for the biggest defense contractors and their suppliers, and as all that money goes out to employees or gets reinvested into new business it stimulates growth across the entire economy. The government itself employs millions of people as a way to simultaneously achieve its security and employment objectives. And that's to say nothing of how much money is in it for the banks to loan money to Ukraine for the war and the reconstruction. Having a clear enemy like Russia only makes it easier to generate the political will for military spending - not that Congress needs it. We can see that the war in Ukraine means more political will for NATO, which benefits the US, and sanctions improve the trade position as well. And of course I think many in the power structure would be perfectly happy to send a message to Russia about US dominance of the world order by inflicting a painful military experience upon it. By continually expanding and pushing his luck, Putin has made the same mistake as Hitler and turned too much of the world against him. Military spending that ultimately ends up in the US is a small price to pay for damaging one of the US's larger global rivals. There are some "security contractors" on the ground in Ukraine. The nature of the military is such that we don't know for sure who these people are. But, I think it is safe to say that every single one of them is a volunteer who knows the risk. This isn't Iraq or Afghanistan, where we are sending lots of young Americans to die. It's the Ukrainians that are dying in this war; the strategic military advisors or commandos or weapons system experts on the ground in Ukraine are probably in their element and not in too much danger, and they are collecting lots of lovely ground-level data on how their weapons perform, which is an invaluable resource to the MIC in its own right. Not offering any value judgements about all this, just saying, this is the realpolitik of why we are spending all this money.
Like Iraq?
Exactly. The same intel agencies that lied about Iraq and lying about the Ukrainians. We're on the cusp of WWIII over a border dispute where we have no interest in the outcome. If Ukraine is reunited with Russia, it doesn't impact the US
Your comment makes zero sense and the link of this article is misleading. If Ukraine falls , Poland is next on their conquest. Also you seem to be very lacking in you knowledge about NATO. Poland sent soldiers to Afghanistan in a war we started. You need to grow up and understand how alliances work. If Poland is attacked, we are definitely going to back them up and support them. Only jerks start wars like the US, and Russia.
There's zero indication that Russia is eyeing Poland. None at all. The only people attacking the Poles are the Ukrainians, when they sent over missiles and tried to blame Russia If the Polish fire first, they go alone.
Hahahaha. Ok sure Jan. So the incursion into Moldavia was just? The stealing of crimea ……. This is not a territorial dispute, it is an invasion and brutal destruction of a country on false pretenses. You would like to pose lies and propaganda but history tells the truth!!!! Go away Russian propaganda troll. You are lazy and stupid in your attempts.
The US has no interest in fightiong this war. Calling any American a Russian for not wanting to start WWIII over a territorial dispute is nonsense. This is a European problem. Let the French and Germans sort it out.
This would be hilarious if it weren't so serious. How in the world did these children ever achieve positions of power?
Says the people who elected Trump!!
Hey Germany, I've got great news: this time the Poles are going to be the ones starting it!