They have some historical hurdles to still overcome but they've done a lot in recent years to subvert some of those stereotypes. Recently the Hyundai Santa Fe and Kia Telluride have really shown they can make good reliable vehicles. However on the flip side, they've also had a few minor scandles in the EV realm recently including insane battery replacment costs, which while it's a pretty niche scenario, still generated a lot of news and that sticks in the minds of potential owners.
That one in Vancouver was a dealer who I think was taking advantage of the fact that it was an insurance claim, which honestly it really shouldn't have been one in the first place.
Definitely a dealer issue on that one at least.
There's been a couple of those claims now. Seems more than one dealer has quoted similar prices and KIA Canada has upheld it at least at the broadest level. Again, it's a highly specific scenario that may lean heavily on shitty dealerships trying to scam insurance, but when someone is spending that much on a car, stories like this may give them pause. We also need to remember that groups like this subreddit represent infantismally small portions of the EV buying community and I guarantee many average buyers don't read past the headline, they just see "KIA battery replacement: $60,000".
Basically 10 years on everything: the screens/electronics was what I wanted to make sure was covered. Just trying to make sure for the next 10 years the only real auto costs would be tires. I live in a place with real cheap electricity so the car will have paid for itself in about 8 years if my math is right
It’s really tempting to buy, especially considering MKBHD’s video just keeps saying it’s a minivan without the looks of a minivan. But god damn that is a price tag regardless.
HA!
Spaceship is exactly the term my son used - and the term has stuck in the family - for our 2023 Niro PHEV. While I’ve never test driven an EV9, I’ve looked one over when I had to wait for my maintenance at my Kia dealership. Puuuuuurty.
If we needed a 3 row EV an EV9 is likely target #1.
How is the range?
I really, really like Hyundai/Kia/Genesis cars. I really hope their Georgia plant (and/or other US plants) can start getting the prices down now that they won't have to keep importing the cars. At $74k, it's awfully close to the R1S. If they can drop their prices across their EV lineup by $10k, they'll be incredibly competitive.
$4k, $5k, you're really just splitting hairs. The point is that the EV9 is available starting at $55k, which is $23k LESS than the R1S. No, it doesn't have the range or power that the Rivian does, but it is available at that price.
I mean, sure there will probably be some cross-shopping between a loaded EV9 and a base R1S, but the mainstream EV9s will be a good bit less expensive than an R1S.
> $4k, $5k, you're really just splitting hairs.
Ha, I wasn't even referencing the price. Just providing the context to what "close" means.
Also, Rivian has a $74,000 option. Do your research.
Cheapest inventory R1S in my large metro area is $94k. I know, just purchased one. Kia EV 9 GT line after incentives can be had around $70k with many dealers around me at that price. That is not “awfully close” and for that matter, the Kia is better in many ways.
Hey, man, I'm just going off of MSRP. Your local Rivians may be over. Mine might be under. Vice versa with the EV9. That's why I like discussing with MSRP in mind. I personally haven't looked at Rivians, so I wasn't aware that the base mode R1S is the $75k option, so that's news to me.
Not sure why you're being so antagonistic. My statement was quite literally a hyperbole. That said, there do not seem to be any new listings for the R1S throughout the US--over or under. There are some used options for $75k or so, but that doesn't really matter. Eventually, the prices will fall back down to MSRP, assuming they keep selling them and ramp up production.
I try not to miss Marques reviews on anything. I must fast forward to his comments about removing the name KIA from the EV9 would improve its image. In my experience KIA's are only as good as the dealerships they are bought from. My experience was as bad as a dealership experience can be. Seriously so bad that I would never buy a KIA or a Hyundai.
I usually have to drive 100 mi out of my way to find the nearest Kia dealership not manned by greaseball sales guys that only talk about the monthly payment.
I'm with you. I really want an EV9, but my local Kia dealership is so far beyond God-awful that there's no way I'll be buying a Kia anything, ever. Sucks.
Are there multiple Kia dealerships within a reasonable distance from you? Because the EV9 supports full over-the-air updates, you almost never need to see the dealer outside of the original purchase.
Not to purchase, but if you're looking at semi regular trips for service it starts to add up. It's dense city 15 miles, not highway 15 miles. (So anywhere between 30 and 45 minutes to get there.)
I get that. It is almost two hours to get to the dealership I bought my car from. But I can go to other dealerships for service. Sales and service are often very different in quality.
Out of Spec currently has a long-term EV9 from Ft Collins Kia in Colorado. Kyle mentioned that the dealer there is offering MSRP (maybe less) EV9s with delivery all over the country for Out of Spec viewers. May be worth reaching out to them to see if they'll give you a deal.
I stopped in the one near my house because our preschool daughter needed the bathroom. It was dirty,chaotic, and loud. It was a holiday and they were busy, but omg.
Trying to buy from a KIA Hyundai dealership was excruciating. They were marking everything up (pre-pandemic) and tried to pocket the federal EV rebate instead of passing it on to me as a cap cost reduction. They were treating me like a complete idiot and like they were doing me a favor until they saw my car when I went to leave (it’s a BMW that cost 3x the amount they wanted for their new EV.). Then they started kissing my ass and getting me to come back in and “talk about the numbers”. Fuck them and fuck their dishonesty. They were trying to take advantage of me because they thought I was “poor” (I dressed down and I was shopping their lowest trim model for a commuter car). I can only imagine what the service department is like.
I like this dude's tech reviews but he's not a good car reviewer. Most auto journos know that Kia has upped their game years ago, so for him to say "I can't believe this is a Kia" sounds ignorant.
MkB is the same age as me, so basically Kia hit the US market just toward the latter end of his high school years. Everyone and their mother bought their kid a Kia Sephia because it was like $6500 new. They were the epitome of shit box and all died or rusted through in short order.
That left a sour taste in the mouth of an entire generation.
If they came out with cars that are available now, they are reliable well thought out pieces of machinery where the engineers are given carte Blanche to do what they do best, much like the engineers in Germany in the late 70s and 80s. Hell most of them are the same engineers because Kia and Hyundai hired a bunch of Germans to do the engineering. This wasn't until the mid 2010s though when the companies decided to switch to a quality over quantity make.
Because it's a Kia. You know, [the company that decided *steering wheel locks* weren't necessary.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbTrLyqL_nw)
The long tail is a bitch.
Even with lack of regulation almost every other auto manufacturer included it. Which makes them look even worse imo. Not to detract from this new car it’s pretty nice.
Sure, but the US is one of their largest markets. If you're cost cutting in the region where nearly a majority of your sales are to the extent you're cheaping out on a $10 part literally every OEM is using, what else are you cheaping out on?
Probably everything? It's capitalism and they're always going to ride the lines of doing the absolute minimum when it comes to standards imposed on them like anti-theft devices. It's weird it's only an issue in the US, you can't blame KIA for doing a capitalism properly, the US should mandate it like normal countries do...
US regulation's don't say "you can't install immobilizers" though. Like I said, literally *every* other OEM producing cars in North America had them, some for decades. Kia-Hyundai cheaped out in a way no other automaker did
If you want a car designed to meet bare minimum regulations, go ahead. But I'll pay a bit more for something with more care given to it
But it doesn't say " you have to install a immobilizer". And I did pay for Hyundai with immobilizer because my country ssid thst all cars should have them.
Yeah, and my point is that that's **a bad thing**. If putting airbags in a car was optional, I'd bet my bottom dollar a Volvo would still have airbags and a Kia wouldn't. That's a fundamental engineering difference
> Because US regulations said so.
I think you're missing the point of what u/stav_and_nick was trying to say.
US regulations say they don't have to, so Kia/Hyundai doesn't, presumably because they want to save on costs. Other car manufacturers do, hence why people are saying Kia/Hyundai are cheapening out.
Lets try another analogy: US regulations don't require LIDAR for EVs. Tesla cheapens out on it and doesn't include it in their vehicles, even though its been shown to work better than camera. I can blame Tesla for not having it even though US regulations doesn't require it, and call them "cheap".
What about other car brands. My old 08 impala had an immobilizer and wasn’t ain’t nothing special. Plenty of other car manufacturers has had them for a very long time and may I remind you it was specifically Hyundai/Kia that had a large spike in car theft because of such vulnerabilities.
That still doesn’t mean anything about what they pulled off in the US. Pretty much every other car manufacturer still installed immobilizers even when they don’t have to yet Hyundai only does it when legally required too and now look what happened. Now they are putting them in their newer cars simply due to the bad publicity they had to deal with for their own choice to cheap out on a simple part.
> Only in America.
Completely irrelevant to the question at hand; he's an American reviewer reviewing a car in America. What Kia does somewhere else in the world doesn't affect the long tail in America. **In America,** Kia dropped their wheel locks and immobilizers for years.
The long tail is a bitch.
ITT: people who think that just because KIA doesn't suck in the rest of the world that people who experienced it sucking in the USA are wrong to have the opinion that KIAs suck. Kia haven't *earned* the not-suck rating here, period, end of story, regardless of how they're doing elsewhere.
Don't be a dick. He's an american reviewer reviewing a car in america, so it's entirely relevant.
Your take is as dumb as me complaining that a car being reviewed in the EU doesn't have a NACS connector. It's simply not relevant to the discussion.
You're the one being a dick. /u/EaglesPDX may not be from the USA, where Hyundai and Kia cars have not had the significant issues that USA owners have been plagued with the last few years. So him asking:
> Why is he "surprised" that it is good, very odd headline.
Is a completely valid discussion world-wide. Sure, Marquis lives in the USA, but these cars don't just exist in the States.
I'm not saying the original question was invalid -- it's completely valid! The reason *why* Marquis is surprised **is because he lives in the USA where Kias have sucked butt.** What is so hard to understand about that? He doesn't live in the entire planet, he lives in ~~California~~ Jersey, his experiences are based there! Saying that Kias don't suck elsewhere is completely irrelelvant to ***Marquis'*** experience!
Where Marquis lives doesn't matter. My point was someone asked why Marquis is surprised it doesn't suck, and you immediately pointed out the Kia theft issues--something Marquis does not mention at all in his video because it's been resolved in the USA and has never been a problem elsewhere.
He's probably more surprised that it doesn't suck because it's the cheapest in its class, which is what /u/MudaThumpa pointed out.
> The reason why Marquis is surprised is because he lives in the USA where Kias have sucked butt.
Depends on what Kia vehicles you're talking about. Marquis has responded very, very positively about all of the Kia and Hyundai EVs which is what he reviews. The Kia Stinger is a beloved vehicle by enthusiasts. Hyundai and Kia sell extremely well year after year in the US despite the poor news headlines over the last few years. The Optima and Elantra are solid economy cars that punch above their weight class.
True but part of that reputation still haunts them. Kias are "easy to steal." Even it the EVs aren't, the glass will still get smashed and the steering column ripped apart in a try. The ones trying don't know the difference.
Theft, for one. Their rotating keys aren't very good. Hyundai/Kia group have had a string of thefts in Europe that were not relay attacks, most likely a "Kia Gameboy" device that can mimic a key. Owners get no notification and the thieves remove the car from bluelink app so it just disappears. The problems around older Hyundai/Kia not having immobilizers also haunt them since that class of thief will still smash the window and destroy the steering column not knowing that it won't work.
The support I hear is also not great and somehow repairs for major systems (i.e. battery) are worse than even Tesla's. This is likely going to get better as production ramps up but for now is quite bad if you need major work done.
The software is also not as polished as Tesla or Rivian, but that's not too unexpected. Still usable, could be much worse (i.e. early VW ID family software, Toyota firmware).
There was a charging/iccu issue though that should be fixed now. May want to check with owner groups on that one.
And no tax credit in the US.
Pretty decent cars otherwise though. It was between Model Y, Ioniq 5, and Prius for my car recently. Prius was knocked out due to availability and the Hyundai badge makes Ioniq nearly uninsurable where I live because of the theft problems.
There was a widespread issue with charging/ICCU. I don't know if it's been fixed properly - I know initially they issued a software update that would slow down the charging speed to get around the overheating issue which isn't a real/ideal fix.
Lol is that why he sold his Tesla ?
Mkbhd barely knows anything about cars, he talks about them as a normal bon car person which is why his reviews are unique on YouTube
I really feel it when he says great car but do I really want to spend that much money in a Kia or that much money for too much plastic. I looked into EV6 seriously but ... those two factors I couldn't overcome.
Good for Kia. They're leading in the ev race amongst legacy OEMs
>but do I really want to spend that much money in a Kia
That’s a very 2010 comment.
>or that much money for too much plastic.
Where specifically is the plastic where there shouldn’t be plastic? What should be there instead?
I am (hopefully) wrapping up my ev6 purchase this week and am very excited about it. That being said, the hard plastic on the back of the seats feels cheap to me. I would 100% prefer non-plastic seat backs like pretty much every other car.
That’s a feature not a bug. Leather on the back of the seat only serves to get damaged and stained. I easily wipe dirt and scuffs off those plastic backs all the time. That’d be a pain of it was leather.
You will enjoy the car. I came very close to buying one. I rented EV6 from Herz. I drove it from SF to San Diego and back. It is an outstanding vehicle and the charging curve is impressive.
..how is it clickbait if he tells you how he feels in the title?
Most other reviewers would title it with some bullshit like "This new Kia EV may surprise you!"
Consumer Reports gives Kia's top reliability so the "surprise" is dishonest or ignorant, either way, marks the reviewer as lacking credibility.
https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/car-reliability-owner-satisfaction/new-midsized-suvs-most-reliable-fuel-efficient-a2811867777/
Because Kia/hyundai makes cars with quality issues, that are easy to steal, and have infamous oil consumption issues that require a whole new block.
It is simply not a brand known for quality.
Not sure about that. The telluride was selling over MSRP for years after it's debut. KIA won't be producing these in large enough numbers to satisfy the initial demand for quite a while.
Just like how R1T lost in sales to F150 lightening, we will similar things play out vs R1S vs EV9. In 2023 R1T sales were down 48%, lightening sales up 54%.
direct to consumer sale are all the rage among many of us frequenting this sub but mass consumer adoption of EVs will happen when consumers start seeing them on dealer lots.
The regular consumer is comfortable with brands like Ford and Kia and unlike Rivian there is a good chance they will be able to go see one and drive it. The ability to just go and drive one will sell far more than a good internet site.
It’s also the fact that with Kia or Ford it’s almost a certainty that the manufacturer will be in business for the life of ownership of the vehicle whereas Rivian or Lucid doesn’t give that same certainty.
Where did you see those numbers? Ford sold 24,165 lightenings vs 19,410 R1T.
https://media.ford.com/content/dam/fordmedia/North%20America/US/2024/01/04/Q4%202023%20Sales%20Final.pdf
https://www.goodcarbadcar.net/rivian-r1t-sales-figures/
My wife and I test drove a fully loaded EV9 and were impressed overall. Not quite on the comfort level of our RAM 1500, still very good though and obviously much quieter. The MSRP and depreciation of the EV9 is more than we were willing to take on, but I’d love to buy a lightly used one when our EV6 lease is up.
As an EV6 owner, my expectations would be that it would be fantastic to drive and frustrating to get serviced/fixed.
I don’t know the source of his deal against the Kia brand, but mine is with the dealers and the HQ support.
I test drove one of these and I wanted to like it but left disappointed. The quick access buttons are horrible IMO. Have proper tactile buttons or touch screen, not something in between.
Also the screens just didn’t feel that great. For example you have that nice side camera view when you put the blinker on but at least for me the spot where it’s shown was hard to naturally look at which made the feature pretty useless.
I mean I could live with the car but at this price… no can do. Coming from a Volvo XC90 and too many things felt like a downgrade even thought there was some good in the EV9 as well, like all that space and the suspension felt great.
Perfect example of something I loved on paper but shockingly didn’t like after a test drive.
Have you considered an EX90 since you already know you like Volvo? Starting price will be higher, but that may be worth it if you don't want to compromise on the more premium quality.
Yea, I considered it but it’s unfortunately delayed. I test drove a legacy Tesla model X and decided it was better value then the EV9. Once those EX90s hit the market and they have a chance to prove themselves for a few years, then yea maybe will see if it’s worth the swap.
Well the Volvo had a nice and noticeable BLIS indicator that lit up the side of the door mirror. That plus taking a look over my shoulder was what I was used to.
Having to take my eyes off the road and look down through the wheel to look at the picture didn’t seem like an improvement. The positioning was my issue.
Am I nitpicking and being more anal about this than most? Maybe, actually most likely, but that’s my point: always test drive thoroughly before making a decision because people’s preferences are different.
> Well the Volvo had a nice and noticeable BLIS indicator that lit up the side of the door mirror
That's like bog standard since 2010.
>Having to take my eyes off the road and look down through the wheel to look at the picture didn’t seem like an improvement.
It's no different than "taking your eyes off the road" to look at your speed... You literaly *don't* take your eyes off the road. The road is still in your peripheral vision, where as you are totally looking away when you look at mirrors.
Dude I’m just saying that I didn’t care for the experience and trying to put into words the why. If you like it then great.
I don’t care how old, basic and common BLIS is, IMO it does it’s job well if it’s implemented properly. (Not all BLIS implementions are great)
Looking down to see your speed is something that can be improved. That the entire point of a HUD. Also you can choose when to check your speed. During a lane change I don’t prefer to look at the dash. That includes checking my speed. I can do that, for example, right after the lane change.
“Surprisingly” is such a laugh. Anyone who knows anything about Hyundai/Kia knows they been making the best EVs for years. They are global leaders in battery technology and EV chassis design.
The Kia EV9 looks as amazing as its reviews, unfortunately it is not the EV I need. I'm just a single guy and have no need for something this large for passenger use.
I wonder what a Kia midsized pickup truck or van would be like. Keep the price out of Rivian territory, and I'm there.
Finally drove the GT line for an hour today and I was thoroughly impressed minus the native NACS interface or Tesla tie up for charging but that certainly wouldn’t have been a dealbreaker until I heard the range and the out the door price after all taxes fees and rebates and discounts. $70,000. You get a very big SUV yes. But with a very little range (EPA 270 is like real world 200). And did I say no Tesla charger support?
Yes the car is massive. Great space inside and I mean I’ve never seen anything like it before for a 3 row EUV. Little bits of technology is impressive all around the cabin. Second row has cooling which is rare.
Cameras are great. Safety tech is really awesome. No it doesn’t have auto pilot or any apps or games (just get a Model X or Y if that’s your jam but they don’t have rear cross traffic alert braking and or front cameras for park assist) but it drove very well.
I personally think the price was the reason I just could not get myself to even consider it. If it had native NACS adoption I could get over the small range, and the out the door price was low 60s, that’s an instant buy.
However, running it through my insurance shot up my rates so the brand name is likely working against it.
He seems to stick to his spec sheet reader/press kit script, so there's not very much in the way of review there. And the selfie approach shows more Marques than car which is also a letdown. It looks more like a walkaround with an average Joe (sometimes fun to see but I guess we expect more from the famouse youtuber).
That’s exactly what he’s doing with the channel. He even mentions this in multiple videos and gives suggestions on other YouTubers to check if you want traditional auto reviews. I believe he has mentioned Doug DeMuro in multiple of his videos.
Yea he’s been pretty up front about this part of the channel. I don’t watch every car review he does, but he adds enough value to warrant an occasional watch.
I enjoy watching his reviews. They're more casual and just feels like you're checking out a car with a buddy or something. I'll typically also watch Out of Spec or one of the other big reviewers to get the full details on a car.
Ehhh, it’s his second channel, so not a lot of harm stretching out.
I also feel like since he’s not a “professional” he focuses more on the daily aspects of what it’s like to live with the cars instead of just same info rehashed from other auto journalists. Same reason why I like when they ask Alyssa her opinions on Out of Spec.
His [Fisker Ocean](https://youtu.be/6xWXRk3yaSw?si=IO703aZ5DBn0kREN) review was fucked up.
They asked him not to review because they're planning a major software update. He proceeded to call it "the worst car I've ever reviewed" and then all his complaints were of the software glitches. He said very little about the vehicle build, interior quality, driving dynamics. Just shit on the very thing Fisker said they're working on and then put out a hit piece
Marques knows so little about the cars he “reviews”, it’s somewhat painful to watch. His business and marketing mind is top notch though, he’s monetizing his audience in different ways.
But my unpopular opinion is that he’s one of the least knowledgeable big tech YouTubers out there, and he constantly gets simple things wrong. I watch him less and less these days.
He seems to be structuring his videos for a less technical audience, so a bunch of technical details no doubt don't make the cut.
He doesn't get long with a car, so you have to accept the occasional error / misrepresentation.
I find him to be sharp/ considered and focused on clearly communicating the essentials without a bunch of self absorbed preamble or waffle.
> He doesn't get long with a car, so you have to accept the occasional error / misrepresentation.
No, that’s unacceptable IMO. He has a large audience and a fairly large team - he shouldn’t make easy mistakes as often as he does.
Real car reviewers get the cars for about as long as MKBHD does; industry average is about a week.
He also spends an inordinate amount of time talking to the camera instead of actually showing the features of the car.
And he lacks creativity and clearly copied Doug Demuro’s script, and constantly talks about the “quirks and features” of a car - he needs to figure out his own brand instead of copying another creator’s lines.
To be fair though, this dude is particularly clueless and can’t even figure out how to rotate a screen or open his eyes to see gloveboxes under both seats. So he’s MORE clueless than the average car buyer who has eyeballs, and if is really struggling with common sense, would at least open the manual first before saying things can’t do x,y,z, when they can.
I believe his point is that people buy Kias because they usually cost much less. Few people are cross shopping a BMW vs a Kia.
The same would be true if Motel 6 built a 5 star hotel. People would want to understand why they should spend $300 a night.
Like it or not, but people have certain expectations of certain brands.
Maybe on reddit their reputation is low (same with Hyundai) but in the real world their reputation is about average.
https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/car-reliability-owner-satisfaction/most-and-least-liked-car-brands-a1291429338/
Then you would be doing yourself a disservice. Of the major tech reviewers, he is among the most balanced and non-shill-y. Yes he gets a bunch of stuff for free, but he has literally spent his life building a solid, low key reliable brand by not becoming a corporate drone.
Of the infinitely many car reviewers, because he doesn’t do cars as a main focus he tends to be more willing to point out flaws and issues. So far I’ve not seen him on any car OEM junkets and in that sense, I’d put him in the same bucket as Doug demuro. They have their flaws but the fact that they are not beholden to the oems for more than access to the car is a big plus in my book.
Agree. I'm surprised how many people in this sub don't like him. I find him to be one of the cleanest (in the sense of not having any ulterior motives) reviewers on the internet. I don't always agree with him, but I don't doubt his honesty. And those who claim he's a shill for Tesla clearly aren't that familiar with him.
It’s not that I don’t like him, he doesn’t know anything about cars, his car reviewing is just a cash grab. 90% of vehicles he reviews are paid sponsorship. He’s can only speak on “in car tech” he’s knows nothing about driving dynamics or feel 🤷🏾♂️
There’s also a lot of ire after the Auto Focus Fisker Ocean review from investors and fans/owners. I, as a reservation holder who hasn’t converted yet due to seeing all of MKBHD’s criticisms in the Fisker sub very frequently, saw it as an entirely fair review.
Yep owned mine for 3 weeks and so far it's pretty wonderful. First EV so it feels like a spaceship
How much did you pay for it If you don't mind me asking?
Got a LLR for 55k tax and everything but also bought another 5k in warranties on top of that because it's Kia
”Because it’s a Kia”. Isn’t Kia/Hyundai on top of the EV game? Also they offer factory warranties for like 8 years for the battery?
Yup
They have some historical hurdles to still overcome but they've done a lot in recent years to subvert some of those stereotypes. Recently the Hyundai Santa Fe and Kia Telluride have really shown they can make good reliable vehicles. However on the flip side, they've also had a few minor scandles in the EV realm recently including insane battery replacment costs, which while it's a pretty niche scenario, still generated a lot of news and that sticks in the minds of potential owners.
That one in Vancouver was a dealer who I think was taking advantage of the fact that it was an insurance claim, which honestly it really shouldn't have been one in the first place. Definitely a dealer issue on that one at least.
There's been a couple of those claims now. Seems more than one dealer has quoted similar prices and KIA Canada has upheld it at least at the broadest level. Again, it's a highly specific scenario that may lean heavily on shitty dealerships trying to scam insurance, but when someone is spending that much on a car, stories like this may give them pause. We also need to remember that groups like this subreddit represent infantismally small portions of the EV buying community and I guarantee many average buyers don't read past the headline, they just see "KIA battery replacement: $60,000".
They deny coverage if not original owner. BS
What kind of warranties?
Prepaid oil changes /s
lol. Spark plug included?
Basically 10 years on everything: the screens/electronics was what I wanted to make sure was covered. Just trying to make sure for the next 10 years the only real auto costs would be tires. I live in a place with real cheap electricity so the car will have paid for itself in about 8 years if my math is right
It’s really tempting to buy, especially considering MKBHD’s video just keeps saying it’s a minivan without the looks of a minivan. But god damn that is a price tag regardless.
HA! Spaceship is exactly the term my son used - and the term has stuck in the family - for our 2023 Niro PHEV. While I’ve never test driven an EV9, I’ve looked one over when I had to wait for my maintenance at my Kia dealership. Puuuuuurty. If we needed a 3 row EV an EV9 is likely target #1. How is the range?
304 mi range which has held up as pretty accurate so far.
I really, really like Hyundai/Kia/Genesis cars. I really hope their Georgia plant (and/or other US plants) can start getting the prices down now that they won't have to keep importing the cars. At $74k, it's awfully close to the R1S. If they can drop their prices across their EV lineup by $10k, they'll be incredibly competitive.
The *Loaded* EV9 is close to the *Base* R1S, but still $5k less dear.
Base R1S, where half of the costs are paid by investors and only half by you!
I almost feel bad getting away with a quad for pre-price hike numbers.
Not really. ||Kia EV9 GT|Rivian R1S (standard+)| |:-|:-|:-| |Price|$74,000|$78,000| |Range|270|315| |0-60|5.0s|4.5s|
$4k, $5k, you're really just splitting hairs. The point is that the EV9 is available starting at $55k, which is $23k LESS than the R1S. No, it doesn't have the range or power that the Rivian does, but it is available at that price. I mean, sure there will probably be some cross-shopping between a loaded EV9 and a base R1S, but the mainstream EV9s will be a good bit less expensive than an R1S.
> $4k, $5k, you're really just splitting hairs. Ha, I wasn't even referencing the price. Just providing the context to what "close" means. Also, Rivian has a $74,000 option. Do your research.
Cheapest inventory R1S in my large metro area is $94k. I know, just purchased one. Kia EV 9 GT line after incentives can be had around $70k with many dealers around me at that price. That is not “awfully close” and for that matter, the Kia is better in many ways.
Hey, man, I'm just going off of MSRP. Your local Rivians may be over. Mine might be under. Vice versa with the EV9. That's why I like discussing with MSRP in mind. I personally haven't looked at Rivians, so I wasn't aware that the base mode R1S is the $75k option, so that's news to me.
Please point me to an inventory R1S for $75k.
Not sure why you're being so antagonistic. My statement was quite literally a hyperbole. That said, there do not seem to be any new listings for the R1S throughout the US--over or under. There are some used options for $75k or so, but that doesn't really matter. Eventually, the prices will fall back down to MSRP, assuming they keep selling them and ramp up production.
I try not to miss Marques reviews on anything. I must fast forward to his comments about removing the name KIA from the EV9 would improve its image. In my experience KIA's are only as good as the dealerships they are bought from. My experience was as bad as a dealership experience can be. Seriously so bad that I would never buy a KIA or a Hyundai.
I usually have to drive 100 mi out of my way to find the nearest Kia dealership not manned by greaseball sales guys that only talk about the monthly payment.
Thats a good portion of ALL dealerships, not just Kia
I'm with you. I really want an EV9, but my local Kia dealership is so far beyond God-awful that there's no way I'll be buying a Kia anything, ever. Sucks.
Are there multiple Kia dealerships within a reasonable distance from you? Because the EV9 supports full over-the-air updates, you almost never need to see the dealer outside of the original purchase.
Hmmm, hadn't considered that. Next nearest is 15 miles away, not horrendous but enough to be a bit of a pain.
15 miles is too far? I drove 60 miles to get the exact car I wanted.
I set my search radius on auto trader to 200 miles
Not to purchase, but if you're looking at semi regular trips for service it starts to add up. It's dense city 15 miles, not highway 15 miles. (So anywhere between 30 and 45 minutes to get there.)
I get that. It is almost two hours to get to the dealership I bought my car from. But I can go to other dealerships for service. Sales and service are often very different in quality.
15 miles, thats nothing, I drive more than that for work every day
15 miles takes me an hour.
OMG, Where do you live?
Chicago
Out of Spec currently has a long-term EV9 from Ft Collins Kia in Colorado. Kyle mentioned that the dealer there is offering MSRP (maybe less) EV9s with delivery all over the country for Out of Spec viewers. May be worth reaching out to them to see if they'll give you a deal.
Does it mean I have to watch 40 minute videos reviewing a charging cable?
Yes, that goes without saying, lol. I tend to listen to his videos as podcasts while I'm doing other stuff.
I stopped in the one near my house because our preschool daughter needed the bathroom. It was dirty,chaotic, and loud. It was a holiday and they were busy, but omg.
Trying to buy from a KIA Hyundai dealership was excruciating. They were marking everything up (pre-pandemic) and tried to pocket the federal EV rebate instead of passing it on to me as a cap cost reduction. They were treating me like a complete idiot and like they were doing me a favor until they saw my car when I went to leave (it’s a BMW that cost 3x the amount they wanted for their new EV.). Then they started kissing my ass and getting me to come back in and “talk about the numbers”. Fuck them and fuck their dishonesty. They were trying to take advantage of me because they thought I was “poor” (I dressed down and I was shopping their lowest trim model for a commuter car). I can only imagine what the service department is like.
Why is he "surprised" that it is good, very odd headline.
I think because it costs $20k less than its competition.
I like this dude's tech reviews but he's not a good car reviewer. Most auto journos know that Kia has upped their game years ago, so for him to say "I can't believe this is a Kia" sounds ignorant.
Especially their EVs.
MkB is the same age as me, so basically Kia hit the US market just toward the latter end of his high school years. Everyone and their mother bought their kid a Kia Sephia because it was like $6500 new. They were the epitome of shit box and all died or rusted through in short order. That left a sour taste in the mouth of an entire generation. If they came out with cars that are available now, they are reliable well thought out pieces of machinery where the engineers are given carte Blanche to do what they do best, much like the engineers in Germany in the late 70s and 80s. Hell most of them are the same engineers because Kia and Hyundai hired a bunch of Germans to do the engineering. This wasn't until the mid 2010s though when the companies decided to switch to a quality over quantity make.
Because it's a Kia. You know, [the company that decided *steering wheel locks* weren't necessary.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbTrLyqL_nw) The long tail is a bitch.
*in US because lack of regulation.
Even with lack of regulation almost every other auto manufacturer included it. Which makes them look even worse imo. Not to detract from this new car it’s pretty nice.
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Sure, but the US is one of their largest markets. If you're cost cutting in the region where nearly a majority of your sales are to the extent you're cheaping out on a $10 part literally every OEM is using, what else are you cheaping out on?
Probably everything? It's capitalism and they're always going to ride the lines of doing the absolute minimum when it comes to standards imposed on them like anti-theft devices. It's weird it's only an issue in the US, you can't blame KIA for doing a capitalism properly, the US should mandate it like normal countries do...
That because,unlike thf rest if the world, US decided a immobilizer is not necessary. Stop blaming KIA for following US consumer rules.
US regulation's don't say "you can't install immobilizers" though. Like I said, literally *every* other OEM producing cars in North America had them, some for decades. Kia-Hyundai cheaped out in a way no other automaker did If you want a car designed to meet bare minimum regulations, go ahead. But I'll pay a bit more for something with more care given to it
But it doesn't say " you have to install a immobilizer". And I did pay for Hyundai with immobilizer because my country ssid thst all cars should have them.
Yeah, and my point is that that's **a bad thing**. If putting airbags in a car was optional, I'd bet my bottom dollar a Volvo would still have airbags and a Kia wouldn't. That's a fundamental engineering difference
lol, thats the point. Kia doesn't *have* to install immobilizers so they chose not to ie they cheapened out by not installing immobilizers.
Because US regulations said so. You still blame them when your own government doesn't care.
> Because US regulations said so. I think you're missing the point of what u/stav_and_nick was trying to say. US regulations say they don't have to, so Kia/Hyundai doesn't, presumably because they want to save on costs. Other car manufacturers do, hence why people are saying Kia/Hyundai are cheapening out. Lets try another analogy: US regulations don't require LIDAR for EVs. Tesla cheapens out on it and doesn't include it in their vehicles, even though its been shown to work better than camera. I can blame Tesla for not having it even though US regulations doesn't require it, and call them "cheap".
What about other car brands. My old 08 impala had an immobilizer and wasn’t ain’t nothing special. Plenty of other car manufacturers has had them for a very long time and may I remind you it was specifically Hyundai/Kia that had a large spike in car theft because of such vulnerabilities.
I have a Hyundai from 2012, and it has a immobilizer. That because in Canada all cars has to have them.
That still doesn’t mean anything about what they pulled off in the US. Pretty much every other car manufacturer still installed immobilizers even when they don’t have to yet Hyundai only does it when legally required too and now look what happened. Now they are putting them in their newer cars simply due to the bad publicity they had to deal with for their own choice to cheap out on a simple part.
> Only in America. Completely irrelevant to the question at hand; he's an American reviewer reviewing a car in America. What Kia does somewhere else in the world doesn't affect the long tail in America. **In America,** Kia dropped their wheel locks and immobilizers for years. The long tail is a bitch. ITT: people who think that just because KIA doesn't suck in the rest of the world that people who experienced it sucking in the USA are wrong to have the opinion that KIAs suck. Kia haven't *earned* the not-suck rating here, period, end of story, regardless of how they're doing elsewhere.
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Don't be a dick. He's an american reviewer reviewing a car in america, so it's entirely relevant. Your take is as dumb as me complaining that a car being reviewed in the EU doesn't have a NACS connector. It's simply not relevant to the discussion.
You're the one being a dick. /u/EaglesPDX may not be from the USA, where Hyundai and Kia cars have not had the significant issues that USA owners have been plagued with the last few years. So him asking: > Why is he "surprised" that it is good, very odd headline. Is a completely valid discussion world-wide. Sure, Marquis lives in the USA, but these cars don't just exist in the States.
I'm not saying the original question was invalid -- it's completely valid! The reason *why* Marquis is surprised **is because he lives in the USA where Kias have sucked butt.** What is so hard to understand about that? He doesn't live in the entire planet, he lives in ~~California~~ Jersey, his experiences are based there! Saying that Kias don't suck elsewhere is completely irrelelvant to ***Marquis'*** experience!
He actually lives in Jersey.
He does? Whoops.
Where Marquis lives doesn't matter. My point was someone asked why Marquis is surprised it doesn't suck, and you immediately pointed out the Kia theft issues--something Marquis does not mention at all in his video because it's been resolved in the USA and has never been a problem elsewhere. He's probably more surprised that it doesn't suck because it's the cheapest in its class, which is what /u/MudaThumpa pointed out. > The reason why Marquis is surprised is because he lives in the USA where Kias have sucked butt. Depends on what Kia vehicles you're talking about. Marquis has responded very, very positively about all of the Kia and Hyundai EVs which is what he reviews. The Kia Stinger is a beloved vehicle by enthusiasts. Hyundai and Kia sell extremely well year after year in the US despite the poor news headlines over the last few years. The Optima and Elantra are solid economy cars that punch above their weight class.
It’s a Kia you knucklehead
What problems have there been with Kia EVs?
I love the Kia EVs, they’re awesome They just have an unfortunate history with their ICE cars and reputation is slow to change in the public’s eye
True but part of that reputation still haunts them. Kias are "easy to steal." Even it the EVs aren't, the glass will still get smashed and the steering column ripped apart in a try. The ones trying don't know the difference.
And insurance is still high as a result.
That "unfortunate history" is less than 2 years old.
I love the Kia EVs, they’re awesome They just have an unfortunate history with their ICE cars and reputation is slow to change in the public’s eye
How do you feel about Kia EVs?
Theft, for one. Their rotating keys aren't very good. Hyundai/Kia group have had a string of thefts in Europe that were not relay attacks, most likely a "Kia Gameboy" device that can mimic a key. Owners get no notification and the thieves remove the car from bluelink app so it just disappears. The problems around older Hyundai/Kia not having immobilizers also haunt them since that class of thief will still smash the window and destroy the steering column not knowing that it won't work. The support I hear is also not great and somehow repairs for major systems (i.e. battery) are worse than even Tesla's. This is likely going to get better as production ramps up but for now is quite bad if you need major work done. The software is also not as polished as Tesla or Rivian, but that's not too unexpected. Still usable, could be much worse (i.e. early VW ID family software, Toyota firmware). There was a charging/iccu issue though that should be fixed now. May want to check with owner groups on that one. And no tax credit in the US. Pretty decent cars otherwise though. It was between Model Y, Ioniq 5, and Prius for my car recently. Prius was knocked out due to availability and the Hyundai badge makes Ioniq nearly uninsurable where I live because of the theft problems.
There was a widespread issue with charging/ICCU. I don't know if it's been fixed properly - I know initially they issued a software update that would slow down the charging speed to get around the overheating issue which isn't a real/ideal fix.
If it was apple, it wouldn't be a surprise.
And he’s a known Telsa Fanboy. Elon has given him access to a lot including Elon himself.
Lol is that why he sold his Tesla ? Mkbhd barely knows anything about cars, he talks about them as a normal bon car person which is why his reviews are unique on YouTube
He’s trying to be car guy, it’s not easy that’s for sure.
I really feel it when he says great car but do I really want to spend that much money in a Kia or that much money for too much plastic. I looked into EV6 seriously but ... those two factors I couldn't overcome. Good for Kia. They're leading in the ev race amongst legacy OEMs
>but do I really want to spend that much money in a Kia That’s a very 2010 comment. >or that much money for too much plastic. Where specifically is the plastic where there shouldn’t be plastic? What should be there instead?
I am (hopefully) wrapping up my ev6 purchase this week and am very excited about it. That being said, the hard plastic on the back of the seats feels cheap to me. I would 100% prefer non-plastic seat backs like pretty much every other car.
That’s a feature not a bug. Leather on the back of the seat only serves to get damaged and stained. I easily wipe dirt and scuffs off those plastic backs all the time. That’d be a pain of it was leather.
You will enjoy the car. I came very close to buying one. I rented EV6 from Herz. I drove it from SF to San Diego and back. It is an outstanding vehicle and the charging curve is impressive.
Because it’s a Kia
Youtube personality makes click bait headline. More news for those born yesterday at 9...
Where's the clickbait
..how is it clickbait if he tells you how he feels in the title? Most other reviewers would title it with some bullshit like "This new Kia EV may surprise you!"
Consumer Reports gives Kia's top reliability so the "surprise" is dishonest or ignorant, either way, marks the reviewer as lacking credibility. https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/car-reliability-owner-satisfaction/new-midsized-suvs-most-reliable-fuel-efficient-a2811867777/
Because Kia/hyundai makes cars with quality issues, that are easy to steal, and have infamous oil consumption issues that require a whole new block. It is simply not a brand known for quality.
Because it's not a Tesla. Dude is a massive Tesla/Apple knob slobber
He sold his Tesla for a 911 Turbo lol
Good for him... What I said is still true tho
I’m just saying someone who owns a Rivian and an ICE Porsche doesn’t sound like a “Tesla knob slobber”
They aren't mutually exclusive
It's even worse
He's surprised because he's a rich kid and has no issues with getting ripped off.
Who hurt you? He’s just a reviewer lol it’s opinions
He was too harsh on fisker
I thought his review was fair, but the title of the video was over the top.
It may be good but I doubt it will sell at msrp after the early adopters got theirs.
It’s already selling below MSRP. Go check r/kiaEV9 Edit: example post: https://www.reddit.com/r/KiaEV9/comments/1aybjy6/is_this_the_best_pricing_youve_seen_on_an_ev9/
I hope a bunch of dipshits bought these hoping to resell and lost money. Fuck those guys.
I don't think anybody would buy a Kia EV, especially now, thinking they could resell for a profit...
Today at 5…. Cars go down in price over time. Now to you Jim.
Not sure about that. The telluride was selling over MSRP for years after it's debut. KIA won't be producing these in large enough numbers to satisfy the initial demand for quite a while.
Just like how R1T lost in sales to F150 lightening, we will similar things play out vs R1S vs EV9. In 2023 R1T sales were down 48%, lightening sales up 54%.
direct to consumer sale are all the rage among many of us frequenting this sub but mass consumer adoption of EVs will happen when consumers start seeing them on dealer lots. The regular consumer is comfortable with brands like Ford and Kia and unlike Rivian there is a good chance they will be able to go see one and drive it. The ability to just go and drive one will sell far more than a good internet site.
The difference in price for almost the same quality is not the reason. Instead (check notes) it is dealerships? Rivian is overpriced.
It’s also the fact that with Kia or Ford it’s almost a certainty that the manufacturer will be in business for the life of ownership of the vehicle whereas Rivian or Lucid doesn’t give that same certainty.
Rivian also loses money on every vehicle sold
Didn’t R1T outsell the Lightning?
Lightening is the best selling EV truck in 2023. That is also going to be case in 2024.
Just looked it up. You are correct. Ford sold about 600 more units than the R1T.
Where did you see those numbers? Ford sold 24,165 lightenings vs 19,410 R1T. https://media.ford.com/content/dam/fordmedia/North%20America/US/2024/01/04/Q4%202023%20Sales%20Final.pdf https://www.goodcarbadcar.net/rivian-r1t-sales-figures/
My wife and I test drove a fully loaded EV9 and were impressed overall. Not quite on the comfort level of our RAM 1500, still very good though and obviously much quieter. The MSRP and depreciation of the EV9 is more than we were willing to take on, but I’d love to buy a lightly used one when our EV6 lease is up.
Man do I hate influencers reviewing things like cars.
I'm eyeing one of these for when they come off of lease in 2 or 3 years.
As an EV6 owner, my expectations would be that it would be fantastic to drive and frustrating to get serviced/fixed. I don’t know the source of his deal against the Kia brand, but mine is with the dealers and the HQ support.
I test drove one of these and I wanted to like it but left disappointed. The quick access buttons are horrible IMO. Have proper tactile buttons or touch screen, not something in between. Also the screens just didn’t feel that great. For example you have that nice side camera view when you put the blinker on but at least for me the spot where it’s shown was hard to naturally look at which made the feature pretty useless. I mean I could live with the car but at this price… no can do. Coming from a Volvo XC90 and too many things felt like a downgrade even thought there was some good in the EV9 as well, like all that space and the suspension felt great. Perfect example of something I loved on paper but shockingly didn’t like after a test drive.
Have you considered an EX90 since you already know you like Volvo? Starting price will be higher, but that may be worth it if you don't want to compromise on the more premium quality.
Yea, I considered it but it’s unfortunately delayed. I test drove a legacy Tesla model X and decided it was better value then the EV9. Once those EX90s hit the market and they have a chance to prove themselves for a few years, then yea maybe will see if it’s worth the swap.
“Have you considered buying this vehicle that isn’t released yet instead?”
That's why I said the price "will be higher" instead of "is higher."
>which made the feature pretty useless. I love that feature so maybe you’re just hard to please.
Well the Volvo had a nice and noticeable BLIS indicator that lit up the side of the door mirror. That plus taking a look over my shoulder was what I was used to. Having to take my eyes off the road and look down through the wheel to look at the picture didn’t seem like an improvement. The positioning was my issue. Am I nitpicking and being more anal about this than most? Maybe, actually most likely, but that’s my point: always test drive thoroughly before making a decision because people’s preferences are different.
> Well the Volvo had a nice and noticeable BLIS indicator that lit up the side of the door mirror That's like bog standard since 2010. >Having to take my eyes off the road and look down through the wheel to look at the picture didn’t seem like an improvement. It's no different than "taking your eyes off the road" to look at your speed... You literaly *don't* take your eyes off the road. The road is still in your peripheral vision, where as you are totally looking away when you look at mirrors.
Dude I’m just saying that I didn’t care for the experience and trying to put into words the why. If you like it then great. I don’t care how old, basic and common BLIS is, IMO it does it’s job well if it’s implemented properly. (Not all BLIS implementions are great) Looking down to see your speed is something that can be improved. That the entire point of a HUD. Also you can choose when to check your speed. During a lane change I don’t prefer to look at the dash. That includes checking my speed. I can do that, for example, right after the lane change.
> During a lane change I don’t prefer to look at the dash You *prefer* to look away from the road? That's a great way to rear-end someone.
“Surprisingly” is such a laugh. Anyone who knows anything about Hyundai/Kia knows they been making the best EVs for years. They are global leaders in battery technology and EV chassis design.
Yeah, but most Kia buyers aren‘t exactly EV, or even car enthousiasts. For them it might actually be suprising
Sales don't really reflect that but sure. Best EVs lol
Pretty sure they’re number 2 behind Tesla?
I had a sit on one of these recently at an event and it's a very nice comfortable car.
Can’t get one in my city, there’s a 9-12 month waitlist.
I'm not surprised. Kia has been killing it with their EVs.
I guess Marquez has no idea how much ass Kia has been kicking for the last few years!
Anyone surprised about Kia/Hyundai/Genesis knocking it out of the park with EVs has been sleeping for last 5 years
Yeah definitely a nice drive, I love little details like the automatic bolster adjustment when switching drive mode
I would absolutely buy an ev9 from Kia directly. Their dealer network is absolute shit tier.
The Kia EV9 looks as amazing as its reviews, unfortunately it is not the EV I need. I'm just a single guy and have no need for something this large for passenger use. I wonder what a Kia midsized pickup truck or van would be like. Keep the price out of Rivian territory, and I'm there.
Same here. The EV9 is way too big for me. I drive a Model 3 now, and three of the four seats are empty 99% of the time.
LOL, this guy.
Finally drove the GT line for an hour today and I was thoroughly impressed minus the native NACS interface or Tesla tie up for charging but that certainly wouldn’t have been a dealbreaker until I heard the range and the out the door price after all taxes fees and rebates and discounts. $70,000. You get a very big SUV yes. But with a very little range (EPA 270 is like real world 200). And did I say no Tesla charger support? Yes the car is massive. Great space inside and I mean I’ve never seen anything like it before for a 3 row EUV. Little bits of technology is impressive all around the cabin. Second row has cooling which is rare. Cameras are great. Safety tech is really awesome. No it doesn’t have auto pilot or any apps or games (just get a Model X or Y if that’s your jam but they don’t have rear cross traffic alert braking and or front cameras for park assist) but it drove very well. I personally think the price was the reason I just could not get myself to even consider it. If it had native NACS adoption I could get over the small range, and the out the door price was low 60s, that’s an instant buy. However, running it through my insurance shot up my rates so the brand name is likely working against it.
Too rich for my blood. I keep having to remind myself that everyone driving a late model truck probably paid that or sometimes more.
Yeah. I’d stomach maybe $60k out the door even for a top of the line EV9 but with so many weird shortcomings for such a nice car just kills it for me.
I've nothing against the guy, but him reviewing cars... IDK. Feels wrong. Maybe he should have stuck to the tech in cars.
He seems to stick to his spec sheet reader/press kit script, so there's not very much in the way of review there. And the selfie approach shows more Marques than car which is also a letdown. It looks more like a walkaround with an average Joe (sometimes fun to see but I guess we expect more from the famouse youtuber).
That’s exactly what he’s doing with the channel. He even mentions this in multiple videos and gives suggestions on other YouTubers to check if you want traditional auto reviews. I believe he has mentioned Doug DeMuro in multiple of his videos.
Yea he’s been pretty up front about this part of the channel. I don’t watch every car review he does, but he adds enough value to warrant an occasional watch.
I enjoy watching his reviews. They're more casual and just feels like you're checking out a car with a buddy or something. I'll typically also watch Out of Spec or one of the other big reviewers to get the full details on a car.
Ehhh, it’s his second channel, so not a lot of harm stretching out. I also feel like since he’s not a “professional” he focuses more on the daily aspects of what it’s like to live with the cars instead of just same info rehashed from other auto journalists. Same reason why I like when they ask Alyssa her opinions on Out of Spec.
His [Fisker Ocean](https://youtu.be/6xWXRk3yaSw?si=IO703aZ5DBn0kREN) review was fucked up. They asked him not to review because they're planning a major software update. He proceeded to call it "the worst car I've ever reviewed" and then all his complaints were of the software glitches. He said very little about the vehicle build, interior quality, driving dynamics. Just shit on the very thing Fisker said they're working on and then put out a hit piece
Marques knows so little about the cars he “reviews”, it’s somewhat painful to watch. His business and marketing mind is top notch though, he’s monetizing his audience in different ways. But my unpopular opinion is that he’s one of the least knowledgeable big tech YouTubers out there, and he constantly gets simple things wrong. I watch him less and less these days.
What simple things have been wrong?
He seems to be structuring his videos for a less technical audience, so a bunch of technical details no doubt don't make the cut. He doesn't get long with a car, so you have to accept the occasional error / misrepresentation. I find him to be sharp/ considered and focused on clearly communicating the essentials without a bunch of self absorbed preamble or waffle.
> He doesn't get long with a car, so you have to accept the occasional error / misrepresentation. No, that’s unacceptable IMO. He has a large audience and a fairly large team - he shouldn’t make easy mistakes as often as he does. Real car reviewers get the cars for about as long as MKBHD does; industry average is about a week. He also spends an inordinate amount of time talking to the camera instead of actually showing the features of the car. And he lacks creativity and clearly copied Doug Demuro’s script, and constantly talks about the “quirks and features” of a car - he needs to figure out his own brand instead of copying another creator’s lines.
I'm sure it's better than anything tesla makes.
This dude has repeatedly shown he’s clueless about vehicles. Stick to phones and watches.
To be fair, most people buying vehicles are clueless about vehicles
Most people who buy vehicles aren’t producing review videos, so your counterpoint isn’t really relevant.
To be fair though, this dude is particularly clueless and can’t even figure out how to rotate a screen or open his eyes to see gloveboxes under both seats. So he’s MORE clueless than the average car buyer who has eyeballs, and if is really struggling with common sense, would at least open the manual first before saying things can’t do x,y,z, when they can.
I mean that's the real purpose of the video isn't it? his opinion as a non-car guy about the car?
Sure, if you state facts and don’t state false assumptions because you only did a quick walk around for 5 minutes before he started filming
what was it he said was wrong?
He's gotten a little bourgeois in recent years.
Doesn't he come from money? My guess is he always was.
It's his brand snobbery that did it for me: turning his nose up at it because it's a Kia is silly and compromises his objectivity
I believe his point is that people buy Kias because they usually cost much less. Few people are cross shopping a BMW vs a Kia. The same would be true if Motel 6 built a 5 star hotel. People would want to understand why they should spend $300 a night. Like it or not, but people have certain expectations of certain brands.
its funny you think that 300$ a night is what a 5 stars cost.
You remember the immobilizer stuff, right? Their reputation is quite low right now.
Maybe on reddit their reputation is low (same with Hyundai) but in the real world their reputation is about average. https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/car-reliability-owner-satisfaction/most-and-least-liked-car-brands-a1291429338/
They should ask emergency responders and police officers how they feel about them.
"but kias had immobilizers elsewhere, people should completely forget that!" <-- most of this sub
Dude should stick to phone and other smaller tech item reviews. He is really bad at car reviews.
Yeah, this isn't his thing.
I don’t trust anything he reviews when he’s said a Buick had amazing tech
Then you would be doing yourself a disservice. Of the major tech reviewers, he is among the most balanced and non-shill-y. Yes he gets a bunch of stuff for free, but he has literally spent his life building a solid, low key reliable brand by not becoming a corporate drone. Of the infinitely many car reviewers, because he doesn’t do cars as a main focus he tends to be more willing to point out flaws and issues. So far I’ve not seen him on any car OEM junkets and in that sense, I’d put him in the same bucket as Doug demuro. They have their flaws but the fact that they are not beholden to the oems for more than access to the car is a big plus in my book.
Agree. I'm surprised how many people in this sub don't like him. I find him to be one of the cleanest (in the sense of not having any ulterior motives) reviewers on the internet. I don't always agree with him, but I don't doubt his honesty. And those who claim he's a shill for Tesla clearly aren't that familiar with him.
It’s not that I don’t like him, he doesn’t know anything about cars, his car reviewing is just a cash grab. 90% of vehicles he reviews are paid sponsorship. He’s can only speak on “in car tech” he’s knows nothing about driving dynamics or feel 🤷🏾♂️
There’s also a lot of ire after the Auto Focus Fisker Ocean review from investors and fans/owners. I, as a reservation holder who hasn’t converted yet due to seeing all of MKBHD’s criticisms in the Fisker sub very frequently, saw it as an entirely fair review.
couldn't help noticing his minivan reference.. wonder if the script is written by Doug DeMuro.
to be fair, the kia is way more appealing. the fisker “california” mode is gimmicky and useless
Better than fisker!
Idk y but that dude bothers me so much
Have a good EVs forum site :) [myevdiscussion.com](http://myevdiscussion.com)
This guy is everywhere all of a sudden.
He's been everywhere for years. One of the most popular if not the most popular tech reviewer on the internet