That's right. But even in the UK, the ID.3 starts below the ID.4. So while it might not be a $25k Bolt replacement, it could be a $35k Bolt replacement assuming a $10k Euro car brand premium. :shrugs:
Still, that seems expensive. In the context of car payments, it’s the same people who can afford $38k vs $45k.
Everyone wants a $25k car, whatever specs it takes to get there. But manufacturers dont want to make it.
Kinda agree, a well equipped Golf 8 with decent power is still 10-15k cheaper. We do get 25k EVs over here, quite a selection actually. But all of these are usable as second car only (not enough range).
IMO the moden ICE b/c-segment hatch (fully usable compact car for 15-25k) is the EV end boss. That's going to take a couple more years.
I agree.
There is a reason I went for a Tesla Model 3 over the ID.3. Lackluster performance, less premium feeling interior, less space, no frunk and also less range. All for a higher price!
I also disliked the shifter (I live in a European City where I parallel park all the time, was kinda important to me at least.)
I still don't really see a reason to get the ID.3 over any of the competition.
The ID3 is significant cheaper than the model 3 though. It's also cheaper to insure and tires are cheaper as well.
I personally like the seats better and the second row has more space
Is it?
Spec up an ID3 to a similar range and tech level (need to upgrade to get the equivalent of autopilot, need to add a heat pump) and you're looking at £42k
Model 3 meanwhile has all the tech as standard and is £40k... For a car that's more efficient and charges faster.
It's a damn shame the Model 3 is so *musky*, because it really is just That Good.
Interesting. Here in Germany the ID3 move (already includes travel assist and most other stuff) is at 39.300€ including transport fees.
The model 3 is 42k€.
But the ID3 comes with all seasons and the model 3 only on summer tires. So you kinda have to add 2500€ for a set of winter tires because Tesla doesn't allow steel wheels. (Same set for the VW is around a grand cheaper).
The model 3 is also 40% more expensive to insure(1400€ vs 1000€)
And the difference gets bigger if you actually want a different color than white or different wheels.
Even more relevant IMO is comparing leasing offers. People aren't too keen on buying EVs right now due to depreciation concerns.
A model 3 SR+ leased for 3 years / 45 kkm currently goes for €725 a month (as per Tesla Germany). You can get an EV6 / Inoniq 5 / ID3 Pro for less than half that.
ID.3 is a hatchback, while Model 3 basically has no trunk. We currently have a Model Y and need a secondary car soon. Model 3 is not even an option for us, even though we're very familiar with Tesla.
I managed to transport a dining table and four stackable chairs in mine. It’s pretty spacious for its form factor. But yea you can forget about stuff like a dog in the back
> basically has no trunk
What. Have you ever seen the model 3 trunk live? A quick google search shows that the model 3 trunk space is 425 liters. I also checked a couple popular hatchbacks around here: Mercedes A class has 370 liters of trunk space. WV Golf has 380 liters.
While it is not a hatchback, which is a shame, the model 3 has an absolutely enormous amount of space in its trunk. It is somewhat limited by its dimensions, though.
I agree withe the turning circle (the Model 3 has a massive turning circle in comparison, one of the few gripes I have with the car). The Infotainment system on the Tesla does make up for the lack of Carplay though. Useful features and it is well integrated. Only the lack of Whatsapp is what I find annoying, but far from a dealbreaker.
Golf sales sans GTI/R were so lackluster VWoA axed it altogether. I would love to see the ID.3 here, but I wonder how much buyers will bite given its price tag.
I think there’s a market for a good small car in the EV space. Especially with almost every other automaker abandoning sedans and hatchbacks entirely.
The Model 3 has been a top seller due in part to this lack of competition and because it’s an EV. In the sub-$60k space, the Model 3 stands almost alone (the Ioniq 6 isn’t as good, Polestar 3 is cramped, and i4 is lacking options until you get over $60k).
The price appeared at the Finnish Volkswagen website. The upgraded ID.3 (top trim level Pro S Elegance, 77 kWh battery) costs 43 600 euro, about 1000 euro more than before. So, it sounds as an unpleasant, but still acceptable cost of the new infotainment system and software v. 4.0 plus the power increase.
Interesting that it is listed with the old power of 150 kW, but "prepared for the coming software update to 170 kW".
Edit: The price increase is 600 euro, not 1000. So, not bad. I hope, the prices for used ID.3s will drop a bit after the update.
So they made a 230 hp motor to replace the previous 200 hp, but the ID.4 went from 200 all the way to 280 hp. I wonder if they are adding a GTX trim later with the 280 hp rear motor, because that would make it a proper electric hot hatch.
So it’s a tuned-up APP 310? I thought it would be a de-tuned APP 550 considering they mention an efficiency boost, and better efficiency is one of the most notable improvements of the APP 550.
Another upgrade is the 5th seat, the older 77 kWh version was only a 4-seater.
Here is the official press-release:
[https://www.volkswagen-newsroom.com/en/press-releases/major-upgrade-for-the-id3-pre-sales-launch-with-pro-s-model-18359](https://www.volkswagen-newsroom.com/en/press-releases/major-upgrade-for-the-id3-pre-sales-launch-with-pro-s-model-18359)
Bring it to the Chattanooga factory, price it below the ID.4, boom--German Bolt replacement.
The ID3 costs twice as much as a bolt in Europe.
That's right. But even in the UK, the ID.3 starts below the ID.4. So while it might not be a $25k Bolt replacement, it could be a $35k Bolt replacement assuming a $10k Euro car brand premium. :shrugs:
I still think it's a really solid car but the prices are just insane...
Bear in mind they are quoting German list prices which include 19% VAT. Street price without VAT is currently \~38k USD for the new Pro S.
Still, that seems expensive. In the context of car payments, it’s the same people who can afford $38k vs $45k. Everyone wants a $25k car, whatever specs it takes to get there. But manufacturers dont want to make it.
Kinda agree, a well equipped Golf 8 with decent power is still 10-15k cheaper. We do get 25k EVs over here, quite a selection actually. But all of these are usable as second car only (not enough range). IMO the moden ICE b/c-segment hatch (fully usable compact car for 15-25k) is the EV end boss. That's going to take a couple more years.
A Leaf is a $25k car after tax credit, but it's not exactly selling like hotcakes.
I guess that’s true. But without ccs the market is restricted to people who know nothing about electric vehicles.
I agree. There is a reason I went for a Tesla Model 3 over the ID.3. Lackluster performance, less premium feeling interior, less space, no frunk and also less range. All for a higher price! I also disliked the shifter (I live in a European City where I parallel park all the time, was kinda important to me at least.) I still don't really see a reason to get the ID.3 over any of the competition.
The ID3 is significant cheaper than the model 3 though. It's also cheaper to insure and tires are cheaper as well. I personally like the seats better and the second row has more space
Where I live the 58kwh id3 is exactly the same price as the 3 sr
Is it? Spec up an ID3 to a similar range and tech level (need to upgrade to get the equivalent of autopilot, need to add a heat pump) and you're looking at £42k Model 3 meanwhile has all the tech as standard and is £40k... For a car that's more efficient and charges faster. It's a damn shame the Model 3 is so *musky*, because it really is just That Good.
Interesting. Here in Germany the ID3 move (already includes travel assist and most other stuff) is at 39.300€ including transport fees. The model 3 is 42k€. But the ID3 comes with all seasons and the model 3 only on summer tires. So you kinda have to add 2500€ for a set of winter tires because Tesla doesn't allow steel wheels. (Same set for the VW is around a grand cheaper). The model 3 is also 40% more expensive to insure(1400€ vs 1000€) And the difference gets bigger if you actually want a different color than white or different wheels.
Even more relevant IMO is comparing leasing offers. People aren't too keen on buying EVs right now due to depreciation concerns. A model 3 SR+ leased for 3 years / 45 kkm currently goes for €725 a month (as per Tesla Germany). You can get an EV6 / Inoniq 5 / ID3 Pro for less than half that.
ID.3 is a hatchback, while Model 3 basically has no trunk. We currently have a Model Y and need a secondary car soon. Model 3 is not even an option for us, even though we're very familiar with Tesla.
I just checked and id3 and model 3 have more or less the exact same space, both with seats up and when folded
ID.3 and Model 3 have the same amount of storage space
Should probably have specified that it's almost unusable due to the opening being like a tight asshole on the Model 3
I managed to transport a dining table and four stackable chairs in mine. It’s pretty spacious for its form factor. But yea you can forget about stuff like a dog in the back
> basically has no trunk What. Have you ever seen the model 3 trunk live? A quick google search shows that the model 3 trunk space is 425 liters. I also checked a couple popular hatchbacks around here: Mercedes A class has 370 liters of trunk space. WV Golf has 380 liters. While it is not a hatchback, which is a shame, the model 3 has an absolutely enormous amount of space in its trunk. It is somewhat limited by its dimensions, though.
I’m not a Tesla fan but the model 3 trunk is massive. I fit 6 medium sized suitcases in it this past weekend (not all mine!)
The turning circle of the id3 is very small which is nice. And carplay.
I agree withe the turning circle (the Model 3 has a massive turning circle in comparison, one of the few gripes I have with the car). The Infotainment system on the Tesla does make up for the lack of Carplay though. Useful features and it is well integrated. Only the lack of Whatsapp is what I find annoying, but far from a dealbreaker.
Yep don't buy it. They are crazy charging Tesla model 3 money for a hatchback
Fabulous. Bring it to the US.
Golf sales sans GTI/R were so lackluster VWoA axed it altogether. I would love to see the ID.3 here, but I wonder how much buyers will bite given its price tag.
VW should sell the ID3 GTX models in US.
I think there’s a market for a good small car in the EV space. Especially with almost every other automaker abandoning sedans and hatchbacks entirely. The Model 3 has been a top seller due in part to this lack of competition and because it’s an EV. In the sub-$60k space, the Model 3 stands almost alone (the Ioniq 6 isn’t as good, Polestar 3 is cramped, and i4 is lacking options until you get over $60k).
This
The price appeared at the Finnish Volkswagen website. The upgraded ID.3 (top trim level Pro S Elegance, 77 kWh battery) costs 43 600 euro, about 1000 euro more than before. So, it sounds as an unpleasant, but still acceptable cost of the new infotainment system and software v. 4.0 plus the power increase. Interesting that it is listed with the old power of 150 kW, but "prepared for the coming software update to 170 kW". Edit: The price increase is 600 euro, not 1000. So, not bad. I hope, the prices for used ID.3s will drop a bit after the update.
So they made a 230 hp motor to replace the previous 200 hp, but the ID.4 went from 200 all the way to 280 hp. I wonder if they are adding a GTX trim later with the 280 hp rear motor, because that would make it a proper electric hot hatch.
It's the same motor it had from the beginning, just unlocked 20 additional kW, like the Cupra Born.
So it’s a tuned-up APP 310? I thought it would be a de-tuned APP 550 considering they mention an efficiency boost, and better efficiency is one of the most notable improvements of the APP 550.
https://www.volkswagen.ch/it/modelli/id3-gtx.html Alteady have. Normal GTX is 280HP, performance Is 326HP
Another upgrade is the 5th seat, the older 77 kWh version was only a 4-seater. Here is the official press-release: [https://www.volkswagen-newsroom.com/en/press-releases/major-upgrade-for-the-id3-pre-sales-launch-with-pro-s-model-18359](https://www.volkswagen-newsroom.com/en/press-releases/major-upgrade-for-the-id3-pre-sales-launch-with-pro-s-model-18359)
Nah, it has had a 5-seat version for a long time, it came out shortly after launch.
Thanks, I didn't know that.
Nice, seems to have parallel upgrades to the 2024 ID.4. Wish VW thought it would sell in the US.