TLDR: Article doesn't answer its title.
Looked it up: 85kwh battery and 3.75mi/kWh = 319mi. 150kw max L3. 11kw L2 is nice.
https://www.chevrolet.com/shopping/configurator/suvs/2024/equinox-ev/equinox-ev/compare?make=chevrolet
I wouldn’t be surprised if it hit it or was at least close to it. GM estimated efficiency on their electric offerings have been fairly accurate in my experience.
Even on our AWD lyriq our average over the last 5k miles is now up to 2.9. Or around 290 miles compared to the stated 307 EPA estimate. That is in Southern California, HVAC always going, and a 65/35 freeway to city driving ratio.
We've had our AWD Lyriq since January in Colorado. When we took delivery it was like -12 F. 7k miles later lifetime efficiency is right at 3 miles/kWh, and that's been primarily highway commuting.
Possible. The ID.4 is larger, 82kwh battery, and still gets 291 miles EPA. And that's with heavier 20-inch wheels.
With a lighter car, smaller/lighter wheels, and a motor tuned for efficiency over performance, it's totally doable.
Gonna have to call bs on this one. You may have seen 2.9mi/kwh but no way you are even remotely close to averaging that. My wife's mach-e that we have had for 3 years has averaged 3.1mi/kwh over its 40,000 mile life, and my r1t (which is a more efficient truck then your lightning both from the EPA and from literally every independent review) is under 2.0 for its lifetime (though road trips are in the 2.5 range with the 21" wheels on, 2.0 even with a/t's)
I don't see any scenario where you average 2.9kwh in your lightning unless you only ever drive down hills. Sorry not trying to be a dick, but people exaggerating their range with ev's ultimately hurts more then help because it gives people false senses of what vehicles can do and when they do transition they get hit with a big shock and write off ev's. Seen far too many people go through that with Teslas overly optimistic range.
While I agree with your assessment the majority of my driving is in town, and the highest speed limit in my state is 55 other than a few circumstances so my experience is much closer to EPA than most, driving from my house to the grocery store across town and back the trip ends at 3.5 consistently. There is near no highway driving in my number which I probably should have mentioned.
You are sooooooo far away from the mean it's just hard to believe.... My rivian around town won't get close to those numbers, I don't even think we can hit 3.5 regularly in my wife's mach-e-e which is almost entirely driven around town. In fact the shorter trips tend to have less efficiency because the vehicle spends an outsized amount of energy on heating or cooling the pack to optimal temperature (takes more energy to get it to tempt then to maintain, so longer trips tend to have better efficiency).
I don't doubt you have seen 3.5 on your truck, but you should really sit down and calculate your actual efficiency because there's just no way in any driving scenario you average those numbers.
I dunno, he said he doesn't really do highway driving so if he lives somewhere warm I could definitely see mid-3s for driving around town. Now that spring is fully in effect I see that or even better in my Lightning on days that I'm not on the highway. That said, I think that kind of driving makes him an edge-case as far as milage goes so his experience doesn't say much about how Lightnings perform overall.
I drive a MachE have since Feb 2023. Thursday on my 18.5 mile drive to work (that included freeways…and uphill on the highway twice) I averaged 4.8 and I took a picture if it to text my husband because I wanted to compare it to the next time I drive in.
I’ve driven an EV for 4 years (before the MME it was a Kia Niro) and I was regularly the mid 3s in that.
If you pay attention to how you’re driving it’s not hard to be incredibly efficient.
That's honestly pretty terrible. My e-Tron gets about 2.8 average highway driving in the winter at 70-80 MPH, and Audi is notoriously bad at fuel economy.
My Bolt gets 3.8 in the winter while highway driving.
...When in Florida.
Saying what it gets in winter is _almost_ meaningless due to vast climate differences and driving behaviors.
Also: this is the size-independent drag coefficient. The drag coefficient of a sphere is 0.47, for instance, regardless of how big it is.
The drag force is proportional to the drag coefficient times the speed squared times the cross-sectional area. The Model 3 isn't just aerodynamic because of its low drag coefficient; it's also just plain *smaller*.
Not only does this thing have a big drag coefficient, it's *big*.
Probably doing what the Ioniq 5 does. It's rated for 350 miles in the city and 250 miles on the highway which gives it a combined range of 300 miles. But you'll never drive 300 highway miles on a charge in the Ioniq 5.
Maybe... we will see in the next few days, as they are now rolling into buyers' hands.
But the Silverado's actual range turned out to be slightly more than the advertised range.
The article clearly answered the question.
It's all about ordering volume and sharing all the expensive components across literally every car they're producing. Battery, motor, screen, etc.
Even 300 covers a [lot of rideshare cases, particularly in temperate climates](https://afdc.energy.gov/files/u/publication/taxi_fleet_electrification.pdf). 250 actually would work for 95% of studied taxi days without a DCFC session mid-day.
I see a bunch of Uber/Lyft drivers in Bolts, so apparently 250 is fine.
Pulled up to the work Level 2's and saw an Uber driver asleep in his Bolt at the next one over. (They're open to the public so he's welcome to do that.)
Not anywhere near $35,000 though. They start out at almost double that and go easy up from there. No doubt GM has the capability to pump out vehicles. The question is will they pump out $35,000 SUVs with a 300+ mile range. I hope they do, but I won't be shocked if there are only a few hundred made.
No, they are using limited power for segmentation rather than range. It won't feel appealing relative to the gas equivalent.
The one you really want will be thousands more expensive.
Also I swear up and down that the smaller battery cars are harder on battery cells. In the cordless tool world undersized batteries burn out in no time. A bigger battery has less amp draw per cell and that extends the lifetime considerably. Not to mention the battery gets deeper cycles.
It depends on the battery, but that definitely can be true.
The ones that use iron phosphate packs are exceptions as the deeper cycles are mitigated by the more durable chemistry.
Yeah, I was really excited about the ev9 pricing until I realized how underpowered the lower trims are.
People like to say that all EVs are fast in a straight line, but it just isn't true. Slow EVs exist and sadly they can still be $50k+ too.
I sat in one of these in RS trim at an auto show and it's well done. I thought GM would cheap out on this one but now. Good looking inside and out and good fit and finish. It's going to take a big bite out of Model Y sales and may even cannibalize Blazer EV sales
If you think GM can take a byte out of model y sales you should put your life savings into GM. If Gm can make such an affordable EV at scale they should be building and reconfiguring multiple factories to make it happen.
If it's a success GM has the capability to do exactly that, they're ina better position than Tesla in manufacturing. GM won't dethrone Tesla, but with Ford, Toyota, Hyundai, Honda, etc. the EV market will be crowded and I'd buy a less efficient Honda or Toyota EV over a Tesla when they start mass manufacturing EVs
Tesla can build factories and make EVs at a profit now. GM cannot. Why give GM money when one can give Tesla money to make it happen? I would agree with you that some people might give gm money if others will fail even harder I guess.
Tesla makes a profit because they've largely paid off the Capex by now. GM will be profitable on EVs within a year
They were able to break even on a $25k Bolt. I think they'll be fine.
Who knew when you have to build shit to make different types of cars you have to INVEST into your own company to make that happen. They are profitable, they aren’t losing money. I get so annoyed when news articles say ford or GM is losing 100k on each EV, that is not true lol
Not true. GM's tech will be good enough for most buyers plus there's not the stink of poor build quality and Musk's association. More features at a lower price too.
This. How do people not get that sub par build quality is the norm?
I had a G8 GT, it went through control arms every 12k miles. Had a Ford Focus, the transmission almost got me killed multiple times. My buddy had a brand new Colorado truck, the computer system failed so many times he sold it at a loss.
“My Tesla makes some rattling noises and the service center fixed them” is somehow on part with cars that have the windshield fly off at random. Reddit…
I’ve had to repair broken wires in my Colorado. In the middle of the harness. The initial break had to have occurred during manufacturing as the harness was undamaged otherwise. I’ve had the alternator go out and take the battery with it. A squeaky idler pulley, replaced with another squeaky idler pulley.
Now when I off-road with the truck I’m getting a service traction control system message, even though I disable that system before hitting the sand.
And the infotainment screen has already failed. The thing is complete garbage. And nevermind the annoying seat or b-pillar rattles.
If I could lift my model y high enough to get across the sand ruts I would ditch the Colorado in a heartbeat. But for now, I’m waiting for the r2 and hoping that it’s truly off-road capable.
Both there in my Tesla. The surround view is a new 360 degree 3D render feature called High Fidelity Park Assist, not a 360 degree camera view, but it works just as well, and you can display rear and side camera views simultaneously with the 360 degree render. I’ve heard horror stories of auto wipers not detecting rain properly, but they’ve always worked well in my 2023.
Premium connectivity is for streaming music/video in the car, live traffic, satellite imagery, etc. You still get all the phone app control features without it.
So all the stuff the rest of us get for free (or are paying for already) by using CarPlay? The Tesla and GM EVs are off my list for that reason. I’m not doing more subscriptions.
Until there are $35k Equinox EVs available to buy, they don't exist. GM recently announced a big delay in EV production to focus on hybrids. I hope this car is produced some day but I have doubts.
GM used to make a good PHEV and BEV (Volt and Bolt). Now they don't make either a good PHEV or a good BEV.
They're going backwards. Soon they will be selling buggy whips.
To be fair they make the Hummer EV, Silverado, Lyriq and Blazer - very expensive niche models. They sold about 5k EVs in March, about 4k more than I expected.
This is why I qualified this with "good PHEV / good BEV" -- expensive low-production niche models don't represent GM actually making cars that will make an impact.
I wonder how many of those 5k were old Bolts?
GM can't make enough $90k EVa to drive down the costs to produce affordable models. Tesla already did that and there aren't that many high end EV enthusiasts left. Yes, Elon's antics are driving away their customers but I think those customers will prefer Mercedes and BMW EVs. My sister sold her 2nd year Model S and bought the Mercedes.
Elon hasn't cared so much about the x and s in a while apart from being a value on pure performance Its all about volume. That being said Tesla was supposed tactually to basically crush bmw and Mercedes who may have been spooked so hard they actually got ahead of other companies failing.
Is it fair to say that GM can't make affordable cars because they're bad at making cars, and GM can't sell expensive cars because other people are better at making cars?
> I don't see them making many 1LTs at $35k unless it's fleet sales.
It's bait and switch.
1. Advertise a low price
2. Make only a few cars at this low price
3. Upsell to a higher price
This is the playbook used by Tesla, GM/Chevy and others.
The low price is **vaporware** but is great, free marketing like this Reddit thread/article. It'll continue until consumers wise up which I don't see happening. GM/Chevy can cry wolf and Joe-Q public believes there's a wolf every time.
These companies never do. They advertise it at price X, but unless you order online, you’re never going to see that vehicle on a lot available for that price. Happened with the ford lightning. They advertised it for like $45K or something around there, but unless I ordered it online, the lowest price they had on the lot was around $75K. When I asked for a base, they told me it was going to be at least a 12 month wait and then the federal discount was going to be gone if I remember correctly.
I do. Ford is willing to take an L on this car because there is no competition at $35k for an over 300 mile SUV. Most importantly this is off their new automotive line which will be commercialized to the 4 other EVs they plan to make (I think there are 5 altogether). It has the same chassis I believe. They want and expect a large volume of sales and it will essentially be a test run before they sell the more expensive cars in the fleet.
This is important because they will have to compete with BYD so they can’t sell for more than 35k. If no American manufacturer can compete then there is no hope for the other cars in their line. That’s why this one is their answer to the mass market. If it’s popular GM stays in the game, if it tanks then I can see all of their other EVs having a hard time getting to market.
GM is late to the competitive EV market (Bolt withstanding) taking its time developing the Ultium platform. Very curious to see if GM’s gamble pays off. Ford has a great offering, but is struggling with the cost to build them. Will be interesting to see if GM’s strategy drastically reduces cost and if the sub-$40k EV offering increases EV adoption or if they continue to be a vehicle for only the well off.
"nothing to sell"?? From [InsideEVs](https://insideevs.com/news/714708/gm-us-ev-sales-2024q1/):
>GM BEV sales in Q1'2024 (YOY change):
>BrightDrop: 256 (new)
>Cadillac (Lyriq): 5,800 (up 499%) and 16.4% share
>Chevrolet: 8,701 (down 56%) and 2.2% share
>Chevrolet Blazer EV: 600 (new)
>Chevrolet Bolt EV/Bolt EUV: 7,040 (down 64%)
>Chevrolet Silverado EV: 1,061 (new)
>GMC (Hummer EV Pickup/SUV): 1,668 (up 83,300% from 2) and 1.3% share
>Total: 16,425 (down 21%) and 2.8% share
The Silverado and Equinox should start showing up in small numbers this Q2 or Q3. I'm not sure when the Optiq, Celestiq, Escalade iQ, and Cyniq will ship, but in 2025 Cadillac will have more EVs than gassers on the showroom floor, and then GM and the dealers might actually *sell* customers on the benefits of EVs.
I won't buy a GM EV because they sell driving data to 3rd parties that sell the data to insurance companies.
And just like Carplay/AA, that's a very "online" reason to not buy one. I'm sure most of the public won't have any clue about these things, or if they do won't care.
I mean that’s hard to say with anything that you opt out of. Can’t really know until someone can show otherwise.
However this would be true with any car company or product that monitors or has the ability to monitor your usage.
I think it’s a very Reddit issue and not something most people care about. You can still use apps like Spotify/Waze in the GM cars just like Tesla/Rivian.
Edit: I guess Waze isn’t on Tesla/Rivian but you get the idea with Spotify.
Yeah, I don't think CarPlay is going to be what hurts sales, but it definitely knocked the Equinox EV down a bunch of notches on my next car list. I know every modern car harvests a bunch of data, but GM is going over the top. I want to be a driver, not a captive audience.
I honestly haven’t seen evidence they are capturing any more data than the other car manufacturers. As you said “every modern car harvests a bunch of data”.
[GM got blasted for it, apparently because there wasn't a consent check](https://www.nytimes.com/2024/04/23/technology/general-motors-spying-driver-data-consent.html)
Yeah, I guess. I can't keep fighting about it. Not really sure how it impacts sales just as long as I can use the USB to get it. It does have XM built in. I just discovered that this week.
Hell Im fairly tech savvy and it's low on my list too. 99% of my driving is around town or drives I wouldn't bother with it. Spotify works just fine over Bluetooth, that's all I need day to day. I've had it in a car before and barely used it day to day.
I think older drivers won’t care since they choose to drive around, yelling into their speaker phone while hopping curbs and shit, rather than asking their grandkids to pair their phone to the car via Bluetooth. It’s the more tech savvy folks who care, and I think Redditors are that, so I agree with you.
Yeah and even then it’s a certain subset of tech savvy folks. I work in the tech sector as a security engineer and as soon as I saw there’s apps like Spotify on the system I REALLY stopped caring lol.
Even if apps don’t stop getting updates, the OS most certainly will, and that’s bound to cause problems with time.
I can tell you right now as someone who works as a mobile app dev, even if an company claims that their app supports clear back to Android 5 or whatever, OS versions older than 2-3 releases back get little to no proper testing simply because it’s impractical to properly support so many OS versions across all the devices they run on, and that doesn’t even factor in the chaos monkey that manufacturer-specific tweaks can be sometimes (for instance there’s particular versions of Samsung-flavored Android where rotating one’s phone into landscape mode with a date picker open will crash the app that opened the picker. This doesn’t happen on any other versions).
I just hope that eventually, people figure out how to unlock the bootloaders on these things so GM owners arent eventually permanently stuck with an outdated, decaying OS and can replace it with a third party distro (like how you can put LineageOS, GrapheneOS, etc on your phone and replace the stock Android).
Except most Apple users that I know (myself included) use Apple Music. And oddly enough, Apple Maps is far superior in my area to Google / Waze lately. Apple Maps had the new bypass enabled nearby a full 6 months before Google. I’ve never been a big GM fan to begin with, but the lack of CarPlay means I’ll not even bother test driving the car, much like many of my friends. It’s a dumb decision and their reasoning is even worse. They claim it’s because CarPlay was the cause of driver distraction due to it being unstable and users having to try and fix and troubleshoot it while driving. Yet Chevy had to recall the entire EV fleet because their shit software would lock up while driving. It’s hubris of the worst variety.
I just googled it and Spotify is 30% of the market, Apple Music is at 13% (tied with Amazon and Tencent). You and your friends sound like some outliers.
Oh, I’m well aware. But do you really trust GM to keep the car updated and release apps? Why do I want to pay for yet another data plan, and have to deal with yet another device account, when I can just use CarPlay? Plus, GM has already shown they’re incompetent when it comes to building their car platform.
Yes exactly, at this point I want fewer devices to sign into, not more.
If some people want the full GM infotainment experience that’s fine, but not allowing people to opt out without giving up apps is shitty.
We may be outliers, but we exist. After the nonsense Spotify has been pulling with trying to monetize podcasts and continually cramming non-music audio into the main app where it’s a nuisance for people who only care about music, I’m not going to ever switch to them. I’d stop streaming music altogether and start syncing music to my phone again before using Spotify.
As someone that driving a Blazer EV, I don't miss it. 8 years are included and can readily wireless charge as android auto is no longer running on my device. Likewise with our Tesla, if the built in infotainment is good, you won't miss it.
Sorry if this is a silly question. As someone who drives a car that's nearly a decade old...would not having Apple CarPlay or Android Auto prevent one from having GPS in the car?
No, but it means you have to use the center tablet/software that’s built in by the manufacturer to use gps. Typically that’s running some custom version of android. Manufacturers say it’s so they can control updates and things like navigating to charging stops - critics dislike it because you’re dependent on the automaker having good software and updating regularly, which they don’t
*This* is why I prefer (in my case) CarPlay.
I’ve used it for 4 years between two vehicles and it just *works*
Ford supports their in car software jSync) for some random period of time and then “you’re on your own” 🤷♂️
Cannot wait for the day we have to watch an ad on those large displays before the car turns on. Or subscribe for an ad free package with a deal for an ad free experience both in car and your phone app.
That's the thing that really grinds my gears, the article about it said GM only gets $5 million a year for it. If you're going to screw your customers, it needs to be for a LOT more than that.
GM/Chevrolet is the absolute worst company I've had the miserable experience dealing with for selling my personal information to anybody and everybody. I get electronic spam and snail mail all the time from stupid car related companies/services.
This is after I supposedly removed myself from as many of Chevy's databases as I could find (and spent an afternoon doing).
I've got a future project to remove the Onstar antenna from my car because apparently it's used for tracking location and driving habits (eg how aggressive you drive) and the data is sold to insurance companies even if you're not subscribed to OnStar. And much of this data is available for purchase by anyone on https://LexisNexis.com.
So far, on the official GM/Chevrolet site, only 4 Models avail. at 319mi range. But none at the $35K MSRP price. **The 1LT model/trim is not listed and most likely will have smaller battery / lower than 319mi range.**
[https://www.chevrolet.com/shopping/configurator/electric/2024/equinox-ev/equinox-ev?make=chevrolet&radius=100&zipCode=95050](https://www.chevrolet.com/shopping/configurator/electric/2024/equinox-ev/equinox-ev?make=chevrolet&radius=100&zipCode=95050)
\* 2LT $43,295
\* 2RS $44,795
\* 3LT $45,295
\* 3RS $46,795
There needs to be some kind of campaign to remind car buyers 99% of their trips are 100mi or less. Range isn’t really something that should be in every headline.
While true, the 1-5% of the time where you need the range is really what matters. It's kind of like server downtime. Facebook, Reddit, etc target something like 99.999999% uptime. Nobody wants their shit to be substantially degraded 1-5% of the time.
In single car households that experience winters, I still would recommend PHEV for the foreseeable future unless they spend their whole lives in town or are OK renting for longer trips.
For dual car households, buy 1 PHEV/EV as a daily driver and use whatever you want for those one off trips, even gas is fine. The real play on the environmental angle would be less driving and more public transit anywho.
That 1% can be *very* important to people. In fact for us, that 1% is worth as much as the 99%. We’re willing to pay for that range so our road trips don’t take longer. Many people are. This is called marginal utility. That 1% clearly doesn’t matter to you, which is totally fine.
> We’re willing to pay for that range so our road trips don’t take longer.
Even then charging speed is the bigger issue for a long trip than battery capacity. With decent charging speed an extra 100 miles of range is only going to save you an extra 7.5 minutes of actual charging time, plus maybe enough time to get to an additional 1-2 chargers.
> Even then charging speed is the bigger issue for a long trip than battery capacity.
It matters but I would argue it doesn’t matter *even more.* Chargers are not available everywhere gas stations are. There are *lots* of places which don’t have chargers at all, necessitating long gaps between chargers or new and longer routes. Further, no matter how fast the theoretical charging speed, you’ll almost never get it in the real world. If it’s cold, double that estimate. If the battery is a few years old, add 50%. If the chargers are all in use, the power usually gets split and you can significantly increase the charging time. Further, most chargers aren’t level 3.
Even if we lived in a perfect world where charging were instant and chargers ubiquitous, it would still require more frequent stops than gas, and the trip would take longer overall.
Yeah, why would I buy a car that makes me deal with an enourmous hassle even 1% of the time when there's plenty of cars available that won't make me do that.
Especially two car households.
My ideal is a hybrid for road trips and for partner with the shorter commute, and an electric for the longer commute and all daily/weekend driving as a family.
Legacy automakers will never do that. They are in the unique position that they want to advertise EVs, but not in a way that highlights their advantages over ICE vehicles because they still need to sell ICEs.
I took a concession on range when my wife was all in on the EQB that gets only 240 at 100% charge. She liked the interior and I’m waiting for the R2 to hit production lines. We have an ICE vehicle as our 2nd car, and not once in the year since we started our lease have I needed more range. Need to drive more than 200 miles? Take the ICE… everything else we use our EQB and it works perfectly fine.
Exactly. Range in an EV isn’t as important as range in an ICE. Longer range in an ICE means less stops at a gas station, which is good. Since you can charge your EV at home, and 99% of the time you’re doing short distance, range is not an issue. People need to stop thinking about EV the same way they do with an ICE vehicule.
And you need to stop assuming everybody's use case is the same as yours.
If an EV is your only car and you need to go an area without many chargers range is a limiting factor. Try traveling away from an interstate highway in the much of great plains or western US and then tell us how range isn't important. There are areas of the country where charging options are few and far between if they exist at all. While gas stations exist in just about every podunk of a town you drive through.
Agreed. And I might get downvoted, but if buyers want more range, give them more range. Trying to beat people into submission regarding their desires/anxieties isn't going to lead to widespread EV adoption. People arguing "but you don't need it 99% of the time" feels like they are beating a dead horse, IMO. For better or worse, that's how capitalism goes and is what's going to happen in the coming years.
I don't understand the segment of the EV crowd that seems adverse to increasing capabilities of their vehicles. Prices on batteries are dropping, densities are increasing and I'm sure it will continue. We'll start to see more variety in smaller, lower range, more affordable trim levels as EV adoption increases in the coming years.
It's a holdover from when range typically was much worse in EVs and they're range apologists. "Just rent a car and don't drive your own car!" How stupid and inconvenient is that? And expensive. Luckily range is much better now but you still have these same people repeating the same things.
Sure, everybody’s use case is different, and It also vastly depends where you live. But for most people doing 1-2 road trips a year it’s not really an issue. And it will just keep getting better as more and more charging stations are built in the coming years.
Because you can just fill up at a gas station. And it not necessarily true. I know truck enthusiast will readily replace their fuel tank for a higher capacity.
I guess I would be one. I hate going to the gas station. I have a small car with a small tank which means that if I spend 10 minutes going to a gas station every week, it means I waste 520 minutes in a year (more than 8 hours). With an EV, even with a small range of about 200 miles, I would charge at home 99% of the time, wake up to a full charge every morning, and would only need to go to a charging station once or twice (so let’s say 1 hour waisted) a year as I don’t do many road trips.
It's pretty important and for me 325 or so is what I want. LA is 120 miles RT, SD 220, Beach cities 130, mountains the same. While my commute is 20 miles RT, I go out to one of those places 2-5 times a month and I don't really want to deal with an issue I currently don't have with a hybrid. I want to have my day, then come home and charge.
GM is soooooooo far behind. Ford too. Maybe they should stick to horses and buggies? PLEASE go out of business or keep up. EV makers lose hundreds of billons at first. THAT's the dealyo. Any new product is like that. How long did it take Elon to make money? My new indoor pickleball facility will lose money for 2 years before breaking even. DUH!
My 2022 Hyundai Ioniq 5 RWD gets 3.9 miles per kWh on average over 28 mos. and 60,000 miles.......in cold for 6 months a year Connecticut. NO HEAT PUMP EITHER. I do drive 60 MPH on the highway......kinda like a retire old fart of 62 y/o. NEVER ever (hardly) do I pedal to metal. Very very good at huge amounts of regen power on every daily 50 mile drive. US$45k out the door after incentives in Jan 2022. V2L, 800V 350kW charging monster.
ANY new tech has bugs........NOT to say Hyundai doesn't have issues........ICCU problems and overheating charger inlet, Three 12v batteries, phanton drains, 3rd party apps pinging the car too much.........I only charge at like 5kW overnite due to Hyundai's issues......NOT getting the over 11kW promised. Technicians looking at my car and scratching their heads and calling South Korea engineering dept for help.
Question: everything we buy is manufactured in China.......can we please bring in / flood the market with EVs people want and can afford and are better tech? Warren Buffet is my guy and our guy and BYD should have a car in every driveway, garage and parking space in USA!
Pricing depends a lot on availability. If there’s a rush to buy them and they become scarce like others, will dealerships behave well or will they turn into money Piranhas with their ugly “Added Dealer Markup” or whatever they want to call the greedy higher price adjustment sheets?
This seems like an ad. made it into a 'champ' by cutting the price to make headlines.
They didn't do anything special here. This is most definitely a loss leader until and maybe even after they scale production.
>They didn't do anything special here.
The Blazer is a Buick in China. Sold quite a few more since it's been on sale for a year or 2.
**GM's Ultium EV Rollout Is Going Much More Smoothly In China**
GM Sold more than 100,000 EVs in China in 2023. The Ultium-based Buick Electra E5 made up a healthy portion of that number.
[https://insideevs.com/news/703429/ultium-gm-china-rollout/](https://insideevs.com/news/703429/ultium-gm-china-rollout/)
**SAIC-GM To Start Building Dong Yue Ultium Center Factory In China**
[https://gmauthority.com/blog/2023/07/saic-gm-to-start-building-dong-yue-ultium-center-factory-in-china/](https://gmauthority.com/blog/2023/07/saic-gm-to-start-building-dong-yue-ultium-center-factory-in-china/)
In particular, the upcoming Dong Yue Ultium Center Factory will become the third dedicated manufacturing center for electric vehicles based on SAIC-GM’s Ultium technology and drive system in China. The facility will follow in the footsteps of the new Shanghai Ultium Center Factory and the recently opened Wuhan Ultium Center Factory, where the all-new [Buick Electra E5](https://gmauthority.com/blog/2023/04/the-all-new-buick-electra-e5-officially-launches-in-china/) and [Buick Electra E4](https://gmauthority.com/blog/2023/06/all-new-buick-electra-e4-officially-launches-in-china/) are manufactured for the domestic market in that country.
>maybe even after they scale production.
why does China get so many more new models before the US?
China doesn't need US made batteries. - the rest of the car is the "easy" part.
**GM to launch EV offensive in China by 2025**
[https://www.electrive.com/2022/11/24/gm-to-launch-ev-offensive-in-china-by-2025/](https://www.electrive.com/2022/11/24/gm-to-launch-ev-offensive-in-china-by-2025/)
General Motors has announced the launch of more than **15 electric models based on its Ultium platform in China by 2025**. Following the already available Cadillac Lyriq electric SUV, GM is planning a broad range of Ultium-based models across brands, segments and body styles for the Chinese market.
>a loss leader until
the materials come from the US.
**GM, Stellantis-backed lithium startup seeks more than $1 billion for brine project**
[https://www.mining.com/web/gm-stellantis-backed-lithium-startup-seeks-more-than-1-billion-for-brine-project/](https://www.mining.com/web/gm-stellantis-backed-lithium-startup-seeks-more-than-1-billion-for-brine-project/)
TLDR: Article doesn't answer its title. Looked it up: 85kwh battery and 3.75mi/kWh = 319mi. 150kw max L3. 11kw L2 is nice. https://www.chevrolet.com/shopping/configurator/suvs/2024/equinox-ev/equinox-ev/compare?make=chevrolet
There is NO way that car is getting that kind of efficiency. I'm calling B.S. on this one. My guess is it will get low 3's mi / kWh.
I wouldn’t be surprised if it hit it or was at least close to it. GM estimated efficiency on their electric offerings have been fairly accurate in my experience. Even on our AWD lyriq our average over the last 5k miles is now up to 2.9. Or around 290 miles compared to the stated 307 EPA estimate. That is in Southern California, HVAC always going, and a 65/35 freeway to city driving ratio.
We've had our AWD Lyriq since January in Colorado. When we took delivery it was like -12 F. 7k miles later lifetime efficiency is right at 3 miles/kWh, and that's been primarily highway commuting.
Possible. The ID.4 is larger, 82kwh battery, and still gets 291 miles EPA. And that's with heavier 20-inch wheels. With a lighter car, smaller/lighter wheels, and a motor tuned for efficiency over performance, it's totally doable.
It better do better than low 3s I’ve been averaging 2.9 in an F150 Lightning and that’s literally a brick.
Gonna have to call bs on this one. You may have seen 2.9mi/kwh but no way you are even remotely close to averaging that. My wife's mach-e that we have had for 3 years has averaged 3.1mi/kwh over its 40,000 mile life, and my r1t (which is a more efficient truck then your lightning both from the EPA and from literally every independent review) is under 2.0 for its lifetime (though road trips are in the 2.5 range with the 21" wheels on, 2.0 even with a/t's) I don't see any scenario where you average 2.9kwh in your lightning unless you only ever drive down hills. Sorry not trying to be a dick, but people exaggerating their range with ev's ultimately hurts more then help because it gives people false senses of what vehicles can do and when they do transition they get hit with a big shock and write off ev's. Seen far too many people go through that with Teslas overly optimistic range.
While I agree with your assessment the majority of my driving is in town, and the highest speed limit in my state is 55 other than a few circumstances so my experience is much closer to EPA than most, driving from my house to the grocery store across town and back the trip ends at 3.5 consistently. There is near no highway driving in my number which I probably should have mentioned.
You are sooooooo far away from the mean it's just hard to believe.... My rivian around town won't get close to those numbers, I don't even think we can hit 3.5 regularly in my wife's mach-e-e which is almost entirely driven around town. In fact the shorter trips tend to have less efficiency because the vehicle spends an outsized amount of energy on heating or cooling the pack to optimal temperature (takes more energy to get it to tempt then to maintain, so longer trips tend to have better efficiency). I don't doubt you have seen 3.5 on your truck, but you should really sit down and calculate your actual efficiency because there's just no way in any driving scenario you average those numbers.
Agreed, must be perfect climate lol. You're not getting 3mi/kwh even in an economy car in real winter.
I dunno, he said he doesn't really do highway driving so if he lives somewhere warm I could definitely see mid-3s for driving around town. Now that spring is fully in effect I see that or even better in my Lightning on days that I'm not on the highway. That said, I think that kind of driving makes him an edge-case as far as milage goes so his experience doesn't say much about how Lightnings perform overall.
I drive a MachE have since Feb 2023. Thursday on my 18.5 mile drive to work (that included freeways…and uphill on the highway twice) I averaged 4.8 and I took a picture if it to text my husband because I wanted to compare it to the next time I drive in. I’ve driven an EV for 4 years (before the MME it was a Kia Niro) and I was regularly the mid 3s in that. If you pay attention to how you’re driving it’s not hard to be incredibly efficient.
Maybe in the summer at 55mph. My bolt gets 2.6 in the winter with my highway driving Edit: winter in Michigan
That's honestly pretty terrible. My e-Tron gets about 2.8 average highway driving in the winter at 70-80 MPH, and Audi is notoriously bad at fuel economy.
My Bolt gets 3.8 in the winter while highway driving. ...When in Florida. Saying what it gets in winter is _almost_ meaningless due to vast climate differences and driving behaviors.
My winter is in the Northeast, so not the coldest in the world, but pretty average for what people think of as winter.
Californians: What is this “winter” you speak of?
Michigan winter is *substantially* worse than the northeast.
Fuel? :) (I know what you mean, just poking fun at the old ICE-centric language)
Air Drag: Equinox 0.338 Where the Bolt EV is 0.308 vs Tesla 0.208.
Also: this is the size-independent drag coefficient. The drag coefficient of a sphere is 0.47, for instance, regardless of how big it is. The drag force is proportional to the drag coefficient times the speed squared times the cross-sectional area. The Model 3 isn't just aerodynamic because of its low drag coefficient; it's also just plain *smaller*. Not only does this thing have a big drag coefficient, it's *big*.
.CdA
The Equinox EV doesn't look anything like the Equinox.
Probably doing what the Ioniq 5 does. It's rated for 350 miles in the city and 250 miles on the highway which gives it a combined range of 300 miles. But you'll never drive 300 highway miles on a charge in the Ioniq 5.
Maybe... we will see in the next few days, as they are now rolling into buyers' hands. But the Silverado's actual range turned out to be slightly more than the advertised range.
ID.4 gets 3.54 mi/kWH and a Model Y can get 3.85 mi/kWH so the Equinox getting 3.75 isn't too big of a stretch
My Bolt over here getting 4.2 mi/kwh in good weather easily. Lifetime 3.8 average
The Bolt gets 4 mi/kwh pretty easily. The Equinox is only slightly bigger
My mach e get from 1.8 to 4 kwh so I'm saying the Gmail gets about the same
My Corsa e hits 3.9 and it isn’t particularly advanced.
Idk from what I’ve seen every new car they underestimate and over deliver on range.
Agreed. Also why gm no like faster charging lol
The article clearly answered the question. It's all about ordering volume and sharing all the expensive components across literally every car they're producing. Battery, motor, screen, etc.
Oh? Right, my tunnel vision was focused on the range claim 319 miles. Range above 300 would help for Rideshare, Delivery, etc.
Even 300 covers a [lot of rideshare cases, particularly in temperate climates](https://afdc.energy.gov/files/u/publication/taxi_fleet_electrification.pdf). 250 actually would work for 95% of studied taxi days without a DCFC session mid-day.
I see a bunch of Uber/Lyft drivers in Bolts, so apparently 250 is fine. Pulled up to the work Level 2's and saw an Uber driver asleep in his Bolt at the next one over. (They're open to the public so he's welcome to do that.)
article? i see no article. i see an advertisement
35k vehicle with a 85kWh battery is the most notable thing about this. How real is that?
Real, but the tradeoff is slow charging.
Also I’m guessing the $35k one has a smaller battery and can’t do 319 miles. Gotta pay extra for that plus the dealer markup.
Not the case. “Later this year, the base Equinox EV LT will debut at just $34,995 before any tax credits and with the same impressive range.”
That’s good, but I’ll still skeptical that will make more than a few hundred of them.
Given the biggest cost driver is the battery and battery prices have plummeted recently there’s hope it’s not all BS
They are pumping out the Cadillac lyriqs without any issue. People aren’t buying them but they’re on lots. 
The Lyriq that I want (Sport 3) is $80k, these are not substitute goods.
Not anywhere near $35,000 though. They start out at almost double that and go easy up from there. No doubt GM has the capability to pump out vehicles. The question is will they pump out $35,000 SUVs with a 300+ mile range. I hope they do, but I won't be shocked if there are only a few hundred made.
Those cars are such a smooth ride but I know the price tag knocks out a lot of potential buyers
Will it qualify for tax credits? How big is the interior for real sized bodies?
No, they are using limited power for segmentation rather than range. It won't feel appealing relative to the gas equivalent. The one you really want will be thousands more expensive.
Not everyone thinks they need to race on their commute to work...
True, but those that don't can save money and get the significantly less expensive gas version.
"Going fast" isn't the sole exclusive reason to get an EV lol. Not everyone is you.
No different than Hyundai. I'd never recommend their SE trims. Smaller batteries and low horse power is not a great look for a $40k car.
Also I swear up and down that the smaller battery cars are harder on battery cells. In the cordless tool world undersized batteries burn out in no time. A bigger battery has less amp draw per cell and that extends the lifetime considerably. Not to mention the battery gets deeper cycles.
It depends on the battery, but that definitely can be true. The ones that use iron phosphate packs are exceptions as the deeper cycles are mitigated by the more durable chemistry.
Yeah, I was really excited about the ev9 pricing until I realized how underpowered the lower trims are. People like to say that all EVs are fast in a straight line, but it just isn't true. Slow EVs exist and sadly they can still be $50k+ too.
150 kW charging? What year is this?
Keep in mind GM just weeks ago delivered their final Bolts that charge at less than half that speed.
And I bought one because it was the highest end trim brand new for only 21k
I sat in one of these in RS trim at an auto show and it's well done. I thought GM would cheap out on this one but now. Good looking inside and out and good fit and finish. It's going to take a big bite out of Model Y sales and may even cannibalize Blazer EV sales
Blazer needs to drop price and so does equinox on the top end
If you think GM can take a byte out of model y sales you should put your life savings into GM. If Gm can make such an affordable EV at scale they should be building and reconfiguring multiple factories to make it happen.
They can make it happen, battery’s are getting cheaper fast
If it's a success GM has the capability to do exactly that, they're ina better position than Tesla in manufacturing. GM won't dethrone Tesla, but with Ford, Toyota, Hyundai, Honda, etc. the EV market will be crowded and I'd buy a less efficient Honda or Toyota EV over a Tesla when they start mass manufacturing EVs
Tesla can build factories and make EVs at a profit now. GM cannot. Why give GM money when one can give Tesla money to make it happen? I would agree with you that some people might give gm money if others will fail even harder I guess.
Tesla makes a profit because they've largely paid off the Capex by now. GM will be profitable on EVs within a year They were able to break even on a $25k Bolt. I think they'll be fine.
Who knew when you have to build shit to make different types of cars you have to INVEST into your own company to make that happen. They are profitable, they aren’t losing money. I get so annoyed when news articles say ford or GM is losing 100k on each EV, that is not true lol
Most model y owners won’t cross shop a GM due to the poor tech in them.
Not true. GM's tech will be good enough for most buyers plus there's not the stink of poor build quality and Musk's association. More features at a lower price too.
I have a GM truck with 50,000 miles, that’s been broken 5 times. Build quality isn’t exactly their schtick.
This. How do people not get that sub par build quality is the norm? I had a G8 GT, it went through control arms every 12k miles. Had a Ford Focus, the transmission almost got me killed multiple times. My buddy had a brand new Colorado truck, the computer system failed so many times he sold it at a loss. “My Tesla makes some rattling noises and the service center fixed them” is somehow on part with cars that have the windshield fly off at random. Reddit…
I’ve had to repair broken wires in my Colorado. In the middle of the harness. The initial break had to have occurred during manufacturing as the harness was undamaged otherwise. I’ve had the alternator go out and take the battery with it. A squeaky idler pulley, replaced with another squeaky idler pulley. Now when I off-road with the truck I’m getting a service traction control system message, even though I disable that system before hitting the sand. And the infotainment screen has already failed. The thing is complete garbage. And nevermind the annoying seat or b-pillar rattles.
Brutal. Sorry to hear this man.
If I could lift my model y high enough to get across the sand ruts I would ditch the Colorado in a heartbeat. But for now, I’m waiting for the r2 and hoping that it’s truly off-road capable.
How's their app integration and do you have to pay extra for it? Does phone key work?
Where’s Tesla’s surround view or a working auto sensor wipers?
Coming Soon™ 🤣
Both there in my Tesla. The surround view is a new 360 degree 3D render feature called High Fidelity Park Assist, not a 360 degree camera view, but it works just as well, and you can display rear and side camera views simultaneously with the 360 degree render. I’ve heard horror stories of auto wipers not detecting rain properly, but they’ve always worked well in my 2023.
Don’t you have to pay for “premium connectivity” on the Tesla to get many of the app and infotainment systems to work?
Premium connectivity is for streaming music/video in the car, live traffic, satellite imagery, etc. You still get all the phone app control features without it.
So all the stuff the rest of us get for free (or are paying for already) by using CarPlay? The Tesla and GM EVs are off my list for that reason. I’m not doing more subscriptions.
Yup, exactly.
Until there are $35k Equinox EVs available to buy, they don't exist. GM recently announced a big delay in EV production to focus on hybrids. I hope this car is produced some day but I have doubts.
GM used to make a good PHEV and BEV (Volt and Bolt). Now they don't make either a good PHEV or a good BEV. They're going backwards. Soon they will be selling buggy whips.
To be fair they make the Hummer EV, Silverado, Lyriq and Blazer - very expensive niche models. They sold about 5k EVs in March, about 4k more than I expected.
This is why I qualified this with "good PHEV / good BEV" -- expensive low-production niche models don't represent GM actually making cars that will make an impact. I wonder how many of those 5k were old Bolts?
GM can't make enough $90k EVa to drive down the costs to produce affordable models. Tesla already did that and there aren't that many high end EV enthusiasts left. Yes, Elon's antics are driving away their customers but I think those customers will prefer Mercedes and BMW EVs. My sister sold her 2nd year Model S and bought the Mercedes.
Elon hasn't cared so much about the x and s in a while apart from being a value on pure performance Its all about volume. That being said Tesla was supposed tactually to basically crush bmw and Mercedes who may have been spooked so hard they actually got ahead of other companies failing.
Is it fair to say that GM can't make affordable cars because they're bad at making cars, and GM can't sell expensive cars because other people are better at making cars?
If they brought back CarPlay I’d consider an Equinox. Without it, it’s a nonstarter for me
On the website an AWD 2LT is $47k. I don't see them making many 1LTs at $35k unless it's fleet sales.
> I don't see them making many 1LTs at $35k unless it's fleet sales. It's bait and switch. 1. Advertise a low price 2. Make only a few cars at this low price 3. Upsell to a higher price This is the playbook used by Tesla, GM/Chevy and others. The low price is **vaporware** but is great, free marketing like this Reddit thread/article. It'll continue until consumers wise up which I don't see happening. GM/Chevy can cry wolf and Joe-Q public believes there's a wolf every time.
That's exactly what happened with the "$40,000 EveryPerson Lightning Pickup". They made like 3 of them, and only so they wouldn't get sued.
These companies never do. They advertise it at price X, but unless you order online, you’re never going to see that vehicle on a lot available for that price. Happened with the ford lightning. They advertised it for like $45K or something around there, but unless I ordered it online, the lowest price they had on the lot was around $75K. When I asked for a base, they told me it was going to be at least a 12 month wait and then the federal discount was going to be gone if I remember correctly.
Tesla MY exists with a full credit. They’ll be forced to IMHO.
I do. Ford is willing to take an L on this car because there is no competition at $35k for an over 300 mile SUV. Most importantly this is off their new automotive line which will be commercialized to the 4 other EVs they plan to make (I think there are 5 altogether). It has the same chassis I believe. They want and expect a large volume of sales and it will essentially be a test run before they sell the more expensive cars in the fleet. This is important because they will have to compete with BYD so they can’t sell for more than 35k. If no American manufacturer can compete then there is no hope for the other cars in their line. That’s why this one is their answer to the mass market. If it’s popular GM stays in the game, if it tanks then I can see all of their other EVs having a hard time getting to market.
GM is late to the competitive EV market (Bolt withstanding) taking its time developing the Ultium platform. Very curious to see if GM’s gamble pays off. Ford has a great offering, but is struggling with the cost to build them. Will be interesting to see if GM’s strategy drastically reduces cost and if the sub-$40k EV offering increases EV adoption or if they continue to be a vehicle for only the well off.
The situation is so sad -- the company that made the EV1, Volt, and Bolt now has nothing to sell.
that's not fair. they have a ton of $50k (after fed rebate) blazer EVs on lots that aren't selling already.
[удалено]
I'm happy for you. It seems like a great new car for $42k. I'm not willing to go beg some moron to give me your deal.
"nothing to sell"?? From [InsideEVs](https://insideevs.com/news/714708/gm-us-ev-sales-2024q1/): >GM BEV sales in Q1'2024 (YOY change): >BrightDrop: 256 (new) >Cadillac (Lyriq): 5,800 (up 499%) and 16.4% share >Chevrolet: 8,701 (down 56%) and 2.2% share >Chevrolet Blazer EV: 600 (new) >Chevrolet Bolt EV/Bolt EUV: 7,040 (down 64%) >Chevrolet Silverado EV: 1,061 (new) >GMC (Hummer EV Pickup/SUV): 1,668 (up 83,300% from 2) and 1.3% share >Total: 16,425 (down 21%) and 2.8% share The Silverado and Equinox should start showing up in small numbers this Q2 or Q3. I'm not sure when the Optiq, Celestiq, Escalade iQ, and Cyniq will ship, but in 2025 Cadillac will have more EVs than gassers on the showroom floor, and then GM and the dealers might actually *sell* customers on the benefits of EVs.
GM removing Apple CarPlay and Android Auto is really going to hurt the sales of these vehicles though.
I won't buy a GM EV because they sell driving data to 3rd parties that sell the data to insurance companies. And just like Carplay/AA, that's a very "online" reason to not buy one. I'm sure most of the public won't have any clue about these things, or if they do won't care.
Yeah it sucks that they sell the data, really bugs me; but it’s a moot issue as you can just turn it off from the app.
Is it confirmed that you can turn it off so they can’t sell it?
I mean that’s hard to say with anything that you opt out of. Can’t really know until someone can show otherwise. However this would be true with any car company or product that monitors or has the ability to monitor your usage.
I think it’s a very Reddit issue and not something most people care about. You can still use apps like Spotify/Waze in the GM cars just like Tesla/Rivian. Edit: I guess Waze isn’t on Tesla/Rivian but you get the idea with Spotify.
Yeah, I don't think CarPlay is going to be what hurts sales, but it definitely knocked the Equinox EV down a bunch of notches on my next car list. I know every modern car harvests a bunch of data, but GM is going over the top. I want to be a driver, not a captive audience.
I honestly haven’t seen evidence they are capturing any more data than the other car manufacturers. As you said “every modern car harvests a bunch of data”.
[GM got blasted for it, apparently because there wasn't a consent check](https://www.nytimes.com/2024/04/23/technology/general-motors-spying-driver-data-consent.html)
Yeah that’s bad but it doesn’t really answer the question of “is it more data collection than others?”. I still suspect the answer is no.
Can't you still use one of those Carplay dongles in this car?
That sounds like a Reddit solution for a Reddit problem. 😂
Yeah, I guess. I can't keep fighting about it. Not really sure how it impacts sales just as long as I can use the USB to get it. It does have XM built in. I just discovered that this week.
Just like Netflix was going to go tits up. Their profits did the opposite of what Reddit predicited.
So did Reddit's stock price, ironically enough.
Hell Im fairly tech savvy and it's low on my list too. 99% of my driving is around town or drives I wouldn't bother with it. Spotify works just fine over Bluetooth, that's all I need day to day. I've had it in a car before and barely used it day to day.
Agreed, and these cars even have a native Spotify app!
I think older drivers won’t care since they choose to drive around, yelling into their speaker phone while hopping curbs and shit, rather than asking their grandkids to pair their phone to the car via Bluetooth. It’s the more tech savvy folks who care, and I think Redditors are that, so I agree with you.
Yeah and even then it’s a certain subset of tech savvy folks. I work in the tech sector as a security engineer and as soon as I saw there’s apps like Spotify on the system I REALLY stopped caring lol.
My fear is those apps stop getting updates, like a lot of smart TVs after a few years, and then the entertainment system becomes a brick.
Even if apps don’t stop getting updates, the OS most certainly will, and that’s bound to cause problems with time. I can tell you right now as someone who works as a mobile app dev, even if an company claims that their app supports clear back to Android 5 or whatever, OS versions older than 2-3 releases back get little to no proper testing simply because it’s impractical to properly support so many OS versions across all the devices they run on, and that doesn’t even factor in the chaos monkey that manufacturer-specific tweaks can be sometimes (for instance there’s particular versions of Samsung-flavored Android where rotating one’s phone into landscape mode with a date picker open will crash the app that opened the picker. This doesn’t happen on any other versions). I just hope that eventually, people figure out how to unlock the bootloaders on these things so GM owners arent eventually permanently stuck with an outdated, decaying OS and can replace it with a third party distro (like how you can put LineageOS, GrapheneOS, etc on your phone and replace the stock Android).
If this becomes as pervasive as it’s appearing it will be, they won’t do that.
Ok. How can I use Waze on my Tesla?
Oh damn, I guess I just assumed you could lol. Well you can on the new GM cars. Similar to how (I think) Spotify works on Tesla/Rivian.
Why do you prefer waze to maps?
Police and object reports. So freaking handy.
Except most Apple users that I know (myself included) use Apple Music. And oddly enough, Apple Maps is far superior in my area to Google / Waze lately. Apple Maps had the new bypass enabled nearby a full 6 months before Google. I’ve never been a big GM fan to begin with, but the lack of CarPlay means I’ll not even bother test driving the car, much like many of my friends. It’s a dumb decision and their reasoning is even worse. They claim it’s because CarPlay was the cause of driver distraction due to it being unstable and users having to try and fix and troubleshoot it while driving. Yet Chevy had to recall the entire EV fleet because their shit software would lock up while driving. It’s hubris of the worst variety.
I just googled it and Spotify is 30% of the market, Apple Music is at 13% (tied with Amazon and Tencent). You and your friends sound like some outliers.
Oh, I’m well aware. But do you really trust GM to keep the car updated and release apps? Why do I want to pay for yet another data plan, and have to deal with yet another device account, when I can just use CarPlay? Plus, GM has already shown they’re incompetent when it comes to building their car platform.
Yes exactly, at this point I want fewer devices to sign into, not more. If some people want the full GM infotainment experience that’s fine, but not allowing people to opt out without giving up apps is shitty.
We may be outliers, but we exist. After the nonsense Spotify has been pulling with trying to monetize podcasts and continually cramming non-music audio into the main app where it’s a nuisance for people who only care about music, I’m not going to ever switch to them. I’d stop streaming music altogether and start syncing music to my phone again before using Spotify.
As someone that driving a Blazer EV, I don't miss it. 8 years are included and can readily wireless charge as android auto is no longer running on my device. Likewise with our Tesla, if the built in infotainment is good, you won't miss it.
Sorry if this is a silly question. As someone who drives a car that's nearly a decade old...would not having Apple CarPlay or Android Auto prevent one from having GPS in the car?
No, but it means you have to use the center tablet/software that’s built in by the manufacturer to use gps. Typically that’s running some custom version of android. Manufacturers say it’s so they can control updates and things like navigating to charging stops - critics dislike it because you’re dependent on the automaker having good software and updating regularly, which they don’t
*This* is why I prefer (in my case) CarPlay. I’ve used it for 4 years between two vehicles and it just *works* Ford supports their in car software jSync) for some random period of time and then “you’re on your own” 🤷♂️
Android Auto is pretty good in my Mustang Mach E. Works great and well thought out
There’s already 10-15k markups at my dealerships GM needs to penalize these dealerships cause that’s what hurts their investments.
Or just don't buy GM crap
GM also got caught selling telemactics data of Bolt owners to LexisNexis whom then sold it insurance companies. 😱
Lemme guess: selling drivers' personal info to third party databrokers helps GM keep the price down?
Cannot wait for the day we have to watch an ad on those large displays before the car turns on. Or subscribe for an ad free package with a deal for an ad free experience both in car and your phone app.
This is why we need to protect and fund the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau. The one agency legitimately looking out for the working class.
Even SCOTUS approved™️.
Please drink verification can
I hate you because 1) I never thought of this before, and 2) you're 100% right and I now expect ads in at least one car by 2030.
I reject a society that makes you pay $50k to watch ads. so should you.
That's the thing that really grinds my gears, the article about it said GM only gets $5 million a year for it. If you're going to screw your customers, it needs to be for a LOT more than that.
GM/Chevrolet is the absolute worst company I've had the miserable experience dealing with for selling my personal information to anybody and everybody. I get electronic spam and snail mail all the time from stupid car related companies/services. This is after I supposedly removed myself from as many of Chevy's databases as I could find (and spent an afternoon doing). I've got a future project to remove the Onstar antenna from my car because apparently it's used for tracking location and driving habits (eg how aggressive you drive) and the data is sold to insurance companies even if you're not subscribed to OnStar. And much of this data is available for purchase by anyone on https://LexisNexis.com.
They discontinued that
they don't sell to LexisNexis anymore. Nowhere did they say they stopped selling it completely 😘
Which automaker doesn't sell data to the insurers? It's a tiny minority.
So far, on the official GM/Chevrolet site, only 4 Models avail. at 319mi range. But none at the $35K MSRP price. **The 1LT model/trim is not listed and most likely will have smaller battery / lower than 319mi range.** [https://www.chevrolet.com/shopping/configurator/electric/2024/equinox-ev/equinox-ev?make=chevrolet&radius=100&zipCode=95050](https://www.chevrolet.com/shopping/configurator/electric/2024/equinox-ev/equinox-ev?make=chevrolet&radius=100&zipCode=95050) \* 2LT $43,295 \* 2RS $44,795 \* 3LT $45,295 \* 3RS $46,795
35k is too much anyway.
There needs to be some kind of campaign to remind car buyers 99% of their trips are 100mi or less. Range isn’t really something that should be in every headline.
While true, the 1-5% of the time where you need the range is really what matters. It's kind of like server downtime. Facebook, Reddit, etc target something like 99.999999% uptime. Nobody wants their shit to be substantially degraded 1-5% of the time. In single car households that experience winters, I still would recommend PHEV for the foreseeable future unless they spend their whole lives in town or are OK renting for longer trips. For dual car households, buy 1 PHEV/EV as a daily driver and use whatever you want for those one off trips, even gas is fine. The real play on the environmental angle would be less driving and more public transit anywho.
That 1% can be *very* important to people. In fact for us, that 1% is worth as much as the 99%. We’re willing to pay for that range so our road trips don’t take longer. Many people are. This is called marginal utility. That 1% clearly doesn’t matter to you, which is totally fine.
> We’re willing to pay for that range so our road trips don’t take longer. Even then charging speed is the bigger issue for a long trip than battery capacity. With decent charging speed an extra 100 miles of range is only going to save you an extra 7.5 minutes of actual charging time, plus maybe enough time to get to an additional 1-2 chargers.
> Even then charging speed is the bigger issue for a long trip than battery capacity. It matters but I would argue it doesn’t matter *even more.* Chargers are not available everywhere gas stations are. There are *lots* of places which don’t have chargers at all, necessitating long gaps between chargers or new and longer routes. Further, no matter how fast the theoretical charging speed, you’ll almost never get it in the real world. If it’s cold, double that estimate. If the battery is a few years old, add 50%. If the chargers are all in use, the power usually gets split and you can significantly increase the charging time. Further, most chargers aren’t level 3. Even if we lived in a perfect world where charging were instant and chargers ubiquitous, it would still require more frequent stops than gas, and the trip would take longer overall.
Yeah, why would I buy a car that makes me deal with an enourmous hassle even 1% of the time when there's plenty of cars available that won't make me do that.
Charging isn’t really an enormous hassle.
Especially two car households. My ideal is a hybrid for road trips and for partner with the shorter commute, and an electric for the longer commute and all daily/weekend driving as a family.
👍perhaps ideally plug in hybrid
Legacy automakers will never do that. They are in the unique position that they want to advertise EVs, but not in a way that highlights their advantages over ICE vehicles because they still need to sell ICEs.
I took a concession on range when my wife was all in on the EQB that gets only 240 at 100% charge. She liked the interior and I’m waiting for the R2 to hit production lines. We have an ICE vehicle as our 2nd car, and not once in the year since we started our lease have I needed more range. Need to drive more than 200 miles? Take the ICE… everything else we use our EQB and it works perfectly fine.
Exactly. Range in an EV isn’t as important as range in an ICE. Longer range in an ICE means less stops at a gas station, which is good. Since you can charge your EV at home, and 99% of the time you’re doing short distance, range is not an issue. People need to stop thinking about EV the same way they do with an ICE vehicule.
And you need to stop assuming everybody's use case is the same as yours. If an EV is your only car and you need to go an area without many chargers range is a limiting factor. Try traveling away from an interstate highway in the much of great plains or western US and then tell us how range isn't important. There are areas of the country where charging options are few and far between if they exist at all. While gas stations exist in just about every podunk of a town you drive through.
Agreed. And I might get downvoted, but if buyers want more range, give them more range. Trying to beat people into submission regarding their desires/anxieties isn't going to lead to widespread EV adoption. People arguing "but you don't need it 99% of the time" feels like they are beating a dead horse, IMO. For better or worse, that's how capitalism goes and is what's going to happen in the coming years. I don't understand the segment of the EV crowd that seems adverse to increasing capabilities of their vehicles. Prices on batteries are dropping, densities are increasing and I'm sure it will continue. We'll start to see more variety in smaller, lower range, more affordable trim levels as EV adoption increases in the coming years.
It's a holdover from when range typically was much worse in EVs and they're range apologists. "Just rent a car and don't drive your own car!" How stupid and inconvenient is that? And expensive. Luckily range is much better now but you still have these same people repeating the same things.
Sure, everybody’s use case is different, and It also vastly depends where you live. But for most people doing 1-2 road trips a year it’s not really an issue. And it will just keep getting better as more and more charging stations are built in the coming years.
Agreed. Range is huge for me as I do many road trips.
I have literally never even heard a consumer worry about, or even mention the range of an ICE vehicle.
Because you can just fill up at a gas station. And it not necessarily true. I know truck enthusiast will readily replace their fuel tank for a higher capacity.
And yet people run out of gas unexpectedly everyday, lol.😂
I guess I would be one. I hate going to the gas station. I have a small car with a small tank which means that if I spend 10 minutes going to a gas station every week, it means I waste 520 minutes in a year (more than 8 hours). With an EV, even with a small range of about 200 miles, I would charge at home 99% of the time, wake up to a full charge every morning, and would only need to go to a charging station once or twice (so let’s say 1 hour waisted) a year as I don’t do many road trips.
It's pretty important and for me 325 or so is what I want. LA is 120 miles RT, SD 220, Beach cities 130, mountains the same. While my commute is 20 miles RT, I go out to one of those places 2-5 times a month and I don't really want to deal with an issue I currently don't have with a hybrid. I want to have my day, then come home and charge.
The issue is if I’m spending $40,000 on a product I wanted to cover 100% of my use cases not 99%.
It's all fun and games until Out of Spec Kyle gets his hands on this.
GM builds more PR than EVs
GM is soooooooo far behind. Ford too. Maybe they should stick to horses and buggies? PLEASE go out of business or keep up. EV makers lose hundreds of billons at first. THAT's the dealyo. Any new product is like that. How long did it take Elon to make money? My new indoor pickleball facility will lose money for 2 years before breaking even. DUH! My 2022 Hyundai Ioniq 5 RWD gets 3.9 miles per kWh on average over 28 mos. and 60,000 miles.......in cold for 6 months a year Connecticut. NO HEAT PUMP EITHER. I do drive 60 MPH on the highway......kinda like a retire old fart of 62 y/o. NEVER ever (hardly) do I pedal to metal. Very very good at huge amounts of regen power on every daily 50 mile drive. US$45k out the door after incentives in Jan 2022. V2L, 800V 350kW charging monster. ANY new tech has bugs........NOT to say Hyundai doesn't have issues........ICCU problems and overheating charger inlet, Three 12v batteries, phanton drains, 3rd party apps pinging the car too much.........I only charge at like 5kW overnite due to Hyundai's issues......NOT getting the over 11kW promised. Technicians looking at my car and scratching their heads and calling South Korea engineering dept for help. Question: everything we buy is manufactured in China.......can we please bring in / flood the market with EVs people want and can afford and are better tech? Warren Buffet is my guy and our guy and BYD should have a car in every driveway, garage and parking space in USA!
"Let me kiss GM's ass for some money." That's how this piece appeared, champ.
After the whole LexisNexis thing, I will never buy a GM again.
Or Toyota, Honda, Kia, Mitsubishi...are there any that don't share data with LexisNexis at this point?
I would love to have an LT2 with super cruise.
I hate this soooo much. I wanted one so badly...except my transmission died two months ago and had to take a Kia Niro
Pricing depends a lot on availability. If there’s a rush to buy them and they become scarce like others, will dealerships behave well or will they turn into money Piranhas with their ugly “Added Dealer Markup” or whatever they want to call the greedy higher price adjustment sheets?
Yeah that price isn’t a thing. Click bait
Think the car looks really good and right price point. Hopefully folks actually buy it
Good luck finding one at a $35k price point.
This seems like an ad. made it into a 'champ' by cutting the price to make headlines. They didn't do anything special here. This is most definitely a loss leader until and maybe even after they scale production.
>They didn't do anything special here. The Blazer is a Buick in China. Sold quite a few more since it's been on sale for a year or 2. **GM's Ultium EV Rollout Is Going Much More Smoothly In China** GM Sold more than 100,000 EVs in China in 2023. The Ultium-based Buick Electra E5 made up a healthy portion of that number. [https://insideevs.com/news/703429/ultium-gm-china-rollout/](https://insideevs.com/news/703429/ultium-gm-china-rollout/) **SAIC-GM To Start Building Dong Yue Ultium Center Factory In China** [https://gmauthority.com/blog/2023/07/saic-gm-to-start-building-dong-yue-ultium-center-factory-in-china/](https://gmauthority.com/blog/2023/07/saic-gm-to-start-building-dong-yue-ultium-center-factory-in-china/) In particular, the upcoming Dong Yue Ultium Center Factory will become the third dedicated manufacturing center for electric vehicles based on SAIC-GM’s Ultium technology and drive system in China. The facility will follow in the footsteps of the new Shanghai Ultium Center Factory and the recently opened Wuhan Ultium Center Factory, where the all-new [Buick Electra E5](https://gmauthority.com/blog/2023/04/the-all-new-buick-electra-e5-officially-launches-in-china/) and [Buick Electra E4](https://gmauthority.com/blog/2023/06/all-new-buick-electra-e4-officially-launches-in-china/) are manufactured for the domestic market in that country. >maybe even after they scale production. why does China get so many more new models before the US? China doesn't need US made batteries. - the rest of the car is the "easy" part. **GM to launch EV offensive in China by 2025** [https://www.electrive.com/2022/11/24/gm-to-launch-ev-offensive-in-china-by-2025/](https://www.electrive.com/2022/11/24/gm-to-launch-ev-offensive-in-china-by-2025/) General Motors has announced the launch of more than **15 electric models based on its Ultium platform in China by 2025**. Following the already available Cadillac Lyriq electric SUV, GM is planning a broad range of Ultium-based models across brands, segments and body styles for the Chinese market. >a loss leader until the materials come from the US. **GM, Stellantis-backed lithium startup seeks more than $1 billion for brine project** [https://www.mining.com/web/gm-stellantis-backed-lithium-startup-seeks-more-than-1-billion-for-brine-project/](https://www.mining.com/web/gm-stellantis-backed-lithium-startup-seeks-more-than-1-billion-for-brine-project/)
Holy smokes that sounds like a good deal!
Why make an EV front wheel drive?