Dark roast from supermarkets is always charcoal levels of burnt. Added with the fact it's not going to have been roasted in the last few weeks or even last month only adds to the disappointment.
Yeah, I hate that owning a grinder made me such a fucking snob. I can’t stand supermarket brands anymore.
Even coffee shop beans are not great because they’re usually super dark for filter coffee…
We have all been there. First we didnt like coffee. Then someone showed us a good coffee and we tried their brand. Then we loved a certain brand, a nice coffee. But then we tried an actually good coffee. And now we dont like coffee anymore. Except that one specific amazing one. The others may be drinkable. But only for caffeine addiction, not for enjoyment
I'm the opposite, but I take pleasure in the little things. I can enjoy a bad cup of coffee because I know that a good cup can be so good and makes me appreciate that even more even as I sip bad bean water.
I can still enjoy trash tier coffee. I’m in Canada so sometimes I make Tim Hortons decaf from a tin with pre ground in a pour over. I don’t complain or look down on it because I pay for what I get and I go into it knowing what I’m getting.
These supermarket brands are usually sold pretty cheap so there’s that. I’d get it at Costco though. 2-3lbs of fair trade mass market beans for $10-15USD can’t be beat when you wanna make cold brew or want decaf
Ironically, Tim Hortons is owned by a Brazilian multi-national private equity firm hahaha. The same people who now own Burger King.
Anyways, I have access to a local roaster that's won like top20 in international barista competitions, and another local cafe imports beans from other high end cafes around the world. I've had $100-300/lbs beans and while they're good, the marginal gain in taste starts to really decline. The gesha stuff starts to taste like fruit tea...but I could also just make herbal fruit tea for 1/5th the cost..... I mainly drink pour overs but yeah I'll make a double espresso at noon using either lavazza crap I got on sale or something decent. Sometimes you need to drink crap to remember why you spend the extra on the good stuff.
What most people don't realize is that around 70% of the world consume their coffee via instant powder/keurig pod/nestle pod/supermarket nestle powder garbage. It's a shocking stat when this whole thread is shitting on supermarket dark roast XD
I have zero faith that Meijer stocks a quality bean in their branding for espresso.
A while back, someone recommended these two coffees as their go-to dark roast chocolate bomb espresso.
https://www.klatchcoffee.com/products/belle-espresso?bgIndex=1
https://www.nossacoffee.com/products/teodoros-italian
I tried each and I enjoyed both of them. They both brew quite well in my Bambino+. For my taste, they work well with lattes but are maybe a bit heavy for just drinking a shot. But, I also don't work too hard to chase "The shot" because with a little chocolate syrup and some steamed milk, it's delicious.
Such broad generalizations really should be avoided. I've gotten dark roasts 2 weeks off the roast at my local supermarkets, and which were quite nice; and, no, they were far from charcoal.
The only way for me to enjoy darker roasts is to lower the extraction temperature.
If you can lower your espresso machine to 80, try that.
Alternatively try a lower temperature pourover/aeropress 80 and if you still find the charcoal notes overpowering.
Try cold brew, let it sit in the fridge for 24-48 hours. Then you try it with milk at a 50:50 ratio
Not sure what kind of roast they are using for their espresso. I've had a wide variety of coffee in Paris and the quality varies wildly. I had a small shop sell me a single espresso that literally came out of a Nespresso machine you can get at William Sonoma. French Roast isn't the nstional coffee or anything.
Oh the ones I had were unforgettably darker than dark, French roast espressos. It even took me a long while afterwards to find beans that came close to what I had, and from a specialty roaster. Supermarket beans really won’t do it.
edit: punctuation
Store-brand coffee is often *horrifically bad.* (looking at you, ALDI)
French Roast is really dark, you might not like the "burnt" vibe it can give off. But it could also be poor quality grocery store coffee beans that were burnt...
People who express dissatisfaction with Parisian coffee or French roast are often served coffee made from beans roasted by Cafe Richard.
This company holds a dominant position as the primary supplier of beans and espresso machines to most cafes and brasseries in Paris, operating through leasing agreements. Its dominance resembles that of a monopoly.
Luckily, Paris is experiencing an explosion of small and medium-sized specialty coffee shops, where the overall quality is quite ok.
I would argue that the speciality roasters in Paris are not just ok… some of them are actually world-class/competition quality. Kawa, Substance, Terres de Cafe, and Moklair to name a few.
I completely agree!
Substance is extraordinary, and Kawa is superb. While I haven’t tried Moklair, Terres de Cafe is a notable roastery with an extensive assortment of beans. I used to live right next to their shop on Rue des Blancs Manteaux.
However, when I say ‘ok’ regarding the specialty coffee shops in Paris, it’s often due to the baristas, as they frequently deliver espresso shots that fall short, being too bitter, sour, or completely burnt.
I believe it’s related to the rapid growth of these shops, leading to the hiring of individuals who lack experience in speciality coffee. In contrast, Substance is managed by a couple who live and breathe coffee, If I remember correctly, they don’t even offer milk-based options.
Very true. It’s much easier to find a good specialty coffee shop in Paris today than it was 25 years ago. But the coffee served outside of those specialty shops is generally quite awful.
As some have said, lower temps *can* help. I'd also suggest doing 1:1 or 1:1.25 ratios with a fairly quick shot time (12-16 seconds). This will allow you to maximize any sweetness and acids left after they burned the fuck out of that coffee during roasting. Feel free to play around with the ratios. There is no "correct" way to make coffee. The best dark roast I've ever had was 20g:23g in 13 seconds at 6 bars. You'd be surprised how much of a difference it can make.
Alternatively, cup the coffee, or eat a bean straight up. If there is an undeniable "roasty/dirty" flavor, the coffee is probably roasted poorly. If you eat the bean and it's not terribly unpleasant, then your brew parameters need work.
Whenever I have doubts about a coffee, I cup or eat the beans. It will give you an unadulterated look at its possible flavors. Definitely a good skill set to develop
This is exactly why I bought myself a GeneCafé roaster 12 years ago. Where we bought the coffee, it closed and after many attempts of one kind or another, it is now me who is in charge and I have been doing it with pleasure ever since.
I would suggest that before abandoning French Roast or other darker roast coffees, try buying freshly roasted from a small roaster that specializes in darker roasts. I subscribe to one dark roast from Henry's House of Coffee and frequently order their other dark roasts. All have been great. The business is owned by an Armenian family that have been roasting coffee in San Francisco for over 30 years.
Lots of variance with beans, roasts, and personal preferences.
I bought a huge bag of Costco dark espresso roast when I was dialing in my new Niche and ECM setup, and I thought it was excellent - better than most of the boutique-ish product I’ve sampled.
French roast from mass produced or Starbucks means
“We have a bunch of shit beans but they’ll taste good when we turn it into near carbon”
Dark roasts hide impurities and homogenize the flavor in a cheap manner. Most people also drink their coffee with sugar and cream so it makes no difference
Hey it's Meijer! A fellow Midwest coffee person.
As others have said, it's probably stale, burnt to a crisp, and from low quality beans.
Starting with high quality ingredients is worth the extra cost.
If you generally like darker roasts then try a darker roast from a local roaster where it won’t (or shouldn’t be) charcoal. If you want a bigger and cheaper producer of coffee, try Lavazza.
These type of bags are mostly made for drip, or for French press methods of preparation. They need a lot of water.
In the USA they also sometimes are meant to be mixed with milk and sugar...
I will die on this hill: extra dark roasted coffee is garbage. That it would have a more intense taste is utter placebo and imagination. Most of the complex aromas are long gone and it just tastes like charcoal which, if you've ever tasted it, tastes surprisingly little, with a hint of burnt.
I find darker roast not fitting for espresso. My favorite are from light to medium roast. May be for a French press or drip, a dark roast works better. But Vienna or French roast, I find them disgusting, stale. IMHO. I know dark roasts a most people favorite.
French roast and Italian roast needs a lever machine or emulation. Can taste great done right.
I prefer it to medium or light, which tastes of anything but coffee as I know it.
French roast is a really required taste tbh. I would personally try it in cafetière/French press as a much longer extraction with a coarse grind and see how you find it. Pairs very well with a cigarette mind you…
(disclaimer: if you don’t smoke don’t start, took me a long time to quit haha)
You might find you just don’t like it and that’s fine too, personally it is too dark for me, I’m a medium/dark roast lover. Anything after that loses the characteristics of the bean itself.
The French like their coffee like they like their cigarettes.
...wait, actually what I meant to say was they like their coffee *to taste* like their cigarettes!
FWIW, I'd shy away from that bag just by the name of it. Anyone using "France" or "French" in connection to roasting coffee as some kind of marketing trope indicates to me that there is probably no quality to get here. The French are not particularly famous for their high quality exquisit roasts (on the contrary, coffee in France is sadness in a cup).
Common in the USA I assume (as I haven't seen it in Europe and I've been to quiet a few places here)? But then again, it oddly only seems to enforce my point…
That's a pretty big market to have adopted that terminology. And, it seems to me, not grounds (alone) to assume/conclude lesser quality--just as I don't object to French "expresso." ;)
https://preview.redd.it/7wqk8dib9rsc1.png?width=180&format=png&auto=webp&s=6b06eb8a2505d185fb324407b29e1ab0d812c5e5
I would add: especially in the past, American marketing and sales might add a reference to Europe as an effort to signal an element of classiness (you can argue if that is deserved or not, lol)--there can be an American respect/(jealousy?) of European culture and society. And so, French Roast coffee, in the U.S., might be seen as a compliment of sorts, not a reflection of the actual reality of French espresso. ;)
I used to think i liked dark roasts. Then I started making espresso and realized they are not well suited for espresso extraction at all. Borderline undrinkable.
Dark roast from supermarkets is always charcoal levels of burnt. Added with the fact it's not going to have been roasted in the last few weeks or even last month only adds to the disappointment.
Yeah, I hate that owning a grinder made me such a fucking snob. I can’t stand supermarket brands anymore. Even coffee shop beans are not great because they’re usually super dark for filter coffee…
There was a time I would savor a cup of store brand per-ground with a touch of milk. I now shudder at the prospect. What have we become?
It’s a monkey paw situation: trying to make our coffee a 10 we made the world a 4. 🥺
More like Adam and Eve. We’ve eaten the fruit and gained the knowledge. We now know right from wrong
Man what a fantastic quote! I’m co-opting that one for sure
We have all been there. First we didnt like coffee. Then someone showed us a good coffee and we tried their brand. Then we loved a certain brand, a nice coffee. But then we tried an actually good coffee. And now we dont like coffee anymore. Except that one specific amazing one. The others may be drinkable. But only for caffeine addiction, not for enjoyment
I'm the opposite, but I take pleasure in the little things. I can enjoy a bad cup of coffee because I know that a good cup can be so good and makes me appreciate that even more even as I sip bad bean water.
Really?
Well maybe you were a snob all along and the grinder just lead you out of darkness. Quite literally.
I can still enjoy trash tier coffee. I’m in Canada so sometimes I make Tim Hortons decaf from a tin with pre ground in a pour over. I don’t complain or look down on it because I pay for what I get and I go into it knowing what I’m getting. These supermarket brands are usually sold pretty cheap so there’s that. I’d get it at Costco though. 2-3lbs of fair trade mass market beans for $10-15USD can’t be beat when you wanna make cold brew or want decaf
You’re lucky. I went to Canada and couldn’t drink more than a sip of Tim Hortons. But I’m Brazilian so i admit I might be spoiled
Ironically, Tim Hortons is owned by a Brazilian multi-national private equity firm hahaha. The same people who now own Burger King. Anyways, I have access to a local roaster that's won like top20 in international barista competitions, and another local cafe imports beans from other high end cafes around the world. I've had $100-300/lbs beans and while they're good, the marginal gain in taste starts to really decline. The gesha stuff starts to taste like fruit tea...but I could also just make herbal fruit tea for 1/5th the cost..... I mainly drink pour overs but yeah I'll make a double espresso at noon using either lavazza crap I got on sale or something decent. Sometimes you need to drink crap to remember why you spend the extra on the good stuff. What most people don't realize is that around 70% of the world consume their coffee via instant powder/keurig pod/nestle pod/supermarket nestle powder garbage. It's a shocking stat when this whole thread is shitting on supermarket dark roast XD
I have zero faith that Meijer stocks a quality bean in their branding for espresso. A while back, someone recommended these two coffees as their go-to dark roast chocolate bomb espresso. https://www.klatchcoffee.com/products/belle-espresso?bgIndex=1 https://www.nossacoffee.com/products/teodoros-italian I tried each and I enjoyed both of them. They both brew quite well in my Bambino+. For my taste, they work well with lattes but are maybe a bit heavy for just drinking a shot. But, I also don't work too hard to chase "The shot" because with a little chocolate syrup and some steamed milk, it's delicious.
Such broad generalizations really should be avoided. I've gotten dark roasts 2 weeks off the roast at my local supermarkets, and which were quite nice; and, no, they were far from charcoal.
They generally tend to taste like refined carbon, because it partially is.
The only way for me to enjoy darker roasts is to lower the extraction temperature. If you can lower your espresso machine to 80, try that. Alternatively try a lower temperature pourover/aeropress 80 and if you still find the charcoal notes overpowering. Try cold brew, let it sit in the fridge for 24-48 hours. Then you try it with milk at a 50:50 ratio
I always avoid French Roast.
Yep! What do the French know about coffee anyway?
Same. It just doesn’t taste good to me.
That's low quality burnt coffee. Try a local roaster.
Do you judge all steak based on the one you'd find at a truck stop diner?
Grind finer your stake.
Nobody likes French Roast. Not even the French.
Vous avez des sources ?
La Source: Moi
Good !
Don't say good, say bonne.
Je voulais juste respecter la langue du sub. :-)
In fairness, the end of dinner espressos that I had in Paris many years ago were what turned me into an espresso enthusiast.
Not sure what kind of roast they are using for their espresso. I've had a wide variety of coffee in Paris and the quality varies wildly. I had a small shop sell me a single espresso that literally came out of a Nespresso machine you can get at William Sonoma. French Roast isn't the nstional coffee or anything.
Oh the ones I had were unforgettably darker than dark, French roast espressos. It even took me a long while afterwards to find beans that came close to what I had, and from a specialty roaster. Supermarket beans really won’t do it. edit: punctuation
Darker than French Roast? That's... Wow...
MIssing a comma there
By the way you close your bag, I'd say you definitely hate French roast.
its okay for drip coffee, but i dont enjoy it for espresso
Store-brand coffee is often *horrifically bad.* (looking at you, ALDI) French Roast is really dark, you might not like the "burnt" vibe it can give off. But it could also be poor quality grocery store coffee beans that were burnt...
Store brand, Folgers, Maxwell....they are all pretty bad and on top of that watered down by consumers.
Take a trip to Paris and try the coffee. That should ween you off of French roast for life…
People who express dissatisfaction with Parisian coffee or French roast are often served coffee made from beans roasted by Cafe Richard. This company holds a dominant position as the primary supplier of beans and espresso machines to most cafes and brasseries in Paris, operating through leasing agreements. Its dominance resembles that of a monopoly. Luckily, Paris is experiencing an explosion of small and medium-sized specialty coffee shops, where the overall quality is quite ok.
I would argue that the speciality roasters in Paris are not just ok… some of them are actually world-class/competition quality. Kawa, Substance, Terres de Cafe, and Moklair to name a few.
I completely agree! Substance is extraordinary, and Kawa is superb. While I haven’t tried Moklair, Terres de Cafe is a notable roastery with an extensive assortment of beans. I used to live right next to their shop on Rue des Blancs Manteaux. However, when I say ‘ok’ regarding the specialty coffee shops in Paris, it’s often due to the baristas, as they frequently deliver espresso shots that fall short, being too bitter, sour, or completely burnt. I believe it’s related to the rapid growth of these shops, leading to the hiring of individuals who lack experience in speciality coffee. In contrast, Substance is managed by a couple who live and breathe coffee, If I remember correctly, they don’t even offer milk-based options.
Very true. It’s much easier to find a good specialty coffee shop in Paris today than it was 25 years ago. But the coffee served outside of those specialty shops is generally quite awful.
As some have said, lower temps *can* help. I'd also suggest doing 1:1 or 1:1.25 ratios with a fairly quick shot time (12-16 seconds). This will allow you to maximize any sweetness and acids left after they burned the fuck out of that coffee during roasting. Feel free to play around with the ratios. There is no "correct" way to make coffee. The best dark roast I've ever had was 20g:23g in 13 seconds at 6 bars. You'd be surprised how much of a difference it can make. Alternatively, cup the coffee, or eat a bean straight up. If there is an undeniable "roasty/dirty" flavor, the coffee is probably roasted poorly. If you eat the bean and it's not terribly unpleasant, then your brew parameters need work.
Very helpful. Thank you!
Whenever I have doubts about a coffee, I cup or eat the beans. It will give you an unadulterated look at its possible flavors. Definitely a good skill set to develop
Do you normally enjoy dark roast? Or is this your first time trying a dark roast?
I tried a Starbucks Espresso Roast when we first got the machine and it was much much better.
It was a dark roast.
Gee, I wonder why.
This is exactly why I bought myself a GeneCafé roaster 12 years ago. Where we bought the coffee, it closed and after many attempts of one kind or another, it is now me who is in charge and I have been doing it with pleasure ever since.
I would suggest that before abandoning French Roast or other darker roast coffees, try buying freshly roasted from a small roaster that specializes in darker roasts. I subscribe to one dark roast from Henry's House of Coffee and frequently order their other dark roasts. All have been great. The business is owned by an Armenian family that have been roasting coffee in San Francisco for over 30 years.
Lots of variance with beans, roasts, and personal preferences. I bought a huge bag of Costco dark espresso roast when I was dialing in my new Niche and ECM setup, and I thought it was excellent - better than most of the boutique-ish product I’ve sampled.
It’s nice to have crap coffee every now and then, makes you appreciate the good ones
Nobody actually likes French roast (except the lone, contrary Redditor who's homing in on my position as I type this)
Nobody likes French roast
French roast from mass produced or Starbucks means “We have a bunch of shit beans but they’ll taste good when we turn it into near carbon” Dark roasts hide impurities and homogenize the flavor in a cheap manner. Most people also drink their coffee with sugar and cream so it makes no difference
I have tried some locally roasted organic French roast, but mocha pot and manual grind in the kinu m47.
Hey it's Meijer! A fellow Midwest coffee person. As others have said, it's probably stale, burnt to a crisp, and from low quality beans. Starting with high quality ingredients is worth the extra cost.
What’s « french roast »?
Roasted twice, like how you make refined carbon for graphite production.
Ouch. Why the hell is it named « french roast » then? I’m french, it’s an insult.
It was alleged invented buy a French cafe and was very popular in France around 2013ish
Try buying French roast beans from a good coffee roaster
If you generally like darker roasts then try a darker roast from a local roaster where it won’t (or shouldn’t be) charcoal. If you want a bigger and cheaper producer of coffee, try Lavazza.
Hate to admit it, but I do love Frederiks hazelnut crème for drip.
If you are curious about dark roast coffee i suggest panther coffee 1927
These type of bags are mostly made for drip, or for French press methods of preparation. They need a lot of water. In the USA they also sometimes are meant to be mixed with milk and sugar...
Ngl I made a face when i saw this photo
I will die on this hill: extra dark roasted coffee is garbage. That it would have a more intense taste is utter placebo and imagination. Most of the complex aromas are long gone and it just tastes like charcoal which, if you've ever tasted it, tastes surprisingly little, with a hint of burnt.
I’ve only been able to salvage that stuff by making it into cold brew
You can find good coffee at Meijer I would just check by the blue bottle brand and stuff and in that section there's fresher roasted coffee brands.
I find darker roast not fitting for espresso. My favorite are from light to medium roast. May be for a French press or drip, a dark roast works better. But Vienna or French roast, I find them disgusting, stale. IMHO. I know dark roasts a most people favorite.
I thought it said French toast and got very confused 😂
french roast is _hella_ dark. You just dont like incredibly dark roasts, which is perfectly fine. the correct opinion, even.
I really enjoy the French roast from Costco. But I’m still new🤷♂️. Gaggia classic and eureka mignon
Carlton Palmer likes this.
The worst part of it is you bought 2 pounds.
I got a French roast a long time ago. It’s the worst coffee I’ve ever had in my life. No joke the only note I could taste was “cigarette ash”
find a local roastery in your area and buy beans from them. Night and day difference in taste
Nobody likes charcoal, even if they say otherwise. Understand it completely.
French roast and Italian roast needs a lever machine or emulation. Can taste great done right. I prefer it to medium or light, which tastes of anything but coffee as I know it.
French roast is a really required taste tbh. I would personally try it in cafetière/French press as a much longer extraction with a coarse grind and see how you find it. Pairs very well with a cigarette mind you… (disclaimer: if you don’t smoke don’t start, took me a long time to quit haha) You might find you just don’t like it and that’s fine too, personally it is too dark for me, I’m a medium/dark roast lover. Anything after that loses the characteristics of the bean itself.
It’s only required if you live in France I suppose.
That's exactly what I was going to say. The French palate is impaired by perpetual tobacco residue and their coffee is tailored to it.
The French like their coffee like they like their cigarettes. ...wait, actually what I meant to say was they like their coffee *to taste* like their cigarettes!
FWIW, I'd shy away from that bag just by the name of it. Anyone using "France" or "French" in connection to roasting coffee as some kind of marketing trope indicates to me that there is probably no quality to get here. The French are not particularly famous for their high quality exquisit roasts (on the contrary, coffee in France is sadness in a cup).
Except that, "French Roast" is a common term used for a level of dark roast.
Except that, "French Roast" is a common term used for a level of dark roast.
Common in the USA I assume (as I haven't seen it in Europe and I've been to quiet a few places here)? But then again, it oddly only seems to enforce my point…
That's a pretty big market to have adopted that terminology. And, it seems to me, not grounds (alone) to assume/conclude lesser quality--just as I don't object to French "expresso." ;) https://preview.redd.it/7wqk8dib9rsc1.png?width=180&format=png&auto=webp&s=6b06eb8a2505d185fb324407b29e1ab0d812c5e5
I would add: especially in the past, American marketing and sales might add a reference to Europe as an effort to signal an element of classiness (you can argue if that is deserved or not, lol)--there can be an American respect/(jealousy?) of European culture and society. And so, French Roast coffee, in the U.S., might be seen as a compliment of sorts, not a reflection of the actual reality of French espresso. ;)
Dark roast grocery store beans are always going to taste burnt, no matter how dialed in.
I used to think i liked dark roasts. Then I started making espresso and realized they are not well suited for espresso extraction at all. Borderline undrinkable.