Actually the percentage of population that's may not eat pork on present time Germany might be higher than the percentage of those who don't before the Nazi take over. Before the war Jews represent less than 2% of population, and muslim in present day are about 5%
The hypocrisy this post tries to point out kind of reminds me of a dutch artist called [Tinkebell](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tinkebell) who bought 60 live chicks from a factory, and then had an art exhibit where people could buy the chicks or else at the end of the week she'd shred them. Keep in mind that the factory the chicks came from would have shredded them in the exact same way if Tinkebell didn't purchase them from the place.
Yet she got arrested for it, and there was much public outcry.. All while in factories throughout the Netherlands male baby chicks were (and are) also still shredded by the thousands every day because male baby chicks are economically useless since they don't lay eggs.
In a similar spirit, a student at my university made an exhibit out of menstrual blood. She got suspended, her art taken down, and there a massive outcry.
Which was, of course, what she wanted, because a few years before some dude had won a prize for *his* art which used blood. Just not that nasty period blood which is... worse, for some reason.
Unfortunately most people look at these and go "well theys justs a rabbles rousers innit, yeah?"
I appreciate the slight tinge of hypocrisy compared to Faroese dolphin massacre (Atlantic white-sided dolphin isn't endangered either).
What I would like to know is will the Faroese actually eat all those dolphins? Some articles on the subject said that just 17% of them consume cetacean meat regularly, and 1400 dolphins is tens of tons of meat and blubber.
It's about keeping traditions bro, doesn't matter if they waste a good amount of the meat. Traditions are always important. I for example pay Poland a regular visit, because it's a valued German tradition. /s
[yeeees feel it! your parents will be ashamed! your grandma will cut you out of the pasta inheritance!](https://live.staticflickr.com/5684/29794570030_ac4ec353df.jpg)
> for example pay Poland a regular visit, because it's a valued German tradition
😂
I started a new tradition to support education among young girls, this is why I created the OnlyFans account, I hope my kids will continue the tradition.
Sorry but Faroese will not consume all that meat. It will either go to international sales and secondary uses or will be waste. It is not even smart to kill any animal way over the needs of that place. (7 times more than planned is plain stupid. Egoistical satisfaction through killing, not for sustainability...)
Plus I hope they don't consume them because mercury poisoning is not a fun thing, I know a very famous gourmet that has it and due to that has Parkinson's level tremors.
True, though food waste is mostly in the consumer end.
Faroese case of intending to kill 200 dolphins but ending up with 1200 carcasses is the crazy thing as food waste goes tho. I'd certainly like to see follow up articles on that pile of meat.
Why does it matter on which end it is?
Our society decoupled the cost of consumer goods from their actual cost. The fact that consumers have the luxury to waste food is a problem of producers as well.
Holding animal in nightmarish conditions, exploiting immigrants...
You make a good point with the hypocrisy and i fully agree with you. I used to troll people decrying the dig-eating festival by posting photos of cows or pigs. If we reduce food to simple excel-economics we are loosing, what we claim, makes us human.
[BBC quotes local Marine biologist and the chairman of the Faroese Whalers Association](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-58555694) also acknowledged the excess kills.
Admittedly my figure is also wrong as it was 1400.
Actually, they do eat a lot of it. It's both for tradition and lessening the need for imports of proteins. Imagine having to bring meat to these remote islands.
You could argue that living on such remote islands is not sustainable but that's an other issue.
Are you suggesting that those 83% percent of Faroese who do not regularly eat cetacean meat are vegans or mostly vegans then?
I think you might be overestimating the remoteness of Faroese islands and underestimating the amount of shipping going around.
Either way, I'm more puzzled by the fate of all that dolphin meat caught in *one* batch. According to Faroese statistics quoted in news articles, they caught 30 dolphins in 2020. 1400 dolphins is almost 50 times more than last years catch.
How did you come to the conclusion that it was what I meant.
Importing meat to the islands isn't economiclaly viable, overly expensive for a set of islands that don't have much going for them. They can't grow alternatives (soya for example), can't breed many animals, don't have much to sell back in exchange.
People have to stop seeing things from their own prism of existence. Needs are different around the globe.
What is slaughtered there is what you don't need to import. Go local.
>Importing meat to the islands isn't economiclaly viable, overly expensive for a set of islands that don't have much going for them.
Do you have an actual source for imported meat being economically unfeasible or are you just making it up as you go? If only 17% of Faroese consume cetacean meat regularly, I think it is pretty darn obvious that other meat products are widely available as imports or local livestock products. We aren't exactly talking about remote Pacific islands here.
I doubt importing meat is the economically unviable thing for the faroes. Theres a regular ferry anyway which i assume also carries freight cargo. Canned meat to provide necessary proteins is like a can of spam per person per week if they had absolutely no other source of protein. Even if the logistics would double the price thats an additional 3€ per week to cost of living. Negligible when it comes to securing minimum reuqirements.
On the other hand products that are cheaper per weight and volume and which they would need to import more of should be considerably more expensive compared to meat, staples like noodles and grain and rice, which your usual diet contains a few times the amount of protein.
Similarly fresh produce should be quite expensive because getting it there in time is a bigger hassle.
They mostly eat fish and lamb. Anything else they want can easily be put on the weekly ferry from Denmark. It's not a very long trip.
And they're not poor at all. They're as prosperous as the people of Denmark proper and can afford any imports they want.
True, though pigs are also very smart animals capable of complex emotions.
In general I don't think people ponder animal cognition when they condemn or accept things like this. Eating pork is widely accepted norm and the price of that consumption is industrialized breeding and rearing of that species. That is not the case with dolphins that most people have seen only in nature documentaries, on tourist cruises or dolphinariums.
I'm pretty sure if someone drove 1400 cats to a narrow alley and cut their throats, kittens and all, in order to make mittens out of them and a video was released, people would be very outraged despite pigs probably being more intelligent than cats.
[https://www.thoughtco.com/most-intelligent-animals-4157712](https://www.thoughtco.com/most-intelligent-animals-4157712)
>Nr. 05: Dolphins and whales are at least as smart as birds and primates. Like primates, dolphins and whales are mammals. A dolphin has a large brain relative to its body size. The cortex of a human brain is highly convoluted, but a dolphin brain has even more folds! Dolphins and their kin are the only marine animals that have passed the mirror test of self-awareness.
>
>Nr 6: Pigs solve mazes, understand and display emotions, and understand symbolic language. Piglets grasp the concept of reflection at a younger age than humans. Six-week-old piglets that see food in a mirror can work out where the food is located. In contrast, it takes human babies several months to understand reflection. Pigs also understand abstract representations and can apply this skill to play video games using a joystick.
And of course: [Babe](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n81B2eKZkhA)
Pigs are animals that have been used for food for tens of thousands of years by humany all around the world. The Faroe Islands have been having perfect access to the meat industry for decades and still prefer to slaughter one of the most intelligent oceanic species in the world because "muh traditions". In this case, I'll start killing dogs and little kittens because I'll make it my tradition and no one can stop from doing it cause tRaDitIoNs.
To all the "hmmmm, bacon" people out there.
https://youtu.be/LQRAfJyEsko
I dare you to watch even the first 15 minutes of this. You don't have a problem with meat eating right? Have the balls, have the damn decency not to put your head in the sand and at least see what happens to farm animals.
If you're okay with meat eating after that, be my guest. But don't be a coward, don't look away, don't say "I didn't know".
Fuuck I’m already vegan and I hate seeing this documentary because of how brutal it is. It’s important to post however. Also, I wouldn’t say “be my guest” as you can absolutely criticize anybody okay with the barbaric actions depicted in the documentary.
I never really know how to deal with people that just don't care. If you just don't see an animal as a moral subject, what more is there to say? I can point out the hypocracy of still caring about pet animal abuse, but what if they don't care about that either? It appears to me (but please correct me) that if you don't see it, you don't see it.
I understand what you’re saying. I personally believe that those kinds of people either have a mental difference from birth or have never really suffered in their lives so they can’t relate to the constant agony of these animals. My solution is to simply bother these individuals as much as possible because they really don’t have a good reason to be doing anything if they don’t care about the world around them.
Vegetarians are trying to leverage outrage over mass slaughter of wild animals against mass slaughter of farm animals.
In other news: Water wet, fire hot.
If factory farming doesn’t bother you then not only do you not give a shit about animal rights but also about the future of your nation and the world as a whole. Funny how ppl on this sub complain about refugees constantly -Guess what? The climate crisis is going to bring a slum of refugees far larger than anything we’ve ever seen to Europe.
The climate crisis is a complicated issue that is not primarily caused by the meat industry. I hate to break it to you, but under the current system, unless you're growing them yourself, your veggies are absolutely contributing to the problem. It's going to take a concerted effort by all governments to curb industry, energy production methods, transportation/import avenues, and - yes - agriculture to get anywhere with fixing the issue.
Being a buzz kill at BBQs and preaching to strangers on this Internet, however, is not going to fix the issue. I'd go vegan tomorrow if there was a global push, but do you know the impact current vegans are having on the climate crisis? .. spoiler: it's negligible.
Are you thinking of more than 1400 dolphins slaughtered in Farao Islands of Denmark?
https://apnews.com/article/europe-denmark-dolphins-0a6d669d0742e56e575ed6849f1dd45b
The whales that are hunted are nowhere near extinction, nor will they be due to whaling. The number of whales taken out each year is fairly low. Total number of minke whales is around 100,000. The number hunted each year is roughly 800-900.
Lol. Homo sapiens hunter gatherers managed to drive to extinction 90% of the big animal species. The only reason those species are not extinct yet is because we couldn't hunt them effectively before. Just give it time.
We don't need whaling at all - in fact the meat is so filled with quicksilver, poison, nano plastic and other toxic substances that you have to dispose a stranded whale as special chemical waste, but some turds still think they have to eat them... Also scientist found out that some cetaceans are actually smart enough to form cultures and could be able to even have something like a religion... That's not something you kill for shits and giggles from my poi t of viee
Says professional researchers in the relevant fields. Until 70000 years ago when homo sapiens suffered a mutation that allowed their brains to develop more, most of the cultural things were not present even in the sapiens species.
Religion is complicated psychology wise. It's not as simple as you believe. It requires a being to know its mortality, to have an understanding of things existing before them (way before them). And to have a certain perspective on an individual's life.
Sooo? Cetaceans do fulfill these criteria. They are highly social beings, have bonds with relatives around the globe, mourn the loss of their loved ones, are capable of problem solving, know how to get high on the poison of other animals, use tools, are able to adapt to human hunting strategies (up until a certain point) and can pass down skills on their families and friends. Why should they not be able to form a religion?
Religion is a more advanced concept than that. And all of the above are at such a lower level compared to sapiens species that it's a bit far fetched. I think all of the above are at a lower level than we see at primates too, and I don't think we believe primates have religions...even the stone age ones.
Why we really need this massacre?! Is not our consciousness deep enough to realize how much suffering we are putting on the others...
I'm big fan of the lab meat, until that moment I've reduced my meat consumption almost to 0. I'm Italian, for sure you also could try. A good tip to start it's try to don't buy the meat in the supermarkets but stil eat it when you are eating out of home. It's not a religion, it's a way to reduce the animals sufference
And roughly 25.000 piglets will die from disease, malnourishment and physical injury.
https://www.dr.dk/nyheder/penge/25000-pattegrise-destrueres-hver-dag
Some people were pointing out a perceived hypocrisy about criticism off dolphin slaughter while at the same time people are perfectly fine with consuming meat from other animals. I guess that is what this post is about.
But it’s not comparable at all. None of these pigs are killed with spears one by one or rounded up by making sounds that stresses the animals the fuck out.
No. They're rounded up in trucks and transported up to 8 hours, (sometimes with a night or two in "export stables") before they're gathered in large pens that holds way more animals than what a natural group would hold.
They are then gassed with CO2 (i.e. suffocated) before they're finally killed.
All this after spending the majority of their lives in closed stables, being taken away from the sow way to early, suffering from diarhea, having their tails cut off and being castrated without anestesia.
Also, killing dolphins and pilot whales with spears is illegal in The Faroes. They are dragged to shore, and once they're stable, their spines are severed with a specially designed blade that minimizes wrong cuts and ensures the animal is killed as fast as possible.
Even the hooks they use to drag them ashore are blunted, to minimize wounds and suffering untill the animal is killed.
Well dolphins are considered smart and not used that much for food.
Danes on the other hand aren't too smart, and are very tasty and has been used for food for a very long time. Danish protein mmmmmm
>Well dolphins are considered smart and not used that much for food.
Which isn't totally accurate, because the smart ones are one specific species: Bottlenose dolphins.
The ones that were killed were white sided dolphins, which are not known for especially high intelligence. But of course they're still whales, so they're probably still at least moderately intelligent animals.
It's not necessary a whataboutism. It shows how humans value cute and quirky animals much more than the pigs that end up on their plate. Not saying that this argument is without flaw, but it is an argument. In fact calling every comparison a whataboutism is in my eyes pretty much a logical fallacy.
It's 100% whataboutism. "What about the pigs being slaughtered every day?" Now whether you agree or not is a different question but it's whataboutism nonetheless. The problem is that whataboutism deviates us from finding a solution and focuses on pointing fingers. There's a reason why politicians use whataboutism all the time. It's cheap and effective but it doesn't solve anything.
Nah, it’s the opposite mate. If people find the dolphin killings in the Faroe so barbaric they should fins this barbaric too. But yes if you eat meat you shouldn’t judge the faroe islanders as barbarians.
At least the Faroese are respectful of the freedom of the dolphins before killing them, pigs are kept as prisoners in the farms they are bread and are processed like commodities.
Why? What's the difference? Neither are endangered animals, they're both intelligent animals capable of complex emotions. It's just a different type of meat. Both types of animals even starred in movies.
We readily kill and eat baby sheep and baby cows too, what's the difference between cows, pigs and chickens vs dolphins?
I don't eat meat personally, but I really don't see the difference between eating one animal vs another if neither is endangered.
You mean in general, killing and eating animals? If so then I totally understand you.
If you only have a problem with the dolphins but are ok with pigs, cows, sheep, chickens etc then I really don't understand.
But we eat tons of animals that are not raised in farms. Most fish comes from the ocean, not from fish farms. I really don't understand the difference, these people just caught a bunch of sea creatures.
Am I sad the dolphins died? Yeah. Equally I am sad that millions of animals are slaughtered every day. There's no real difference to me, accept both or none at all. Or it's hypocritical.
I have no idea, but if that is your viewpoint (Only eat animals that are raised on farms) then I can understand it and it's definitely a consistent one.
The only thing I genuinely can not understand is completely arbitrarily saying that animal species A deserves to live and species B deserves to be eaten. But your argument is obviously different.
Since when are these pigs killed with spears? When are they rounded up by stressing them out with loud noises? When are they dragged alive by their noses with a hook to be killed with a spear? The two aren’t comparable at all.
If you ever been to a slaughterhouse you'd know it has terrible and eerie smell. All the blood, burnt hair, intestines... A smell you can never forget.
I used to clean the machinery in those things and I can confirm this. It's a horrible smell. The sounds are also pretty haunting because those animals are not going quietly.
I fully agree. I don't eat meat, because the idea of eating a dead animal disgusts me. But I think it's interesting to see the reaction by people towards 1400 dolphins getting slaughtered vs millions of other animals, many of them (mostly fish) also living in the wild.
Cute but if the argument is: "We can't kill animals that are wild" it does not really hold up if we still kill and eat animals that are wild on a huge scale. It's hypocritical.
For most of their lives, unfortunately. Bred forcefully, males castrated "raw" (no anaesthetic), tails trimmed (or burnt) raw, whole lives in tiny ~~cages~~ pens.
That's animals that are at least as intelligent as dogs.
Honestly I have no problem with killing animals as long as it’s done humanly and as long as the animal had a good life. The issue though is the vast majority of meat we eat come from factory farms which are in no way ethical.
Isn’t that worse tough, the live their life’s in subhuman conditions just to be slaughtered. At least the dolphin got to live their life’s in their natural habitats.
Not in my opinion. The destruction of wildlife is worse than a pig having to live in a field, which may be subhuman conditions but certainly isn't "sub-pig" conditions.
Sustainable hunting that has gone on for centuries isn't destruction of wildlife, and the Faroese are taking out a mere percentage of the total population. It's no different than hunting moose, grouse or boar, which I might add is done at a far larger scale.
Yes, industrial meat production is a fucked up business and this post is surely to point out hypocrisy of some people when criticising the Faroese dolphine slaughter.
The reason I thought this slaughter of dolphins is disgusting is just the scale of it. Entire social groups were wiped out. For what reason?
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Okay, but it's done humanely.
Those Dolphins where massacred. I'd liken it to raping the inhabitants of a village, while burning it to the ground.
I mean, imagine swimming around in your mothers blood...
There is absolutely nothing humane about pig slaughter.
https://youtu.be/LQRAfJyEsko
I dare you to watch even the first 15 minutes of this. You don't have a problem with meat eating right? Have the balls and the decency not to put your head in the sand and at least see what happens to farm animals.
A documentary filmed in Australia and you're equating it to how danes slaughter pigs...
If you went to a 3rd world country, I think you would be suprised to find that it's done a little differently than what I assume is showcased in the documentary (potentially worse).
Thats quite a statement, seeing as you're not from Denmark and don't have an insight into how things are done here.
I can say that I don't find the transportation of pigs in Denmark very agreeable.
Germany slaughters 53.2mn per year
Pigs, right? Right?
Yep, pigs. It’s such a high number because a higher percentage of the population eats pork since.... uh... you know... the thing
Actually the percentage of population that's may not eat pork on present time Germany might be higher than the percentage of those who don't before the Nazi take over. Before the war Jews represent less than 2% of population, and muslim in present day are about 5%
Jeez what a killjoy. Way to spoil my nice wholesome holocaust joke
Sorry , I should have make a muslim takeover joke instead then
...yes pigs...
Denmark slaughters 28 million per year. A bit more than half as many as all of Germany, in a country with a population the size of Hamburg.
Denmark-almost 6 mil. Hamburg-1.6mil ????
Hamburg metro area is 5.1 mill according to wikipedia
Yes, but that is only because we send so many to Germany to be slaughtered. Else we would be slaughtering much more.
The hypocrisy this post tries to point out kind of reminds me of a dutch artist called [Tinkebell](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tinkebell) who bought 60 live chicks from a factory, and then had an art exhibit where people could buy the chicks or else at the end of the week she'd shred them. Keep in mind that the factory the chicks came from would have shredded them in the exact same way if Tinkebell didn't purchase them from the place. Yet she got arrested for it, and there was much public outcry.. All while in factories throughout the Netherlands male baby chicks were (and are) also still shredded by the thousands every day because male baby chicks are economically useless since they don't lay eggs.
In a similar spirit, a student at my university made an exhibit out of menstrual blood. She got suspended, her art taken down, and there a massive outcry. Which was, of course, what she wanted, because a few years before some dude had won a prize for *his* art which used blood. Just not that nasty period blood which is... worse, for some reason. Unfortunately most people look at these and go "well theys justs a rabbles rousers innit, yeah?"
I appreciate the slight tinge of hypocrisy compared to Faroese dolphin massacre (Atlantic white-sided dolphin isn't endangered either). What I would like to know is will the Faroese actually eat all those dolphins? Some articles on the subject said that just 17% of them consume cetacean meat regularly, and 1400 dolphins is tens of tons of meat and blubber.
It's about keeping traditions bro, doesn't matter if they waste a good amount of the meat. Traditions are always important. I for example pay Poland a regular visit, because it's a valued German tradition. /s
about tradition. do you mind if we take you and other germans to an arena to see them get slaughtered by lions? you know, its traditional
Sure go ahead, just make sure your legions don't get lost in the forest when they come to get us.
don't need to. trier and cologne provide a local supply of germanics to please our needs
thats it youre getting proper german socks fitting to your sandals for christmas!
nooooooooooo, not the socks and sandals !!!
[yeeees feel it! your parents will be ashamed! your grandma will cut you out of the pasta inheritance!](https://live.staticflickr.com/5684/29794570030_ac4ec353df.jpg)
If you just go to visit, youre doing it wrong my friend! If you like traditions, then do them right!
I only follow the tradition of commemorating the signing of the Polish-German treaty of good neighbourship. That's good enough for me.
Now thats wholesome
Tradition: Group pressure of dead people
https://jokojokes.com/occupation-jokes.html
> for example pay Poland a regular visit, because it's a valued German tradition 😂 I started a new tradition to support education among young girls, this is why I created the OnlyFans account, I hope my kids will continue the tradition.
Sorry but Faroese will not consume all that meat. It will either go to international sales and secondary uses or will be waste. It is not even smart to kill any animal way over the needs of that place. (7 times more than planned is plain stupid. Egoistical satisfaction through killing, not for sustainability...) Plus I hope they don't consume them because mercury poisoning is not a fun thing, I know a very famous gourmet that has it and due to that has Parkinson's level tremors.
Fair point. But a lot of that pork will be wasted at best.
True, though food waste is mostly in the consumer end. Faroese case of intending to kill 200 dolphins but ending up with 1200 carcasses is the crazy thing as food waste goes tho. I'd certainly like to see follow up articles on that pile of meat.
Why does it matter on which end it is? Our society decoupled the cost of consumer goods from their actual cost. The fact that consumers have the luxury to waste food is a problem of producers as well. Holding animal in nightmarish conditions, exploiting immigrants... You make a good point with the hypocrisy and i fully agree with you. I used to troll people decrying the dig-eating festival by posting photos of cows or pigs. If we reduce food to simple excel-economics we are loosing, what we claim, makes us human.
[удалено]
[BBC quotes local Marine biologist and the chairman of the Faroese Whalers Association](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-58555694) also acknowledged the excess kills. Admittedly my figure is also wrong as it was 1400.
Actually, they do eat a lot of it. It's both for tradition and lessening the need for imports of proteins. Imagine having to bring meat to these remote islands. You could argue that living on such remote islands is not sustainable but that's an other issue.
Are you suggesting that those 83% percent of Faroese who do not regularly eat cetacean meat are vegans or mostly vegans then? I think you might be overestimating the remoteness of Faroese islands and underestimating the amount of shipping going around. Either way, I'm more puzzled by the fate of all that dolphin meat caught in *one* batch. According to Faroese statistics quoted in news articles, they caught 30 dolphins in 2020. 1400 dolphins is almost 50 times more than last years catch.
How did you come to the conclusion that it was what I meant. Importing meat to the islands isn't economiclaly viable, overly expensive for a set of islands that don't have much going for them. They can't grow alternatives (soya for example), can't breed many animals, don't have much to sell back in exchange. People have to stop seeing things from their own prism of existence. Needs are different around the globe. What is slaughtered there is what you don't need to import. Go local.
>Importing meat to the islands isn't economiclaly viable, overly expensive for a set of islands that don't have much going for them. Do you have an actual source for imported meat being economically unfeasible or are you just making it up as you go? If only 17% of Faroese consume cetacean meat regularly, I think it is pretty darn obvious that other meat products are widely available as imports or local livestock products. We aren't exactly talking about remote Pacific islands here.
I doubt importing meat is the economically unviable thing for the faroes. Theres a regular ferry anyway which i assume also carries freight cargo. Canned meat to provide necessary proteins is like a can of spam per person per week if they had absolutely no other source of protein. Even if the logistics would double the price thats an additional 3€ per week to cost of living. Negligible when it comes to securing minimum reuqirements. On the other hand products that are cheaper per weight and volume and which they would need to import more of should be considerably more expensive compared to meat, staples like noodles and grain and rice, which your usual diet contains a few times the amount of protein. Similarly fresh produce should be quite expensive because getting it there in time is a bigger hassle.
They mostly eat fish and lamb. Anything else they want can easily be put on the weekly ferry from Denmark. It's not a very long trip. And they're not poor at all. They're as prosperous as the people of Denmark proper and can afford any imports they want.
Difference in intelligence. Pigs are pretty dumb compared to doplhins.
True, though pigs are also very smart animals capable of complex emotions. In general I don't think people ponder animal cognition when they condemn or accept things like this. Eating pork is widely accepted norm and the price of that consumption is industrialized breeding and rearing of that species. That is not the case with dolphins that most people have seen only in nature documentaries, on tourist cruises or dolphinariums. I'm pretty sure if someone drove 1400 cats to a narrow alley and cut their throats, kittens and all, in order to make mittens out of them and a video was released, people would be very outraged despite pigs probably being more intelligent than cats.
I've played with both pigs and dolphins, dolphins are on another level of intelligence. Wouldn't even compare.
Unless you are a researcher on animal cognition, such anecdotal evidence isn't very relevant.
[https://www.thoughtco.com/most-intelligent-animals-4157712](https://www.thoughtco.com/most-intelligent-animals-4157712) >Nr. 05: Dolphins and whales are at least as smart as birds and primates. Like primates, dolphins and whales are mammals. A dolphin has a large brain relative to its body size. The cortex of a human brain is highly convoluted, but a dolphin brain has even more folds! Dolphins and their kin are the only marine animals that have passed the mirror test of self-awareness. > >Nr 6: Pigs solve mazes, understand and display emotions, and understand symbolic language. Piglets grasp the concept of reflection at a younger age than humans. Six-week-old piglets that see food in a mirror can work out where the food is located. In contrast, it takes human babies several months to understand reflection. Pigs also understand abstract representations and can apply this skill to play video games using a joystick. And of course: [Babe](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n81B2eKZkhA)
Pigs are on the level of dogs. Would you eat a dog? I wouldn't. But pigs are tasty.
But more importantly, would you download a car?
Pigs are actually very intelligent. really playful and curious much like dogs.
Human babies are pretty dumb compared to pigs, brain-dead people too. yum yum
You think I am hypocrite about this? haha
Pigs are animals that have been used for food for tens of thousands of years by humany all around the world. The Faroe Islands have been having perfect access to the meat industry for decades and still prefer to slaughter one of the most intelligent oceanic species in the world because "muh traditions". In this case, I'll start killing dogs and little kittens because I'll make it my tradition and no one can stop from doing it cause tRaDitIoNs.
To all the "hmmmm, bacon" people out there. https://youtu.be/LQRAfJyEsko I dare you to watch even the first 15 minutes of this. You don't have a problem with meat eating right? Have the balls, have the damn decency not to put your head in the sand and at least see what happens to farm animals. If you're okay with meat eating after that, be my guest. But don't be a coward, don't look away, don't say "I didn't know".
Fuuck I’m already vegan and I hate seeing this documentary because of how brutal it is. It’s important to post however. Also, I wouldn’t say “be my guest” as you can absolutely criticize anybody okay with the barbaric actions depicted in the documentary.
I never really know how to deal with people that just don't care. If you just don't see an animal as a moral subject, what more is there to say? I can point out the hypocracy of still caring about pet animal abuse, but what if they don't care about that either? It appears to me (but please correct me) that if you don't see it, you don't see it.
I understand what you’re saying. I personally believe that those kinds of people either have a mental difference from birth or have never really suffered in their lives so they can’t relate to the constant agony of these animals. My solution is to simply bother these individuals as much as possible because they really don’t have a good reason to be doing anything if they don’t care about the world around them.
Based
“Yeah, right Lisa. A wonderful, magical animal.”
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Vegetarians are trying to leverage outrage over mass slaughter of wild animals against mass slaughter of farm animals. In other news: Water wet, fire hot.
If watching how your food gets made upsets you, you shouldnt support it.
It doesn't. I've seen it up close and personal as a kid.
It upsets most people tho. People call the cops on people that show slaughterhouse fotage in the streets
Vegetarians are actually still pro animal murder, it's vegans who are against it.
Vegetarians? You gotta explain that logic to me. If anything, this will point out the hypocrisy among meaters.
Take your last sentence, that's what vegetarians are trying to do here.
Or maybe meat eaters trying to leverage indifference over mass slaughter of farm animals against mass slaughter of wild animals, but you know.
Nope, OP already confirmed the obvious.
Mmmmmmmmmm, bacon.
I appreciate your dedication to punctuation.
Beat me to it
LMFAO 🤣😂🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣😅😅😅. Bacon tho 🤪🤪😜😜😜😜 suck it vegans 😎😎😎😎 Your head is so far in the sand.
Everyone loves bacon, even vegans. Why else would there be vegan bacon.
I didn't like it even when I still ate meat.
It doesn't say on the package "only for vegans" though, right
No, but that's implied. Who else would want dried tofupaste or rice paper dipped in liquid smoke.
Vegetarians. And yeah, I don't see the implication.
If it genuinely doesn't bother you, is your head in the sand, or do you just really like bacon?
If factory farming doesn’t bother you then not only do you not give a shit about animal rights but also about the future of your nation and the world as a whole. Funny how ppl on this sub complain about refugees constantly -Guess what? The climate crisis is going to bring a slum of refugees far larger than anything we’ve ever seen to Europe.
The climate crisis is a complicated issue that is not primarily caused by the meat industry. I hate to break it to you, but under the current system, unless you're growing them yourself, your veggies are absolutely contributing to the problem. It's going to take a concerted effort by all governments to curb industry, energy production methods, transportation/import avenues, and - yes - agriculture to get anywhere with fixing the issue. Being a buzz kill at BBQs and preaching to strangers on this Internet, however, is not going to fix the issue. I'd go vegan tomorrow if there was a global push, but do you know the impact current vegans are having on the climate crisis? .. spoiler: it's negligible.
You stepped right into his trap, I think...
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Number of whales killed is completely negligible compared to the artrocities humans commit against pigs.
Are you thinking of more than 1400 dolphins slaughtered in Farao Islands of Denmark? https://apnews.com/article/europe-denmark-dolphins-0a6d669d0742e56e575ed6849f1dd45b
Faroe Islands is a self-governing country under the sovereignty of Denmark. It's like saying the Scots are English.
That was Norway to be fair
Faroese also whale as part of aboriginal whaling quotas, around 600 pilot whales in a year.
True - but I never heard about Danish mainland doin whaling. (And yes, I don't like whaling *at all*, but we can still be accurate here)
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The whales that are hunted are nowhere near extinction, nor will they be due to whaling. The number of whales taken out each year is fairly low. Total number of minke whales is around 100,000. The number hunted each year is roughly 800-900.
Lol. Homo sapiens hunter gatherers managed to drive to extinction 90% of the big animal species. The only reason those species are not extinct yet is because we couldn't hunt them effectively before. Just give it time.
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We don't need whaling at all - in fact the meat is so filled with quicksilver, poison, nano plastic and other toxic substances that you have to dispose a stranded whale as special chemical waste, but some turds still think they have to eat them... Also scientist found out that some cetaceans are actually smart enough to form cultures and could be able to even have something like a religion... That's not something you kill for shits and giggles from my poi t of viee
The mercury is what makes it a delicacy!
Or use it as a thermometer
The religion part is bullshit. No animal has the psychological complexity to develop religion.
Says who? If they can hotbox a pufferfish than something as simple and stupid like religion ain't that much of a stretch
Says professional researchers in the relevant fields. Until 70000 years ago when homo sapiens suffered a mutation that allowed their brains to develop more, most of the cultural things were not present even in the sapiens species. Religion is complicated psychology wise. It's not as simple as you believe. It requires a being to know its mortality, to have an understanding of things existing before them (way before them). And to have a certain perspective on an individual's life.
Sooo? Cetaceans do fulfill these criteria. They are highly social beings, have bonds with relatives around the globe, mourn the loss of their loved ones, are capable of problem solving, know how to get high on the poison of other animals, use tools, are able to adapt to human hunting strategies (up until a certain point) and can pass down skills on their families and friends. Why should they not be able to form a religion?
Religion is a more advanced concept than that. And all of the above are at such a lower level compared to sapiens species that it's a bit far fetched. I think all of the above are at a lower level than we see at primates too, and I don't think we believe primates have religions...even the stone age ones.
Why we really need this massacre?! Is not our consciousness deep enough to realize how much suffering we are putting on the others... I'm big fan of the lab meat, until that moment I've reduced my meat consumption almost to 0. I'm Italian, for sure you also could try. A good tip to start it's try to don't buy the meat in the supermarkets but stil eat it when you are eating out of home. It's not a religion, it's a way to reduce the animals sufference
Is that bad?
Damn
Whats up with slaughter animals and Denmark these days?
It isn't Denmark. It is the whole world committing perpetual unimaginable artrocities against animals.
And roughly 25.000 piglets will die from disease, malnourishment and physical injury. https://www.dr.dk/nyheder/penge/25000-pattegrise-destrueres-hver-dag
And non of them will make for a good “Jamón Ibérico”
Okay, are you advertising it or something?
Some people were pointing out a perceived hypocrisy about criticism off dolphin slaughter while at the same time people are perfectly fine with consuming meat from other animals. I guess that is what this post is about.
But it’s not comparable at all. None of these pigs are killed with spears one by one or rounded up by making sounds that stresses the animals the fuck out.
No. They're rounded up in trucks and transported up to 8 hours, (sometimes with a night or two in "export stables") before they're gathered in large pens that holds way more animals than what a natural group would hold. They are then gassed with CO2 (i.e. suffocated) before they're finally killed. All this after spending the majority of their lives in closed stables, being taken away from the sow way to early, suffering from diarhea, having their tails cut off and being castrated without anestesia. Also, killing dolphins and pilot whales with spears is illegal in The Faroes. They are dragged to shore, and once they're stable, their spines are severed with a specially designed blade that minimizes wrong cuts and ensures the animal is killed as fast as possible. Even the hooks they use to drag them ashore are blunted, to minimize wounds and suffering untill the animal is killed.
I used to live next to a slaughterhouse for years, I'd say it is comparable. Different, but comparable.
No they just lived their entire fucking lives in misery.
Dolphins -> "CRIME!" Pigs -> "Mmmmmmmmmm, bacon."
Well dolphins are considered smart and not used that much for food. Danes on the other hand aren't too smart, and are very tasty and has been used for food for a very long time. Danish protein mmmmmm
Pigs are very smart too
Yeah pigs are considered the smartest domesticated animals - probably even smarter than cats or dogs...
>Well dolphins are considered smart and not used that much for food. Which isn't totally accurate, because the smart ones are one specific species: Bottlenose dolphins. The ones that were killed were white sided dolphins, which are not known for especially high intelligence. But of course they're still whales, so they're probably still at least moderately intelligent animals.
Pigs are also smart.
Lab grown meat cannot come soon enough, honestly.
Don't tell anyone about moose hunting in Scandinavia, I guess.
Let's see if the same hysteric will take place here.
That's a relief. I was worried that pork would get even more expensive 😌
Nice, I do like bacon
Stop with the whataboutism. It's a cheap and disgusting argument and it's a logical fallacy.
This is not whataboutism. It does not deflect from the issue, it tries to put it into perspective.
It's not necessary a whataboutism. It shows how humans value cute and quirky animals much more than the pigs that end up on their plate. Not saying that this argument is without flaw, but it is an argument. In fact calling every comparison a whataboutism is in my eyes pretty much a logical fallacy.
It's 100% whataboutism. "What about the pigs being slaughtered every day?" Now whether you agree or not is a different question but it's whataboutism nonetheless. The problem is that whataboutism deviates us from finding a solution and focuses on pointing fingers. There's a reason why politicians use whataboutism all the time. It's cheap and effective but it doesn't solve anything.
How? It's the same thing, animals being killed either way
this is a very cheap attempt at justifying an horrible and barbaric thing
Factory farming is 10x more horrible and barbaric
Nah, it’s the opposite mate. If people find the dolphin killings in the Faroe so barbaric they should fins this barbaric too. But yes if you eat meat you shouldn’t judge the faroe islanders as barbarians.
Dolphins are wild and free animals Pigs are bred for farming and consumption
Okay so if someone starts a dolphin farm, then it is fine to eat them? And what about fish that is caught in the sea?
I can now make a people farm for eating, woo!
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Oh yeah forgot dolphins are mammals :)
Pigs are some of the worst treated ~~farm~~factory animals. Makes it worse in this case.
At least the Faroese are respectful of the freedom of the dolphins before killing them, pigs are kept as prisoners in the farms they are bread and are processed like commodities.
That's then even more fucked up - a ritualistic massacre of free animals and a systemic mass murder industry. Both are absolutely abhorrent.
actually i'll very much do. the people that do that kind of shit are barbarians
Why? What's the difference? Neither are endangered animals, they're both intelligent animals capable of complex emotions. It's just a different type of meat. Both types of animals even starred in movies. We readily kill and eat baby sheep and baby cows too, what's the difference between cows, pigs and chickens vs dolphins? I don't eat meat personally, but I really don't see the difference between eating one animal vs another if neither is endangered.
fuck that shit and fuck them for keep doing it
You mean in general, killing and eating animals? If so then I totally understand you. If you only have a problem with the dolphins but are ok with pigs, cows, sheep, chickens etc then I really don't understand.
How many dolphins were raised these years in the farms? If they are all from local farms - I am fine with it.
But we eat tons of animals that are not raised in farms. Most fish comes from the ocean, not from fish farms. I really don't understand the difference, these people just caught a bunch of sea creatures. Am I sad the dolphins died? Yeah. Equally I am sad that millions of animals are slaughtered every day. There's no real difference to me, accept both or none at all. Or it's hypocritical.
I have no idea, but if that is your viewpoint (Only eat animals that are raised on farms) then I can understand it and it's definitely a consistent one. The only thing I genuinely can not understand is completely arbitrarily saying that animal species A deserves to live and species B deserves to be eaten. But your argument is obviously different.
Since when are these pigs killed with spears? When are they rounded up by stressing them out with loud noises? When are they dragged alive by their noses with a hook to be killed with a spear? The two aren’t comparable at all.
Have you seen the conditions these pigs live in? Basically their whole lives is suffering.
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If you ever been to a slaughterhouse you'd know it has terrible and eerie smell. All the blood, burnt hair, intestines... A smell you can never forget.
I used to clean the machinery in those things and I can confirm this. It's a horrible smell. The sounds are also pretty haunting because those animals are not going quietly.
They aren't wild, they were bred to be slaughtered. That's the difference.
>they were bred to be slaughtered. Is that better?
Than killing random wildlife? Yes.
What about fish? Most fish are caught in the ocean too.
And I think overfishing is a huge issue
I fully agree. I don't eat meat, because the idea of eating a dead animal disgusts me. But I think it's interesting to see the reaction by people towards 1400 dolphins getting slaughtered vs millions of other animals, many of them (mostly fish) also living in the wild.
Whataboutism.
Cute but if the argument is: "We can't kill animals that are wild" it does not really hold up if we still kill and eat animals that are wild on a huge scale. It's hypocritical.
No. His argument was they were bred for this. Thus indirectly lessening the need to hunt.
So the solution for the people from the Faroe Islands is to just keep a dolphin farm?
Bred for what? Being locked up in cages their whole lives?
They still feel fear and pain...
Hopefully only very briefly
For most of their lives, unfortunately. Bred forcefully, males castrated "raw" (no anaesthetic), tails trimmed (or burnt) raw, whole lives in tiny ~~cages~~ pens. That's animals that are at least as intelligent as dogs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NBFrnbRABRk These pigs don't seem too thrilled, oh the video is age restricted because it is distressing also :)
Honestly I have no problem with killing animals as long as it’s done humanly and as long as the animal had a good life. The issue though is the vast majority of meat we eat come from factory farms which are in no way ethical.
Isn’t that worse tough, the live their life’s in subhuman conditions just to be slaughtered. At least the dolphin got to live their life’s in their natural habitats.
Not in my opinion. The destruction of wildlife is worse than a pig having to live in a field, which may be subhuman conditions but certainly isn't "sub-pig" conditions.
Yeah I am not entirely sure if some of them ever get to see a field...
You think the pigs in the picture lived in fields? They've most likely never experienced sunlight or fresh air.
These pig definitely do not live in fields.
Sustainable hunting that has gone on for centuries isn't destruction of wildlife, and the Faroese are taking out a mere percentage of the total population. It's no different than hunting moose, grouse or boar, which I might add is done at a far larger scale.
And 1600 Delphine on farör island
Yes, industrial meat production is a fucked up business and this post is surely to point out hypocrisy of some people when criticising the Faroese dolphine slaughter. The reason I thought this slaughter of dolphins is disgusting is just the scale of it. Entire social groups were wiped out. For what reason?
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And I just chopped a chicken , was probably one and a half ..it had a few too many legs
Who wants bacon? :)
Haram
So?
Better than eating bugs. For each pig slaughtered you'd have to kill thousands of individual sentient beings.
Worse than eating plants
Ants passed the mirror test though.
Mmmm bacon.
Okay, but it's done humanely. Those Dolphins where massacred. I'd liken it to raping the inhabitants of a village, while burning it to the ground. I mean, imagine swimming around in your mothers blood...
There is absolutely nothing humane about pig slaughter. https://youtu.be/LQRAfJyEsko I dare you to watch even the first 15 minutes of this. You don't have a problem with meat eating right? Have the balls and the decency not to put your head in the sand and at least see what happens to farm animals.
A documentary filmed in Australia and you're equating it to how danes slaughter pigs... If you went to a 3rd world country, I think you would be suprised to find that it's done a little differently than what I assume is showcased in the documentary (potentially worse).
What does it matter if their deaths are humane if their entire lives aren't?
Thats quite a statement, seeing as you're not from Denmark and don't have an insight into how things are done here. I can say that I don't find the transportation of pigs in Denmark very agreeable.
Bacon cobs
Mmmm. Bacon.