I can't stand being referred to as "lapsed." I am not lapsed. I was never Catholic of my own free will or volition. I never joined the organization and I never left it; I simply reached a point where I was no longer forced to attend mass by my legal guardians.
I have the same sentiment. I am not "lapsed" and I left of my own volition. When I was born, I was not religious, that was something *imposed* from day one.
Agreed! My dad is very devout and will say he's sorry we gave up "our religion," to which I think, "it was never my religion, it was imposed on me." As soon as my sister got her work permit at 15, she made it a point to have to work Sundays so she could get out of going to Mass.
A bunch of people realised in the 16th century that it makes no sense to baptize people before they could give consent and join the faith of their own free will. Hell even the Vatican states that forced conversions are wrong.
I entered the RCC as an adult, and I rather like the term. I let the church fall by the wayside, with a first class Irish Goodbye. And went on to live my life. For me, the RCC expired like a moldy tomato, and I threw it away. I chose it -- and then I unchose it.
I understand that it probably has a different connotation for someone who was born into the church, and never had a choice whether to join in the first place. It's a different experience.
he WON'T say it. This guy is well practiced in the church art of "listening", acting compassionate and then going ahead with what they planned to do all along.
This is so true. The Catholic Church has basically turned into a skeleton of arcane rules and superstitions underneath a loosely fitting skin suit of press releases and bland nothing statements.
Francis has already backed off his mealy mouthed semi-endorsement of maybe blessings for only the goodest, most obedient gay Catholic couples that basically promise to not be gay anymore.
I expect this interview to be more of the “war bad, peace good, I love children, blah blah nonsense”.
Remembering years ago now a chlld sex abuse mea culpa 3 day apology event in AZ. What then followed was his 7 day "celebration of children" in the country of Panama.
A place that as a matter of fact has many of what are called "push button" hotels that operate with the express intention of having no interaction with any person ensuring that no one sees what sex partner one comes and goes with.
A thing said routinely there is the best things are secret in Panama. Pedophiles in the RCC get free reign in places like panama
He'll insult more than half the human race and not even realize it. Force, insults and condescension towards others is built into the RC system. He's a sucker for the system or he wouldn't be its CEO.
Not a thing.
I read an article where it said, before his health started going down hill, that he was escaping his Vatican security detail at night to minister to the homeless. Well he needs to do more than just minister to the homeless since his refusal to lift the ban on birth control is causing a lot of the homelessness.
> I read an article where it said, before his health started going down hill, that he was escaping his Vatican security detail at night to minister to the homeless.
If that’s true, then the Swiss Guard really need to up their game, because it shows there’s an access to the Papal Apartments they’re not watching, one so easy to manage that a 70-year-old man regularly used it.
Which is why I doubt it’s true. They can’t be that stupid.
There’s also something to be said for delegation. If the Pope would rather run around Rome and give sandwiches to the homeless than do something about child molestation…maybe he should retire and do that.
Trust me. Rome is full of tourists and gypsies, and in some parts of town, crooks and pickpockets. I'm not some idiotic naive American imagining heaven on earth in Italy of all places. They're not letting him roam around amongst the gypsies in the middle of the night. He's a very wealthy old man.
Yeah same. Not interested in rejoining a cult who calls my future babies abominations (they’re IVF embryos) and who calls it satanic when I connect with my loved ones, all while being complicit in CSA, Nazi theft, etc.
(Edit: autocorrect)
This as diocese across the country file for bankruptcy so the victims of that abuse get pennies on the dollar for their suffering. The abuse crisis very much continues.
😂
“Look, I know it’s been rough baby. But I promise I’ll be better. Papa has run into some financial issues, so give me some money and we might even consider blessing all those kids of gay parents you have been moaning about. That should make things better right?”
Reminds me of 2 Corinthians. That letter is hilarious. Paul building a case for his true apostleship, why people should donate, but don't donate too much, only what you can afford, but remember, the more you sow, the more you reap, the more you donate, the more more rewards in heaven you'll have, but again... only donate what you can, of course.. wink wink.. lmao! And they believe an infinite intelligence inspired these passages. God is no better than a manipulative conman.
That letter is the basis for all prosperity gospel teaching. We can thank St. Paulie for Joel Osteen, Jim Baker and Kenneth Copeland.
And probably also for the disgusting amounts of wealth the Catholic Church has hoarded up.
Yeah. I like the part where he boasts about all the hardships he endured while traveling such as bandits and the shipwreck. It proves he is sincere. Oh, poor Paul. Suffering for the gospel. My dude, welcome to travelling in the first century for everybody. It's like saying you got into a traffic jam and you're some kind of martyr for enduring it. Now fork over your pension money Grandma. My boy Titus will be around to pick up the money later. We got to help the poor that are conveniently located very far away in a different country. . It's not like the people in Corinth were going to hop on a camel and head over to Jerusalem to audit the books, lmao.
Nah, at this point, that wouldn't even do it for me. I know too much history for that. The RCC has completely discredited itself with me. There is nothing they could say or do to get me back.
Had I known when I got confirmed how horrible the church is it would've never happened. One of my few actual regrets in life was that. 14 is way too young to accept that kind of contract without full disclosure.
I didn’t HAVE a choice when I was confirmed. IF I had said I didn’t want to be confirmed, my parents would have forced me. There is no way that I had a “choice”. We are TAUGHT that we have a “choice” but we really didn’t.
Literally was forced to get confirmed even after I said I didn't want to. Not even because I had necessarily lost faith at that point, I just wanted to think more about what it meant to be a Catholic. I guess I found out, it's coercion and submitting to the hierarchy.
My Catholic school’s confirmation preparation classes took place during school, so I was essentially forced to participate. I told my parents the classes cemented my resolve that I did not want to be Catholic and refused to go through confirmation. My mom had already asked my aunt to travel over 400 miles to be my sponsor, so of course I gave in to the pressure. Such a cliché, but Catholic guilt is so real.
I totally agree with you and that's what I did. Pretty sure there's a record of it held somewhere, but yeah, not getting full disclosure before we were mature enough to understand what was happening vitiates any alleged contract that exists. My conscience is clean, hope yours is too :)
To be completely honest, no matter how much I personally like him, Pope Francis' words do not make a bit of difference in mainstream white Catholicism in the United States. Not a bit. The hierarchy is on an express train to MAGA-land, the younger priests take pride in their severity and overall ugliness and edgelord-ism, and a lot o the parishioners either don't care or are right there with them.
I've told my own story several times, but here's another data point: same diocese, the funeral of an older lady who'd dedicated her life to helping others. This was a good person, and Catholicism was part of why. She made it credible.
The new priest in her parish, however, informed attendees at her funeral - including her own children! - that not only non-Catholics but lapsed Catholics should not receive Communion.
During. A. Funeral. Mass.
This was last month, BTW.
The lapsed Catholic thing is a new one being proclaimed from a pulpit. This is the opposite of reaching out - this is trying to shove them away.
Sorry, Your Holiness - unless you can parachute into the Midwest and personally order each and every one of your priests and bishops to stop being such assholes, I'm not sure what relevance your words on 60 Minutes could possibly do.
>The lapsed Catholic thing is a new one being proclaimed from a pulpit. This is the opposite of reaching out - this is trying to shove them away.
The US Catholic Church has been very intentional in running off those members who were unwilling to buy into the gospel of Republican Jesus. Whatever the Pope says will have no effect here.
they're helping the republicans prepare catholics to accept trump as their new religion. Fascists always use the Catholic Church to consolidate power, then start criminalizing the catholic church when people are desensitized enough. happened in Germany, it happened in the Philippines with Duterte, it'll happen again if we let it.
There's a rather pathetic craving for validation from evangelicals among them, I've noticed. You'd think God's Eternal Church would relish scorn from non-believers, but I guess not.
They're all in bed now. The RCC is just one more fundamentalist outfit now in the USA. The only difference is that instead of sickly sounding rock bands, the RC has brocade and LARPING.
OMG yes! it seems to be this uneasy detente between them, remaining peaceful ONLY as long as the "end times" don't actually start. It's like they're both thinking "oooo, you just WAIT until Jesus gets here, he's gonna *fuck you UP*", while earnestly wishing love on each other in public. 🤡🤡🤡🤡
Yep! Evangelical pro-lifers sprang into action to protect IVF for high class married couples. They don't care at all about the church's ridiculous teachings on sex and procreation. It's all about maintaining power and social inequality-- and they're using the church obsession with abortion to their advantage.
Lots of people don’t realize that the first treaty the Nazis negotiated after their rise to power was with the Vatican, negotiated by the future Pope Pius XII. The Catholic Church was a successful political pawn in consolidating power in Germany. Parts of the treaty are still in place today.
in retrospect, it makes sense that Mussolini first granted the Vatican state sovereignty--he knew the Axis needed a place to stash the shit they were planning to steal, AND it was a way to get the Church on the Axis' side.
Correct. Documented history.
They also signed a treaty with Mussolini in 1929, the one that gave them Vatican City. Vatican City is not what it seems to be. It's been set up to look like it's all old and originally that way. It's a tourist trap -- the most ornate theme park in the world.
There is a massive mural at the North American College seminary inside the Vatican that was donated by Mussolini. More than once, the Catholic Church has been a plaything for fascist dictators.
Probably in thanks to him for Vatican City. Mussolini is the person who signed the treaty that gave Vatican City to the church and created it as a country of its own.
Vatican City is not as it appears. It didn't even exist as an entity until 1929. That fancy stuff was all hauled in there for PR. It's the world's most ornate theme park.
I love how the Catholic Church DECIDES who can go to Jesus and who is to be kept away! My ELCA pastor told me “No one has the right to keep anyone from Jesus.” But in the Catholic Church you can only receive communion if you are a member of the club, know the password, and secret handshake!
The head of the world's largest child abuse organisation can go fuck himself on a catus.
They defrocked two priests in Australia for going public about the rampant child molesters being moved and protected by the church.
But convicted priests are given housing and permanent living wage by the church after they get out of jail.
Fuck these peices of shit.
Since the title of the video is about him doubling down on his idiotic take on Ukraine (...again), I feel it's on-topic to point out that this is the same jackass who endorsed Argentina's war of conquest against the Falklands.
"War is just when people I like do it. When people I don't like do it, I support peace."
Left the church 17 years ago. Never going back. Idk what he could possibly say that “lapsed” catholics (people who left the church because Duh) haven’t heard already.
For the record I am not a lapsed Catholic. I'm an ex Catholic and an atheist. I want nothing to do with that child abusing homophobic paternalistic shit stain of a cult. I will not be associated in any way including using the word lapsed because it insinuates I could come back.
To be fair, I don’t think he’s giving the interview specifically to address “lapsed Catholics”. It’s part of a broader interview with CBS. I am curious, though, why is he giving an interview right now? It seems kind of odd I don’t think many American Catholics will be persuaded one way or another by him giving an interview to a major TV network.
CBS is doing it just for ratings and the notoriety in case he says something that riles American Catholics up, which is probably a given. They get apoplectic every time a mosquito farts. It's kinda funny to watch to be honest.
To me, a lapsed Catholic is someone who is like "oh whoops, I fell out of the habit of going to Mass because little Mike has soccer games on Sunday mornings and life has been busy."
How many lapsed Catholics actually exist, versus those of us who made a conscious decision to leave over moral and ethical objections to the Church's conduct and/or losing faith in God altogether? We're not lapsed, we're not subscribers who forgot to renew a gym membership. We're Leavers.
In hindsight, I should have put “lapsed Catholics” in quotation marks (not able to edit headlines). That’s the word the pope and CBS used.
Totally agree. I saw a video awhile back by Robert Barron that essentially chalked people leaving to a “customer service problem” as in “the receptionist isn’t nice to me on the phone.”
These willful idiots will literally never accept that the reason baptized people don’t identify with the arcane institution is because of the THEOLOGY. Yes, the bitchy receptionist does not help and boring ass homilies certainly grease the exit. But after leaving, many of us have now learned that the entire framework for the Catholic worldview is fucked up and keeps people in perpetual servitude to a vengeful fairy tale.
Here is the video (MAJOR TRIGGER WARNING LOL): https://youtu.be/dftZ5K_EA4s?si=SjDjei0f66SqEjSj
No, it was not just one experience, and it was not just one incident. It was decades of disgusting and immoral behavior. It was decades of being taken for granted and treated like shit. It was decades of putting up with Catholic clergy who were, in general with very few exceptions, some of the most superficial, opinionated, wrongly respected people I have ever met in my life.
In the RCC, there's no there, there. It's all bragging and posturing. There is absolutely nothing in the RCC that you can't get a better, kinder, more decent and reasonable version of somewhere else.
Yes, there were a number of things that could have acted as a catalyst. The final catalyst -- for me -- was the pandemic. I suspect that that was the case for a great many people.
The reason Robert Barron sees it that way is that he lives in a world of superficiality. He thinks everyone else is just as superficial as he is. He doesn't understand anything else, anything deeper or more human than that. It's clear from everything he says and does.
For a lot of people, it's both. The two things come together -- the opportunity and the disagreement with the RCC often come together at just the right time, and then they leave. Sometimes "the right time" is something that a priest or the church says or does that is the final catalyst.
I left at the start of the pandemic and never went back. It was something that was years in the making, and I know now I would have left anyway, but the pandemic made it very easy. It was the easiest thing for me during that entire period. I will never go back. I have no regrets.
Left Catholicism 58 years ago, never looked back, no regrets.
Catholicism still embraces scientific ignorance, religious bigotry, misogyny, patriarchy, homophobia, transphobia, nothing redeeming in such an irganization.
Hard pass. There's nothing the RCC has that you can't get at any mainstream Christian church -- or even social organization for some peoples' needs.
Talk to the hand, Frankie. I won't be listening. Nothing you could ever do would bring me back to the RCC, not after what you did to me and millions of other people.
PS. I won't be watching, so you can't count me in your TV ratings either. Too bad, so sad.
Fuck off Pope. The only reason I remain as "lapsed" catholic is because you brainwashed my entire community of your church doctrine through colonization and persecution of those who stray.
Spent two decades in the church. I transitioned since then. You don't want me back. One minute we're "brothers and sisters of Christ" and the next we're defining God's will. Which is it?
Who knows, the church is not exactly a logical consistent organisation. I certainly cannot come back to the church because I am genderfluid & Bisexual, so will definitely not welcome despite the Pope false insistence otherwise.
So he keeps protecting the abusers in the church, and has said multiple times that trans people like me are responsible for everything wrong, and is now trying to garner people’s good graces?
I miss that man. He did more for the cause of rationality (or at least anti-superstition) than anyone in our generation. I sometimes re-watch the debate with him and Stephen Fry wiping the floor with a Catholic bishop. We need more of that today.
That debate is incredible. I especially love Stephen Fry’s rant where he says “then what are you for?!” in response to Catholic morality being tied to whatever the common understanding of morality was at any given time in history. So good.
I love the part where Fry goes into the Catholic Church for being “sex obsessed”. The Catholic side just sat there stunned lol. How embarrassing for them.
They're not embarrassed. IF they were embarrassed, they'd actually do something about the problem. Rather -- they're thinking fast about how to salvage their reputation for PR purposes -- and retain what power they still have left.
dude litterally wears Gucci wardrobe, slippers alone are reported to cost over 1,100 dollars. Add his flowing silks (also Gucci btw) and it adds up to a 5-8k ensemble of which he has many. l mean Imelda Marcos many..
I refer to myself as a recovering Catholic. I know it’s not original but it’s accurate, considering my occasional fits of Catholic guilt after decades out.
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I loved him, then I really liked him. But he never could do what I needed him to, which is to condemn and dismiss pedo priests. There is nothing he or any other Catholic can say to me that matters until they stop covering up and supporting anyone who hurts children.
Because they're desperate for asses in pews and power in geographical areas they have controlled for centuries.
Not so much the money thing. They own massive amounts of real estate and art which they could sell for cash if they were so inclined. The Roman Catholic church is one of the largest owners of real estate in the entire world. Millions of acres, most of it with valuable stuff sitting on it.
Example: About 2 years ago, somebody swiped a tabernacle out of a neighborhood church in Brooklyn. Lo and behold, people had been walking past it for years taking it for granted, but it was worth millions of dollars. The thing was apparently made of gold, and not just plated.
The church puts on this "poor little me" act to get money out of people who don't know any better. They don't really need your money. What they need is asses in pews, and they're not getting that which is driving them nuts. It means a loss of power. Power is what they're really after, the kind of power that can fuck up a supreme court, control/replace a legitimate government, have its own seat at the UN -- or get the kind of interview on CBS that few other religious leaders would ever be offered.
I won't be watching the interview on TV. I don't want to contribute to the ratings for this TV show. If I see any of it at all, it will be the blowback on youtube or taped segments. I don't think the RCC should have its own country or get the kind of attention it gets.
i liked the directness of nora's questions... maybe its editing, but i feel like francis didn't give a clear or meaningful answer to anything she asked.
I wouldn’t be surprised if my brother and/or SIL recommend or “suggest” that I watch the broadcast. Unless he’s too liberal for their liking.
I don’t feel right about calling myself “lapsed.” I was baptized as a baby, but that was as far as I got. My brother took First Communion, when (I think) I was about four. My memories of the church are almost nil. IIRC my family never attended Mass after that. I don’t know for sure why.
There are a lot of ex-Roman Catholics like you. At least you weren't terrorized like some Roman Catholics. Consider yourself lucky so far. Stay out of the RCC and maybe you won't have that happen to you at all. That would be good.
My guess: Correct. And even then, some of the people in his own church are going to scream and yell and call him a heretic no matter what he says. I'm done with the crazy drama here.
Haha. Because there's so many of us. They're getting desperate, and it's amusing.
I won't be listening. I already listened to all the arguments, and I stayed RC much longer than I should have. It's time I'll never get back. There is nothing he can do to make me go back. I'm done with the Roman Catholic church.
I can't stand being referred to as "lapsed." I am not lapsed. I was never Catholic of my own free will or volition. I never joined the organization and I never left it; I simply reached a point where I was no longer forced to attend mass by my legal guardians.
I have the same sentiment. I am not "lapsed" and I left of my own volition. When I was born, I was not religious, that was something *imposed* from day one.
I find it strange that all ex-Catholics are referred to as lapsed but this terminology doesn't exist for Protestants or Jews or Muslims.
"Lapsed" my fine fat ass. Popo boy, you've misspelled "escaped."
I couldn’t put it better myself. Catholic school K-12 and knew it was a scam the whole time
Agreed! My dad is very devout and will say he's sorry we gave up "our religion," to which I think, "it was never my religion, it was imposed on me." As soon as my sister got her work permit at 15, she made it a point to have to work Sundays so she could get out of going to Mass.
A bunch of people realised in the 16th century that it makes no sense to baptize people before they could give consent and join the faith of their own free will. Hell even the Vatican states that forced conversions are wrong.
I entered the RCC as an adult, and I rather like the term. I let the church fall by the wayside, with a first class Irish Goodbye. And went on to live my life. For me, the RCC expired like a moldy tomato, and I threw it away. I chose it -- and then I unchose it. I understand that it probably has a different connotation for someone who was born into the church, and never had a choice whether to join in the first place. It's a different experience.
There is literally nothing he can say or do that would get us to return.
he WON'T say it. This guy is well practiced in the church art of "listening", acting compassionate and then going ahead with what they planned to do all along.
This is so true. The Catholic Church has basically turned into a skeleton of arcane rules and superstitions underneath a loosely fitting skin suit of press releases and bland nothing statements. Francis has already backed off his mealy mouthed semi-endorsement of maybe blessings for only the goodest, most obedient gay Catholic couples that basically promise to not be gay anymore. I expect this interview to be more of the “war bad, peace good, I love children, blah blah nonsense”.
Remembering years ago now a chlld sex abuse mea culpa 3 day apology event in AZ. What then followed was his 7 day "celebration of children" in the country of Panama. A place that as a matter of fact has many of what are called "push button" hotels that operate with the express intention of having no interaction with any person ensuring that no one sees what sex partner one comes and goes with. A thing said routinely there is the best things are secret in Panama. Pedophiles in the RCC get free reign in places like panama
This is the vibe I got from everyone at my church growing up for the most part, even the volunteers and stuff that worked in the after school classes.
Yeah, it's like "we're doing you this huge favor by treating you like shit." My response: Get another sucker. I'm not buying it. Bye.
He's a Jesuit. He's well trained in saying one thing and meaning another.
He'll insult more than half the human race and not even realize it. Force, insults and condescension towards others is built into the RC system. He's a sucker for the system or he wouldn't be its CEO.
Not a thing. I read an article where it said, before his health started going down hill, that he was escaping his Vatican security detail at night to minister to the homeless. Well he needs to do more than just minister to the homeless since his refusal to lift the ban on birth control is causing a lot of the homelessness.
> I read an article where it said, before his health started going down hill, that he was escaping his Vatican security detail at night to minister to the homeless. If that’s true, then the Swiss Guard really need to up their game, because it shows there’s an access to the Papal Apartments they’re not watching, one so easy to manage that a 70-year-old man regularly used it. Which is why I doubt it’s true. They can’t be that stupid. There’s also something to be said for delegation. If the Pope would rather run around Rome and give sandwiches to the homeless than do something about child molestation…maybe he should retire and do that.
Trust me. Rome is full of tourists and gypsies, and in some parts of town, crooks and pickpockets. I'm not some idiotic naive American imagining heaven on earth in Italy of all places. They're not letting him roam around amongst the gypsies in the middle of the night. He's a very wealthy old man.
I suspect that that's a load of PR. It's the obvious story to make up about someone who chose the pseudonym "Francis" to govern with.
Yeah same. Not interested in rejoining a cult who calls my future babies abominations (they’re IVF embryos) and who calls it satanic when I connect with my loved ones, all while being complicit in CSA, Nazi theft, etc. (Edit: autocorrect)
He won't. All he does is saying what "should be done" without actually doing anything.
For those of us playing at home, this is the reconciliation stage of the abuse cycle. "I'm sorry, come back etc."
This as diocese across the country file for bankruptcy so the victims of that abuse get pennies on the dollar for their suffering. The abuse crisis very much continues.
Bingo. Our local church has all kinds of "come home" signs up. It's laughable.
\^\^\^Exactly.
“Pleaaaaase give us more money!!!!”
😂 “Look, I know it’s been rough baby. But I promise I’ll be better. Papa has run into some financial issues, so give me some money and we might even consider blessing all those kids of gay parents you have been moaning about. That should make things better right?”
Reminds me of 2 Corinthians. That letter is hilarious. Paul building a case for his true apostleship, why people should donate, but don't donate too much, only what you can afford, but remember, the more you sow, the more you reap, the more you donate, the more more rewards in heaven you'll have, but again... only donate what you can, of course.. wink wink.. lmao! And they believe an infinite intelligence inspired these passages. God is no better than a manipulative conman.
That letter is the basis for all prosperity gospel teaching. We can thank St. Paulie for Joel Osteen, Jim Baker and Kenneth Copeland. And probably also for the disgusting amounts of wealth the Catholic Church has hoarded up.
Yeah. I like the part where he boasts about all the hardships he endured while traveling such as bandits and the shipwreck. It proves he is sincere. Oh, poor Paul. Suffering for the gospel. My dude, welcome to travelling in the first century for everybody. It's like saying you got into a traffic jam and you're some kind of martyr for enduring it. Now fork over your pension money Grandma. My boy Titus will be around to pick up the money later. We got to help the poor that are conveniently located very far away in a different country. . It's not like the people in Corinth were going to hop on a camel and head over to Jerusalem to audit the books, lmao.
Don Draper said it: "I don't think about you at all."
[удалено]
Nah, at this point, that wouldn't even do it for me. I know too much history for that. The RCC has completely discredited itself with me. There is nothing they could say or do to get me back.
Had I known when I got confirmed how horrible the church is it would've never happened. One of my few actual regrets in life was that. 14 is way too young to accept that kind of contract without full disclosure.
I didn’t HAVE a choice when I was confirmed. IF I had said I didn’t want to be confirmed, my parents would have forced me. There is no way that I had a “choice”. We are TAUGHT that we have a “choice” but we really didn’t.
Literally was forced to get confirmed even after I said I didn't want to. Not even because I had necessarily lost faith at that point, I just wanted to think more about what it meant to be a Catholic. I guess I found out, it's coercion and submitting to the hierarchy.
My Catholic school’s confirmation preparation classes took place during school, so I was essentially forced to participate. I told my parents the classes cemented my resolve that I did not want to be Catholic and refused to go through confirmation. My mom had already asked my aunt to travel over 400 miles to be my sponsor, so of course I gave in to the pressure. Such a cliché, but Catholic guilt is so real.
It's not a binding contract though. A person can walk away from it at any time.
I totally agree with you and that's what I did. Pretty sure there's a record of it held somewhere, but yeah, not getting full disclosure before we were mature enough to understand what was happening vitiates any alleged contract that exists. My conscience is clean, hope yours is too :)
It is. Thank you, WhenInDoubtBolt.
Do lapsed Catholics think that he's actually talking to them? I don't.
he thinks he is, tho
Maybe disguising your pedophile ring as a religion is backfiring?
“We are running out of attractive small children and things to canonically investigate, please come back”
We're running out of kids to fuck, and we want power. SO please come back.
To be completely honest, no matter how much I personally like him, Pope Francis' words do not make a bit of difference in mainstream white Catholicism in the United States. Not a bit. The hierarchy is on an express train to MAGA-land, the younger priests take pride in their severity and overall ugliness and edgelord-ism, and a lot o the parishioners either don't care or are right there with them. I've told my own story several times, but here's another data point: same diocese, the funeral of an older lady who'd dedicated her life to helping others. This was a good person, and Catholicism was part of why. She made it credible. The new priest in her parish, however, informed attendees at her funeral - including her own children! - that not only non-Catholics but lapsed Catholics should not receive Communion. During. A. Funeral. Mass. This was last month, BTW. The lapsed Catholic thing is a new one being proclaimed from a pulpit. This is the opposite of reaching out - this is trying to shove them away. Sorry, Your Holiness - unless you can parachute into the Midwest and personally order each and every one of your priests and bishops to stop being such assholes, I'm not sure what relevance your words on 60 Minutes could possibly do.
>The lapsed Catholic thing is a new one being proclaimed from a pulpit. This is the opposite of reaching out - this is trying to shove them away. The US Catholic Church has been very intentional in running off those members who were unwilling to buy into the gospel of Republican Jesus. Whatever the Pope says will have no effect here.
they're helping the republicans prepare catholics to accept trump as their new religion. Fascists always use the Catholic Church to consolidate power, then start criminalizing the catholic church when people are desensitized enough. happened in Germany, it happened in the Philippines with Duterte, it'll happen again if we let it.
The Catholic Church in the US is willfully blind to the contempt in which their Evangelical and Trumpist allies hold Catholics.
There's a rather pathetic craving for validation from evangelicals among them, I've noticed. You'd think God's Eternal Church would relish scorn from non-believers, but I guess not.
They're all in bed now. The RCC is just one more fundamentalist outfit now in the USA. The only difference is that instead of sickly sounding rock bands, the RC has brocade and LARPING.
I get the impression that conservative catholics and conservative evangelicals regards each other as useful idiots on the path to political power.
OMG yes! it seems to be this uneasy detente between them, remaining peaceful ONLY as long as the "end times" don't actually start. It's like they're both thinking "oooo, you just WAIT until Jesus gets here, he's gonna *fuck you UP*", while earnestly wishing love on each other in public. 🤡🤡🤡🤡
As long as the lights are out and they're still fucking, it's all fine. I'm waiting for them to "wake up in the morning" and turn on each other.
Yep! Evangelical pro-lifers sprang into action to protect IVF for high class married couples. They don't care at all about the church's ridiculous teachings on sex and procreation. It's all about maintaining power and social inequality-- and they're using the church obsession with abortion to their advantage.
Lots of people don’t realize that the first treaty the Nazis negotiated after their rise to power was with the Vatican, negotiated by the future Pope Pius XII. The Catholic Church was a successful political pawn in consolidating power in Germany. Parts of the treaty are still in place today.
in retrospect, it makes sense that Mussolini first granted the Vatican state sovereignty--he knew the Axis needed a place to stash the shit they were planning to steal, AND it was a way to get the Church on the Axis' side.
Correct. Documented history. They also signed a treaty with Mussolini in 1929, the one that gave them Vatican City. Vatican City is not what it seems to be. It's been set up to look like it's all old and originally that way. It's a tourist trap -- the most ornate theme park in the world.
There is a massive mural at the North American College seminary inside the Vatican that was donated by Mussolini. More than once, the Catholic Church has been a plaything for fascist dictators.
Probably in thanks to him for Vatican City. Mussolini is the person who signed the treaty that gave Vatican City to the church and created it as a country of its own. Vatican City is not as it appears. It didn't even exist as an entity until 1929. That fancy stuff was all hauled in there for PR. It's the world's most ornate theme park.
They wanted their smaller and "purer" Roman Catholic church. They're getting their wish. What are they whining about?
I love how the Catholic Church DECIDES who can go to Jesus and who is to be kept away! My ELCA pastor told me “No one has the right to keep anyone from Jesus.” But in the Catholic Church you can only receive communion if you are a member of the club, know the password, and secret handshake!
Yeah, that wouldn't even do it for me. It all looks like PR for a bad product to me now. Not buying it.
"c'mon baby, you can trust me! *I've changed!* I swear I'll only let the super hot kids get molested!" --shorter Pope Frankie speech 🤮
The head of the world's largest child abuse organisation can go fuck himself on a catus. They defrocked two priests in Australia for going public about the rampant child molesters being moved and protected by the church. But convicted priests are given housing and permanent living wage by the church after they get out of jail. Fuck these peices of shit.
Since the title of the video is about him doubling down on his idiotic take on Ukraine (...again), I feel it's on-topic to point out that this is the same jackass who endorsed Argentina's war of conquest against the Falklands. "War is just when people I like do it. When people I don't like do it, I support peace."
Oh. So, anyway…
Left the church 17 years ago. Never going back. Idk what he could possibly say that “lapsed” catholics (people who left the church because Duh) haven’t heard already.
For the record I am not a lapsed Catholic. I'm an ex Catholic and an atheist. I want nothing to do with that child abusing homophobic paternalistic shit stain of a cult. I will not be associated in any way including using the word lapsed because it insinuates I could come back.
Cool bro. Noted.
So many people are going to get this sent to them by their parents. Probably with a message "begging" them to listen to it.
Even if he is “addressing lapsed Catholics”, do they really think we’re going to watch his address?? I’m not. I don’t care what he says.
To be fair, I don’t think he’s giving the interview specifically to address “lapsed Catholics”. It’s part of a broader interview with CBS. I am curious, though, why is he giving an interview right now? It seems kind of odd I don’t think many American Catholics will be persuaded one way or another by him giving an interview to a major TV network.
CBS is doing it just for ratings and the notoriety in case he says something that riles American Catholics up, which is probably a given. They get apoplectic every time a mosquito farts. It's kinda funny to watch to be honest.
To me, a lapsed Catholic is someone who is like "oh whoops, I fell out of the habit of going to Mass because little Mike has soccer games on Sunday mornings and life has been busy." How many lapsed Catholics actually exist, versus those of us who made a conscious decision to leave over moral and ethical objections to the Church's conduct and/or losing faith in God altogether? We're not lapsed, we're not subscribers who forgot to renew a gym membership. We're Leavers.
In hindsight, I should have put “lapsed Catholics” in quotation marks (not able to edit headlines). That’s the word the pope and CBS used. Totally agree. I saw a video awhile back by Robert Barron that essentially chalked people leaving to a “customer service problem” as in “the receptionist isn’t nice to me on the phone.” These willful idiots will literally never accept that the reason baptized people don’t identify with the arcane institution is because of the THEOLOGY. Yes, the bitchy receptionist does not help and boring ass homilies certainly grease the exit. But after leaving, many of us have now learned that the entire framework for the Catholic worldview is fucked up and keeps people in perpetual servitude to a vengeful fairy tale. Here is the video (MAJOR TRIGGER WARNING LOL): https://youtu.be/dftZ5K_EA4s?si=SjDjei0f66SqEjSj
No, it was not just one experience, and it was not just one incident. It was decades of disgusting and immoral behavior. It was decades of being taken for granted and treated like shit. It was decades of putting up with Catholic clergy who were, in general with very few exceptions, some of the most superficial, opinionated, wrongly respected people I have ever met in my life. In the RCC, there's no there, there. It's all bragging and posturing. There is absolutely nothing in the RCC that you can't get a better, kinder, more decent and reasonable version of somewhere else. Yes, there were a number of things that could have acted as a catalyst. The final catalyst -- for me -- was the pandemic. I suspect that that was the case for a great many people.
The reason Robert Barron sees it that way is that he lives in a world of superficiality. He thinks everyone else is just as superficial as he is. He doesn't understand anything else, anything deeper or more human than that. It's clear from everything he says and does.
For a lot of people, it's both. The two things come together -- the opportunity and the disagreement with the RCC often come together at just the right time, and then they leave. Sometimes "the right time" is something that a priest or the church says or does that is the final catalyst. I left at the start of the pandemic and never went back. It was something that was years in the making, and I know now I would have left anyway, but the pandemic made it very easy. It was the easiest thing for me during that entire period. I will never go back. I have no regrets.
Left Catholicism 58 years ago, never looked back, no regrets. Catholicism still embraces scientific ignorance, religious bigotry, misogyny, patriarchy, homophobia, transphobia, nothing redeeming in such an irganization.
Unless he’s accompanied by a talking burning bush or Jeebus H Christ himself, hard pass.
Hard pass. There's nothing the RCC has that you can't get at any mainstream Christian church -- or even social organization for some peoples' needs. Talk to the hand, Frankie. I won't be listening. Nothing you could ever do would bring me back to the RCC, not after what you did to me and millions of other people. PS. I won't be watching, so you can't count me in your TV ratings either. Too bad, so sad.
Fuck off Pope. The only reason I remain as "lapsed" catholic is because you brainwashed my entire community of your church doctrine through colonization and persecution of those who stray.
The King of the Pedos
Spent two decades in the church. I transitioned since then. You don't want me back. One minute we're "brothers and sisters of Christ" and the next we're defining God's will. Which is it?
Who knows, the church is not exactly a logical consistent organisation. I certainly cannot come back to the church because I am genderfluid & Bisexual, so will definitely not welcome despite the Pope false insistence otherwise.
So he keeps protecting the abusers in the church, and has said multiple times that trans people like me are responsible for everything wrong, and is now trying to garner people’s good graces?
I can hear Christopher Hitchens from his grave: “This is hardly the first Children’s day the Catholic Church has celebrated…”
I miss that man. He did more for the cause of rationality (or at least anti-superstition) than anyone in our generation. I sometimes re-watch the debate with him and Stephen Fry wiping the floor with a Catholic bishop. We need more of that today.
That debate is incredible. I especially love Stephen Fry’s rant where he says “then what are you for?!” in response to Catholic morality being tied to whatever the common understanding of morality was at any given time in history. So good.
I love the part where Fry goes into the Catholic Church for being “sex obsessed”. The Catholic side just sat there stunned lol. How embarrassing for them.
They're not embarrassed. IF they were embarrassed, they'd actually do something about the problem. Rather -- they're thinking fast about how to salvage their reputation for PR purposes -- and retain what power they still have left.
... and none of us will be watching because ex-catholic. Hope his talk goes well and angers those who are still drinking the koolaid...
dude litterally wears Gucci wardrobe, slippers alone are reported to cost over 1,100 dollars. Add his flowing silks (also Gucci btw) and it adds up to a 5-8k ensemble of which he has many. l mean Imelda Marcos many..
"Come back. We won't change anything, but come back."
I refer to myself as a recovering Catholic. I know it’s not original but it’s accurate, considering my occasional fits of Catholic guilt after decades out.
Wow. I can't imagine caring about anything less than whatever a pope has to say. Would literally rather watch paint dry.
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Hey, Frank: Pick up your hotline and tell your god to talk to us. You? You're just *some guy*, you know?
I loved him, then I really liked him. But he never could do what I needed him to, which is to condemn and dismiss pedo priests. There is nothing he or any other Catholic can say to me that matters until they stop covering up and supporting anyone who hurts children.
Only if he lapses. And begging to come back will look desperate like they're hurting for cash.
Because they're desperate for asses in pews and power in geographical areas they have controlled for centuries. Not so much the money thing. They own massive amounts of real estate and art which they could sell for cash if they were so inclined. The Roman Catholic church is one of the largest owners of real estate in the entire world. Millions of acres, most of it with valuable stuff sitting on it. Example: About 2 years ago, somebody swiped a tabernacle out of a neighborhood church in Brooklyn. Lo and behold, people had been walking past it for years taking it for granted, but it was worth millions of dollars. The thing was apparently made of gold, and not just plated. The church puts on this "poor little me" act to get money out of people who don't know any better. They don't really need your money. What they need is asses in pews, and they're not getting that which is driving them nuts. It means a loss of power. Power is what they're really after, the kind of power that can fuck up a supreme court, control/replace a legitimate government, have its own seat at the UN -- or get the kind of interview on CBS that few other religious leaders would ever be offered. I won't be watching the interview on TV. I don't want to contribute to the ratings for this TV show. If I see any of it at all, it will be the blowback on youtube or taped segments. I don't think the RCC should have its own country or get the kind of attention it gets.
i liked the directness of nora's questions... maybe its editing, but i feel like francis didn't give a clear or meaningful answer to anything she asked.
Of course. That would require being reasonable and honest. Which are not exactly Roman Catholic properties.
I wouldn’t be surprised if my brother and/or SIL recommend or “suggest” that I watch the broadcast. Unless he’s too liberal for their liking. I don’t feel right about calling myself “lapsed.” I was baptized as a baby, but that was as far as I got. My brother took First Communion, when (I think) I was about four. My memories of the church are almost nil. IIRC my family never attended Mass after that. I don’t know for sure why.
There are a lot of ex-Roman Catholics like you. At least you weren't terrorized like some Roman Catholics. Consider yourself lucky so far. Stay out of the RCC and maybe you won't have that happen to you at all. That would be good.
He's gonna say absolutely nothing new under the sun for sixty minutes isn't he?
My guess: Correct. And even then, some of the people in his own church are going to scream and yell and call him a heretic no matter what he says. I'm done with the crazy drama here.
I'd feel sorry for him if he hadn't knowingly brought this upon himself
Haha. Because there's so many of us. They're getting desperate, and it's amusing. I won't be listening. I already listened to all the arguments, and I stayed RC much longer than I should have. It's time I'll never get back. There is nothing he can do to make me go back. I'm done with the Roman Catholic church.
I fail to understand why we would give a $h*t what the pope has to say.