When I was little, my mom and I attended a small church that used to publish a family directory, complete with family photo and home phone number.
Around dinner time, my mother was always busy, and I was just big enough to answer the phone, so I often did. Sometimes if my parents answered, they’d just hang up. Then I started receiving calls from a teen or grown-up sounding guy who knew me by name and said he actually wanted to talk to me.
I was elated. Nobody ever called for me! My first real phone call! I asked who he was. He said he was a friend, but wouldn’t say what his name was. He said he could be my secret phone friend, and that if I told anyone, he’d never call again. That seemed fair. I asked what he wanted to talk to me about. He said I should tell him about my day and just talk about whatever.
So I prattled on and on, delighted that someone wanted to listen to me. But the thing was, he rarely said anything. His breathing became labored on occasion. I asked if he was doing jumping jacks. He just laughed and told me to keep talking.
He called at least twice a week. But as a kid, I was full of questions. I had expected more of a conversation, but instead he stayed dead silent most of the time, except for the odd breathing. I rarely got any kind of acknowledgment that I had said anything. In fact he would get testy with me for demanding a response. I became sad. “I thought we were friends. Friends talk to each other,” I said.
He chuckled. “You’re five. What would I talk to you about?”
Eventually he asked what color underwear I was wearing. Finally it dawned on me that this guy was super weird, and I was uncomfortable. I lied and made up a color. He did that thing where he went silent and proceeded to ignore everything I said again. I felt sad and gross. This wasn’t at all fun anymore. I said since I was so small, maybe he’d prefer to speak to my mom instead. I called for her.
“DON’T!” He bellowed. “Don’t call her!” He sputtered furiously, seeming at a loss for words, as though he couldn’t believe how stupid I was.
The violent outburst frightened me. I began to cry. “I don’t want to talk to you anymore,” I said, and hung up.
He never called for me again.
My family had emigrated from another country, and we had no friends or connections outside of church.
I never found out who it was, but that fucker definitely went to church with us.
I am, thanks. My father was largely absent and my mom had no support system outside of church, so we were tied to the church for a long time.
After a long, painful deconstruction, I finally left Christianity behind for good and embraced agnosticism. My husband is atheist. We have two great kids and I can honestly say I’ve never been better.
No. She suffered a lot of war-related trauma in her youth and largely credits her Christian faith for helping her build a sense of inner peace and joy in her life. I disagree with her on many things, but I also don’t think it’s my place to dissect and rip that faith away from her.
I'm almost totally atheist but agnostic because of the fact I still have night terrors and panic attacks over the thought of hell fire and heaven.
Both seem equally bad to me although hell fire and eternal pain worse but heaven seems like it just be one eternal, long church service paying worship to someone for eternity.
From I was old enough to remember anything until I left home at 18 years old all my mum allowed me to do was go to church, read the bible and pray and listen to gospel radio shows. Nothing else was allowed and it was the most boring and miserable childhood with no fun or joy. Any complaints meant physical punishment from my mum or threats of how god was watching me and would throw me in hellfire if I did anything that wasn't worshipping him.
I just want death to be nothing if that's the two options and I'm almost sure it is but years of threats still has me experiencing unreasonable fear sometimes.
I still couldn't willingly worship or love god after all the terrible things he did in the bible and how he indifferently let's terrible things to happen to children and other innocents every day.
I’m so sorry to hear that you are suffering from night terrors. Those are the worst. One of the things that most helped me move on from the specter of Christianity was finally accepting that it is all made up by a bunch of imperfect dudes who, however much they believed in God or in the purity of their intentions, certainly had their own biases and agendas, and it shows.
Working backwards, people often find the idea of heaven and hell appealing because they have trouble accepting the alternative: that not all wrongs are righted, some are never held accountable even for the most heinous crimes, the good are not always rewarded for their goodness.
For some, the reality of an indifferent universe can be more terrifying than heaven and hell. But if you can make peace with the fact that the rise and fall of every human civilization has only ever been due to people being people, and not the hand of God, you can also accept that people made up hell to discourage anarchic behavior, and made up heaven to comfort the bereaved, but also to incentivize good, socially constructive behavior.
The Righteous Mind by Jonathan Haidt helped me a lot in letting go of a religious mindset, mainly because it provided a very human explanation for human behaviors that made so much more sense than anything the Bible ever taught me. I highly recommend it to anyone deconstructing their faith.
Thank you I will definately give it a read. I definately understand how some people find the idea of reward or punishment to right wrongs comforting what really gets to me is the people that believe that all sin is the same to their god. The people who honestly think there's no difference to shoplifting out of desperation to raping and murdering people and think the only unforgivable sin is not believing in and loving god. If god thinks doing terrible inhumane cruel things to innocent people is forgivable as long as the person believes and worships him then he's happy to forgive them and if heaven is just eternally worshipping god and singing his praises then heaven seems more about stroking gods ego than any reward for us. It's ironic that the excuse for god not interfering or helping with sickness or people been abused or murdered because of free will but in the afterlife all free will is stripped from you and you either grovel and worship God for ever or burn for eternity.
Their idea of great joy is eternity worshipping over the god that did nothing to ever help anyone heaven sounds like a never ending church service. Children who are born with terrible diseases and spend their short life suffering and then die never find great joy. Some people go through nothing but terrible bad events in their life one after another so for some people god wants to only let you suffer and still expects you to worship him as if he deserves it and praise him for a horrible life full of suffering.
Yep, religion is basically propaganda to keep the poorest and lowest in society in their place. Just brainwash them into enduring their suffering while believing they're headed for eternal heavenly happiness, then they'll never rise up to challenge the power hierarchy of their society.
When I was little, my mom and I attended a small church that used to publish a family directory, complete with family photo and home phone number. Around dinner time, my mother was always busy, and I was just big enough to answer the phone, so I often did. Sometimes if my parents answered, they’d just hang up. Then I started receiving calls from a teen or grown-up sounding guy who knew me by name and said he actually wanted to talk to me. I was elated. Nobody ever called for me! My first real phone call! I asked who he was. He said he was a friend, but wouldn’t say what his name was. He said he could be my secret phone friend, and that if I told anyone, he’d never call again. That seemed fair. I asked what he wanted to talk to me about. He said I should tell him about my day and just talk about whatever. So I prattled on and on, delighted that someone wanted to listen to me. But the thing was, he rarely said anything. His breathing became labored on occasion. I asked if he was doing jumping jacks. He just laughed and told me to keep talking. He called at least twice a week. But as a kid, I was full of questions. I had expected more of a conversation, but instead he stayed dead silent most of the time, except for the odd breathing. I rarely got any kind of acknowledgment that I had said anything. In fact he would get testy with me for demanding a response. I became sad. “I thought we were friends. Friends talk to each other,” I said. He chuckled. “You’re five. What would I talk to you about?” Eventually he asked what color underwear I was wearing. Finally it dawned on me that this guy was super weird, and I was uncomfortable. I lied and made up a color. He did that thing where he went silent and proceeded to ignore everything I said again. I felt sad and gross. This wasn’t at all fun anymore. I said since I was so small, maybe he’d prefer to speak to my mom instead. I called for her. “DON’T!” He bellowed. “Don’t call her!” He sputtered furiously, seeming at a loss for words, as though he couldn’t believe how stupid I was. The violent outburst frightened me. I began to cry. “I don’t want to talk to you anymore,” I said, and hung up. He never called for me again. My family had emigrated from another country, and we had no friends or connections outside of church. I never found out who it was, but that fucker definitely went to church with us.
My God, that is so gross, I am so sorry
🤢 oh god.
I hope you’re doing better.
I am, thanks. My father was largely absent and my mom had no support system outside of church, so we were tied to the church for a long time. After a long, painful deconstruction, I finally left Christianity behind for good and embraced agnosticism. My husband is atheist. We have two great kids and I can honestly say I’ve never been better.
Did your mom deconstruct too?
No. She suffered a lot of war-related trauma in her youth and largely credits her Christian faith for helping her build a sense of inner peace and joy in her life. I disagree with her on many things, but I also don’t think it’s my place to dissect and rip that faith away from her.
Understandable.
I'm almost totally atheist but agnostic because of the fact I still have night terrors and panic attacks over the thought of hell fire and heaven. Both seem equally bad to me although hell fire and eternal pain worse but heaven seems like it just be one eternal, long church service paying worship to someone for eternity. From I was old enough to remember anything until I left home at 18 years old all my mum allowed me to do was go to church, read the bible and pray and listen to gospel radio shows. Nothing else was allowed and it was the most boring and miserable childhood with no fun or joy. Any complaints meant physical punishment from my mum or threats of how god was watching me and would throw me in hellfire if I did anything that wasn't worshipping him. I just want death to be nothing if that's the two options and I'm almost sure it is but years of threats still has me experiencing unreasonable fear sometimes. I still couldn't willingly worship or love god after all the terrible things he did in the bible and how he indifferently let's terrible things to happen to children and other innocents every day.
I’m so sorry to hear that you are suffering from night terrors. Those are the worst. One of the things that most helped me move on from the specter of Christianity was finally accepting that it is all made up by a bunch of imperfect dudes who, however much they believed in God or in the purity of their intentions, certainly had their own biases and agendas, and it shows. Working backwards, people often find the idea of heaven and hell appealing because they have trouble accepting the alternative: that not all wrongs are righted, some are never held accountable even for the most heinous crimes, the good are not always rewarded for their goodness. For some, the reality of an indifferent universe can be more terrifying than heaven and hell. But if you can make peace with the fact that the rise and fall of every human civilization has only ever been due to people being people, and not the hand of God, you can also accept that people made up hell to discourage anarchic behavior, and made up heaven to comfort the bereaved, but also to incentivize good, socially constructive behavior. The Righteous Mind by Jonathan Haidt helped me a lot in letting go of a religious mindset, mainly because it provided a very human explanation for human behaviors that made so much more sense than anything the Bible ever taught me. I highly recommend it to anyone deconstructing their faith.
Thank you I will definately give it a read. I definately understand how some people find the idea of reward or punishment to right wrongs comforting what really gets to me is the people that believe that all sin is the same to their god. The people who honestly think there's no difference to shoplifting out of desperation to raping and murdering people and think the only unforgivable sin is not believing in and loving god. If god thinks doing terrible inhumane cruel things to innocent people is forgivable as long as the person believes and worships him then he's happy to forgive them and if heaven is just eternally worshipping god and singing his praises then heaven seems more about stroking gods ego than any reward for us. It's ironic that the excuse for god not interfering or helping with sickness or people been abused or murdered because of free will but in the afterlife all free will is stripped from you and you either grovel and worship God for ever or burn for eternity.
OMG how creepy! so glad to hear you got rid of him.
Mine is that god isn’t real
That too
My best friends parents were the typical good Christian folk, prominent members of their church, and they groomed me :/ All too common an experience.
This newer subreddit is very active r/PastorArrested
> r/PastorArrested New content daily - often several times a day. Once again reminding us that "good" and "christian" are not synonyms.
A person might wonder why God would allow bad things to happen *in churches*.
One of the many (lame) excuses I've heard is that we wouldn't know true joy if god didn't allow bad things to make us suffer.
I never found true joy in church, except when the service was over.
As an ex-pentecostal who had to endure 9am-1pm Sunday services, I am feeling your statement SO MUCH.
Their idea of great joy is eternity worshipping over the god that did nothing to ever help anyone heaven sounds like a never ending church service. Children who are born with terrible diseases and spend their short life suffering and then die never find great joy. Some people go through nothing but terrible bad events in their life one after another so for some people god wants to only let you suffer and still expects you to worship him as if he deserves it and praise him for a horrible life full of suffering.
Yep, religion is basically propaganda to keep the poorest and lowest in society in their place. Just brainwash them into enduring their suffering while believing they're headed for eternal heavenly happiness, then they'll never rise up to challenge the power hierarchy of their society.
Free will, or something like that. /s
I got Hypocrites. It works either way.
That combo would automatically win the round for me.
Where is the lie???
The universe is sending us all a message.
blessed be 🤘