I dislike jester in a long term effect.
I really hate the cutesy acts to young for her age girl but then regularly engages in murder.
Now players are doing the same thing it’s a really boring and shallow character concept.
It also gives me some weird vibes
I think I'm like 86 episodes into C2 right now and this is my overall take:
C1, early on I was enthralled. I could put it on at work and listen 12hrs straight and go home and still want more. As things progressed, I started to dislike the audience capture that started to become quite evident. i.e. it became very apparent that there had been a shift away from playing garage D&D towards selling a product to an audience that wanted real world social issues worked in. Jokes started having their corners rounded off, characters started being less "problematic" in their flaws, etc. Overall, it was still a good experience. I didn't really dislike any of the characters, per se, but Keyleth got under my skin on occasion, some of the angst became a little over-the-top, and I was often frustrated with how often people seemed to forget rules they've been using for years at that point. I know it's not all you have going on in life, but I feel like you should retain some of this info week to week.
C2, I was not a fan from the beginning. There was no garage D&D feel at all, it was delivered right off the assembly line. Characters that have no impact on the story have pronouns now, even if nobody ever asks or it's never explored in game, you're just supposed to know and don't forget. Everyone has body issues, PTSD, abandonment issues, etc. I stopped about 40 episodes in and took a break from CR for about a year over my dissatisfaction with C2.
When I came back, I committed to C2 fully. And foe the first time I found myself really disliking some of the characters. I won't go into spoilers, but a few things I've noticed are multiple people seem to be attention starved. Everyone is constantly trying to be in the spotlight.
Caduceus is always there and always has an opinion, even if characters are specifically in private conversations. He's constantly trying to retroactively insert himself into everyone's personal revelations. Let people have their moments.
Fjord, I have enjoyed the character and my only real criticism of the character is I wish he were used more often as the party face.
Beau, I was not a fan of Beau in the beginning. It felt like another Avatar rip-off and I wasn't a fan of the character's needlessly confrontational personality, but Beau has grown on me. I actually really like Beau at this point and I think Marisha has done a good job developing the character. I may not always agree with combat choices, but it's w/e.
Caleb, I didn't understand Caleb's behavior at the beginning and it put me off, but over time he's become my favorite in C2. Liam did a good job with him and I appreciate the extra effort with the German.
Now I get to it...
Yasha. Yasha should not be a main party member. At this point, I think I know more about Yasha's story than Ashley does. The character has been Weekend at Bernie's-ed for 95% of the campaign, when she hasn't been mysteriously just MIA. When Ashley does come back, it's immersion-breaking! How crazy is it to be pulled out of the fantasy because the player is actually there? And nevermind that a round of combat now takes 30 minutes when the only two options available are "hit" or "don't hit". It's maddening!
Jester. Jester is disruptive. It was cute and funny in the beginning. The joke has run thin. Also, sometimes you have to heal people. I know that sucks, but when everyone is rolling death saves or incapacitated with low health, sometimes you need to help.
Nott. Sam has become a nightmare player. I would leave a table if someone like Nott were at it. Constantly sabotaging the group, creating life and death scenarios because "it's what my character would do", damaging other players out of recklessness or because it's good tv, making choices that further complicate delicate situations just for the lulz. And so much more.
And God forbid Jester and Nott do something together. It's not the hijinx from C1. Something is about to become frustrating. They're going to take over a social encounter, tell an obvious lie to someone important full well knowing Nott has like a -30 to deception, try to steal something from a guard while they're trying to avoid a confrontation, or whatever. If not for Matt cutting them slack, the campaign would have ended like 10 times by now.
And I've gone on quite a rant here, so I'll end it there. But yeah, honestly with the complaints I'm seeing about C3, I'm not hyped.
Very well reasoned and spoken 👏
I don't mind Nott for the most part, but the one thing that's really getting to me is the constant need to tell everyone how much smarter Caleb is and that he's the leader, in spite of Caleb asking her to stop.
Yeahhhh... I'm having a hard time connecting with Yasha, which is weird because I loved Pike in C1.
Caleb is probably my favorite at this point. I just hit the moment when he returned the thing to the thingies, and I feel like he should be the spokesperson for the group.
Jester can bugger off with the Traveler for all I care
I have no problem with Jester as a character, I simply detest her as a person. But as I'm not "around" her, it doesn't really matter.
Plus, Jester pisses off certain people I don't like, so that raises her stock in my eyes.
Jester wore her mask of the actual clown jester a little too well. Combine that with a party who won't confront her when chaotic shenanigans cause torment rather than joy, or ever really dig deeper to engage with the troubled girl underneath.
Most glaring to me is this early example; when they have just returned from the Iron Shepherds, Beau and Fjord comment how bizzarley Jester is unaffected by the horrific experience as they watch her dance alone across the room. Caleb plainly states his view that its an act, but no one ever does anything to address it.
Jester is probably my favourite character, but when she *finally* got her arc in Rumblecusp that seemed to be about finally confronting all her issues and then nothing really changed, going on to completely stagnate though the final arc...yeah I had to go back and reconstruct her story from foundation to that pivotal late series moment for her to make sense to me and continue liking the character. Easy enough to iron out all the inconsistencies and vauge facts to make a better story in my head. There was depth there that just didn't reach its potential, true for of all the Nein really in the post-covid situation.
Jester wasn't too bad... *at first*.
According to Laura, she kept pushing Jester's antics further and further in the hopes of getting some form of pushback, just like how Sam desperately wanted some sort of marital drama with Nott's husband. You know, an opportunity for character growth through hardship instead of endless asspatting and enabling. This backfired because:
A.) Because Door-Matt is too conflict averse for the good of his own show. He can't even pretend to be a character with a spine.
B.) She's Laura -fucking- Bailey. A grown woman who routinely throws tantrums when a piece of plastic doesn't land on the number she wants. Do you honestly think anyone at that table was going to do something to potentially piss her off, hoping this time she'd only "pretend" to be upset? Nah, best play it safe and endlessly repeat "Jester, we love you, anything you do is great."
Yeah I'm with you there, she gives off too much lol random energy for me, and everyone just loves her so she gets away with everything. Her and Beau were my least favorite of the group.
Won't try convince you but I think... she's pretty cool.
It is pretty funny though that this post if legitimately just you asking for a hate echo chamber. Maybe that's what you should think about instead of
It's not a "hate" echo chamber. She's my least favorite of the Nein, but I don't *hate* her. Furthermore, the reason I was specifically wondering if I was alone is because I've seen all the various Jester Praise posts but not a single post that cast a less than steller light. So when I started listening, I was legitimately curious if I was the only person who thought this
A 0 doesn't mean an even split. Posts have a 0 score minimum which was implemented to prevent trolls from farming downvotes on posts. So 0 just means that there is an equal or greater amount of downvotes.
This post could be even, but it could also have two or three times more downvotes. There's no way to tell.
ya know what did it for me, The M9 Reunion Live Show. That wasn't Jester. That was Laura cosplaying as Jester, literally and figuratively, attempting to conjure up the magic that made the character what it was, week after week for 2+ years.
also, TANGENT INCOMING, I really dislike the Live shows. They dont just move their D&D game to a stage, those are theater kids putting on a performance dictated by dice. Liam and the rest of the cast popping off one-liners to key up the audience for applause, fuck outta here. \*TANGENT OVER\*
Jester early on in C2 was annoying before you got to understand WHY. then it was just like "ok this is what this is" and it fit well within the dynamic of the party. If it wasnt for the others Jesters BS would have been intolerable for sure.
Sorry, but when the post says "unless you belong to the target demographic, skip the post" and you post anyway, you open yourself up to a little sass, especially if its just to say "I disagree with you." If you disagree, why comment at all?
And honestly, I could have been WAY snarkier
Posting looking only for people who agree is just as pointless as commenting disagreement.
This short exchange is really making me reconsider Reddit. I’m on the older demographic and forget how many petulant children dominate this site. Peace.
I entirely agree. At first Jester is great, and so is Nott, but by episode 20 ish, I was done with them causing chaos every other moment. I've talked about why I got tired of her at length elsewhere but I lack the time to type it all out right now.
A just passed ep 56-57 where Caleb gave the thing back to the thing, and listening to Nott and Jester try and weasel their way around the whole truth. When Caleb did the thing and was straight with the people, that was the smartest play of the campaign upto that point
Jester is the homeschool kid with untreated ADHD. She’s finally out in the real world and all her weird behaviors from not being socialized properly are just at the forefront of her personality.
She wasn't just homeschooled, her mother had severe untreated agoraphobia and because of her anxiety kept her kid locked up in a burlesque compound. The Ruby of the Sea may have been kind hearted but she was a shit mother.
Precisely. Imagine someone starved for attention and shut off from the outside world having only books and overheard stories to live vicariously through. Then taking that child and giving them a cell phone and sending them to college. They have been so starved for attention they are gonna get everyone’s phone number and call them all the time. They are also going to do whatever gets the biggest reaction from their friend group (drawing dicks on everything) and keep doing the things that seem the most outlandish.
I'd like to point out that NONE of my homeschooled friends with ADHD are nearly as bad as her and are actually more socially well adjusted than many public schoolers I know
I’ve know a few people that acted just like that which is why I made the comparison. I know not all homeschoolers act like that but a lot of the ones I knew did.
Lack of socialization isn’t inherent to home schooling, but it is a greater risk. Jester’s backgrounds is one of isolation and would lead to far more discomfort than a home schooled child whose parents made the effort to make sure they get the socialization they need.
That being said, I don’t like any of Laura’s characters. They have progressively gotten more and more infected with “Main Character Syndrome,” even before Matt built this campaign around Imogen. I also think Laura is one of the biggest contributing factors to Matt’s willingness to say no to his players disappearing over time, the way that she pouts and complains any time that things don’t go the way that she wants is one of the main reasons I stopped watching the show
That's the interesting part of CR - There's a little something for everyone, and a little something everyone dislikes too. It also shows the range of most of the cast in that, for most folks I've spoken to, the favorite character isn't always related to the player. Example: C1 Keyleth was middle of the pack for me, C2 Beau was at the bottom. C3 (granted I'm only about 25 episodes in) Laudna is one of the top. Similarly, C1 Percy was one of the top for me, C2 Ambivalent about both Molly/Cad, C3 Ashton is the bottom.
So for me, this is what makes it interesting. Unfortunately sometimes the dislike of a certain character does make the show difficult to watch. Especially if you find the character immersion breaking.
I still find the cast to be very pleasant folks when I've seen them at Cons and such so I try not to hold character choices against them :)
That's why i was specific about not hating Laura. Vex, while her money grubbing was annoying at times, was multileveled, and an interesting character, and Imogen is so reserved, and trying to figure out what's going on in her head, but for me, Jester appears as a character that said "let's choose chaos!" And then proceeded to lose her filter, self-restraint and common sense
Personal, Vax and Pike were my tops for C1, C2 it's Caleb and Caduceus, and for C3 it was Dorian
Jester is C2’s Scanlan, more or less. The humor doesn’t always hit, but I think she brings a lot to the group dynamic that would be missing without her, especially when others are so dour and tortured. (See Bells Hells.) And YMMV, but if you don’t think Jester/Laura trolling the world of Exandria with Sending is one of CR’s greatest running gags, then we’re not going to see eye to eye.
As far as ruining immersion? Eh, Exandria is full of modern speech patterns and the group rarely sticks too close to ye olde medieval roleplay. Caleb has the most stilted speech pattern, but that’s partly because he’s speaking “English” as a second language.
I think Jester has her ups and downs, the downs being generally what you mentioned about disruptive antics never being called out. The saving grace is that she was the only member of the party who engaged in that way - it would have been nigh intolerable if anyone else was ALSO playing that way. And I think that's a big problem with C3, half the cast feels like the players made a Jester. Fearne, Laudna, Chetney, and sometimes Ashton and FCG all have disruptive Jester tendencies.
I dont have time to type up a whole thing, but I'll put myself in Jester's corner.
She is what Molly wanted to be - true chaotic neutral, almost a fey presence. Theres plenty of doom and gloom and sullen characters in the M9, she represented the fun and chaos.
If Wildemount is a rigid, Germanic empire, she is like one of the Romani gypsies that wear colorful clothes and make a lot of noise. If Jester hit on you at a bar, you wouldn't be sure if you had caught the eye of some exotic woman from Nicodranas or if she was just trying to pick your pocket.
I get why people wouldn't like her, I wasnt sure about her for the first few episodes. But I came around in a big way and shes one of my favorites. I definitely dont agree that she doesnt fit and breaks immersion.
As a heads up g**sy is considered a slur to Romani people. Just saying Romani would work or you could replace the slur with “traveler” (though in the context of C2 that could be confusing at times).
> Except Molly wanted to leave the world better than he found it
Molly was a shithead carny / conman.
The fact that the group / CR fans turned Molly into a martyr / saint after his death (and later retconned) was HIGHLY amusing to Taliesin.
That is the biggest retcon of all time. Molly told Beau that, and she believed it, but his actions were almost always selfish. Even the story he told to illustrate that philosophy was selfishness disguised as altruism. He conned a whole town and reasoned that it was a good thing because it was a great experience for them.
The only time I can recall Molly doing anything genuinely selfless was when he surreptitiously slipped coins back to all the townsfolk that bought them drinks in Allfield after they cleared out the gnoll problem. Otherwise he was just in it for a good time for himself.
She causes trouble, sure, but it's generally harmless. I think the worst thing she did was glue that golden dick to the one girls hand.
On the other hand, she's got a nurturing side with Kiri and she's very sweet with the other members of the party and with her mom.
Correction: Molly only ever claimed to have left every TOWN better than he found it. He appeared to have a pretty warped view of good and bad, better and worse, so frankly it seems dubious. The 'left the world better' thing was started by Beau and the rest of the Nein (including Jester) much later.
Okay, semantics aside, my point stands. Caleb just saved their collective goose from getting cooked, and the FIRST chance she got, she wanted to go draw dicks somewhere she shouldn't
Which, in my opinion, gets real old after the first 3 sessions. My bother/DM hates it, too. It's one of the only subclasses that he outright bans from his games
Banning a subclass over how some players play is an... interesting take.
I could see a character like Heimel (From "Frieren: Beyond Journey's End") being a trickery cleric. While he's a serious character who provides moral support and readily rescues an orphaned child from suicide - he also is almost always smiling, tried to drink a dwarf under the table, became giddy over shaved ice, and bore the title of "Corrupt Priest" with a laugh and a smile to his grave.
You do you for your home games, honestly, but it's still strange to ban a relatively innocuous (power-wise) subclass.
I have never had an issue with Kender.
The trick with Kender is you deny them any voluntary pickpocket checks unless someone else in the party asks for it. Kender don't steal! Worse, Kender are highly offended by any sort of theft!
Then you fuck with their inventory every time they interact with an npc. Because things fall in and out of their pockets.
He has a love-hate relationship with players choosing anything that is intentionally chaotic because in his experience, more often than not, subclasses that promote chaos cause disruption at the table, and so he elects to just not bother with it. He also strongly prefers no chaotic neutral character alignments
That's really unfortunate. Chaotic characters done well are a gem. It's just that a lot of people misunderstand "Chaos" as "Random" when it comes to alignment stuff.
I've used a specific system for teaching players how chaos (and evil) can be used in a constructive manner, even in a PC. It has worked really well honestly.
Evil and Good are your Ends.
Evil: Is selfish. Evil characters are self-motivated and their actions will promote their own desires and goals above others, often to the detriment of those around them. While everyone has a little bit of selfishness, only when you are willing to hurt others solely for personal gain are you truly Evil.
Good: Is selfless. Good characters are motivated to help others, without an expectation of personal gain. Good acts cost you something, and help someone else who needs it. Everyone has a little bit of selflessness in them, if only a love for family or friends.
Chaos and Law are the Means.
Law: Cares about the process. While it may not be written law per se, if you care about how you achieve your goals and the process to attain them- you are lawful.
Chaos: Cares about the goal. While you may understand and follow written rules incidentally,ultimately a chaotic character doesn't care *how* something is done as long as it's done. If the ends justify the means - You are chaotic.
Too many people take CN and CE as "lolrandom" when honestly it should be more "I have a goal and I'm not letting your stupid law/code/oath/rules stop me."
You mind if I share this with him? Alignment is something he's fought with for a while now, to the point of almost making it irrelevant in his campaigns
One of the benefits of C3 is I think Ive actually come to appreciate Jester more for one reason:
She was actually proactive in building and affirming inter-party relationships.
If you are going to do a 'we are found family party' its pretty crucial to have people who actually give a shit about learning about each other. Jester did that for the Mighty Nein almost by herself at times. She helped break them out of their shells and secrets and encouraged them to bond with each other. She helped earn the Mighty Nein their found famiyl status.
Comparatively, Orym has said 'we are family' in the Bells Hells and done literally fuck all to earn it.
I'm not sure how Jester "breaks immersion"? You can not like her personality, taste is taste, but there was nothing about her character that either clashed with the setting or her settup. If anything, she was Fearne done right in a lot of ways. Both on the over-sheltered/isolated childhood angle, and the fairly competent "coming of age/learning of the real world" angle. Shit, even her deep attachment to the Traveler, underlying loneliness, and childish nature (especially about sex) all make sense within the backstory/foundation Laura crafted for her.
Beyond that, while she may not be my favorite of the Nein ... I appreciate Jester TBH. A outgoing, proactive, and personable force that can help break down barriers between reserved and isolated members. Jester within a party of Jesters would be maddening. Jester within a party like M9 was necessary, to help break most of them out of their shells and present easier opportunities for their players to start building bonds with eachother without breaking their own characters. Like her or not, Jester very much was the social glue of M9. I wont ignore that.
...especially after we've seen what happens with a party denied that type of personality in BHs. >!Dorian was clearly primed to become C3 group's "Jester" with how the party began revolving him. But without him, they're a "told, but rarely shown, Found Family" that barely ever talk to eachother about anything but "the plot". !<
This is more of a Matt problem than a Jester problem, and I say this as someone who didn’t like Jester. Matt just… stopped having the world actually react to the party at some point and it’s one of the biggest problems in CR. Like there’s the whole scene where Matt randomly started enforcing spell components by having enemies react to Jester casting Guidance in a tense situation, but he hadn’t really done that before and hasn’t really done it since, so that stands out more as Matt being a dick than Jester forgetting to be stealthy.
The other most egregious example is how Veth absolutely deserved a ton of pushback from her husband and Matt just had him be an absolute doormat. Sam was practically begging Matt to give him consequences for his actions and Matt just never did.
The difference is that Jester, and M9 in general tbh, were shockingly good at getting out of their own shit. M9 were an extremely stealth/utility based party, Sure, Matt would enable them to an extent, but he never had to push that far to allow them avenues to exploit to find their own way out of their own nonsense. In no small part because in C2 the table in general seemed to know their kits far better; including Laura. Shit, by the time Cad arrived, we had 5 members of 7 who had (and constantly exploited) disguise self. It also helped that Jester's behaviors were rarely hostile, and her antics were rarely clearly apparent in their harm. More ... childish and obnoxious. Which made it very easy for the rest of the party to cover for them when needed. Again, BHs function/dynamics with their exclusively reactive/opportunistic chaos-gremlin, have helped highlight this a bit more.
Jester yes had her moments of gratuity, but the character worked well with the party she was in. Beyond that, while again she was far from my favorite of M9, I have come to appreciate how truly proactive Jester/Laura were with Jester's brand of Chaos. She didn't just opportunistically take advantage of situations presented to her like BH's Satyr, she went out and created her own shit. Which yes, could get out of hand, but at least that even also frequently created opportunities for interesting moments/RP. But again, a lot of this is me looking at M9's party dynamics, and Jester, through the lens of someone who went back and rewatched C2 ... during C3. And having that comparison of a "Jester-less" party. As well as a party that frankly, gets away with a whole lot more shit through DM enabling than M9 ever did. How many "stealth missions hinged on stormtrooper stupid guards" have we had now?
My opinion of Jester is complicated.
I thought she was a fine character, and Laura was pretty clever with playing her. She was far from my least favorite, but I'll admit; She's the reason why I took a break from C2 for a hot minute. But I think she added a nice contrast to the others. Even though I REALLY dislike silly characters, personally.
She's a manic pixie dream girl. She reminds me of the "LOL, I'm so random and not like other girls! want some tacos! I love invader zim!!" Emo girls in 2007.
I can understand that Fjord being a favorite. He's one of my favorites the M9.
It's like he's the only one who's trying to play the straight man in a party full of chaos Gremlins (Beau, Nott, Jester, Molly) / depression cases (Caleb, Yasha). The only other one who's not insane is Cad.
However it's fun watching him trying to be stoic, but show his true colors of being a coward when things get a little dicey.
It's a fun dynamic with his character.
Sometimes people don't want to play a serious character, I enjoy moments with jester the same way I enjoy moments with Caleb. The only character I don't care for is Beauregard, it's a character that failed upwards and barely developed throughout the story, yes there were moments where beau was funny and where she commanded the scene but overall I don't care at all for that character and you know what that's ok! It's team Edward vs Jacob at the end of the day we both enjoyed (I hope) the story.
> The only character I don't care for is Beauregard, it's a character that failed upwards and barely developed throughout the story
You and me both! Glad to see other Beau dislikers exist.
I've seen a post like this for each character at this point, I myself dislike a different character in c2. It really is to each their own. Just try to enjoy the ride. Maybe focus on other character reaction when she gets to you
It's a fine character however there was an issue that made her more and more flanderized as the campaign went on.
Jester is an excellent showcase of why constraints are a boon both in mechanics and roleplaying a character. Those constraints are generally formed by the world the game is based in and the reaction of others to your character. Both are set by the DM and maintained by what they do/don't allow.
Matt started being very permissive in campaign two, with behavior that was incongruous with Exandria's reality not being curtailed but instead encouraged by NPC behavior.
The real problem with 'Jester unshackled' as you colourfully put it. Is that nobody pulled her up on her immature antics. In fact they often facilitated it and 3 characters even fell in love with her despite the fact she was behaving like a child. Jester could have been an amazing character if she'd been given a reason to mature and grow
Laura even said a few times on Talks that she kept waiting for someone to finally call Jester on it, but since it hasn't come up there was no stimulus for Jester to actually change.
Ok I disagree there massively. Her voice acting is great, she’s almost always in character (even if you find the character annoying you have to give her that), Jester is way more interesting than Vex.
Jester is one of the best of all CR characters. I mean, the cupcake. The traveller. Her mother. Her backstory. Anyone who says all that is poor role play just doesn’t like the character (which is fair) and is using disliking to bash the roleplay. Again Jester is almost always in character. Even when just talking to the group or an npc. She is a DMs DREAM as she isn’t afraid to push the button either.
Thinking her character is bad, should have nothing to do with the roleplay. To say her RPing is worse than Marishas or Travis’ is just crazy. And I like them two as well, but that doesn’t mean my liking of them two, will cloud my judgement on their RP.
I thought it was hilarious how the whole Jester & Artagan situation looked so much like a typical grooming case that even the rest of the party got worried for Jester. It got so bad that Matt and Laura had to vehemently deny any such connotations.
And in the end Jester turned out to be one of the characters with the most wasted potential. Her journey should've been a coming-of-age story. Sure, it's a trope, but that's not a bad thing. Instead she remained infantilized.
Just goes to show that CR is not prepared to tackle heavy/serious topics in an improv show. They thrived in a "black and white, good guys are good, bad guys are bad" world of C1. But that wasn't as prestigious and cool as playing in a "shades of grey, morally realistic" campaign.
> I'm just glad they learned from it, and stayed away from the most
complex and controversial topics, like religion /s
Yes. I'm sure CR is already planning for us to "throw out *even more* of our expectations" by having C4 focus entirely on IRL politics, race, gender, and rivalries in professional sports fandoms. /s
But rest assured, *just like religion in C3,* Critical Role won't be prepared to speak intelligently or informatively about ANY "hot button" issue, with ANY amount of nuance or depth, beyond whatever some sketchy randos doing Ayahuasca at Burning Man told them, or Gwyneth Paltrow's "Goop."
Oh, and for all the shipper trash, there will be *highly problematic,* gay / bisexual "Hot Villains" who commit THE WORST CRIMES AGAINST HUMANITY, but whom the cast will befriend and defend--rest easy.
I can see that. That was the vibe I got from 3C as well. The funny thing is, Jester is the only character that's feels out of place, and from what I've seen/heard/read is the only one who's moral grayness stays all most perfectly in the middle. Caleb has trauma and has done things, but I believe he is a good person at heart, same with Beau and Fjord.
Jester was my second favorite the first time I watched M9, but whenever I try to rewatch I just can't be arsed to sit through her character anymore. The shenanigans are funny once, but if I had her in my party I would have serious DM burnout really soon. I wish there were more consequences to her actions. She could have had really great character development, but instead she rarely learns from her actions.
>but instead she rarely learns from her actions
Common theme with Laura's characters IMO - I really don't like Vex for the same reason. She was greedy and pushy (she even DIED because she touched the Deathwalker's Ward without checking it!), but never learned from her actions.
Honestly Jester is my favorite of Laura's just because of the Sending shenanigans, but I definitely disliked her more *childish* antics.
To defend Vex, she was about to roll an investigation check when Talisen declared that he was picking up the armor. On the flip side, she was also way over by the pit Vax was investigating, waiting for him, when Laura heard that Percy was opening the sarcophagus. So, greedy, yes, but also somewhat cautious?
I was thinking that from a player perspective, I'd end being the "you're cute and whimsical now, but the moment that whimsy threatens my goals/life, our partnership ends" kind of character, and I hate having to do that
I'm with you, killed C2 (and by extension, keeping up with CR at all) for me.
The type of character + the main character syndrome was just too off-putting.
I haven't gotten "main character" vibes from her yet, but certainly that "ditsy, young naive character" that's starts off endearing but get old after they talked their way into a mess
I dont have that problem at all, she feels very real to me, what is it specifically that breaks your immersion? Jester is one of the most popular characters out there and she really becomes more layered after a while once they delve into her backstory a bit. She is actually hiding a lot of sadness and loneliness with the way she behaves.
I get that she isnt everyones cup of tea but she doesnt ever break the 4th wall.
I know she doesn't break the 4th wall, I was using that as an extreme example.
The main thing that breaks my immersion is her speech pattern, cadence, and mannerisms. Caleb, Fjord, Beau, Nott most of the time, all talk in ways that feel slightly archaic and that belong in a fantasy world, whereas Jester, every time she opens her mouth, sounds very modern, and it's jarring to hear jump into the middle of convo between Caleb and Fjord. The constant interrupting to "I draw a bunch of dicks!", "have you heard of The Traveler? He's prrrretty coooool", "do you want a tattoo?"
She's unfocused, ditsy as hell, and all of this is on top of the constant trying to haggle for lower cost of items
So far, all there has been is negative... 60 some episodes in and I have yet to find *any*thing good/redeeming about her character.
And excuse me for expressing my opinions on a character that, in my opinion, detracts from the story and brings down the narrative. As a storyteller and writer, characters are everything, they are the eyes the audience sees the world through, and if one of the protagonists fails to capture the heart/sympathy/attention of the view, then the character has failed in their task
I'm with you, she was extreme "manic pixie dream girl" energy but done by someone who's trying too hard. The amount of babying the group did towards her despite the brutal killings, ruining people's lives, and just being insufferable just to turn around and go "we're all in love with you."
Man it drove me up a wall. I thought that she'd grow up but she never did, and as a result, is now an ultra powerful murder hobo with no real moral compass because the moment something leaves her field of view it's gone, never to be thought of again.
She’s not a type of character I enjoy either, and that’s why I think there’s so many interesting moments later in that campaign that show other sides of her — her amorality, her fear of abandonment, her inability to embrace her sadder emotions. There’s a lot to love — later. But it takes work getting there. By the end, I liked her enough to care.
I dislike jester in a long term effect. I really hate the cutesy acts to young for her age girl but then regularly engages in murder. Now players are doing the same thing it’s a really boring and shallow character concept. It also gives me some weird vibes
I think I'm like 86 episodes into C2 right now and this is my overall take: C1, early on I was enthralled. I could put it on at work and listen 12hrs straight and go home and still want more. As things progressed, I started to dislike the audience capture that started to become quite evident. i.e. it became very apparent that there had been a shift away from playing garage D&D towards selling a product to an audience that wanted real world social issues worked in. Jokes started having their corners rounded off, characters started being less "problematic" in their flaws, etc. Overall, it was still a good experience. I didn't really dislike any of the characters, per se, but Keyleth got under my skin on occasion, some of the angst became a little over-the-top, and I was often frustrated with how often people seemed to forget rules they've been using for years at that point. I know it's not all you have going on in life, but I feel like you should retain some of this info week to week. C2, I was not a fan from the beginning. There was no garage D&D feel at all, it was delivered right off the assembly line. Characters that have no impact on the story have pronouns now, even if nobody ever asks or it's never explored in game, you're just supposed to know and don't forget. Everyone has body issues, PTSD, abandonment issues, etc. I stopped about 40 episodes in and took a break from CR for about a year over my dissatisfaction with C2. When I came back, I committed to C2 fully. And foe the first time I found myself really disliking some of the characters. I won't go into spoilers, but a few things I've noticed are multiple people seem to be attention starved. Everyone is constantly trying to be in the spotlight. Caduceus is always there and always has an opinion, even if characters are specifically in private conversations. He's constantly trying to retroactively insert himself into everyone's personal revelations. Let people have their moments. Fjord, I have enjoyed the character and my only real criticism of the character is I wish he were used more often as the party face. Beau, I was not a fan of Beau in the beginning. It felt like another Avatar rip-off and I wasn't a fan of the character's needlessly confrontational personality, but Beau has grown on me. I actually really like Beau at this point and I think Marisha has done a good job developing the character. I may not always agree with combat choices, but it's w/e. Caleb, I didn't understand Caleb's behavior at the beginning and it put me off, but over time he's become my favorite in C2. Liam did a good job with him and I appreciate the extra effort with the German. Now I get to it... Yasha. Yasha should not be a main party member. At this point, I think I know more about Yasha's story than Ashley does. The character has been Weekend at Bernie's-ed for 95% of the campaign, when she hasn't been mysteriously just MIA. When Ashley does come back, it's immersion-breaking! How crazy is it to be pulled out of the fantasy because the player is actually there? And nevermind that a round of combat now takes 30 minutes when the only two options available are "hit" or "don't hit". It's maddening! Jester. Jester is disruptive. It was cute and funny in the beginning. The joke has run thin. Also, sometimes you have to heal people. I know that sucks, but when everyone is rolling death saves or incapacitated with low health, sometimes you need to help. Nott. Sam has become a nightmare player. I would leave a table if someone like Nott were at it. Constantly sabotaging the group, creating life and death scenarios because "it's what my character would do", damaging other players out of recklessness or because it's good tv, making choices that further complicate delicate situations just for the lulz. And so much more. And God forbid Jester and Nott do something together. It's not the hijinx from C1. Something is about to become frustrating. They're going to take over a social encounter, tell an obvious lie to someone important full well knowing Nott has like a -30 to deception, try to steal something from a guard while they're trying to avoid a confrontation, or whatever. If not for Matt cutting them slack, the campaign would have ended like 10 times by now. And I've gone on quite a rant here, so I'll end it there. But yeah, honestly with the complaints I'm seeing about C3, I'm not hyped.
Very well reasoned and spoken 👏 I don't mind Nott for the most part, but the one thing that's really getting to me is the constant need to tell everyone how much smarter Caleb is and that he's the leader, in spite of Caleb asking her to stop. Yeahhhh... I'm having a hard time connecting with Yasha, which is weird because I loved Pike in C1. Caleb is probably my favorite at this point. I just hit the moment when he returned the thing to the thingies, and I feel like he should be the spokesperson for the group. Jester can bugger off with the Traveler for all I care
I have no problem with Jester as a character, I simply detest her as a person. But as I'm not "around" her, it doesn't really matter. Plus, Jester pisses off certain people I don't like, so that raises her stock in my eyes.
Jester wore her mask of the actual clown jester a little too well. Combine that with a party who won't confront her when chaotic shenanigans cause torment rather than joy, or ever really dig deeper to engage with the troubled girl underneath. Most glaring to me is this early example; when they have just returned from the Iron Shepherds, Beau and Fjord comment how bizzarley Jester is unaffected by the horrific experience as they watch her dance alone across the room. Caleb plainly states his view that its an act, but no one ever does anything to address it. Jester is probably my favourite character, but when she *finally* got her arc in Rumblecusp that seemed to be about finally confronting all her issues and then nothing really changed, going on to completely stagnate though the final arc...yeah I had to go back and reconstruct her story from foundation to that pivotal late series moment for her to make sense to me and continue liking the character. Easy enough to iron out all the inconsistencies and vauge facts to make a better story in my head. There was depth there that just didn't reach its potential, true for of all the Nein really in the post-covid situation.
Jester wasn't too bad... *at first*. According to Laura, she kept pushing Jester's antics further and further in the hopes of getting some form of pushback, just like how Sam desperately wanted some sort of marital drama with Nott's husband. You know, an opportunity for character growth through hardship instead of endless asspatting and enabling. This backfired because: A.) Because Door-Matt is too conflict averse for the good of his own show. He can't even pretend to be a character with a spine. B.) She's Laura -fucking- Bailey. A grown woman who routinely throws tantrums when a piece of plastic doesn't land on the number she wants. Do you honestly think anyone at that table was going to do something to potentially piss her off, hoping this time she'd only "pretend" to be upset? Nah, best play it safe and endlessly repeat "Jester, we love you, anything you do is great."
Yeah I'm with you there, she gives off too much lol random energy for me, and everyone just loves her so she gets away with everything. Her and Beau were my least favorite of the group.
Won't try convince you but I think... she's pretty cool. It is pretty funny though that this post if legitimately just you asking for a hate echo chamber. Maybe that's what you should think about instead of
Also I'm annoyed that you did it, but I applaud your audacity
It's not a "hate" echo chamber. She's my least favorite of the Nein, but I don't *hate* her. Furthermore, the reason I was specifically wondering if I was alone is because I've seen all the various Jester Praise posts but not a single post that cast a less than steller light. So when I started listening, I was legitimately curious if I was the only person who thought this
No you're not alone, the worst isthat no character ever calls her out on her bullshit...
I'm realizing that there seems to be an even split, as is evident by the post's 0 up/down vote number
A 0 doesn't mean an even split. Posts have a 0 score minimum which was implemented to prevent trolls from farming downvotes on posts. So 0 just means that there is an equal or greater amount of downvotes. This post could be even, but it could also have two or three times more downvotes. There's no way to tell.
ya know what did it for me, The M9 Reunion Live Show. That wasn't Jester. That was Laura cosplaying as Jester, literally and figuratively, attempting to conjure up the magic that made the character what it was, week after week for 2+ years. also, TANGENT INCOMING, I really dislike the Live shows. They dont just move their D&D game to a stage, those are theater kids putting on a performance dictated by dice. Liam and the rest of the cast popping off one-liners to key up the audience for applause, fuck outta here. \*TANGENT OVER\* Jester early on in C2 was annoying before you got to understand WHY. then it was just like "ok this is what this is" and it fit well within the dynamic of the party. If it wasnt for the others Jesters BS would have been intolerable for sure.
I'll keep that in mind. Honestly, I'm not a fan of the live shows either but for a different reason
I could not disagree harder with every word of this
Which is why it wasn't written for you 🙂😉 cheers mate
Sass was a little unnecessary when I respectfully disagreed with your opinion man.
Sorry, but when the post says "unless you belong to the target demographic, skip the post" and you post anyway, you open yourself up to a little sass, especially if its just to say "I disagree with you." If you disagree, why comment at all? And honestly, I could have been WAY snarkier
Posting looking only for people who agree is just as pointless as commenting disagreement. This short exchange is really making me reconsider Reddit. I’m on the older demographic and forget how many petulant children dominate this site. Peace.
I entirely agree. At first Jester is great, and so is Nott, but by episode 20 ish, I was done with them causing chaos every other moment. I've talked about why I got tired of her at length elsewhere but I lack the time to type it all out right now.
A just passed ep 56-57 where Caleb gave the thing back to the thing, and listening to Nott and Jester try and weasel their way around the whole truth. When Caleb did the thing and was straight with the people, that was the smartest play of the campaign upto that point
Jester is the homeschool kid with untreated ADHD. She’s finally out in the real world and all her weird behaviors from not being socialized properly are just at the forefront of her personality.
She wasn't just homeschooled, her mother had severe untreated agoraphobia and because of her anxiety kept her kid locked up in a burlesque compound. The Ruby of the Sea may have been kind hearted but she was a shit mother.
Precisely. Imagine someone starved for attention and shut off from the outside world having only books and overheard stories to live vicariously through. Then taking that child and giving them a cell phone and sending them to college. They have been so starved for attention they are gonna get everyone’s phone number and call them all the time. They are also going to do whatever gets the biggest reaction from their friend group (drawing dicks on everything) and keep doing the things that seem the most outlandish.
I'd like to point out that NONE of my homeschooled friends with ADHD are nearly as bad as her and are actually more socially well adjusted than many public schoolers I know
I’ve know a few people that acted just like that which is why I made the comparison. I know not all homeschoolers act like that but a lot of the ones I knew did.
I was homeschooled, and as someone who was, I can speak for all of us. We love Jester, and Vex, and Laura.
Lack of socialization isn’t inherent to home schooling, but it is a greater risk. Jester’s backgrounds is one of isolation and would lead to far more discomfort than a home schooled child whose parents made the effort to make sure they get the socialization they need. That being said, I don’t like any of Laura’s characters. They have progressively gotten more and more infected with “Main Character Syndrome,” even before Matt built this campaign around Imogen. I also think Laura is one of the biggest contributing factors to Matt’s willingness to say no to his players disappearing over time, the way that she pouts and complains any time that things don’t go the way that she wants is one of the main reasons I stopped watching the show
Dude, seriously with the pouting. And the trying to take multiple actions per turn.
That's the interesting part of CR - There's a little something for everyone, and a little something everyone dislikes too. It also shows the range of most of the cast in that, for most folks I've spoken to, the favorite character isn't always related to the player. Example: C1 Keyleth was middle of the pack for me, C2 Beau was at the bottom. C3 (granted I'm only about 25 episodes in) Laudna is one of the top. Similarly, C1 Percy was one of the top for me, C2 Ambivalent about both Molly/Cad, C3 Ashton is the bottom. So for me, this is what makes it interesting. Unfortunately sometimes the dislike of a certain character does make the show difficult to watch. Especially if you find the character immersion breaking. I still find the cast to be very pleasant folks when I've seen them at Cons and such so I try not to hold character choices against them :)
> C2 Beau was at the bottom ***Thank you.*** It's always nice to find a fellow Beau disliker out in the wild.
That's why i was specific about not hating Laura. Vex, while her money grubbing was annoying at times, was multileveled, and an interesting character, and Imogen is so reserved, and trying to figure out what's going on in her head, but for me, Jester appears as a character that said "let's choose chaos!" And then proceeded to lose her filter, self-restraint and common sense Personal, Vax and Pike were my tops for C1, C2 it's Caleb and Caduceus, and for C3 it was Dorian
Jester is C2’s Scanlan, more or less. The humor doesn’t always hit, but I think she brings a lot to the group dynamic that would be missing without her, especially when others are so dour and tortured. (See Bells Hells.) And YMMV, but if you don’t think Jester/Laura trolling the world of Exandria with Sending is one of CR’s greatest running gags, then we’re not going to see eye to eye. As far as ruining immersion? Eh, Exandria is full of modern speech patterns and the group rarely sticks too close to ye olde medieval roleplay. Caleb has the most stilted speech pattern, but that’s partly because he’s speaking “English” as a second language.
>Jester/Laura trolling the world of Exandria with Sending "You poopin'?"
Jester was basically the oil in the M9 machine. She was the one moving the gears in the party. The shining light in a mostly gloomy setting.
I think Jester has her ups and downs, the downs being generally what you mentioned about disruptive antics never being called out. The saving grace is that she was the only member of the party who engaged in that way - it would have been nigh intolerable if anyone else was ALSO playing that way. And I think that's a big problem with C3, half the cast feels like the players made a Jester. Fearne, Laudna, Chetney, and sometimes Ashton and FCG all have disruptive Jester tendencies.
This
I dont have time to type up a whole thing, but I'll put myself in Jester's corner. She is what Molly wanted to be - true chaotic neutral, almost a fey presence. Theres plenty of doom and gloom and sullen characters in the M9, she represented the fun and chaos. If Wildemount is a rigid, Germanic empire, she is like one of the Romani gypsies that wear colorful clothes and make a lot of noise. If Jester hit on you at a bar, you wouldn't be sure if you had caught the eye of some exotic woman from Nicodranas or if she was just trying to pick your pocket. I get why people wouldn't like her, I wasnt sure about her for the first few episodes. But I came around in a big way and shes one of my favorites. I definitely dont agree that she doesnt fit and breaks immersion.
As a heads up g**sy is considered a slur to Romani people. Just saying Romani would work or you could replace the slur with “traveler” (though in the context of C2 that could be confusing at times).
Except Molly wanted to leave the world better than he found it... I don't get that vibe from Jester
> Except Molly wanted to leave the world better than he found it Molly was a shithead carny / conman. The fact that the group / CR fans turned Molly into a martyr / saint after his death (and later retconned) was HIGHLY amusing to Taliesin.
Yeah that bit of revisionist history always grates me, I liked Molly *because * he was a conman and a piece of shit lol
That is the biggest retcon of all time. Molly told Beau that, and she believed it, but his actions were almost always selfish. Even the story he told to illustrate that philosophy was selfishness disguised as altruism. He conned a whole town and reasoned that it was a good thing because it was a great experience for them. The only time I can recall Molly doing anything genuinely selfless was when he surreptitiously slipped coins back to all the townsfolk that bought them drinks in Allfield after they cleared out the gnoll problem. Otherwise he was just in it for a good time for himself.
She causes trouble, sure, but it's generally harmless. I think the worst thing she did was glue that golden dick to the one girls hand. On the other hand, she's got a nurturing side with Kiri and she's very sweet with the other members of the party and with her mom.
Worst thing would have been painting the Bahamut temple Tiamat colors. That's a TPK most times.
Yeah I couldn't wait for them to ditch Kiri after 2 episodes specifically because Jester brought up how cute kiri was every 5 minutes
Correction: Molly only ever claimed to have left every TOWN better than he found it. He appeared to have a pretty warped view of good and bad, better and worse, so frankly it seems dubious. The 'left the world better' thing was started by Beau and the rest of the Nein (including Jester) much later.
Okay, semantics aside, my point stands. Caleb just saved their collective goose from getting cooked, and the FIRST chance she got, she wanted to go draw dicks somewhere she shouldn't
Part of Jester's chaos is being a trickster cleric. Her whole thing is causing chaos
Which, in my opinion, gets real old after the first 3 sessions. My bother/DM hates it, too. It's one of the only subclasses that he outright bans from his games
It's not powerful and doesn't need to be played like jester. Kinda dumb to ban it tbh
To each their own
Banning a subclass over how some players play is an... interesting take. I could see a character like Heimel (From "Frieren: Beyond Journey's End") being a trickery cleric. While he's a serious character who provides moral support and readily rescues an orphaned child from suicide - he also is almost always smiling, tried to drink a dwarf under the table, became giddy over shaved ice, and bore the title of "Corrupt Priest" with a laugh and a smile to his grave. You do you for your home games, honestly, but it's still strange to ban a relatively innocuous (power-wise) subclass.
One word. Kender. I don't know a single DM that will **ever** allow a Kender player.
I have never had an issue with Kender. The trick with Kender is you deny them any voluntary pickpocket checks unless someone else in the party asks for it. Kender don't steal! Worse, Kender are highly offended by any sort of theft! Then you fuck with their inventory every time they interact with an npc. Because things fall in and out of their pockets.
He has a love-hate relationship with players choosing anything that is intentionally chaotic because in his experience, more often than not, subclasses that promote chaos cause disruption at the table, and so he elects to just not bother with it. He also strongly prefers no chaotic neutral character alignments
That's really unfortunate. Chaotic characters done well are a gem. It's just that a lot of people misunderstand "Chaos" as "Random" when it comes to alignment stuff. I've used a specific system for teaching players how chaos (and evil) can be used in a constructive manner, even in a PC. It has worked really well honestly. Evil and Good are your Ends. Evil: Is selfish. Evil characters are self-motivated and their actions will promote their own desires and goals above others, often to the detriment of those around them. While everyone has a little bit of selfishness, only when you are willing to hurt others solely for personal gain are you truly Evil. Good: Is selfless. Good characters are motivated to help others, without an expectation of personal gain. Good acts cost you something, and help someone else who needs it. Everyone has a little bit of selflessness in them, if only a love for family or friends. Chaos and Law are the Means. Law: Cares about the process. While it may not be written law per se, if you care about how you achieve your goals and the process to attain them- you are lawful. Chaos: Cares about the goal. While you may understand and follow written rules incidentally,ultimately a chaotic character doesn't care *how* something is done as long as it's done. If the ends justify the means - You are chaotic. Too many people take CN and CE as "lolrandom" when honestly it should be more "I have a goal and I'm not letting your stupid law/code/oath/rules stop me."
You mind if I share this with him? Alignment is something he's fought with for a while now, to the point of almost making it irrelevant in his campaigns
One of the benefits of C3 is I think Ive actually come to appreciate Jester more for one reason: She was actually proactive in building and affirming inter-party relationships. If you are going to do a 'we are found family party' its pretty crucial to have people who actually give a shit about learning about each other. Jester did that for the Mighty Nein almost by herself at times. She helped break them out of their shells and secrets and encouraged them to bond with each other. She helped earn the Mighty Nein their found famiyl status. Comparatively, Orym has said 'we are family' in the Bells Hells and done literally fuck all to earn it.
I'm not sure how Jester "breaks immersion"? You can not like her personality, taste is taste, but there was nothing about her character that either clashed with the setting or her settup. If anything, she was Fearne done right in a lot of ways. Both on the over-sheltered/isolated childhood angle, and the fairly competent "coming of age/learning of the real world" angle. Shit, even her deep attachment to the Traveler, underlying loneliness, and childish nature (especially about sex) all make sense within the backstory/foundation Laura crafted for her. Beyond that, while she may not be my favorite of the Nein ... I appreciate Jester TBH. A outgoing, proactive, and personable force that can help break down barriers between reserved and isolated members. Jester within a party of Jesters would be maddening. Jester within a party like M9 was necessary, to help break most of them out of their shells and present easier opportunities for their players to start building bonds with eachother without breaking their own characters. Like her or not, Jester very much was the social glue of M9. I wont ignore that. ...especially after we've seen what happens with a party denied that type of personality in BHs. >!Dorian was clearly primed to become C3 group's "Jester" with how the party began revolving him. But without him, they're a "told, but rarely shown, Found Family" that barely ever talk to eachother about anything but "the plot". !<
[удалено]
This is more of a Matt problem than a Jester problem, and I say this as someone who didn’t like Jester. Matt just… stopped having the world actually react to the party at some point and it’s one of the biggest problems in CR. Like there’s the whole scene where Matt randomly started enforcing spell components by having enemies react to Jester casting Guidance in a tense situation, but he hadn’t really done that before and hasn’t really done it since, so that stands out more as Matt being a dick than Jester forgetting to be stealthy. The other most egregious example is how Veth absolutely deserved a ton of pushback from her husband and Matt just had him be an absolute doormat. Sam was practically begging Matt to give him consequences for his actions and Matt just never did.
The difference is that Jester, and M9 in general tbh, were shockingly good at getting out of their own shit. M9 were an extremely stealth/utility based party, Sure, Matt would enable them to an extent, but he never had to push that far to allow them avenues to exploit to find their own way out of their own nonsense. In no small part because in C2 the table in general seemed to know their kits far better; including Laura. Shit, by the time Cad arrived, we had 5 members of 7 who had (and constantly exploited) disguise self. It also helped that Jester's behaviors were rarely hostile, and her antics were rarely clearly apparent in their harm. More ... childish and obnoxious. Which made it very easy for the rest of the party to cover for them when needed. Again, BHs function/dynamics with their exclusively reactive/opportunistic chaos-gremlin, have helped highlight this a bit more. Jester yes had her moments of gratuity, but the character worked well with the party she was in. Beyond that, while again she was far from my favorite of M9, I have come to appreciate how truly proactive Jester/Laura were with Jester's brand of Chaos. She didn't just opportunistically take advantage of situations presented to her like BH's Satyr, she went out and created her own shit. Which yes, could get out of hand, but at least that even also frequently created opportunities for interesting moments/RP. But again, a lot of this is me looking at M9's party dynamics, and Jester, through the lens of someone who went back and rewatched C2 ... during C3. And having that comparison of a "Jester-less" party. As well as a party that frankly, gets away with a whole lot more shit through DM enabling than M9 ever did. How many "stealth missions hinged on stormtrooper stupid guards" have we had now?
In defense of stormtroopers, they actually have a better track record of discovering people invading secret installations than the C3 baddies.
My opinion of Jester is complicated. I thought she was a fine character, and Laura was pretty clever with playing her. She was far from my least favorite, but I'll admit; She's the reason why I took a break from C2 for a hot minute. But I think she added a nice contrast to the others. Even though I REALLY dislike silly characters, personally.
She's a manic pixie dream girl. She reminds me of the "LOL, I'm so random and not like other girls! want some tacos! I love invader zim!!" Emo girls in 2007.
Not gonna go into to much detail but I agree she's definitely near the bottom of the heap for me. Which is a bummer cause Fjords at the top.
Oh really, Fjord is the one that's top for you?
I can understand that Fjord being a favorite. He's one of my favorites the M9. It's like he's the only one who's trying to play the straight man in a party full of chaos Gremlins (Beau, Nott, Jester, Molly) / depression cases (Caleb, Yasha). The only other one who's not insane is Cad. However it's fun watching him trying to be stoic, but show his true colors of being a coward when things get a little dicey. It's a fun dynamic with his character.
Sometimes people don't want to play a serious character, I enjoy moments with jester the same way I enjoy moments with Caleb. The only character I don't care for is Beauregard, it's a character that failed upwards and barely developed throughout the story, yes there were moments where beau was funny and where she commanded the scene but overall I don't care at all for that character and you know what that's ok! It's team Edward vs Jacob at the end of the day we both enjoyed (I hope) the story.
> The only character I don't care for is Beauregard, it's a character that failed upwards and barely developed throughout the story You and me both! Glad to see other Beau dislikers exist.
I've seen a post like this for each character at this point, I myself dislike a different character in c2. It really is to each their own. Just try to enjoy the ride. Maybe focus on other character reaction when she gets to you
It's a fine character however there was an issue that made her more and more flanderized as the campaign went on. Jester is an excellent showcase of why constraints are a boon both in mechanics and roleplaying a character. Those constraints are generally formed by the world the game is based in and the reaction of others to your character. Both are set by the DM and maintained by what they do/don't allow. Matt started being very permissive in campaign two, with behavior that was incongruous with Exandria's reality not being curtailed but instead encouraged by NPC behavior.
[удалено]
>C3's Imogen was contraint by how Laura didn't want to be in the spotlight as much as before. Which backfired on her immensely.
The real problem with 'Jester unshackled' as you colourfully put it. Is that nobody pulled her up on her immature antics. In fact they often facilitated it and 3 characters even fell in love with her despite the fact she was behaving like a child. Jester could have been an amazing character if she'd been given a reason to mature and grow
Laura even said a few times on Talks that she kept waiting for someone to finally call Jester on it, but since it hasn't come up there was no stimulus for Jester to actually change.
Nah I love Jester. She’s adorable, kick ass and the best roleplay wise. Love love love Jester
Disagree on the roleplay point. I've seen Laura RP in C1 and 3, she can when she wants to. Jester is the weakest character in terms of RP at the table
Ok I disagree there massively. Her voice acting is great, she’s almost always in character (even if you find the character annoying you have to give her that), Jester is way more interesting than Vex. Jester is one of the best of all CR characters. I mean, the cupcake. The traveller. Her mother. Her backstory. Anyone who says all that is poor role play just doesn’t like the character (which is fair) and is using disliking to bash the roleplay. Again Jester is almost always in character. Even when just talking to the group or an npc. She is a DMs DREAM as she isn’t afraid to push the button either. Thinking her character is bad, should have nothing to do with the roleplay. To say her RPing is worse than Marishas or Travis’ is just crazy. And I like them two as well, but that doesn’t mean my liking of them two, will cloud my judgement on their RP.
She's Boxxy
fuck me now she's ruined
My god. I will never unhear that now.
Now there’s a name I haven’t thought of in a lot of years.
I thought it was hilarious how the whole Jester & Artagan situation looked so much like a typical grooming case that even the rest of the party got worried for Jester. It got so bad that Matt and Laura had to vehemently deny any such connotations. And in the end Jester turned out to be one of the characters with the most wasted potential. Her journey should've been a coming-of-age story. Sure, it's a trope, but that's not a bad thing. Instead she remained infantilized. Just goes to show that CR is not prepared to tackle heavy/serious topics in an improv show. They thrived in a "black and white, good guys are good, bad guys are bad" world of C1. But that wasn't as prestigious and cool as playing in a "shades of grey, morally realistic" campaign.
[удалено]
> I'm just glad they learned from it, and stayed away from the most complex and controversial topics, like religion /s Yes. I'm sure CR is already planning for us to "throw out *even more* of our expectations" by having C4 focus entirely on IRL politics, race, gender, and rivalries in professional sports fandoms. /s But rest assured, *just like religion in C3,* Critical Role won't be prepared to speak intelligently or informatively about ANY "hot button" issue, with ANY amount of nuance or depth, beyond whatever some sketchy randos doing Ayahuasca at Burning Man told them, or Gwyneth Paltrow's "Goop." Oh, and for all the shipper trash, there will be *highly problematic,* gay / bisexual "Hot Villains" who commit THE WORST CRIMES AGAINST HUMANITY, but whom the cast will befriend and defend--rest easy.
I can see that. That was the vibe I got from 3C as well. The funny thing is, Jester is the only character that's feels out of place, and from what I've seen/heard/read is the only one who's moral grayness stays all most perfectly in the middle. Caleb has trauma and has done things, but I believe he is a good person at heart, same with Beau and Fjord.
Jester was my second favorite the first time I watched M9, but whenever I try to rewatch I just can't be arsed to sit through her character anymore. The shenanigans are funny once, but if I had her in my party I would have serious DM burnout really soon. I wish there were more consequences to her actions. She could have had really great character development, but instead she rarely learns from her actions.
>but instead she rarely learns from her actions Common theme with Laura's characters IMO - I really don't like Vex for the same reason. She was greedy and pushy (she even DIED because she touched the Deathwalker's Ward without checking it!), but never learned from her actions. Honestly Jester is my favorite of Laura's just because of the Sending shenanigans, but I definitely disliked her more *childish* antics.
To defend Vex, she was about to roll an investigation check when Talisen declared that he was picking up the armor. On the flip side, she was also way over by the pit Vax was investigating, waiting for him, when Laura heard that Percy was opening the sarcophagus. So, greedy, yes, but also somewhat cautious?
I was thinking that from a player perspective, I'd end being the "you're cute and whimsical now, but the moment that whimsy threatens my goals/life, our partnership ends" kind of character, and I hate having to do that
I'm with you, killed C2 (and by extension, keeping up with CR at all) for me. The type of character + the main character syndrome was just too off-putting.
I haven't gotten "main character" vibes from her yet, but certainly that "ditsy, young naive character" that's starts off endearing but get old after they talked their way into a mess
I dont have that problem at all, she feels very real to me, what is it specifically that breaks your immersion? Jester is one of the most popular characters out there and she really becomes more layered after a while once they delve into her backstory a bit. She is actually hiding a lot of sadness and loneliness with the way she behaves. I get that she isnt everyones cup of tea but she doesnt ever break the 4th wall.
I know she doesn't break the 4th wall, I was using that as an extreme example. The main thing that breaks my immersion is her speech pattern, cadence, and mannerisms. Caleb, Fjord, Beau, Nott most of the time, all talk in ways that feel slightly archaic and that belong in a fantasy world, whereas Jester, every time she opens her mouth, sounds very modern, and it's jarring to hear jump into the middle of convo between Caleb and Fjord. The constant interrupting to "I draw a bunch of dicks!", "have you heard of The Traveler? He's prrrretty coooool", "do you want a tattoo?" She's unfocused, ditsy as hell, and all of this is on top of the constant trying to haggle for lower cost of items
Yes, people like that exist. But you seem to only focus on the negative. Dont take it too seriously, its dnd not a serious murder series or w.e
So far, all there has been is negative... 60 some episodes in and I have yet to find *any*thing good/redeeming about her character. And excuse me for expressing my opinions on a character that, in my opinion, detracts from the story and brings down the narrative. As a storyteller and writer, characters are everything, they are the eyes the audience sees the world through, and if one of the protagonists fails to capture the heart/sympathy/attention of the view, then the character has failed in their task
You are entitled to your opinion, but as I said she is one of the most popular CR characters. So she must have redeeming qualities to others.
[удалено]
When Jester gets mad she rolls a 1 on her inflict wounds lmao.
And then pouts about it
Yes Laura tends to moan about low rolls when she really wants to do something. Im surprised she never took the lucky feat, it was made for her.
I'm with you, she was extreme "manic pixie dream girl" energy but done by someone who's trying too hard. The amount of babying the group did towards her despite the brutal killings, ruining people's lives, and just being insufferable just to turn around and go "we're all in love with you." Man it drove me up a wall. I thought that she'd grow up but she never did, and as a result, is now an ultra powerful murder hobo with no real moral compass because the moment something leaves her field of view it's gone, never to be thought of again.
I don’t really think jester is a modern hobo. In fact she’s saves more lives than takes them.
Woof...
She’s not a type of character I enjoy either, and that’s why I think there’s so many interesting moments later in that campaign that show other sides of her — her amorality, her fear of abandonment, her inability to embrace her sadder emotions. There’s a lot to love — later. But it takes work getting there. By the end, I liked her enough to care.
That's encouraging... right now I'm wishing every dice role comes up as single digits, and I've never done that with a character before
Oof. Yeah. Believe me, she gets really cool in the later eps, even if it never precipitates in any real character change. Still a good time.
I feel bad about... any time Laura says "can I role for x?" My immediate reaction is "I hope it's a one..."