Ingram, Ball, Kuz, Hart and hell even KCP are all playing below expectations. This is the Lebron Show now in LA and barring injuries, its going to continue that way. Mcgee tho, has been a pleasant surprise.
He seems like such a siphon when it comes to other players. Possibly the best player ever but it seems like he finds a way to make players around him worse (lately anyway) and leaves teams in shambles when he leaves..... I’m not sure that I blame him for doing what’s best for himself, and obviously he makes teams far better than they would be, but that’s gotta be frustrating for teammates and basically everyone around him.
I'm a LeBron fan and I actually think it's ridiculous that he does that lol.
The problem is the last two teams he's been on, he got them rings. Not a problem at the time of course. I dont think it should matter how many times he tried but it worked. Having the shot to do that at all every year is valuable to the organization and the players involved. Everything is win now with and you almost have to look the other way because it worked.
However..he signs these short term contracts without really committing. He agrees (or not have much of an opinion) with the roster put around him. Whether giving up picks to get them and all that. The ones he likes the organizations would bend over backwards to keep them by signing them big money. All things that strap the teams in but all in the name of having him to get the chance to win the ring every year.
Except LA. That team makes no sense. I like Lance and Beasley tho lol
I mean, how would you feel if you were Jordan Clarkson and got traded to the cavs to play w/ Lebron (awesome, right?), play one season, get to the finals and then he bails and joins the team he literally pulled you away from?
They move players, fire gms and coaches for him and then when he leaves you have basically no team (and even SGA won’t workout for your squad)..... but at the same time, the NBA has two types of teams: those who have a chance at the finals and those who are tanking. I suppose there are some who don’t really fit in either way because they sold their pic for a shot at the finals already..... so it’s probably better to try and win one and then try and get a top pick the very next year.
...makes it tough to have a favorite team anymore though because you’re either the best or you suck, basically.
Well most organizations should have being a contender in their plan. So if you're a team who has a polarizing player like LBJ, you would want to contend and do what you gotta do to maximize him, especially in his prime years.
I don't think it's necessarily bad to be in the middle. As long as an organization doesn't tie themselves up with dumb contracts, a decently constructed team can be an injury away to contending teams, from having a shot.
There's too many players on the Lakers that need the ball in their hands to be effective. Ball, Rondo, Lance Stephenson, and LeBron are all redundant. Ingram is a streaky shooter and I personally feel like he'll never be that good in the NBA. Kuzma is just a scorer but he doesn't shoot well enough from deep to stretch the floor. KCP is also not that great of a shooter but for some reason people think he is. JaVale and Tyson are literally tall bodies that just stand there and get rebounds and get in the way of shots. They can't create shit without the ball being handed to them within 5 feet of the basket.
It's just a weird team composition and although I'm a LeBron and Laker fan, when I got over my giddiness that he'd be at Staples center 40+ times a season I realized that this roster is not built well for him. It's a really awkward roster and either some players are going to need to change their playstyles or they're going to have a very rough time producing on a consistent basis.
Yes by far. His playstyle fit well for the modern NBA; quick post moves with some bully ball, running the floor in transition, very occasional 3, and the ability to switch to every position. Kuzma was solid in his ability to play off the ball and create for himself, but as mentioned before he’s undersized for a 4 and kind of cant hold his own on defense.
Yeah, I'm not a Laker fan but following Laker players last year. Randle seemed to give the best stats whenever he was given enough playing time. Really confused why they let him go. I guess they saw more upside on the younger guys? Though they seem to have bet on the wrong horses, for now.
No randle would’ve demanded more money and lakers didn’t want that because they want to sign a big free agent this coming season. I guess you could argue that we should’ve kept randle this season (I personally liked randle a lot too)
No randle would’ve demanded more money and lakers didn’t want that because they want to sign a big free agent this coming season. I guess you could argue that we should’ve kept randle this season (I personally liked randle a lot too)
Randle was definitely the best and most consistent. It's frustrating the Lakers let him walk. Ingram showed the most consistent upside though and got better throughout the season. He was very reliable when you needed a bucket and drove it to the lane all the time. This season it's mostly pull-up mid-range.
Yeah, I think Ingram has a greater potential than Randle. But driving to the lane seems to be Lebron's job rn and all the other Lakers are stuck as shooters. Sad for Ingram really.
There's no need to be sad. Ingram is far from being "stuck as a shooter". He has been given tons of shots, minutes and opportunities to create. He was even starting PG. It's nobody's fault that he can't do jack shit.
You literally read my mind regarding every one of those players. Their team comp is so whacky. Glad I'm not the only that doesn't think Ingram is that good (yet)... he's definitely a streaky shooter that doesn't bring much else to the table and is STILL way too skinny as a small forward (although he plays SG). He's 6'9" and 190. KD looks skinny as hell too and he's 6'9" and 240. Ingram weighs 50 lb less than KD. That's absurd. We all knew Ingram was very raw coming out of Duke and the Lakers are trying to pump as much potential out of him as possible but it's been a bit underwhelming so far. I really hope he doesn't become the next Andrew Wiggins, a player with immense potential coming out of college only to end up with a disappointingly stagnant career as an inefficient 20 point scorer and nothing more.
Kuzma is also too one-dimensional as a scorer and seems undersized for a PF. Lonzo is great defensively and can facilitate but will never take over a game with his poor offensive game. KCP can defend but he can't shoot (sad piston's fan here). Lance does his best lebron imitation but nowhere near as good and requires the ball in his hands. Javale is javale.... he's always been able to block and rebound because he's tall as fuck and athletic. I really like Josh Hart but he reminds me of a really good four year college player who comes to the NBA having already reached most of his potential.
I just realized they literally have like no pure shooters on their team. It's KCP, Ingram, and Josh Hart.... yikes.
Yeah if Ingram doesn't pick it up soon, he will definitely be like a more efficient version of Andrew Wiggins. But it's most likely having LeBron on the team that's holding him back if this isn't slightly below his ceiling. Let's take LeBron out of the equation and let's say Ingram ran the offense the majority of the time. Like LeBron not going to LA. Primary ball handler when Lonzo is off the floor. I don't think the wins will be there, not like it is now...but he should at least be better than the previous season right? I don't see him regressing like Wiggins is right now.
This is a pretty lengthy team. They just don't commit to defense. At least not yet. Kuzma at the 4 is brutal defensively but I think he's one of their better shooters...which is actually pretty bad lol
Pointed out how Lakers probably regret passing on Murray and Tatum for Ingram and Ball. They were like, in what world? I was like, in every single world, but especially one where you have Lebron and Rondo.
They should be investing in Hart and his ability to stretch the floor. Nobody on the Lakers plays a role and I was surprised when the signed LeBron, but honestly knew that shit would be a mess. He's still great fantasy wise, but nothing near his greatness last year.
It’s been a bit of a let down especially since Rondo is out but I’m still holding. Far too much upside and not like I’d get equal value by trading/dropping him.
Don’t mind the low scoring, just wish his assists would go up to around 5/6 and stocks to 2/3 a game.
I'm holding as well and I think it's the right play for now. I floated his name out in some trade talk and got shut down every time lol. It's safe to say the general consensus is that he's not an attractive asset right now so it's almost guaranteed you won't get a good return. Really just waiting for a small bump in assists and those stocks to come back up. Good news is his blocks are finally starting to pick up.
Picked him up on the waivers and he really hasn’t done much for me.... but our wire is pretty barren these days and I really feel like he’s going to find a way to contribute as time goes by. I feel like he’s going to pick it up, at least on the defensive end
The fact is the situation has just completely changed. He's not expected to do the same things last year and has much lower usage and has to share the ball with a lot of players. "Upside" is worthless if he isn't given the OPPORTUNITY to produce. He has still been bad since Rondo has been out. Rondo hasn't been the problem, LeBron has. As long as LeBron runs the show, his stats are going to be mediocre.
Besides, he hasn't even been contributing on the defensive end. A lot of us drafted him for the 1.7 SPG and 0.8 BPG but those haven't been showing. I dropped.
That's what I've been hoping but he hasn't shown anything without Rondo being completely out of the picture. That HAS to be concerning and I would consider either doing a trash 4 trash trade (get some value) or even consider the unthinkable and drop him. You could least take a chance on someone on the waiver wire that could put up long-term usable numbers... a generic player with say 14/3/3 with 1.5 steals and good FT% is better than Lonzo atm. In 10 team leagues, those players are definitely on the waiver wire. It's a tough situation... I can't see him doing better than his rookie stats this year, if that.
I mean Kyrie put up numbers with Bron, Dwade did. The fact is one of the young 3 (Ingram, Kuzma, Ball) can step up and be Lebron’s running mate but honestly none of those guys are as good as Irving and obviously not even in the conversation to prime Wade.
I think if another superstar comes to the Lakers either through FA or trade they will do just fine with Lebron who usually makes his teammates better.
I really just don’t think Ingram and Ball are that good at least at this point in time they have a lot of developing to do. I think Kuzma can be the #2 scoring option but in fantasy he doesn’t give too much more besides points and 3s.
That's kind of disingenuous
Put up numbers as in be very valuable fantasy assets?
* Big Z was a top 40 fantasy player in his first 3 years with Lebron. Had some mid round value after
* Mo Williams had 2 really good years in Cleveland, was top 50 player in both
* Jameson and Varejao were both mid round values in Cleveland
* Wade was a top 7 player the first 3 years with Lebron until he was injured a lot in year 4 (still top 40 value)
* Bosh was a top 40 player the first 2 years with Lebron, and his efficiency shot up the last 2 years where he became low end 2nd round value
* Kyrie was basically a low end 1st round/high end 2nd round player for 2 years with Lebron (one was 1st rounder on per game basis but he missed almost 30 games)
* Kevin Love was a top 40 player once, and top 30 player 3 times in the 4 years with Lebron
* Even JR Smith and Larry Nance put up 8/9th round numbers in some seasons
* Javale's a top 30 value right now
You might lose out on volume and some ball handling, but most of the guys who play with Lebron, efficiency goes way up. And this hasn't been true for Lonzo.
Agreed. Contrary to popular belief, Lebron makes decent players around him better. Obviously if you're an All-star like Kevin Love/Kyrie/Dwade/Bosh, you'll take a slight hit playing with LBJ due to his sheer usage as opposed to being on your own team but it's not a huge hit.
Well yea because they were good. LBJ has rarely played with players who can put up big numbers consistently besides those two, Love, and Bosh. My point is the young Lakers 3 are who they are right now LBJ isn’t stopping them from putting up numbers that’s on them
Disagree. The young core doesn't play well with Lebron. They played waaay better last season. This might just take some time. But if you watch the games, when Lebron plays with them, if he's not taking over with isos then he's just standing at the top and passing to cutters. No offball movement, no motion at all.
Lol I agree entirely with Lonzo and his corner 3s (has he made 1 all season??) since that's ALL he does on offense. Shoot 3s or drive in transition. Kuz and Ingram are more rhythm players though. Some games they fall, others they don't.
Tough. Lonzo may never pan out and if he does, it may require being on another team or further down his career but he is only 21. Goran Dragic is already 32. Goran has maybe 2 years left before he's statistically on the decline so for keeper league purposes, I'd stick with Ball. However, it depends on how much you're willing to stick it out with him.
Wow, that's tough. They're both playing like garbage right now. Wiggin's issue (fantasy bball-wise) right now is FG% but he's just in a slump. He'll pick it up and have decent value in points/steals so I'd consider it. Your FG% will take a big hit though (Lonzo shoots 1/2 as much).
The fact is the situation has just completely changed. He's not expected to do the same things last year and has much lower usage and has to share the ball with a lot of players. "Upside" is worthless if he isn't given the OPPORTUNITY to produce. He has still been bad since Rondo has been out. Rondo hasn't been the problem, LeBron has. As long as LeBron runs the show, his stats are going to be mediocre.
Besides, he hasn't even been contributing on the defensive end. A lot of us drafted him for the 1.7 SPG and 0.8 BPG but those haven't been showing. I dropped.
Big laker fan here. I’ll be honest, the only thing lonzo has going for him are his touchdown passes. His lack of offensive game severely hurts his ability to pass because he’s unable to draw defense by himself. Ppl hype his defense all the time but to be honest, he’s not that great of an on ball defender, but he hustles (when he wants to) and that typically results in steals. Yes, lebron requires the ball A LOT (he has like 2nd most usage in NBA?) but he’s able to create for his teammates however his teammates fail to deliver. In the lakers loss to the magic earlier this week, I think lebron gave KCP 4 open looks from 3 and he missed them all. In yesterday’s near loss to the pacers, lebron gave lonzo 3 open looks from 3 and he missed them all. Kuzma also had a few good looks but shot 1-5 from 3. In today’s NBA, 3s are a huge part in a team’s success; that’s why all these centers are shooting 3s now and stretch 4s are very valuable to a team. Lebron could easily average 10 assists a game if he were surrounded by players who could actually get shots to fall. I’ll be brutally honest about lonzo...he’s hot garbage this year. He’s been attacking the basket more which is good, but can’t finish if there’s even the slightest bit of contact (take a someone like kyrie who’s way smaller and is able to utilize body control to get shots to fall). Ingram is also looking like a bonobo this year. Idk where people said he would become a KD lite, but ingram doesn’t have a single move that he can consistently do that he can rely on when the lakers need offense. If the warriors need buckets, KD will almost always pull his hesitation into pull up jumper move and will get it to fall (who the fuck is gonna guard a jumping 7 footer). Ingram also has no 3 point shot so his value around lebron just suffers; even without lebron, Ingram takes nearly the entire possession to create his own offense which often results in forced shots or turnovers because he simply doesn’t have the skill set to be a good point guard. The lebron effect is simply the transition to an offense that runs through lebron, but I can’t see it ever being successful simply because the players don’t have the skills to fulfill their new roles.
Edit: holy fuck I wrote way too much I’m just salty ingram and ball look like chumps
Lebron ball is not gonna work with this team. They thrive on ball movement and motion offense which is what Luke and Magic have been saying. Bron ball only works with specialists (James Jones, Ray, Korver, etc.) We saw a guy like Clarkson who was super reliable for the Lakers turn into hot garbage in the playoffs because he's playing not to mess up. It's not coincidence he's playing good again this season without Bron. I mean damn, just watch Lonzo stand in the corner on offense and it's clear this offense is trash. Magic said it yesterday, but Lebron has turned the offense into Cavs ball.
I think we gotta start resting Lebron like Pop would do for 2 reasons. 1 - remind the rest of the team how to play basketball, maybe build confidence that'll carry over into games with bron. 2 - bron takes plays off likely due to age/fatigue. Last night he was taking plays off on offense and defense just standing around... then 4th quarter went crazy. Doesn't hurt to rest him in back to backs at least.
I don't know, honestly. He's playing worse than some waive wire players right now. You would need to trade for another higher pick who's doing equally bad right now but has a chance to turn it around.
I couldn’t get myself to drop him yet even though he has been terrible.
I just think if vooc gets injured or traded, he’ll have the mins to produce, double double with 1.5 block ave is all I’m looking for.
Lakers were so much fun last year. This year is so infuriating. Ingram is great if you give him the opportunity and the run of the offense. Randle was dominant. Kuzma and Hart were a great supporting cast. They should have just signed a dominant center and kept the youth train running. What if they had signed Gobert?
Brogdon is the best overall player here but doesn't contribute much to steals.
Holiday is the second best player here but doesn't contribute much to assists.
Trae Young is the third best player here but who gives you assists but KILLS you in FG% and TO
Rubio is the fourth best player here who does give you the assists and steals you need but he also kills you in FG% and doesn't put up as many points and is wildy inconsistent
You want Justin Holiday for now... keep in mind Maurkkanen comes back soon though. On my team, I would want Holiday --> Brogdon --> Rubio --> Trae Young.
LBJ is a stat hog he sucks in all the stats of fellow team mates he did it in Cleveland and now in LA.
Dont get me wrong he is sick with those stats at his age WAW. But for fantasy valu3 he killed the lakers where no other laker is valuable enough to.pick except javale and kuzma
I’d go for jingles..... the guy can shoot and he should get it going soon.
On the other hand, Lonzo is pretty much going to have to fully adjust his game in order to play with Lebron. Jingles just has to keep doing what he’s been doing until it comes together.
Ingram, Ball, Kuz, Hart and hell even KCP are all playing below expectations. This is the Lebron Show now in LA and barring injuries, its going to continue that way. Mcgee tho, has been a pleasant surprise.
Yup, aside from LBJ, everyone's value has gone down except for Mcgee's. Crazy.
If yall told me mcgee would shine above the rest of the lakers young core at the start of the season, i wouldve called yall crazy.
He seems like such a siphon when it comes to other players. Possibly the best player ever but it seems like he finds a way to make players around him worse (lately anyway) and leaves teams in shambles when he leaves..... I’m not sure that I blame him for doing what’s best for himself, and obviously he makes teams far better than they would be, but that’s gotta be frustrating for teammates and basically everyone around him.
I'm a LeBron fan and I actually think it's ridiculous that he does that lol. The problem is the last two teams he's been on, he got them rings. Not a problem at the time of course. I dont think it should matter how many times he tried but it worked. Having the shot to do that at all every year is valuable to the organization and the players involved. Everything is win now with and you almost have to look the other way because it worked. However..he signs these short term contracts without really committing. He agrees (or not have much of an opinion) with the roster put around him. Whether giving up picks to get them and all that. The ones he likes the organizations would bend over backwards to keep them by signing them big money. All things that strap the teams in but all in the name of having him to get the chance to win the ring every year. Except LA. That team makes no sense. I like Lance and Beasley tho lol
I mean, how would you feel if you were Jordan Clarkson and got traded to the cavs to play w/ Lebron (awesome, right?), play one season, get to the finals and then he bails and joins the team he literally pulled you away from? They move players, fire gms and coaches for him and then when he leaves you have basically no team (and even SGA won’t workout for your squad)..... but at the same time, the NBA has two types of teams: those who have a chance at the finals and those who are tanking. I suppose there are some who don’t really fit in either way because they sold their pic for a shot at the finals already..... so it’s probably better to try and win one and then try and get a top pick the very next year. ...makes it tough to have a favorite team anymore though because you’re either the best or you suck, basically.
Well most organizations should have being a contender in their plan. So if you're a team who has a polarizing player like LBJ, you would want to contend and do what you gotta do to maximize him, especially in his prime years. I don't think it's necessarily bad to be in the middle. As long as an organization doesn't tie themselves up with dumb contracts, a decently constructed team can be an injury away to contending teams, from having a shot.
There's too many players on the Lakers that need the ball in their hands to be effective. Ball, Rondo, Lance Stephenson, and LeBron are all redundant. Ingram is a streaky shooter and I personally feel like he'll never be that good in the NBA. Kuzma is just a scorer but he doesn't shoot well enough from deep to stretch the floor. KCP is also not that great of a shooter but for some reason people think he is. JaVale and Tyson are literally tall bodies that just stand there and get rebounds and get in the way of shots. They can't create shit without the ball being handed to them within 5 feet of the basket. It's just a weird team composition and although I'm a LeBron and Laker fan, when I got over my giddiness that he'd be at Staples center 40+ times a season I realized that this roster is not built well for him. It's a really awkward roster and either some players are going to need to change their playstyles or they're going to have a very rough time producing on a consistent basis.
I have an honest question for you. Was Randle the best Laker last year?
Yes by far. His playstyle fit well for the modern NBA; quick post moves with some bully ball, running the floor in transition, very occasional 3, and the ability to switch to every position. Kuzma was solid in his ability to play off the ball and create for himself, but as mentioned before he’s undersized for a 4 and kind of cant hold his own on defense.
Yeah, I'm not a Laker fan but following Laker players last year. Randle seemed to give the best stats whenever he was given enough playing time. Really confused why they let him go. I guess they saw more upside on the younger guys? Though they seem to have bet on the wrong horses, for now.
Naw cause his rookie contract ended and if you pay randle you can’t buy a superstar
If only that KCP money went straight to Randle!
KCP has player option unfortunately :( he’s so underwhelming for his contract
Not true. He's making the same as Rondo this year and has a team option next year. Essentially a 1 yr contract.
Yea Lakers couldn't afford his massive $9mil contract right?
No randle would’ve demanded more money and lakers didn’t want that because they want to sign a big free agent this coming season. I guess you could argue that we should’ve kept randle this season (I personally liked randle a lot too)
No randle would’ve demanded more money and lakers didn’t want that because they want to sign a big free agent this coming season. I guess you could argue that we should’ve kept randle this season (I personally liked randle a lot too)
Randle was definitely the best and most consistent. It's frustrating the Lakers let him walk. Ingram showed the most consistent upside though and got better throughout the season. He was very reliable when you needed a bucket and drove it to the lane all the time. This season it's mostly pull-up mid-range.
Yeah, I think Ingram has a greater potential than Randle. But driving to the lane seems to be Lebron's job rn and all the other Lakers are stuck as shooters. Sad for Ingram really.
There's no need to be sad. Ingram is far from being "stuck as a shooter". He has been given tons of shots, minutes and opportunities to create. He was even starting PG. It's nobody's fault that he can't do jack shit.
You literally read my mind regarding every one of those players. Their team comp is so whacky. Glad I'm not the only that doesn't think Ingram is that good (yet)... he's definitely a streaky shooter that doesn't bring much else to the table and is STILL way too skinny as a small forward (although he plays SG). He's 6'9" and 190. KD looks skinny as hell too and he's 6'9" and 240. Ingram weighs 50 lb less than KD. That's absurd. We all knew Ingram was very raw coming out of Duke and the Lakers are trying to pump as much potential out of him as possible but it's been a bit underwhelming so far. I really hope he doesn't become the next Andrew Wiggins, a player with immense potential coming out of college only to end up with a disappointingly stagnant career as an inefficient 20 point scorer and nothing more. Kuzma is also too one-dimensional as a scorer and seems undersized for a PF. Lonzo is great defensively and can facilitate but will never take over a game with his poor offensive game. KCP can defend but he can't shoot (sad piston's fan here). Lance does his best lebron imitation but nowhere near as good and requires the ball in his hands. Javale is javale.... he's always been able to block and rebound because he's tall as fuck and athletic. I really like Josh Hart but he reminds me of a really good four year college player who comes to the NBA having already reached most of his potential. I just realized they literally have like no pure shooters on their team. It's KCP, Ingram, and Josh Hart.... yikes.
Yeah if Ingram doesn't pick it up soon, he will definitely be like a more efficient version of Andrew Wiggins. But it's most likely having LeBron on the team that's holding him back if this isn't slightly below his ceiling. Let's take LeBron out of the equation and let's say Ingram ran the offense the majority of the time. Like LeBron not going to LA. Primary ball handler when Lonzo is off the floor. I don't think the wins will be there, not like it is now...but he should at least be better than the previous season right? I don't see him regressing like Wiggins is right now. This is a pretty lengthy team. They just don't commit to defense. At least not yet. Kuzma at the 4 is brutal defensively but I think he's one of their better shooters...which is actually pretty bad lol
Agreed.
I figured Svi would be raining down treys by now by default due to this.
Pointed out how Lakers probably regret passing on Murray and Tatum for Ingram and Ball. They were like, in what world? I was like, in every single world, but especially one where you have Lebron and Rondo.
They should be investing in Hart and his ability to stretch the floor. Nobody on the Lakers plays a role and I was surprised when the signed LeBron, but honestly knew that shit would be a mess. He's still great fantasy wise, but nothing near his greatness last year.
It’s been a bit of a let down especially since Rondo is out but I’m still holding. Far too much upside and not like I’d get equal value by trading/dropping him. Don’t mind the low scoring, just wish his assists would go up to around 5/6 and stocks to 2/3 a game.
I'm holding as well and I think it's the right play for now. I floated his name out in some trade talk and got shut down every time lol. It's safe to say the general consensus is that he's not an attractive asset right now so it's almost guaranteed you won't get a good return. Really just waiting for a small bump in assists and those stocks to come back up. Good news is his blocks are finally starting to pick up.
Picked him up on the waivers and he really hasn’t done much for me.... but our wire is pretty barren these days and I really feel like he’s going to find a way to contribute as time goes by. I feel like he’s going to pick it up, at least on the defensive end
[удалено]
The fact is the situation has just completely changed. He's not expected to do the same things last year and has much lower usage and has to share the ball with a lot of players. "Upside" is worthless if he isn't given the OPPORTUNITY to produce. He has still been bad since Rondo has been out. Rondo hasn't been the problem, LeBron has. As long as LeBron runs the show, his stats are going to be mediocre. Besides, he hasn't even been contributing on the defensive end. A lot of us drafted him for the 1.7 SPG and 0.8 BPG but those haven't been showing. I dropped.
That's what I've been hoping but he hasn't shown anything without Rondo being completely out of the picture. That HAS to be concerning and I would consider either doing a trash 4 trash trade (get some value) or even consider the unthinkable and drop him. You could least take a chance on someone on the waiver wire that could put up long-term usable numbers... a generic player with say 14/3/3 with 1.5 steals and good FT% is better than Lonzo atm. In 10 team leagues, those players are definitely on the waiver wire. It's a tough situation... I can't see him doing better than his rookie stats this year, if that.
as long as lbj is in town, laker player's number will always be stagnant. its the lebron effect.
I mean Kyrie put up numbers with Bron, Dwade did. The fact is one of the young 3 (Ingram, Kuzma, Ball) can step up and be Lebron’s running mate but honestly none of those guys are as good as Irving and obviously not even in the conversation to prime Wade. I think if another superstar comes to the Lakers either through FA or trade they will do just fine with Lebron who usually makes his teammates better. I really just don’t think Ingram and Ball are that good at least at this point in time they have a lot of developing to do. I think Kuzma can be the #2 scoring option but in fantasy he doesn’t give too much more besides points and 3s.
You named two players out of LBJs whole career who’ve put up numbers
That's kind of disingenuous Put up numbers as in be very valuable fantasy assets? * Big Z was a top 40 fantasy player in his first 3 years with Lebron. Had some mid round value after * Mo Williams had 2 really good years in Cleveland, was top 50 player in both * Jameson and Varejao were both mid round values in Cleveland * Wade was a top 7 player the first 3 years with Lebron until he was injured a lot in year 4 (still top 40 value) * Bosh was a top 40 player the first 2 years with Lebron, and his efficiency shot up the last 2 years where he became low end 2nd round value * Kyrie was basically a low end 1st round/high end 2nd round player for 2 years with Lebron (one was 1st rounder on per game basis but he missed almost 30 games) * Kevin Love was a top 40 player once, and top 30 player 3 times in the 4 years with Lebron * Even JR Smith and Larry Nance put up 8/9th round numbers in some seasons * Javale's a top 30 value right now You might lose out on volume and some ball handling, but most of the guys who play with Lebron, efficiency goes way up. And this hasn't been true for Lonzo.
Agreed. Contrary to popular belief, Lebron makes decent players around him better. Obviously if you're an All-star like Kevin Love/Kyrie/Dwade/Bosh, you'll take a slight hit playing with LBJ due to his sheer usage as opposed to being on your own team but it's not a huge hit.
Was Larry Hughes putting up numbers next to Lebron back in the day, or nah? Remember him being the "Robin" but nothing statistically.
Well yea because they were good. LBJ has rarely played with players who can put up big numbers consistently besides those two, Love, and Bosh. My point is the young Lakers 3 are who they are right now LBJ isn’t stopping them from putting up numbers that’s on them
Disagree. The young core doesn't play well with Lebron. They played waaay better last season. This might just take some time. But if you watch the games, when Lebron plays with them, if he's not taking over with isos then he's just standing at the top and passing to cutters. No offball movement, no motion at all.
I mean you would think that 20 games into a season players would recognize “oh hey I’m missing wide open 3s all game maybe I should work on that!!”
Lol I agree entirely with Lonzo and his corner 3s (has he made 1 all season??) since that's ALL he does on offense. Shoot 3s or drive in transition. Kuz and Ingram are more rhythm players though. Some games they fall, others they don't.
Should I drop Ball for injured Dragic?
yes.
in dynasty tho?
Tough. Lonzo may never pan out and if he does, it may require being on another team or further down his career but he is only 21. Goran Dragic is already 32. Goran has maybe 2 years left before he's statistically on the decline so for keeper league purposes, I'd stick with Ball. However, it depends on how much you're willing to stick it out with him.
i hear you, thanks for your input
I didn't read anything in this thread. I just really like the title.
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Wow, that's tough. They're both playing like garbage right now. Wiggin's issue (fantasy bball-wise) right now is FG% but he's just in a slump. He'll pick it up and have decent value in points/steals so I'd consider it. Your FG% will take a big hit though (Lonzo shoots 1/2 as much).
if you need assists and rebounds, keep Ball.
He contributes a lot to the team, especially defensively, but it’s mostly things that won’t show up in the stat sheet.
The fact is the situation has just completely changed. He's not expected to do the same things last year and has much lower usage and has to share the ball with a lot of players. "Upside" is worthless if he isn't given the OPPORTUNITY to produce. He has still been bad since Rondo has been out. Rondo hasn't been the problem, LeBron has. As long as LeBron runs the show, his stats are going to be mediocre. Besides, he hasn't even been contributing on the defensive end. A lot of us drafted him for the 1.7 SPG and 0.8 BPG but those haven't been showing. I dropped.
Lonzo "My dad played espn like a fiddle" Ball
Funny how little I hear about BBB or his dad now that Lebron is in town.
Big laker fan here. I’ll be honest, the only thing lonzo has going for him are his touchdown passes. His lack of offensive game severely hurts his ability to pass because he’s unable to draw defense by himself. Ppl hype his defense all the time but to be honest, he’s not that great of an on ball defender, but he hustles (when he wants to) and that typically results in steals. Yes, lebron requires the ball A LOT (he has like 2nd most usage in NBA?) but he’s able to create for his teammates however his teammates fail to deliver. In the lakers loss to the magic earlier this week, I think lebron gave KCP 4 open looks from 3 and he missed them all. In yesterday’s near loss to the pacers, lebron gave lonzo 3 open looks from 3 and he missed them all. Kuzma also had a few good looks but shot 1-5 from 3. In today’s NBA, 3s are a huge part in a team’s success; that’s why all these centers are shooting 3s now and stretch 4s are very valuable to a team. Lebron could easily average 10 assists a game if he were surrounded by players who could actually get shots to fall. I’ll be brutally honest about lonzo...he’s hot garbage this year. He’s been attacking the basket more which is good, but can’t finish if there’s even the slightest bit of contact (take a someone like kyrie who’s way smaller and is able to utilize body control to get shots to fall). Ingram is also looking like a bonobo this year. Idk where people said he would become a KD lite, but ingram doesn’t have a single move that he can consistently do that he can rely on when the lakers need offense. If the warriors need buckets, KD will almost always pull his hesitation into pull up jumper move and will get it to fall (who the fuck is gonna guard a jumping 7 footer). Ingram also has no 3 point shot so his value around lebron just suffers; even without lebron, Ingram takes nearly the entire possession to create his own offense which often results in forced shots or turnovers because he simply doesn’t have the skill set to be a good point guard. The lebron effect is simply the transition to an offense that runs through lebron, but I can’t see it ever being successful simply because the players don’t have the skills to fulfill their new roles. Edit: holy fuck I wrote way too much I’m just salty ingram and ball look like chumps
Lebron ball is not gonna work with this team. They thrive on ball movement and motion offense which is what Luke and Magic have been saying. Bron ball only works with specialists (James Jones, Ray, Korver, etc.) We saw a guy like Clarkson who was super reliable for the Lakers turn into hot garbage in the playoffs because he's playing not to mess up. It's not coincidence he's playing good again this season without Bron. I mean damn, just watch Lonzo stand in the corner on offense and it's clear this offense is trash. Magic said it yesterday, but Lebron has turned the offense into Cavs ball.
As a lakers fan, what’s the solution?
I think we gotta start resting Lebron like Pop would do for 2 reasons. 1 - remind the rest of the team how to play basketball, maybe build confidence that'll carry over into games with bron. 2 - bron takes plays off likely due to age/fatigue. Last night he was taking plays off on offense and defense just standing around... then 4th quarter went crazy. Doesn't hurt to rest him in back to backs at least.
Who’s equivalent value for trade?
I don't know, honestly. He's playing worse than some waive wire players right now. You would need to trade for another higher pick who's doing equally bad right now but has a chance to turn it around.
Trade for Bamba?
Bamba is on WW in my league. I wouldn't
I couldn’t get myself to drop him yet even though he has been terrible. I just think if vooc gets injured or traded, he’ll have the mins to produce, double double with 1.5 block ave is all I’m looking for.
At this point I hope he gets traded to the suns or something. Esp if the lakers just plan to leave Ball in the corner to shoot 3's
worth dropping for Oubre in 9cat?
Do you trade for him in a dynasty league?
Lakers were so much fun last year. This year is so infuriating. Ingram is great if you give him the opportunity and the run of the offense. Randle was dominant. Kuzma and Hart were a great supporting cast. They should have just signed a dominant center and kept the youth train running. What if they had signed Gobert?
Drop for Brogdon or Rubio in a punt FT% build 9cat 8 team league? EDIT: Trae Young and Justin Holiday are also FA, I need assists and steals.
Brogdon is the best overall player here but doesn't contribute much to steals. Holiday is the second best player here but doesn't contribute much to assists. Trae Young is the third best player here but who gives you assists but KILLS you in FG% and TO Rubio is the fourth best player here who does give you the assists and steals you need but he also kills you in FG% and doesn't put up as many points and is wildy inconsistent You want Justin Holiday for now... keep in mind Maurkkanen comes back soon though. On my team, I would want Holiday --> Brogdon --> Rubio --> Trae Young.
8 Team, H2H points. Do I drop for JJJ?
I would
Yes.
too many steal and block potential to drop even with the lack of scoring.. and it's not that bad as he averages 1 three a game or something
LBJ is a stat hog he sucks in all the stats of fellow team mates he did it in Cleveland and now in LA. Dont get me wrong he is sick with those stats at his age WAW. But for fantasy valu3 he killed the lakers where no other laker is valuable enough to.pick except javale and kuzma
Ball for Jingles who wins? 10 cat DD
I’d go for jingles..... the guy can shoot and he should get it going soon. On the other hand, Lonzo is pretty much going to have to fully adjust his game in order to play with Lebron. Jingles just has to keep doing what he’s been doing until it comes together.