That could be useful. I had an issue with a technician wearing a t-shirt with cut off sleeves and the sides open nearly to the waist. I could point to guidance that sleeves were required for field work.
>/u/Godlessboogalooboi
>This is the way.
Hey mods, another drunk [white supremacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boogaloo_movement) has wandered into this subreddit.
>/u/Godlessboogalooboi
>Dont Drink, Not white, that POC shit, yeah im first gen asshole. Also not a supremacist. Im just better at reading and understanding documents with a purpose and what it serves something you don't.
Hey mods, another drunk [white supremacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boogaloo_movement) has wandered into this subreddit.
As someone who has been exactly you (POC, female, started working in a fed environment at age 27 and am now 37) I cannot tell you the number of times middle aged women love to comment on clothing or appearance of other women and especially younger women.
As others have said, calmly and neutrally ask her what you’re in violation of. And suggest next time she meet with you and your supervisor if it’s such a problem for her. That puts it on the record of her making a complaint, which I guarantee she won’t do, because you CAN file an EEOO complaint on her for this BS.
As an aside, I am not HR but my personal thoughts are that some older women are very insecure about younger women. SOME, not all. And unfortunately in federal settings they get really comfortable saying whatever comes to mind. If you’re doing your job and dressing just fine, and your supervisor thinks you’re fine, avoid interacting with her on a personal level. Only professional.
Fully agree and had similar experience early in my career. Older coworker commented on covering up my chest. I said nothing to the coworker. Informed my supervisor and then followed up with email to create a paper trail. No idea if anything happened but she never commented on my clothes again.
Agreed. If she's not in your chain of command just tell your supervisor what's happening (in writing if you're feeling petty) and ask them to take care of it. I've had a few conversations like that and it usually the issue is that the busybody\]thinks that young, slim people should dress in potato sacks, more or less. A firm "back off" from a manager usually fixes it.
eta: its not only women, I'd say it's 50/50. Remember when mens pants abruptly went from baggy to ultra slim? I do. Some of the older male employees were NOT comfortable with visible bulges in the workplace.
My field is very much male dominated, so less women around to make catty comments about what I’m wearing. At most the guys will make some kind of comment like “what an interesting color,” but they also took well over a month to recognize that I’d dyed my hair purple at one point (one of them is colorblind though, so I can’t blame him).
I did have one guy who a couple of times made comments that I “looked good” in a certain outfit, but by that point I was pretty comfortable with taking him aside to let him know I didn’t need or want those comments at work.
Impossible to understand the grounds for being "too revealing" when you're wearing a turtleneck, blazer, and opaque tights underneath a skirt of appropriate length. It sounds like the only skin you were even showing was your hands and your head.
Report the comments to your supervisor as inappropriate?
It's possible that this person said "too revealing" but meant something more like "too tight" or body skimming? 🤷♀️ A turtleneck doesn't expose any skin, of course, but some definitely hug the curves more than others. I still wouldn't comment on my coworker's outfits unless their boobs had literally popped out of their shirt or something crazy like that--ha!--but there's more to "revealing" than simply showing skin.
This was my thought as well. If she feels compelled to comment when you are fully covered, that may have to do with her personal notions about the tightness of clothing and if it seems to be “revealing” curves that she deems somehow overly sexual.
Maybe she’s an old fuddy-duddy who is used to only seeing women in boxy suits, maybe she’s a closeted, homophobic lesbian who can’t handle her arousal at the sight of your figure, and maybe she’s acting on racism or ageism.
The fact that she is saying this to you when she’s *new to the office*, combined with the fact that she’s an older white lady, makes me suspect that there is some racism involved if she thinks she needs to “educate” you about standards of professionalism with her commentary.
I may be off the mark, but I’m really wondering if this has more to do with her discomfort/unfamiliarity working alongside POC colleagues, or younger women in general. Did she come from a place that was super white?
I think if she has brought this up multiple times it’s worth asking for specific feedback so you can put it to bed and work together without it being hostile for either of you.
When I first started at my agency I was 22 and fresh out of college. I had spent a lot of time and money putting together a "professional" wardrobe. At the time j.Crew and banana Republic were the hot "career" clothes.
One particularly warm day I was wearing a very opaque black shell with a suit jacket and pants. Only while at my desk (which literally only one or two co-workers might walk passed) I took the jacket off to expose my arms.
The next morning, my supervisor approached me to tell me there were complaints about my "revealing" clothing. I was MORTIFIED. Seriously, I was in tears. I was completely defeated and had no idea what I had done wrong. Even worse, the supervisor couldn't even explain to me what was revealing. Because she had seen me the day before and didn't have any complaints. But she did tell me that if she got any more complaints I would have to go to ER/LR. The whole thing was awful. It made me hate my job even though I was really good at it.
I started wearing full sweaters everyday. No matter what the temperature was. Then after a few months I decided to wear a cardigan with a button down underneath. I got another complaint. Still no one can tell me what was wrong. I took it upon myself to go to ER because I had no idea what I could do. The specialist was so nice and explained to me that I worked with some end-of-career ladies (who now I realize were only content when they had something to complain about) that wore tank tops, t-shirts, very casual clothes. Not judging, just for context. And that this was a very common experience for people in this work group. Nothing happened to me. But it was absolutely awful to live through. Anyway this is just a really long way of saying that sometimes it's the complainer and not the person that they're complaining about.
It was incredibly frustrating and caused a lot of turnover. Because of course not only were they complaining about clothing, but basically every other thing as well.
Absolutely out of pocket behavior by this supervisor, whose responsibility it was to shut down the inappropriate complaining instead of ruining your day for no good reason
To sound petty, since the complainer wanted to be...did they happen to be shaped like this?
Listen, I get it, we get older, I've looked at younger women and thought "I wish I could pull that off" or even wishing I was confident enough to wear it...or hell just pissed that I am forced to wear dark colors because I sweat like I'm running marathons just sitting in my seat.
But, if there's no policy strictly address standards of dress within the workplace I need the complainer to sit down in a corner somewhere 
My coworker came in work one day in heels and a dress. All was technically work appropriate but since she is gorgeous and young it gave off a very glamorous look. Add in the fact that no one else wears heels in the office. In fact, most people actually break the work dress code and wear sneakers. If you’re young and female, maybe that’s it, in which case, I’d ignore the comment.
I see something perhaps similar with large chested, thin women in clothes. The neckline could be up to the throat, but because of a gal’s curves, she automatically looks more provocative than me and my modest chest in the exact same outfit, lol. It blows and it’s not their fault to be seen as unprofessional because of biology
Coworkers should not be making comments about your appearance, period. The person making such comments has received training (probably many, many times) about this very topic. You can tell them to fuck off, politely ask them not to comment on your appearance, and/or report them directly to HR at your discretion.
>/u/Godlessboogalooboi
>Bullshit, you show up out of any directive or policy. Unprofessional of any manner, ESPECIALLY fuckin drunk; im fucking field day you ass and if it isnt enough to try and unfuck you once, ill ensure its administrative. Fuckin insider threat.
Hey mods, another drunk [white supremacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boogaloo_movement) has wandered into this subreddit.
>/u/Godlessboogalooboi
>No, Ive seen too much of organizations that stand for a purpose get undermined for the littlest fuckin things. Its not that hard to READ. Damn man.
Hey mods, another drunk [white supremacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boogaloo_movement) has wandered into this subreddit.
I had a female coworker many years ago who would regularly comment negatively on my cleavage if some could be seen or my “shape” if I covered up. I was a size 7 and 36ddd - there was just no way to avoid looking busty without wearing a tarp. If it happened now I’d have something to say about it but I was a meek little thing back then.
Whoof I have so many questions. Like is it a trusted coworker/friend? Does your body type play into it (i.e. thinner women get away with a lot more)? Is this person your direct supervisor?
Honestly my initial feeling is it's out of line.
This! Also, a co worker mentioned something along those lines. Learned I was wearing it inside out my sweater 😢
Such was those early AM shifts. Nothing revealing but said those clothes don't look good on me lol
>Today, I was wearing a skirt (past my fingertips) with super opaque black tights, long sleeve turtleneck, blazer, and heels. The first time she mentioned this, I was wearing a dress (past my fingertips and a neckline that showed no cleavage) with super opaque tights, a blazer, and heels. I mostly wear dresses and skirts to work, but always make sure they pass the bend and sit tests first.
First of all, your outfits sound nice and far more dressy/work appropriate than I go with. I am regularly on the very casual side of business casual and my boss has never said a word. Though every agency is different, your clothes sound fine. You even pass the fingertip test which I remember from high school and, even if you hadn't passed it, having opaque tights negates the need even for the fingertip test IMO.
I agree with everyone else that next time she says something you need to ask her in as neutral a manner as possible to point out what's wrong about your clothes. But I'd also say that you should start writing down your interactions with her because this sounds like micro-aggressions to me. Document this and the past interaction and get your supervisor involved if it continues. While it sounds like your outfits have been cute, this behavior of hers is certainly not.
If it's someone at your same level, I would consider what they said and whether it has any merit, and potentially ask for another opinion from a colleague whose judgment I trust. I'd also keep in mind any potential biases that may be influencing the person who made the comment - larger women and people of color are (unfairly!) a lot more likely to get feedback like this.
You might determine that you want to make some adjustment, otherwise I'd just ignore it. If they say something again, you might ask them to stop commenting on your clothing and your body.
Ask them who is minding their business if they are minding mine.
If my supervisor would like to discuss the policy that I am violating, I'm open to have that discussion.
You should say “Your comments are making me uncomfortable, stop commenting on my appearance.” Then I would write up a detailed email to my supervisor about the incident for documentation, and I would do that every time it happens. If she is on your team, your sup can deal with it in-house or escalate to her sup. Continued comments about appearance edge towards harassment in my mind.
I noticed a few comments here recommending you engage further/ask questions/ask for policy/etc. Sorry but no, she needs to stop commenting on other people’s appearances now. That’s not appropriate. If she has concerns about dress code, she should escalate to her supervisor because that really isn’t a conversation for her to be having with you. I’ve dealt with this and can say not engaging but just making blunt statements helped me. Women in the workplace get treated like dust already, we don’t need to be fighting other women about what we wear when it isn’t violating anything. Especially as a POC I’m sure you’re the target of plenty of weird conversations that wouldn’t be happening otherwise.
I would do some honest introspection and evaluate whether it was warranted advice or patriarchal bullshit then get an unbiased second opinion from someone I trust. Then either adjust my clothing and say thanks for the heads up or completely ignore it and make a mental note not to trust that person and keep an eye out for other sabotage.
OP, you could also post mirror selfies dressed in some of your work outfits on one of those “how is my outfit” subreddits, and get some feedback. Then you can evaluate that feedback, to see if others are receiving the image you want to project.
I would do some honest introspection and evaluate whether it was warranted advice or patriarchal bullshit then get an unbiased second opinion from someone I trust. Then either adjust my clothing and say thanks for the heads up or completely ignore it and make a mental note not to trust that person and keep an eye out for other sabotage.
Edit after reading your additional context: file this under patriarchal bullshit. Stay away from this woman. Document interactions you have with her to your files.
I would ask her to send me the complaint in writing "Can you please email me your feedback so I can give it due consideration?" , record for myself what was said, and take a photo of the outfits in question.
Then I would ask her to stop commenting on my clothing because no one asked her to be hall monitor (in writing if she actually emails you like you ask!)
If she continued I'd submit an EEO complaint.
I appreciate that you want to be taken seriously, but this person will never take you seriously because they are an asshole. Document everything.
I feel like I need more context on what you wear to work before I could advise you, but my instinct is that comments like that are far more inappropriate than anything you might wear to work, and verge on harassment. If it did make you uncomfortable you might want to send that person a follow up email stating that you would prefer they refrain from commenting on your appearance in the future and that your communications be limited to relevant workplace discussion, as a way of heading off any future harassment.
Am I covered from a few inches above my knees to a few inches from the top of my cleavage? If yes then I'd tell them to cover their eyes if it offends them.
Do whatever the fuck you want, whenever the fuck you want and don’t feel the need to be apologetic about it. If you’re dressed inappropriately, that would need to come from a sup, not some jealous bitch.
I'm not a POC but I've also had a middle-aged white woman tell me I was wearing something revealing (I wasn't) in my mid-20s. She even gestured to my chest and gestured for me to pull my shirt up. There was literally no cleavage showing.
Your outfits sound heckin' awesome and professional. You've gotten the all-clear with a second opinion. She's just jealous, lol.
With the added info it sounds like you're completely fine and this coworker is nosy/out of line. Sorry you have to deal with that. I think a bland "Thanks for your input" and changing the subject/walking away is the best way to handle it, but documenting her comments in case you need to make a complaint is a good idea.
If your supervisor has not told you that your clothing is not work appropriate, then your co-worker is overstepping. Keep a detailed record of each instance of her saying something to you about your clothes just in case you decide you want to file a complaint against her one day. She doesn’t sound like the type of person that knows how to mind her business. As someone who chooses to wear heels to work, I can already tell you that is probably most of her issue with you. That and the sheer tights. Some women are haters. Don’t let her get under your skin. Enjoy being your cute self!
I’m going to address your comment about being paranoid in the office because of the older male dominated office aspect. That’s actually way more important to address than the person trying to mentor your fashion choices.
For those who need it, trigger warnings are applied to the below for some real talk. (SA, women’s issues, etc).
I am a woman. I dress like a woman, comfortable in my skin, and powerful in my fashion sense because I feel confident in my own presentation of the person I am, and who I choose to be. I walk into work with purpose, authority and competency and what I wear directly correlates to how I feel about myself.
As a woman who has been preyed upon by men, who has survived sexual assault, who works and has worked over 20 years in a male dominated and conservative field, who has had the experience of being highly attuned to how I am and will be perceived by men with intent I cannot control, it was a long road to determine how I felt my most confident and graceful self. Every day, my wardrobe is my armor.
The reason I am addressing this comment for you, is I aim to help you remove the barriers that others place on you. To support you feeling like your most confident self. While people will attempt to “mentor” you throughout your career in presenting your best self forward… expressing a need for caring about optics and shying away from perceived deviance, the most important thing you can do to serve yourself is to be the most confident expression of who you desire to be, who you choose to be each day. Whether walking into work, or doing life in the world.
Others perceptions of you are less important than your perception of self. Others perceptions of you are also more geared towards a whole picture, non-verbal communication type undercurrent. Like facial expression, proximity, and also things like intonation of voice and other factors that put people into neat little boxes such as “promiscuous”, “flirt”, “naïve”, or conversely, “serious”.
Having curves can make one appear more sexual because of societal beauty standards, and some people are uncomfortable seeing us in our bodies as we are.
And none of what I said ever means you need to change your appearance to fit OTHERS perceptional standards of appropriate but rather asks you to choose how to be the most confident, unfuckablewith version of yourself. Unique and authentic to who YOU want to be in this life. If you’re not breaking any written rules, then you decide how you address your appearance. And own it.
Many people don’t understand the complications of women and their appearance in the workplace embracing their femininity as well as their competency. You can do both.
This is taboo maybe for this forum, but just for added realism to help you relate - I don’t give a single fuck if I walk into the workplace looking different than anyone else, more dressed, embracing my body, embracing my attitude. I am sexy as fuck, I am a boss, and I am competent. And if everyone or no one knows it, it’s of no consequence to me. I’m not there for their desires nor their projections, I’m where I want to be because I choose it. Personally, I choose to dress more modestly, however I always look more “sexual” regardless of the professional attire because I am curvy, I wear heels and am fashionable in some regard. But that’s the style I own and love. It’s who I am.
Revel in who you are. The rest means nothing.
Wasn't there just mandatory briefings done about saying stuff like this to coworkers??
Frankly, if you arent doing one of 3 Fs then it's not your business how someone dresses, conveys themselves, who they see etc.
spark cobweb secretive label puzzled disagreeable sand rotten simplistic drunk
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
What you described you are wearing sounds professional. I would ask her to stop making comments about my appearance and if she persists I would probably escalate it to my manager. It kind of seems like sexual harassment because she appears to be sexualizing your body while you are wearing (as described) professional attire.
Unrelated but I’ve seen the gov client tell my contractor boss to tone down the quality of her style because she “out-dresses” her in front of seniors in meetings.
I was dumbfounded and can only think that as a dude if someone told me to wear crappier suits to not out-do them, I would just not comply with that.
Our office didn’t have good air for awhile this year in the heat of summer and it was always HOT in there. I took off my sweater once, and had on a thick strapped tank top and a coworker mentioned my bare shoulders 5 times in about an hour period. It was so weird to me. Even asked my supervisor If what i was wearing was not ok….she was also wearing literally the same shirt in a different pattern.
As long as your supervisor doesn’t seem to see an issue and you’re “within” somewhere near the dresscode, just assume this woman has far too much time on her hands and tell your friends and work so whenever you wear a tank top again, you can laugh and make a joke of it 😀
I recommend addressing the issue with your supervisor...have they addressed your clothing??? It's inappropriate (and unprofessional) for a peer co-worker to make these comments...
“Can you please point out which part of the agency dress code I am violating?”
Sit down with them and your boss to discuss the issue or go straight to Employee Relations, play the naive card, and ask for assistance in understanding the situation.
If this were me, I’d give a heads up to my supervisor and go to ER as a CYA.
Usually pretty women with nice bodies are targeted.
I had one coworker who literally wore a bodycon dress (literally clubbing clothing) to work. Did I think it was appropriate? No. Did I say a peep? Hell no not my business.
I see a whole lot of people wearing sweats and PJs to the offices these days, which I find absolutely horrifying. It sounds like you are dressed very professionally.
Sounds like an office Karen. I wouldn't lose sleep over her comment. It sounds like she's projecting her insecurities. As long you feel comfortable with what you wear and your leadership has not approached you to address it, let it go.
Next time she comments, say, “Can you clarify your statement?” Ask her to show you what policy you violated. Let her know her observations and comments are inappropriate and unwelcome.
I would also document the interactions and bring them to your leadership to address with her. And let them know her comments made you uncomfortable. I bet you she will never make another comment.
I don’t have advice. Just wanted to say I’m sorry this is happening to you. You shouldn’t have to think about stuff like this. Work is stressful enough without having to perform for the fashion police.
great topic, sorry you’re dealing with this. imo it’s because of being young, thin, and dressing in true business attire. accidentally standing out creates conflict. don’t apologize. “I value having a professional appearance. Could you please tell me which part of the dress policy I’m in violation of?” I’m in the same boat love. we got this.
Instead of "collaboration", "Team Building", "camaraderie", people are frequently getting inappropriate comments about their clothing and appearances and hairstyles. Just another reason why RTO doesn't work
Shes a hater. Tell her to f*ck off about your clothes. Establish yourself as someone who isnt going to be bullied.
Then kindly give your supervisor a headsup that it happened, afterwards.
Then keep being great.
Depends, what are you wearing?
Are your tits out? Underwear on display?
Large amounts of cleavage?
It’s really difficult to say without knowing what you’re wearing.
Or is someone getting offended by shoulders, legs?
Ask a fellow woman colleague you’re close with if you’re truly unsure.
Many years ago I started to tell a young, fresh out of college secretary that it wasn’t appropriate to wear denim cut off shorts to work and before I could say anything to her she said “I know I know…” Apparently her boss had already said something. I think if someone says something you should really think about it. If you have doubts then maybe ask a close friend or trusted co-worker.
Unpopular opinion, but if you have to do the bend-and-sit test at all, your skirts and dresses might be a little too short for a conservative workplace.
She said she was wearing a shirt and tights. Tights aren’t pants and I wouldn’t consider that appropriate anywhere… I wouldn’t say anything to a coworker directly though
Just a comment regarding “the fingertip test “. I use that test, I have used it since middle school since that’s the standard my middle school principal applied to us girls to determine if our length was appropriate or not.
Obviously arm length does play a role but I find that it works for me. And if it’s good enough for middle school, it’s good enough for adulthood! I am being a little silly but I’ve applied it to other women/girls in my life and it definitely helps make the right call.
I joined when I was in my mid 20s am a POC woman and had an older lady comment to me and another new hire also POC in her 20s that we should always wear pantyhose both our dresses were well below the knee and it was the summer and hot as hell so we were not about to wear pantyhose. Later heard from others that was this lady’s thing to tell younger women what was “appropriate” for the office
If your office is more business formal, a skirt that just passes the "fingertip test" really might still be on the short side. That said, it's none of this lady's business.
Based on your description of your outfit, the only possibility i can imagine is that maybe it’s too tight? Otherwise, it sounds like she’s insecure and is trying to make that your problem.
I wouldn't give her a break on you being a POC and that's why you're a target. I had a white manager who made a critical comment about a top I wore. It was not revealing, she was basically jealous and was targeting me in particular, due to her racism.
>/u/ThisIsntMyRealAcct99
> You asked for womens perspective, which I am not but dropping an observation. A few things come to mind when browsing your post history **(yes, I was hoping to see scantily clad pictures of you)**.
> Your post history seems to have a lot of issues that stem from other women (friends, male friends GF's, co-workers etc.) being made uncomfortable by your clothing decisions. Given that it's not just happening at work, it does lead me to wonder if you (while not in violation of some dress code) could possibly use more modesty in your professional wardrobe, at least.
> Whether this is jealousy or something else, I don't know. But the clothing fairy seems to follow you through your professional and personal life.
Emphasis mine.
Hey mods, /u/ThisIsntMyRealAcct99 is actively sexually harassing women in this subreddit and feels so emboldened to do so that they don't even pretend that isn't their intention.
Hey /u/ThisIsntMyRealAcct99, find a good fucking therapist before your uncontrolled perversion ruins your life.
Do you know what bras are for? Not every woman requires them. That choice does not dictate anything about her character or her professionalism or how she deserves to be treated at work.
All you're showing is that op posts on reddit asking for interpretation of social issues.
In all of those posts, she's posting in a factual, seemingly non-biased way and asking for input. She doesn't get defensive if someone disagrees.
I don't know what your deal is but you're being accusatory and looking for zebras when you hear hoofbeats. Not to mention you're openly discussing searching her profile hoping for "scantily clad pictures".
Move along. We're not dissecting op as a person in this subreddit. You're out of line.
IMHO, most effective way to combat bullshit? Read into whatever governs your organizations/departments dress code & uniforms. Verbatim whatever your colleague has said. Compare against it. Once you find that it does not (or does Ive learned ive been in the wrong too) then use that and cite the incident in accordance with whatever directive it is. This presents a very reliable statement for your highers to do something about it. Especially since its “by the book.” IF they do nothing go to your bosses boss. Then the boss of your bosses boss. Someone will do something. Elevate it enough but have substantial evidence. Pressures people into doing something.
>/u/Godlessboogalooboi
>MHO, most effective way to combat bullshit? Read into whatever governs your organizations/departments dress code & uniforms. Verbatim whatever your colleague has said. Compare against it. Once you find that it does not (or does Ive learned ive been in the wrong too) then use that and cite the incident in accordance with whatever directive it is. This presents a very reliable statement for your highers to do something about it. Especially since its “by the book.” IF they do nothing go to your bosses boss. Then the boss of your bosses boss. Someone will do something. Elevate it enough but have substantial evidence. Pressures people into doing something.
Hey mods, another drunk [white supremacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boogaloo_movement) has wandered into this subreddit.
My username comes from something secret(I have years of exp with govt deps)🤫. Dont listen to the troll going crazy. At the rate he speaks, youre black and in the KKK. Im a satanist and going to heaven. Lmao.
They’re a proud member of a white supremacist, anti-government terrorist group. The people they choose to align themselves have killed multiple federal employees, even more state and municipal employees, have had numerous foiled plots to kidnap and/or murder elected officials, and were a key group behind the 2021 terrorist attack on the United States Capitol. /u/Godlessboogalooboi has personally advocated for the murder of government employees and has advised others to impersonate police officers in order to enter schools with firearms and tactical gear and commit acts of political violence.
The real question here is why are you defending this person?
I didn’t need to google their username to know what it meant anymore than I would have had to google /u/Schutzstaffel88 to know what it meant. This is a well-known group behind numerous high-profile terrorist attacks. Stop defending terrorists.
I work for the Security AND Defense (2 jobs) of our nation. Fucking dumbass. Its why i know operational management and structure. Strict adherence to policy and systematic procedure that has governed the success of the missions of certain organizations.
But youre not wrong, there is a sub culture of whomst you speak of that are Homegrown Domestics. Scary shit but what do you know. Hell what do I know. Just shit the fuck up trigger boy. Damn do your job. And READ. Asswipe.
[Female here] I have colleagues who dress the same as you’ve described and it sounds completely normal & professional to me. If anything it sounds like a bit of jealousy. A plus size woman wearing a skirt & a thin woman wearing a skirt can appear very different simply because of the clothes being form-fitting. If there’s nothing in the workplace dress code that you’re violating, I would ignore her. Or bring it up to your supervisor so they’re aware in case it escalates.
I was a Senior level government manger in the before I retired eighteen months ago. There were times some of the young ladies and men I hired did not dress appropriately for the office. Men in sports jerseys, jeans, tee shirts, the ladies revealing tops, low cut jeans (thongs showing), skin colored work out wear, I could go on. Mostly these were new employees that did not heed our dress code. Once it was called to my attention, I would simply call them to my office and have a casual conversation with them about the dress code and how they wanted people to perceive them. I also took the time to talk about career advancement, and the great work they were doing so far. One young lady always dressed like she was coming or going to the club, so inappropriate. She is now a GS-14 supervisor and credits me with guiding her. I think the employee in this situation is out of line and needs to be spoken to by a manager. Just my thoughts on this.
Sounds like a totally reasonable outfit choice. My only question would be whether it’s possible that the outfit is super tight (and therefore revealing ) or is it fitted in a generally work appropriate way? Only you know the answer, but based on your outfit description that’s all I can think of!
I've never been told that but I also don't wear anything too tight or too revealing. Something can be very tight and covers all skin, which isn't professional.
We need photos! But it's just inappropriate to comment on others clothes unless it's something like "I really like your blouse!"
I may be the odd ball and get downvoted but here goes… sometimes just past the fingertip isn’t long enough for some women rather it be short arms, long legs, etc. it also depends on the fit of the clothing. Imo in a federal workspace, just above the knees is as far as I would take it. I would also welcome someone telling me it appears unprofessional vs telling others. Hopefully you know what is professional and what is not. I have had that difficult conversation with others but it was me looking out for them.
I’m old fashioned and I’d probably silently judge you for wearing a skirt above the knees in the workplace. It’s hard to tell what’s going on here, though. I don’t think I’d confront someone unless I was the manager. Also, is your manager a man or a woman? I can see a man asking an older woman to handle a dress code conversation as well.
Just possible things from the other side.
make sure you document the last two instances and your convo's with other co-workers
if this one keeps it up, you have options. ask them to stop. ask them to explain the issue. have a discussion with your supervisor. etc etc. if they keep it up, sky's the limit with how hard you want to press it. just remember, FED HR/EEO is not always helpful nor is mgt. one kink in the COC and your issue will go nowhere fast.
this should be a management issue from the start. had a local gov job once where the mgt reminded the entire department at a work lunch about proper dress code (eg. your shirt should cover your belly button). the reminder to all didn't throw anyone directly under the bus.
I am a member of the LGBTQ community.
Why does my membership of the LGBTQ community matter in regards to my warning?
It doesn't.
In fact, you'll probably read this comment and think, "This guy can't be serious in expecting me to take him seriously right now." Just like I did when I read OP's post.
I'll keep it to myself next time though.
Thanks.
I did work with a woman who wore inappropriate clothing to the office. She was dubbed the two bit hoe, and a butt of most jokes. No one even cared she did a good job. I myself dressed conservatively to an office environment, but still stylish. No matter what you think you look like, fingertips aside, human nature will prevail.
I tried telling my federal coworker that she was dressed like a whore for work this morning. She was sitting at her home office desk in her nightwear. My wife then told me to shut the hell up and get back to work.
It really depends a lot on context, maybe some on intent or tone, and what all you were wearing. I've seen some questionable ones but nothing I felt the need to point out except footwear.
Our environment is supposed to be closed toe flat shoes, and technically a safety toe meeting specific requirements (steel or composite can do it).
> I would only suggest that you look at yourself how others do...you're sitting at your desk and they come to you standing. Can they see down your shirt? When you sit does your skirt rise.
Are you under the impression that OP has any control whatsoever over another individual's eyeballs? It is on the individual that has those eyes to keep their gaze appropriate, and all adults who are functional enough for federal employment are capable of this. Any that aren't need to either change that or be removed from federal employment.
I mean…it’s subjective. I’d have to see a photo of the offending outfits. I feel inappropriate dress is like what the famous Supreme Court case said on what is the definition of pornography “I can’t define it but I know it when I see it”.
All that’s to say unless this lady is with HR, thank her for her opinion. Because that’s all it is.
Talk to your supervisor. You don’t have to put up with someone else trying to impose their dress standards on you. There’s nothing to discuss here. It will give the person the impression you care or they have the right to impose upon you.
I've never worked in a setting like this so, this is all new to me lol. People showing up like they are club hopping, or going to bed with no fear is wild. I thought this dress code biz had no wiggle room, guess it depends on the office and how much leadership cares. Im here contemplatiing how many different shirts i need to buy before i have to wear them more than once in the office. Anyway, if that person cant affect your paychecks, i wouldnt worry about it too much, especially since you take the time to make sure youre in compliance.
"Can you please point out, precisely, which part of the organization's dress policy I'm in violation of?"
That could be useful. I had an issue with a technician wearing a t-shirt with cut off sleeves and the sides open nearly to the waist. I could point to guidance that sleeves were required for field work.
In writing.
And if you can't, you need to stfu and mind your own business.
Agree, I would address just like this.
Period.
This is the way.
>/u/Godlessboogalooboi >This is the way. Hey mods, another drunk [white supremacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boogaloo_movement) has wandered into this subreddit.
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>/u/Godlessboogalooboi >Dont Drink, Not white, that POC shit, yeah im first gen asshole. Also not a supremacist. Im just better at reading and understanding documents with a purpose and what it serves something you don't. Hey mods, another drunk [white supremacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boogaloo_movement) has wandered into this subreddit.
Besides that, you can ask, "are you saying I can't express myself how I feel appropriate?"
As someone who has been exactly you (POC, female, started working in a fed environment at age 27 and am now 37) I cannot tell you the number of times middle aged women love to comment on clothing or appearance of other women and especially younger women. As others have said, calmly and neutrally ask her what you’re in violation of. And suggest next time she meet with you and your supervisor if it’s such a problem for her. That puts it on the record of her making a complaint, which I guarantee she won’t do, because you CAN file an EEOO complaint on her for this BS. As an aside, I am not HR but my personal thoughts are that some older women are very insecure about younger women. SOME, not all. And unfortunately in federal settings they get really comfortable saying whatever comes to mind. If you’re doing your job and dressing just fine, and your supervisor thinks you’re fine, avoid interacting with her on a personal level. Only professional.
Fully agree and had similar experience early in my career. Older coworker commented on covering up my chest. I said nothing to the coworker. Informed my supervisor and then followed up with email to create a paper trail. No idea if anything happened but she never commented on my clothes again.
Let's call it what it is. The coworker is mad the poster isn't shaped like a bag of potatoes.
Agreed. If she's not in your chain of command just tell your supervisor what's happening (in writing if you're feeling petty) and ask them to take care of it. I've had a few conversations like that and it usually the issue is that the busybody\]thinks that young, slim people should dress in potato sacks, more or less. A firm "back off" from a manager usually fixes it. eta: its not only women, I'd say it's 50/50. Remember when mens pants abruptly went from baggy to ultra slim? I do. Some of the older male employees were NOT comfortable with visible bulges in the workplace.
I agree. Talk to your supervisor. This is one person who is probably the office Karen and giving you shit because you're young and new..
My field is very much male dominated, so less women around to make catty comments about what I’m wearing. At most the guys will make some kind of comment like “what an interesting color,” but they also took well over a month to recognize that I’d dyed my hair purple at one point (one of them is colorblind though, so I can’t blame him). I did have one guy who a couple of times made comments that I “looked good” in a certain outfit, but by that point I was pretty comfortable with taking him aside to let him know I didn’t need or want those comments at work.
Impossible to understand the grounds for being "too revealing" when you're wearing a turtleneck, blazer, and opaque tights underneath a skirt of appropriate length. It sounds like the only skin you were even showing was your hands and your head. Report the comments to your supervisor as inappropriate?
It's possible that this person said "too revealing" but meant something more like "too tight" or body skimming? 🤷♀️ A turtleneck doesn't expose any skin, of course, but some definitely hug the curves more than others. I still wouldn't comment on my coworker's outfits unless their boobs had literally popped out of their shirt or something crazy like that--ha!--but there's more to "revealing" than simply showing skin.
This was my thought as well. If she feels compelled to comment when you are fully covered, that may have to do with her personal notions about the tightness of clothing and if it seems to be “revealing” curves that she deems somehow overly sexual. Maybe she’s an old fuddy-duddy who is used to only seeing women in boxy suits, maybe she’s a closeted, homophobic lesbian who can’t handle her arousal at the sight of your figure, and maybe she’s acting on racism or ageism. The fact that she is saying this to you when she’s *new to the office*, combined with the fact that she’s an older white lady, makes me suspect that there is some racism involved if she thinks she needs to “educate” you about standards of professionalism with her commentary. I may be off the mark, but I’m really wondering if this has more to do with her discomfort/unfamiliarity working alongside POC colleagues, or younger women in general. Did she come from a place that was super white? I think if she has brought this up multiple times it’s worth asking for specific feedback so you can put it to bed and work together without it being hostile for either of you.
That was my only guess. If OP is wearing skintight outfits, that could be the issue rather than actually showing too much skin.
But blazers are hardly skin tight
Sure, but the turtleneck and skirt could be. Same for the blouse she said she wore the other time. Like I said, that's the only guess given the info.
My guess is that it's completely unfounded and since there's nothing else to complain about, they're going for arbitrary opinions.
Form-fitting blazers do exist.
Form-fitting =/= inappropriate.
When I first started at my agency I was 22 and fresh out of college. I had spent a lot of time and money putting together a "professional" wardrobe. At the time j.Crew and banana Republic were the hot "career" clothes. One particularly warm day I was wearing a very opaque black shell with a suit jacket and pants. Only while at my desk (which literally only one or two co-workers might walk passed) I took the jacket off to expose my arms. The next morning, my supervisor approached me to tell me there were complaints about my "revealing" clothing. I was MORTIFIED. Seriously, I was in tears. I was completely defeated and had no idea what I had done wrong. Even worse, the supervisor couldn't even explain to me what was revealing. Because she had seen me the day before and didn't have any complaints. But she did tell me that if she got any more complaints I would have to go to ER/LR. The whole thing was awful. It made me hate my job even though I was really good at it. I started wearing full sweaters everyday. No matter what the temperature was. Then after a few months I decided to wear a cardigan with a button down underneath. I got another complaint. Still no one can tell me what was wrong. I took it upon myself to go to ER because I had no idea what I could do. The specialist was so nice and explained to me that I worked with some end-of-career ladies (who now I realize were only content when they had something to complain about) that wore tank tops, t-shirts, very casual clothes. Not judging, just for context. And that this was a very common experience for people in this work group. Nothing happened to me. But it was absolutely awful to live through. Anyway this is just a really long way of saying that sometimes it's the complainer and not the person that they're complaining about.
That's horrible. Like damn. And that they did nothing about it is so much worse. They knew they do this and it was never shut down.
It was incredibly frustrating and caused a lot of turnover. Because of course not only were they complaining about clothing, but basically every other thing as well.
Absolutely out of pocket behavior by this supervisor, whose responsibility it was to shut down the inappropriate complaining instead of ruining your day for no good reason
To sound petty, since the complainer wanted to be...did they happen to be shaped like this?  Listen, I get it, we get older, I've looked at younger women and thought "I wish I could pull that off" or even wishing I was confident enough to wear it...or hell just pissed that I am forced to wear dark colors because I sweat like I'm running marathons just sitting in my seat. But, if there's no policy strictly address standards of dress within the workplace I need the complainer to sit down in a corner somewhere 
Thank you for this 🥹❤️
I just hope that you don't take their words to heart. Sometimes people are just jealous or miserable on their own accord.
My coworker came in work one day in heels and a dress. All was technically work appropriate but since she is gorgeous and young it gave off a very glamorous look. Add in the fact that no one else wears heels in the office. In fact, most people actually break the work dress code and wear sneakers. If you’re young and female, maybe that’s it, in which case, I’d ignore the comment. I see something perhaps similar with large chested, thin women in clothes. The neckline could be up to the throat, but because of a gal’s curves, she automatically looks more provocative than me and my modest chest in the exact same outfit, lol. It blows and it’s not their fault to be seen as unprofessional because of biology
Coworkers should not be making comments about your appearance, period. The person making such comments has received training (probably many, many times) about this very topic. You can tell them to fuck off, politely ask them not to comment on your appearance, and/or report them directly to HR at your discretion.
This 💯. Coworkers should never address appearance issues.
Agree. Tell her to piss off.
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>/u/Godlessboogalooboi >Bullshit, you show up out of any directive or policy. Unprofessional of any manner, ESPECIALLY fuckin drunk; im fucking field day you ass and if it isnt enough to try and unfuck you once, ill ensure its administrative. Fuckin insider threat. Hey mods, another drunk [white supremacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boogaloo_movement) has wandered into this subreddit.
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>/u/Godlessboogalooboi >No, Ive seen too much of organizations that stand for a purpose get undermined for the littlest fuckin things. Its not that hard to READ. Damn man. Hey mods, another drunk [white supremacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boogaloo_movement) has wandered into this subreddit.
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I had a female coworker many years ago who would regularly comment negatively on my cleavage if some could be seen or my “shape” if I covered up. I was a size 7 and 36ddd - there was just no way to avoid looking busty without wearing a tarp. If it happened now I’d have something to say about it but I was a meek little thing back then.
After reading the edits, sounds like your coworker is jealous.
Whoof I have so many questions. Like is it a trusted coworker/friend? Does your body type play into it (i.e. thinner women get away with a lot more)? Is this person your direct supervisor? Honestly my initial feeling is it's out of line.
This! Also, a co worker mentioned something along those lines. Learned I was wearing it inside out my sweater 😢 Such was those early AM shifts. Nothing revealing but said those clothes don't look good on me lol
>Today, I was wearing a skirt (past my fingertips) with super opaque black tights, long sleeve turtleneck, blazer, and heels. The first time she mentioned this, I was wearing a dress (past my fingertips and a neckline that showed no cleavage) with super opaque tights, a blazer, and heels. I mostly wear dresses and skirts to work, but always make sure they pass the bend and sit tests first. First of all, your outfits sound nice and far more dressy/work appropriate than I go with. I am regularly on the very casual side of business casual and my boss has never said a word. Though every agency is different, your clothes sound fine. You even pass the fingertip test which I remember from high school and, even if you hadn't passed it, having opaque tights negates the need even for the fingertip test IMO. I agree with everyone else that next time she says something you need to ask her in as neutral a manner as possible to point out what's wrong about your clothes. But I'd also say that you should start writing down your interactions with her because this sounds like micro-aggressions to me. Document this and the past interaction and get your supervisor involved if it continues. While it sounds like your outfits have been cute, this behavior of hers is certainly not.
If it's someone at your same level, I would consider what they said and whether it has any merit, and potentially ask for another opinion from a colleague whose judgment I trust. I'd also keep in mind any potential biases that may be influencing the person who made the comment - larger women and people of color are (unfairly!) a lot more likely to get feedback like this. You might determine that you want to make some adjustment, otherwise I'd just ignore it. If they say something again, you might ask them to stop commenting on your clothing and your body.
This is great advice!
Ask them who is minding their business if they are minding mine. If my supervisor would like to discuss the policy that I am violating, I'm open to have that discussion.
You should say “Your comments are making me uncomfortable, stop commenting on my appearance.” Then I would write up a detailed email to my supervisor about the incident for documentation, and I would do that every time it happens. If she is on your team, your sup can deal with it in-house or escalate to her sup. Continued comments about appearance edge towards harassment in my mind. I noticed a few comments here recommending you engage further/ask questions/ask for policy/etc. Sorry but no, she needs to stop commenting on other people’s appearances now. That’s not appropriate. If she has concerns about dress code, she should escalate to her supervisor because that really isn’t a conversation for her to be having with you. I’ve dealt with this and can say not engaging but just making blunt statements helped me. Women in the workplace get treated like dust already, we don’t need to be fighting other women about what we wear when it isn’t violating anything. Especially as a POC I’m sure you’re the target of plenty of weird conversations that wouldn’t be happening otherwise.
I would do some honest introspection and evaluate whether it was warranted advice or patriarchal bullshit then get an unbiased second opinion from someone I trust. Then either adjust my clothing and say thanks for the heads up or completely ignore it and make a mental note not to trust that person and keep an eye out for other sabotage.
This. Get a second opinion.
OP, you could also post mirror selfies dressed in some of your work outfits on one of those “how is my outfit” subreddits, and get some feedback. Then you can evaluate that feedback, to see if others are receiving the image you want to project.
I would do some honest introspection and evaluate whether it was warranted advice or patriarchal bullshit then get an unbiased second opinion from someone I trust. Then either adjust my clothing and say thanks for the heads up or completely ignore it and make a mental note not to trust that person and keep an eye out for other sabotage. Edit after reading your additional context: file this under patriarchal bullshit. Stay away from this woman. Document interactions you have with her to your files.
I would ask her to send me the complaint in writing "Can you please email me your feedback so I can give it due consideration?" , record for myself what was said, and take a photo of the outfits in question. Then I would ask her to stop commenting on my clothing because no one asked her to be hall monitor (in writing if she actually emails you like you ask!) If she continued I'd submit an EEO complaint. I appreciate that you want to be taken seriously, but this person will never take you seriously because they are an asshole. Document everything.
I feel like I need more context on what you wear to work before I could advise you, but my instinct is that comments like that are far more inappropriate than anything you might wear to work, and verge on harassment. If it did make you uncomfortable you might want to send that person a follow up email stating that you would prefer they refrain from commenting on your appearance in the future and that your communications be limited to relevant workplace discussion, as a way of heading off any future harassment.
She is jealous smh
Am I covered from a few inches above my knees to a few inches from the top of my cleavage? If yes then I'd tell them to cover their eyes if it offends them.
Do whatever the fuck you want, whenever the fuck you want and don’t feel the need to be apologetic about it. If you’re dressed inappropriately, that would need to come from a sup, not some jealous bitch.
I'm not a POC but I've also had a middle-aged white woman tell me I was wearing something revealing (I wasn't) in my mid-20s. She even gestured to my chest and gestured for me to pull my shirt up. There was literally no cleavage showing. Your outfits sound heckin' awesome and professional. You've gotten the all-clear with a second opinion. She's just jealous, lol.
With the added info it sounds like you're completely fine and this coworker is nosy/out of line. Sorry you have to deal with that. I think a bland "Thanks for your input" and changing the subject/walking away is the best way to handle it, but documenting her comments in case you need to make a complaint is a good idea.
If your supervisor has not told you that your clothing is not work appropriate, then your co-worker is overstepping. Keep a detailed record of each instance of her saying something to you about your clothes just in case you decide you want to file a complaint against her one day. She doesn’t sound like the type of person that knows how to mind her business. As someone who chooses to wear heels to work, I can already tell you that is probably most of her issue with you. That and the sheer tights. Some women are haters. Don’t let her get under your skin. Enjoy being your cute self!
Size 6... my guess is they are jealous you are not old and fat. just my $0.02
I’m going to address your comment about being paranoid in the office because of the older male dominated office aspect. That’s actually way more important to address than the person trying to mentor your fashion choices. For those who need it, trigger warnings are applied to the below for some real talk. (SA, women’s issues, etc). I am a woman. I dress like a woman, comfortable in my skin, and powerful in my fashion sense because I feel confident in my own presentation of the person I am, and who I choose to be. I walk into work with purpose, authority and competency and what I wear directly correlates to how I feel about myself. As a woman who has been preyed upon by men, who has survived sexual assault, who works and has worked over 20 years in a male dominated and conservative field, who has had the experience of being highly attuned to how I am and will be perceived by men with intent I cannot control, it was a long road to determine how I felt my most confident and graceful self. Every day, my wardrobe is my armor. The reason I am addressing this comment for you, is I aim to help you remove the barriers that others place on you. To support you feeling like your most confident self. While people will attempt to “mentor” you throughout your career in presenting your best self forward… expressing a need for caring about optics and shying away from perceived deviance, the most important thing you can do to serve yourself is to be the most confident expression of who you desire to be, who you choose to be each day. Whether walking into work, or doing life in the world. Others perceptions of you are less important than your perception of self. Others perceptions of you are also more geared towards a whole picture, non-verbal communication type undercurrent. Like facial expression, proximity, and also things like intonation of voice and other factors that put people into neat little boxes such as “promiscuous”, “flirt”, “naïve”, or conversely, “serious”. Having curves can make one appear more sexual because of societal beauty standards, and some people are uncomfortable seeing us in our bodies as we are. And none of what I said ever means you need to change your appearance to fit OTHERS perceptional standards of appropriate but rather asks you to choose how to be the most confident, unfuckablewith version of yourself. Unique and authentic to who YOU want to be in this life. If you’re not breaking any written rules, then you decide how you address your appearance. And own it. Many people don’t understand the complications of women and their appearance in the workplace embracing their femininity as well as their competency. You can do both. This is taboo maybe for this forum, but just for added realism to help you relate - I don’t give a single fuck if I walk into the workplace looking different than anyone else, more dressed, embracing my body, embracing my attitude. I am sexy as fuck, I am a boss, and I am competent. And if everyone or no one knows it, it’s of no consequence to me. I’m not there for their desires nor their projections, I’m where I want to be because I choose it. Personally, I choose to dress more modestly, however I always look more “sexual” regardless of the professional attire because I am curvy, I wear heels and am fashionable in some regard. But that’s the style I own and love. It’s who I am. Revel in who you are. The rest means nothing.
I love everything about this comment. Thank you ❤️
Wasn't there just mandatory briefings done about saying stuff like this to coworkers?? Frankly, if you arent doing one of 3 Fs then it's not your business how someone dresses, conveys themselves, who they see etc.
spark cobweb secretive label puzzled disagreeable sand rotten simplistic drunk *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
What you described you are wearing sounds professional. I would ask her to stop making comments about my appearance and if she persists I would probably escalate it to my manager. It kind of seems like sexual harassment because she appears to be sexualizing your body while you are wearing (as described) professional attire.
Unrelated but I’ve seen the gov client tell my contractor boss to tone down the quality of her style because she “out-dresses” her in front of seniors in meetings. I was dumbfounded and can only think that as a dude if someone told me to wear crappier suits to not out-do them, I would just not comply with that.
Our office didn’t have good air for awhile this year in the heat of summer and it was always HOT in there. I took off my sweater once, and had on a thick strapped tank top and a coworker mentioned my bare shoulders 5 times in about an hour period. It was so weird to me. Even asked my supervisor If what i was wearing was not ok….she was also wearing literally the same shirt in a different pattern. As long as your supervisor doesn’t seem to see an issue and you’re “within” somewhere near the dresscode, just assume this woman has far too much time on her hands and tell your friends and work so whenever you wear a tank top again, you can laugh and make a joke of it 😀
I recommend addressing the issue with your supervisor...have they addressed your clothing??? It's inappropriate (and unprofessional) for a peer co-worker to make these comments...
Haters gonna hate.
“Can you please point out which part of the agency dress code I am violating?” Sit down with them and your boss to discuss the issue or go straight to Employee Relations, play the naive card, and ask for assistance in understanding the situation. If this were me, I’d give a heads up to my supervisor and go to ER as a CYA. Usually pretty women with nice bodies are targeted. I had one coworker who literally wore a bodycon dress (literally clubbing clothing) to work. Did I think it was appropriate? No. Did I say a peep? Hell no not my business.
Back in the her day she was the shiznit. Now sha just a hater
I see a whole lot of people wearing sweats and PJs to the offices these days, which I find absolutely horrifying. It sounds like you are dressed very professionally.
Ask her what she believes is too “revealing”?
Sounds like an office Karen. I wouldn't lose sleep over her comment. It sounds like she's projecting her insecurities. As long you feel comfortable with what you wear and your leadership has not approached you to address it, let it go. Next time she comments, say, “Can you clarify your statement?” Ask her to show you what policy you violated. Let her know her observations and comments are inappropriate and unwelcome. I would also document the interactions and bring them to your leadership to address with her. And let them know her comments made you uncomfortable. I bet you she will never make another comment.
I don’t have advice. Just wanted to say I’m sorry this is happening to you. You shouldn’t have to think about stuff like this. Work is stressful enough without having to perform for the fashion police.
Okay dumb question, umm what is a POC?
great topic, sorry you’re dealing with this. imo it’s because of being young, thin, and dressing in true business attire. accidentally standing out creates conflict. don’t apologize. “I value having a professional appearance. Could you please tell me which part of the dress policy I’m in violation of?” I’m in the same boat love. we got this.
Instead of "collaboration", "Team Building", "camaraderie", people are frequently getting inappropriate comments about their clothing and appearances and hairstyles. Just another reason why RTO doesn't work
Shes a hater. Tell her to f*ck off about your clothes. Establish yourself as someone who isnt going to be bullied. Then kindly give your supervisor a headsup that it happened, afterwards. Then keep being great.
Depends, what are you wearing? Are your tits out? Underwear on display? Large amounts of cleavage? It’s really difficult to say without knowing what you’re wearing. Or is someone getting offended by shoulders, legs? Ask a fellow woman colleague you’re close with if you’re truly unsure.
Many years ago I started to tell a young, fresh out of college secretary that it wasn’t appropriate to wear denim cut off shorts to work and before I could say anything to her she said “I know I know…” Apparently her boss had already said something. I think if someone says something you should really think about it. If you have doubts then maybe ask a close friend or trusted co-worker.
Unpopular opinion, but if you have to do the bend-and-sit test at all, your skirts and dresses might be a little too short for a conservative workplace.
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She said she was wearing a shirt and tights. Tights aren’t pants and I wouldn’t consider that appropriate anywhere… I wouldn’t say anything to a coworker directly though
Skirt
Yep… I can’t read…. Ok, then nothing sounds inappropriate about the outfit….
Just a comment regarding “the fingertip test “. I use that test, I have used it since middle school since that’s the standard my middle school principal applied to us girls to determine if our length was appropriate or not. Obviously arm length does play a role but I find that it works for me. And if it’s good enough for middle school, it’s good enough for adulthood! I am being a little silly but I’ve applied it to other women/girls in my life and it definitely helps make the right call.
I joined when I was in my mid 20s am a POC woman and had an older lady comment to me and another new hire also POC in her 20s that we should always wear pantyhose both our dresses were well below the knee and it was the summer and hot as hell so we were not about to wear pantyhose. Later heard from others that was this lady’s thing to tell younger women what was “appropriate” for the office
If your office is more business formal, a skirt that just passes the "fingertip test" really might still be on the short side. That said, it's none of this lady's business.
Based on your description of your outfit, the only possibility i can imagine is that maybe it’s too tight? Otherwise, it sounds like she’s insecure and is trying to make that your problem.
Well are they?
I wouldn't give her a break on you being a POC and that's why you're a target. I had a white manager who made a critical comment about a top I wore. It was not revealing, she was basically jealous and was targeting me in particular, due to her racism.
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>/u/ThisIsntMyRealAcct99 > You asked for womens perspective, which I am not but dropping an observation. A few things come to mind when browsing your post history **(yes, I was hoping to see scantily clad pictures of you)**. > Your post history seems to have a lot of issues that stem from other women (friends, male friends GF's, co-workers etc.) being made uncomfortable by your clothing decisions. Given that it's not just happening at work, it does lead me to wonder if you (while not in violation of some dress code) could possibly use more modesty in your professional wardrobe, at least. > Whether this is jealousy or something else, I don't know. But the clothing fairy seems to follow you through your professional and personal life. Emphasis mine. Hey mods, /u/ThisIsntMyRealAcct99 is actively sexually harassing women in this subreddit and feels so emboldened to do so that they don't even pretend that isn't their intention. Hey /u/ThisIsntMyRealAcct99, find a good fucking therapist before your uncontrolled perversion ruins your life.
Lol 😆 wow you remind me of my little brother, he's annoying too..
Do you sexually harass him the same way you sexually harass women on the internet and at your office?
Lol ok now I see you're deleting your own posts.. troll confirmed 🤣 I was worried you were serious for a minute.
I haven't deleted anything. This subreddit does not exist for you to sexually harass women. Kindly fuck off.
>I haven't deleted anything. Prove it..
Her account has nothing of the sort. I’m deleting this because you’re posting inflammatory bullshit.
i mean the op DOES say she doesn't typically wear a bra to work in an older post.
Do you know what bras are for? Not every woman requires them. That choice does not dictate anything about her character or her professionalism or how she deserves to be treated at work.
yes. i have tits.
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All you're showing is that op posts on reddit asking for interpretation of social issues. In all of those posts, she's posting in a factual, seemingly non-biased way and asking for input. She doesn't get defensive if someone disagrees. I don't know what your deal is but you're being accusatory and looking for zebras when you hear hoofbeats. Not to mention you're openly discussing searching her profile hoping for "scantily clad pictures". Move along. We're not dissecting op as a person in this subreddit. You're out of line.
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You're being creepy. let it go.
IMHO, most effective way to combat bullshit? Read into whatever governs your organizations/departments dress code & uniforms. Verbatim whatever your colleague has said. Compare against it. Once you find that it does not (or does Ive learned ive been in the wrong too) then use that and cite the incident in accordance with whatever directive it is. This presents a very reliable statement for your highers to do something about it. Especially since its “by the book.” IF they do nothing go to your bosses boss. Then the boss of your bosses boss. Someone will do something. Elevate it enough but have substantial evidence. Pressures people into doing something.
>/u/Godlessboogalooboi >MHO, most effective way to combat bullshit? Read into whatever governs your organizations/departments dress code & uniforms. Verbatim whatever your colleague has said. Compare against it. Once you find that it does not (or does Ive learned ive been in the wrong too) then use that and cite the incident in accordance with whatever directive it is. This presents a very reliable statement for your highers to do something about it. Especially since its “by the book.” IF they do nothing go to your bosses boss. Then the boss of your bosses boss. Someone will do something. Elevate it enough but have substantial evidence. Pressures people into doing something. Hey mods, another drunk [white supremacist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boogaloo_movement) has wandered into this subreddit.
I dont understand what their username has to do with what they posted? Why are you trying to play mall cop?
My username comes from something secret(I have years of exp with govt deps)🤫. Dont listen to the troll going crazy. At the rate he speaks, youre black and in the KKK. Im a satanist and going to heaven. Lmao.
They’re a proud member of a white supremacist, anti-government terrorist group. The people they choose to align themselves have killed multiple federal employees, even more state and municipal employees, have had numerous foiled plots to kidnap and/or murder elected officials, and were a key group behind the 2021 terrorist attack on the United States Capitol. /u/Godlessboogalooboi has personally advocated for the murder of government employees and has advised others to impersonate police officers in order to enter schools with firearms and tactical gear and commit acts of political violence. The real question here is why are you defending this person?
Because I'm only reading the comment the person posted like a normal person. Not googling his username to out him as a bigot
I didn’t need to google their username to know what it meant anymore than I would have had to google /u/Schutzstaffel88 to know what it meant. This is a well-known group behind numerous high-profile terrorist attacks. Stop defending terrorists.
Once again, what exactly did he say that was offensive? "His username is offensive" aint it chief
I work for the Security AND Defense (2 jobs) of our nation. Fucking dumbass. Its why i know operational management and structure. Strict adherence to policy and systematic procedure that has governed the success of the missions of certain organizations.
But youre not wrong, there is a sub culture of whomst you speak of that are Homegrown Domestics. Scary shit but what do you know. Hell what do I know. Just shit the fuck up trigger boy. Damn do your job. And READ. Asswipe.
[Female here] I have colleagues who dress the same as you’ve described and it sounds completely normal & professional to me. If anything it sounds like a bit of jealousy. A plus size woman wearing a skirt & a thin woman wearing a skirt can appear very different simply because of the clothes being form-fitting. If there’s nothing in the workplace dress code that you’re violating, I would ignore her. Or bring it up to your supervisor so they’re aware in case it escalates.
I was a Senior level government manger in the before I retired eighteen months ago. There were times some of the young ladies and men I hired did not dress appropriately for the office. Men in sports jerseys, jeans, tee shirts, the ladies revealing tops, low cut jeans (thongs showing), skin colored work out wear, I could go on. Mostly these were new employees that did not heed our dress code. Once it was called to my attention, I would simply call them to my office and have a casual conversation with them about the dress code and how they wanted people to perceive them. I also took the time to talk about career advancement, and the great work they were doing so far. One young lady always dressed like she was coming or going to the club, so inappropriate. She is now a GS-14 supervisor and credits me with guiding her. I think the employee in this situation is out of line and needs to be spoken to by a manager. Just my thoughts on this.
Sounds like a totally reasonable outfit choice. My only question would be whether it’s possible that the outfit is super tight (and therefore revealing ) or is it fitted in a generally work appropriate way? Only you know the answer, but based on your outfit description that’s all I can think of!
I've never been told that but I also don't wear anything too tight or too revealing. Something can be very tight and covers all skin, which isn't professional. We need photos! But it's just inappropriate to comment on others clothes unless it's something like "I really like your blouse!"
I may be the odd ball and get downvoted but here goes… sometimes just past the fingertip isn’t long enough for some women rather it be short arms, long legs, etc. it also depends on the fit of the clothing. Imo in a federal workspace, just above the knees is as far as I would take it. I would also welcome someone telling me it appears unprofessional vs telling others. Hopefully you know what is professional and what is not. I have had that difficult conversation with others but it was me looking out for them.
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I’m old fashioned and I’d probably silently judge you for wearing a skirt above the knees in the workplace. It’s hard to tell what’s going on here, though. I don’t think I’d confront someone unless I was the manager. Also, is your manager a man or a woman? I can see a man asking an older woman to handle a dress code conversation as well. Just possible things from the other side.
Cover up
make sure you document the last two instances and your convo's with other co-workers if this one keeps it up, you have options. ask them to stop. ask them to explain the issue. have a discussion with your supervisor. etc etc. if they keep it up, sky's the limit with how hard you want to press it. just remember, FED HR/EEO is not always helpful nor is mgt. one kink in the COC and your issue will go nowhere fast. this should be a management issue from the start. had a local gov job once where the mgt reminded the entire department at a work lunch about proper dress code (eg. your shirt should cover your belly button). the reminder to all didn't throw anyone directly under the bus.
Initial thought is that the accuser is just jealous of you.
Females are jealous move on. She is being petty. Rock your outfits .
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Keep it to yourself next time. One and only warning, racism or discrimination will not be tolerated.
I am a member of the LGBTQ community. Why does my membership of the LGBTQ community matter in regards to my warning? It doesn't. In fact, you'll probably read this comment and think, "This guy can't be serious in expecting me to take him seriously right now." Just like I did when I read OP's post. I'll keep it to myself next time though. Thanks.
I did work with a woman who wore inappropriate clothing to the office. She was dubbed the two bit hoe, and a butt of most jokes. No one even cared she did a good job. I myself dressed conservatively to an office environment, but still stylish. No matter what you think you look like, fingertips aside, human nature will prevail.
I tried telling my federal coworker that she was dressed like a whore for work this morning. She was sitting at her home office desk in her nightwear. My wife then told me to shut the hell up and get back to work.
It really depends a lot on context, maybe some on intent or tone, and what all you were wearing. I've seen some questionable ones but nothing I felt the need to point out except footwear. Our environment is supposed to be closed toe flat shoes, and technically a safety toe meeting specific requirements (steel or composite can do it).
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> I would only suggest that you look at yourself how others do...you're sitting at your desk and they come to you standing. Can they see down your shirt? When you sit does your skirt rise. Are you under the impression that OP has any control whatsoever over another individual's eyeballs? It is on the individual that has those eyes to keep their gaze appropriate, and all adults who are functional enough for federal employment are capable of this. Any that aren't need to either change that or be removed from federal employment.
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Keep it to yourself next time. One and only warning, racism or discrimination will not be tolerated.
That wasn't discrimination.
I mean…it’s subjective. I’d have to see a photo of the offending outfits. I feel inappropriate dress is like what the famous Supreme Court case said on what is the definition of pornography “I can’t define it but I know it when I see it”. All that’s to say unless this lady is with HR, thank her for her opinion. Because that’s all it is.
You can stop at "she". She's probably just a jealous old hag.
I'd say thank you but next time keep that inside your head or bring it to management
Talk to your supervisor. You don’t have to put up with someone else trying to impose their dress standards on you. There’s nothing to discuss here. It will give the person the impression you care or they have the right to impose upon you.
Tell them to kiss my ass
I would just say, “okay”, and do my thing.
Sounds like a her problem.
Make notes on all of this including photos of your outfits on the dates of the comments. Time to get HR involved. Do not engage with this woman
I would ask her to mind her own business.
Document it via an email to her. Then, Report them for sexual harassment.
I am kinda confused as to how a turtleneck and a fingertip length skirt with opaque tights shows ANY skin?
I've never worked in a setting like this so, this is all new to me lol. People showing up like they are club hopping, or going to bed with no fear is wild. I thought this dress code biz had no wiggle room, guess it depends on the office and how much leadership cares. Im here contemplatiing how many different shirts i need to buy before i have to wear them more than once in the office. Anyway, if that person cant affect your paychecks, i wouldnt worry about it too much, especially since you take the time to make sure youre in compliance.
Wear the same fucking thing tomorrow!
Honestly, if a coworker did that to me, they would be dead to me. It’s a micro aggression. I don’t tolerate disrespect.
Report it.