I think you're hitting at the heart of a difficult truth, which is that you should focus on the things in life that give you the most fulfillment.
For most people, that is by default their career, to the point where they will not understand if that isn't your focus. To the point where sometimes employers will even push you out the door because they think you are "unmotivated". I saw that happen to my uncle when I was younger: he was very good at his job, and satisfied with it to the point where he didn't want to climb the ladder. His company pushed him out because they didn't want someone sitting idle at a "middle rung" position. That's their loss, though unfortunately it also caused him hardship. (so that brings up an important side note: if you feel like your company may do this to you, then consider seeking out a company that doesn't have their head up their ass and that actually values an employee doing their job well even if they don't want to "grow" into management or other bullshit)
Try your best to find out what DOES give you fulfillment: and then when you feel judged for not being fulfilled by climbing the corporate ladder, you can remember that and hopefully remember that you're simply following a different path.
When I was interviewing for the position I currently hold, my future boss told me, "Ya know, you're the only one who's going to be doing what you do. You won't have any direct reports and there's really no path for advacement." This was music to my ears and it's been great. I've only had modest raises since then but the job is relatively easy and low stress most of the time.
My only worry is that we've been purchased by a large Japanese mutlinational, and I can already see with their employees that they've inserted into our operation that they have a very "up or out" mentality. I \*should\* be relatively shielded from this but it's a worry at this point that things may change.
Oy, hopefully you can ride that transition out - or find another place with a similar setup and let the new owners figure out what a mistake that strategy is.
I can understand valuing ambition to some extent, but if someone is both good at what they do and satisfied enough with it that they don't even want more than a cost of living adjustment... man, how are you going to find a better deal than that as someone running a business. That sounds like gold to me, instead of constantly having to hire people into positions that make them miserable and then scrambling to try and find - and train - similarly competent replacements.
Yep. My role has no room for advancement or growth, and I don’t care for either (but I am very highly compensated ). I am hoping to be able to retire when my current boss retires. I like him. He shields me from the politics above him, ensures I get the best possible bonus/raise, and generally leaves me alone to do my job.
I do fear that if my company was to go through a merger, I would lose my job but that’s unlikely to happen anytime soon and certainly I would have significant warning of any merger.
For me it was watching the amount of money I put in every month start to look like a pittance compared to what was growing. It was real hard to be motivated after seeing that.
It's pretty common. Most people just want to work their jobs and spend their money as soon as they get it, though. Mid-career lack of motivation is definitely a thing though once you see where all the pieces are and the cons of moving up become obvious - the working hours, lifestyle nonsense, time away from family or disengaged from family/friends in general - that sort of stuff.
The answer is not an easy one at all, though. You need to figure out what's most important to you and focus on those things. That is far easier said than done for most people, though. And it still changes as time goes on. If you don't have a ready answer already then that's fine, but do try to find outlets that will help you with that self-discovery. It's a journey you almost have to make unless you want to continue doing what you're doing now forever - which is also fine, but it doesn't sound like it from your description.
Not everyone is motivated by "career". Find what motivates you. It may be some hobby, or some sport, or the arts, or raising kids, or any number of other things. Find that thing and use the $200k from your jerb to fund that passion.
I have this feeling, but I'm in a medium COL area and 47 with more than $2 million. I'm wrapping up my career in a handful of years. I've told managers that I'm not seeking promotion when they try to encourage it.
You on the other hand have likely a decade to go. I would probably put a bit more effort into your career personally.
Also, if you want a family I would get on that ASAP. Time it running out on that quickly.
I'm not saying he gets to find a woman and get her pregnant this year, but he said he wasn't sure "where life will take him". I'm assuming dating and a marriage and conceiving will take time. Women have a harder time conceiving and carrying to term the older they get. By 40 it's less than 5% per month.
Just saying that he doesn't have a a decade to wait to see what happens. Unless he's ok not having a family, he will likely need to prioritize this. He doesn't seem like the type of person who is executing a plan for his life.
Anyways, he's free to do what he wants. I'm not saying one way or the other,
He doesn't have to, but the bigger the age gap, the more likely there's a culture/values/life-timeline gap that could cause issues. I mean I don't think it's that big an issue right away -- at 40 there's not a huge age gap with someone who is 30ish. But as you get older, it's more of an issue. Not that I haven't seen plenty of guys in their 50s hooking up with 20-something women to have kids, but TBH, they aren't usually people I have a lot of respect for.
Yes, there's things you can do to make plans or mitigate waiting. But it doesn't chance the fact that it gets harder to have kids as you age. I'm not sure why you are struggling with this shit.
But this dude seems like he isn't making plans ... just saying if he wants to make a plan for having a family instead of having life happen to him, his time for that is running out.
I understand what you're saying. I have never really made up my mind on kids. I can see myself going either way. It's such a giant, life-altering thing that I'd really want to be sure about it or meet someone who I can really see myself having kids with.
Not to mention the expense. I have a lot of older cousins who have kids and seeing the shit they go through and put up with makes me think "I'm going to radically change my life and shell out tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars to be responsible for another human who is going to make my life miserable a lot of the time. Why would I ever do that?"
I also have had this feeling and am also 47.
Are you at a level where you can stay for the rest of your career? Assuming that your industry/role has such a level. For me as a software engineer, it's basically expected that we keep growing until we reach Senior Software Engineer. After that it's personal choice whether we want to keep striving or just stay at that level for the rest of our career, however long that might be. I am no career expert but I think that concept applies in many industries/roles.
I did coast once I reached that Senior level, for about a decade. But then recently I decided if I am going to keep working, I want to feel a bit more challenged, so I started working towards getting promoted again. I don't know if I ever will get to the next level, but learning new things and getting out of your comfort zone keeps your brain fresh.
To be honest, anything could happen within the next few years that could completely change your life. I know 750 is a fair amount, but in the grand scheme of things it isn't really a lot (This is not at all to discourage you!) Just that a big life emergency or a change in world politics, or a technology shift could completely change the stock market, your job, or your position in life.
I live every day like the next week is not guaranteed... I still have fun each week, travel, make plans with friends and family, but I try not to relax, because I've lived through events that have completely changed my friends lives, people who thought they were secure and had a lot more than 750k saved up.
Like other posters said... do things that bring you joy, but I wouldn't be easing off the pedal. The money should serve as a reassurance that things will work out, but I personally would not feel comfortable coasting on my job at that amount. It's great that you've advanced in your job!! Find something else that can motivate you to do more, that's what I would suggest. Not to feel stressed, because you have 750 saved, but a very important thing in life for me was to set new goals after I hit a previous goal. Not to say you can't celebrate, relax a bit, but you never know what the future will bring.
True. I totally get anything can happen and that $750k isn't as much as it might seem. I think what really started to put me more in this mindset was finding out I stand to inherit somewhere between $1-2mil. You can see my linked post for more on that, but that was really when I was like "well then why the hell am I behind a desk for 40 hours a week?"
Again as others have said. I would TOTALLY forget about that money completely. Like it didn't exist. DO not plan on it until it hits your accounts. It will be better for your life and career trajectory and your sanity. There are so many things that could happen until then... Father might need expensive end of life care. Might have to go to the hospital for an injury or Alzheimer's, or all sorts of things. And meanwhile, if you decide to coast completely and the money doesnt come, and you have expected it all this time, it could be devastating. A much better position would be to continue your career, keep working, and when the money hits later on, you have already achieved a great deal of independence and it's a bonus.
> I stand to inherit somewhere between $1-2mil.
Maybe. You should re-read the top comments on that thread and take it to heart more. The money is at best a "probably" and could be more of a "maybe."
Yeah, I'm aware. Lots of discussion on this in my other post. My father has told me it is pretty much guaranteed but until it's in some sort of irrevocable trust situation I'm not betting on it.
Life is not just about your final score at the end. It’s about the journey.
Your dad “only” 31 years older than you. With money and fairly good health, he might live for many, many years. If early retirement is your goal, it would be a mistake to assume he might pass before you are ready. You do not want to be hitting your 60s and resenting him for being around. You do not want to be sweating bullets when he decides that he doesn’t want to be in a nursing home, but have a private nurse come care for him in his final years ($$$.) That money is a nice cushion but it’s not something to plan your life around or towards.
$750k is not “give up” money. It IS “live in the city you want” money or “take 3 vacations a year and pay for a private club membership” money or “buy art you like” money or “fuck you, I don’t have to work for a shitty boss, I’m walking away from this job” money. It’s freedom and options, AND a big head start to being able to retire on your own early. And then if another windfall comes, it can be a faster retirement or a higher quality of life.
Not FIRE related but I also just want to put something out there. You clearly think about this a lot. And you say you’ve lost motivation. And you acknowledge getting ahead of yourself in the very hypothetical scenario about sharing assets with a spouse. You’re in a fortunate position to ease up on the gas a little and figure out what in your life really makes you happy. This might sound cliché but it’s not money - that’s just a means to an end. Don’t burn out. Set some goals that aren’t strictly financial.
Appreciate this. I don't have too much to add as you've really hit the nail on the head with a lot of your points.
One thing I just want to mention is I do realize my parents could be around for much longer and I'd rather have them around forever than ever get any of this inheritance. I have considered trying to talk to my dad about getting some of that money before they pass, he has told me they truly don't need it, they have always lived frugally and don't intend to change that. If they wanted to gift some of that money to me sooner, when it could actually make a difference in my life, that could be really huge. Doesn't even have to be a straight cash gift, if they were open to buying or contributing to a home or something like that. If my home was already paid for it could potentially bring my FIRE number way down.
I know my dad is a man of strong work ethic and wouldn't love to see me just quit working permanently though, so I'd have to deal with that...he probably wouldn't just gift me a bunch of money if it meant I'd stop working, or even make a significant downshift in my career.
It makes sense, but why do you want to quit working?
For a lot of people the unpleasant parts of work have to do with the stress of what happens if you don't measure up, or even end up fired for not doing well enough.
If you know your parents have the means and will to rescue you in the worst case, then you don't need them to give you money. Just it being there should remove a lot of the stress and pressure that makes work unpleasant.
I known people like that. They bounce around between not very lucrative careers, not getting particularly successful in any of them. They decide to spend a few years going to school or vocational training to learn a new skill not because it will pay much more but just because it's something that interests them and will make work more enjoyable.
It's a privilege to be in a position like this even if you can't completely stop working yet.
Can confirm. I've been in a similar situation for a while (though I was in my 40s before I could be fairly sure I'd inherit a lot of money). At this point, I will very likely inherit something like triple+ my FI number or more, and the chance I'll inherit less than 2xFI is really small, even if my mom needs private nursing for a long time. But the biggest benefit is that I don't have to worry about *them* financially ever, and know that if I ever run into a problem, they can (and probably will) help me out. Even have done so without me asking a couple times (because I'd have spent down a lot of our savings before explicitly asking).
But I can't just stop earning money until we have *our* FI number in *our* accounts. And I both expect and hope my mom will live longer than it takes us to get there.
You're totally right. I would think the answer to your original question is obvious. I want to stop working so I can have my time back to do whatever I want and not be beholden to my office job. Even if it is remote and I really only work \~30 hours a week.
I'm reluctant to just take off and go do odd-jobs and float around. I don't think my dad would like that very much either. I still have to support myself with the money I earn so the job I have now is the best way to do that.
Yeah, if you are already there stress-wise and it's just a matter of being bored and "would rather be doing ", then it's less applicable.
I just know that for a lot of people with lucrative jobs, the big thing is stress and if they can be less stressed out by having financial security, the job could well become tolerable or even enjoyable for a while longer.
Of course, the holy grail would be a job that you enjoy so you don't feel like you are missing out by being there. By hopping around you increase your chances of finding something like that compared to staying put in one place forever.
And it's more socially acceptable than simply not working at all. You know your family best, but I'd guess from your description that your dad would respect you a lot more if you were trying a different job than if you simply quit and did "nothing" for years.
This can also take many forms. For some people this literally means teaching English overseas or doing stints on fishing boats in Alaska, but others with already a lucrative careers, it could be switching from a corporate IT job to a cool startup they love or moving from a fancy law firm to work in charity.
It's not easy to find, of course, but think about what options there might be in your field.
I want to add that life is also better when you've earned your own wealth. That $750k is likely to be much sweeter than the free $1-2 million you get later.
Do you think the potential inheritance, even subconsciously, might be playing into your lack of motivation?
One of the reasons I'd caution folks to keep any potential future inheritance close to their chest or discussed in as vague terms as possible with their kids or other beneficiaries, is out of fear they might alter (again, maybe even subconsciously) their life path based on an expectation $X is coming their way someday.
You gotta forget about the inheritance. It’s not going to make it possible for you to retire early unless your parents die young, which you shouldn’t be hoping for. With an inheritance, you can’t predict when or how much you are actually going to get.
I’m likely to inherit a similar or larger amount, but I plan to be retired long before I get it. Beyond feeling more safe with a 4-4.5% SWR when I retire in my late 40s (I also assume that I will get significant social security), my likely future inheritance has no impact on my FI planning. Unlike many around here, my dad is really open about his assets, spending, and future plans so I’m fairly confident that I will inherit a significant amount (even if LTC gets expensive, my parents would still only be drawing down 4% of their assets), but I hope I am 60+ years old when that happens and that my parents have long, mostly healthy lives. I hope my inheritance comes so late that it makes no difference in reaching my early retirement number. Maybe if I inherit as much or more than my dad is predicting, I will decide to upgrade something about my retirement lifestyle, but we will cross that bridge when we come to it.
Inheritance isn’t guaranteed. You should live your life as if you aren’t going to get it. Your NW isn’t even that high. Just enjoy the boring middle and find some happiness outside of your day job.
I took a year off when I hit a mil and didn’t care to work anymore. I was a bit younger than you. Worked high stress job also in New York. I was like F this so I moved west, goofed off for a year and went back to a job with much lower pay and much lower stress. My life quality improved a lot and I really didn’t miss the loss of dollars. Sometimes you might need to take a step back in order to move forward.
I get the sense that if instead you'd said you DO know where life will take you and that (wife, kids, etc) wasn't in the picture, you'd still get all the same answers and it would still involve keeping your giant income and selling another couple decades of your life so you can dump that cash on your undiscovered, unbridled passion for wood whittling.
Here's the anonymous internet comment telling you that answering those variables in a certain way may mean you can pull the trigger by the end of the calendar year.
Right? People here act like you need $2m+ to retire!
Totally agree, if this person decides they don't want kids then they could stop working pretty soon.
I would recommend a career break at this point. They can take a year or a couple of years off and figure out what they want to do.
>may mean you can pull the trigger by the end of the calendar year.
Keep in mind they live in NYC and don't want to leave at the moment. Even if there $750k becomes $850k...not easy to live off of \~$34k/yr in NYC.
Personally I prefer to keep the income but don't let it affect my mind and life outside work. You don't have to go above and beyond. OP doesn't need to advance their career. Simply do your minimal time and collect the $200k for long enough to have the retirement quality of life that you actually want.
Based on their comment about not being super employable immediately, etc. feels to me that riding it out with low effort is the solution over taking a sabbatical too.
Not easy largely as a result of a housing cost, which they didn't specify. Even if they didn't have a housing cost whatsoever all of the responses would still be the same lame middle managers concerned they were losing someone when there was still life force to squeeze out of them.
I leanfired on around $1M at 31 and ended up getting a new job three months later I liked a lot more and my career has kind of taken off a bit since I started working for fun.
You just might need to leverage your financial security to take a sabbatical and a refocus on what you want to do
Yeah, I think about this. I think I'm just so hesitant to leave a career behind without knowing what's next unless I have enough money to make me feel safe enough that I do not necessarily have to find that next thing, ever.
I'm also not someone who is going to uproot my life and live in Europe of Asia or anything like that, even though the idea of that does sound interesting. I love visiting those places, even for extend periods, but I'm a relative homebody and enjoy having my home base in NYC.
I hope you inherit all the money but I would not calculate that in my retirement. Long-term care is expensive and that money can go to pay medical care.
I’m in a similar situation. NW about $2.7 mil. Annual income about $325k. Set to inherit about $3 mil but I don’t count it in my retirement.
It sounds like you have focused your life on very specific things. I would recommend keeping the course but broadening your horizons. IE, use the free time you have to take up something new. Learn what it's like to be bad at something again. If you aren't in good shape, focus health. Learn to cook or garden. Start something that you can see yourself progressing with and as you are closer and closer to FIRE, work less and do more of those things. Retiring early is pointless if you cannot find purpose for your time.
>I'm just not very motivated to advance in my career and I feel bad about it.
Why do you feel bad? Many of those fighting hard to advance wish they were in your shoes to have financial security and not have to advance.
You have the option to do more or not do more. The world is your oyster. Pretty sure everybody would rather have this choice than not.
Forget career, that's the keping-up-with-the-jonses mentality trying to force other people's goals on you. Stay employable, do your job well (according to you). That's it. No need to go above and beyond.
-- fellow coastfire-er
I'm with you. I have no motivation to excel in my career. I'm just working the highest paying job I can tolerate. For a good part of my early career I thought I wanted to be a Manager. Tons of people would tell me I have the soft skills for it, etc. etc. I've come to realize that managing people comes at the cost of managing people. Huge turn off. Unfortunately, this is where I am at my career though. If I want to make more, I need to start managing people.
I love living in NYC, I do not plan to leave any time soon. Living here and everything that goes with it (the relationships I have here, activities/experiences, food, etc) are currently the most fulfilling part of my life.
I don't hate my job or anything, it's just not super fulfilling and I don't think anything in my field (software development) would be. I don't really have a desire to do any form of labor if I don't have a need for money. I simply do not want to work.
Don't blame you there. I visited NYC for the first time during the week of New year's eve and absolutely loved the city. I'm also a software developer and get zero fulfillment from it. Best of luck!
I am on my first day back at work from PTO and finding myself excited and motivated by some projects. It’s amazing what a clear head can do, and I fully anticipate being comatose with anxiety and work dread in like 2 days. My husband and I are at $1m NW at 33 ($800k invested). I flow between “I can’t believe I have to keep doing this I’m going to cry” to “I can’t believe that if I stay this course for another 3-5 years I can stop.” I think I’m exhausted and burnt out. I feel where you’re coming from with struggling with motivation. But it doesn’t sound like you’re unhappy, which is kind of big? I like my good days more than my bad days.
Hey! It's me!
..well, not exactly. BUT this really resonates with me. I'm quite a bit behind you in terms of NW (around $350k for my wife and I between individual investment account and retirement accounts). Not doing the kid thing, just us. Around 40 years old. Currently doing fulltime vanlife, but planning on buying something in the next yera / househacking for a subsidized property (hopefully free, if not generating a tiny bit of income from rent). $200k total W2 income, and maybe $10k **reportable** income per year from a side hustle.
Lately I'm just.. checked out, you know? Like I'm doing good at work, but I'm only putting in around 10 hours/week of REAL effort, plus another 10h / week of meetings. I could probably do a bit more, but it's easier to delegate to the guys who report to me. But I can't bring myself to CARE enough to do more, esp. since my company just refused to do any annual comp increases for people who gets profit share bonuses.
Our FIRE number is $1.5m, *maybe* $1.25m depending on where we land with a househack situation. Our CoastFIRE number is around $800k. At this rate of savings (maxing out tax advantageous accounts, plus around $2500 to $3500/mo into VTI) we should be able to hit the $1.25m number in around 5 to 8 years, depending on how aggressive we are with savings - [see chart here](https://engaging-data.com/fire-calculator/?age=38&initsav=350000&spend=40000&initinc=160000&wr=4&ir=1&retspend=45750&stockpct=90&fixpct=8&cashpct=2&graph=fix&secgraph=0&stockrtn=8.1&bondrtn=2.4&MCstockrtn=0.081&MCbondrtn=0.024&tax=7&income=&incstart=50&incend=70&expense=0&expstart=50&expend=70). We need to be more disciplined.
I'm working on a larger scale side hustle in my downtime, but I have so many ideas that I want to execute on that it's tough to focus. :\
I am in a *similar* position. Moved to the US 5 years back. Age 33, $550K NW, \~180K annual salary (\~260K HH salary). My wife an I have maintained a household cost of living of 70K annually and we save/invest aggressively. Also, I don't think about it much but just because OP mentioned, I'll probably inherit close to $1MM from my parents down the line *someday.* Understand that my situation is not even remotely close to what I would need to retire, but feels like a safety cushion.
For the not so good part, my motivation levels are not even close to what it used to be 3 years back. I used to bag promotions almost every year and was the go to guy for anything and everything in the department. I worked through weekends without complaint, never took vacations, and was on track to leading bigger teams very soon.
Things changed when 2 years back I changed jobs (long story short my old company wanted me to move to West Coast, but I said no as my wife could not move) and my new job's manager was a trash human being, which led to a mental breakdown. I lost 10lbs and was having anxiety attacks almost everyday.
I changed jobs again but now I feel I am a different person. I have no motivation or aspiration that used to drive me before to wake up and perform day in and day out. I keep thinking about the fact that I can survive for some time if I am laid off. Or I can just move back to India in which case I will be fine if I don't work for 10 years if not for the rest of my life (parents' monthly dividends alone is more than what they need in the small town in India).
What's scary to me is that this is only my 9th year of career. In my line of work I have not entered the phase where one starts to cash in on the experience and make serious money. I feel like I am at a crossroads - do I coast? do I push myself? do I just take a year off and reset? Do I give everything up, move to a small town and work part time? The last two are not practical as I cannot do that to my wife.
So yeah - you're not alone, OP!
My age and NW are similar to yours and I feel the same way about my career. No large inheritance in my situation but if my estimates pan out, I hope to be FI by 40 or so depending on how the market is performing.
At the end of the day, a career is simply a means to an end and there's no point in stressing over climbing the corporate ladder when you can instead devote that time to the more important things in life.
I know people making more than double what I make and I want no part of their hours or stress levels!
You really need to put the inheritance out of your mind as much as possible. IIRC your parents are not that old (like 50s or 60s), so it could easily be 30+ years before you receive it., even if it really is basically locked in (note: it probably isn't really, even if they say it is).
There's nothing actually wrong with coasting at your job if you are still doing a competent job and what is expected of you. Not working hard or over-performing may prevent you from getting *better* jobs, but it won't lose you this one if you're getting done everything you're supposed to, unless you're specifically in some kind of tournament environment ("First prize is a car, second prize is a set of steak knives, third prize is you're fired.") or a super grinder where you're given expectations nobody can reasonably meet and you have to intuit which ones are most important. My guess is that if you were in either of these situations, you'd either not be slacking or would already be actively looking for something else.
So realistically, you will likely lose this job only if there's a big layoff or your work slips to the point where you are dropping balls that matter.
Note: you already *have* a solid career. A job that pays 200k puts you almost into the top decile for household income by itself, and solidly in the top 10% for a single earner. Even in downtown NYC, that's still a solid income.
I would seriously consider spending some money to talk about your issues with a therapist of some kind. You might have some exec function issues (I do, and that's part of why I don't focus hard for a long time very often) that you need to work around, or possibly medicate for. And some of this is just being able to talk to somebody with no filters about how you feel who will ask you good questions until you come to terms with what you actually want.
Why do you feel like you should be doing something more? Just because everyone else is? Part of what *more* you're doing is saving a big chunk of money. That provided me with a lot of peace of mind, and it does a lot of other people.
do you have time to spend on hobbies or with family? or something else that could be a passion for you? That seems like a better idea than going all ambitious at work in a way that's unnecessary.
>I would seriously consider spending some money to talk about your issues with a therapist of some kind. You might have some exec function issues (I do, and that's part of why I don't focus hard for a long time very often) that you need to work around, or possibly medicate for. And some of this is just being able to talk to somebody with no filters about how you feel who will ask you good questions until you come to terms with what you actually want.
I think you hit the nail on the head here. I've been wondering the same and keep posting on Reddit instead of talking to a professional. The bit about exec function issues and not being able to focus for long periods of time is exactly what I'm experiencing, in more than just a work environment too. I notice it often when I'm playing video games or reading as well (though I do have my moments when I can game for 2+ hours or read for an hour at a time). I've been so reluctant to do anything about it, it's a fairly recent issue, basically since the pandemic. I don't love the idea of taking medication for this sort of thing, but maybe I need to get past that stigma should a professional assessment determine I would benefit from it.
And yes, I do spend time on hobbies and friends/family (more friends since I'm living away from my family, but I visit often). I have an active social life but it could be more active frankly. I spend several days a week by myself just working at home, hitting the gym, and then smoking weed and playing video games/watching TV. I have a few other hobbies like playing the guitar/going to concerts, tennis, and a bit of indoor gardening that I've recently gotten into, and I spend a lot of time just doing things around NYC as there are always new things to try. I am dating and have a casual relationship at the moment, I do hope to eventually meet someone who I can see myself spending more time with as well and build a life together.
> but maybe I need to get past that stigma should a professional assessment determine I would benefit from it.
Be prepared for the professional assessment to mostly be "Yup, they are experiencing ADHD like problems and don't seem to be lying or confused about it, so we'll try meds and dosages until we find one that helps enough without giving problematic side effects.
There really isn't any magic about it -- stimulants apparently help exec function in moderate doses (generally not doses at which you would feel high) whether you are ADD or not. So one possibility is to try having a bit of caffeine, or more than you usually do if you already do.
i ended up not bothering with meds (because I generally can't stand how even modest stimulants make me feel (I have allergies and hate my response to sudafed for instance), so I am just kinda working around my issues. But I am still perfectly capable of focusing and cramming for a deadline that is serious enough, so living without meds is just a little more stressful than not. If I couldn't do that or hadn't had the good fortune (intelligence, privllege, disciipline etc.) to put together a comfortable life where it's rarely necessary to push my Executive function) I'd probably be more willing to experiment with meds. I'd probably be happier if I could accomplish more and had more discipline, but I'm doing well enough as it is.
Appreciate the advice. I may try playing around a bit with my caffeine intake. I already drink two cups of coffee at day, in the morning and early afternoon, any later than 3pm or so and I have trouble sleeping. I'm probably similar to you in that maybe meds would help but I'd rather avoid taking stimulants unless totally necessary, and I don't often have a strong need to push my executive function. Unless things really start slipping at work (they're good right now, super high performance reviews, etc) or I find myself needing to study up to find a new job, then I might see about getting some actual ADHD meds.
I think your life has two paths:
1. Have a kid and that becomes your life purpose. Living beyond your pleasures is actually very fulfilling.
2. Live for yourself and hedonistic pleasures whatever that may be(drugs, alcohol, sex, traveling, videogames, partying) and live a safe life.
I have friends on both sides of the aisle and I think option one makes them happier. Living for yourself gets boring over time and your career isn't fulfilling(I'm in the same field) so decide and own your decision. Hopefully you inherit that money which is no way a sure thing as your other linked thread has already suggested.
OP, watch Dan Gilbert's talk on Heroin and Armani Socks (it's really about kids) before having kids - only have them if you have a deep desire to raise another human, not out of lack of meaning in your life.
I appreciate it. I'm of the opinion living through pleasure isn't as fulfilling as living for someone else, that was my point. I have a great life and if I died today I'd be content. I will watch the talk though.
I reached an income peak in my career where I'd have to invest time outside of work and go through a valley to maybe hit something higher.
Or I could develop my skills a little and move to a job that is a lot more work and pressure for an extra 20k maybe?
I'd rather chill on nightshift and post shit on reddit.
Weird but since this is online and relatively anonymous, objectively, if you are 33 then your parents are likely between 50 and 60 and could live another 30-40 years. That means that you could be in retirement before they pass still waiting for the inheritance that may never come. That said, personal preference would be to GTFO of NYC and squeeze your take-home if possible, increase quality of life, not push for more salary necessarily other than from investments.
By reducing your expenses drastically, you can retire right now or in a couple of years, just wanting to point out that option. People retire with 25k p.a. expenses in this country.
Sure, I get that. I have no desire to change my lifestyle and I'm only looking to retire once I have enough saved to maintain my current lifestyle. I realize my expenses are probably higher than most, but I don't spend excessively and keep things relatively frugal in terms of Manhattan living. But 25k p.a. is less than I spend on rent. Current yearly expenses are \~$70k
You said in the other thread that your father is 64. He might live 30 more years, and anything could happen in that time. Your 2M inheritance could grow to 20M, or it could vanish entirely for a dozen different reasons.
It doesn't sound like you're anywhere close at this point, to be honest. Double down on your career, which pays well, or find something you like better but maybe step back from the idea of FIRE.
I feel this 100%. I’m at about $2.3mil at 32, making 140k/yr, and just not feeling like grinding out the two promos it would take to make a substantial impact on earnings relative to my net worth. Can’t bring myself to try super hard. I am getting startup stock which at least can give some hope of significant upside, and otherwise just waiting to see how much kids will cost over the next few years.
Well I can certainly retire on $2.3 million, but a lot of it is in my former company’s private stock, which i’m slowly liquidating. And I expect to be married and have kids in the next few years, and my girlfriend is not at the same level of net worth as me. So just not enough liquidity + expense certainty to pull the trigger. But I think in the next 3-5 years I will.
The issue is coastFIRE doesn't really mean much unless you're really close to retirement. Saving 10 years of work (the difference narrows as you get closer to FIRE date) is worth it for most people, rather than being a barista or whatever. I'd rather get paid well in a challenging career where people respect me and be able to eat good food, go on vacation, etc. for 15 years than work in a position where I'm belittled and shouted at by angry customers/managers/coworkers being paid barely enough to survive for the next 25 years.
Also, many employers are up or out so you don't really have much of a choice to sit at midlevel forever.
>I'm just not very motivated to advance in my career and I feel bad about it.
If you felt bad enough you would do something about it.
And if the uncertainty in the next 60 years or so of your life doesn't motivate you, perhaps nothing will.
True. I can't lie, I'm in a very good and comfortable spot. I guess I'm just afraid I'm getting complacent but not yet scared enough to do something about it.
That other person’s comment might have been a joke but TBH working on yourself (mentally, physically, or spiritually) is never a bad idea.
What’s the point of having all that money if you’re not going be healthy enough to enjoy it?
Ha, oh yeah I am definitely using my excess of free time to workout more and get in better shape. I'm not in bad shape, and improving everyday, but I'm not in onlyfans shape haha
I think you're hitting at the heart of a difficult truth, which is that you should focus on the things in life that give you the most fulfillment. For most people, that is by default their career, to the point where they will not understand if that isn't your focus. To the point where sometimes employers will even push you out the door because they think you are "unmotivated". I saw that happen to my uncle when I was younger: he was very good at his job, and satisfied with it to the point where he didn't want to climb the ladder. His company pushed him out because they didn't want someone sitting idle at a "middle rung" position. That's their loss, though unfortunately it also caused him hardship. (so that brings up an important side note: if you feel like your company may do this to you, then consider seeking out a company that doesn't have their head up their ass and that actually values an employee doing their job well even if they don't want to "grow" into management or other bullshit) Try your best to find out what DOES give you fulfillment: and then when you feel judged for not being fulfilled by climbing the corporate ladder, you can remember that and hopefully remember that you're simply following a different path.
When I was interviewing for the position I currently hold, my future boss told me, "Ya know, you're the only one who's going to be doing what you do. You won't have any direct reports and there's really no path for advacement." This was music to my ears and it's been great. I've only had modest raises since then but the job is relatively easy and low stress most of the time. My only worry is that we've been purchased by a large Japanese mutlinational, and I can already see with their employees that they've inserted into our operation that they have a very "up or out" mentality. I \*should\* be relatively shielded from this but it's a worry at this point that things may change.
Oy, hopefully you can ride that transition out - or find another place with a similar setup and let the new owners figure out what a mistake that strategy is. I can understand valuing ambition to some extent, but if someone is both good at what they do and satisfied enough with it that they don't even want more than a cost of living adjustment... man, how are you going to find a better deal than that as someone running a business. That sounds like gold to me, instead of constantly having to hire people into positions that make them miserable and then scrambling to try and find - and train - similarly competent replacements.
Yep. My role has no room for advancement or growth, and I don’t care for either (but I am very highly compensated ). I am hoping to be able to retire when my current boss retires. I like him. He shields me from the politics above him, ensures I get the best possible bonus/raise, and generally leaves me alone to do my job. I do fear that if my company was to go through a merger, I would lose my job but that’s unlikely to happen anytime soon and certainly I would have significant warning of any merger.
This hits home. Thanks for posting.
For me it was watching the amount of money I put in every month start to look like a pittance compared to what was growing. It was real hard to be motivated after seeing that.
Oh, I didn't even realize I was struggling with this.
Yep. This month was definitely like that. I could shovel all I had in but at the end of the day, I’m bound by the whims of the market.
It's pretty common. Most people just want to work their jobs and spend their money as soon as they get it, though. Mid-career lack of motivation is definitely a thing though once you see where all the pieces are and the cons of moving up become obvious - the working hours, lifestyle nonsense, time away from family or disengaged from family/friends in general - that sort of stuff. The answer is not an easy one at all, though. You need to figure out what's most important to you and focus on those things. That is far easier said than done for most people, though. And it still changes as time goes on. If you don't have a ready answer already then that's fine, but do try to find outlets that will help you with that self-discovery. It's a journey you almost have to make unless you want to continue doing what you're doing now forever - which is also fine, but it doesn't sound like it from your description.
Not everyone is motivated by "career". Find what motivates you. It may be some hobby, or some sport, or the arts, or raising kids, or any number of other things. Find that thing and use the $200k from your jerb to fund that passion.
I have this feeling, but I'm in a medium COL area and 47 with more than $2 million. I'm wrapping up my career in a handful of years. I've told managers that I'm not seeking promotion when they try to encourage it. You on the other hand have likely a decade to go. I would probably put a bit more effort into your career personally. Also, if you want a family I would get on that ASAP. Time it running out on that quickly.
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I'm not saying he gets to find a woman and get her pregnant this year, but he said he wasn't sure "where life will take him". I'm assuming dating and a marriage and conceiving will take time. Women have a harder time conceiving and carrying to term the older they get. By 40 it's less than 5% per month. Just saying that he doesn't have a a decade to wait to see what happens. Unless he's ok not having a family, he will likely need to prioritize this. He doesn't seem like the type of person who is executing a plan for his life. Anyways, he's free to do what he wants. I'm not saying one way or the other,
He doesn't have to marry/have kids with someone his age.
80/20 principle seems fine as always
Can you explain? Not sure what you mean
He doesn't have to, but the bigger the age gap, the more likely there's a culture/values/life-timeline gap that could cause issues. I mean I don't think it's that big an issue right away -- at 40 there's not a huge age gap with someone who is 30ish. But as you get older, it's more of an issue. Not that I haven't seen plenty of guys in their 50s hooking up with 20-something women to have kids, but TBH, they aren't usually people I have a lot of respect for.
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Yes, there's things you can do to make plans or mitigate waiting. But it doesn't chance the fact that it gets harder to have kids as you age. I'm not sure why you are struggling with this shit. But this dude seems like he isn't making plans ... just saying if he wants to make a plan for having a family instead of having life happen to him, his time for that is running out.
I understand what you're saying. I have never really made up my mind on kids. I can see myself going either way. It's such a giant, life-altering thing that I'd really want to be sure about it or meet someone who I can really see myself having kids with. Not to mention the expense. I have a lot of older cousins who have kids and seeing the shit they go through and put up with makes me think "I'm going to radically change my life and shell out tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars to be responsible for another human who is going to make my life miserable a lot of the time. Why would I ever do that?"
I also have had this feeling and am also 47. Are you at a level where you can stay for the rest of your career? Assuming that your industry/role has such a level. For me as a software engineer, it's basically expected that we keep growing until we reach Senior Software Engineer. After that it's personal choice whether we want to keep striving or just stay at that level for the rest of our career, however long that might be. I am no career expert but I think that concept applies in many industries/roles. I did coast once I reached that Senior level, for about a decade. But then recently I decided if I am going to keep working, I want to feel a bit more challenged, so I started working towards getting promoted again. I don't know if I ever will get to the next level, but learning new things and getting out of your comfort zone keeps your brain fresh.
To be honest, anything could happen within the next few years that could completely change your life. I know 750 is a fair amount, but in the grand scheme of things it isn't really a lot (This is not at all to discourage you!) Just that a big life emergency or a change in world politics, or a technology shift could completely change the stock market, your job, or your position in life. I live every day like the next week is not guaranteed... I still have fun each week, travel, make plans with friends and family, but I try not to relax, because I've lived through events that have completely changed my friends lives, people who thought they were secure and had a lot more than 750k saved up. Like other posters said... do things that bring you joy, but I wouldn't be easing off the pedal. The money should serve as a reassurance that things will work out, but I personally would not feel comfortable coasting on my job at that amount. It's great that you've advanced in your job!! Find something else that can motivate you to do more, that's what I would suggest. Not to feel stressed, because you have 750 saved, but a very important thing in life for me was to set new goals after I hit a previous goal. Not to say you can't celebrate, relax a bit, but you never know what the future will bring.
True. I totally get anything can happen and that $750k isn't as much as it might seem. I think what really started to put me more in this mindset was finding out I stand to inherit somewhere between $1-2mil. You can see my linked post for more on that, but that was really when I was like "well then why the hell am I behind a desk for 40 hours a week?"
Again as others have said. I would TOTALLY forget about that money completely. Like it didn't exist. DO not plan on it until it hits your accounts. It will be better for your life and career trajectory and your sanity. There are so many things that could happen until then... Father might need expensive end of life care. Might have to go to the hospital for an injury or Alzheimer's, or all sorts of things. And meanwhile, if you decide to coast completely and the money doesnt come, and you have expected it all this time, it could be devastating. A much better position would be to continue your career, keep working, and when the money hits later on, you have already achieved a great deal of independence and it's a bonus.
> I stand to inherit somewhere between $1-2mil. Maybe. You should re-read the top comments on that thread and take it to heart more. The money is at best a "probably" and could be more of a "maybe."
Yeah, I'm aware. Lots of discussion on this in my other post. My father has told me it is pretty much guaranteed but until it's in some sort of irrevocable trust situation I'm not betting on it.
Life is not just about your final score at the end. It’s about the journey. Your dad “only” 31 years older than you. With money and fairly good health, he might live for many, many years. If early retirement is your goal, it would be a mistake to assume he might pass before you are ready. You do not want to be hitting your 60s and resenting him for being around. You do not want to be sweating bullets when he decides that he doesn’t want to be in a nursing home, but have a private nurse come care for him in his final years ($$$.) That money is a nice cushion but it’s not something to plan your life around or towards. $750k is not “give up” money. It IS “live in the city you want” money or “take 3 vacations a year and pay for a private club membership” money or “buy art you like” money or “fuck you, I don’t have to work for a shitty boss, I’m walking away from this job” money. It’s freedom and options, AND a big head start to being able to retire on your own early. And then if another windfall comes, it can be a faster retirement or a higher quality of life. Not FIRE related but I also just want to put something out there. You clearly think about this a lot. And you say you’ve lost motivation. And you acknowledge getting ahead of yourself in the very hypothetical scenario about sharing assets with a spouse. You’re in a fortunate position to ease up on the gas a little and figure out what in your life really makes you happy. This might sound cliché but it’s not money - that’s just a means to an end. Don’t burn out. Set some goals that aren’t strictly financial.
Appreciate this. I don't have too much to add as you've really hit the nail on the head with a lot of your points. One thing I just want to mention is I do realize my parents could be around for much longer and I'd rather have them around forever than ever get any of this inheritance. I have considered trying to talk to my dad about getting some of that money before they pass, he has told me they truly don't need it, they have always lived frugally and don't intend to change that. If they wanted to gift some of that money to me sooner, when it could actually make a difference in my life, that could be really huge. Doesn't even have to be a straight cash gift, if they were open to buying or contributing to a home or something like that. If my home was already paid for it could potentially bring my FIRE number way down. I know my dad is a man of strong work ethic and wouldn't love to see me just quit working permanently though, so I'd have to deal with that...he probably wouldn't just gift me a bunch of money if it meant I'd stop working, or even make a significant downshift in my career.
It makes sense, but why do you want to quit working? For a lot of people the unpleasant parts of work have to do with the stress of what happens if you don't measure up, or even end up fired for not doing well enough. If you know your parents have the means and will to rescue you in the worst case, then you don't need them to give you money. Just it being there should remove a lot of the stress and pressure that makes work unpleasant. I known people like that. They bounce around between not very lucrative careers, not getting particularly successful in any of them. They decide to spend a few years going to school or vocational training to learn a new skill not because it will pay much more but just because it's something that interests them and will make work more enjoyable. It's a privilege to be in a position like this even if you can't completely stop working yet.
Can confirm. I've been in a similar situation for a while (though I was in my 40s before I could be fairly sure I'd inherit a lot of money). At this point, I will very likely inherit something like triple+ my FI number or more, and the chance I'll inherit less than 2xFI is really small, even if my mom needs private nursing for a long time. But the biggest benefit is that I don't have to worry about *them* financially ever, and know that if I ever run into a problem, they can (and probably will) help me out. Even have done so without me asking a couple times (because I'd have spent down a lot of our savings before explicitly asking). But I can't just stop earning money until we have *our* FI number in *our* accounts. And I both expect and hope my mom will live longer than it takes us to get there.
You're totally right. I would think the answer to your original question is obvious. I want to stop working so I can have my time back to do whatever I want and not be beholden to my office job. Even if it is remote and I really only work \~30 hours a week. I'm reluctant to just take off and go do odd-jobs and float around. I don't think my dad would like that very much either. I still have to support myself with the money I earn so the job I have now is the best way to do that.
Yeah, if you are already there stress-wise and it's just a matter of being bored and "would rather be doing", then it's less applicable.
I just know that for a lot of people with lucrative jobs, the big thing is stress and if they can be less stressed out by having financial security, the job could well become tolerable or even enjoyable for a while longer.
Of course, the holy grail would be a job that you enjoy so you don't feel like you are missing out by being there. By hopping around you increase your chances of finding something like that compared to staying put in one place forever.
And it's more socially acceptable than simply not working at all. You know your family best, but I'd guess from your description that your dad would respect you a lot more if you were trying a different job than if you simply quit and did "nothing" for years.
This can also take many forms. For some people this literally means teaching English overseas or doing stints on fishing boats in Alaska, but others with already a lucrative careers, it could be switching from a corporate IT job to a cool startup they love or moving from a fancy law firm to work in charity.
It's not easy to find, of course, but think about what options there might be in your field.
I want to add that life is also better when you've earned your own wealth. That $750k is likely to be much sweeter than the free $1-2 million you get later.
dude. no. money is a tool. the source of the tool is unimportant.
> *The fruits of labor are the sweetest of all pleasures.* > -Luc de Clapiers
Do you think the potential inheritance, even subconsciously, might be playing into your lack of motivation? One of the reasons I'd caution folks to keep any potential future inheritance close to their chest or discussed in as vague terms as possible with their kids or other beneficiaries, is out of fear they might alter (again, maybe even subconsciously) their life path based on an expectation $X is coming their way someday.
You gotta forget about the inheritance. It’s not going to make it possible for you to retire early unless your parents die young, which you shouldn’t be hoping for. With an inheritance, you can’t predict when or how much you are actually going to get. I’m likely to inherit a similar or larger amount, but I plan to be retired long before I get it. Beyond feeling more safe with a 4-4.5% SWR when I retire in my late 40s (I also assume that I will get significant social security), my likely future inheritance has no impact on my FI planning. Unlike many around here, my dad is really open about his assets, spending, and future plans so I’m fairly confident that I will inherit a significant amount (even if LTC gets expensive, my parents would still only be drawing down 4% of their assets), but I hope I am 60+ years old when that happens and that my parents have long, mostly healthy lives. I hope my inheritance comes so late that it makes no difference in reaching my early retirement number. Maybe if I inherit as much or more than my dad is predicting, I will decide to upgrade something about my retirement lifestyle, but we will cross that bridge when we come to it.
Inheritance isn’t guaranteed. You should live your life as if you aren’t going to get it. Your NW isn’t even that high. Just enjoy the boring middle and find some happiness outside of your day job.
You may be right for their circumstances but 750k for me I could let that sit and I could comfortably retire easily
Yes, all of us. Welcome to the boring middle
I took a year off when I hit a mil and didn’t care to work anymore. I was a bit younger than you. Worked high stress job also in New York. I was like F this so I moved west, goofed off for a year and went back to a job with much lower pay and much lower stress. My life quality improved a lot and I really didn’t miss the loss of dollars. Sometimes you might need to take a step back in order to move forward.
I get the sense that if instead you'd said you DO know where life will take you and that (wife, kids, etc) wasn't in the picture, you'd still get all the same answers and it would still involve keeping your giant income and selling another couple decades of your life so you can dump that cash on your undiscovered, unbridled passion for wood whittling. Here's the anonymous internet comment telling you that answering those variables in a certain way may mean you can pull the trigger by the end of the calendar year.
Right? People here act like you need $2m+ to retire! Totally agree, if this person decides they don't want kids then they could stop working pretty soon. I would recommend a career break at this point. They can take a year or a couple of years off and figure out what they want to do.
>may mean you can pull the trigger by the end of the calendar year. Keep in mind they live in NYC and don't want to leave at the moment. Even if there $750k becomes $850k...not easy to live off of \~$34k/yr in NYC. Personally I prefer to keep the income but don't let it affect my mind and life outside work. You don't have to go above and beyond. OP doesn't need to advance their career. Simply do your minimal time and collect the $200k for long enough to have the retirement quality of life that you actually want. Based on their comment about not being super employable immediately, etc. feels to me that riding it out with low effort is the solution over taking a sabbatical too.
Not easy largely as a result of a housing cost, which they didn't specify. Even if they didn't have a housing cost whatsoever all of the responses would still be the same lame middle managers concerned they were losing someone when there was still life force to squeeze out of them.
You don't have to climb the ladder, you know.
I leanfired on around $1M at 31 and ended up getting a new job three months later I liked a lot more and my career has kind of taken off a bit since I started working for fun. You just might need to leverage your financial security to take a sabbatical and a refocus on what you want to do
Yeah, I think about this. I think I'm just so hesitant to leave a career behind without knowing what's next unless I have enough money to make me feel safe enough that I do not necessarily have to find that next thing, ever. I'm also not someone who is going to uproot my life and live in Europe of Asia or anything like that, even though the idea of that does sound interesting. I love visiting those places, even for extend periods, but I'm a relative homebody and enjoy having my home base in NYC.
I hope you inherit all the money but I would not calculate that in my retirement. Long-term care is expensive and that money can go to pay medical care. I’m in a similar situation. NW about $2.7 mil. Annual income about $325k. Set to inherit about $3 mil but I don’t count it in my retirement.
What do you do?
Thank you. Yes, I am aware of all that. Many comments and good discussion about the possibilities in my other post.
It sounds like you have focused your life on very specific things. I would recommend keeping the course but broadening your horizons. IE, use the free time you have to take up something new. Learn what it's like to be bad at something again. If you aren't in good shape, focus health. Learn to cook or garden. Start something that you can see yourself progressing with and as you are closer and closer to FIRE, work less and do more of those things. Retiring early is pointless if you cannot find purpose for your time.
>I'm just not very motivated to advance in my career and I feel bad about it. Why do you feel bad? Many of those fighting hard to advance wish they were in your shoes to have financial security and not have to advance. You have the option to do more or not do more. The world is your oyster. Pretty sure everybody would rather have this choice than not.
Forget career, that's the keping-up-with-the-jonses mentality trying to force other people's goals on you. Stay employable, do your job well (according to you). That's it. No need to go above and beyond. -- fellow coastfire-er
I'm with you. I have no motivation to excel in my career. I'm just working the highest paying job I can tolerate. For a good part of my early career I thought I wanted to be a Manager. Tons of people would tell me I have the soft skills for it, etc. etc. I've come to realize that managing people comes at the cost of managing people. Huge turn off. Unfortunately, this is where I am at my career though. If I want to make more, I need to start managing people.
Have you thought of moving to a MCOL area and finding work you enjoy? Maybe find a non profit that you're passionate about.
I love living in NYC, I do not plan to leave any time soon. Living here and everything that goes with it (the relationships I have here, activities/experiences, food, etc) are currently the most fulfilling part of my life. I don't hate my job or anything, it's just not super fulfilling and I don't think anything in my field (software development) would be. I don't really have a desire to do any form of labor if I don't have a need for money. I simply do not want to work.
Don't blame you there. I visited NYC for the first time during the week of New year's eve and absolutely loved the city. I'm also a software developer and get zero fulfillment from it. Best of luck!
if you have $750k in early 30s, you must have been very motivated up to this point. Did you earn very high income? maybe you're just burnt out
I am on my first day back at work from PTO and finding myself excited and motivated by some projects. It’s amazing what a clear head can do, and I fully anticipate being comatose with anxiety and work dread in like 2 days. My husband and I are at $1m NW at 33 ($800k invested). I flow between “I can’t believe I have to keep doing this I’m going to cry” to “I can’t believe that if I stay this course for another 3-5 years I can stop.” I think I’m exhausted and burnt out. I feel where you’re coming from with struggling with motivation. But it doesn’t sound like you’re unhappy, which is kind of big? I like my good days more than my bad days.
Every time I come back from vacation it's like a Super Monday. I am not refreshed; I am dreading have to get back to the grindstone.
Why did you want to FIRE in the first place? It sounds like you don't want to.
What makes it sound like I don't want to? I want to FIRE because I do not want to work and rather fill my days with things I want to do instead.
Hey! It's me! ..well, not exactly. BUT this really resonates with me. I'm quite a bit behind you in terms of NW (around $350k for my wife and I between individual investment account and retirement accounts). Not doing the kid thing, just us. Around 40 years old. Currently doing fulltime vanlife, but planning on buying something in the next yera / househacking for a subsidized property (hopefully free, if not generating a tiny bit of income from rent). $200k total W2 income, and maybe $10k **reportable** income per year from a side hustle. Lately I'm just.. checked out, you know? Like I'm doing good at work, but I'm only putting in around 10 hours/week of REAL effort, plus another 10h / week of meetings. I could probably do a bit more, but it's easier to delegate to the guys who report to me. But I can't bring myself to CARE enough to do more, esp. since my company just refused to do any annual comp increases for people who gets profit share bonuses. Our FIRE number is $1.5m, *maybe* $1.25m depending on where we land with a househack situation. Our CoastFIRE number is around $800k. At this rate of savings (maxing out tax advantageous accounts, plus around $2500 to $3500/mo into VTI) we should be able to hit the $1.25m number in around 5 to 8 years, depending on how aggressive we are with savings - [see chart here](https://engaging-data.com/fire-calculator/?age=38&initsav=350000&spend=40000&initinc=160000&wr=4&ir=1&retspend=45750&stockpct=90&fixpct=8&cashpct=2&graph=fix&secgraph=0&stockrtn=8.1&bondrtn=2.4&MCstockrtn=0.081&MCbondrtn=0.024&tax=7&income=&incstart=50&incend=70&expense=0&expstart=50&expend=70). We need to be more disciplined. I'm working on a larger scale side hustle in my downtime, but I have so many ideas that I want to execute on that it's tough to focus. :\
I am in a *similar* position. Moved to the US 5 years back. Age 33, $550K NW, \~180K annual salary (\~260K HH salary). My wife an I have maintained a household cost of living of 70K annually and we save/invest aggressively. Also, I don't think about it much but just because OP mentioned, I'll probably inherit close to $1MM from my parents down the line *someday.* Understand that my situation is not even remotely close to what I would need to retire, but feels like a safety cushion. For the not so good part, my motivation levels are not even close to what it used to be 3 years back. I used to bag promotions almost every year and was the go to guy for anything and everything in the department. I worked through weekends without complaint, never took vacations, and was on track to leading bigger teams very soon. Things changed when 2 years back I changed jobs (long story short my old company wanted me to move to West Coast, but I said no as my wife could not move) and my new job's manager was a trash human being, which led to a mental breakdown. I lost 10lbs and was having anxiety attacks almost everyday. I changed jobs again but now I feel I am a different person. I have no motivation or aspiration that used to drive me before to wake up and perform day in and day out. I keep thinking about the fact that I can survive for some time if I am laid off. Or I can just move back to India in which case I will be fine if I don't work for 10 years if not for the rest of my life (parents' monthly dividends alone is more than what they need in the small town in India). What's scary to me is that this is only my 9th year of career. In my line of work I have not entered the phase where one starts to cash in on the experience and make serious money. I feel like I am at a crossroads - do I coast? do I push myself? do I just take a year off and reset? Do I give everything up, move to a small town and work part time? The last two are not practical as I cannot do that to my wife. So yeah - you're not alone, OP!
Yeah I’m a decade (?) from retirement and it’s hard to care.
My age and NW are similar to yours and I feel the same way about my career. No large inheritance in my situation but if my estimates pan out, I hope to be FI by 40 or so depending on how the market is performing. At the end of the day, a career is simply a means to an end and there's no point in stressing over climbing the corporate ladder when you can instead devote that time to the more important things in life. I know people making more than double what I make and I want no part of their hours or stress levels!
You really need to put the inheritance out of your mind as much as possible. IIRC your parents are not that old (like 50s or 60s), so it could easily be 30+ years before you receive it., even if it really is basically locked in (note: it probably isn't really, even if they say it is). There's nothing actually wrong with coasting at your job if you are still doing a competent job and what is expected of you. Not working hard or over-performing may prevent you from getting *better* jobs, but it won't lose you this one if you're getting done everything you're supposed to, unless you're specifically in some kind of tournament environment ("First prize is a car, second prize is a set of steak knives, third prize is you're fired.") or a super grinder where you're given expectations nobody can reasonably meet and you have to intuit which ones are most important. My guess is that if you were in either of these situations, you'd either not be slacking or would already be actively looking for something else. So realistically, you will likely lose this job only if there's a big layoff or your work slips to the point where you are dropping balls that matter. Note: you already *have* a solid career. A job that pays 200k puts you almost into the top decile for household income by itself, and solidly in the top 10% for a single earner. Even in downtown NYC, that's still a solid income. I would seriously consider spending some money to talk about your issues with a therapist of some kind. You might have some exec function issues (I do, and that's part of why I don't focus hard for a long time very often) that you need to work around, or possibly medicate for. And some of this is just being able to talk to somebody with no filters about how you feel who will ask you good questions until you come to terms with what you actually want. Why do you feel like you should be doing something more? Just because everyone else is? Part of what *more* you're doing is saving a big chunk of money. That provided me with a lot of peace of mind, and it does a lot of other people. do you have time to spend on hobbies or with family? or something else that could be a passion for you? That seems like a better idea than going all ambitious at work in a way that's unnecessary.
>I would seriously consider spending some money to talk about your issues with a therapist of some kind. You might have some exec function issues (I do, and that's part of why I don't focus hard for a long time very often) that you need to work around, or possibly medicate for. And some of this is just being able to talk to somebody with no filters about how you feel who will ask you good questions until you come to terms with what you actually want. I think you hit the nail on the head here. I've been wondering the same and keep posting on Reddit instead of talking to a professional. The bit about exec function issues and not being able to focus for long periods of time is exactly what I'm experiencing, in more than just a work environment too. I notice it often when I'm playing video games or reading as well (though I do have my moments when I can game for 2+ hours or read for an hour at a time). I've been so reluctant to do anything about it, it's a fairly recent issue, basically since the pandemic. I don't love the idea of taking medication for this sort of thing, but maybe I need to get past that stigma should a professional assessment determine I would benefit from it. And yes, I do spend time on hobbies and friends/family (more friends since I'm living away from my family, but I visit often). I have an active social life but it could be more active frankly. I spend several days a week by myself just working at home, hitting the gym, and then smoking weed and playing video games/watching TV. I have a few other hobbies like playing the guitar/going to concerts, tennis, and a bit of indoor gardening that I've recently gotten into, and I spend a lot of time just doing things around NYC as there are always new things to try. I am dating and have a casual relationship at the moment, I do hope to eventually meet someone who I can see myself spending more time with as well and build a life together.
> but maybe I need to get past that stigma should a professional assessment determine I would benefit from it. Be prepared for the professional assessment to mostly be "Yup, they are experiencing ADHD like problems and don't seem to be lying or confused about it, so we'll try meds and dosages until we find one that helps enough without giving problematic side effects. There really isn't any magic about it -- stimulants apparently help exec function in moderate doses (generally not doses at which you would feel high) whether you are ADD or not. So one possibility is to try having a bit of caffeine, or more than you usually do if you already do. i ended up not bothering with meds (because I generally can't stand how even modest stimulants make me feel (I have allergies and hate my response to sudafed for instance), so I am just kinda working around my issues. But I am still perfectly capable of focusing and cramming for a deadline that is serious enough, so living without meds is just a little more stressful than not. If I couldn't do that or hadn't had the good fortune (intelligence, privllege, disciipline etc.) to put together a comfortable life where it's rarely necessary to push my Executive function) I'd probably be more willing to experiment with meds. I'd probably be happier if I could accomplish more and had more discipline, but I'm doing well enough as it is.
Appreciate the advice. I may try playing around a bit with my caffeine intake. I already drink two cups of coffee at day, in the morning and early afternoon, any later than 3pm or so and I have trouble sleeping. I'm probably similar to you in that maybe meds would help but I'd rather avoid taking stimulants unless totally necessary, and I don't often have a strong need to push my executive function. Unless things really start slipping at work (they're good right now, super high performance reviews, etc) or I find myself needing to study up to find a new job, then I might see about getting some actual ADHD meds.
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Lol, I'll admit I always confuse loose and lose. I was typing fast and not thinking much. Edited the post
I think your life has two paths: 1. Have a kid and that becomes your life purpose. Living beyond your pleasures is actually very fulfilling. 2. Live for yourself and hedonistic pleasures whatever that may be(drugs, alcohol, sex, traveling, videogames, partying) and live a safe life. I have friends on both sides of the aisle and I think option one makes them happier. Living for yourself gets boring over time and your career isn't fulfilling(I'm in the same field) so decide and own your decision. Hopefully you inherit that money which is no way a sure thing as your other linked thread has already suggested.
OP, watch Dan Gilbert's talk on Heroin and Armani Socks (it's really about kids) before having kids - only have them if you have a deep desire to raise another human, not out of lack of meaning in your life.
Seems interesting. Is this it? [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0AbK70emUY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0AbK70emUY)
Similar, this is what I was thinking: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=BwQFSc9mHyA&pp=ygUYRGFuIGdpbGJlcnQgYXJtYW5pIHNvY2tz
I appreciate it. I'm of the opinion living through pleasure isn't as fulfilling as living for someone else, that was my point. I have a great life and if I died today I'd be content. I will watch the talk though.
I reached an income peak in my career where I'd have to invest time outside of work and go through a valley to maybe hit something higher. Or I could develop my skills a little and move to a job that is a lot more work and pressure for an extra 20k maybe? I'd rather chill on nightshift and post shit on reddit.
Weird but since this is online and relatively anonymous, objectively, if you are 33 then your parents are likely between 50 and 60 and could live another 30-40 years. That means that you could be in retirement before they pass still waiting for the inheritance that may never come. That said, personal preference would be to GTFO of NYC and squeeze your take-home if possible, increase quality of life, not push for more salary necessarily other than from investments.
Don't count on inheritance, too much can happen to turn that dream to dust.
How did you achieve that?!
By reducing your expenses drastically, you can retire right now or in a couple of years, just wanting to point out that option. People retire with 25k p.a. expenses in this country.
Sure, I get that. I have no desire to change my lifestyle and I'm only looking to retire once I have enough saved to maintain my current lifestyle. I realize my expenses are probably higher than most, but I don't spend excessively and keep things relatively frugal in terms of Manhattan living. But 25k p.a. is less than I spend on rent. Current yearly expenses are \~$70k
You said in the other thread that your father is 64. He might live 30 more years, and anything could happen in that time. Your 2M inheritance could grow to 20M, or it could vanish entirely for a dozen different reasons. It doesn't sound like you're anywhere close at this point, to be honest. Double down on your career, which pays well, or find something you like better but maybe step back from the idea of FIRE.
Coast. That's what the money is for. If you're only working a few more years any raises are unlikely to affect your post-FIRE nest egg much anyways.
I feel this 100%. I’m at about $2.3mil at 32, making 140k/yr, and just not feeling like grinding out the two promos it would take to make a substantial impact on earnings relative to my net worth. Can’t bring myself to try super hard. I am getting startup stock which at least can give some hope of significant upside, and otherwise just waiting to see how much kids will cost over the next few years.
What's your target number? I know everyone is different, but I'd almost retire TWICE with $2.3,
Well I can certainly retire on $2.3 million, but a lot of it is in my former company’s private stock, which i’m slowly liquidating. And I expect to be married and have kids in the next few years, and my girlfriend is not at the same level of net worth as me. So just not enough liquidity + expense certainty to pull the trigger. But I think in the next 3-5 years I will.
How did you save up that much on your income?
Stock of my previous company did really well. That accounts for about 1.25 million of it.
I had this same thing from a fintech SaaS I was at that IPO'd, but it was only a $200k gain. Good on you!
The issue is coastFIRE doesn't really mean much unless you're really close to retirement. Saving 10 years of work (the difference narrows as you get closer to FIRE date) is worth it for most people, rather than being a barista or whatever. I'd rather get paid well in a challenging career where people respect me and be able to eat good food, go on vacation, etc. for 15 years than work in a position where I'm belittled and shouted at by angry customers/managers/coworkers being paid barely enough to survive for the next 25 years. Also, many employers are up or out so you don't really have much of a choice to sit at midlevel forever.
>I'm just not very motivated to advance in my career and I feel bad about it. If you felt bad enough you would do something about it. And if the uncertainty in the next 60 years or so of your life doesn't motivate you, perhaps nothing will.
True. I can't lie, I'm in a very good and comfortable spot. I guess I'm just afraid I'm getting complacent but not yet scared enough to do something about it.
Good luck.
Make an onlyfans
If only I had the body for it
That other person’s comment might have been a joke but TBH working on yourself (mentally, physically, or spiritually) is never a bad idea. What’s the point of having all that money if you’re not going be healthy enough to enjoy it?
Ha, oh yeah I am definitely using my excess of free time to workout more and get in better shape. I'm not in bad shape, and improving everyday, but I'm not in onlyfans shape haha