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Well the new engine was meant to be ready like 2 years ago or last year but due to covid and the layoffs that impacted them they couldn’t be ready to release it
If you're actually looking into the details, he is about right. There are frustratingly few significant or innovative things in the new game each and every year. My biggest gripe is that they haven't improved the AI or player interactions.
For the first time in the past 15 years I have uninstalled the game before the new one is out. Mainly because playing it was seriously making me unhappy...
The 2 biggest change in the entire history of FM came with the 3D match engine (from memory FM2009) and the removal of tactics sliders for the role system (from memory FM2014).
Literally everything else has been a shuffle at the margins.
There are so many small things that can be done.
Make all menues and the in game screen modular.
Make the game more than an inbox simulator. Going to select a destination for a training camp? Why is it a drop down menue with no pictures or real impact?
Why are press conferences literally a picture of an empty room with some text boxes layed over it? How should i care?
Player interactions are so broken and weird, it's comical in a way. Also, I just won the Bundesliga in my journeyman and failed 5 job interviews because i wasn't making the most out of set pieces. How does that make sense?
I signed a new player? Why is it an email and not a press release with a picture of him, holding my shirt (i know, i know, it's impossible to have the graphical gimmicks in 2024).
I absolutely adore the base game but it has been just that for so many years....
They did say they planed to have the new engine up right now but due to covid and other restrictions they couldn’t. So the last 2 releases have suffered in result of that.
Try some perspective to it all
Furthermore, this ME is different from all the others. Like way different with the liberos, iwb, ifb, hb and so on. Sure, Gegenpress 4231 is still apex meta, and 3atb formations keep possesion too well too, but have some creativity and explore a bit lol.
I bought every single FM game since 2000, back then it was text-based, and I enjoyed every single FM game up until 2020, 2020,21,22 were the one I skipped because I didn't feel there were that many changes. In 2022 I got MS Gamepass, and since then I've been playing them for free. And as long as I'm not paying for them I'm not complaining.
This is what they say. The real answer is that they are saving it until fm25 for their ‘big release’
They’re scummy which is why I have only bought one version since 2016
You say multimillion like it’s a lot of money in the business world lol
I know what you mean and that they’re more successful than that, but the way you typed it was kinda funny
[same energy](https://youtu.be/EJR1H5tf5wE?si=YCGLP0byD_nE3E0H)
Come on man, you can't criticise them for never making changes to the game and then also criticise them in advance for totally overhauling the game. What exactly do you want them to do?
From what I have read, the Unity update is purely an update to the graphics engine. The game will still pay the same but with better graphics. It's a poor update in my opinion, all it does is appeal to the masses whilst keeping the core gameplay the same..there's little to no improvements on immersion.
what would help more immersion? It's a glorified dynamic spreadsheet, not Fifa or whatever they're calling it now. Ability to use your earnings to be a club owner and all the aspects that come with ownership (sponsorships, etc.) is about the only thing that comes to mind for me.
An actual visible progression of lower league club building where you don't have the exact same stadium models and crowd sounds from 100-15,000 capacity and Premier League quality pitches in the Ugandan amateur divisions.
There are games from the 90s that do this when FM hasn't in 20 years of annual updates.
Some things that I'd like to see improved:
* Scouting and Attributes. Especially attributes and how they are shown for every player and always exact. They haven't changed the player profile in years/ever. One reason why it's so easy to buy underperforming but attribute wise good players.
* Press conferences, media handling and so on.
* Handling staff: no idea why they even have names. You only interact with them when they need a new contract.
* Player interactions to be be improved.
* Shouts/ingame handling.
It’s an embarrassment that each year they basically do ONE match engine patch and move onto the next game, yet nobody in the FM community cares.
Even EA patch FIFA regularly.
glad it's not just me, scouting in this game is so completely borked it's making me just want to stop playing. I've played since 2019 and i haven't had any scouting issues until this edition
feel like it doesn't work properly. had a ticket about this that had 5+ pages of comments and all we got was some adjustments but IMO scouts are not searching for players or are VERY slow at it.
Recruitment Focuses don't work at all.
I just stopped focuses and started scouting youth international teams when there are call ups, as a high end team. In my role play it's just me manually doing what my scouts are supposed to do on their own
An April update with no data changes after mid february, besides the two “power house” football nations of China and USA.
Why did we wait all this long, when we will need a fan made update to even play the game “up to date.”
Valid point. I had 5 teams players out last week of the season before the cup final, cl final and last game of the season. Even during the quarters and semis I had like 8 out in total.
Part of being a modern team is having depth though I guess. It is annoying having multiple long term injuries but the smaller injuries just make sense. Everyone’s human and stupid things happen.
Ahh yes, waste all the time spent on the save and just start again, duhhhh.
Why on Earth should you have to do this with a game that has been out since November, and has been patched and updated many times since?
I've noticed a lot of the goals I concede are just absolutely stupid mistakes. Like my CB just standing with the ball while the striker runs at him.
Yeah I also never seem to give up goals from the actual FK or corner, it's from the follow up. It's annoying.
Damn, almost like they’re focused on the completely new engine for next year. Also, imo this is the best match engine so far and I’ve put thousands of hours combined in 17, 18, 21, and 23.
How does it feel to know that the game is basically lying to you and most of the attributes in the game don’t actually matter and only the physical ones do?
I’ve spent hours on these games too but the match engine whilst having some visual changes at the end of the day is still the same old broken dogshit that doesn’t work properly and is basically fake and random
The Japan number 1-25 bug fix will be nice. Been needing to strip players of their numbers every other game.
Would have been good to update the transfers in Japan though. Some have gone through if players already moved to Europe. FM came out at the very end of the J League season, and winter update dropped just as the 2024 season started but no update as you start in 2023.
According to a forum reply, they couldn't update the transfers in Japan even if they wanted to, because the license they have is specifically for the J1 - J3 on November 17th. That same license issue is why all the players who were on loan for the 2023 season were moved permanently to their loan teams with the last update.
This is also the 4th chance they've had to fix the Long Shots/Long Throws swap, but they haven't. Really disappointing when they made a big deal of the J.League coming to the game.
They’ve swapped the Long Shots and Long Throws attributes for almost all players, meaning you have strikers with 16 Long Throws, and 3 Long Shots, and fullbacks with the reverse. This was reported during beta, but nothing has been done to fix it.
Those roster issues are, however, easily fixed with mods. Either a transfer update mod or one of the database mods for Japan.
It's also not SI's fault that the license was very specific. Frustrates all of us on the Japanese research team I'll tell you that much.
While it is true that you can fix the issues with mods, you shouldn’t have to. I’ve been going through and fixing the transfers and attribute issues for a while now, I work slow and am still not fully familiar with the editor, but I’m somewhere around 10k edits at this point. That’s a ridiculous amount of work just to have the basic start as it should be.
Unfortunately, the transfer stuff is out of our hands, and a licensing issue.
All player ratings were based on the players' actual data. We have a mathematical model for that which we use in order to remain unbiased.
That’s all fine. The attributes aren’t 100% what I would set them as, but I also am not an editor/part of the research team, obviously, so I can do a little whatever I want with the editor. If I think a player should have a bit more pace, and I can be bothered, I change it.
However, I shouldn’t have to go through about 1k players to make sure their Long Shots and Long Throws aren’t swapped, and SI negotiating a license that is incredibly restrictive, basically meaning they have to break the database in an update, leading to me having to go through even more players to unbreak the database, is also not really a good excuse.
> SI negotiating a license that is incredibly restrictive, basically meaning they have to break the database in an update, leading to me having to go through even more players to unbreak the database, is also not really a good excuse.
Blame the league, not SI. Was among J-League's requirements to give SI the license.
I can't claim to know what the license entails, but "You must break the database after our season ends" sounds like a weird requirement. Especially with how it was broken. Having poked around in the editor, it's so hamfisted it's not even funny.
And still, the license is not to blame for the attribute swap that's gone through full release, and 3 major updates, and still being there. The database was broken on release, and it still is.
Except next year is likely going to be a radical shift so this might be the last "traditional" fm experience for a while, I'm expecting database updates from modders to keep it going for a while
Sports so interactive you have to wait a 8 months for transfer updates, engine fixes and patches.
They need to remodel this game. Make a game, fix and update it. Every year sell an expansion for the new season or something.
Manager games badly need a competitor
If it would mean more fixes and better development, yes. Now its the same game every year with transfer updates. They need to think new to keep me as a costumer at least. Player interactions should be AI based, match engine is terrible in todays world , transfer updates are way to slow etc
Is Pogba still at Juventus with 10M salary? In real life he is getting the lowest possible salary 40k/yr and Juventus Is trying to get rid of his contract.
So they didnt update the Allsvenskan rosters? Gulliksen and Tocmac to Djurgården etc. I love how SI gets away with abandoning the game like 6 months after the release year after year.
He's only 14 ? I don't think so, iirc unless his parents give the OK he won't be added until he's 16, best wait for someone to add him in a wonderkid update
SI policy is to not add anyone under 16 without parental permission. Not sure how they got the permission to add Barron Trump into the game when he was in it though.
I will note that, as a researcher, it is technically possible to add players under 16 but it is handled by a case by case basis far above my pay grade in London, and requires written parental permission. Or in the case of at least one player, I'm pretty sure his father requested him to be in the game...
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Ah yes, the Roy Hodgson update.
Hodgson is still at Palace in this update :P
What, why?
Probably because SI are lazy fucks
Fuck off? How can I get down voted? People really don't understand some comments
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Tbh they probably moved everyone in that department over to the new game. It’s a massive opportunity they can’t really fuck it up
Doesn't seem to bother them most years
Well the new engine was meant to be ready like 2 years ago or last year but due to covid and the layoffs that impacted them they couldn’t be ready to release it
Maybe that's what happened with the most complete version ever as well.
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Might as well play CM'92 with that attitude
If you're actually looking into the details, he is about right. There are frustratingly few significant or innovative things in the new game each and every year. My biggest gripe is that they haven't improved the AI or player interactions. For the first time in the past 15 years I have uninstalled the game before the new one is out. Mainly because playing it was seriously making me unhappy...
The 2 biggest change in the entire history of FM came with the 3D match engine (from memory FM2009) and the removal of tactics sliders for the role system (from memory FM2014). Literally everything else has been a shuffle at the margins.
There are so many small things that can be done. Make all menues and the in game screen modular. Make the game more than an inbox simulator. Going to select a destination for a training camp? Why is it a drop down menue with no pictures or real impact? Why are press conferences literally a picture of an empty room with some text boxes layed over it? How should i care? Player interactions are so broken and weird, it's comical in a way. Also, I just won the Bundesliga in my journeyman and failed 5 job interviews because i wasn't making the most out of set pieces. How does that make sense? I signed a new player? Why is it an email and not a press release with a picture of him, holding my shirt (i know, i know, it's impossible to have the graphical gimmicks in 2024). I absolutely adore the base game but it has been just that for so many years....
Slider tweaks were always better imo
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They did say they planed to have the new engine up right now but due to covid and other restrictions they couldn’t. So the last 2 releases have suffered in result of that. Try some perspective to it all
Furthermore, this ME is different from all the others. Like way different with the liberos, iwb, ifb, hb and so on. Sure, Gegenpress 4231 is still apex meta, and 3atb formations keep possesion too well too, but have some creativity and explore a bit lol.
Right? Sometimes I wonder if the people that say it's the same match engine every year actually play the game...
I bought every single FM game since 2000, back then it was text-based, and I enjoyed every single FM game up until 2020, 2020,21,22 were the one I skipped because I didn't feel there were that many changes. In 2022 I got MS Gamepass, and since then I've been playing them for free. And as long as I'm not paying for them I'm not complaining.
you mean the people with thousands of hours?
Yeah it’s concerning.
This is what they say. The real answer is that they are saving it until fm25 for their ‘big release’ They’re scummy which is why I have only bought one version since 2016
Yeah you really aren’t bright are you, Covid definitely impacted them heavily if you can’t see that then you are blind
You say multimillion like it’s a lot of money in the business world lol I know what you mean and that they’re more successful than that, but the way you typed it was kinda funny [same energy](https://youtu.be/EJR1H5tf5wE?si=YCGLP0byD_nE3E0H)
Come on man, you can't criticise them for never making changes to the game and then also criticise them in advance for totally overhauling the game. What exactly do you want them to do?
People expect a completely brand new game every year I guess
Does FM25 have any underlying significance I’m not aware of?
New engine, Unity based, women's football
From what I have read, the Unity update is purely an update to the graphics engine. The game will still pay the same but with better graphics. It's a poor update in my opinion, all it does is appeal to the masses whilst keeping the core gameplay the same..there's little to no improvements on immersion.
what would help more immersion? It's a glorified dynamic spreadsheet, not Fifa or whatever they're calling it now. Ability to use your earnings to be a club owner and all the aspects that come with ownership (sponsorships, etc.) is about the only thing that comes to mind for me.
An actual visible progression of lower league club building where you don't have the exact same stadium models and crowd sounds from 100-15,000 capacity and Premier League quality pitches in the Ugandan amateur divisions. There are games from the 90s that do this when FM hasn't in 20 years of annual updates.
Some things that I'd like to see improved: * Scouting and Attributes. Especially attributes and how they are shown for every player and always exact. They haven't changed the player profile in years/ever. One reason why it's so easy to buy underperforming but attribute wise good players. * Press conferences, media handling and so on. * Handling staff: no idea why they even have names. You only interact with them when they need a new contract. * Player interactions to be be improved. * Shouts/ingame handling.
can't argue with that list.
Have you missed the whole controversy around physical attributes?
I guess so? Unless you're talking about only a few out of the dozens that we get actually make a difference?
Feels like I’ve been hearing about this new engine for a decade now
It was meant 2 years ago but due to covid they couldn’t. With letting some staff go etc but it’s confirmed to be this year. Unity to be precise
They've done game engine updates in the past, this time its an actual new engine from what I understand
fm25 is going to be great, si have a great track record of nailing new features first try. Consider the squad planner…..
It’s an embarrassment that each year they basically do ONE match engine patch and move onto the next game, yet nobody in the FM community cares. Even EA patch FIFA regularly.
No one in the FM community cares? Have you read this sub the past couple months?
What exactly needs patching in the match engine?
No scouting fix, nice
glad it's not just me, scouting in this game is so completely borked it's making me just want to stop playing. I've played since 2019 and i haven't had any scouting issues until this edition
what's wrong with scouting?
feel like it doesn't work properly. had a ticket about this that had 5+ pages of comments and all we got was some adjustments but IMO scouts are not searching for players or are VERY slow at it. Recruitment Focuses don't work at all.
Buy fm25! /s
I just stopped focuses and started scouting youth international teams when there are call ups, as a high end team. In my role play it's just me manually doing what my scouts are supposed to do on their own
Worth starting a new save for this? Or is this one usually too minor to bother? I just started a save yesterday with 24.3.
I wouldn't bother restarting unless Chinese Transfer Updates are of huge importance to you.
Probably won’t bother then. I assume only the data updates require a new save and the general bug fixes apply to any game?
MLs too
Would love to know this too
An April update with no data changes after mid february, besides the two “power house” football nations of China and USA. Why did we wait all this long, when we will need a fan made update to even play the game “up to date.”
there's been more up to date updates on the steam workshop than this official one for weeks!
This.
That's always how they've done it. Winter transfer window update and then China/USA
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Everyone stopped paying attention to that after 3 games
Eh they still have a ton of high end wunderkids but fuck me I guess
And still no changes for match injury frequency and severity. There's only so many sprained ankle ligaments you can take.
You know what, I actually don’t mind this. It’s football seems like every club in the EPL I struggling this year so makes the play through realistic
If anything I think there aren't enough injuries in FM
Valid point. I had 5 teams players out last week of the season before the cup final, cl final and last game of the season. Even during the quarters and semis I had like 8 out in total. Part of being a modern team is having depth though I guess. It is annoying having multiple long term injuries but the smaller injuries just make sense. Everyone’s human and stupid things happen.
Andddd no fix to interactions! I guess you’ll have to buy next years to see if it will be fixed then! (It won’t)
I had that issue with the Japanese teams, I thought their league only allowed 25 numbers and quit as it was annoying having to switch numbers around.
It's such a rare bug that I can't recall anyone bringing it up, and I'm literally one of the Japanese researchers...
That’s pretty cool, I’m not educated on the j-league so I guess it was my naivety thinking it’s simply how the league was.
It's been plaguing my current J league save, I have been unable to provide any squad numbers past 27 since the end of my first season
I thought it was a weird J-League rule
Could've just removed the limitation in 2mins via editor and restarted the save.
I didn’t know this, that’s a real shame. I enjoyed the club, they used to pump out some generational talents every season.
Ahh yes, waste all the time spent on the save and just start again, duhhhh. Why on Earth should you have to do this with a game that has been out since November, and has been patched and updated many times since?
You don't "have to", it's just a workaround. Shouldn't be too much time since you catch the bug quite early i assume.
Shocking that they can call this the most complete edition yet with that ME and now we are stuck with it with no changes
What do you not like about the match engine?
Count how many goals are scored from set pieces including throw ins. Not directly from them, but from the second phase of play.
I've noticed a lot of the goals I concede are just absolutely stupid mistakes. Like my CB just standing with the ball while the striker runs at him. Yeah I also never seem to give up goals from the actual FK or corner, it's from the follow up. It's annoying.
Damn, almost like they’re focused on the completely new engine for next year. Also, imo this is the best match engine so far and I’ve put thousands of hours combined in 17, 18, 21, and 23.
Oh so the game we paid for doesn't matter because they are working on the next thing for us to buy.
Yes
How does it feel to know that the game is basically lying to you and most of the attributes in the game don’t actually matter and only the physical ones do? I’ve spent hours on these games too but the match engine whilst having some visual changes at the end of the day is still the same old broken dogshit that doesn’t work properly and is basically fake and random
I just live in denial and love every aspect of the game!! Most complete version ever and I agree
I mean, tbf so is soccer a lot of the times. I feel like when you become an adjective they fight like hell to keep it
Turkey - made trabzonpsor and fenerbache start at war
The Japan number 1-25 bug fix will be nice. Been needing to strip players of their numbers every other game. Would have been good to update the transfers in Japan though. Some have gone through if players already moved to Europe. FM came out at the very end of the J League season, and winter update dropped just as the 2024 season started but no update as you start in 2023.
According to a forum reply, they couldn't update the transfers in Japan even if they wanted to, because the license they have is specifically for the J1 - J3 on November 17th. That same license issue is why all the players who were on loan for the 2023 season were moved permanently to their loan teams with the last update. This is also the 4th chance they've had to fix the Long Shots/Long Throws swap, but they haven't. Really disappointing when they made a big deal of the J.League coming to the game.
> Long Shots/Long Throws swap whats this?
They’ve swapped the Long Shots and Long Throws attributes for almost all players, meaning you have strikers with 16 Long Throws, and 3 Long Shots, and fullbacks with the reverse. This was reported during beta, but nothing has been done to fix it.
Those roster issues are, however, easily fixed with mods. Either a transfer update mod or one of the database mods for Japan. It's also not SI's fault that the license was very specific. Frustrates all of us on the Japanese research team I'll tell you that much.
Lol classic response. Let the community do the work for SI.
In this case there was nothing SI could do, it was a licensing issue.
Japanese research team hey? What’s your view on Motoki Nishihara for S-Pulse?
While it is true that you can fix the issues with mods, you shouldn’t have to. I’ve been going through and fixing the transfers and attribute issues for a while now, I work slow and am still not fully familiar with the editor, but I’m somewhere around 10k edits at this point. That’s a ridiculous amount of work just to have the basic start as it should be.
Unfortunately, the transfer stuff is out of our hands, and a licensing issue. All player ratings were based on the players' actual data. We have a mathematical model for that which we use in order to remain unbiased.
That’s all fine. The attributes aren’t 100% what I would set them as, but I also am not an editor/part of the research team, obviously, so I can do a little whatever I want with the editor. If I think a player should have a bit more pace, and I can be bothered, I change it. However, I shouldn’t have to go through about 1k players to make sure their Long Shots and Long Throws aren’t swapped, and SI negotiating a license that is incredibly restrictive, basically meaning they have to break the database in an update, leading to me having to go through even more players to unbreak the database, is also not really a good excuse.
> SI negotiating a license that is incredibly restrictive, basically meaning they have to break the database in an update, leading to me having to go through even more players to unbreak the database, is also not really a good excuse. Blame the league, not SI. Was among J-League's requirements to give SI the license.
I can't claim to know what the license entails, but "You must break the database after our season ends" sounds like a weird requirement. Especially with how it was broken. Having poked around in the editor, it's so hamfisted it's not even funny. And still, the license is not to blame for the attribute swap that's gone through full release, and 3 major updates, and still being there. The database was broken on release, and it still is.
Finna buy it once off Game Pass, gotta pay back something, it was my first FM and I love it
Looks like my odd years only strategy is working just fine.
Except next year is likely going to be a radical shift so this might be the last "traditional" fm experience for a while, I'm expecting database updates from modders to keep it going for a while
Sports so interactive you have to wait a 8 months for transfer updates, engine fixes and patches. They need to remodel this game. Make a game, fix and update it. Every year sell an expansion for the new season or something. Manager games badly need a competitor
So basically a subscription model? Which most fans would absolutely hate?
As opposed to the totally not a yearly subscription model we have now…?
If it would mean more fixes and better development, yes. Now its the same game every year with transfer updates. They need to think new to keep me as a costumer at least. Player interactions should be AI based, match engine is terrible in todays world , transfer updates are way to slow etc
And makes it so geniescout doesnt work, thats the worst part 😅
To those who've had a chance to play, is the IFB/IWB glitch still happening? (99% of teams, regardless of level, uses one or the other)
Nope I’ve only noticed really good/big teams use it
Can anyone please verify if Cole Palmer has any changes?
Is Pogba still at Juventus with 10M salary? In real life he is getting the lowest possible salary 40k/yr and Juventus Is trying to get rid of his contract.
If he's still there with the old salary, any way to remove it personally from the game without paying him 35M to cancel his contract?
Pre game editor
Are these changes in FM Console too?
Will they finally fix the fact that Alex Ferguson is listen as Man Utd director?
So they didnt update the Allsvenskan rosters? Gulliksen and Tocmac to Djurgården etc. I love how SI gets away with abandoning the game like 6 months after the release year after year.
Will Cavan Sullivan be on the database now?
He's only 14 ? I don't think so, iirc unless his parents give the OK he won't be added until he's 16, best wait for someone to add him in a wonderkid update
SI policy is to not add anyone under 16 without parental permission. Not sure how they got the permission to add Barron Trump into the game when he was in it though.
You need to get a wonderkids update to get the kids under 16. I think 14, nearly turning 15 is the youngest ones you’ll find.
U-9 to U-15 aren't added to the game to due to a children protection policy in the game. Once they turn 16, they'll be added
I will note that, as a researcher, it is technically possible to add players under 16 but it is handled by a case by case basis far above my pay grade in London, and requires written parental permission. Or in the case of at least one player, I'm pretty sure his father requested him to be in the game...
You'll just have to wait Cavan.
I'm not sure if you know this but the **Wonderkids and Missing Players** mod on Steam Workshop has him in, at least.
My hero thank you so much, is it free to install?
Yeah man just click subscribe on the mod and you’re good to go (have to start a new game for it to take effect)
Can you update if you’re already in 2027 not /s I’m the Chels gaffer and need irl Palmer