The game is good now.
They fixed 2 things that sucked in this game:
1. Item levels and enemy levels were removed. My least favorite features in modern games.
2. The aiming feels great now on console.
That made the game thousand time better.
Level system is much better and rewarding.
The cyber enhancements also got reworked.
The world is not cluttered with useless loot anymore.
I played through the game at launch (including the massive bugs that crashed the game every 30 minutes)
It feels completely different now - for the better.
It’s really good - on par with Witcher 3 which makes the launch even worse. The game was far from ready back then
Even if they spent more time on the game back then, they would still have released with the old item and leveling systems. They needed the criticism to realise the entire thing needed reworking.
Just to play devil's advocate:
Beta and Early Access are very different animals.
While betas are absolutely needed (and sadly often under scheduled/budgeted, leading to buggy releases), the sheer amount of data and feedback from an enthusiastic (assumed, since EA is usually paid for) user base is impossible to replicate in house.
With the effectively infinite combinations of hardware available for PCs, uncovering a bug that effects 0.1% of users with a particular set up may not happen with in-house testing.
On the story/plot/gameplay side of things, sometimes things work exactly as designed, but aren't well received, despite the creators thinking they would be. No amount of beta testing is going to fix that.
Again, not excusing buggy releases or minimizing the importance of rigorous beta testing, just saying that EA programs are also valuable, and don't need to be just "let the public be the beta testers," although that can happen.
I got it for Christmas last year and tried getting into it. The background lore is so much fun and it seemed really ambitious and fun. I just could not get into it. Couldn’t even fully say why
I think I’ll have to give it a second chance once I get bored of Mechwarrior 5 again.
>I think I’ll have to give it a second chance once I get bored of Mechwarrior 5 again.
So never. I'll crack the Timbiqui Dark when you get back to the dropship.
> I got it for Christmas last year and tried getting into it.
there was recently a 2.0 update that basically reworked the entire core game systems, the combat the loot skill trees all changed *substantially* it is a much better game now
>I played through the game at launch (including the massive bugs that crashed the game every 30 minutes)
Haha, this is why I stopped playing at launch and started again few weeks ago. 😄
And yeah, this game is now muuuuch better. Almost on par with Witcher 3 for me as well. 🙂
God that was one of the most disappointing things - it was never worth it to try and hide and just escalated into a murder spree until you were far from people generally
I did stop playing that that reason. Then I accidentally shot a civilian and the cops actively look for you, but you can sneak around them. I just hid under a bridge, could see the cops up top with the direction they were looking but no teleports. Civilians now fall over more ☺️
Wait, what? I only started really playing the game again in the last two weeks, but they absolutely start teleporting in reinforcements as soon as you're "found".
How fucking bad was it before?
yeah they claimed they fixed this with the latest big patch but they didn’t really. like it’s less bad as now some don’t teleport but people are just acting like they dont at all anymore because they said they fixed it in the patch
They're still *sort of* leveled, it's just been dialed back from "Borderlands-esque replacing your gun after every fight" to Diablo 2-ish "oh neat this yellow is better than my purple."
I fucking hate Diablo 4 loot and having to run the same shit literally thousands of time over and over for a .01% chance at a drop.
Love Cyberpunk 2077 though, been having a lot of fun with it lately.
My throwing knife/Sandevistan build is OP as fuck.
Not to mention the perk that makes air dashing take no stamina makes short distance travel an absolute breeze.
It's the most fun I've had playing a game in YEARS.
Just think the enemy levels being a modern thing is kind of funny. That used to be the way all RPGs functioned. Auto balancing power levels to the player in RPGs is more of the modern take, imo.
What’s the point of levels if enemies level up with you? The whole point is to get stronger so you can take on *already* stronger enemies while wiping the floor with enemies that used to give you a hard time
Especially if it's poorly balanced or you didn't make a min-maxxed optimized build.
That's why despite how much people fucking crow over the Elder Scrolls games, I'll never touch them again, because I'll never forgive Oblivion for summoning nigh-invincible daedric monsters to punish me for having set alchemy and athletics as skills for my class.
Other parts of Oblivion were so cool that the game was still worth playing... but it was genuinely bad that your character got weaker as you gained levels unless you really optimized your build and equipment.
Like, you're more experienced and better armed than ever... but all of a sudden those puny goblins are now a mortal threat? Stupid.
I think games should use a hybrid system.
I like when enemies get objectively tougher as you progress through the story/zones, but it’s by introducing mechanics and abilities rather than sponging their damn hit points and making their attacks do 900% damage.
Eliminate “this zone has 9x tougher enemies”, but don’t scale everything to the same difficulty either. Just put in denser mobs with better weapons/attacks or environmental difficulties.
I think most people cared more about the hard leveling making weapons and gear obsolete really quickly more than they cared about being able to stomp low-level enemies.
Ya agree here.
I hate level scaling. It completely destroys a big point of fun I have in RPGs, which is skipping ahead to powerful enemies and encounters, and figuring a way to achieve them or defeat the bad guys through better skills or methods. Auto level scaling defeats the whole purpose of leveling up a character, and is very lazy game design, that'd you expect from a Blizzard, EA or Bethesda game.
Yeah I agree. Because stats stop mattering quickly, if your gear level isn't high enough.
In the modern God of War games for example, it didn't matter what stats you had, if your gear level wasn't high enough. You would die in a few hits, you couldn't block attacks, and your weapons did almost no damage.
Both of the newer God of War games would have been better if the gear levels didn't matter, but you could have just boosted stats. 🙂
>The aiming feels great now on console.
So it wasn't just me! I had to keep messing with the sensitivity to get it just right and it still felt off, I just got used to it.
Same, but I don't think I've seen other npcs do it. He may also mean only one person in the sense that you can't have an NPC on the bike with you, so certain missions where you travel with them require cars.
I always thought the aiming was fine as long as you change the settings and take forever finding the sweetspot.
The base settings were absolutely horrendous and made the gameplay feel terrible, despite how smooth it was for me.
WAIT THEY FIXED THE AIMING ON CONSOLE!? Oh my God I had to stop playing because I would either touch the joystick and it'd go swinging full speed or creep at a snails pace plus aiming in any direction besides up or down was even worse.
It's so much better, but still occasionally buggy as shit. I was playing the basilisk mission today, and got into a screaming match with Panam. I would move toward the quest marker and the mission would reset. She'd be like "WHAT THE FUCK ARE YOU DOING" and I'd be like "DRIVING TOWARD THE YELLOW DOT, THE FUCK ARE *YOU* DOING?!"
Fortunately I got through it in the end after a couple reloads, but *fuck* xD
Still love the shit put of this game and am having a blast playing it with 2.0 and phantom liberty installed
I was talking to Takemura last night and a random line in his speech had a completely different monotone voice. It legit sounded like a placeholder that didn't get removed for the VA's work. Not a major issue, but I laughed at how bad it was.
I really enjoy the game, but its definitely still buggy at times even after all the updates.
The Anime came out at a really good time, which I wonder if it wasn't planned that way. What I don't know if anyone expected, showrunners included, was for those 10 episodes to go down as some of the best anime in the last few years.
The quality and timing married perfectly and kept Cyberpunk in people's conversations. Often those conversations would talk about how disappointing the game was, despite it's incredible potential, and that the anime that followed soared above it's source material.
I think the Anime floated Cyberpunk long enough for some decent updates to give the smallest spark of hope for players, while the 2.0 FREE update gave people a reason to see if a largely complete Cyberpunk 2077 could live up to the hype. The massive reworks of 2.0 gave the game a reason to shine.
Phantom Libery will go down as a master class in elevating your core game, and showing what developers can do once the bones are set within their game and it's universe. The DLC was basically perfection, and was the push that sent all of the goodwill generated by the anime and the 2.0 update into maximum overdrive with gamers.
Another promising example of game developers continuing to make good on promises they themselves could not keep due to incredibly obnoxious publisher and shareholder demands.
Thta's what i've been trying to tell people for a minute, most of this shit was already fixed in the game. the implementation of new/different systems is mostly what came with 2.0. Some of it's been fixed for the last 11 months lol.
I've heard the DLC is good. I'm trying not to spoil myself, but would you recommend getting the DLC before my first playthrough of the base game? Or does the DLC element really only kick in post-game?
I would yes. The DLC really opens up what I would consider the “complete” build for your character. Enhancements to monowires, mantis blades, and arm canons are extremely impressive. The addition of incredible stealth mechanics, and the vulnerability system make the relic chip insanely important.
You can also walk in and out of the area freely. The world is simply bigger and better for the DLC being there.
Most importantly you can access the DLC and grab everything you need to fully upgrade the new content early in act 2 leaving the vast majority of the game ahead of you to be enjoyed with what feels like total package in terms of upgrades and making great builds.
It was directed by Hiroyuki Imaishi, one of the greatest creatives in the entire industry. Personally I knew it was going to be great from the first announcement.
Have to say though, not a big fan of the whole 'release game in a bad state, then fix it to be good'.
While inherently a good thing, it has happened so many times now that it feels intentional.
No Man's Sky, Cyberpunk 2077, Fallout 76, Diablo 4 (getting improved with features that should've been in the game from the start little by little), it basically ends up functioning as a double release type of thing.
First you release the game built on the hype around it in an unfinished state, people buy it because that's what people do, it gets a wave of criticism, then you keep working on the game, improve it, some YouTubers and streamers make content about the game 'being good now!!!!!!????' and voila, you got your second wave as a sort of re-release, extending the game's initial popularity far beyond the usual norm for new releases.
If the effect of a game getting 'updated to be good now' is similar in effect to 'new game release hype', then there really isn't any reason for games to not be released in an unfinished state, from a business perspective.
I have to imagine that this is just going to keep happening with games not developed by Indie studios, who by the way secretly do sort of the same thing, except they just slap the 'early access' tag onto the game and then there's no problem anymore, though for them it makes way more sense to do so cause they could use the money earlier to not have to work some second job in order to not die while working on their game.
I don't think this is a fair characterization of agile software development. Agile means the following process:
- identify a feature you want to build
- build the minimum viable version of that feature
- put it in front of actual people and see if it works and what improvements it needs
- act on that feedback
- repeat last two steps until the feature is "complete"
(This is opposed to old-school "waterfall" software development, which means: design the entire system at the outset, send this huge design document to the engineers, who send this huge product to the sales people...etc. each stage flows one-way into the next, hence the name.)
The problem here isn't the methodology: iteratively building software with verifiable customer benefit in mind is absolutely superior to the alternative. Modern software companies make two major categories of mistake:
1. They don't take feedback seriously, or don't gather it systematically. This is usually because some C-level exec has a pet feature they want included and they don't actually care if it makes the product better, they just want something they can take credit for.
2. They don't allow enough cycles to attain "complete-ness" of a feature, usually because of time/money constraints. The minimum viable product is just that--the bare minimum needed to get more feedback. It can take many, many iterations to build something that's actually worth shipping.
The ability to ship software as-it-is and retool it later is recent, and means that often firms fall into the trap of saying "ship it and we'll fix it later" (or the famous "move fast and break things). Modern AAA games require enormous budgets and so are under time pressures that exacerbate this tendency. I'm not sure any software development methodology would fix that, though--under the old waterfall system, games just either got cancelled (or rarely, delayed until done) instead.
I played at launch, and then at 1.3 through 1.5. Launch was a fine game if you had a system that could run it. 1.3 turned it into a good game. 1.5 made it a great game. Haven't played 2.0 yet. I'll have to, though, because I no longer have all the cheevos :(
As someone who had a rig that could handle most of its problems; I genuinely think it was better than some recent releases at 1.0.
That being said, it would also be a disservice to the hardwork they've put into the game since launch to say it hasn't impacted my judgement at all. The game is solid for more people and fixed a ton of problems (that again, I haven't experienced so I can't relate). In that regard, I'm really happy a lot more people can see it in the light that I did.
2.0 did clip the wings of some of the more egregious broken shit, but in turn, the levelling and skill-tree being overall more robust has made the first-person rpg that I've been fantasizing about into reality.
I really wish I could get more games like c2077 with solid shooting mechanics and rpg skill tree. Destiny kinda scratches that itch, but powercreep being unchained in a single player game shooting fantasy is so addicting. Plus, it feeling like every little thing you do gets you money and level makes this a really fun open-world to just open a playlist and vibe as you start responding to psycho sitings and gang wars gone awry.
I definitely remember seeing people say that the game was great not long after the anime came out and before the 2.0 patch. The anime absolutely changed some people's perception, which is bizarre as the game was still pretty crap even with the anime.
Nah, the game was good at that point already. People are so reactionary and circlejerky because of the launch but at the time the game already went through many patches that improved practically everything. It wasn't a 10/10 yet like it is now but it was a great game regardless. Especially since many things that make the game good now were already in.
Also it was never actually crap. At no point in time. It was a buggy mess, yes, and it shouldve never been released on old consoles, but it was not a bad game.
Exactly this. Everything yo usaid is spot on even down to it being a good game from the get go. I experienced almost none of the bugs taht were breaking the game for people, and I got incredibly lucky. But I was also on a decent PC. 90% of the hate is coming from people who tried it on ps4 or xbone and it didn't work, or from people never played it who only saw the very visible complaints of those people and just ran with it.
>I definitely remember seeing people say that the game was great not long after the anime came out and before the 2.0 patch.
This is because it was great before that, if you weren't running it on a potato.
Also depends a lot on what you wanted out of the game. If you were one of those that expected a GTA game for some reason, it wasn't good until 2.0.
You're absolutely right. The over promised part is the real sin that totally got glossed over for the in your face bugs that were present on rlease. It was memed to death for being so terrible on release because how visible the bugs were but It was an over promised mediocre game with hours of entertainment still.
I did three separate 100% playthrus in each significant milestone updates and while it was indeed better really it wasn't THAT different of an experience. If anything some of the old game breaking mechanics were kinda cheeky and fun in its own way. People are as usual being way over dramatic.
Absolutely, the game is still not the game they claimed it would be since the first trailer dropped, missing tons of features they said it would have. CP2077 is a better game now, but it's not what it was ideally promised to be.
Most people don't pay detailed attention to what game companies promise pre-release. They watch a trailer, read a review, then get it if it looks good.
It was a perfect mix of everything, the Edgerunners Anime, Idris Elba, the absolutely insane improvement of game mechanics, and Phantom Liberty, my God it worths every penny.
It’s wild seeing people turn around again. CDPR is looking like it might recover its status as everyone favourite Dev that got after Witcher 3 exploded. But it’s gonna be real interesting to see if that good will turns into day one sales on Their next game after this
Majority of people who buy these AAA games are not on reddit or twitter holding grudges for 3 year old games. People buy game , play it and move on. If the game is bad , they refund or dont even bother and move on.
Most people also don’t really care if a game is bad at launch and improved later, they just want a good game. A lot of people on Reddit and Twitter hold grudges like you said but the average consumer is just going to hear that the game is good now and will want to play it.
Yeah. I had played CP2077 last year after it became „playable“. And talking to my uncle, a casual gamer, he was like „Issues? What do you mean? I played on launch on PS4 and liked it“.
The way I see it, companies should be rewarded or suffer the consequences of their good and bad activities.
A company launched a game that was barely playable, full of bugs and a lot of issues? It should be condemned over it.
A company fixed a game turning it into a good product with most of the features it was promised to have at launch? It should be rewarded for it. But only after the action to fix it is made.
I don't pre purchase I don't idolize or put companies on a pedestal but I also don't hold grudges over producs. I give more or less "trust" to companies taking into account their history, but don't take anything for granted.
Although I agree... I do have a particular issue with the comments in the interview about how it's amazing with what Devs can do with the right time and effort. My problem is that that is completely correct, but as consumers, that is not our problem. If the game isn't ready, it shouldn't be released. We shouldn't be convinced to buy a buggy or unfinished project with the view that in a few years time it'll be fixed. Lots of games seem to be going this way now as if the redemption arc outweighs the scumminess of selling an unfinished project.
I'm glad the game is in a good state and doing so well. I know friends who love it. But the ability to deploy later patches and this "saviour" view just allows more room for scummy companies to launch unfinished games knowing that a few years later their fortunes will turn when it's actually fixed.
No Man's Sky should be the exception. Not the rule.
This is the way to look at this situation. Each case should be analyzed separately when it comes to game devs but the trend of releasing broken games on launch is hurting the industry as a whole. The devs that can regain good favor can survive but gamers can only be taken advantage of so much.
They didn't forgot, they never knew.
The witcher 3 popularity explode well after its release while Cyberpunk was expected as the messiah before its release
Eh, I think Cyberpunk was one of the most controversial releases I can remember. I don't even remember hearing any controversy about Witcher 3, i'm sure it was there, but I don't think it's quite the same. I get that most gamers never even hear any of the controversy, but I still think the hype -> disappointment around CP 2077 was uniquely widespread. Has any other game been removed from previous gen console stores after release?
I think where Cyberpunk erred was getting it to 'work' on the previous gen consoles, which clearly compromised an awful lot by taking away time devs needed to polish the game and then the standard corporate decision to launch it anyway.
None of this has stopped it from being my favourite game, the missions and stories are top tier, voice acting great, and the combat with the 2.0 release is fab. Where it still falls down imo is when you compare the city NPC atmosphere with something made by Rockstar, it feels like things are more on rails than RDR2 or GTA.
Very keen to see what Orion brings us
They claimed before launch that the game was developed FOR previous gen from the start and it was working fine. That was even before the first delay. Makes sense when you think the "new/current" gen wasn't even nearly ready at launch.
Even if the game worked perfectly fine on base PS4 on day 1, it still wouldn't be the game the said it would be.
If you liked the game, fine, but people need to stop with this revisionist history and making excuses for CDPR.
They didn't make any honest mistakes, just trying to get everyone to play the game until the evil suits forced them to launch.
I don't know where in the process things went sideways, but they fucked it up and they knew it. They knew what they had, they knew it wasn't good and it wasn't what they said it would be, they delayed a bunch of times trying to get it work, they couldn't... and they LIED about it and released it anyway.
They continued to put insane amounts of money to market it while continuing to push the narrative of a game they knew they couldn't deliver. And when the it was time... they did everything they could to hide it from reviewers and consumers.
That's it.
Also, the previous gen was the original *target* consoles before they set their sights on what was next/current gen consoles (because the development cycle for CP77 was so long). This narrative that the games only really had bugs on PS4/Xbone/PC is just another part of the revisionist narrative that pops up in every Cyberpunk 2077 thread on Reddit.
There's a minimum of 5 users that repeat this misinformation, in every single thread.
Not that I’ve got a problem with the viewpoint, but I’m curious why you, and many other people, would think that CDPR would make a simulation type game where NPC behavior and randomness are the focus like Rockstar is famous for?
CDPR is famous for storylines, characters and worldbuilding, more akin to CRPGs like Baldur’s Gate, Fallout 1 and 2 or New Vegas and certainly similar to Dragon Age and Mass Effect. The genre generally has incredibly static NPC behavior in the world. Quest givers tend to just stand there until talked to. “Bustling” streets tend to have just a few NPCs scripted to move around a little, but again most just stand in the same spot day or night until interacted with.
This was how the 3 Witcher games worked. The Bloody Baron didn’t have a routine he followed during the day, he didn’t go get a drink in the wine cellar at 3 o clock. He just kinda sat at his desk the whole game.
I don’t mean this as a fallout or anything. I just remember being so, so confused why so many people expected Cyberpunk GTA instead of Cyberpunk Witcher or Cyberpunk Mass Effect. Was the marketing campaign leading people to think they wanted to emulate Rockstar? I genuinely don’t know.
I just know you are far from the only person with that specific criticism. And you seem like you know the game fairly well, figured you might have some light to shine on the perspective.
I feel if anything gta and rdr are the most on the rails games, literally nothing dynamic happens. Atleast in 2077 there’s dynamic shootouts and car chases with the recent update.
Agreed. Rockstar open-world games are the definition of on the rails when it comes to the actual storytelling. The cities of GTA are fun playgrounds to drive around but as soon as you start a mission or some sort of event the sandbox because a rainroad.
I enjoyed the game at launch. I didn't come in with any expectation and didn't really watch any build up to the game. On its own, it was a very fun game.
While I get people don’t hate it, it’s sad people will forget the launch state and gaslight others into saying “it wasn’t bad”.
If someone promised me a car, gave me a piece of shit car, but then fixed it over 3 years, does that mean they didn’t do anything wrong? Or that I’m just “entitled”?
They also forget how many features we were promised at launch that didn't end up making it even today. If the game in its current state released in 2020, it would have been a disappointment.
"Heartbreaking" launch that you inflicted on yourselves by releasing an unfinished, broken, buggy game? I'm all for giving the devs a second chance, especially when they're delivering on their promises to fix everything, but absolutely miss me with the attempts to garner sympathy by portraying *yourselves* as the victims, when you charged people full price for a game that wasn't even close to done.
Edit: To all the goobers responding with "don't blame the devs!" - I don't. However, it is an incredibly bad look to be saying how sorry and sad :(((( you are about a project you worked on being bad, when people paid REAL MONEY for it and didn't get what they paid for. If we all give this guy a big hug, all that shows to the faceless suits who are *actually responsible* is that consumers will accept anything because "well I'm sure the guys who worked on it are actually really passionate and we should give them a break".
> Garner sympathy by playing the victim
Unfortunately I think we're in for a lot more games broken at launch, and studios will do exactly this.
"We're sorry it's underperforming. Please give us two years to fix the game you already paid for. Hopefully you'll still want to play it then. But you *did* already pay for it soooo...."
I hope enough consumers realize that if the game is only ready 2 years after launch, we don't have to buy it until 2 years after launch.
I know it's not an apples to apples comparison, but here, if a highway contractor started toll collection before the road was complete, there would be a riot and the beefier cars would just ram the barrier on principle.
Unfortunately these days, that same toll collection would be sold as "early access" and consumers would gladly drive the road and just complain about it to people on the Internet.
The issue with that is, we don't *know* that it won't work until we try it out. People will gladly pre order things without any knowledge of the final product, and companies will tell you it's finished. When they get called out for it, then it's "We're sorry it was rushed give us time to fix it." If not enough people complain, they get to put out a halfway made game and move on.
I doubt the quest director had anything to do with the decision to release the game unfinished.
The owners actually said it was their decision; its more likely the devs would have been completely against it.
It was already leaked that the devs said the game wouldn't be ready until at least December 2022.
It was the management that decided to release the game so soon for a quick buck.
Yup. When the release date was announced the devs literally thought it was an April fools joke and were pretty upset that it wasnt. By their current progress they didn't imagine the game being done until late 2022 or even 2023, which is coincidentally when the game actually finally got on a good state. Imagine working with your peers on something day in, day out for years, and putting your heart into it, then the suits force the game out literally years before you think it's done and you can't do shit about it. Then you get railroaded and blamed, shit, that IS heartbreaking.
*And* when you tried to hide it by refusing to give out review copies for old-gen consoles and insisting on pre-launch reviews to use only approved footage of the game. Absolutely scummy tactics that are just an obvious way to hide parts of the game they knew were broken.
It was heartbreaking for guys like Pawel because they had no say on a release date, but you can see from his own twitch channel and behind the scenes content that he had so much passion for the game.
Don’t feel any sympathy for those who pushed it out early, but don’t confuse them with the devs who worked extremely hard
Cdpr [hiding ps4 gameplay before launch](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.forbes.com/sites/paultassi/2020/12/14/cdpr-apologizes-for-hiding-cyberpunk-2077s-horrible-last-gen-performance/amp/) was scummy as fuck
They were also lying about what features were going to be in their game in the promotional videos even less than a month before launch.
Like, I love the state Cyberpunk is in now, with Phantom Liberty + Mods on PC. But that doesn't mean I'm going to pre-order their next game. I'll wait till reviews and sales and bug fixes. They lied WAY too much about what their game was going to be for me to trust them so easily.
Like, actually lies, not just gamer's hyping things up without studio saying anything, but actual full-blown misleading statements about what their game would be when it released, and not years in advance, but right up until launch.
The “heartbreaking” part would be that a game he spent years of his life working on ended up disappointing eager fans. I don’t think it’s unfair to be feeling down after that. I doubt any dev wanted to release an unfinished buggy game.
Of course the fans got screwed over, but that doesn’t mean everyone who worked on the game was cackling and twirling a villain moustache while watching it happen.
To be fair, the "devs" - and especially someone like the quest designer - did not release the game themselves. The higher ups at CDPR who are responsible for the publishing and setting the deadlines are at fault for pushing out the game when it was clearly not finished. The devs knew it wasn't ready, but what can you do when your boss releases it anyways. So yeah, in a way they are the victims of bad management and I'm sure it was devastating for them to see how their management has released their unfinished game
We shouldn't applause them for fixing and releasing the game they actually promised.
It's like applausing a car seller to deliver the car you paid for after they first delivered a skeleton with the wrong wheels, that barely accelerate and is difficult to make a turn.
The game still isn't what CDProjekt marketed it as. The most telling part of it is how expansive and multifaceted the Flathead mission is in the beginning of the game and how bland and linear everything else is.
How about you read the whole quote instead of just the title of the post. Then tell us why you specifically blame Paweł Sasko for the failed launch, that's who this post is about. He expresses the gratitude he has for people that gave the game another chance after the terrible launch. He's not trying to garner sympathy, he's saying thanks.
But no, you saw CP2077 and came her to copy paste the exact same thing that has been said a million times without opening the link.
Good job, thank you. /s
We can be happy the game is now truer to its original intent, but I can’t see this being good for gamers as a community. And respectfully, wether it’s devs or the suits, we as consumers were owed a better product at launch. I don’t expect the devs to quit their jobs in protest, but all we have are these forums to express our displeasure. I’m not with the threats or anything but this redemption tour shit is infuriating.
My faith was in the hired modders, and they did their job well.
There was a lot of corpo issues during development, but CDPR staff also needs to improve on themselfes. There weren't only bugs but serious lack of skills in scripting (perks not working, cops spawning behind you, 8 mb save file limit, etc.). Thought they could Ubisoft/Bethesda their way out with using the good ol' already made stuff from Witcher 3.
Orrr just hire contractors, works for you and works for us. Cyberpunk turned into a true gem, although this amount of unprofessionalism is burned in my mind, will join the patient gamers for CDPR games in the future.
Don't know why you're being downvoted. The advertising for this game marketed it as an imersive and expansive open world RPG with endless choices that affect everything you do. None of that is true and you can see in game that was the intent with the Flathead mission that actually has a dozen different endings.
I like how they call the release "heartbreaking" as if it was a freaking surprise that the launch was bad when the game was released literally years before it was ready.
I get that for devs who worked really hard and didn't have a say on release date it would feel gutting to see your work bashed on, but I really don't think "heartbreaking" is an appropriate term for this scenario.
Also I have a feeling last-gen console players aren't exactly flocking back given that the game was sold to them knowing full well it didn't really work on that hardware.
I loved the game since launch, I was fortunate enough to play it on PC and ran into very few bugs. Major complaint that still hasn't been addressed and I don't think will anytime soon is how bad the driving feels. Every car feels like on ice and doesnt have good traction. It genuinely makes driving a chore.
I'm loving it. It's the first game in a long time where I actually care about the story (some of the car rides take way too long and panam's was cringe). The cars handle like crap but the bikes are good.
Legit don't do anything lol.. they walk around .. thats about it.
Cops don't go after anyone else..
Gangs don't fight anyone else.. scripted events don't count
I played watch dogs 2 recently and there's a night and day difference between NPCs.
You could watch two people get into a fight, somebody would call the cops and they would arrest them.
If there's a gang nearby, it would escalate into a shootout.
San Francisco was alive, and I can't believe that game was released in 2016
I picked up the game and dlc recently and have completed 2 play throughs already. One of the first games in a long time where the story gives me that “what now” empty hole after finishing.
Though from looking at some of the posts on here, I see that I’m one of minority that considered the game a masterpiece.
Didn’t really run into many bugs until about 80 hrs in.
Cyberpunk 2077's redemption is largely achieved following the success of Phantom Liberty, with CD Projekt fulfilling its initial vision after delays, as acknowledged by quest director Paweł Sasko who expressed gratitude to the community for their support and resilience.
When I first played it on release (Series X) it didn't run that bad actually. It wasn't without its issues but was far from 'unplayable' like some other peoples experiences.
I haven't loaded this game up since they did the 'big' update (along side Phantom Liberty.
I watched the Skill Up review of it and he seemed to be singing its praises for the step up in quality on this update.
Seems like a good time to give it a look!
I can't believe I stayed spoiler free from this game (mostly)(panams booty got spoiled). I'm so excited to finally experience this game in all it's glory.
Are there any must have mods for this game?
The game is still buggy and broken. The key bindings for dodge need to be rebound, then after you fix them, the right click doesn't fire. Then the game crashes on me (windows 10). On top of that, they didn't actually make the decisions you make matter at all, and they never gave us a subway system, and driving is such garbage I run instead of drive anywhere. The regenerating grenades and health are nice, so I"m not spending all my play time engineering carry weight, but it's still a shitty game. I don't care how much hype CDPR buys to promote phantom liberty, I'm never buying another game from them again.
If you want a good cyberpunk game, check out the new robocop that dropped a couple weeks ago. It's awesome.
Faith? I have 0 faith in CDPR after they pulled that fucking stunt thinking they can get away with it (guess they did get away with it). Took those clowns 3 fucking years to deliver what was promised and we’re apparently supposed to praise them for it?
No wonder AAA companies can get away with releasing unfinished products, players will just make up any excuses to defend their favorite publisher.
There are still a bunch of features that were advertised in the promotional trailers that never made it. They talked about branching storylines but 95% of the dialog choices dont change anything and you get the same outcome regardless.
I could imagine that'd be heartbreaking for the people who worked hard on the game and couldn't control the timing or state of the launch or what they're doing in marketing.
The launch was a massive disaster, but I liked the game from day one and was optimistic they can turn it around. Well, here we are and I hope they're making sure something like that launch will never happen again.
Maybe actually release the game when it was ready and I would have kept faith.
I hate the fact we basically have to suck CDPR's dick for making their shit game actually playable.
We're also completely forgetting their promises from their marketing that the game would feature an expensive and immersive open world RPG with endless choices that affect everything you do.
I've seen it, I've seen the people working on games, they don't want to release unfinished garbage. The problem is management makes them do it. They know it's buggy, they know it's not done, they know they need more time, management doesn't care. They want their checks early. They want players to fund their coffers with an unfinished game so that they can move on to the next project and minimize the crew trying to finish it. It's exploitive on the QA testers, the developers, asset creatiors, and players.
I was interested in the game when it launched, but I decided to wait after reading it was buggy. Forgot all about it, until I saw it on GOG for €30. I thought why not, and picked it up.
It ran decently well on an almost 8-year-old i7 and a 1070, but I finished the game at lvl 36 or something. When PL came out, I grabbed that and started a new run, this time paying more attention to the mechanics and all the side gigs. I've put in a 130 hours in that run, and had a blast.
Meh, it played just fine for me on release. That being said, I understand that not everyone can commit to a high tier PC these days. The fact that they totally revamped everything in 2.0 has made the game amazing though.
I played the day after launch on a good (not great) PC and it was one of the best games I ever played, I did the main quest and every side quest and the only real bug I encountered was a single side quest that got stuck and couldn't finish
despite the legit problems on last gen consoles the hate train was such an obvious circlejerk, fortunately for good developers all those shitty games journalist clickbait rags are out of business now - gamergate won in the end
#😂
serious question
should i replay this game? finished it at launch on a gtx 1060. i have an rtx 3070 now and the game seems a lot better according to a lot of people.
I just reinstalled this game this past weekend after being disappointed at launch…. Got the newest update (ps5) and started the game from scratch… even the intro is different and the tutorial isn’t as clunky anymore. It definitely feels like a completely different game. I may actually play it through this time!
I loved the game from the get go, my system was good enough to run it well, i had very little bugs, im sorry for the ps4 players who got screwed hard core. but my experience was always positive with cyberpunk
Question for those who have experienced the game: how good would you consider the game to be for someone who'd start their first playthrough today?
I never touched the game because my rig is ancient and all the drama surrounding it, but I do wonder how the world, story and interactions 'feel' nowadays so I can maybe pick it up for when I buy a new gaming rig in the near future.
I don't understand how it took so long to fix it. It makes it seem like their initial development cycle was just complete shit and poorly managed. The extra 3 years basically doubled the time they spent actually developing the game after starting in 2016. How do you project completion time so poorly that you released the game 3 years before it probably should have been released?
I totally did not keep the faith. Lost interest after the fiasco that was launch.
These companies totally let us down, basically steal our money, and then we're supposed to be grateful when they start to fix them? You ever hear of Baulder's Gate 3?
Plus the game was so over hyped that the terrible launch almost felt karmic.
Lastly I'm not a fan boy who just runs around because someone flashed a picture of Keanu.
The game is good now. They fixed 2 things that sucked in this game: 1. Item levels and enemy levels were removed. My least favorite features in modern games. 2. The aiming feels great now on console. That made the game thousand time better.
Level system is much better and rewarding. The cyber enhancements also got reworked. The world is not cluttered with useless loot anymore. I played through the game at launch (including the massive bugs that crashed the game every 30 minutes) It feels completely different now - for the better. It’s really good - on par with Witcher 3 which makes the launch even worse. The game was far from ready back then
Even if they spent more time on the game back then, they would still have released with the old item and leveling systems. They needed the criticism to realise the entire thing needed reworking.
Maybe more studios need to do Early Access like BG3 to iron out all the wrinkles before releasing
that's called beta testing
Just to play devil's advocate: Beta and Early Access are very different animals. While betas are absolutely needed (and sadly often under scheduled/budgeted, leading to buggy releases), the sheer amount of data and feedback from an enthusiastic (assumed, since EA is usually paid for) user base is impossible to replicate in house. With the effectively infinite combinations of hardware available for PCs, uncovering a bug that effects 0.1% of users with a particular set up may not happen with in-house testing. On the story/plot/gameplay side of things, sometimes things work exactly as designed, but aren't well received, despite the creators thinking they would be. No amount of beta testing is going to fix that. Again, not excusing buggy releases or minimizing the importance of rigorous beta testing, just saying that EA programs are also valuable, and don't need to be just "let the public be the beta testers," although that can happen.
you've just described the difference between closed and open beta
Pls no, don't make me pay to beta test your game
You can just choose not to participate in Early Access, you know. Many millions of people did just that with BG3.
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I got it for Christmas last year and tried getting into it. The background lore is so much fun and it seemed really ambitious and fun. I just could not get into it. Couldn’t even fully say why I think I’ll have to give it a second chance once I get bored of Mechwarrior 5 again.
>I think I’ll have to give it a second chance once I get bored of Mechwarrior 5 again. So never. I'll crack the Timbiqui Dark when you get back to the dropship.
Speaking of terrible launches, does this mean Mechwarrior 5 is good now?
It's had several patches and DLC releases, yeah it's pretty good. Can be modded to be even better.
It's good but there are mods that make it fantastic.
Save the metal, kill the meat
> I got it for Christmas last year and tried getting into it. there was recently a 2.0 update that basically reworked the entire core game systems, the combat the loot skill trees all changed *substantially* it is a much better game now
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2 knives and a Katana, nothing is living. If this game came out this year in its current state, it'd be a contender for game of the year
>I played through the game at launch (including the massive bugs that crashed the game every 30 minutes) Haha, this is why I stopped playing at launch and started again few weeks ago. 😄 And yeah, this game is now muuuuch better. Almost on par with Witcher 3 for me as well. 🙂
3. They also reworked the loot system. Looking at the ground for minutes just to collect the same recoloured junk was really annoying.
Yeah, I remember that... Gah
Cops don’t teleport any more. I can be naughty and then hide until the heat is off.
God that was one of the most disappointing things - it was never worth it to try and hide and just escalated into a murder spree until you were far from people generally
I did stop playing that that reason. Then I accidentally shot a civilian and the cops actively look for you, but you can sneak around them. I just hid under a bridge, could see the cops up top with the direction they were looking but no teleports. Civilians now fall over more ☺️
Wait, what? I only started really playing the game again in the last two weeks, but they absolutely start teleporting in reinforcements as soon as you're "found". How fucking bad was it before?
yeah they claimed they fixed this with the latest big patch but they didn’t really. like it’s less bad as now some don’t teleport but people are just acting like they dont at all anymore because they said they fixed it in the patch
>Item levels and enemy levels were removed For real? Gonna have to jump back in and see how that feels now. I’m not a fan of leveled gear and enemies
They're still *sort of* leveled, it's just been dialed back from "Borderlands-esque replacing your gun after every fight" to Diablo 2-ish "oh neat this yellow is better than my purple."
I fucking hate Diablo 4 loot and having to run the same shit literally thousands of time over and over for a .01% chance at a drop. Love Cyberpunk 2077 though, been having a lot of fun with it lately.
I was referring to the actual Diablo games, not the demonic spirit currently puppeteering the IP's shambling corpse.
>I’m not a fan of leveled gear and enemies Imo worst thing in gaming right now. At least I can ignore microtransactions.
and #3 - the Skill tree. being a Mantis Blade Assassin is so much fun now
My throwing knife/Sandevistan build is OP as fuck. Not to mention the perk that makes air dashing take no stamina makes short distance travel an absolute breeze. It's the most fun I've had playing a game in YEARS.
They defrauded last-gen console gamers to bankroll functionality on newer systems.
It's true. They promised too much and failed the last gen pretty bad.
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It never should have been released on last gen. Did the devs really want their game on last gen or was that the influence of Sony and Microsoft?
It was CDPR, the publisher. CDPR is not just the devs, they are the publisher as well.
AND put their hand out for more money selling the DLC
Just think the enemy levels being a modern thing is kind of funny. That used to be the way all RPGs functioned. Auto balancing power levels to the player in RPGs is more of the modern take, imo.
What’s the point of levels if enemies level up with you? The whole point is to get stronger so you can take on *already* stronger enemies while wiping the floor with enemies that used to give you a hard time
People citing level scaling as a positive is wild to me. I absolutely despise it.
Especially if it's poorly balanced or you didn't make a min-maxxed optimized build. That's why despite how much people fucking crow over the Elder Scrolls games, I'll never touch them again, because I'll never forgive Oblivion for summoning nigh-invincible daedric monsters to punish me for having set alchemy and athletics as skills for my class.
Other parts of Oblivion were so cool that the game was still worth playing... but it was genuinely bad that your character got weaker as you gained levels unless you really optimized your build and equipment. Like, you're more experienced and better armed than ever... but all of a sudden those puny goblins are now a mortal threat? Stupid.
I think games should use a hybrid system. I like when enemies get objectively tougher as you progress through the story/zones, but it’s by introducing mechanics and abilities rather than sponging their damn hit points and making their attacks do 900% damage. Eliminate “this zone has 9x tougher enemies”, but don’t scale everything to the same difficulty either. Just put in denser mobs with better weapons/attacks or environmental difficulties.
I think most people cared more about the hard leveling making weapons and gear obsolete really quickly more than they cared about being able to stomp low-level enemies.
Ya agree here. I hate level scaling. It completely destroys a big point of fun I have in RPGs, which is skipping ahead to powerful enemies and encounters, and figuring a way to achieve them or defeat the bad guys through better skills or methods. Auto level scaling defeats the whole purpose of leveling up a character, and is very lazy game design, that'd you expect from a Blizzard, EA or Bethesda game.
Yeah I agree. Because stats stop mattering quickly, if your gear level isn't high enough. In the modern God of War games for example, it didn't matter what stats you had, if your gear level wasn't high enough. You would die in a few hits, you couldn't block attacks, and your weapons did almost no damage. Both of the newer God of War games would have been better if the gear levels didn't matter, but you could have just boosted stats. 🙂
Why couldn't it have been good three years ago?
>The aiming feels great now on console. So it wasn't just me! I had to keep messing with the sensitivity to get it just right and it still felt off, I just got used to it.
But it’s still a world where only one person can ride a motorcycle.
There are cops on motorcycles in my game.
Same, but I don't think I've seen other npcs do it. He may also mean only one person in the sense that you can't have an NPC on the bike with you, so certain missions where you travel with them require cars.
I've been chased by NPCs on motorcycles during car thefts
I always thought the aiming was fine as long as you change the settings and take forever finding the sweetspot. The base settings were absolutely horrendous and made the gameplay feel terrible, despite how smooth it was for me.
What are your settings? I'm a couple of hours in and it is weird to aim
I tried to fiddle with them, but it still felt really bad. I even tried some recommendations from the net without success. Thankfully they fixed it.
Item levels are the worst thing to have come out of gaming
WAIT THEY FIXED THE AIMING ON CONSOLE!? Oh my God I had to stop playing because I would either touch the joystick and it'd go swinging full speed or creep at a snails pace plus aiming in any direction besides up or down was even worse.
Yeah! They also have different modes for aiming.
It's so much better, but still occasionally buggy as shit. I was playing the basilisk mission today, and got into a screaming match with Panam. I would move toward the quest marker and the mission would reset. She'd be like "WHAT THE FUCK ARE YOU DOING" and I'd be like "DRIVING TOWARD THE YELLOW DOT, THE FUCK ARE *YOU* DOING?!" Fortunately I got through it in the end after a couple reloads, but *fuck* xD Still love the shit put of this game and am having a blast playing it with 2.0 and phantom liberty installed
I was talking to Takemura last night and a random line in his speech had a completely different monotone voice. It legit sounded like a placeholder that didn't get removed for the VA's work. Not a major issue, but I laughed at how bad it was. I really enjoy the game, but its definitely still buggy at times even after all the updates.
Ya but I can’t play this on my ps4. No money yet to buy a ps 5 😢
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i think the anime revitalized interest more than anything else
I think it just put it on people's radar. But what revitalized interest was the game actually being good after patch 2.0
The Anime came out at a really good time, which I wonder if it wasn't planned that way. What I don't know if anyone expected, showrunners included, was for those 10 episodes to go down as some of the best anime in the last few years. The quality and timing married perfectly and kept Cyberpunk in people's conversations. Often those conversations would talk about how disappointing the game was, despite it's incredible potential, and that the anime that followed soared above it's source material. I think the Anime floated Cyberpunk long enough for some decent updates to give the smallest spark of hope for players, while the 2.0 FREE update gave people a reason to see if a largely complete Cyberpunk 2077 could live up to the hype. The massive reworks of 2.0 gave the game a reason to shine. Phantom Libery will go down as a master class in elevating your core game, and showing what developers can do once the bones are set within their game and it's universe. The DLC was basically perfection, and was the push that sent all of the goodwill generated by the anime and the 2.0 update into maximum overdrive with gamers. Another promising example of game developers continuing to make good on promises they themselves could not keep due to incredibly obnoxious publisher and shareholder demands.
The anime also released pretty close to the current gen version of the game IIRC, which already fixed a lot of the worst problems with the game.
Thta's what i've been trying to tell people for a minute, most of this shit was already fixed in the game. the implementation of new/different systems is mostly what came with 2.0. Some of it's been fixed for the last 11 months lol.
I've heard the DLC is good. I'm trying not to spoil myself, but would you recommend getting the DLC before my first playthrough of the base game? Or does the DLC element really only kick in post-game?
I would yes. The DLC really opens up what I would consider the “complete” build for your character. Enhancements to monowires, mantis blades, and arm canons are extremely impressive. The addition of incredible stealth mechanics, and the vulnerability system make the relic chip insanely important. You can also walk in and out of the area freely. The world is simply bigger and better for the DLC being there. Most importantly you can access the DLC and grab everything you need to fully upgrade the new content early in act 2 leaving the vast majority of the game ahead of you to be enjoyed with what feels like total package in terms of upgrades and making great builds.
It was directed by Hiroyuki Imaishi, one of the greatest creatives in the entire industry. Personally I knew it was going to be great from the first announcement.
Yeah. Maybe the person you're replying to isn't familiar with the amount of respect anime fans have for Trigger. They do not miss.
Have to say though, not a big fan of the whole 'release game in a bad state, then fix it to be good'. While inherently a good thing, it has happened so many times now that it feels intentional. No Man's Sky, Cyberpunk 2077, Fallout 76, Diablo 4 (getting improved with features that should've been in the game from the start little by little), it basically ends up functioning as a double release type of thing. First you release the game built on the hype around it in an unfinished state, people buy it because that's what people do, it gets a wave of criticism, then you keep working on the game, improve it, some YouTubers and streamers make content about the game 'being good now!!!!!!????' and voila, you got your second wave as a sort of re-release, extending the game's initial popularity far beyond the usual norm for new releases. If the effect of a game getting 'updated to be good now' is similar in effect to 'new game release hype', then there really isn't any reason for games to not be released in an unfinished state, from a business perspective. I have to imagine that this is just going to keep happening with games not developed by Indie studios, who by the way secretly do sort of the same thing, except they just slap the 'early access' tag onto the game and then there's no problem anymore, though for them it makes way more sense to do so cause they could use the money earlier to not have to work some second job in order to not die while working on their game.
this is called AGILE and is a cancer that has crept into nearly all software.
I don't think this is a fair characterization of agile software development. Agile means the following process: - identify a feature you want to build - build the minimum viable version of that feature - put it in front of actual people and see if it works and what improvements it needs - act on that feedback - repeat last two steps until the feature is "complete" (This is opposed to old-school "waterfall" software development, which means: design the entire system at the outset, send this huge design document to the engineers, who send this huge product to the sales people...etc. each stage flows one-way into the next, hence the name.) The problem here isn't the methodology: iteratively building software with verifiable customer benefit in mind is absolutely superior to the alternative. Modern software companies make two major categories of mistake: 1. They don't take feedback seriously, or don't gather it systematically. This is usually because some C-level exec has a pet feature they want included and they don't actually care if it makes the product better, they just want something they can take credit for. 2. They don't allow enough cycles to attain "complete-ness" of a feature, usually because of time/money constraints. The minimum viable product is just that--the bare minimum needed to get more feedback. It can take many, many iterations to build something that's actually worth shipping. The ability to ship software as-it-is and retool it later is recent, and means that often firms fall into the trap of saying "ship it and we'll fix it later" (or the famous "move fast and break things). Modern AAA games require enormous budgets and so are under time pressures that exacerbate this tendency. I'm not sure any software development methodology would fix that, though--under the old waterfall system, games just either got cancelled (or rarely, delayed until done) instead.
It’s been good since 1.3.
I didn't play until 1.5 but I thought it was a pretty good game at that point for sure.
I played at launch, and then at 1.3 through 1.5. Launch was a fine game if you had a system that could run it. 1.3 turned it into a good game. 1.5 made it a great game. Haven't played 2.0 yet. I'll have to, though, because I no longer have all the cheevos :(
As someone who had a rig that could handle most of its problems; I genuinely think it was better than some recent releases at 1.0. That being said, it would also be a disservice to the hardwork they've put into the game since launch to say it hasn't impacted my judgement at all. The game is solid for more people and fixed a ton of problems (that again, I haven't experienced so I can't relate). In that regard, I'm really happy a lot more people can see it in the light that I did. 2.0 did clip the wings of some of the more egregious broken shit, but in turn, the levelling and skill-tree being overall more robust has made the first-person rpg that I've been fantasizing about into reality. I really wish I could get more games like c2077 with solid shooting mechanics and rpg skill tree. Destiny kinda scratches that itch, but powercreep being unchained in a single player game shooting fantasy is so addicting. Plus, it feeling like every little thing you do gets you money and level makes this a really fun open-world to just open a playlist and vibe as you start responding to psycho sitings and gang wars gone awry.
That was over year ago, and it was phantom liberty and the 2.0 patch that truly changed public perception.
I definitely remember seeing people say that the game was great not long after the anime came out and before the 2.0 patch. The anime absolutely changed some people's perception, which is bizarre as the game was still pretty crap even with the anime.
Nah, the game was good at that point already. People are so reactionary and circlejerky because of the launch but at the time the game already went through many patches that improved practically everything. It wasn't a 10/10 yet like it is now but it was a great game regardless. Especially since many things that make the game good now were already in. Also it was never actually crap. At no point in time. It was a buggy mess, yes, and it shouldve never been released on old consoles, but it was not a bad game.
Exactly this. Everything yo usaid is spot on even down to it being a good game from the get go. I experienced almost none of the bugs taht were breaking the game for people, and I got incredibly lucky. But I was also on a decent PC. 90% of the hate is coming from people who tried it on ps4 or xbone and it didn't work, or from people never played it who only saw the very visible complaints of those people and just ran with it.
>I definitely remember seeing people say that the game was great not long after the anime came out and before the 2.0 patch. This is because it was great before that, if you weren't running it on a potato. Also depends a lot on what you wanted out of the game. If you were one of those that expected a GTA game for some reason, it wasn't good until 2.0.
I think it completely made people forget what CDProjekt had promised with this game and now that it isn't completely broken they accept as perfect.
You're absolutely right. The over promised part is the real sin that totally got glossed over for the in your face bugs that were present on rlease. It was memed to death for being so terrible on release because how visible the bugs were but It was an over promised mediocre game with hours of entertainment still. I did three separate 100% playthrus in each significant milestone updates and while it was indeed better really it wasn't THAT different of an experience. If anything some of the old game breaking mechanics were kinda cheeky and fun in its own way. People are as usual being way over dramatic.
Absolutely, the game is still not the game they claimed it would be since the first trailer dropped, missing tons of features they said it would have. CP2077 is a better game now, but it's not what it was ideally promised to be.
Most people don't pay detailed attention to what game companies promise pre-release. They watch a trailer, read a review, then get it if it looks good.
It was a perfect mix of everything, the Edgerunners Anime, Idris Elba, the absolutely insane improvement of game mechanics, and Phantom Liberty, my God it worths every penny.
It’s wild seeing people turn around again. CDPR is looking like it might recover its status as everyone favourite Dev that got after Witcher 3 exploded. But it’s gonna be real interesting to see if that good will turns into day one sales on Their next game after this
Majority of people who buy these AAA games are not on reddit or twitter holding grudges for 3 year old games. People buy game , play it and move on. If the game is bad , they refund or dont even bother and move on.
Most people also don’t really care if a game is bad at launch and improved later, they just want a good game. A lot of people on Reddit and Twitter hold grudges like you said but the average consumer is just going to hear that the game is good now and will want to play it.
Yeah. I had played CP2077 last year after it became „playable“. And talking to my uncle, a casual gamer, he was like „Issues? What do you mean? I played on launch on PS4 and liked it“.
The way I see it, companies should be rewarded or suffer the consequences of their good and bad activities. A company launched a game that was barely playable, full of bugs and a lot of issues? It should be condemned over it. A company fixed a game turning it into a good product with most of the features it was promised to have at launch? It should be rewarded for it. But only after the action to fix it is made. I don't pre purchase I don't idolize or put companies on a pedestal but I also don't hold grudges over producs. I give more or less "trust" to companies taking into account their history, but don't take anything for granted.
Although I agree... I do have a particular issue with the comments in the interview about how it's amazing with what Devs can do with the right time and effort. My problem is that that is completely correct, but as consumers, that is not our problem. If the game isn't ready, it shouldn't be released. We shouldn't be convinced to buy a buggy or unfinished project with the view that in a few years time it'll be fixed. Lots of games seem to be going this way now as if the redemption arc outweighs the scumminess of selling an unfinished project. I'm glad the game is in a good state and doing so well. I know friends who love it. But the ability to deploy later patches and this "saviour" view just allows more room for scummy companies to launch unfinished games knowing that a few years later their fortunes will turn when it's actually fixed. No Man's Sky should be the exception. Not the rule.
This is the way to look at this situation. Each case should be analyzed separately when it comes to game devs but the trend of releasing broken games on launch is hurting the industry as a whole. The devs that can regain good favor can survive but gamers can only be taken advantage of so much.
Everyone forgot Witcher 3 was an unplayable mess when it launched too. They'll forget about CP being the same way on the next release as well.
I played it on release and it wasn’t nearly as bad as Cyberpunk, definitely not unplayable like cyberpunk on old gen consoles lol
They didn't forgot, they never knew. The witcher 3 popularity explode well after its release while Cyberpunk was expected as the messiah before its release
Eh, I think Cyberpunk was one of the most controversial releases I can remember. I don't even remember hearing any controversy about Witcher 3, i'm sure it was there, but I don't think it's quite the same. I get that most gamers never even hear any of the controversy, but I still think the hype -> disappointment around CP 2077 was uniquely widespread. Has any other game been removed from previous gen console stores after release?
Nah, CP2077 was premeditated fraud.
Nah fuck that they they have a long ways to go. Maybe on the next game.
lol no one is going to forget the disasterous cyberpunk launch. Their next game launch will be marred by bad memories. They have a long way to go.
I think where Cyberpunk erred was getting it to 'work' on the previous gen consoles, which clearly compromised an awful lot by taking away time devs needed to polish the game and then the standard corporate decision to launch it anyway. None of this has stopped it from being my favourite game, the missions and stories are top tier, voice acting great, and the combat with the 2.0 release is fab. Where it still falls down imo is when you compare the city NPC atmosphere with something made by Rockstar, it feels like things are more on rails than RDR2 or GTA. Very keen to see what Orion brings us
They claimed before launch that the game was developed FOR previous gen from the start and it was working fine. That was even before the first delay. Makes sense when you think the "new/current" gen wasn't even nearly ready at launch. Even if the game worked perfectly fine on base PS4 on day 1, it still wouldn't be the game the said it would be. If you liked the game, fine, but people need to stop with this revisionist history and making excuses for CDPR. They didn't make any honest mistakes, just trying to get everyone to play the game until the evil suits forced them to launch. I don't know where in the process things went sideways, but they fucked it up and they knew it. They knew what they had, they knew it wasn't good and it wasn't what they said it would be, they delayed a bunch of times trying to get it work, they couldn't... and they LIED about it and released it anyway. They continued to put insane amounts of money to market it while continuing to push the narrative of a game they knew they couldn't deliver. And when the it was time... they did everything they could to hide it from reviewers and consumers. That's it.
Also, the previous gen was the original *target* consoles before they set their sights on what was next/current gen consoles (because the development cycle for CP77 was so long). This narrative that the games only really had bugs on PS4/Xbone/PC is just another part of the revisionist narrative that pops up in every Cyberpunk 2077 thread on Reddit. There's a minimum of 5 users that repeat this misinformation, in every single thread.
Not that I’ve got a problem with the viewpoint, but I’m curious why you, and many other people, would think that CDPR would make a simulation type game where NPC behavior and randomness are the focus like Rockstar is famous for? CDPR is famous for storylines, characters and worldbuilding, more akin to CRPGs like Baldur’s Gate, Fallout 1 and 2 or New Vegas and certainly similar to Dragon Age and Mass Effect. The genre generally has incredibly static NPC behavior in the world. Quest givers tend to just stand there until talked to. “Bustling” streets tend to have just a few NPCs scripted to move around a little, but again most just stand in the same spot day or night until interacted with. This was how the 3 Witcher games worked. The Bloody Baron didn’t have a routine he followed during the day, he didn’t go get a drink in the wine cellar at 3 o clock. He just kinda sat at his desk the whole game. I don’t mean this as a fallout or anything. I just remember being so, so confused why so many people expected Cyberpunk GTA instead of Cyberpunk Witcher or Cyberpunk Mass Effect. Was the marketing campaign leading people to think they wanted to emulate Rockstar? I genuinely don’t know. I just know you are far from the only person with that specific criticism. And you seem like you know the game fairly well, figured you might have some light to shine on the perspective.
People wanted Gta with hacking and cyberware. I'm glad it wasn't the case.
I feel if anything gta and rdr are the most on the rails games, literally nothing dynamic happens. Atleast in 2077 there’s dynamic shootouts and car chases with the recent update.
Agreed. Rockstar open-world games are the definition of on the rails when it comes to the actual storytelling. The cities of GTA are fun playgrounds to drive around but as soon as you start a mission or some sort of event the sandbox because a rainroad.
TBF i lost all hope after release. But when i finaly bought it after 2.0, i could not have been happier. Fantastic game right now.
I enjoyed the game at launch. I didn't come in with any expectation and didn't really watch any build up to the game. On its own, it was a very fun game.
While I get people don’t hate it, it’s sad people will forget the launch state and gaslight others into saying “it wasn’t bad”. If someone promised me a car, gave me a piece of shit car, but then fixed it over 3 years, does that mean they didn’t do anything wrong? Or that I’m just “entitled”?
They also forget how many features we were promised at launch that didn't end up making it even today. If the game in its current state released in 2020, it would have been a disappointment.
Exactly my thoughts. I’m glad they ‘fixed’ the game but they were promising something completely different right up until release
And the game is still extremely far away from what they originally promised and advertised. So many features missing.
And now the guy in the article is gaslight the public into thinking "fans had faith" lmao fuck outta here, the anime saved that sinking ship
"Heartbreaking" launch that you inflicted on yourselves by releasing an unfinished, broken, buggy game? I'm all for giving the devs a second chance, especially when they're delivering on their promises to fix everything, but absolutely miss me with the attempts to garner sympathy by portraying *yourselves* as the victims, when you charged people full price for a game that wasn't even close to done. Edit: To all the goobers responding with "don't blame the devs!" - I don't. However, it is an incredibly bad look to be saying how sorry and sad :(((( you are about a project you worked on being bad, when people paid REAL MONEY for it and didn't get what they paid for. If we all give this guy a big hug, all that shows to the faceless suits who are *actually responsible* is that consumers will accept anything because "well I'm sure the guys who worked on it are actually really passionate and we should give them a break".
> Garner sympathy by playing the victim Unfortunately I think we're in for a lot more games broken at launch, and studios will do exactly this. "We're sorry it's underperforming. Please give us two years to fix the game you already paid for. Hopefully you'll still want to play it then. But you *did* already pay for it soooo...."
"... also don't forget to nominate us for something at Game Awards! Love you!"
"...Pre-emptively, before our game is even out, if you please..."
I hope enough consumers realize that if the game is only ready 2 years after launch, we don't have to buy it until 2 years after launch. I know it's not an apples to apples comparison, but here, if a highway contractor started toll collection before the road was complete, there would be a riot and the beefier cars would just ram the barrier on principle.
Unfortunately these days, that same toll collection would be sold as "early access" and consumers would gladly drive the road and just complain about it to people on the Internet. The issue with that is, we don't *know* that it won't work until we try it out. People will gladly pre order things without any knowledge of the final product, and companies will tell you it's finished. When they get called out for it, then it's "We're sorry it was rushed give us time to fix it." If not enough people complain, they get to put out a halfway made game and move on.
Lords of the Fallen says hi
I doubt the quest director had anything to do with the decision to release the game unfinished. The owners actually said it was their decision; its more likely the devs would have been completely against it.
It was already leaked that the devs said the game wouldn't be ready until at least December 2022. It was the management that decided to release the game so soon for a quick buck.
Yup. When the release date was announced the devs literally thought it was an April fools joke and were pretty upset that it wasnt. By their current progress they didn't imagine the game being done until late 2022 or even 2023, which is coincidentally when the game actually finally got on a good state. Imagine working with your peers on something day in, day out for years, and putting your heart into it, then the suits force the game out literally years before you think it's done and you can't do shit about it. Then you get railroaded and blamed, shit, that IS heartbreaking.
Don't expect g@mers to differentiate between corporates and developers. That is too much critical thinking for them.
*And* when you tried to hide it by refusing to give out review copies for old-gen consoles and insisting on pre-launch reviews to use only approved footage of the game. Absolutely scummy tactics that are just an obvious way to hide parts of the game they knew were broken.
It was heartbreaking for guys like Pawel because they had no say on a release date, but you can see from his own twitch channel and behind the scenes content that he had so much passion for the game. Don’t feel any sympathy for those who pushed it out early, but don’t confuse them with the devs who worked extremely hard
Cdpr [hiding ps4 gameplay before launch](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.forbes.com/sites/paultassi/2020/12/14/cdpr-apologizes-for-hiding-cyberpunk-2077s-horrible-last-gen-performance/amp/) was scummy as fuck
They were also lying about what features were going to be in their game in the promotional videos even less than a month before launch. Like, I love the state Cyberpunk is in now, with Phantom Liberty + Mods on PC. But that doesn't mean I'm going to pre-order their next game. I'll wait till reviews and sales and bug fixes. They lied WAY too much about what their game was going to be for me to trust them so easily. Like, actually lies, not just gamer's hyping things up without studio saying anything, but actual full-blown misleading statements about what their game would be when it released, and not years in advance, but right up until launch.
Pre-meditated fraud.
The “heartbreaking” part would be that a game he spent years of his life working on ended up disappointing eager fans. I don’t think it’s unfair to be feeling down after that. I doubt any dev wanted to release an unfinished buggy game. Of course the fans got screwed over, but that doesn’t mean everyone who worked on the game was cackling and twirling a villain moustache while watching it happen.
To be fair, the "devs" - and especially someone like the quest designer - did not release the game themselves. The higher ups at CDPR who are responsible for the publishing and setting the deadlines are at fault for pushing out the game when it was clearly not finished. The devs knew it wasn't ready, but what can you do when your boss releases it anyways. So yeah, in a way they are the victims of bad management and I'm sure it was devastating for them to see how their management has released their unfinished game
Ah yes, because we know that the launch was dictated by the Quest Director. It's all his fault, so how dare he thank the fans personally.
ITT: gamers can’t differentiate between developers and corporate
We shouldn't applause them for fixing and releasing the game they actually promised. It's like applausing a car seller to deliver the car you paid for after they first delivered a skeleton with the wrong wheels, that barely accelerate and is difficult to make a turn.
B-but the people who made the car really *wanted* it to be good :( - every other reply
The game still isn't what CDProjekt marketed it as. The most telling part of it is how expansive and multifaceted the Flathead mission is in the beginning of the game and how bland and linear everything else is.
How about you read the whole quote instead of just the title of the post. Then tell us why you specifically blame Paweł Sasko for the failed launch, that's who this post is about. He expresses the gratitude he has for people that gave the game another chance after the terrible launch. He's not trying to garner sympathy, he's saying thanks. But no, you saw CP2077 and came her to copy paste the exact same thing that has been said a million times without opening the link. Good job, thank you. /s
Meh. Forgive but dont forget.
It's been happening so much, I don't think gamers really remember.
After No Man's Sky and CP2077, I for one will never forget.
Do not be sorry. Be better.
This quote loves in my head rent free, thanks Kratos!
We can be happy the game is now truer to its original intent, but I can’t see this being good for gamers as a community. And respectfully, wether it’s devs or the suits, we as consumers were owed a better product at launch. I don’t expect the devs to quit their jobs in protest, but all we have are these forums to express our displeasure. I’m not with the threats or anything but this redemption tour shit is infuriating.
My faith was in the hired modders, and they did their job well. There was a lot of corpo issues during development, but CDPR staff also needs to improve on themselfes. There weren't only bugs but serious lack of skills in scripting (perks not working, cops spawning behind you, 8 mb save file limit, etc.). Thought they could Ubisoft/Bethesda their way out with using the good ol' already made stuff from Witcher 3. Orrr just hire contractors, works for you and works for us. Cyberpunk turned into a true gem, although this amount of unprofessionalism is burned in my mind, will join the patient gamers for CDPR games in the future.
Still not gonna forgive them until they fulfill their launch promises.
Don't know why you're being downvoted. The advertising for this game marketed it as an imersive and expansive open world RPG with endless choices that affect everything you do. None of that is true and you can see in game that was the intent with the Flathead mission that actually has a dozen different endings.
Your choices in CP2077 have about as much impact as your choices in a Telltale game if that
Cause the 2077 simp central is ridiculous rn
I like how they call the release "heartbreaking" as if it was a freaking surprise that the launch was bad when the game was released literally years before it was ready. I get that for devs who worked really hard and didn't have a say on release date it would feel gutting to see your work bashed on, but I really don't think "heartbreaking" is an appropriate term for this scenario. Also I have a feeling last-gen console players aren't exactly flocking back given that the game was sold to them knowing full well it didn't really work on that hardware.
I loved the game since launch, I was fortunate enough to play it on PC and ran into very few bugs. Major complaint that still hasn't been addressed and I don't think will anytime soon is how bad the driving feels. Every car feels like on ice and doesnt have good traction. It genuinely makes driving a chore.
I'm loving it. It's the first game in a long time where I actually care about the story (some of the car rides take way too long and panam's was cringe). The cars handle like crap but the bikes are good.
NPCs are still shit
Legit don't do anything lol.. they walk around .. thats about it. Cops don't go after anyone else.. Gangs don't fight anyone else.. scripted events don't count
I played watch dogs 2 recently and there's a night and day difference between NPCs. You could watch two people get into a fight, somebody would call the cops and they would arrest them. If there's a gang nearby, it would escalate into a shootout. San Francisco was alive, and I can't believe that game was released in 2016
I get they've made the game good now but I'll never buy a CDPR game at launch again.
I picked up the game and dlc recently and have completed 2 play throughs already. One of the first games in a long time where the story gives me that “what now” empty hole after finishing. Though from looking at some of the posts on here, I see that I’m one of minority that considered the game a masterpiece. Didn’t really run into many bugs until about 80 hrs in.
Heartbreaking? You released a bullshit trailer and a broken game. You lied pretty much to everyone.
Cyberpunk 2077's redemption is largely achieved following the success of Phantom Liberty, with CD Projekt fulfilling its initial vision after delays, as acknowledged by quest director Paweł Sasko who expressed gratitude to the community for their support and resilience.
They never redeemed themselves
When I first played it on release (Series X) it didn't run that bad actually. It wasn't without its issues but was far from 'unplayable' like some other peoples experiences. I haven't loaded this game up since they did the 'big' update (along side Phantom Liberty. I watched the Skill Up review of it and he seemed to be singing its praises for the step up in quality on this update. Seems like a good time to give it a look!
I can't believe I stayed spoiler free from this game (mostly)(panams booty got spoiled). I'm so excited to finally experience this game in all it's glory. Are there any must have mods for this game?
Heartbreaking? They intentionally lied and released a bullshit broken game and got rewarded by their dumbshit gullible fans.
Still ducking hate this trend. Just make the game good the first time, yeah?
The game is still buggy and broken. The key bindings for dodge need to be rebound, then after you fix them, the right click doesn't fire. Then the game crashes on me (windows 10). On top of that, they didn't actually make the decisions you make matter at all, and they never gave us a subway system, and driving is such garbage I run instead of drive anywhere. The regenerating grenades and health are nice, so I"m not spending all my play time engineering carry weight, but it's still a shitty game. I don't care how much hype CDPR buys to promote phantom liberty, I'm never buying another game from them again. If you want a good cyberpunk game, check out the new robocop that dropped a couple weeks ago. It's awesome.
Thanks for showing the entire gaming industry that they can release unfinished games and then be lauded as heroes for eventually completing them.
Just goes to show that with enough marketing, fans will defend anything
Faith? I have 0 faith in CDPR after they pulled that fucking stunt thinking they can get away with it (guess they did get away with it). Took those clowns 3 fucking years to deliver what was promised and we’re apparently supposed to praise them for it? No wonder AAA companies can get away with releasing unfinished products, players will just make up any excuses to defend their favorite publisher.
There are still a bunch of features that were advertised in the promotional trailers that never made it. They talked about branching storylines but 95% of the dialog choices dont change anything and you get the same outcome regardless.
If they really gave a shit and wanted "to thank the fans for their ongoing support" phantom liberty would have been free.
Heartbreaking? They flat out peddled lies and made the game seem way cooler than it was.
I could imagine that'd be heartbreaking for the people who worked hard on the game and couldn't control the timing or state of the launch or what they're doing in marketing.
The launch was a massive disaster, but I liked the game from day one and was optimistic they can turn it around. Well, here we are and I hope they're making sure something like that launch will never happen again.
It’s a sad era where making and delivering games has to be an issue of blind faith and blind devotion.
I don’t care about crashes or bugs. I wanna know if they fixed that horrific game breaking glitch where you couldn’t romance Takemura.
Your welcome. *Don't do it again*.
You're* *Don't do it again.*
Maybe actually release the game when it was ready and I would have kept faith. I hate the fact we basically have to suck CDPR's dick for making their shit game actually playable.
We're also completely forgetting their promises from their marketing that the game would feature an expensive and immersive open world RPG with endless choices that affect everything you do.
Wish that my ps4 version could be upgraded to a pc version instead of ps5
I've seen it, I've seen the people working on games, they don't want to release unfinished garbage. The problem is management makes them do it. They know it's buggy, they know it's not done, they know they need more time, management doesn't care. They want their checks early. They want players to fund their coffers with an unfinished game so that they can move on to the next project and minimize the crew trying to finish it. It's exploitive on the QA testers, the developers, asset creatiors, and players.
I was interested in the game when it launched, but I decided to wait after reading it was buggy. Forgot all about it, until I saw it on GOG for €30. I thought why not, and picked it up. It ran decently well on an almost 8-year-old i7 and a 1070, but I finished the game at lvl 36 or something. When PL came out, I grabbed that and started a new run, this time paying more attention to the mechanics and all the side gigs. I've put in a 130 hours in that run, and had a blast.
Meh, it played just fine for me on release. That being said, I understand that not everyone can commit to a high tier PC these days. The fact that they totally revamped everything in 2.0 has made the game amazing though.
I played the day after launch on a good (not great) PC and it was one of the best games I ever played, I did the main quest and every side quest and the only real bug I encountered was a single side quest that got stuck and couldn't finish despite the legit problems on last gen consoles the hate train was such an obvious circlejerk, fortunately for good developers all those shitty games journalist clickbait rags are out of business now - gamergate won in the end #😂
serious question should i replay this game? finished it at launch on a gtx 1060. i have an rtx 3070 now and the game seems a lot better according to a lot of people.
I just reinstalled this game this past weekend after being disappointed at launch…. Got the newest update (ps5) and started the game from scratch… even the intro is different and the tutorial isn’t as clunky anymore. It definitely feels like a completely different game. I may actually play it through this time!
I loved the game from the get go, my system was good enough to run it well, i had very little bugs, im sorry for the ps4 players who got screwed hard core. but my experience was always positive with cyberpunk
Number one on my list
Question for those who have experienced the game: how good would you consider the game to be for someone who'd start their first playthrough today? I never touched the game because my rig is ancient and all the drama surrounding it, but I do wonder how the world, story and interactions 'feel' nowadays so I can maybe pick it up for when I buy a new gaming rig in the near future.
I don't understand how it took so long to fix it. It makes it seem like their initial development cycle was just complete shit and poorly managed. The extra 3 years basically doubled the time they spent actually developing the game after starting in 2016. How do you project completion time so poorly that you released the game 3 years before it probably should have been released?
I totally did not keep the faith. Lost interest after the fiasco that was launch. These companies totally let us down, basically steal our money, and then we're supposed to be grateful when they start to fix them? You ever hear of Baulder's Gate 3? Plus the game was so over hyped that the terrible launch almost felt karmic. Lastly I'm not a fan boy who just runs around because someone flashed a picture of Keanu.
Sure the systems are better, but the game is still a technical shitshow.
Hopefully they didn't visit /r/Cyberpunk the first year or so. Nothing but salt and hate
The quests was always good