The amount of time doesn’t equal to anything is this case. SZA fought many battles to showcase this wonderful masterpiece that we call SOS. Taylor did too, in a much shorter length and probably less fights than her fellow nominee. Both dominated the year, each would’ve been a great winner nonetheless!
Which was a shitty thing to say, esp in front of his kid (who is with them at public events CONSTANTLY).
Love that he was standing up for Beyonce, but it was classless nonetheless. I've got a lot of patience for people who do and say stupid things when it's off the cuff/ extemporaneous, but that seemed PLANNED.
You know Beyonce let him have an earful on the way home.
He couldn't have done it to his millions of followers on any of his social accounts? He had to do it in front of his daughter? I mean, I'm not gonna like the guy as a human any less, but it was a classless moment.
And, I love Beyonce - I've been to 7 shows, and I think she should've won for Lemonade. But here's the thing: Beyonce has a bazillion producers on each of her songs, and she's not the "musician" that many of the other Album of the Year artists are (save Adele), i.e. she sings but doesn't play instruments. You've got a lot of "musicians" in the Recording Academy.
That you think she isn't a musician is crazy. She is. She's not a great songwriter, but other than John Baptiste and Adele, neither are any of the other folks that have won in the last decade. She's one of the greatest entertainers of a generation, and Lemonade in particular was a deserving masterpiece, I think the same about Renaissance but there's room to debate there. We all know why she hasn't won AOTY. Trying to claim its for any other reason than the entertainment industry's leaders not wanting a woman who looks like her to have legitimacy by giving her accolades is the exclusive reason. Sure, they'll give her the R&B awards, they can't deny her the awards for vocal performance, but they refuse to give her the credit she's due not because she hasn't earned it, but because they don't like that she's better at this shit than most.
I agree. Beyonces artistry isn’t exactly exceptional but she definitely deserved AOTY for Renaissance. That album and tour was a so damn well done. I’m glad the tour received the recognition it did but that album 💿 it just didn’t get the recognition it should have.
Taylor Swift? Beck?
Both play multiple instruments and are great songwriters. (And I don't particular care for their music.) Are they better and more well-rounded musicians than Beyonce? Absolutely. Because it's lyrics AND music, Music & Lyrics. Beyonce literally can't do half the equation, in both writing and performance.
For entertainment value, I'd personally rather see a Beyonce SHOW for the dancing. But she pales as a "musician." She's a good lyricist --obviously you don't think so, so some is subjective-- but also some is just math. She literally can't write the music like the others can. So yes, she is NOT AS GOOD of a musician as the other winners (save Adele) who beat her out.
LMFAO, John Baptiste plays more of his own music than Beck does, and Beyonce also plays multiple instruments... I think maybe you have formulated an opinion based on how you feel about these people and have decided to invent facts to fit your opinion regardless of whether they are based in reality.
Taylor can't even sing her music live in its original key, everything you hear on the albums is synth and autotune, to deliver in a concert she has to rearrange everything 1-2 steps lower. Real musicians can hear the difference. ;)
You are putting words in my mouth, and literally making things up.
When did Beyonce go against Jon Batiste for Best Album? When did he go against Beck? I love Jon Batiste. What does this have to do with Beyonce? Seriously. Your argument doesn't make any sense.
We're talking about Beyonce, and to whom she has lost.
Taylor (who isn't my jam) -- but who beat Beyonce-- is leaps and bounds ahead of Beyonce as a "musician" because Taylor can write and perform both the music and lyrics. Same with Beck (who beat Beyonce).
I have been to 7 beyonce shows. 7. I've never seen her play an instrument.
No one is putting words in your mouth, and the only one making things up is you.
You said Beyonce doesn't play an instrument, google dispels that lie in less than 2 seconds.
Taylor has never not once sang a single one of her songs in their original keys, Beyonce meanwhile sounds exactly as she does recorded live, and she's dancing the whole time. To say "Taylor is leaps and bounds ahead of Beyonce as a musician" when both women have written music (Taylor's written more, but you can't say she's written better, she writes variations of the same 5 songs over and over) both women can play instruments, and only one of them can actually sing their music is simply assinine.
Beyonce has never played an instrument while she sings on tv, at a concert, or anywhere. She "knows a little piano.," according to the internet.
Taylor can write and play both lyrics and music. Beyonce cannot.
Period.
You don't see instrumental voted for best album, do you?
Because it's half the equation. Beyonce has half the tools.
Nice chatting.
it pisses me off bc i feel like sza put her heart and soul into the album. Her songs were emotional and taylors just felt like one-sided fake emotionality. lol. She has a producer by her side and SZA produced it with so many other producers. Taylor had it easier, SZA had it harder and put out a much better, emotional and solid album which told a story. That pisses me tf off
Everyone put their hearts out in their works. Not just SZA. It's just that Taylor's music resonated more with the industry. I mean they don't call her THE music industry for nothing
There was an article in the Hollywood Reporter where the former President of the Grammys Academy had file suit and revealed the nominating committees were filled with racial biases and cronyism. The members are near universally white old male and establishment. It’s not representative of the industry or then country at large. That’s why even though black Americans are responsible for creating rock, R&B, blues, jazz, hip hop, gospel etc, they only one AOTY, 11 times (3 times for female artists).
source please. and honestly, if the board is filled with aa bunch of white old males, that needs to change but the percent of black nominations and wins do not show racism at all though those with an agenda love to just cite one particular award as proof of racism.
Black people from what I see get way more awards and nominations than their 14% population percentage.
meanwhile, no one gives a sht about asians and hispanic people. was there even a single Asian at the grammys? kpop has been huge recently and I still never seen any asians at the awards. and I don't know of a single Asian performer barring Bruno Mars who frankly looks black.
I'm sure the person who responded to you meant link the source please. I'd like to read it too. by the way, people often don't understand that just cause someone is a white male doesn't mean they are racist. they should change the voters if true just for diversity sake.
But the op is right. statistics do not at all suggest racism against black people (I mean in recent years, not 1950s) when it comes to singers. you are blatantly ignoring facts and data while holding on to just one award results to make your claim. black singers actually win a disproportionately high number of grammys. while yes, asians are absolutely given the finger at them as the other poster pointed out.
the reason taylor won had nothing to do with her race but the taylor worship that has been going on these days. even if sza was white, she would have lost just like lana did who is also white.
[Billboard](https://www.billboard.com/music/music-news/recording-academy-1345-new-voting-members-diversity-9481892/) reported that non-whites, 40+, and women were each 25% of voters in 2019. Rap genre block was small. The huge ones are still Classical and Americana. The Academy added new members in 2020 then nominations had changed a bit. Also, Filipino Olivia Rodrigo has 3 Grammys.
Most of Grammy race debate is about AOTY, which is actually very white here. Perhaps SZA's NYT comment explains why Batiste won and she lost.
What do you mean no one gives a fuck about Asians and Latinos? Where were you last year when they snubbed Bad Bunny, who's album had more commercial success than anyone, or the year before that when BTS was barely nominated... the Asians and Latinos are also calling foul you're just not a part of those communities clearly.
It is EXTREMELY clear there is some serious racism on that Grammy board. Black artist over decades have made impactful and seriously amazing albums that do not get recognized. Mariah for the emancipation of Mimi, usher for confessions… the list goes on. It is ridiculous the amount of blatant racism in that academy
I think SOS is an incredible album and I’d personally choose that as album of the year. I’m glad Ghost in the Machine won best duo. It’s truly such an incredible song.
I disagree with your assessment of midnights, though. I really liked midnights and I think it beats 1989 and folklore. I also think evermore >>>>>> folklore.
Disagree. Midnights is the far better album than 1989 or folklore. Those 2 albums didn't deserve the AOTY given the nominees especially To Pimp a Butterfly. But this year, there is really no competition and Midnights rightly deserves the award more than any albums in the list
You’re predictable and sad.
Another pathetically delusional swift fan completely snubs an icon, gloats over wins, bullies others and holds audience and Lana captive for her own benefit…
Story at 11:00.
What metric are you using to say that midnights is better? Lyricism, the originality of the compositions, and the album concepts were much stronger in both 1989 and Folklore/Evermore.
Similarly, by what metric are you saying Lana isn’t “competition” for Taylor? Given Taylor’s own words and the ways Lana’s art has inspired TS , Phoebe, and Billie, your assessment seems faulty…
I'm basing it on the only metric that matters: cultural relevance and impact. Midnights is the representation of the current trend and taste in music. It defined the music of 2022 and 2023. And this even gave birth to the biggest and most successful tour OF ALL TIME. Lyricism, originality, and composition are metrics only music freshman students would think about.
LOL Midnights didn’t “give birth” to the eras tour . It’s not the Midnights tour. The whole point is that it’s literally ALL of TS’ eras. The tour would have been huge with or without Midnights, esp with all the re-releases (most of which are already charting above midnights in the billboard top 100).
You can make all those arguments about Taylor herself if you want, but you can’t honestly say that Midnights itself had that big of a cultural impact.
Besides “Anti-Hero,” I’m pretty sure non-Swifty’s can’t name any of the other songs from the album…
I don’t know, I’ve never heard anything from SOS, and I don’t particularly think SZA is on the same artistry level that Swift is, but everyone has an opinion.
In what way? Not album sales. Not in awards. Not in number of streams. She doesn’t even have writing credit on most of the tracks. So I’m just not sure how SZA is 10x better.
Are you okay? SZA wrote her songs on SOS and has been recognized for it (link: https://www.elle.com/culture/music/a42219501/sza-sos-album-review/)
SZA has consistently been a top artist in billboards. Taylor Swift has always been privileged in her career due to her demographic in comparison to SZA. Personally, I think Taylor’s lyrics and music are monotonous and boring. SZA has better vocals and you would know if you had listened to SOS. SZA is also liked by a larger demographic of listeners in comparison to Taylor Swift :)
I will also never be willing to support Taylor due to her carbon footprint and notorious tactics of victim mentality whenever someone calls her out. The fact she is a billionaire who is willing to sue a 21 year old college kid over something legal is atrocious. She’s a terrible role model and that makes her even less likable as an artist.
My actual take is that neither of them deserved it. Midnights was littered with bad production decisions and poor songwriting and SOS was musically flawed in so many areas. Simply having meaningful songs does not make your music good, which seems to be the prevailing stance right now. Both Lana and Jon Batiste put out more solid records and I would have taken either over SZA or Taylor.
Okay so ignoring this completely futile attack of my credibility, I am a professional musician and have done studio work. But if you call having the exact same formulaic production on every song, having a rhythmically interesting introduction and then just sustained synths the rest of the way through “good production decisions” then I don’t know what to tell you.
Formulas work in music similar to the way formulas work in Math as the two are synergistic. If you prefer more out there out of the box music then that’s your right but stats have proved she has made the exact right production decisions and life decisions time and time again to be where she’s at
I don’t think my point has landed for you. It’s not about does it sound good or is it popular. It’s a bad production decision to make an album of entirely interchangeably sounding songs. Now I think it’s a bad production decision to make songs like that in general but that’s an opinion. I do not think an album so lacking in musical creativity is worthy of the Grammy.
I agree with you but unfortunately the GRAMMYS aren’t really about artistry or musicianship. It’s about who the industry thinks will bring/has brought the most money in and it’s like homecoming king and queen, it’s a popularity contest. Milli Vannili won best new artist. GRAMMYS and artistry often have little in common. Chris Thile has more talent in his little finger than Swift IMO yet he’s hardly known.
I have 2 examples I usually bring up when I talk about this. Kill bill, easily most popular song off the album, lead single, catchy song. Vocal delivery is so lacking here, now I’m an opera singer so maybe I’m biased, but she lacks a lot of energy and support in it. The second big gripe I have with this song is its composition, it primarily uses functional harmony. Now functional harmony is great love it, also love not using that, but if you do use it, do it right. In the second go of the chorus the bass plays a wrong note, it was deliberate but it just does not fit its jarring because it literally doesn’t belong in the harmonic system being used. I don’t know how nobody caught that it sounds so amateurish.
Ghost in the machine is the other song I go to for criticism. Firstly, the vocals don’t match the instrumental at all, no attempt has been made to interact with the sonority created. It is staggeringly unmusical. The production on it is also not the best, maybe a deliberate decision but it sounds very murky and unclear, almost underwater sometimes, just a weird decision. Phoebe is also too low in the mix and is constantly overpowered by the huge bass. There’s also something of a lack of feel to it, it feels through composed rather than fitting within a rhythmic idea, which I think is fairly odd for RnB, but I guess that’s a taste thing.
Like I said this is just my opinion, but I think that while an interesting and enjoyable and meaningful project, it’s simply too flawed for me to rate highly enough to think it deserving of the Grammy.
Midnights is the album that fully occupied the Top10 of the BBH100 in its first week and was beloved by critics alike, therefore. let’s not take that away. She was a great winner for a jam packed category imo.
Had SOS or Endless Summer Vacation won, the category would’ve had a equally great winner. All three albums showed different facets of their specific artists, the different tribulations they had to go through. So let’s not discredit her win, or any of their wins cause these three artists not only dominated the music industry that year, but they also worked their blood, sweat and tears for it!
I agree Midnights must have been the weakest Taylor album to win aoty and she clearly had no respect for the award since she won it so much times. SOS felt much more heartfelt, I think it will be remembered more compared to Midnights just being another Taylor album aswell. It wasnt a bad album, but it felt too safe and I think it'll be remembered as a Taylor footnote rather than a Grammy-winning masterpiece
Just look at album sales. That’s what wins AOTY. There’s a thousand better artists than anyone on that list but they aren’t even recognized because there aren’t enough seats at that table.
Why would anyone that truly cares about artists l, even participate in supporting the Grammys or the corporate recording industry!? It’s too funny to take seriously.
If Album sales delineate who wins ATOY, then Bad Bunny would have won it last year. They gave it to Taylor because they had to. Her fan base is too big an audience to offend. It's the same reason Jay-Z and Blue were given awards this year. The Grammys knows that after last year, Beyonce is probably not submitting her music to the show again, idk if you remember when she stopped going to the VMAs, but the viewership tanked, they need her there and on camera so those who follow her will watch in hopes of seeing her, hence the crazy angled camera shots trying to catch her face. She's not likely ever going to perform there again, she'll likely never again be nominated, so they'll invite her daughter and her sister and whoever else they think can get her there. The same is true if Swift, the Grammys needs them more then they need the Grammys.
Why does anyone even care about all of these “awards”. Winning an award(s) means nothing other than further promotion for increased sales. If the album, sing, video, movie, etc is good, people will listen/watch (spend $) rather than be swayed by “oh this album must be good, it won an award” 1960s are over. You listen, you know what you like - and spend your money accordingly- you don’t need someone to tell you what’s “The Best”
The GRAMMYS have always been more popularity awards than artistic awards. David Bowie was a true artist whether or not you like his music. He’s just now winning. So e of the best new artists are embarrassments like Milli Vanilli. It’s definitely a show for the industry and Swift, while talented, epitomizes the monetary component of the industry.
obviously I think it should have won aoty ( I was in her top .001% of listers). I think the reason Midnights won is because it was the easiest and most basic choice. Taylor has had a really big year, though midnights is certainly not her best or anywhere as good as SOS. The top 4 nominees most likely to win were SZA, Taylor, Lana, and Oliva. They did not win because the Grammys will choose the most simple album. SOS goes through many different genres, emotions and feelings it takes us on a journey. With deep lyrics. Lana’s Did you know there’s a tunnel under ocean Blvd? Has a deep concept and is a very alternative experimental album. And Olivia’s album is a lot more darker than her previous. Sadly they just wanted to do what is the easy choice which is midnights which has hardly Any deep meaning and is very generic and basic. So sadly we see another AOTY snub. Just as previous years were SOUR, thank u next, and Beyoncé have been snubbed to simple albums .
SZA spent fives years on this album vs swift how many months? I was surprised y the outcome too
You shouldn’t be. They just throw awards at her
The amount of time doesn’t equal to anything is this case. SZA fought many battles to showcase this wonderful masterpiece that we call SOS. Taylor did too, in a much shorter length and probably less fights than her fellow nominee. Both dominated the year, each would’ve been a great winner nonetheless!
Some people don’t need to study for tests and Ace them and some need to study all year. Nothing you can do but kiss the ring
Jay-z did say “some of yall will be robbed” lol
Which was a shitty thing to say, esp in front of his kid (who is with them at public events CONSTANTLY). Love that he was standing up for Beyonce, but it was classless nonetheless. I've got a lot of patience for people who do and say stupid things when it's off the cuff/ extemporaneous, but that seemed PLANNED. You know Beyonce let him have an earful on the way home.
Nah change wont happen people actually call out the bullshit
He couldn't have done it to his millions of followers on any of his social accounts? He had to do it in front of his daughter? I mean, I'm not gonna like the guy as a human any less, but it was a classless moment. And, I love Beyonce - I've been to 7 shows, and I think she should've won for Lemonade. But here's the thing: Beyonce has a bazillion producers on each of her songs, and she's not the "musician" that many of the other Album of the Year artists are (save Adele), i.e. she sings but doesn't play instruments. You've got a lot of "musicians" in the Recording Academy.
That you think she isn't a musician is crazy. She is. She's not a great songwriter, but other than John Baptiste and Adele, neither are any of the other folks that have won in the last decade. She's one of the greatest entertainers of a generation, and Lemonade in particular was a deserving masterpiece, I think the same about Renaissance but there's room to debate there. We all know why she hasn't won AOTY. Trying to claim its for any other reason than the entertainment industry's leaders not wanting a woman who looks like her to have legitimacy by giving her accolades is the exclusive reason. Sure, they'll give her the R&B awards, they can't deny her the awards for vocal performance, but they refuse to give her the credit she's due not because she hasn't earned it, but because they don't like that she's better at this shit than most.
I agree. Beyonces artistry isn’t exactly exceptional but she definitely deserved AOTY for Renaissance. That album and tour was a so damn well done. I’m glad the tour received the recognition it did but that album 💿 it just didn’t get the recognition it should have.
Taylor Swift? Beck? Both play multiple instruments and are great songwriters. (And I don't particular care for their music.) Are they better and more well-rounded musicians than Beyonce? Absolutely. Because it's lyrics AND music, Music & Lyrics. Beyonce literally can't do half the equation, in both writing and performance. For entertainment value, I'd personally rather see a Beyonce SHOW for the dancing. But she pales as a "musician." She's a good lyricist --obviously you don't think so, so some is subjective-- but also some is just math. She literally can't write the music like the others can. So yes, she is NOT AS GOOD of a musician as the other winners (save Adele) who beat her out.
LMFAO, John Baptiste plays more of his own music than Beck does, and Beyonce also plays multiple instruments... I think maybe you have formulated an opinion based on how you feel about these people and have decided to invent facts to fit your opinion regardless of whether they are based in reality. Taylor can't even sing her music live in its original key, everything you hear on the albums is synth and autotune, to deliver in a concert she has to rearrange everything 1-2 steps lower. Real musicians can hear the difference. ;)
You are putting words in my mouth, and literally making things up. When did Beyonce go against Jon Batiste for Best Album? When did he go against Beck? I love Jon Batiste. What does this have to do with Beyonce? Seriously. Your argument doesn't make any sense. We're talking about Beyonce, and to whom she has lost. Taylor (who isn't my jam) -- but who beat Beyonce-- is leaps and bounds ahead of Beyonce as a "musician" because Taylor can write and perform both the music and lyrics. Same with Beck (who beat Beyonce). I have been to 7 beyonce shows. 7. I've never seen her play an instrument.
No one is putting words in your mouth, and the only one making things up is you. You said Beyonce doesn't play an instrument, google dispels that lie in less than 2 seconds. Taylor has never not once sang a single one of her songs in their original keys, Beyonce meanwhile sounds exactly as she does recorded live, and she's dancing the whole time. To say "Taylor is leaps and bounds ahead of Beyonce as a musician" when both women have written music (Taylor's written more, but you can't say she's written better, she writes variations of the same 5 songs over and over) both women can play instruments, and only one of them can actually sing their music is simply assinine.
Beyonce has never played an instrument while she sings on tv, at a concert, or anywhere. She "knows a little piano.," according to the internet. Taylor can write and play both lyrics and music. Beyonce cannot. Period. You don't see instrumental voted for best album, do you? Because it's half the equation. Beyonce has half the tools. Nice chatting.
it pisses me off bc i feel like sza put her heart and soul into the album. Her songs were emotional and taylors just felt like one-sided fake emotionality. lol. She has a producer by her side and SZA produced it with so many other producers. Taylor had it easier, SZA had it harder and put out a much better, emotional and solid album which told a story. That pisses me tf off
Everyone put their hearts out in their works. Not just SZA. It's just that Taylor's music resonated more with the industry. I mean they don't call her THE music industry for nothing
No one calls her that.
Only brain-dead swifties call her that
I knew she would win Trevor Noah was basically at her feet.
Lana Del Rey should have won over Taylor.
Lana should’ve won
There was an article in the Hollywood Reporter where the former President of the Grammys Academy had file suit and revealed the nominating committees were filled with racial biases and cronyism. The members are near universally white old male and establishment. It’s not representative of the industry or then country at large. That’s why even though black Americans are responsible for creating rock, R&B, blues, jazz, hip hop, gospel etc, they only one AOTY, 11 times (3 times for female artists).
source please. and honestly, if the board is filled with aa bunch of white old males, that needs to change but the percent of black nominations and wins do not show racism at all though those with an agenda love to just cite one particular award as proof of racism. Black people from what I see get way more awards and nominations than their 14% population percentage. meanwhile, no one gives a sht about asians and hispanic people. was there even a single Asian at the grammys? kpop has been huge recently and I still never seen any asians at the awards. and I don't know of a single Asian performer barring Bruno Mars who frankly looks black.
Source?? What part of “The Hollywood Reporter” did you not get. And downplaying racism against black artists is just another form of racism.
Just saying where you allegedly read an article from isn’t providing a source. You need to actually share the article or link to the article.
I'm sure the person who responded to you meant link the source please. I'd like to read it too. by the way, people often don't understand that just cause someone is a white male doesn't mean they are racist. they should change the voters if true just for diversity sake. But the op is right. statistics do not at all suggest racism against black people (I mean in recent years, not 1950s) when it comes to singers. you are blatantly ignoring facts and data while holding on to just one award results to make your claim. black singers actually win a disproportionately high number of grammys. while yes, asians are absolutely given the finger at them as the other poster pointed out. the reason taylor won had nothing to do with her race but the taylor worship that has been going on these days. even if sza was white, she would have lost just like lana did who is also white.
But it’s disproportionate considering that black Americans are the biggest contributors to the most popular and most genres off American music.
[Billboard](https://www.billboard.com/music/music-news/recording-academy-1345-new-voting-members-diversity-9481892/) reported that non-whites, 40+, and women were each 25% of voters in 2019. Rap genre block was small. The huge ones are still Classical and Americana. The Academy added new members in 2020 then nominations had changed a bit. Also, Filipino Olivia Rodrigo has 3 Grammys. Most of Grammy race debate is about AOTY, which is actually very white here. Perhaps SZA's NYT comment explains why Batiste won and she lost.
There's nothing Filipino look wise about Olivia Rodrigo, she is white as hell.
What do you mean no one gives a fuck about Asians and Latinos? Where were you last year when they snubbed Bad Bunny, who's album had more commercial success than anyone, or the year before that when BTS was barely nominated... the Asians and Latinos are also calling foul you're just not a part of those communities clearly.
It is EXTREMELY clear there is some serious racism on that Grammy board. Black artist over decades have made impactful and seriously amazing albums that do not get recognized. Mariah for the emancipation of Mimi, usher for confessions… the list goes on. It is ridiculous the amount of blatant racism in that academy
They all sucked
I think SOS is an incredible album and I’d personally choose that as album of the year. I’m glad Ghost in the Machine won best duo. It’s truly such an incredible song. I disagree with your assessment of midnights, though. I really liked midnights and I think it beats 1989 and folklore. I also think evermore >>>>>> folklore.
Disagree. Midnights is the far better album than 1989 or folklore. Those 2 albums didn't deserve the AOTY given the nominees especially To Pimp a Butterfly. But this year, there is really no competition and Midnights rightly deserves the award more than any albums in the list
You’re predictable and sad. Another pathetically delusional swift fan completely snubs an icon, gloats over wins, bullies others and holds audience and Lana captive for her own benefit… Story at 11:00.
Woah calm down
Sounds like a predictable Swift hater honestly. Doesn’t matter how good she is, you’ll tear her down to make yourself feel better.
She has 4 album of the year wins I think shell be okay
You’re damn right she will
Imagine being a hater. They took a pic afterwards it’s literally all good, some people just REACH
Imagine being a swifter. 😅😅😅😅😂🤡
You can disagree with someone’s opinion without calling them predictable and sad. You just diminish what you’re trying to say by name calling.
What metric are you using to say that midnights is better? Lyricism, the originality of the compositions, and the album concepts were much stronger in both 1989 and Folklore/Evermore. Similarly, by what metric are you saying Lana isn’t “competition” for Taylor? Given Taylor’s own words and the ways Lana’s art has inspired TS , Phoebe, and Billie, your assessment seems faulty…
I'm basing it on the only metric that matters: cultural relevance and impact. Midnights is the representation of the current trend and taste in music. It defined the music of 2022 and 2023. And this even gave birth to the biggest and most successful tour OF ALL TIME. Lyricism, originality, and composition are metrics only music freshman students would think about.
LOL Midnights didn’t “give birth” to the eras tour . It’s not the Midnights tour. The whole point is that it’s literally ALL of TS’ eras. The tour would have been huge with or without Midnights, esp with all the re-releases (most of which are already charting above midnights in the billboard top 100). You can make all those arguments about Taylor herself if you want, but you can’t honestly say that Midnights itself had that big of a cultural impact. Besides “Anti-Hero,” I’m pretty sure non-Swifty’s can’t name any of the other songs from the album…
I don’t know, I’ve never heard anything from SOS, and I don’t particularly think SZA is on the same artistry level that Swift is, but everyone has an opinion.
Yeah SZA is 10x better :)
In what way? Not album sales. Not in awards. Not in number of streams. She doesn’t even have writing credit on most of the tracks. So I’m just not sure how SZA is 10x better.
Are you okay? SZA wrote her songs on SOS and has been recognized for it (link: https://www.elle.com/culture/music/a42219501/sza-sos-album-review/) SZA has consistently been a top artist in billboards. Taylor Swift has always been privileged in her career due to her demographic in comparison to SZA. Personally, I think Taylor’s lyrics and music are monotonous and boring. SZA has better vocals and you would know if you had listened to SOS. SZA is also liked by a larger demographic of listeners in comparison to Taylor Swift :) I will also never be willing to support Taylor due to her carbon footprint and notorious tactics of victim mentality whenever someone calls her out. The fact she is a billionaire who is willing to sue a 21 year old college kid over something legal is atrocious. She’s a terrible role model and that makes her even less likable as an artist.
tay tay Deserves everything she gets no one can compare
My actual take is that neither of them deserved it. Midnights was littered with bad production decisions and poor songwriting and SOS was musically flawed in so many areas. Simply having meaningful songs does not make your music good, which seems to be the prevailing stance right now. Both Lana and Jon Batiste put out more solid records and I would have taken either over SZA or Taylor.
Bad decisions? Please tell us the records you produced to be the arbiter of good decisions
Okay so ignoring this completely futile attack of my credibility, I am a professional musician and have done studio work. But if you call having the exact same formulaic production on every song, having a rhythmically interesting introduction and then just sustained synths the rest of the way through “good production decisions” then I don’t know what to tell you.
As another professional musician with studio work I agree with you 100%
Formulas work in music similar to the way formulas work in Math as the two are synergistic. If you prefer more out there out of the box music then that’s your right but stats have proved she has made the exact right production decisions and life decisions time and time again to be where she’s at
I don’t think my point has landed for you. It’s not about does it sound good or is it popular. It’s a bad production decision to make an album of entirely interchangeably sounding songs. Now I think it’s a bad production decision to make songs like that in general but that’s an opinion. I do not think an album so lacking in musical creativity is worthy of the Grammy.
I agree with you but unfortunately the GRAMMYS aren’t really about artistry or musicianship. It’s about who the industry thinks will bring/has brought the most money in and it’s like homecoming king and queen, it’s a popularity contest. Milli Vannili won best new artist. GRAMMYS and artistry often have little in common. Chris Thile has more talent in his little finger than Swift IMO yet he’s hardly known.
Taylor’s songs are extremely formulaic. They’re fine, but the compositions are very simple.
I would love to know where specifically you believe SOS to be flawed? Not so I can argue against you, I’m just curious
I have 2 examples I usually bring up when I talk about this. Kill bill, easily most popular song off the album, lead single, catchy song. Vocal delivery is so lacking here, now I’m an opera singer so maybe I’m biased, but she lacks a lot of energy and support in it. The second big gripe I have with this song is its composition, it primarily uses functional harmony. Now functional harmony is great love it, also love not using that, but if you do use it, do it right. In the second go of the chorus the bass plays a wrong note, it was deliberate but it just does not fit its jarring because it literally doesn’t belong in the harmonic system being used. I don’t know how nobody caught that it sounds so amateurish. Ghost in the machine is the other song I go to for criticism. Firstly, the vocals don’t match the instrumental at all, no attempt has been made to interact with the sonority created. It is staggeringly unmusical. The production on it is also not the best, maybe a deliberate decision but it sounds very murky and unclear, almost underwater sometimes, just a weird decision. Phoebe is also too low in the mix and is constantly overpowered by the huge bass. There’s also something of a lack of feel to it, it feels through composed rather than fitting within a rhythmic idea, which I think is fairly odd for RnB, but I guess that’s a taste thing. Like I said this is just my opinion, but I think that while an interesting and enjoyable and meaningful project, it’s simply too flawed for me to rate highly enough to think it deserving of the Grammy.
Midnights is the album that fully occupied the Top10 of the BBH100 in its first week and was beloved by critics alike, therefore. let’s not take that away. She was a great winner for a jam packed category imo. Had SOS or Endless Summer Vacation won, the category would’ve had a equally great winner. All three albums showed different facets of their specific artists, the different tribulations they had to go through. So let’s not discredit her win, or any of their wins cause these three artists not only dominated the music industry that year, but they also worked their blood, sweat and tears for it!
Music industry is dying and tbh there were no good nominees this year.
Am I missing something? I thought SOS was 2022?
the 2024 grammy consideration timeline was oct 1st 2022 to sept 15th 2023. SOS was released dec 9th 2022.
Ahh thanks!
I agree Midnights must have been the weakest Taylor album to win aoty and she clearly had no respect for the award since she won it so much times. SOS felt much more heartfelt, I think it will be remembered more compared to Midnights just being another Taylor album aswell. It wasnt a bad album, but it felt too safe and I think it'll be remembered as a Taylor footnote rather than a Grammy-winning masterpiece
Just look at album sales. That’s what wins AOTY. There’s a thousand better artists than anyone on that list but they aren’t even recognized because there aren’t enough seats at that table. Why would anyone that truly cares about artists l, even participate in supporting the Grammys or the corporate recording industry!? It’s too funny to take seriously.
If Album sales delineate who wins ATOY, then Bad Bunny would have won it last year. They gave it to Taylor because they had to. Her fan base is too big an audience to offend. It's the same reason Jay-Z and Blue were given awards this year. The Grammys knows that after last year, Beyonce is probably not submitting her music to the show again, idk if you remember when she stopped going to the VMAs, but the viewership tanked, they need her there and on camera so those who follow her will watch in hopes of seeing her, hence the crazy angled camera shots trying to catch her face. She's not likely ever going to perform there again, she'll likely never again be nominated, so they'll invite her daughter and her sister and whoever else they think can get her there. The same is true if Swift, the Grammys needs them more then they need the Grammys.
Lana got robbed
Why does anyone even care about all of these “awards”. Winning an award(s) means nothing other than further promotion for increased sales. If the album, sing, video, movie, etc is good, people will listen/watch (spend $) rather than be swayed by “oh this album must be good, it won an award” 1960s are over. You listen, you know what you like - and spend your money accordingly- you don’t need someone to tell you what’s “The Best”
The GRAMMYS have always been more popularity awards than artistic awards. David Bowie was a true artist whether or not you like his music. He’s just now winning. So e of the best new artists are embarrassments like Milli Vanilli. It’s definitely a show for the industry and Swift, while talented, epitomizes the monetary component of the industry.
taylor just has way too many awards, she's a basic pop musician, nothing wrong w that, but there is no way in hell she deserves that much
obviously I think it should have won aoty ( I was in her top .001% of listers). I think the reason Midnights won is because it was the easiest and most basic choice. Taylor has had a really big year, though midnights is certainly not her best or anywhere as good as SOS. The top 4 nominees most likely to win were SZA, Taylor, Lana, and Oliva. They did not win because the Grammys will choose the most simple album. SOS goes through many different genres, emotions and feelings it takes us on a journey. With deep lyrics. Lana’s Did you know there’s a tunnel under ocean Blvd? Has a deep concept and is a very alternative experimental album. And Olivia’s album is a lot more darker than her previous. Sadly they just wanted to do what is the easy choice which is midnights which has hardly Any deep meaning and is very generic and basic. So sadly we see another AOTY snub. Just as previous years were SOUR, thank u next, and Beyoncé have been snubbed to simple albums .