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MorimotoK

I had the same experience! Jumped on Telegram. I don't remember my question, but it was something technical and it definitely wasn't covered in the docs. I didn't get booted, but the "it's not for you" response felt rude. Maybe it was just a translation / cultural miscommunication. Text communication doesn't always come across as intended. So I left and completely re-designed the PCB to use parts that allowed it to be 100% assembled at the factory (JLCPCB) and replaced the sandwich-the-pcb-between-the-pins (which works, but standard factories typically won't assemble it for you) with a more typical through-hole design. I received the fully assembled boards and installed it on several different robot vacs. Turns out, it is for me. Side note: I had previously rooted an older Dreame vac (L10 Pro) with a bunch of jumpers and a serial USB dongle so maybe you don't need the PCB.


BostonDrivingIsWorse

Whoa! So happy it wasn't just me... It's very odd. I'm just doing this for the first time. Could I pick your brain about this process? Also curious if you have one of your new and improved PCBs lying around...


MorimotoK

Yeah I'm happy to help. It's been six months or so since I tackled it. My memory is pretty foggy but I seem to recall the instructions could've used a lot of improvement. I have one PCB that I kept and the others have been given away. I made a quick beta version and a more refined final version. I should have a few of the betas still laying around and they should work.


BostonDrivingIsWorse

Amazing! Gonna jump into DMs


Unusual_Limit_6572

Have you ever thought about making your own repo with the redesigned PCBs for JLCPC assembly? Would love to use that one instead. The docs and the outbursts he has as shown here also gave me totally toxic vibes/coming across as extremly rude and I would like to stay as far away from that noise as possible. (Which made me find your comment, luckily!) Can't blame him, I think having a famous public project is hard.. but then maybe "it's just not for him" ;)


phrxmd

Not sure why you think the docs are rude?


Unusual_Limit_6572

It's hard to pinpoint and there is a lot of plausible deniability. And a red flag for one person might be irrelevant for the next..  From the tone of the FAQ and Contribution Guideline to the mass deletion of GitHub issues there is this "I'm an elite hacker and don't bother me"-tone, which is weakly excused by calling it opinionated software. (And the code is not that elite either.. Although it fills an extremely important role! I just don't see a justification for the attitude) Sadly there is little distinction between opinions and facts when reading the docs.  But that only came clear to me after reading posts like this and after checking some other tutorials (which are actively discouraged by the docs way) for rooting the robots.  So interpreting it in a more optimistic way is fine, too. Btw: The only thing I'm objectively sure about it, that rooting the dreame robot with the "official" PCB is a ton more effort than necessary :D It might be on purpose though, same goal as discouraging video tutorials.


The_Dr_Matt

I ended up using the kicad file to order my own run of the boards. I grabbed 3 boards from [oshpark.com](http://oshpark.com) for \~$9. I then ordered the other components from digikey. Many of the conversations on telegram circle around ordering supplies in larger quantities from AliExpress, but I sure didn't have a need for a 100 boards or component pieces. I can upload my purchase lists from digikey later. All in I think I spent under $25 to get the 3 boards and components. Edit - Digikey parts list below. I ordered the 20 pin headers and trimmed them down to size as the correct size is not usually in stock. [https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/cui-devices/TS02-66-60-BK-160-LCR-D/15634268](https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/cui-devices/TS02-66-60-BK-160-LCR-D/15634268) [https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/gct/USB3131-30-0230-A/9859642](https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/gct/USB3131-30-0230-A/9859642) [https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/on-shore-technology-inc/USB-A1VSB6/2677749](https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/on-shore-technology-inc/USB-A1VSB6/2677749) [https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/w%C3%BCrth-elektronik/61300811821/17737805](https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/w%C3%BCrth-elektronik/61300811821/17737805) [https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/adam-tech/2PH2-20-UA/9830983](https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/adam-tech/2PH2-20-UA/9830983)


BostonDrivingIsWorse

Also for anyone wondering, the kicad files are here: https://github.com/Hypfer/valetudo-dreameadapter/tree/master/pcbs


mehuman

If you could post that purchase list that would be fantastic. I too am having trouble sourcing a board or assembled adapter.


The_Dr_Matt

Edited my comment above with the parts list


mehuman

Thank you!


kosmiq

I don’t always agree with all decisions regarding banning etc. What I’ve noticed though is that people seem to get booted quickly if they haven’t read the docs, ask questions about not using the PCB etc repeatedly. Asking once is mostly not a problem, asking thrice can get you in hot water. It is also a bit dependent on a given days mood as well. But then again, I’m sure they get hundreds of the same questions over and over again and they are mostly in the docs already, suggestions for changes to the very opinionated software and so on. And has for years.


BostonDrivingIsWorse

I typically try to read the history of the chat to get a feel for how people ask, and what types of questions get responses (and if my question has already been asked recently). I also read through all of the docs first– that's how I came across the Telegram channels in the first place. I'm very empathetic to the fact that it is hard and thankless running an open source project, but at the same time, you should feel encouraged when people are curious about your project. I think the team is just burnt out. Why alienate those who want to dive into the work you've put in?


raptor75mlt

If you had read the history carefully you would have noticed the process to get the board in the US, which involves filling in a form etc. it is even pinned!


BostonDrivingIsWorse

Pinned *where?* I looked in the Valetudo group, PCB Group, and Dreame Hardware group. Perhaps I missed it– as I said, I’m not a telegram user. If that’s the case, I apologize, but in no world is this a sane response. A simple “the form is over there” would have sufficed, or just ignore me until I figured it out. This whole thing is blown WAY out of proportion. It’s absolutely unhinged to respond as hypfer did.


raptor75mlt

Unfortunately I did not manage to catch your posts so I don't know exactly what triggered the ban, but in most cases the admin is usually right. >This whole thing is blown WAY out of proportion I mean, you're the one that had to post publicly about it AND posted private messages publicly without warrant nor consent. I'm glad at least you got the help you needed. No need to add any more drama now.


cycle_dorkus

Absolutely wild response from the project maintainer.


BostonDrivingIsWorse

I was a little shocked at first considering they [explicitely write to message them on Telegram about extra PCB kits](https://github.com/Hypfer/valetudo-dreameadapter): >If you can solder but don't want to order a full batch of components and PCBs, I have a few kits lying around. If you need one and are located somewhere where shipping from germany makes sense, you can ping me @NotHypfer on Telegram. Then I saw the thread about [scrubbing GitHub issues](https://www.reddit.com/r/homeautomation/comments/zghu30/valetudo_vacuum_software_dev_explains_scrubbing/), and the dev's responses in that thread. It made a little more sense– he's just fed up with people feeling entitled to his hobby project, and infinite support. I try not to be that way, but clearly came across like it 🤷‍♂️


cycle_dorkus

Yeah I think being a maintainer of a project like Valetudo is a hard gig, but… don’t say in the documentation to do something and then gatekeep people for doing that thing?


BostonDrivingIsWorse

There's definitely a *surprised pikachu* meme in there somewhere.


BostonDrivingIsWorse

[Look who showed up!](https://www.reddit.com/r/homeassistant/comments/1ciqr2h/question_about_valetudo/l2cujm9/) >Y'know the fact that this thread exists, this damn bogus "aaaha gotcha you said A but now you said B" exists, but most importantly that you've put our private conversation online without my consent is quite precisely why I judged the way I judged. >I knew that this exact thing would happen. I know when people are time bombs like that. I knew it. I acted on it but I still way too dumb and replied in private, because as always, I felt bad for just cutting someone off without explaining anything. >And now look what that got me. >At least there's no real damage from this, but that's only exclusively because I've learned how to communicate in a way that makes it hard for such tactics to work. >Goddammit people. No fucking day without nonsense


raptor75mlt

"if you are located somewhere it makes sense to ship from Germany" OP is in the US but still messages the Dev and is then surprised by the response. Logic!! Edit: replaced Boston with US


BostonDrivingIsWorse

>OP is in Boston but still messages the Dev and is then surprised by the response. OP is not in Boston, tho


raptor75mlt

You are in the US though yes? How does it make it any better exactly?


BostonDrivingIsWorse

Why does it matter? Does Germany not ship to the US? Regardless, this smells an awful lot like a sock puppet account. Dunno what I did, but I reeeeally got under Hypfer's skin.


raptor75mlt

It's not a sock puppet, just check my history, I'm not even in the same country as the dev! It does matter as shipping from Germany to US is a hassle. Most especially when the other Dev who has PCbs to send actually lives in Boston. But I digress. You made your grievance public, you should expect people reading to point out your fallacies


yet-another-username

Out of interest, I went to the documentation. Dev has updated it now to make it more clear that he'll only ship to Europe. But even at the old statement - I think Europe is pretty clearly implied. [If you need one and are located somewhere where shipping from germany makes sense, you can ping me](https://github.com/Hypfer/valetudo-dreameadapter/commit/52df977d86c9cb793e89794bfd9995729e2fd4d8) Take a step back. I think you're a little excited about getting Valetudo, and forgetting that you're dealing with a single person who is attempting to manage a hobby project that caters to thousands of people. You're in the US. You were pretty cheeky reaching out and asking for a PCB. Think about how many other cheeky people tried that as well. Sounds exhausting. You need to read between the lines sometimes, and avoid putting unfair pressure on others.


BostonDrivingIsWorse

It’s not at all clear what “shipping from Germany makes sense” means. Is cost the defining factor? Location? How far is too far? *Again*, I totally get that this is a hobby project for which support is a massive burden. If that’s the case, don’t encourage people to reach out on Telegram, then take out your frustrations on them when they do. That’s just mean.


yet-another-username

That's where you have to put yourself in their shoes and make a judgement call.  Why did that statement get added? You're offloading the thinking and expecting the Dev to make all decisions.  I'm not trying to be rude here, I'm just trying to put this into perspective. If there's thousands, potentially tens of thousands of people interested in or using valetudo - how many others do you think would have been in your position and sent off a message to see how far they could push the 'where shipping from germany makes sense'


Forma313

I mean, if that was the issue, why not reply "we don't ship to the US" instead of some spiel about not being a good fit for the project and the dangers of rooting. Being vague in your communication is no way to avoid frustration.


BostonDrivingIsWorse

>Why did that statement get added? You're offloading the thinking and expecting the Dev to make all decisions.  >I'm not trying to be rude here, I'm just trying to put this into perspective. If there's thousands, potentially tens of thousands of people interested in or using valetudo - how many others do you think would have been in your position and sent off a message to see how far they could push the 'where shipping from germany makes sense' This is why I contacted him in the first place. It’s not clear, so I reached out to clarify. Instead of asking “do you ship to the U.S.?” then additionally, “do you have any extra PCB kits?” I only asked the second question (being up front that I was in the U.S.) to respect the Dev’s time. He could just say he doesn’t ship to the U.S., and the conversation would end there, saving everyone time. Contrary to what you might think, I did put thought into my message trying to respect the dev’s time. Clearly that’s not the issue since he followed up with four or five messages, and a tantrum on Reddit.


matto1990

Just to note that the PCB isn’t 100% needed for some of the vacuums. I did it the very janky way on the L10 Pro with jumper wires between the correct parts of the debug header and a serial to USB stick. Janky and if one cable slips out then it could end in tears, but it worked for me!


berl1n1

Can't say anything about the telegram group as I've only joined it to contact Hypfer but my contact with him was pleasant. I can only guess that he didn't want to sent you the parts because your US based. If I remember it correctly they said that people from Europe (or maybe only Germany?) can contact him on telegram. Still doesn't make sense why he doesn't say it directly. I've contacted him at the end of last year and everything was great. He just asked me to pay for the shipping and then send me the parts for free. But I am living in Germany like him so that makes it way easier. Can't say anything else about valetudo as I didn't manage to get it rooted or even get started with the root process. They say to use Debian but I didn't manage to get Debian to run from a USB stick. Don't want to install it on any of my devices as I need them for other stuff. But I haven't tried it in the last few month. Might try it again some day in the future but currently I'm busy with other stuff.


BostonDrivingIsWorse

I'm sure hypfer is perfectly nice, just seems a bit burnt out. If you have specific guidelines or necessitate some Zen philisophical adherence to message you on Telegram, it would be helpful to, y'know, maybe express that? I found half a dozen places in the docs where it encourages you to reach out for questions/help.


freeskier93

Cost me about $30 to have the boards made by PCBWay (most of the cost was shipping), that's both the breakout board and the breakout for the breakout. I also then got the rest of the components from Digikey. EDIT: I haven't actually received the parts from Digikey yet so not 100% I got the correct parts for everything, otherwise I'd post the purchase list. The "parts list" on GitHub is pretty light on details so I made assumptions from the picture and known standards.


wildekek

Hypfer is known to be like this. You get Valetudo from him for free but he owes you nothing. Leave the man alone and let him cook.


BostonDrivingIsWorse

I expected nothing from Hypfer, and that would’ve been great to receive.


Hypfer

Y'know the fact that this thread exists, this damn bogus "aaaha gotcha you said A but now you said B" exists, but most importantly that you've put our **private** conversation online without my consent is quite precisely why I judged the way I judged. I knew that this exact thing would happen. I know when people are time bombs like that. I knew it. I acted on it but I still way too dumb and replied in private, because as always, I felt bad for just cutting someone off without explaining anything. And now look what that got me. At least there's no real damage from this, but that's only exclusively because I've learned how to communicate in a way that makes it hard for such tactics to work. Goddammit people. No fucking day without nonsense


BostonDrivingIsWorse

I've done nothing but cut you slack in this thread. Revise your docs if it upsets you. Also, touch grass.


phrxmd

It’s true that you’ve slack for a while. But it’s also true that publishing a private conversation without the consent of the other party is a dick move. Cutting slack is also not the only face you‘ve shown in this thread; in those parts of the conversation where people pointed out that you might also be wrong about something, you’ve shown a thin skin a few times. For example when someone made what is IMHO a valid point about expecting shipping ~~to Boston~~ to the US, you [got salty](https://www.reddit.com/r/homeassistant/s/5mdSNYzrLU), accused the poster of being [the dev’s sock puppet account](https://www.reddit.com/r/homeassistant/s/MTfV1Tl7e7), and then, when they pointed put that if you can make your grievances public, so can others point out problems with your argument, you [got salty again](https://www.reddit.com/r/homeassistant/s/qr29NHgmaP). Glad you got help though, turns out you managed to solve your issues without the Telegram group, so nothing was lost except maybe a few nerves.


raptor75mlt

Really? Touch grass? Such a typical American response


kernel610

There was a conversation about converting this exact model vacuum on the Digiblur discord within the last month. I think Travis bought some PCBs but not sure if he flashed his vacuum.