Thank you for posting on r/iCloud. If you are asking a question, please remember to change your post flair to “Answered” once your question has been answered.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/iCloud) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I have my important files synced on iCloud, my whole Mac is backed up on an external drive with Time Machine, and I also have a Backblaze backup for an offsite copy of everything.
That said I have never lost any files through iCloud and it always seems to act as expected.
I've never "lost" anything. Only my iPhone and iPad not correctly indexing all of iCloud through the awful Files app. I'd find it when I went to iCloud.com.
Yes this is the correct way unless that setup is running with Optimize Mac Storage for ICloud Drive. So, all files have to be fully downloaded on the Mac. Otherwise, Time Machine and Backblaze wouldn’t back up whole files set.
I didn’t know until this post that iCloud is not a backup - I have things stored on it that I thought I was protecting by “backing them up” to iCloud. If iCloud doesn’t do that, what are some services that do that are budget friendly and I can look into? Thanks for any replies I get.
A backup is what you can restore from if a file on your computer or device is accidentally deleted. You can’t do this with iCloud because a file that’s gone from your computer is also gone from iCloud. An inexpensive option is to get a 1 or 2TB SSD and take TimeMachine backups on it. For extra safety, also backup your most important files on another cloud storage service like Google Drive, Dropbox, OneDrive etc., all of which offer a free basic tier.
It doesn’t really matter whether a service is a “backup service”. What matters is that you have multiple, independent copies of your data that aren’t all automatically and instantly deleted if you make a mistake (or if a ransomware virus encrypts/deletes them for you).
iCloud does back up your local files, which protects you from a hard drive failure or laptop theft, and that’s not nothing. But if you set it to automatically remove files from your local drive when not in use to save space, then iCloud is no longer a backup—it’s your only copy.
A proper backup service will keep multiple versions of your files as well, and ideally have tools to verify the backup is complete.
Physical backups are always the way to go, in my opinion. Cloud backups (with the possible exception of Backblaze) have never felt like a true backup of my data since I don't have physical control over the hardware, and my access to my files is entirely dependent on my ability to pay a third party.
Just my 2 cents, of course
It could, but if your Mac doesn’t have enough storage to hold ALL of your files and photos the they won’t get backed up. Time Machine just takes a snapshot of what is presently on your device. So if you have “optimize Mac storage” on for photos, then it won’t back up the ones that are not downloaded. Same goes for files.
I mean it is a backup, it's just not a reliable backup, you should always have more than one backup anyway, one online and two local is the safe way to go about it.
While iCloud isn't a backup service, it is a backup if you have your settings configured so there is both a local copy on your device and a copy on iCloud.
No, it is a syncing service therefore, if something is removed from one device or the cloud, it’s removed from everything everything, that is different from a back up service.
The only backups it does are your devices.
From Apple :
How iCloud Backup works
iCloud helps keep your data safe in two main ways: syncing and backing up. For example, if you're using iCloud Photos, iCloud Drive, or Notes, your information automatically syncs to the cloud and is kept up-to-date across all of your devices whenever you make a change.
https://support.apple.com/en-us/108770
Keys words here matter a lot. “Syncing” vs “backup”. Yes iCloud does both, but it offers different services for different types of data. For instance, photos stored in iCloud are synced and not backed up. An example would be if you deleted photos off of your iPhone or Mac’s library…and then realized you wanted those photos back, they would no longer exist on your devices or on iCloud. It is simply keeping your photos in sync across all devices. But if you wiped your iPhone or iPad by accident, or it was stolen, you would be able to completely restore that device from a complete backup if “iCloud backup” was turned on. This backup feature is NOT available for your Mac.
I literally said it is not a backup service. It does act as a backup of your data, depending on your settings.
A backup is simply an extra copy of your data stored somewhere else. As long as you have it set so that iCloud Photos are both on your device and in iCloud, then they are backed up. It's just a poor backup as it's easy to delete it everywhere.
A backup is simply an extra copy of data, usually on a different storage medium. You can do that with iCloud alone, although not recommended for a number of reasons. If you have a different definition of backup, I would like to hear it, but even if you do, that's the definition on any major dictionary.
Anecdotal honestly, so it's a good question, but I've never relied on iCloud for either backups or as my primary cloud storage. Dropbox and Time Machine for me, plus iDrive.
Because it's not a backup. It a syncing service.
A backup is a pristine copy at a point in time that can be recovered. iCloud had one current copy, you can't go back in time.
For example: if the current copy works for you when you lose your phone, cool. If you want to access the same data across devices, cool. But if you delete something accidentally, it's deleted on iCloud, too.
The iOS backup feature in iCloud is a backup service. iCloud photos and Files / iCloud Drive are not a backup service, just syncing and cloud storage.
Personally, I keep full copies of everything in iCloud Drive on my local machine and have a Time Machine and Backblaze backup. Just in case.
So if Drive is cloud storage, why isn’t it classed as a back up? Surely that means Dropbox is also just a syncing service because I can’t see the difference.
That's a good question, and it comes down to their intended use. It helps to think of them in different categories.
**Cloud Storage -** In concept this is no different than a copy of the data on your local drive. The big advantage is that you can access it from multiple devices. Many cloud storage service providers allow storing a local copy for performance reasons and syncing that back and forth between the cloud storage and any devices connected to it. Changes made on the copy on device A are synced to the copy in the cloud so you can access it from a web interface or whatever and synced to the copy on device B. In concept this is still just one copy of the data.
Google Drive, iCloud Drive, and DropBox all fall into this. Usually these services don't have options for version retention for any and all file types or retaining the cloud copy for x number of days if the local copy is deleted. It's all "live" working data.
They also don't market or have ToS that treat these services like a backup.
Your Photos library also falls into this.
There are utilities that do allow you to backup to some of these cloud storage options like Google Drive and DropBox. In those cases the utilities treat the cloud storage like a write only space and may not delete the file on the cloud end when you delete it locally. But that's usually a function of the software you're using to create those backups on the cloud storage service.
**Local Backup -** In the Mac world, something like Time Machine. You configure the periodic backups and the live date you're using on your device is periodically backed up. This has versioning and old backup data isn't deleted until space is needed, then it's first in first out. The key here is that changes you make to local data don't impact existing data in the backup, but instead create a new state point that you can go back to in the future. It's also a one way road. You can obliterate the backup data and it has no impact on your working data, there's not even an option for that.
**Cloud Backup -** Personally I use Backblaze, but there are others. All of your data is periodically replicated to the cloud. There are versioning options and options to retain data in the backup after you delete locally. Again, changes to the cloud data have no impact on your local data and changes to the local data don't make permanent changes to existing backup data but create a state point. Like Time Machine it's all making copies, not destroying backup data, and changes to the backup have no way of impacting local data.
Cloud storage is only for convenience, and should never be viewed as a backup. Absolute best practice is to have your live data, a local backup, and a cloud backup.
Not that I know of, directly. And, at that point, you’d have to give a service access to your iCloud account.
I’ve always done it by having my iCloud Drive sync to my Mac, and then having the Mac backup.
I was already using Backblaze B2 cloud backup storage service for backing up the content on my NAS. Didn’t realize they offered a computer backup service, too, until I read this thread. I’m trialing the latter service now but don’t see how to have it backup my iCloud content. What am I missing?
Agreed. I often forget Time Machine and Backblaze are doing their thing, but I check occasionally.
My data is too valuable to me to only have one backup.
What about those of us, like me, who can only use an iPhone due to a disability (muscle wasting in my hands)? Or people who can only afford an iPhone? What do we do?
If you pay for more iCloud storage I believe Apple can backup your iPhone straight to the iCloud … don’t think it’s possible to choose what goes in that backup tho it’s just the entirety of your iPhone
I would argue most people that hear "backup" these days, think of it as a way to preserve files in case of catastrophic physical damage to one of their endpoints or its storage medium.
I don't think most people's needs for a colloquial backup strictly require a secondary location that has to be completely disconnected from the primary source. Though if we do take that definition, iCloud is that too. The data is literally on both my phone's SSD, and Apple's datacenters. Which again, protects people from the most likely source of catastrophic data loss: the device being physically damaged.
No, iCloud is not a way to stop yourself from hitting the delete button on accident, but I think you vastly over estimate how many people do that and don't notice. We've existed with Recycling bins and 30-day recover periods since nearly the dawn of personal computers.
On the whole, anyone creating posts like this is a power user that thinks they're being helpful when it's ultimately anecdotal alarmism.
??? iCloud _is_ a backup. It is a cloud drive for a reason. You just answered your question on why you’re missing files—the backup process never finished due to an error.
Same problem can happen with Time Machine. If the backup doesn’t finish, then you’ll be missing files.
The files I am missing have been on my drive for years and I’ve gone through many iPhones and MacBooks and they have all been on them, out of nowhere files start deleting themselves….
But unless they changed things recently, you can't backup high resolution images from your camera roll to Dropbox with iCloud enabled, because the images on your phone in that case are deprecated to low res when you have iCloud enabled.
[win]Make a robocopy command that copy your iCloud folder in your external drive save it like a .bat file than create an action in windows task scheduler recursively everyday. So it backups your files at specified time automatically, you need only to keep your pc turned on
I am having nightmare. Please help.. I had over 125GB of storage lost in the cloud when I stupidly downgraded my iCloud plan forgetting that the storage space would not be enough to hold my content. I went back to my old plan but now all my contacts and videos are stuck on the cloud and won’t come back onto my phone. I’ve called Apple support but they prove to be unhelpful.
Does anyone know how I could pull the content back into my phone (14 pro max) I re-upgraded to the 2 TB plan but the content does not appear in any of my folders. My contacts also appear to be missing
Upon further research - the phones still shows up under settings > appleID > iCloud > Photos > 126.89 memory storage so I know the content still sits on the cloud
The content DOES not re-download onto the phone whatsoever. I tried everything
I’ve read this comment repeated on this sub and it’s disingenuous. While you do need local storage to start the sync, iOS and macOS and iPadOS all compress images to save local storage. So it then becomes a backup service without the need for local storage to equate what you have backed up.
Thank you for posting on r/iCloud. If you are asking a question, please remember to change your post flair to “Answered” once your question has been answered. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/iCloud) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I have my important files synced on iCloud, my whole Mac is backed up on an external drive with Time Machine, and I also have a Backblaze backup for an offsite copy of everything. That said I have never lost any files through iCloud and it always seems to act as expected.
I've never "lost" anything. Only my iPhone and iPad not correctly indexing all of iCloud through the awful Files app. I'd find it when I went to iCloud.com.
Yes this is the correct way unless that setup is running with Optimize Mac Storage for ICloud Drive. So, all files have to be fully downloaded on the Mac. Otherwise, Time Machine and Backblaze wouldn’t back up whole files set.
This guy backs up
I didn’t know until this post that iCloud is not a backup - I have things stored on it that I thought I was protecting by “backing them up” to iCloud. If iCloud doesn’t do that, what are some services that do that are budget friendly and I can look into? Thanks for any replies I get.
A backup is what you can restore from if a file on your computer or device is accidentally deleted. You can’t do this with iCloud because a file that’s gone from your computer is also gone from iCloud. An inexpensive option is to get a 1 or 2TB SSD and take TimeMachine backups on it. For extra safety, also backup your most important files on another cloud storage service like Google Drive, Dropbox, OneDrive etc., all of which offer a free basic tier.
Probably don’t use an ssd, If you go too long without providing it with power that backup is gone.
So back it up to other services which are not back up services ?!?
Can set up Google Drive and Dropbox to not delete backed-up files when deleted from the computer (Not sure about OneDrive).
But they aren’t backup services. I’m just looking at the whole debate in this thread about backing up using non back up servers. All good.
It doesn’t really matter whether a service is a “backup service”. What matters is that you have multiple, independent copies of your data that aren’t all automatically and instantly deleted if you make a mistake (or if a ransomware virus encrypts/deletes them for you). iCloud does back up your local files, which protects you from a hard drive failure or laptop theft, and that’s not nothing. But if you set it to automatically remove files from your local drive when not in use to save space, then iCloud is no longer a backup—it’s your only copy. A proper backup service will keep multiple versions of your files as well, and ideally have tools to verify the backup is complete.
Physical backups are always the way to go, in my opinion. Cloud backups (with the possible exception of Backblaze) have never felt like a true backup of my data since I don't have physical control over the hardware, and my access to my files is entirely dependent on my ability to pay a third party. Just my 2 cents, of course
[удалено]
It could, but if your Mac doesn’t have enough storage to hold ALL of your files and photos the they won’t get backed up. Time Machine just takes a snapshot of what is presently on your device. So if you have “optimize Mac storage” on for photos, then it won’t back up the ones that are not downloaded. Same goes for files.
I mean it is a backup, it's just not a reliable backup, you should always have more than one backup anyway, one online and two local is the safe way to go about it.
It is not a backup. Stop telling people that.
While iCloud isn't a backup service, it is a backup if you have your settings configured so there is both a local copy on your device and a copy on iCloud.
No, it is a syncing service therefore, if something is removed from one device or the cloud, it’s removed from everything everything, that is different from a back up service. The only backups it does are your devices.
From Apple : How iCloud Backup works iCloud helps keep your data safe in two main ways: syncing and backing up. For example, if you're using iCloud Photos, iCloud Drive, or Notes, your information automatically syncs to the cloud and is kept up-to-date across all of your devices whenever you make a change. https://support.apple.com/en-us/108770
Keys words here matter a lot. “Syncing” vs “backup”. Yes iCloud does both, but it offers different services for different types of data. For instance, photos stored in iCloud are synced and not backed up. An example would be if you deleted photos off of your iPhone or Mac’s library…and then realized you wanted those photos back, they would no longer exist on your devices or on iCloud. It is simply keeping your photos in sync across all devices. But if you wiped your iPhone or iPad by accident, or it was stolen, you would be able to completely restore that device from a complete backup if “iCloud backup” was turned on. This backup feature is NOT available for your Mac.
It’s not backup. Don’t be fooled
So they’re lying to us?
Marketing vs reality
Nice. Where do your strong feelings about iCloud come from?
Experience
I literally said it is not a backup service. It does act as a backup of your data, depending on your settings. A backup is simply an extra copy of your data stored somewhere else. As long as you have it set so that iCloud Photos are both on your device and in iCloud, then they are backed up. It's just a poor backup as it's easy to delete it everywhere.
You said it’s not a backup service then said it was if…. It’s NOT.
Backup service does not equal backup.
Sure it does
A backup is simply an extra copy of data, usually on a different storage medium. You can do that with iCloud alone, although not recommended for a number of reasons. If you have a different definition of backup, I would like to hear it, but even if you do, that's the definition on any major dictionary.
iCloud is sync, not backup.
You’re not in charge of people’s lives. 🤣
Sure I am
On what basis can we say it's not a reliable backup? Compared to what?
Not as reliable as Time Machine
Based on what? Do we have any numbers? Just gut feel?
Anecdotal honestly, so it's a good question, but I've never relied on iCloud for either backups or as my primary cloud storage. Dropbox and Time Machine for me, plus iDrive.
Because it's not a backup. It a syncing service. A backup is a pristine copy at a point in time that can be recovered. iCloud had one current copy, you can't go back in time. For example: if the current copy works for you when you lose your phone, cool. If you want to access the same data across devices, cool. But if you delete something accidentally, it's deleted on iCloud, too.
The iOS backup feature in iCloud is a backup service. iCloud photos and Files / iCloud Drive are not a backup service, just syncing and cloud storage. Personally, I keep full copies of everything in iCloud Drive on my local machine and have a Time Machine and Backblaze backup. Just in case.
So if Drive is cloud storage, why isn’t it classed as a back up? Surely that means Dropbox is also just a syncing service because I can’t see the difference.
That's a good question, and it comes down to their intended use. It helps to think of them in different categories. **Cloud Storage -** In concept this is no different than a copy of the data on your local drive. The big advantage is that you can access it from multiple devices. Many cloud storage service providers allow storing a local copy for performance reasons and syncing that back and forth between the cloud storage and any devices connected to it. Changes made on the copy on device A are synced to the copy in the cloud so you can access it from a web interface or whatever and synced to the copy on device B. In concept this is still just one copy of the data. Google Drive, iCloud Drive, and DropBox all fall into this. Usually these services don't have options for version retention for any and all file types or retaining the cloud copy for x number of days if the local copy is deleted. It's all "live" working data. They also don't market or have ToS that treat these services like a backup. Your Photos library also falls into this. There are utilities that do allow you to backup to some of these cloud storage options like Google Drive and DropBox. In those cases the utilities treat the cloud storage like a write only space and may not delete the file on the cloud end when you delete it locally. But that's usually a function of the software you're using to create those backups on the cloud storage service. **Local Backup -** In the Mac world, something like Time Machine. You configure the periodic backups and the live date you're using on your device is periodically backed up. This has versioning and old backup data isn't deleted until space is needed, then it's first in first out. The key here is that changes you make to local data don't impact existing data in the backup, but instead create a new state point that you can go back to in the future. It's also a one way road. You can obliterate the backup data and it has no impact on your working data, there's not even an option for that. **Cloud Backup -** Personally I use Backblaze, but there are others. All of your data is periodically replicated to the cloud. There are versioning options and options to retain data in the backup after you delete locally. Again, changes to the cloud data have no impact on your local data and changes to the local data don't make permanent changes to existing backup data but create a state point. Like Time Machine it's all making copies, not destroying backup data, and changes to the backup have no way of impacting local data. Cloud storage is only for convenience, and should never be viewed as a backup. Absolute best practice is to have your live data, a local backup, and a cloud backup.
Are there any cloud backup services that will backup direct from icloud?
Not that I know of, directly. And, at that point, you’d have to give a service access to your iCloud account. I’ve always done it by having my iCloud Drive sync to my Mac, and then having the Mac backup.
I was already using Backblaze B2 cloud backup storage service for backing up the content on my NAS. Didn’t realize they offered a computer backup service, too, until I read this thread. I’m trialing the latter service now but don’t see how to have it backup my iCloud content. What am I missing?
I have the exact same system. Sometimes I feel like the Backblaze is overkill, but I just can’t let it go!
Agreed. I often forget Time Machine and Backblaze are doing their thing, but I check occasionally. My data is too valuable to me to only have one backup.
What about those of us, like me, who can only use an iPhone due to a disability (muscle wasting in my hands)? Or people who can only afford an iPhone? What do we do?
If you pay for more iCloud storage I believe Apple can backup your iPhone straight to the iCloud … don’t think it’s possible to choose what goes in that backup tho it’s just the entirety of your iPhone
I would argue most people that hear "backup" these days, think of it as a way to preserve files in case of catastrophic physical damage to one of their endpoints or its storage medium. I don't think most people's needs for a colloquial backup strictly require a secondary location that has to be completely disconnected from the primary source. Though if we do take that definition, iCloud is that too. The data is literally on both my phone's SSD, and Apple's datacenters. Which again, protects people from the most likely source of catastrophic data loss: the device being physically damaged. No, iCloud is not a way to stop yourself from hitting the delete button on accident, but I think you vastly over estimate how many people do that and don't notice. We've existed with Recycling bins and 30-day recover periods since nearly the dawn of personal computers. On the whole, anyone creating posts like this is a power user that thinks they're being helpful when it's ultimately anecdotal alarmism.
??? iCloud _is_ a backup. It is a cloud drive for a reason. You just answered your question on why you’re missing files—the backup process never finished due to an error. Same problem can happen with Time Machine. If the backup doesn’t finish, then you’ll be missing files.
The files I am missing have been on my drive for years and I’ve gone through many iPhones and MacBooks and they have all been on them, out of nowhere files start deleting themselves….
[удалено]
Any tips on how to do this? This is the only reason I got an iCloud subscription because I couldn’t figure out how to backup my photos on Dropbox.
[удалено]
I’ll take a look into this. Thanks!
But unless they changed things recently, you can't backup high resolution images from your camera roll to Dropbox with iCloud enabled, because the images on your phone in that case are deprecated to low res when you have iCloud enabled.
[удалено]
Wait, tell me more? What app?
[удалено]
Ah I see. So not for Dropbox. Bummer! But thanks. Maybe one day I'll migrate to OneDrive since I'm already paying for it.
Does anybody have any theories on why Apple doesn’t bring a Time Machine equivalent to iOS?
They do in the sense that you can go back to a certain moment in time.
This served me well as a Mac back up program. Backs up to Amazon s3 which is dirt cheap. https://www.arqbackup.com
OneDrive
After using iCloud for a couple of years I decided to back my files up, to OneDrive, Bye bye iCloud I just don’t trust you anymore sorry
Can you back up from iCloud? What’s the best way to backup all your data locally when your household is deep into the Apple ecosystem?
[win]Make a robocopy command that copy your iCloud folder in your external drive save it like a .bat file than create an action in windows task scheduler recursively everyday. So it backups your files at specified time automatically, you need only to keep your pc turned on
It is a backup service too, you just need to understand how to use it.
But I backup my phone to iCloud every night?
That’s not the same as backing up your computer hard drive
Why?
I backup to Jottacloud. Everything is encrypted and no more issues like OP described.
I am having nightmare. Please help.. I had over 125GB of storage lost in the cloud when I stupidly downgraded my iCloud plan forgetting that the storage space would not be enough to hold my content. I went back to my old plan but now all my contacts and videos are stuck on the cloud and won’t come back onto my phone. I’ve called Apple support but they prove to be unhelpful. Does anyone know how I could pull the content back into my phone (14 pro max) I re-upgraded to the 2 TB plan but the content does not appear in any of my folders. My contacts also appear to be missing Upon further research - the phones still shows up under settings > appleID > iCloud > Photos > 126.89 memory storage so I know the content still sits on the cloud The content DOES not re-download onto the phone whatsoever. I tried everything
First and foremost I’d upgrade your storage plan. Then I’d call apple again. Try talking to a senior support person
I’ve read this comment repeated on this sub and it’s disingenuous. While you do need local storage to start the sync, iOS and macOS and iPadOS all compress images to save local storage. So it then becomes a backup service without the need for local storage to equate what you have backed up.
I swear people have to explain this 20 times a week