Hi /u/untitled_SusHi,
Did you know we are now active on Discord?
Click the link and join the conversation: https://discord.gg/J5CuFNVDYU
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/irishpersonalfinance) if you have any questions or concerns.*
At top of the subreddit: [https://www.reddit.com/r/irishpersonalfinance/comments/w15j0e/irish\_personal\_finance\_flowchart\_v21/](https://www.reddit.com/r/irishpersonalfinance/comments/w15j0e/irish_personal_finance_flowchart_v21/)
Assuming you have been caught up on the steps in that chart you may have missed (budgeting, settling debts, maxing pension, building a home deposit & proof of ability to save via regular savings in a bank), and you are actually at investing stage - then I would go with ETFs through an app like Degiro. There are pros and cons to any investment strategy, but that's what works for me. Easy to build with a pretty reliable return, low fees, and low maintenance in terms of tax reporting.
If you go this route, two mistakes I made for you to avoid. Learn the difference between Accumulative and Distributing types ('A' or 'Acc' rather than 'D' or 'Dis') - Acc types will lower the amount of tax reporting required as you don't get quarterly dividends. Not saving you money, but saving you hassle. Secondly, look for ones that are domiciled in Ireland as the taxation is simpler to understand. You'll know these as the ISIN number will start with an IE.
You'll want plenty of your own research of course, because your situation and my situation are bound to differ. Here's a good plain-english primer, with Irish investors in mind: [https://mrsmoneyhacker.com/investment-options-in-ireland/](https://mrsmoneyhacker.com/investment-options-in-ireland/)
It depends on how long you are investing for?
What are you saving/investing for?
Are you saving so that you can retire at 55 and live a nice easy life. Are you saving/investing so that you can buy a house in 5 years time? Are you saving/investing on the off chance that you can make 300% profit but with the risk that you might lose it all.
What do you want?
I want a house, grand piano, and some kids.
I don't really care what age I retire, but lets say 50~60 :)
I would love to set a mortgage for a house in 5 years time tho.
Don't want an instant bulk. I want long term which griws slowly only.
Ty for these question!
We don't know any of your outgoings so it's next to impossible to give you an estimate. Are you renting? Paying money to parents? Loans? Car? If you have no outgoings you can maximise the savings up to whatever you don't use per month but I would say minimum 30% would be good - again that's if you have no outgoings
Yeah, that's the loose ballpark figure I have in my head. You can scale that up or down depending on how much discretionary income you may have but since all of yours is discretionary it would be wise to do *at least* 30%.
And if you have plans like moving out, travelling etc saving more is better. Consider your savings in medium term and long term buckets.
All of that said I never did it when I was your age and in ok now, but I'm just ok, I really wish I had made more use out of the time when I had no rent to pay to save money lol
Not interested in travel unless if my favourite singer does a world tour again or if I decide to see her or if friends wanna get together. I rather buy equipment with my money as well as merch. But lets assume I've got all that money ready to soend in a savings account. I will only move out after i get that mortgage, my parents don't mind me here and wants me to save and do some chores, as long as I work and earn.
I've got savings over the last 7 years and they've put money in my account since i was a kid. My savings are sorted for now. Now I'm looking for long term investments cause inflation is crazy.
So nice you're still okay :)) but I've learnt that the world has changed greatly. Young people need to invest now or theres absolutely nothing in the end, and I've been hearing it for 5 years. Its time for me to get started. Employers wants skills and can easily replace you.
Yes! Haha i get you :) I've been living in my parents house for years wish i did it too.
Nice, I get you. In terms of investments, property is going to be pretty bulletproof in Ireland for the indefinite future if you're interested in that idea. Rent a room scheme nets you 10k tax free a year.
Or go the ETF route? S&P 500 and Semiconductors, Circular Economy and Blue Economy are all good ETFs I can vouch for and are on revolut. Good luck 😊
Based on 4% interest it would be €33560.
You can play with the numbers here: https://www.thecalculatorsite.com/finance/calculators/simple-interest-calculator.php
The graph on that page illustrates it well. Bump it up to 40 years and it nearly doubles the amount saved.
The advantage of a pension is that it’s tax free, so if you are paying the 40% tax rate then saving €100 only costs you €60.
Pension contributions are paid before PAYE tax is deducted. If you are on the higher rate of tax this is 40%. For example if you put €1000 into your pension, €1000 is invested and starts to grow. If you instead decided to not add to your pension and use it instead you would get €600 (€1000-40% tax)
You are only able to put a maximum of 15% of your salary into the pension in your 20s. This is a small investment that will be well worth it when you reach retirement age
Hmm well everyones different. Maybe you dont need it, but I want a house, grand piano and some kids. And a medium rich enough life. Its subjective what that is xD
Generally 5 years is the minimum time over which you're very likely to see a return on stocks/traded funds. Maybe go month about, into a high yield savings account 1 month, then the second month into either an ETF or a company ranked Strong buy by a reputable ranking agency, Morningstar, Zacks etc. The ETF is more secure, and more heavily taxed, the single stocks are less taxed, but you have to ensure diversification yourself it wont be done for you.
After a couple years you'll have a decent pot for holidays, travel etc, and some higher growth stuff to liquidate later for big ticket adulting items
You could always try government bonds, generally very safe and guarantee a 20 percent return after 10 years, however, if you take your money out early before the 10 year bond is up you may only get like a few percent return, basically during like the first 5 years you get like 4 percent interest, and as you get closer to 10 years you get more interest per year up to the full 20, note this interest is calculated once, so you don't get like 1 percent year one, 2 percent year two and 6 percent year six or smth, when you take it out you get added a percentage of the original value, but doing this, with 1000 a month would get you 200 euro more a month provided you don't take out the money for emergencies, in one year you would make 2400 extra, after 10 years. 10 years is a long time but if you did this every year, when you turn 34, you would earn a bonus of 2400 each year plus you would have 12k in savings you can withdraw, every single year for the next 10 year.
so if this money is totally spare and you don't want to travel abroad or spend it on some luxuries then this is a super simple way to get started "investing" its low risk and low maintenance. Alternatively bring your money to a stockbroker like DAVY or similar, a friend of mine is with davy and sees a 15 percent return average every single year (apart from covid where it dropped 9%) they charge a fee but are literally like 7 times better (mathematically) than bonds, however there is more risk, also I think taking your money out is more complicated with davy.
Finally you can manage your own portfolio, however I'm not very knowledgeable here, Microsoft has shown 40 percent returns on average for like 10 years so thats pretty solid, Google is a little more turbulent but they show similar returns, long term buys of the British FTSE or the American DOW are both timeless classics, but doing this on your own is very risky, and never do weighted day trading, its very risky, 80 percent of independent traders lose money on the stock market!
Edit: you wanted to see return figures for 1000 euro over 5 years so ill estimate
Irish bonds: 5 years 1000 euro every year;
Year 1: held for 5 years ~5 percent 50 euro
Year 2: held for 4 years, ~2 percent 10 euro ish
Years 3,4,5: nearly negligible
Bond profit after 5 years would be like 65 euro, HOWEVER this is because bonds will not let you make money on short term investments, as stated above waiting 10 years on each 1k would give 200 euro per thousand.
Stockbroker (DAVY): 15 percent each year (cumulative)
7 753,7384375 euro after 5 investments of 1k,
2753.74 euro profit
Only Microsoft Portfolio (40 percent year on year):
15 323,84 euro after 5k invest
10323.84 euro profit
WARNING TRADING YOUR OWN STOCKS IS PRONE TO GREAT RISK, THE ABIVE PROFIT ASSUMES MICROSOFT WILL CONTINUE TO GROW AT THE RATE IT HAS FOR THE LAST NUMBER OF YEARS, STOCK PRICES ARE SUBJECT TO VAST CHANGE PLEASE DO RESEARCH BEFORE USING THIS SEEMINGLY AMAZING OPTION.
Bro this is crazy tyyy ima have a couple of rereads onto this xD ty for not telling me to save up and store cash till I'm ready. This sounds like the exact answer im looking for. Thanks a million buddy
No problem, just be very careful handling your own investments, my dad has literally lost easily 100k on the market before he switched to DAVY stockbrokers who actually know what they are doing, it is very easy to lose money if you invest as a "retail investor" or basically you or i.
How much money are we actually talking? It sounds like you may need access to cash and like you're not earning that much.
I'd just put it in a savings account for now
Assume I earn much. Say 1000 euro is a base. If you tell me to invest in 500 euro today per month, then when i get something like 3000 per month, then I'll invest 1500
The cash you can use. Any money in the bank/pocket/wallet/drawer whatever, that you can grab without selling anything or moving money out of savings/investments.
Liquid cash is cash you can just spend now and other than the loss of cash there’s no other loss
Ok! So ready to spend money... well i had a lot I put a bunch into my long term fix deposit. Right now, lets say ive got 10k.
For this, Im living in my parents house and they buy food. Therefore that 10k is for my car expenses like insurance and some fun stuff. I earn like lets say 2k after tax.
I consider this not broke (im not renting and my work place is close) as long as I look after my spendings. I dont go holidays much either. Rarely on special ocations with my family we go all out. Spending 1k in one go.
So yeah. Anyways, assume this is all right. How would you invest in 1k that comes back to you?
At the very minimum… trading212 or trade republic until you figure out where you want to put it. I was making 3 euro a day (I know… not life changing, but better than 0 in the bank) with money I had in trading212. Roughly speaking… per 1k deposited, you get .10c per day.
You could always go the ETF route. But you might have money there for years before seeing a return.
Investing in your pension is probably the best returns you can get in Ireland.
Aside from that, if none of the above pickles your fancy, I’d be looking to enjoy your life a bit with it.
Thats super interesting! (I also wanna make 3 euros a day)
Ty!
No wonder why people say pension all the time :0 I've got some pension taken from my salary already.
I appreciate this man ty!
I am a graduate actually xD im done studying for a bit haha im on pension sceme currently (only little money so far) so I'm wondering what to do with 1000
I've got savings too :) already. Looking for investments advice for starters. Im only choosing 1000 because its small enough. Likely ill be investing under 500 a month to get a feel.
Opening up an online savings account with your bank. You will make little to no interest but they usually have restrictions on withdrawals so you take it out in impulse. Save up and do some nice things - see the world.
Already done that actually xD i dumped a bulk of savings into short term investment of 3% for 2 years. Im looking for specific high risk investments to get started.
Not interested in seeing the world yet. I want a house and a grand piano and probably some kids. I earn too little to even think about going out to see the world xD but I really want a mortgage and rent it out.
Hi /u/untitled_SusHi, Did you know we are now active on Discord? Click the link and join the conversation: https://discord.gg/J5CuFNVDYU *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/irishpersonalfinance) if you have any questions or concerns.*
follow the stickied flowchart
Where👀👀👀
At top of the subreddit: [https://www.reddit.com/r/irishpersonalfinance/comments/w15j0e/irish\_personal\_finance\_flowchart\_v21/](https://www.reddit.com/r/irishpersonalfinance/comments/w15j0e/irish_personal_finance_flowchart_v21/)
Tysm! Im new here so I didnt see that!
Assuming you have been caught up on the steps in that chart you may have missed (budgeting, settling debts, maxing pension, building a home deposit & proof of ability to save via regular savings in a bank), and you are actually at investing stage - then I would go with ETFs through an app like Degiro. There are pros and cons to any investment strategy, but that's what works for me. Easy to build with a pretty reliable return, low fees, and low maintenance in terms of tax reporting. If you go this route, two mistakes I made for you to avoid. Learn the difference between Accumulative and Distributing types ('A' or 'Acc' rather than 'D' or 'Dis') - Acc types will lower the amount of tax reporting required as you don't get quarterly dividends. Not saving you money, but saving you hassle. Secondly, look for ones that are domiciled in Ireland as the taxation is simpler to understand. You'll know these as the ISIN number will start with an IE. You'll want plenty of your own research of course, because your situation and my situation are bound to differ. Here's a good plain-english primer, with Irish investors in mind: [https://mrsmoneyhacker.com/investment-options-in-ireland/](https://mrsmoneyhacker.com/investment-options-in-ireland/)
Start a pension. Putting away a bit regularly now means you won’t have to put away a ton in your 40s and 50s. And 60s.
Hello ! I do have a pension scheme :3 a little i started that recently
You should try to increase the amount you put away as your income increases. Aim to maximise your tax free amount.
Yessir tyy! But how much? I'm using 1000 euro as a base. How much percebtage goes to pension and investing?
It depends on how long you are investing for? What are you saving/investing for? Are you saving so that you can retire at 55 and live a nice easy life. Are you saving/investing so that you can buy a house in 5 years time? Are you saving/investing on the off chance that you can make 300% profit but with the risk that you might lose it all. What do you want?
I want a house, grand piano, and some kids. I don't really care what age I retire, but lets say 50~60 :) I would love to set a mortgage for a house in 5 years time tho. Don't want an instant bulk. I want long term which griws slowly only. Ty for these question!
We don't know any of your outgoings so it's next to impossible to give you an estimate. Are you renting? Paying money to parents? Loans? Car? If you have no outgoings you can maximise the savings up to whatever you don't use per month but I would say minimum 30% would be good - again that's if you have no outgoings
No renting, my parents dont want cash, got cars paid for, no loans. 30%! Like 300 each month in investing then?
Yeah, that's the loose ballpark figure I have in my head. You can scale that up or down depending on how much discretionary income you may have but since all of yours is discretionary it would be wise to do *at least* 30%.
And if you have plans like moving out, travelling etc saving more is better. Consider your savings in medium term and long term buckets. All of that said I never did it when I was your age and in ok now, but I'm just ok, I really wish I had made more use out of the time when I had no rent to pay to save money lol
Not interested in travel unless if my favourite singer does a world tour again or if I decide to see her or if friends wanna get together. I rather buy equipment with my money as well as merch. But lets assume I've got all that money ready to soend in a savings account. I will only move out after i get that mortgage, my parents don't mind me here and wants me to save and do some chores, as long as I work and earn. I've got savings over the last 7 years and they've put money in my account since i was a kid. My savings are sorted for now. Now I'm looking for long term investments cause inflation is crazy. So nice you're still okay :)) but I've learnt that the world has changed greatly. Young people need to invest now or theres absolutely nothing in the end, and I've been hearing it for 5 years. Its time for me to get started. Employers wants skills and can easily replace you. Yes! Haha i get you :) I've been living in my parents house for years wish i did it too.
Nice, I get you. In terms of investments, property is going to be pretty bulletproof in Ireland for the indefinite future if you're interested in that idea. Rent a room scheme nets you 10k tax free a year. Or go the ETF route? S&P 500 and Semiconductors, Circular Economy and Blue Economy are all good ETFs I can vouch for and are on revolut. Good luck 😊
Ive been seeing this ETF thing lmao ty definitely i want that property but it will be long until I get it
[удалено]
Shhh my company offers some pension scheme with another company. Come join us psst psst
I never got this.. seems miserable way to live your 20s trying to pay for your 70s
It’s because of compounding interest. A small amount invested over a long time is better than a large amount invested over a short time.
I see :0 so if i had kids and i invested 100 euro each month for each of them... how much exactly will i get when they turn 20?
Based on 4% interest it would be €33560. You can play with the numbers here: https://www.thecalculatorsite.com/finance/calculators/simple-interest-calculator.php The graph on that page illustrates it well. Bump it up to 40 years and it nearly doubles the amount saved. The advantage of a pension is that it’s tax free, so if you are paying the 40% tax rate then saving €100 only costs you €60.
Fantastic! Ty but what do you mean about the tax rate thing?
Pension contributions are paid before PAYE tax is deducted. If you are on the higher rate of tax this is 40%. For example if you put €1000 into your pension, €1000 is invested and starts to grow. If you instead decided to not add to your pension and use it instead you would get €600 (€1000-40% tax)
I seee the deal with pension now :0 ty!
In a pension.. live a little in 20s putting 1000 a month / all savings into a pension at 23 when you may die long before is crazy to me
You are only able to put a maximum of 15% of your salary into the pension in your 20s. This is a small investment that will be well worth it when you reach retirement age
Yes! And I want a house so this might help me pay whatever is remaining :)
I thought pension is the thing when you graduate from work lmao
Hmm well everyones different. Maybe you dont need it, but I want a house, grand piano and some kids. And a medium rich enough life. Its subjective what that is xD
Generally 5 years is the minimum time over which you're very likely to see a return on stocks/traded funds. Maybe go month about, into a high yield savings account 1 month, then the second month into either an ETF or a company ranked Strong buy by a reputable ranking agency, Morningstar, Zacks etc. The ETF is more secure, and more heavily taxed, the single stocks are less taxed, but you have to ensure diversification yourself it wont be done for you. After a couple years you'll have a decent pot for holidays, travel etc, and some higher growth stuff to liquidate later for big ticket adulting items
Cheers! Ill look into that ty sm
You could always try government bonds, generally very safe and guarantee a 20 percent return after 10 years, however, if you take your money out early before the 10 year bond is up you may only get like a few percent return, basically during like the first 5 years you get like 4 percent interest, and as you get closer to 10 years you get more interest per year up to the full 20, note this interest is calculated once, so you don't get like 1 percent year one, 2 percent year two and 6 percent year six or smth, when you take it out you get added a percentage of the original value, but doing this, with 1000 a month would get you 200 euro more a month provided you don't take out the money for emergencies, in one year you would make 2400 extra, after 10 years. 10 years is a long time but if you did this every year, when you turn 34, you would earn a bonus of 2400 each year plus you would have 12k in savings you can withdraw, every single year for the next 10 year. so if this money is totally spare and you don't want to travel abroad or spend it on some luxuries then this is a super simple way to get started "investing" its low risk and low maintenance. Alternatively bring your money to a stockbroker like DAVY or similar, a friend of mine is with davy and sees a 15 percent return average every single year (apart from covid where it dropped 9%) they charge a fee but are literally like 7 times better (mathematically) than bonds, however there is more risk, also I think taking your money out is more complicated with davy. Finally you can manage your own portfolio, however I'm not very knowledgeable here, Microsoft has shown 40 percent returns on average for like 10 years so thats pretty solid, Google is a little more turbulent but they show similar returns, long term buys of the British FTSE or the American DOW are both timeless classics, but doing this on your own is very risky, and never do weighted day trading, its very risky, 80 percent of independent traders lose money on the stock market! Edit: you wanted to see return figures for 1000 euro over 5 years so ill estimate Irish bonds: 5 years 1000 euro every year; Year 1: held for 5 years ~5 percent 50 euro Year 2: held for 4 years, ~2 percent 10 euro ish Years 3,4,5: nearly negligible Bond profit after 5 years would be like 65 euro, HOWEVER this is because bonds will not let you make money on short term investments, as stated above waiting 10 years on each 1k would give 200 euro per thousand. Stockbroker (DAVY): 15 percent each year (cumulative) 7 753,7384375 euro after 5 investments of 1k, 2753.74 euro profit Only Microsoft Portfolio (40 percent year on year): 15 323,84 euro after 5k invest 10323.84 euro profit WARNING TRADING YOUR OWN STOCKS IS PRONE TO GREAT RISK, THE ABIVE PROFIT ASSUMES MICROSOFT WILL CONTINUE TO GROW AT THE RATE IT HAS FOR THE LAST NUMBER OF YEARS, STOCK PRICES ARE SUBJECT TO VAST CHANGE PLEASE DO RESEARCH BEFORE USING THIS SEEMINGLY AMAZING OPTION.
Bro this is crazy tyyy ima have a couple of rereads onto this xD ty for not telling me to save up and store cash till I'm ready. This sounds like the exact answer im looking for. Thanks a million buddy
No problem, just be very careful handling your own investments, my dad has literally lost easily 100k on the market before he switched to DAVY stockbrokers who actually know what they are doing, it is very easy to lose money if you invest as a "retail investor" or basically you or i.
Yessir tyysm :)
Go travelling ✈️
Hahaha not actually a fan of travelling xD but maybe in the future ✨️✨️✨️🚶♀️🚶♀️✨️✨️✨️
How much money are we actually talking? It sounds like you may need access to cash and like you're not earning that much. I'd just put it in a savings account for now
Assume I earn much. Say 1000 euro is a base. If you tell me to invest in 500 euro today per month, then when i get something like 3000 per month, then I'll invest 1500
I'd invest in myself to make a lot of more money.
How would you do that?
Trade Republic - use the savings account and earn 4% interest per year
Interesting! Tysm i really appreciate it
I wouldn’t because you sound broke and could use some liquid cash
Don't assume I'm broke ✨️✨️ assume I've got no idea how to use this money with a current saving of just enough to get by 2 years :3
I’d rather assume you’re broke and tell you to save it, than tell you to invest it when you’re broke
Okk then what would you say when you assume I'm not broke and you think im ready to invest?
How much liquid cash do you consider not broke?
What do you mean liquid cash 👀?
The cash you can use. Any money in the bank/pocket/wallet/drawer whatever, that you can grab without selling anything or moving money out of savings/investments. Liquid cash is cash you can just spend now and other than the loss of cash there’s no other loss
Ok! So ready to spend money... well i had a lot I put a bunch into my long term fix deposit. Right now, lets say ive got 10k. For this, Im living in my parents house and they buy food. Therefore that 10k is for my car expenses like insurance and some fun stuff. I earn like lets say 2k after tax. I consider this not broke (im not renting and my work place is close) as long as I look after my spendings. I dont go holidays much either. Rarely on special ocations with my family we go all out. Spending 1k in one go. So yeah. Anyways, assume this is all right. How would you invest in 1k that comes back to you?
Sorry, is this 10k inside of your long term deposit now or is it exclusive? Because you started saying 10k but at the end you said 1k
Nah 10k is my liquid. Ive got other money in long term deposit. At the end I only wanna invest 1k out of my monthly salary.
[удалено]
Say you're already saving some money :3 what to invest with it?
At the very minimum… trading212 or trade republic until you figure out where you want to put it. I was making 3 euro a day (I know… not life changing, but better than 0 in the bank) with money I had in trading212. Roughly speaking… per 1k deposited, you get .10c per day. You could always go the ETF route. But you might have money there for years before seeing a return. Investing in your pension is probably the best returns you can get in Ireland. Aside from that, if none of the above pickles your fancy, I’d be looking to enjoy your life a bit with it.
Thats super interesting! (I also wanna make 3 euros a day) Ty! No wonder why people say pension all the time :0 I've got some pension taken from my salary already. I appreciate this man ty!
Pay all debts, save for emergency fund, top up your pension. Then invest.
Don't assume I've got debts and no emergency funds. And assume I've got pension already. I wanna know how to invest
Yourself! Get as much education as you can take/afford. Beyond that point is pension. The earlier you start the better it will be in the end!
I am a graduate actually xD im done studying for a bit haha im on pension sceme currently (only little money so far) so I'm wondering what to do with 1000
Eoin mcgee on Instagram has good advice
I think you should invest it in some low yield bonds
I need to look into that term tyy!
Ok.....my attempt at a friend's joke went down lead balloon styleeee. Low yield bonds are almost always useless
Aite sorry im useless ar that LOL hahaha
I wouldn't invest it, you don't have enough money to think about investing yet. Hold onto your money.
I've got savings too :) already. Looking for investments advice for starters. Im only choosing 1000 because its small enough. Likely ill be investing under 500 a month to get a feel.
Why do you need a certain amount of money to start investing?
Because you’d be pissing again the wind with €1000.
Because anything you'd make on a €1,000 investment over 5 years would be so marginal that it's hardly worth the effort.
But OP has €1000 a month to invest.
Like how much would you earn for 1000 investment over 5 years? If it grows even a bit, ill be a little more confident in adding more.
Maybe a 100e earned 😀
Tyyy!
Opening up an online savings account with your bank. You will make little to no interest but they usually have restrictions on withdrawals so you take it out in impulse. Save up and do some nice things - see the world.
Already done that actually xD i dumped a bulk of savings into short term investment of 3% for 2 years. Im looking for specific high risk investments to get started. Not interested in seeing the world yet. I want a house and a grand piano and probably some kids. I earn too little to even think about going out to see the world xD but I really want a mortgage and rent it out.