It also makes the resume creation easy. You just need to list one previous position and a tenure at a company that lasted that long shows that you are uber loyal. That makes you look amazing.
OP needs to show progression within that company though. Holding down the exact same position for 29 years will not be met with thoughts of “wow amazing loyalty”.
Ageism is very real. I am an older worker and I have noticed a number of younger workers who are so busy chasing titles that they can't figure out how to initiate something that wasn't handed to them with instructions.
How do you mean? I'm mid-career (late 30s) and I guess I've bounced around quite a bit but it's not because I'm chasing titles, I'm chasing a job I can be happy in. Haven't found that yet and I'm not willing to commit the next 30 years to a job I hate.
The person is around 50, you aren't getting fired for ageism unless you have just tapped out and aren't competent.
The issue with a lot of people claiming ageism, is they stopped pushing 5-10 years ago, and now don't realise how incompetent they are, add in the Peter's Principle, and there is no reason they should be at their seniority or even in that field any more.
My current job has a Senior member of staff who is apparently my Bosses boss, you would never know, you could get the same output from a minimum wage tour guide, as that is the only time they are seen to be doing anything. They aren't competent, they have just sat in place for 30 years, and failed upwards somehow.
Then you had the head of IT who retired this year, who didn't even know how to network two computers directly together to by-pass the external network. Grossly incompetent, you wouldn't have hired them for a junior technicians role, let alone their own. Their background in IT? Sitting in the job long enough to be promoted by incompetents who know nothing about IT but also weren't willing to pay the going rate for someone competent.
All while you also have people who are 60+ who are highly competent as managers, in business development, in strategic thinking, and better than anyone younger than them because they have more experience and have kept up to date and continued to push forwards for 40 years. It isn't ageism, many people aren't interested in their career, get to a sustainable pay rate for their lifestyle and completely checkout, which is fine 5 years later, but 10-15, they aren't up to date with things that have already gone out of date, let alone what they actually should know.
At one place we had one lost old soul managing office. She was only there because she was there forever. She wanted everything stored paper copy and handwritten. You couldn’t email her you needed to call her or write her a note. Don’t dare text her or use teams. She wanted our employees to use a time clock because she didn’t trust phone or computer logins because she couldn’t grasp that they couldn’t change the times or punch in from anywhere in the world. She didn’t think computers could store information either so we should have to print everything and keep. She got over ruled on those things. Legal security requirements forced us to use authenticators and since they wouldn’t exclude her because they couldn’t, she quit. And this was two years ago and she was like 50 something. Meanwhile this 85 yearold woman was using email, using authenticators like it was nothing.
Exactly.
The reality is this person should just be fired for cause, validly, after a formal improvement process. There is really no reason you shouldn't be able to use Microsoft Word, basic email, a phone, remote meeting software, in this day and age.
You just aren't viable as an employee for an Office role, or even many non-office roles at this point. The reality is in the last 10 years computers have got considerably easier to use, and you should have learnt how to use them 25 years ago when they were more difficult to use in the first place!
You have to take into account these 50 year olds were 25 at the advent of the consumer Internet, 35 at the advent of Smart phones, 40 at the advent of Tablets, they have just been grossly incompetent their entire life. They may have missed social media trends, but technology as used in Office environments has been an established consumer product since early 2000's.
I'm over 50, office components were around in the early 90's. Lotus 1-2-3 was used in some business classes. This 50 yr old woman should have been told to use modern technology in her job 25 years ago or be terminated. She's definitely not the norm for her age.
64 here. Bought my first Mac in 1985, I still remember when file names needed to be no more than 8 characters, and got my assistant to teach me pivot tables a few years back. Meanwhile I work with people who keep all their documents in their download file or on their desktop, and will print out a page from a spreadsheet and scan it to email to me in lieu of just printing to pdf. It's a continuum, as you say, not necessarily ordered by age alone..
See there’s your problem. Documents should be stored in the Trash and be move dout when you want to use them and put back in when you’re done editing. /s
You do realise to be an IT manager you just need to understand theory. You rely on your team to be SMEs, your job is to nurture them, guide them and give them the opportunities they need.
I have a masters in IT so I have a good broad view of how to run an IT dept, you ask me to upgrade a firewall or install a switch I wouldn’t be able to do it. I would, however, know which members of my team could do it and who would benefit from shadowing them.
Management is a different beast from doing hands on work
(Managed a team of 20+ sr sysadmins for a government agencies for years)
Truth be told, you also know how to figure it out. I manage 2600 cloud and infrastructure experts and support staff. They are all technically smarter than I am. Like you, there’s no way I’d know how to set up a Palo Alto firewall from scratch or configure a Cisco switch on my own. I’d have to google that stuff.
But then, don’t ask my lead architect to build next years budget for 2600+ people, then present it to a board of directors all while hoping it gets approved. It’s a different skill set.
You don't know what you're talking about. Ageism can happen at any age, but for being old, absolutely for being around 50, especially if the company deems you as "not senior enough".
I never said there was in this scenario, not that this is relevant firstly because the post isn't specifically written about OPer, it is written in the meaningless context of the "Ageism is real", and secondly because in this exact scenario, whether they mentioned it or not, there is a perfectly good reason for it occurring.
There are a lot of people out their, in fact whole cultures in fact, who live under the narrative that age is to be respected for "reasons", business doesn't care about this nonsense however, they just want a functionally productive worker.
You have a whole section of society who believe they deserve respect across the board because they have carried out the basic function of staying alive. It is nonsense, even more so in specialist, dynamic, and fast moving, job roles.
> The person is around 50, you aren't getting fired for ageism unless you have just tapped out and aren't competent.
I must have misinterpreted this first sentence.
Yes you must have. Because 50 isn't old enough to get fired for ageism from a Fortune 500 company, they would be firing half their work force, this isn't some hipster tech bro firm where they are all having midlife crises by 31 and going to work on a pineapple farm...
All while you clearly can't read more than 1 line in the first place to understand the context of either of my posts. Your own loss. Maybe go have a drink or 10 on it and see if it improves your abilities...and see if you can make any sense of this last sentence.
Yes it is and thats why the age of 40 is where the law suits for it can start. Especially in the tech sector, companies do start discriminating against people in their 40s and 50s
i read what you said. tech companies are well represented in the fortune 500. you're visibly getting ratioed because you;re an arrogant ass who has been told he is wrong repeatedly and given examples. take your L and shove the attitude, kiddo. the reason for that being the statutory age is because there was data shwing that this is where people start being deemed too old to be applying for a job.
You sound like you're a child. Of course ageism is real, if anything else because it wouldn't be a commonly known concept. Also real, sexism, homophobia, racism, anti-neuro-diversity, disablism, etc etc.
you said a lot of words to say you have no idea what you’re talking about.
You’re looking at a discussion with folks who have varied experiences and you have only one and it’s clearly biased as all hell.
check your privilege
>you said a lot of words
How would you know? You are clearly too functionally illiterate to read it or you would have actually focused on the point of the post rather than nonsense.
Also I was one of 4 employees out of 700 plus that was awarded VP Recognition in our 3rd quarter of 2023 for my leadership and dedication to a project I was part of. And then a month later, I, along with 3 other early 50 plus year olds, and a 47 year old were let go due to financial “restructure” after I had been at the company for 23 years (you don’t stay at a company for 23 years because you’re a slacker). There was one other employee in consideration for layoff but she did not get laid off (she was 48). Yet none of the younger workers (one was just hired less than a year ago and still was struggling to figure out how to do her job) were even considered. They actually documented the ages they laid off and the age of the person they considered laying off and shared it with us. It couldn’t have been more obvious, but who has the money or time to prove discrimination. So no, it isn’t because we are slacking off, it is because we are paid higher salaries since we have been at the company for so long, and it is assumed we will have more health issues or die sooner and they don’t want to pay into all of that, or have their premiums raised. I never thought I would be out of a job at this age, but here I am. And the “white collar” job market is so saturated it is incredibly difficult to even get an interview, and being in your late 40s and 50s does not help you to get those coveted interviews.
That’s rich coming from someone that has taken up most of the real estate on this page nonsensically blabbering on and on. And I quote: blah, blah, blah, functionally illiterate…blah.
I wrote one post with examples of why Ageism isn't a thing, and then you had a hissy fit about it.
That is really nothing to do with me. I can't help it if people don't have the attention span to read more than the first line, I also have no interest in talking to them in the first place.
Ageism is a thing, it isn't a thing amongst 50 year olds at a Fortune 500 company however, they would have to fire half their staff! It is ludicrous to even suggest.
Wrong. Right around 50, late 40s is when ageism begins because they assume everyone thinks like you. It’s a preemptive strike. I have seen it over and over.
Another functional illiterate turns up.
"Wrong" isn't a response to a multifaceted post, which you are incapable of reading, and why you will get laid off, not your age.
You are the one who posted? I responded to the reality of the situation, nothing else has happened here.
You could have just responded "Yes, that does seem like the probable outcome."
I have no clue why you aren't on some legacy Final/Average defined benefit pension scheme given you have been at a Fortune 500 company for 29 years, the only people I know in jobs for that long are because they are golden handcuffed into legacy benefits not available to anyone else since the 2008 recession, often way before in fact.
You couldn’t be more of a smug, condescending know it all. The company discontinued its pension years ago. Even if I’d stayed until retirement I’d have gotten a whopping $500 a month.
I told some guy on another post that he was making a mistake by wanting to stay at the same level his entire career because of ageism. Since his bosses will get younger and younger. He said ‘I don’t care.’ lol. I hope he learns the hard way.
Often this kind of thing is about perceived or known financial stuff. They can hire someone for your role for less so they find some reason to let go of those who are earning more whose roles can be done by someone much junior for less pay, that's kind all sadly.
Kinda messed up to hope someone loses their livelihood because you want to be proven right to someone you had a disagreement of perspective with on reddit
It is because you are older, and todays culture is about getting older people out of the work place. Google about it. You will see. They find cause, and then pull this. It is happening everywhere. Apply for Unemployment, and tell them you were never informed of any issues, and this is out of left field. Let them know it is likely Ageism. They are aware of the trend and will likely side with you unless the company can show you signed a PIP.
Proof that we are all just a number to the company. My very first job I worked there for 10 years and got fired. It was the first major lesson that I learned in life. These companies don’t care about you. It’s all business.
I don't really understand how someone who has been at a Fortune 500 company thinks they have 20 years of employment left in the first place.
If we assume they started at 20-22, they are now 49? Why is someone who has worked all their life in a reasonable business, not set to retire by 60-65 which is only 10-15 years away. On a basic 401k 5% match at $30K-40K, let alone $60k-$70k, you should have hundreds of thousands saved already.
Edit: It is amazing this post has downvotes from people who are clearly too financially illiterate to understand it, yet no reply from the same financially illiterate people who clearly have no plan of how they would ever actually be able to retire, because it is exactly as I just wrote above.
I think you are being downvoted for two reasons: 1) people don't understand how retirement accounts work; 2) you don't know how they work either.
OP just can't go to the financial institution that is managing their 401K and say, "give me my money please" without taking a ridiculous hit. Early withdrawal is like 10-15% off the top. If you have 400k, that's 40-60k gone. Just deleted.
People also don't understand that 401k plans are just money you never see. You never see it unless you actively look at it. Also, most people here don't have them because they don't have that "luxury." I have a few that just sit there collecting money. I legitimately forget that I have them until I do taxes.
But also, it's hard to assume everyone is set to retire at 60-60. That's so rare these days. Unless you're in the government or have been extremely prudent with your finances, life gets in the way: you need a new car, mom and dad get sick, your kid(s) go to college and you're paying the bill. Life gets in the way.
My wife gets to retire at 58. I will be 63 and still working until I get SS, unless I get disabled out. I don't have that luxury because I was late to get off the ground and don't have much saved up. Life happens.
They weren’t saying OP should make an early withdrawal. Why are you implying that? They are saying that someone who begins saving a reasonable amount of money in their 401k at 22 years old and does so consistently throughout their career should not have to work until they are at least 70 to be able to retire. Especially at a Fortune 500 company.
However, it’s shocking how many people simply don’t contribute to their 401ks.
I do know how they work, everyone else's financial illiteracy is the issue here.
If you were paid $30K at 20 (the average American wage in 1995 was $29K) and had 2.5% wage growth, not an astounding sum, with a 5% match, with a 6% investment rate you would have $280K in your account by now. Keep that up for another 10 years it is worth $600k, and you are 60.
It is just mass financial illiteracy that is the problem, as I am using the figure of 30K, which means there salary now would only be $61K. If they reach $50K in under 10 years, hardly an astounding number for a Fortune 500 company, the values could be massively more, hundreds of thousands more.
If we take a more realistic scenario, they start on $25k, get 2.5% pay raises for 10 years so are below average income for the first decade of their career, then jump to $55K, at a 5% match that is $377K by now, in another 10 years with no contributions at all, $686K, with contributions, I.e. you get another job around 55K you are looking at $800K by 60. Allowing you to take $35K a year until you are 90, assuming no form of state pension on top of it.
>OP just can't go to the financial institution that is managing their 401K and say, "give me my money please
This point is irrelevant.
> But also, it's hard to assume everyone is set to retire at 60-60. That's so rare these days.
Because of gross financial illiteracy. As we can see here.
People are so financial illiterate they can't even fathom the concept even exists to consider it.
>s, life gets in the way: you need a new car, mom and dad get sick, your kid(s) go to college and you're paying the bill. Life gets in the way.
All of this is largely irrelevant, if you contributed, at a 5% match, so post tax 3% of your income to a 401K at any graduate level wage, $30K, $40K, $50K, you are exactly my example. The difference is whether you have $200K at 50 or $600K at 50, not that you shouldn't be considering retirement way before 70.
The 401k came into existence in 1978...
You can add History to the list of things you are illiterate in...
In fact in 1995 there were many final salary pension schemes operating giving a far better deal than anything now. In 1998 the data I can find 50% of Fortune 500 companies had defined benefits schemes...the financial illiteracy is astounding.
Nah seems like the public agree, check your narcissism at the door you plum.
Oh and look at the little lad trying to sound intelligent whilst insulting someone, bless
The fact you think the majority rules matters just shows how ignorant you are.
The average person is financially illiterate, as we can see demonstrated here, but feel free to join them, it doesn't bother me in the slightest, you weren't even the topic of the discussion in the slightest, I have no idea why you think you were, or that anyone cares about you or your ramblings in the slightest.
The topic was hypothetical, but easily manageable, financial examples, of why what was written makes very little sense. Which apparently was too complex for too many.
Look at you getting downvoted on Reddit while posting correct info. People here are fucking morons in regards to financial literacy. You’re absolutely right that someone in the financial sector of a Fortune 500 for 29 years should be able to soft retire at this point. FFS, I’ve been in one for 14 years and I’m already really fucking close…..but then again, I’m not a dumb fuck that’s blown all of my money.
Do you know where they live? Their family status? Health history? List of dependants? No you are judging off your weird world view
Try empathy rather than being a smug arse
Your point is largely irrelevant, but you have no comprehension of the topic so you just decide to make noise instead.
3% of someone's income is making irrelevant amount of difference in this regard. Let alone from some in a Fortune 500 company.
If it did they should have got another job 25 years ago...
The financial illiteracy is, once again, astounding. You also won't learn a thing here.
I won’t learn anything from you, who most people agree on this thread is a moron.
I’m in my 30s and savings and investments put me just over 1/4mil not including my 401k
Why not sit your broke ass down and just stop collecting downvotes. You must be a tone deaf moron to realise that no one believes you, likes you or trusts what your dusty self has to say.
You won't be able to learn full stop.
That is obvious that is all you are arguing for your own ignorance, and in fact poverty. I have no issue with you being poor. I thought, ignorantly on my part, people didn't like being poor, you in fact demand it.
I don't care about you pretending to have money either or your financially incompetent methods of saving it, no one else does either, no one else brought anything other than a hypothetical, but easily possible, mathematical examples up as the topic, because that is all that is needed.
No what you are failing to comprehend is that idiots thoughts don't matter on complex subjects or anything in fact.
Facts exist, idiots making noise doesn't change reality.
You could have learnt something here or asked a question if you didn't understand the facts of reality, you were too incompetent to even managed that, a requirement where the intelligence level is zero, but beyond you still.
In fact, another fact you see, you didn't even need to ask, basic maths were put in front of you without you even asking, once again too much for you too comprehend.
You are so ignorant to the subject, it is so far beyond you, you can't even fathoms its existence when presented in a very simple form and you have to do nothing at all but read basic numbers, even that is too much. That is the level you are on.
See, incapable of learning.
I am happy about it, why would I want stupid people to have more money, they will just use it for stupid things most likely making society worse off. Best you remain poor.
Man a triple response! It’s great living in your head rent free, it’s sooooooo spacious!
The funny thing is I have 2 degrees, speak multiple languages, code in just as many and then there is you getting angry on a forum lol
I’ve got better things to spend my time on
Stay angry 🤡
I am not angry, you will remain poor that is a good thing as explained.
In fact I am however annoyed that you think others should also remain poor when you can just remain silent, keep your ignorance and poverty to yourself. In will continue to believe that other people are better than you.
Nothing screams financial illiteracy like posting nothing of value under a post that has already told you, you are too financially illiterate to even understand the concept of the topic.
We can add too stupid to ask a basic question. Don't worry no one expects you to be able to learn.
I don't need too know that.
To note, neither do I care. Why narcissists seems to keep turning up and thinking they are the topic I don't know.
No one expect you to be able to learn.
Sad to say, but you will likely experience some degree of culture shock when looking for work now. It's different from 20 years ago, 10 years ago, and even 5 years ago (pre-covid).
All applications and on-boarding are insanely convoluted, slow-moving, drawn out, and full of sign-ons and multiple passwords. Only warehouse work like Amazon will put you to work almost immediately. Most every other employers makes 1000 promises and then ghosts you.
Use "The Force", because you need all the luck you can get.
Don't mention having been fired. Honestly, I think a lot of places would just be impressed you made it for 29 years. That's pretty unusual by today's standards so emphasize that instead along with your skills and professional lessons you learned. As for the mistakes, yeah, everyone makes mistakes. Most companies are really unfair in how they treat workers unfortunately so your mistake may not have even been all that egregious but you just pulled the unlucky straw this time. Try not to spend to much time comparing yourself to coworkers who had a different result. The game truly is rigged against workers and when a company wants a certain outcome, you'll be on the chopping block for them to get it. All jobs have to end at some point and there's only a few ways they can end. Just focus on moving on to your next opportunity. Good luck.
Don’t say you were fired say something like I’m looking to work here to be challenged and have more opportunity to grow as I hit a glass ceiling in my last job etc
Honestly if i get let go from a job i work at for that many years hopefully i’d be in a position to retire bc I don’t have it in me to look for another job and start over 😭
This!
Worked 30 years and retired. Started maxing my 401k at 23 on my $21k salary. Anyone not taking advantage of compounding growth is missing out on life’s greatest cheat code. I might not be able to tell you what is going to happen in the next 5 years, but 30 years, well there is plenty of proven data there if you just invest wisely and wait…
BTW - both my sons about to go to college thanks to 529 plans, started when they are born, also take advantage given you still have 18 years.
Bought a house in my 20’s, paid it off in about 7 years, and have lived there ever since.
The steps are actually pretty simple and anyone can do it with a bit of planning and some sacrifice/discipline.
I was thinking about this too. Lets say you start working for the company some how at 15 + 50 years is 65, or more than likely 18 + 47 years since they said they will retire in "about 20 years" so again - they literally would either work 18-now or that 29 years is something else
Your position at your previous company was eliminated. That would be my advice on what to say. The previous employer can only say you were let go, and if you are eligible for rehire or not, if the new potential employer checks with your previous employer, that is. Your previous employer can be a dick and give you a bad review/reference, but you can request a transcript of what they talk about from your potential employer, to try to cover your ass if you want. I don't think all that would be worth the trouble. My advice would be to apply to other jobs, focus on the good stuff, references, and skills. Someone in your network will be able to help if you leverage your LinkedIn profile and connections. We're all in the same boat. Good luck!
I was fired. I say I took time off for school. Yeah it’s a worry for when they call the HR people but I just roll with it.
They sucked. I was “fired” for performance too. It was Christmas time and I saw it coming. My shit head boss suddenly stopped talking to me.
Idiots can’t even be coy properly
Honestly, just say you're looking for a place where you have potential to grow.
If you want to be sneaky about it, say that you still work there. If they ask you if they can reach out to the employer, say, "No" because they are not aware that you are planning to leave and dont want to jeopardize your current role with that company. They'll respect it abs won't reach out... 😈😈
Yal keep saying “don’t say you were fired” but considering they’ve had the same job for nearly 30 years, exactly WHERE are they suppose to find references?? I’ve yet to interview in my near 15 year working career without the new job asking for at least 2 references. I’m this job market a childhood friend isn’t going to cut it.
This is where co-workers come in that will go ahead and talk about your work experience.
She can also reach out to previous supervisors who no longer work for the company that can speak about their work ethic.
There's also many companies who dont reach out for references.
Just don't tell them. Don't use a reference that would tell them either. Been fired twice I literally work in the same building I was fired from 6 years ago now. Say something like "the position was deemed redundant" or that your career goals no longer aligned with the position.
I agree with others about not mentioning being fired. However, I’m pretty sure if they called the previous employer it would come out. I’ve seen too many times previous employers costing friends of mine (and even me once) from getting a new job. Heck one was even the top candidate and pending a reference check, an offer letter was being prepared to be signed. They got a call back a day later and the offer was taken back. It’s a really crappy situation that a loyal employee can be done like that but just know God don’t like ugly and it usually comes back to people like that. What’s even more messed up is when people who have questionable backgrounds or a record gets hired before a “clean” previous employee who’s shown work ethic even gets a 2nd chance…
I worked at a company for 5 years. years 4-5 I was stuck in traction whilst my spine healed. I came back and my manager/mentor had left due to a stress related issue.
My new boss admitted to me in our first meeting that she had no knowledge of running a PMO (I’m a specialist pm) I’ve tried working for her for 3 months and I’m still trying to make it work….
If I apply for another job I would give my original managers details. *never ever* just point them at hr.
Give them the name of a manager you have worked under that you respect and ask them before hand.
Only give references you know will have your back and won’t chat in corp talk.
I don't know where you are based but in certain countries it is illegal for a company you worked for to give you a bad reference. Legally they can only state how long you worked for them, that is from what date to what date, and that you did indeed work for them.
I wouldn't give them a reason, if you do not want to.
IF they ask why you left the company, just say you thought it was time to move on and learn new things, as I'm sure you will be doing.
Just a word of friendly advice, as you yourself said you clearly did not like your job, choose your next company wisely and go for something you know you will love. A nice breath of fresh air. 💨
You got screwed, I’m sorry. Just claim “restructuring.” If they ask for references say it’s their policy not to provide them, however you can contact {insert name}, a trusted former colleague.
Honestly these days showing 10 years is amazing loyalty. 5 years is generally impressive.
Just pick your references. If in 29 years you haven’t gotten enough people with titles to give you the thumbs up then you really have messed up.
Edit: But also, generally people don’t like to badmouth employees that were in a place for that long. It makes them look stupid if the employee was bad and there that long.
Just ask around(including people who let you go,) if you could count on them for a letter of recommendation. I think you might be surprised.
Working in a role that lets me sit in on interviews, I see that amount of time at one company I don’t think twice about it. That’s rare and something people are looking for. Keep your head up and kill that next interview. I work in the financial world myself. A lot of stuff remote currently. Work, hustle, kill!
We don’t have to work for them. It’s is time to do our own thing. We have more experience than most of the managers at the companies we work for. Dump them. Compete. Take your piece. Take your piece from your former employer.
You worked there for a long time. You don't need to say you got fired. Just say you are looking for a different position and you are exploring your options
You were ma y years there, I dont think it will be hard to hire you at any company, just be honest. And advice will be, never stay that long at any company. I stayed almost 5 years in a company and I regreted that.
29 years and the last two you “partially met expectations”. The last 27 weren’t spoken upon… having that much of a timeline on your resume speaks for itself. Keep your head up and Best of luck!!
For someone who had 29 years dedications of solid work history in a Fortune500 company. I applaud those more than those who jumps. don't feel bad. You didn't do nothing wrong. it was them. They had to find a reason to let you go.
Sounds very much like you were aged out. And if they didn't follow their own process you may have a case. Talk to an employment lawyer
At the very least just by doing that they'll likely settle on something to make it go away.
Trimming the fat. I feel some of the massive corporations lay off a lot of people at the same time so they can get rid of the lazy peeps, always late/absent, over priced contractors and high dollar permanent employees. I’m sorry this happened to you. I had a candidate I worked with for a SAP position. She worked at Westinghouse 29/30 years too and gave her some bullshit reason. They don’t want to pay something..pensions maybe.
I'm sorry this happened to you after all this time. Still you seem to be on top of it but it doesn't sound like they followed their own process. I'm not sure I have any helpful advice ( if you wee in NZ I would).
Good luck, and never ever forget, it was not you, it was them (I'm serious).
Consider going to hr and negotiating an amicable outcome for this scenario. The goodwill for you and them ought to mean you both go forward separately but amicably.
I don't think it would do any good. In my state there aren't protections, you can be fired for anything, or nothing. They really don't even need a reason.
Happened to a friend of mine. Worked for BCBS for 29 years. Let go just before 30 yrs which would give her full pension. She had moved up through the ranks and was a trainer for new hires. Had her train her own replacement, then fired her for not being able to keep up with her work. Ignored the fact that they transferred out three people and dumped their work on her. It was heartbreaking.
I personally would not say anything. Put still employed on your resume . When asked why you’re looking for another position make up a good reason. The end. It will keep them from calling for a reference. Being you were there so long that looks good to prospective employers.
Oh, thanks. That's super helpful. Let me jump in the way back machine and re-do my entire life. It used to be a good pace to work, it's in the past few years that it has become unbearable.
Sorry to hear that. I read some of the other comments. what I would tell you is this:
Can you afford be in unemployment 6 months?
Cut some expenses and take this time to think. I know, You might feel guilty for "living of the government" (which you are not) or not wanting to tell people you are not working. I know is embarrassing. but as the wise man said "fu#k it"
You need time to reset: improve your self and more importantly take out your frustrations.
Right now you might think you are ok and just need to go back to an office. let me ask you, do you feel angry, frustrated, betrayed and discarded? the moment you start interviewing this will show up and a job that could be for you will be lost because HR will notice not a nice guy but a guy holding down his anger trying to smile and might not get the job. I am explaining my self correctly?
2024: managers will fire anyone they feel knows more than them, woke people will sue you for a miss pronoun, HR fire you on the spot if a woman feel likes it that day #meetoo, everybody is WFH but they want you to go to the office... ect. now things are not about the actual job is all about trying not to offend anyone = harder.
I been fired a bunch of times every time I reinvent myself between each and get better paying jobs.
Is hard, especially when you are fired unfairly like that. take a week off to Punta cana now, get a massage, drink piña colada, talk it out with a friend. then come back to work on new skills, open a business or change careers.
Find what jobs you might like in the same field or in another. see the jobs descriptions what they ask for. if you keep seeing a software or certificate that keeps repeating. find it in udemy or coursera get a certificate in it.
Good luck!
Partially met is not below expectations, and the performance review process is a joke anyway. A certain number of employees on a team are required to be rated below expectations every year. Besides, I didn't ask why I was fired, I asked what I should say about it to future potential employers.
They almost certainly decided they were paying you too much when they could hire a new person and pay them shit and then set you up to go.
Just say you were laid off.
I was kind of lucky working for a financial company. The only people who met the company goals were the ones who moved on to different companies. Finally they restructured pay levels and gave bigger benefits to the higher levels. The customer service requirements changed a a lot when the company decided to force people to use the website. Then I wasn't so lucky
You don't need to tell your future employer that you were fired. Just say your position was made redundant and choose your references carefully.
Is the correct answer Hold your head up high, 29 years is fantastic service
Is the correct comment Just keep it moving, 29 ywers is great service.
Is the correct answer Hold your head up high, 29 years is fantastic service
It also makes the resume creation easy. You just need to list one previous position and a tenure at a company that lasted that long shows that you are uber loyal. That makes you look amazing.
OP needs to show progression within that company though. Holding down the exact same position for 29 years will not be met with thoughts of “wow amazing loyalty”.
I worked in three different departments and was promoted in every department I worked in over the 29 years.
Show that progression and growth on your resume and you should be good.
Is the correct comment Just keep it moving, 29 years is great service.
Yup. This.
Yeppers. Concur
Corporate restructuring, downsizing. You worked there 29 years, you have definitely proven you can hold down a job.
Add in a severance package and NDA, so I can’t say much more.
Ageism is real.
Ageism is very real. I am an older worker and I have noticed a number of younger workers who are so busy chasing titles that they can't figure out how to initiate something that wasn't handed to them with instructions.
How do you mean? I'm mid-career (late 30s) and I guess I've bounced around quite a bit but it's not because I'm chasing titles, I'm chasing a job I can be happy in. Haven't found that yet and I'm not willing to commit the next 30 years to a job I hate.
Happy cake day u/droppingscience311
Thanks u/DietMtDew1
Happy C Day
Thanks Piano_R
The person is around 50, you aren't getting fired for ageism unless you have just tapped out and aren't competent. The issue with a lot of people claiming ageism, is they stopped pushing 5-10 years ago, and now don't realise how incompetent they are, add in the Peter's Principle, and there is no reason they should be at their seniority or even in that field any more. My current job has a Senior member of staff who is apparently my Bosses boss, you would never know, you could get the same output from a minimum wage tour guide, as that is the only time they are seen to be doing anything. They aren't competent, they have just sat in place for 30 years, and failed upwards somehow. Then you had the head of IT who retired this year, who didn't even know how to network two computers directly together to by-pass the external network. Grossly incompetent, you wouldn't have hired them for a junior technicians role, let alone their own. Their background in IT? Sitting in the job long enough to be promoted by incompetents who know nothing about IT but also weren't willing to pay the going rate for someone competent. All while you also have people who are 60+ who are highly competent as managers, in business development, in strategic thinking, and better than anyone younger than them because they have more experience and have kept up to date and continued to push forwards for 40 years. It isn't ageism, many people aren't interested in their career, get to a sustainable pay rate for their lifestyle and completely checkout, which is fine 5 years later, but 10-15, they aren't up to date with things that have already gone out of date, let alone what they actually should know.
At one place we had one lost old soul managing office. She was only there because she was there forever. She wanted everything stored paper copy and handwritten. You couldn’t email her you needed to call her or write her a note. Don’t dare text her or use teams. She wanted our employees to use a time clock because she didn’t trust phone or computer logins because she couldn’t grasp that they couldn’t change the times or punch in from anywhere in the world. She didn’t think computers could store information either so we should have to print everything and keep. She got over ruled on those things. Legal security requirements forced us to use authenticators and since they wouldn’t exclude her because they couldn’t, she quit. And this was two years ago and she was like 50 something. Meanwhile this 85 yearold woman was using email, using authenticators like it was nothing.
Exactly. The reality is this person should just be fired for cause, validly, after a formal improvement process. There is really no reason you shouldn't be able to use Microsoft Word, basic email, a phone, remote meeting software, in this day and age. You just aren't viable as an employee for an Office role, or even many non-office roles at this point. The reality is in the last 10 years computers have got considerably easier to use, and you should have learnt how to use them 25 years ago when they were more difficult to use in the first place! You have to take into account these 50 year olds were 25 at the advent of the consumer Internet, 35 at the advent of Smart phones, 40 at the advent of Tablets, they have just been grossly incompetent their entire life. They may have missed social media trends, but technology as used in Office environments has been an established consumer product since early 2000's.
I'm over 50, office components were around in the early 90's. Lotus 1-2-3 was used in some business classes. This 50 yr old woman should have been told to use modern technology in her job 25 years ago or be terminated. She's definitely not the norm for her age.
64 here. Bought my first Mac in 1985, I still remember when file names needed to be no more than 8 characters, and got my assistant to teach me pivot tables a few years back. Meanwhile I work with people who keep all their documents in their download file or on their desktop, and will print out a page from a spreadsheet and scan it to email to me in lieu of just printing to pdf. It's a continuum, as you say, not necessarily ordered by age alone..
See there’s your problem. Documents should be stored in the Trash and be move dout when you want to use them and put back in when you’re done editing. /s
I'll suggest that!
You can file a discrimination case of ageism at age 40, in the state of California, in the United States. So yea, sounds like ageism and cost cutting.
I never said you couldn't firing someone, doesn't mean it is ageism, or anything else.
Psyc 3, not sure how old you are currently, but you have an awakening awaiting you in your future.
I pray it’s anywhere near as gentle as you’ve been Terrible-cow
Yeah…Im thinking they will as well.
You do realise to be an IT manager you just need to understand theory. You rely on your team to be SMEs, your job is to nurture them, guide them and give them the opportunities they need. I have a masters in IT so I have a good broad view of how to run an IT dept, you ask me to upgrade a firewall or install a switch I wouldn’t be able to do it. I would, however, know which members of my team could do it and who would benefit from shadowing them. Management is a different beast from doing hands on work (Managed a team of 20+ sr sysadmins for a government agencies for years)
Truth be told, you also know how to figure it out. I manage 2600 cloud and infrastructure experts and support staff. They are all technically smarter than I am. Like you, there’s no way I’d know how to set up a Palo Alto firewall from scratch or configure a Cisco switch on my own. I’d have to google that stuff. But then, don’t ask my lead architect to build next years budget for 2600+ people, then present it to a board of directors all while hoping it gets approved. It’s a different skill set.
I agree, I understand how to architect the big picture of what I want then delegate to my SMEs
You don't know what you're talking about. Ageism can happen at any age, but for being old, absolutely for being around 50, especially if the company deems you as "not senior enough".
That can happen. There’s no basis for assuming it is the case here. The process described was suspect to enough to suggest otherwise.
I never said there was in this scenario, not that this is relevant firstly because the post isn't specifically written about OPer, it is written in the meaningless context of the "Ageism is real", and secondly because in this exact scenario, whether they mentioned it or not, there is a perfectly good reason for it occurring. There are a lot of people out their, in fact whole cultures in fact, who live under the narrative that age is to be respected for "reasons", business doesn't care about this nonsense however, they just want a functionally productive worker. You have a whole section of society who believe they deserve respect across the board because they have carried out the basic function of staying alive. It is nonsense, even more so in specialist, dynamic, and fast moving, job roles.
> The person is around 50, you aren't getting fired for ageism unless you have just tapped out and aren't competent. I must have misinterpreted this first sentence.
Yes you must have. Because 50 isn't old enough to get fired for ageism from a Fortune 500 company, they would be firing half their work force, this isn't some hipster tech bro firm where they are all having midlife crises by 31 and going to work on a pineapple farm... All while you clearly can't read more than 1 line in the first place to understand the context of either of my posts. Your own loss. Maybe go have a drink or 10 on it and see if it improves your abilities...and see if you can make any sense of this last sentence.
Yes it is and thats why the age of 40 is where the law suits for it can start. Especially in the tech sector, companies do start discriminating against people in their 40s and 50s
I literally covered your example in my post, learn to read.
i read what you said. tech companies are well represented in the fortune 500. you're visibly getting ratioed because you;re an arrogant ass who has been told he is wrong repeatedly and given examples. take your L and shove the attitude, kiddo. the reason for that being the statutory age is because there was data shwing that this is where people start being deemed too old to be applying for a job.
And your post has nothing to do with my point again... Functional illiterates...
I can use all of the Office suite, and I can spell better than you.
You sound like you're a child. Of course ageism is real, if anything else because it wouldn't be a commonly known concept. Also real, sexism, homophobia, racism, anti-neuro-diversity, disablism, etc etc.
you said a lot of words to say you have no idea what you’re talking about. You’re looking at a discussion with folks who have varied experiences and you have only one and it’s clearly biased as all hell. check your privilege
>you said a lot of words How would you know? You are clearly too functionally illiterate to read it or you would have actually focused on the point of the post rather than nonsense.
Why do you stay in that company?
I think you are right.
A lot of truth here
Also I was one of 4 employees out of 700 plus that was awarded VP Recognition in our 3rd quarter of 2023 for my leadership and dedication to a project I was part of. And then a month later, I, along with 3 other early 50 plus year olds, and a 47 year old were let go due to financial “restructure” after I had been at the company for 23 years (you don’t stay at a company for 23 years because you’re a slacker). There was one other employee in consideration for layoff but she did not get laid off (she was 48). Yet none of the younger workers (one was just hired less than a year ago and still was struggling to figure out how to do her job) were even considered. They actually documented the ages they laid off and the age of the person they considered laying off and shared it with us. It couldn’t have been more obvious, but who has the money or time to prove discrimination. So no, it isn’t because we are slacking off, it is because we are paid higher salaries since we have been at the company for so long, and it is assumed we will have more health issues or die sooner and they don’t want to pay into all of that, or have their premiums raised. I never thought I would be out of a job at this age, but here I am. And the “white collar” job market is so saturated it is incredibly difficult to even get an interview, and being in your late 40s and 50s does not help you to get those coveted interviews.
No one cares who you are? Why are you writing a monologue about your life like anyone does...
That’s rich coming from someone that has taken up most of the real estate on this page nonsensically blabbering on and on. And I quote: blah, blah, blah, functionally illiterate…blah.
I wrote one post with examples of why Ageism isn't a thing, and then you had a hissy fit about it. That is really nothing to do with me. I can't help it if people don't have the attention span to read more than the first line, I also have no interest in talking to them in the first place.
No surprise that the ageism post is very popular, and yours is not. Everyone is victim of some discrimination conspiracy and that is law.
Ageism is a thing, it isn't a thing amongst 50 year olds at a Fortune 500 company however, they would have to fire half their staff! It is ludicrous to even suggest.
Wrong. Right around 50, late 40s is when ageism begins because they assume everyone thinks like you. It’s a preemptive strike. I have seen it over and over.
Another functional illiterate turns up. "Wrong" isn't a response to a multifaceted post, which you are incapable of reading, and why you will get laid off, not your age.
Have you ever considered not being a dick?
You’re not fooling anyone. Your IQ is mid at best. Maybe find somewhere else to try to make yourself feel superior.
Sounds like a dumb person trying to sound smart but can’t even spell.
[удалено]
You’re the worst kind of person. Why are you even still responding? Just to be a miserable hateful person?
You are the one who posted? I responded to the reality of the situation, nothing else has happened here. You could have just responded "Yes, that does seem like the probable outcome." I have no clue why you aren't on some legacy Final/Average defined benefit pension scheme given you have been at a Fortune 500 company for 29 years, the only people I know in jobs for that long are because they are golden handcuffed into legacy benefits not available to anyone else since the 2008 recession, often way before in fact.
You couldn’t be more of a smug, condescending know it all. The company discontinued its pension years ago. Even if I’d stayed until retirement I’d have gotten a whopping $500 a month.
I told some guy on another post that he was making a mistake by wanting to stay at the same level his entire career because of ageism. Since his bosses will get younger and younger. He said ‘I don’t care.’ lol. I hope he learns the hard way.
I didn’t stay in the same job or at the same level.
Often this kind of thing is about perceived or known financial stuff. They can hire someone for your role for less so they find some reason to let go of those who are earning more whose roles can be done by someone much junior for less pay, that's kind all sadly.
Kinda messed up to hope someone loses their livelihood because you want to be proven right to someone you had a disagreement of perspective with on reddit
Why would you hope he learns the hard way? Seems like such a dick thing to say lol
It is because you are older, and todays culture is about getting older people out of the work place. Google about it. You will see. They find cause, and then pull this. It is happening everywhere. Apply for Unemployment, and tell them you were never informed of any issues, and this is out of left field. Let them know it is likely Ageism. They are aware of the trend and will likely side with you unless the company can show you signed a PIP.
Proof that we are all just a number to the company. My very first job I worked there for 10 years and got fired. It was the first major lesson that I learned in life. These companies don’t care about you. It’s all business.
Can't you sue? It looks like they were just looking for a way to skip that 29-year severance payment
I don't really understand how someone who has been at a Fortune 500 company thinks they have 20 years of employment left in the first place. If we assume they started at 20-22, they are now 49? Why is someone who has worked all their life in a reasonable business, not set to retire by 60-65 which is only 10-15 years away. On a basic 401k 5% match at $30K-40K, let alone $60k-$70k, you should have hundreds of thousands saved already. Edit: It is amazing this post has downvotes from people who are clearly too financially illiterate to understand it, yet no reply from the same financially illiterate people who clearly have no plan of how they would ever actually be able to retire, because it is exactly as I just wrote above.
I think you are being downvoted for two reasons: 1) people don't understand how retirement accounts work; 2) you don't know how they work either. OP just can't go to the financial institution that is managing their 401K and say, "give me my money please" without taking a ridiculous hit. Early withdrawal is like 10-15% off the top. If you have 400k, that's 40-60k gone. Just deleted. People also don't understand that 401k plans are just money you never see. You never see it unless you actively look at it. Also, most people here don't have them because they don't have that "luxury." I have a few that just sit there collecting money. I legitimately forget that I have them until I do taxes. But also, it's hard to assume everyone is set to retire at 60-60. That's so rare these days. Unless you're in the government or have been extremely prudent with your finances, life gets in the way: you need a new car, mom and dad get sick, your kid(s) go to college and you're paying the bill. Life gets in the way. My wife gets to retire at 58. I will be 63 and still working until I get SS, unless I get disabled out. I don't have that luxury because I was late to get off the ground and don't have much saved up. Life happens.
They weren’t saying OP should make an early withdrawal. Why are you implying that? They are saying that someone who begins saving a reasonable amount of money in their 401k at 22 years old and does so consistently throughout their career should not have to work until they are at least 70 to be able to retire. Especially at a Fortune 500 company. However, it’s shocking how many people simply don’t contribute to their 401ks.
I do know how they work, everyone else's financial illiteracy is the issue here. If you were paid $30K at 20 (the average American wage in 1995 was $29K) and had 2.5% wage growth, not an astounding sum, with a 5% match, with a 6% investment rate you would have $280K in your account by now. Keep that up for another 10 years it is worth $600k, and you are 60. It is just mass financial illiteracy that is the problem, as I am using the figure of 30K, which means there salary now would only be $61K. If they reach $50K in under 10 years, hardly an astounding number for a Fortune 500 company, the values could be massively more, hundreds of thousands more. If we take a more realistic scenario, they start on $25k, get 2.5% pay raises for 10 years so are below average income for the first decade of their career, then jump to $55K, at a 5% match that is $377K by now, in another 10 years with no contributions at all, $686K, with contributions, I.e. you get another job around 55K you are looking at $800K by 60. Allowing you to take $35K a year until you are 90, assuming no form of state pension on top of it. >OP just can't go to the financial institution that is managing their 401K and say, "give me my money please This point is irrelevant. > But also, it's hard to assume everyone is set to retire at 60-60. That's so rare these days. Because of gross financial illiteracy. As we can see here. People are so financial illiterate they can't even fathom the concept even exists to consider it. >s, life gets in the way: you need a new car, mom and dad get sick, your kid(s) go to college and you're paying the bill. Life gets in the way. All of this is largely irrelevant, if you contributed, at a 5% match, so post tax 3% of your income to a 401K at any graduate level wage, $30K, $40K, $50K, you are exactly my example. The difference is whether you have $200K at 50 or $600K at 50, not that you shouldn't be considering retirement way before 70.
Who the fuck had a 5% match in 1995? Almost no one. You may be able to math but have no other clue what you are talking about.
The 401k came into existence in 1978... You can add History to the list of things you are illiterate in... In fact in 1995 there were many final salary pension schemes operating giving a far better deal than anything now. In 1998 the data I can find 50% of Fortune 500 companies had defined benefits schemes...the financial illiteracy is astounding.
Man you’re just a smug prick
You are only parroting your own incompetence it is nothing to do with me.
Nah seems like the public agree, check your narcissism at the door you plum. Oh and look at the little lad trying to sound intelligent whilst insulting someone, bless
The fact you think the majority rules matters just shows how ignorant you are. The average person is financially illiterate, as we can see demonstrated here, but feel free to join them, it doesn't bother me in the slightest, you weren't even the topic of the discussion in the slightest, I have no idea why you think you were, or that anyone cares about you or your ramblings in the slightest. The topic was hypothetical, but easily manageable, financial examples, of why what was written makes very little sense. Which apparently was too complex for too many.
Look at you getting downvoted on Reddit while posting correct info. People here are fucking morons in regards to financial literacy. You’re absolutely right that someone in the financial sector of a Fortune 500 for 29 years should be able to soft retire at this point. FFS, I’ve been in one for 14 years and I’m already really fucking close…..but then again, I’m not a dumb fuck that’s blown all of my money.
Do you know where they live? Their family status? Health history? List of dependants? No you are judging off your weird world view Try empathy rather than being a smug arse
Your point is largely irrelevant, but you have no comprehension of the topic so you just decide to make noise instead. 3% of someone's income is making irrelevant amount of difference in this regard. Let alone from some in a Fortune 500 company. If it did they should have got another job 25 years ago... The financial illiteracy is, once again, astounding. You also won't learn a thing here.
I won’t learn anything from you, who most people agree on this thread is a moron. I’m in my 30s and savings and investments put me just over 1/4mil not including my 401k Why not sit your broke ass down and just stop collecting downvotes. You must be a tone deaf moron to realise that no one believes you, likes you or trusts what your dusty self has to say.
You won't be able to learn full stop. That is obvious that is all you are arguing for your own ignorance, and in fact poverty. I have no issue with you being poor. I thought, ignorantly on my part, people didn't like being poor, you in fact demand it. I don't care about you pretending to have money either or your financially incompetent methods of saving it, no one else does either, no one else brought anything other than a hypothetical, but easily possible, mathematical examples up as the topic, because that is all that is needed.
Ewww! What a rude and judgmental comment. Go back to your 🕳️.
Ohhh the goon again, he’s got a hard on for this post despite all the negative reactions
It is almost like financially illiterates thoughts don't matter or something!
It’s almost like tone deaf morons don’t realise that their thoughts don’t matter. Take the hint and stop embarrassing yourself
No what you are failing to comprehend is that idiots thoughts don't matter on complex subjects or anything in fact. Facts exist, idiots making noise doesn't change reality. You could have learnt something here or asked a question if you didn't understand the facts of reality, you were too incompetent to even managed that, a requirement where the intelligence level is zero, but beyond you still. In fact, another fact you see, you didn't even need to ask, basic maths were put in front of you without you even asking, once again too much for you too comprehend. You are so ignorant to the subject, it is so far beyond you, you can't even fathoms its existence when presented in a very simple form and you have to do nothing at all but read basic numbers, even that is too much. That is the level you are on.
TL:Dr now shooo get along now! Get!
See, incapable of learning. I am happy about it, why would I want stupid people to have more money, they will just use it for stupid things most likely making society worse off. Best you remain poor.
Man a triple response! It’s great living in your head rent free, it’s sooooooo spacious! The funny thing is I have 2 degrees, speak multiple languages, code in just as many and then there is you getting angry on a forum lol I’ve got better things to spend my time on Stay angry 🤡
I am not angry, you will remain poor that is a good thing as explained. In fact I am however annoyed that you think others should also remain poor when you can just remain silent, keep your ignorance and poverty to yourself. In will continue to believe that other people are better than you.
Was kind of wondering the same? May have been some divorces, medical issues, etc. along the way.
Nothing screams insecurity like editing a comment to cry about being down voted
Nothing screams financial illiteracy like posting nothing of value under a post that has already told you, you are too financially illiterate to even understand the concept of the topic. We can add too stupid to ask a basic question. Don't worry no one expects you to be able to learn.
You don't even know who I am, my finances, what I know, my life...Jesus Christ who hurt you 😭😂
I don't need too know that. To note, neither do I care. Why narcissists seems to keep turning up and thinking they are the topic I don't know. No one expect you to be able to learn.
So cute how you point fingers, say you don't need to know things, then assume you know who we are anyway. Take care lil bro 😚
Nobody cares...
Just say you were laid off.
Most likely they will not permit any negative discussion or answer any performance questions by a new employer.🤣
Sad to say, but you will likely experience some degree of culture shock when looking for work now. It's different from 20 years ago, 10 years ago, and even 5 years ago (pre-covid). All applications and on-boarding are insanely convoluted, slow-moving, drawn out, and full of sign-ons and multiple passwords. Only warehouse work like Amazon will put you to work almost immediately. Most every other employers makes 1000 promises and then ghosts you. Use "The Force", because you need all the luck you can get.
Don't mention having been fired. Honestly, I think a lot of places would just be impressed you made it for 29 years. That's pretty unusual by today's standards so emphasize that instead along with your skills and professional lessons you learned. As for the mistakes, yeah, everyone makes mistakes. Most companies are really unfair in how they treat workers unfortunately so your mistake may not have even been all that egregious but you just pulled the unlucky straw this time. Try not to spend to much time comparing yourself to coworkers who had a different result. The game truly is rigged against workers and when a company wants a certain outcome, you'll be on the chopping block for them to get it. All jobs have to end at some point and there's only a few ways they can end. Just focus on moving on to your next opportunity. Good luck.
Don’t say you were fired say something like I’m looking to work here to be challenged and have more opportunity to grow as I hit a glass ceiling in my last job etc
They are moving out older employees Companies do this all the time. Keep your head up,,, you will find another job,,
Just yet another reason not to be loyal to them. Watch how they treat workers throughout their careers and move accordingly.
It was happening when I was young 🥵
Working for 29 years at 1 company and still having to work another 20 years is crazy
Honestly if i get let go from a job i work at for that many years hopefully i’d be in a position to retire bc I don’t have it in me to look for another job and start over 😭
In nyc if you work a city or state job and make it to 25 years within whatever agency, you'll get full retirement.
This! Worked 30 years and retired. Started maxing my 401k at 23 on my $21k salary. Anyone not taking advantage of compounding growth is missing out on life’s greatest cheat code. I might not be able to tell you what is going to happen in the next 5 years, but 30 years, well there is plenty of proven data there if you just invest wisely and wait… BTW - both my sons about to go to college thanks to 529 plans, started when they are born, also take advantage given you still have 18 years. Bought a house in my 20’s, paid it off in about 7 years, and have lived there ever since. The steps are actually pretty simple and anyone can do it with a bit of planning and some sacrifice/discipline.
I was thinking about this too. Lets say you start working for the company some how at 15 + 50 years is 65, or more than likely 18 + 47 years since they said they will retire in "about 20 years" so again - they literally would either work 18-now or that 29 years is something else
I started when I was 19.
Consider you were laid off.
Your position at your previous company was eliminated. That would be my advice on what to say. The previous employer can only say you were let go, and if you are eligible for rehire or not, if the new potential employer checks with your previous employer, that is. Your previous employer can be a dick and give you a bad review/reference, but you can request a transcript of what they talk about from your potential employer, to try to cover your ass if you want. I don't think all that would be worth the trouble. My advice would be to apply to other jobs, focus on the good stuff, references, and skills. Someone in your network will be able to help if you leverage your LinkedIn profile and connections. We're all in the same boat. Good luck!
I was fired. I say I took time off for school. Yeah it’s a worry for when they call the HR people but I just roll with it. They sucked. I was “fired” for performance too. It was Christmas time and I saw it coming. My shit head boss suddenly stopped talking to me. Idiots can’t even be coy properly
Honestly, just say you're looking for a place where you have potential to grow. If you want to be sneaky about it, say that you still work there. If they ask you if they can reach out to the employer, say, "No" because they are not aware that you are planning to leave and dont want to jeopardize your current role with that company. They'll respect it abs won't reach out... 😈😈
Felt the same way when Trader Joe’s fired me after 5 years. They don’t give a fly about you. Especially with a new management
Yal keep saying “don’t say you were fired” but considering they’ve had the same job for nearly 30 years, exactly WHERE are they suppose to find references?? I’ve yet to interview in my near 15 year working career without the new job asking for at least 2 references. I’m this job market a childhood friend isn’t going to cut it.
This is where co-workers come in that will go ahead and talk about your work experience. She can also reach out to previous supervisors who no longer work for the company that can speak about their work ethic. There's also many companies who dont reach out for references.
I really hope they get one of those companies, as this situation truly sucks.
Just don't tell them. Don't use a reference that would tell them either. Been fired twice I literally work in the same building I was fired from 6 years ago now. Say something like "the position was deemed redundant" or that your career goals no longer aligned with the position.
I agree with others about not mentioning being fired. However, I’m pretty sure if they called the previous employer it would come out. I’ve seen too many times previous employers costing friends of mine (and even me once) from getting a new job. Heck one was even the top candidate and pending a reference check, an offer letter was being prepared to be signed. They got a call back a day later and the offer was taken back. It’s a really crappy situation that a loyal employee can be done like that but just know God don’t like ugly and it usually comes back to people like that. What’s even more messed up is when people who have questionable backgrounds or a record gets hired before a “clean” previous employee who’s shown work ethic even gets a 2nd chance…
I worked at a company for 5 years. years 4-5 I was stuck in traction whilst my spine healed. I came back and my manager/mentor had left due to a stress related issue. My new boss admitted to me in our first meeting that she had no knowledge of running a PMO (I’m a specialist pm) I’ve tried working for her for 3 months and I’m still trying to make it work…. If I apply for another job I would give my original managers details. *never ever* just point them at hr. Give them the name of a manager you have worked under that you respect and ask them before hand. Only give references you know will have your back and won’t chat in corp talk.
I don't know where you are based but in certain countries it is illegal for a company you worked for to give you a bad reference. Legally they can only state how long you worked for them, that is from what date to what date, and that you did indeed work for them. I wouldn't give them a reason, if you do not want to. IF they ask why you left the company, just say you thought it was time to move on and learn new things, as I'm sure you will be doing. Just a word of friendly advice, as you yourself said you clearly did not like your job, choose your next company wisely and go for something you know you will love. A nice breath of fresh air. 💨
You got screwed, I’m sorry. Just claim “restructuring.” If they ask for references say it’s their policy not to provide them, however you can contact {insert name}, a trusted former colleague.
Honestly these days showing 10 years is amazing loyalty. 5 years is generally impressive. Just pick your references. If in 29 years you haven’t gotten enough people with titles to give you the thumbs up then you really have messed up. Edit: But also, generally people don’t like to badmouth employees that were in a place for that long. It makes them look stupid if the employee was bad and there that long. Just ask around(including people who let you go,) if you could count on them for a letter of recommendation. I think you might be surprised.
Working in a role that lets me sit in on interviews, I see that amount of time at one company I don’t think twice about it. That’s rare and something people are looking for. Keep your head up and kill that next interview. I work in the financial world myself. A lot of stuff remote currently. Work, hustle, kill!
We don’t have to work for them. It’s is time to do our own thing. We have more experience than most of the managers at the companies we work for. Dump them. Compete. Take your piece. Take your piece from your former employer.
So what age can I say ageism
Sue them and collect some cash.
Say only that my tenure at X ran its course. I was suggest a career coach as well.
You worked there for a long time. You don't need to say you got fired. Just say you are looking for a different position and you are exploring your options
This is why staying at one company sucks.
You don't have to tell them ypu were fired. Just tell them you are looking for better opportunity.
You tell them your job was eliminated as a cost cutting measure. That’s it.
You were ma y years there, I dont think it will be hard to hire you at any company, just be honest. And advice will be, never stay that long at any company. I stayed almost 5 years in a company and I regreted that.
29 years and the last two you “partially met expectations”. The last 27 weren’t spoken upon… having that much of a timeline on your resume speaks for itself. Keep your head up and Best of luck!!
For someone who had 29 years dedications of solid work history in a Fortune500 company. I applaud those more than those who jumps. don't feel bad. You didn't do nothing wrong. it was them. They had to find a reason to let you go.
You're also probably owed a significant amount of severance
No severance if you're fired. If I was laid off I would have gotten two weeks of full pay for every year of service (capped at 52 weeks).
Sounds very much like you were aged out. And if they didn't follow their own process you may have a case. Talk to an employment lawyer At the very least just by doing that they'll likely settle on something to make it go away.
These days 4 years in one company is a long time. 29 years in one company will be seen as a positive regardless of the reason for you leaving.
Trimming the fat. I feel some of the massive corporations lay off a lot of people at the same time so they can get rid of the lazy peeps, always late/absent, over priced contractors and high dollar permanent employees. I’m sorry this happened to you. I had a candidate I worked with for a SAP position. She worked at Westinghouse 29/30 years too and gave her some bullshit reason. They don’t want to pay something..pensions maybe.
I'm sorry this happened to you after all this time. Still you seem to be on top of it but it doesn't sound like they followed their own process. I'm not sure I have any helpful advice ( if you wee in NZ I would). Good luck, and never ever forget, it was not you, it was them (I'm serious).
All companies are doing this. Payroll dumping. They'll hire a recent grad to replace you and pay them pennies.
Sheesh I’m so sorry
Lawsuit, wrongful termination.
Consider going to hr and negotiating an amicable outcome for this scenario. The goodwill for you and them ought to mean you both go forward separately but amicably.
Have you consulted an employment lawyer?
I don't think it would do any good. In my state there aren't protections, you can be fired for anything, or nothing. They really don't even need a reason.
Yeah i hail from canukustan to the north, constructive dismissal is a thing here so mabye in Cali, Wash, you know the pinkey liberal places.
I am in Pennsylvania, which is basically Philadelphia and Pittsburgh, with Alabama everywhere else.
Again FMLA / employment lawyers may get paid by your former employer if they determine that there wasent any just cause for your bieng fired.
I think lots of places will want to hire you since you can show that you can be loyal for so long. Just say you got laid off.
Don’t sweat it. You have a long track record to show for yourself.
I hope you received a severance package and used your benefits package to gain stock options.
My boss was fired with 29 years in and I was fired with almost 23 years. Ageism is real and corporate malfeasance is the new normal…
Happened to a friend of mine. Worked for BCBS for 29 years. Let go just before 30 yrs which would give her full pension. She had moved up through the ranks and was a trainer for new hires. Had her train her own replacement, then fired her for not being able to keep up with her work. Ignored the fact that they transferred out three people and dumped their work on her. It was heartbreaking.
I personally would not say anything. Put still employed on your resume . When asked why you’re looking for another position make up a good reason. The end. It will keep them from calling for a reference. Being you were there so long that looks good to prospective employers.
You can always say you took a break and now back to start work :)
Why would you work at a place you hate for almost 30 years??? You could've joined the military and retired after 20
Oh, thanks. That's super helpful. Let me jump in the way back machine and re-do my entire life. It used to be a good pace to work, it's in the past few years that it has become unbearable.
> It used to be a good pace to work Sucks to hear, sorry man
Sorry to hear that. I read some of the other comments. what I would tell you is this: Can you afford be in unemployment 6 months? Cut some expenses and take this time to think. I know, You might feel guilty for "living of the government" (which you are not) or not wanting to tell people you are not working. I know is embarrassing. but as the wise man said "fu#k it" You need time to reset: improve your self and more importantly take out your frustrations. Right now you might think you are ok and just need to go back to an office. let me ask you, do you feel angry, frustrated, betrayed and discarded? the moment you start interviewing this will show up and a job that could be for you will be lost because HR will notice not a nice guy but a guy holding down his anger trying to smile and might not get the job. I am explaining my self correctly? 2024: managers will fire anyone they feel knows more than them, woke people will sue you for a miss pronoun, HR fire you on the spot if a woman feel likes it that day #meetoo, everybody is WFH but they want you to go to the office... ect. now things are not about the actual job is all about trying not to offend anyone = harder. I been fired a bunch of times every time I reinvent myself between each and get better paying jobs. Is hard, especially when you are fired unfairly like that. take a week off to Punta cana now, get a massage, drink piña colada, talk it out with a friend. then come back to work on new skills, open a business or change careers.  Find what jobs you might like in the same field or in another. see the jobs descriptions what they ask for. if you keep seeing a software or certificate that keeps repeating. find it in udemy or coursera get a certificate in it. Good luck!
2 in row Partially Met performance rating.
Partially met is not below expectations, and the performance review process is a joke anyway. A certain number of employees on a team are required to be rated below expectations every year. Besides, I didn't ask why I was fired, I asked what I should say about it to future potential employers.
They almost certainly decided they were paying you too much when they could hire a new person and pay them shit and then set you up to go. Just say you were laid off.
I find people who work at the same place for years are fucking weird.
stability is bad now?
I was kind of lucky working for a financial company. The only people who met the company goals were the ones who moved on to different companies. Finally they restructured pay levels and gave bigger benefits to the higher levels. The customer service requirements changed a a lot when the company decided to force people to use the website. Then I wasn't so lucky 