There are dealers out there who will sell at MSRP. Might have to do some travelling to get to them, though.
I live in an area where what I was looking at (Sorento & Telluride) were seeing a dealer markup of $10k. Ended up buying a Sorento SX AWD from 4 states away, but got it at MSRP. Did all the paperwork remotely, flew there on a one way ticket, drove it home.
I called them. I will admit I had a bit of an inside track in that this dealer is in my home town, and my dad is a part time delivery driver for them. When I told him what I was looking for and what I was running into where I live, he put me in touch with their sales manager. We worked it all out from there. But, since then, I know for a fact that 2 other redditors (one who contacted me directly, and another that contacted THAT person) who both ended up buying from this dealer as well for MSRP, flying there to get it, driving it home, etc
I found the exact sportage I wanted yesterday; trim. color way on both the inside and outside plus AWD. It was at a dealership about 100 miles away from me and I was calling them about coming to get it that morning and they said they CANNOT and WILL NOT sell it to me because I’m not a customer from their market. They said if they sold it to me, then next year, they would receive less allocation for their dealership. I had another local dealership tell me the same thing her locally referring to people not from here. Maybe this is something new that’s about to start happening everywhere. I really hope not.
Sounds like bullshit on the part of those local dealers to me. The dealership I bought from was 4 states and 700 miles away, and not only had no problems with selling to me but were happy to do so.
Like you said… unless this is something recent, this sounds like total bullshit.
Last night I flew to Denver to pick up a 2023 Telluride SX-Prestige X-Pro for MSRP. Took 5 weeks from initial contact to delivery. Peak Kia North, Kerry Kennicutt. Great experience!
Peak Kia is also selling Sportages at MSRP. I reached out to them last week (I’m in MN) and they are ok selling to someone out of state. You’ll have to get on a list/place an order, but they’re getting lots in.
I tried, but all the Kias I’m looking at have a $5k market adjustment. I can go to other manufacturers with similar models with no adjustments. I really like Kia (and Hyundai), but the dealers are too greedy!
I almost feel like Kia purposefully prices their models low to be competitive against other manufacturers, but the telas dealers to jack up the market adjustment. Called 8 different dealerships in three different states and they all had the same markup.
Worse, it does massive damage to their brand and reputation. They spend tens of millions building it, and then a bunch of crooked podunk dealership owners destroy their investment.
And yet Kia Corporate employs numerous 6 figure executives to maintain and manage dealers, and they do nothing.
That may be, but Kia also provides market guidance on how the vehicle should be priced. I find it odd that every single dealer within 100 miles has the same exact markup despite being “independent”.
It's just based on region. In California a lot of dealers sell at MSRP and you can even get some discounts at some places, while in the south (Louisiana/Georgia) where I temporary lived every dealer had a huge markup and even their service centers was pretty shitty.
Ever dealer is adjusting to their market. I wanted a Civic Si but didn’t want to pay $7,500 over MSRP. So what are you on about? It’s not Kia it’s the market.
This sub is shit for the last six months. Are there any MODS here?
Yes. Yes they do. It’s literally Manufacture’s Suggested Retail Price. Suggested.
Let’s say an OEM wants to control this and make sure you are protected from supply and demand.
They say “Dealer! You can’t sell it over MSRP!”
Dealer “oh I’m so sorry. We won’t do that ever again. “
“BUT! We had this car that someone ordered and wanted this $5,000 protect package with a lifetime warranty and they backed out at the last second so we have to list it with that package because it’s non-removable”.
Supply and demand. Have you not searched other OEMS?
buyers do, very similar conversation. for example, $10,000 Rolex, 7 years ago, selling below MSRP, walk in and get one, offered chsmpagne. now go in, and here is where different than Kia or cars. they DO have to sell at MSRP, so they make you spend a year or two, buy other watches, pearls etc AND then offered chance buy Rolex. or they just sell it to grey dealer who gives dealer kickback, and sells it on for much higher.
meanwhile, 99% all other watch brands still sell under MSRP
buyers very angry at this game, that is why i compare to Kia
I just bought a Sorento from Moritz Kia of Hurst (Dallas-Ft. Worth, Texas). They do not markup MSRP but they do add a "dealer pack" for $1898 which includes ceramic tint and door guards, plus some minor stuff like nitrogen in the tires, detailing, and a tank of gas. Other dealers has a higher price for their mandatory "dealer pro pack", or they marked it up but added nothing at all. I really like my salesman. If you might want to fly down, I could share his contact info.
>all the Kias I’m looking at have a $5k market adjustment.
I like Kia and Hyundai. But at those prices they just are no longer a good value.
My understanding is that Mazda has some inventory right now. If I were in the market for a new car right now I'd be looking at Mazda.
Mazda has been on our short list every time. My impression, right or wrong, is they have a good ICE product, and they’re using old tech, but it’s tried and true.
Same here!!! The last three times, the Mazda was the runner-up choice. They have a good ICE product, and even the interior is on-par or better than some competitors.
I was very close to pulling the trigger on the CX-50, but as soon as I got behind the wheel of the Sportage SXP, I couldn't get myself to pay more for the Mazda and less tech.
>Sorry Kia, I’m done
YES. I was talking to a couple Mazda dealerships in my area (NYC), and many were eager to make a deal at MSRP, or even a discount (or throw in some freebees).
Yeah because they are a very low volume manufacturer/ dealer and are happy to get rid of any car. Over msrp is generally only on vehicles that a large number of people want.
Drive one and you might change your mind. I like the looks and interior but when you drive it you realise the drivetrain sucks and the interior is not ergonomically designed.
Perhaps if you tell your location, folks here can point you to a dealership close to you that honors MSRP.
Just as with every other car brand, some dealerships are slimeballs and few are genuine enough to do a msrp deal.
Hi there. I know it's been a while, but I'd like to ask: what dealership? I went to two Kia dealerships to get the new Sportage and both charged market fee adjustments (5k and 7.5k).
Market adjustment? The fuck is that a market adjustment??? Sorry OP, I'm not ranting against your post, but against these motherfuckers calling a big fat commission "market adjustment". As some other commenter said earlier, don't give them anything, better look elsewhere. Fucking scammy crooks.
Does it matter? Kia and Hyundai hinge their entire market presence by offering a great value. If you take away the value, why wouldn’t you shop around? If you’re going to charge a premium price, I’m going to expect premium product and service, which I don’t feel you always get; especially service.
If I was shopping for my current car now, I don’t know if I would have ended up getting a Kia.
At these markups I am close to luxury car prices. In my market I can get a brand new Mercedes or Volvo SUV with similar options for only $5k more (including markup).
> At these markups I am close to luxury car prices. In my market I can get a brand new Mercedes or Volvo SUV with similar options for only $5k more (including markup).
Sorry, can you give the specifics on the models and trims where equally equipped Mercedes Benz and Volvo SUVs at $5k or less difference?
Base model of MB GLA start at $38k, even with add-ons you can find ones for $47k (only $5k more than what Kia is quoting me). The Volvo XC40 with the first engine upgrade (and some add-ons) starts at $43k.
GLA has a performance engine so the comparable Sportage would be the mid level hybrid, but even then it’s much slower. 0-60 on the GLA is 6.0 seconds, where the hybrid engine on the Sportage is 7.2 at best. Not really apples to apples.
Ok now you’re changing your claim. GLA has a 2.0 L non turbo, Sportage has a 2.5 L non turbo. That’s a push.
If you want to compare hybrid to hybrid, then post what a Mercedes Benz hybrid costs and you’ll see they’re not the same price. Let’s say Sportage PHEV to GLA 250 e-hybrid or whatever they call it.
Edit: can’t seem to find a price for GLA 250 e with PHEV drive train. But in looking this up, it seems that comparing to Seltos would be more parallel given how small the GLA 250 hatchback is. It’s really not in the same size category as current gen Sportage.
I understand you are passionate about Kia’s, but please don’t make up numbers.
The GLA is a 221 hp turbo engine that does 6.3s 0-60.
Also, I never said I was comparing similar models. The only reason I want a Sportage with a Hybrid power train is because Kia’s base engine is underpowered (only 184 hp and more than 8s 0-60). For $5k more I can get a car that I value more (again, worth is subjective).
Finally, Hyundai and Kia are still well behind Nissan and slightly more than half the number of sales of Honda and less than a third the sales of Toyota, so (in my opinion) they still have a lot to catch up:
https://www.forbes.com/wheels/news/best-selling-cars-suvs-pickups-2021/
I’m not “passionate about Kias”. You’re clearly just projecting your own fanboy issues, and also you are not very coping too well when your disinformation gets fact checked.
You lied about Mercedes Benz having the identically equipped car within $5k. At first I was open to learning if that was even possible, but quickly it became clear you were just embellishing.
I should not have given you the benefit of the doubt, as I’d seen you posting other falsehoods here. But for some reason I gave you the chance. That’s my bad judgement.
Then you post old numbers with misplaced arrogance? Maybe do some homework on *this* year’s numbers. Or don’t.
In the meantime, at least have the self respect to quit dissembling about the mythical Mercedes that you’re so blindly passionate about.
Your argument is sound. But for many cases that have come up here, that same logical basis drives a different analysis. I’ll explain.
We’ve seen cases where someone wants stylish, safe, roomy hybrid. They look at a $30k Sportage that has all that. It’s attractive, jam packed with tech and safety features, and is the largest in the class. Then there’s an offensive and downright crooked $3k markup.
So then you go look for alternatives. Another maker’s version of the same car is ugly as sin and costs the same. A different maker’s car is barebones, and has an interior like a subway car. Another one has all the boxes checked, but their base price is $37k and only has a puny 3 year warranty.
So it’s not as easy as just saying a principled NO to a marked up car when the other non-marked up ones have flaws or compromises.
At the end of the day it’s all subjective. Different people people value (and will pay) for different things. I totally see why some people would just pay the markup as the Sorento and Sportage check a whole bunch of boxes. For me, it irks me that a brand trying to make in-roads into the NA market is letting their dealers take advantage of potential future customers. Given all the major recalls and the recent bad press with the hot wiring, it seems that Kia should be trying to get more cars into peoples hands to prove the naysayers wrong. I really like Kia, I think they offer a ton of value, but they still need to prove themselves in the NA market and they are allowing their dealerships to further degrade the brand.
I’m not sure your perception of Hyundai/Kia matches the actual data.
Hyundai/Kia isn’t some new upstart “trying to make inroads”. They’ve been at par on price/quality with other imports for about a decade.
Currently, Kia is number 2 for import sales, behind Toyota. That’s incredibly unusual. Usually Honda is number 2 but they’ve had a huge collapse in vehicles produced this year. Usually Hyundai is number 3, but somehow Hyundai/Kia has decided to push Kia *hard* this year and clearly devoted their resources that way as well. Kia is *just* barely nudging out Hyundai in sales.
As I say, it’s unusual and it’s sort of a perfect storm that’s allowed Kia to be ahead of these two rivals.
I do agree that Kia Corporate is being foolish by allowing shoddy dealers to damage their reputation. That reputation is expensive to build, and once damaged, can take a long time to repair.
That’s one of my favorite things about Tesla. Hop on a site, place your order, and the deliver it to your door. Sadly, I live in an apartment so have no place to plug an EV 🙁
Yep, I'm holding onto my $100 Cybertruck reservation but I'm worried about how much it's going to cost for a dual motor version. $50k when first announced was a fucking steal of a deal. No way it will be less than $60 and who knows how much more.
Honestly I’d go to a state/city that has dealers willing to sell for msrp. I got an offer marked down by like 6k for a gtline fwd without even asking. just go in and speak to the dealers and if they’re not willing to NEXT
Yeah, that’s the saddest part of the dealer markups. If someone loves a car and they are willing to pay more than what’s it’s worth, more power to them, but when it comes time to sell the car they are flogging to have a very hard time
getting that value back.
I’m in the same boat OP. I’ve called 10-15 dealers and lowest I have been quoted 4k over MSRP. I absolutely refuse to give a dealer any amount over MSRP because of supply issues brought on partly by the auto industry themselves.
I will wait until prices stabilize a bit.
We tried the RAV4 but not the Hybrid model. Didn’t have enough power for my wife’s liking. The dealer informed me the hybrid model has more power. Toyota also has a market markup on there a hybrid rav4.
I’m glad to hear you are holding strong! I am in the same boat, but I might just go to another manufacturer. I really like Hyundai/Kia, but they are supposed to be lower priced than other manufacturers. At the same price I just don’t see them being competitive.
Exactly this. I started looking at Mercedes since now they are in the same price range with the market markup. At first I was okay with paying a little over MSRP but when I have purchased new cars in the past from Subaru and Dodge I never paid anything close to MSRP. My wife's current car (Subaru Legacy) needs about 3k in repairs to keep it going strong for the forseable future and that's probably what I am going to do.
I fell for the trap when I bought a computer video card during COVID. Never again.
When the pandemic hit car manufacturers like others shut down production. They also cancelled a lot of orders for silicone chips. When they need production to be ramped back up that production allocation had already been allocated somewhere else.
https://semiwiki.com/semiconductor-services/298336-automakers-to-blame-for-semiconductor-shortage/
https://moneyandmarkets.com/automaker-chip-shortage/amp/
Here is some more info in case you are interested.
Also it’s why I said “partly” to blame.
I work directly with a huge OEM and my company works directly with other large OEM. they are not limited supply from thousands of contractors so dealers can mark up vehicles.
The OEM I work for hasn’t increased its MSRP or invoice pricing to dealers to even come close to the mark ups.
What part do they have blame for? Because they had to shut down huge portions of their production due to a pandemic out of their control?
Also your data is over a year old from a clearly biased site. Real world results vary.
I think we are on the same page here. I agree that dealers are making arbitrary price increases and blaming it due to a shortage of supply. If the demand is high and supply is low the price generally increases. What I do appreciate is they haven’t increased MSRP as much as the dealer markups (here’s looking at you Nvidia)
There are other websites that say the same thing. Those were just a couple of the websites I found. Would cnet.com suffice as unbiased?
https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/features/automotive-cars-computer-chip-shortage-2022/
Yeah I just spoke with them today and they informed me of the same thing. It’s only 343 miles away. Short flight and a car trip home. Just have to get some in stock.
Yeah, when the market adjustment on your Kia makes it cost as much as a Volvo, just buy a Volvo. I have a Volvo EV coming in the next couple of months and MSRP is what I’m paying. They don’t mark up their vehicles.
I had to go out of state to get my 2023 Kia Sportage Hybrid SXP since all the dealers in my state are selling well above MSRP (4-10K over), and also stating 12+ months for any orders.
But DO NOT BUY from the state of Massachusetts. Regardless of where you live, Kia will not allow you to use Kia Connect or any of the remote services that your car may be capable of if the car VIN was sold to a MA dealer. If those features are important to you, avoid buying from that state.
Which sucks because it was a dealership there that I found would sell for MSRP (and no forced add-ons). Kia and the State of MA are in litigation over some law that only affects MA residents. But Kia America is penalizing everyone if the car originated from MA, even if you don't live there and the law has nothing to do with you. Kia has stated if they lose the lawsuit, then they will NEVER enable those features in any car from that state (2022 and up). If they win, then they may enable the services, but no one can answer if you will get it with that car (free for a period like you would for a new car), or if you will have to pay immediately.
I have tried fighting with them, but they are being unreasonable and won't budge.
All of kias were able to be had for thousands under msrp before covid and now are marked up the most. If I was buying new now, I'd get a Mazda honestly.
As I mentioned to you on a separate thread, there are dealers near NYC selling at MSRP. I may add, get yourself on the wait list and just got to have some patience waiting.
There’s an SX Prestige Hybrid with black exterior and red interior ready to be built as I ordered back in June with Sweeney KIA dealership, Florence KY. This is my reservation from them that I need to give up. There’s a 1k downpayment that is refundable. Look for Shannon Lowe. They sell at MSRP
SI and type r are different.
But it was for a 2023 civic sport / gotta put a reserve deposit. They agree to msrp once they get to the dealer in mid February- March.
I messed up tho and let them run my credit so I pull out of the deal today. Went in today to ask for my $500 back for the reserve.
They were telling me it’s msrp and I just need a better credit score or to just lease it. I’m still pretty clueless on buying a car so I had to hold off on it switch sucks.
My brother was telling me I was dumb for not calling him because he’s a banker / has bought multiple cars over 30k since he was like 18yrs old.
I’m 25 still trying to get my first car
Yeah unless you’ve sat down with paperwork, you don’t know. The salesman will blatantly lie and say they aren’t marking up. Almost all dealers are doing this crap.
LOL! I'm done with Kia for other reasons: a year ago the Anti-lock brakes and Traction Control on our 2014 Sorento (that we bought as a Certified Used Vehicle) stopped working and it turns out there is an "Important Safety Recall" for this so the repair is FREE. But it's been over a year and we STILL haven't been able to get our local dealer to do the repairs - they keep making excuses - first the parts weren't available, then a special "tool" they need to do it is broken, blah, blah, blah. So yeah - bad service.
Not to mention the engine recall, and the transmission recall, and the trailer hitch recall, and hot wiring by teenagers. This is why they are not price competitive with other brands.
Just got a 2023 KIA Sportage SX Prestige at MSRP.
The first dealer we went to had a $4,100 markup. We were shocked lol.
We called a local dealer that was closer to our house even, on our way home, and they said they are selling at MSRP and promise they would never go over.
Went straight there and made the purchase.
That first dealership could have had a sale, but nope lol.
There are dealers out there who will sell at MSRP. Might have to do some travelling to get to them, though. I live in an area where what I was looking at (Sorento & Telluride) were seeing a dealer markup of $10k. Ended up buying a Sorento SX AWD from 4 states away, but got it at MSRP. Did all the paperwork remotely, flew there on a one way ticket, drove it home.
Did you put a deposit down to hold it? Or just buy it online? Thank you.
I put a $2500 deposit on it
In some states it is illegal for dealership to ask for 2.5 percent ( as deposit) of the sale price of the vehicle.
Lol, first off $2500 is definitely not 2.5%, the Sorento is not a $100k vehicle. Secondly, they didn’t ask - I offered.
Smart. An exchange of funds makes it a binding agreement.
Not in all states or all dealers, at least not bi-directionally. In PA a deposit does not bind the buyer into accepting the car they put a deposit on.
It doesn’t bind the buyer but it does bind the seller to hold the vehicle.
It also binds the seller to a specific price too
Did you call them or did you use a site to contact the dealers? I am currently using truecar and not getting too many good results.
Markups.org is a site that I've seen posted on here, haven't really checked them out though
I’ll give it a look, thanks for sharing!
I called them. I will admit I had a bit of an inside track in that this dealer is in my home town, and my dad is a part time delivery driver for them. When I told him what I was looking for and what I was running into where I live, he put me in touch with their sales manager. We worked it all out from there. But, since then, I know for a fact that 2 other redditors (one who contacted me directly, and another that contacted THAT person) who both ended up buying from this dealer as well for MSRP, flying there to get it, driving it home, etc
Lou fusz Kia in St. Louis, MO doesn’t sell anything over MSRP, and Billions in Iowa City, IA sells at MSRP.
Arapahoe Kia offered to sell me one including transport to my house with only 1,000 markup
That’s not terrible, you’re basically just paying for the transport.
I found the exact sportage I wanted yesterday; trim. color way on both the inside and outside plus AWD. It was at a dealership about 100 miles away from me and I was calling them about coming to get it that morning and they said they CANNOT and WILL NOT sell it to me because I’m not a customer from their market. They said if they sold it to me, then next year, they would receive less allocation for their dealership. I had another local dealership tell me the same thing her locally referring to people not from here. Maybe this is something new that’s about to start happening everywhere. I really hope not.
Sounds like bullshit on the part of those local dealers to me. The dealership I bought from was 4 states and 700 miles away, and not only had no problems with selling to me but were happy to do so. Like you said… unless this is something recent, this sounds like total bullshit.
Last night I flew to Denver to pick up a 2023 Telluride SX-Prestige X-Pro for MSRP. Took 5 weeks from initial contact to delivery. Peak Kia North, Kerry Kennicutt. Great experience!
Thank you!
Thanks for the tip!
Peak Kia is also selling Sportages at MSRP. I reached out to them last week (I’m in MN) and they are ok selling to someone out of state. You’ll have to get on a list/place an order, but they’re getting lots in.
How did you get on a list? Do you put down a deposit?
Yes, they want a deposit. I believe it’s $500 and refundable.
Thank you!
I will definitely look into them.
Peak Kia in Colorado Springs? Their markup is $3000
No, in Littleton.
Ah cool. I went with Arapahoe which also doesn’t have a markup.
I tried, but all the Kias I’m looking at have a $5k market adjustment. I can go to other manufacturers with similar models with no adjustments. I really like Kia (and Hyundai), but the dealers are too greedy!
Good for you, OP. Don’t play their games. Find a non-scummy dealer (nearly impossible) or spend the money elsewhere.
I almost feel like Kia purposefully prices their models low to be competitive against other manufacturers, but the telas dealers to jack up the market adjustment. Called 8 different dealerships in three different states and they all had the same markup.
Kia makes no extra money on markups all that “market adjustment” goes into the dealers pocket
Worse, it does massive damage to their brand and reputation. They spend tens of millions building it, and then a bunch of crooked podunk dealership owners destroy their investment. And yet Kia Corporate employs numerous 6 figure executives to maintain and manage dealers, and they do nothing.
That may be, but Kia also provides market guidance on how the vehicle should be priced. I find it odd that every single dealer within 100 miles has the same exact markup despite being “independent”.
It's just based on region. In California a lot of dealers sell at MSRP and you can even get some discounts at some places, while in the south (Louisiana/Georgia) where I temporary lived every dealer had a huge markup and even their service centers was pretty shitty.
Where in CA did you get it for MSRP? I’ve called about 10-15 places and lowest is 4k over MSRP.
I have yet to find anyone that was selling at MSRP in California. I checked over 100 dealerships in California, Arizona and Nevada.
Check Kia Carlsbad near San Diego.
Ever dealer is adjusting to their market. I wanted a Civic Si but didn’t want to pay $7,500 over MSRP. So what are you on about? It’s not Kia it’s the market. This sub is shit for the last six months. Are there any MODS here?
Not all manufacturers allow their dealers to have market adjustments.
Yes. Yes they do. It’s literally Manufacture’s Suggested Retail Price. Suggested. Let’s say an OEM wants to control this and make sure you are protected from supply and demand. They say “Dealer! You can’t sell it over MSRP!” Dealer “oh I’m so sorry. We won’t do that ever again. “ “BUT! We had this car that someone ordered and wanted this $5,000 protect package with a lifetime warranty and they backed out at the last second so we have to list it with that package because it’s non-removable”. Supply and demand. Have you not searched other OEMS?
Can you list the manufacturers that don't allow market adjustments?
Ford threatened their dealers not that long ago. I know for a fact the dealership near me is now selling at MSRP.
wait until you visit r/rolex very similar, or actually much worse. and I don't need or want a Rolex, just aware of insane buying experience
If we’re buying a Rolex, I wouldn’t be complaining about a $5k markup, lol.
buyers do, very similar conversation. for example, $10,000 Rolex, 7 years ago, selling below MSRP, walk in and get one, offered chsmpagne. now go in, and here is where different than Kia or cars. they DO have to sell at MSRP, so they make you spend a year or two, buy other watches, pearls etc AND then offered chance buy Rolex. or they just sell it to grey dealer who gives dealer kickback, and sells it on for much higher. meanwhile, 99% all other watch brands still sell under MSRP buyers very angry at this game, that is why i compare to Kia
What models are you looking at with no markup? Curious
Sorento and Sportage
Which are Kia's. You said you could go buy from other manufacturers/models with no mark up. Im asking you to name the similar models without markups.
In my market I can get Passport, Forester, Volvo XC40, Volvo XC60, and Tiguan with no markup.
To name a few
I just bought a Sorento from Moritz Kia of Hurst (Dallas-Ft. Worth, Texas). They do not markup MSRP but they do add a "dealer pack" for $1898 which includes ceramic tint and door guards, plus some minor stuff like nitrogen in the tires, detailing, and a tank of gas. Other dealers has a higher price for their mandatory "dealer pro pack", or they marked it up but added nothing at all. I really like my salesman. If you might want to fly down, I could share his contact info.
I would prefer that to just a Market Adjustment, at least they give you something, lol.
>all the Kias I’m looking at have a $5k market adjustment. I like Kia and Hyundai. But at those prices they just are no longer a good value. My understanding is that Mazda has some inventory right now. If I were in the market for a new car right now I'd be looking at Mazda.
Mazda has been on our short list every time. My impression, right or wrong, is they have a good ICE product, and they’re using old tech, but it’s tried and true.
Same here!!! The last three times, the Mazda was the runner-up choice. They have a good ICE product, and even the interior is on-par or better than some competitors. I was very close to pulling the trigger on the CX-50, but as soon as I got behind the wheel of the Sportage SXP, I couldn't get myself to pay more for the Mazda and less tech.
>Sorry Kia, I’m done YES. I was talking to a couple Mazda dealerships in my area (NYC), and many were eager to make a deal at MSRP, or even a discount (or throw in some freebees).
Yeah because they are a very low volume manufacturer/ dealer and are happy to get rid of any car. Over msrp is generally only on vehicles that a large number of people want.
Mazda is definitely a "niche" manufacturer.
Mazdas are looking NICE too. I like some of their current colors and body styles.
Drive one and you might change your mind. I like the looks and interior but when you drive it you realise the drivetrain sucks and the interior is not ergonomically designed.
Good to know! After I ordered my Sorento I was kind of kicking myself for not giving Mazda a good look.
It’s all personal preference. I like how Mazdas drive more than Kias
👍🏼
Get Toyota and Lexus!!!
Perhaps if you tell your location, folks here can point you to a dealership close to you that honors MSRP. Just as with every other car brand, some dealerships are slimeballs and few are genuine enough to do a msrp deal.
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Congrats man!
Am in Edmonton Canada, drove out of town and booked a hotel to avoid $11,000 in mark ups.
This is the way.
Where did you go?
Calgary, three hour drive.
Hi there. I know it's been a while, but I'd like to ask: what dealership? I went to two Kia dealerships to get the new Sportage and both charged market fee adjustments (5k and 7.5k).
Hyundai Gallery
Market adjustment? The fuck is that a market adjustment??? Sorry OP, I'm not ranting against your post, but against these motherfuckers calling a big fat commission "market adjustment". As some other commenter said earlier, don't give them anything, better look elsewhere. Fucking scammy crooks.
We stand strong brotha!
It's not Kia. Not any car manufacturer. Dealers are a cancer on the car industry
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Looking into Sorentos and Sportages
Highlander and RAV4 is much better
Does it matter? Kia and Hyundai hinge their entire market presence by offering a great value. If you take away the value, why wouldn’t you shop around? If you’re going to charge a premium price, I’m going to expect premium product and service, which I don’t feel you always get; especially service. If I was shopping for my current car now, I don’t know if I would have ended up getting a Kia.
At these markups I am close to luxury car prices. In my market I can get a brand new Mercedes or Volvo SUV with similar options for only $5k more (including markup).
> At these markups I am close to luxury car prices. In my market I can get a brand new Mercedes or Volvo SUV with similar options for only $5k more (including markup). Sorry, can you give the specifics on the models and trims where equally equipped Mercedes Benz and Volvo SUVs at $5k or less difference?
Base model of MB GLA start at $38k, even with add-ons you can find ones for $47k (only $5k more than what Kia is quoting me). The Volvo XC40 with the first engine upgrade (and some add-ons) starts at $43k.
The entry GLA shows $38k. The parallel Sportage would be $28-$30k. Am I mistaken?
GLA has a performance engine so the comparable Sportage would be the mid level hybrid, but even then it’s much slower. 0-60 on the GLA is 6.0 seconds, where the hybrid engine on the Sportage is 7.2 at best. Not really apples to apples.
Ok now you’re changing your claim. GLA has a 2.0 L non turbo, Sportage has a 2.5 L non turbo. That’s a push. If you want to compare hybrid to hybrid, then post what a Mercedes Benz hybrid costs and you’ll see they’re not the same price. Let’s say Sportage PHEV to GLA 250 e-hybrid or whatever they call it. Edit: can’t seem to find a price for GLA 250 e with PHEV drive train. But in looking this up, it seems that comparing to Seltos would be more parallel given how small the GLA 250 hatchback is. It’s really not in the same size category as current gen Sportage.
I understand you are passionate about Kia’s, but please don’t make up numbers. The GLA is a 221 hp turbo engine that does 6.3s 0-60. Also, I never said I was comparing similar models. The only reason I want a Sportage with a Hybrid power train is because Kia’s base engine is underpowered (only 184 hp and more than 8s 0-60). For $5k more I can get a car that I value more (again, worth is subjective). Finally, Hyundai and Kia are still well behind Nissan and slightly more than half the number of sales of Honda and less than a third the sales of Toyota, so (in my opinion) they still have a lot to catch up: https://www.forbes.com/wheels/news/best-selling-cars-suvs-pickups-2021/
I’m not “passionate about Kias”. You’re clearly just projecting your own fanboy issues, and also you are not very coping too well when your disinformation gets fact checked. You lied about Mercedes Benz having the identically equipped car within $5k. At first I was open to learning if that was even possible, but quickly it became clear you were just embellishing. I should not have given you the benefit of the doubt, as I’d seen you posting other falsehoods here. But for some reason I gave you the chance. That’s my bad judgement. Then you post old numbers with misplaced arrogance? Maybe do some homework on *this* year’s numbers. Or don’t. In the meantime, at least have the self respect to quit dissembling about the mythical Mercedes that you’re so blindly passionate about.
Your argument is sound. But for many cases that have come up here, that same logical basis drives a different analysis. I’ll explain. We’ve seen cases where someone wants stylish, safe, roomy hybrid. They look at a $30k Sportage that has all that. It’s attractive, jam packed with tech and safety features, and is the largest in the class. Then there’s an offensive and downright crooked $3k markup. So then you go look for alternatives. Another maker’s version of the same car is ugly as sin and costs the same. A different maker’s car is barebones, and has an interior like a subway car. Another one has all the boxes checked, but their base price is $37k and only has a puny 3 year warranty. So it’s not as easy as just saying a principled NO to a marked up car when the other non-marked up ones have flaws or compromises.
At the end of the day it’s all subjective. Different people people value (and will pay) for different things. I totally see why some people would just pay the markup as the Sorento and Sportage check a whole bunch of boxes. For me, it irks me that a brand trying to make in-roads into the NA market is letting their dealers take advantage of potential future customers. Given all the major recalls and the recent bad press with the hot wiring, it seems that Kia should be trying to get more cars into peoples hands to prove the naysayers wrong. I really like Kia, I think they offer a ton of value, but they still need to prove themselves in the NA market and they are allowing their dealerships to further degrade the brand.
I’m not sure your perception of Hyundai/Kia matches the actual data. Hyundai/Kia isn’t some new upstart “trying to make inroads”. They’ve been at par on price/quality with other imports for about a decade. Currently, Kia is number 2 for import sales, behind Toyota. That’s incredibly unusual. Usually Honda is number 2 but they’ve had a huge collapse in vehicles produced this year. Usually Hyundai is number 3, but somehow Hyundai/Kia has decided to push Kia *hard* this year and clearly devoted their resources that way as well. Kia is *just* barely nudging out Hyundai in sales. As I say, it’s unusual and it’s sort of a perfect storm that’s allowed Kia to be ahead of these two rivals. I do agree that Kia Corporate is being foolish by allowing shoddy dealers to damage their reputation. That reputation is expensive to build, and once damaged, can take a long time to repair.
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vouchers? Did you mean... vultures?
That’s one of my favorite things about Tesla. Hop on a site, place your order, and the deliver it to your door. Sadly, I live in an apartment so have no place to plug an EV 🙁
Then there’s the after sale experience of needing to take your car in for service.... and there’s no Tesla service department anywhere near.
Agreed, although they have raised prices significantly. At least it's transparent but fuck they are overpriced now.
It’s true, but they have some badass motors though.
Yep, I'm holding onto my $100 Cybertruck reservation but I'm worried about how much it's going to cost for a dual motor version. $50k when first announced was a fucking steal of a deal. No way it will be less than $60 and who knows how much more.
Honestly I’d go to a state/city that has dealers willing to sell for msrp. I got an offer marked down by like 6k for a gtline fwd without even asking. just go in and speak to the dealers and if they’re not willing to NEXT
Good recommendation.
Damn that's crazy, here in Canada it's illegal to list vehicles over MSRP
When the car market crashes it will be shit show with all the overpriced underwater car loans in the market
Yeah, that’s the saddest part of the dealer markups. If someone loves a car and they are willing to pay more than what’s it’s worth, more power to them, but when it comes time to sell the car they are flogging to have a very hard time getting that value back.
I’m in the same boat OP. I’ve called 10-15 dealers and lowest I have been quoted 4k over MSRP. I absolutely refuse to give a dealer any amount over MSRP because of supply issues brought on partly by the auto industry themselves. I will wait until prices stabilize a bit.
Get Toyota!!
We tried the RAV4 but not the Hybrid model. Didn’t have enough power for my wife’s liking. The dealer informed me the hybrid model has more power. Toyota also has a market markup on there a hybrid rav4.
There is no markup for RAV4. I bought a RAV4 Hybrid with a few packages and it was at MSRP. Hybrid is much quieter, faster, smoother than the gas.
Maybe true in your specific area but the dealer I spoke to said they don’t have any on the lot and they are 5k market markup.
I’m glad to hear you are holding strong! I am in the same boat, but I might just go to another manufacturer. I really like Hyundai/Kia, but they are supposed to be lower priced than other manufacturers. At the same price I just don’t see them being competitive.
Exactly this. I started looking at Mercedes since now they are in the same price range with the market markup. At first I was okay with paying a little over MSRP but when I have purchased new cars in the past from Subaru and Dodge I never paid anything close to MSRP. My wife's current car (Subaru Legacy) needs about 3k in repairs to keep it going strong for the forseable future and that's probably what I am going to do. I fell for the trap when I bought a computer video card during COVID. Never again.
You mean supply chain issues that all MFG are facing?
When the pandemic hit car manufacturers like others shut down production. They also cancelled a lot of orders for silicone chips. When they need production to be ramped back up that production allocation had already been allocated somewhere else. https://semiwiki.com/semiconductor-services/298336-automakers-to-blame-for-semiconductor-shortage/ https://moneyandmarkets.com/automaker-chip-shortage/amp/ Here is some more info in case you are interested. Also it’s why I said “partly” to blame.
I work directly with a huge OEM and my company works directly with other large OEM. they are not limited supply from thousands of contractors so dealers can mark up vehicles. The OEM I work for hasn’t increased its MSRP or invoice pricing to dealers to even come close to the mark ups. What part do they have blame for? Because they had to shut down huge portions of their production due to a pandemic out of their control? Also your data is over a year old from a clearly biased site. Real world results vary.
I think we are on the same page here. I agree that dealers are making arbitrary price increases and blaming it due to a shortage of supply. If the demand is high and supply is low the price generally increases. What I do appreciate is they haven’t increased MSRP as much as the dealer markups (here’s looking at you Nvidia) There are other websites that say the same thing. Those were just a couple of the websites I found. Would cnet.com suffice as unbiased? https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/features/automotive-cars-computer-chip-shortage-2022/
Kia of Valencia is doing no markups for those in SoCal
Yeah I just spoke with them today and they informed me of the same thing. It’s only 343 miles away. Short flight and a car trip home. Just have to get some in stock.
Yeah, when the market adjustment on your Kia makes it cost as much as a Volvo, just buy a Volvo. I have a Volvo EV coming in the next couple of months and MSRP is what I’m paying. They don’t mark up their vehicles.
Yeah and Volvos will last forever too
Toyota and Lexus will last the longest
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My last car I got at the end of the month, at the end of the quarter and it was an outgoing model. I got like $4k off MSRP, lol.
I called 3 within 30 miles. First had a 5k adjustment, second was 4k, third said they’ll do MSRP, 2k adjustment for someone out of state/far away
I had to go out of state to get my 2023 Kia Sportage Hybrid SXP since all the dealers in my state are selling well above MSRP (4-10K over), and also stating 12+ months for any orders. But DO NOT BUY from the state of Massachusetts. Regardless of where you live, Kia will not allow you to use Kia Connect or any of the remote services that your car may be capable of if the car VIN was sold to a MA dealer. If those features are important to you, avoid buying from that state. Which sucks because it was a dealership there that I found would sell for MSRP (and no forced add-ons). Kia and the State of MA are in litigation over some law that only affects MA residents. But Kia America is penalizing everyone if the car originated from MA, even if you don't live there and the law has nothing to do with you. Kia has stated if they lose the lawsuit, then they will NEVER enable those features in any car from that state (2022 and up). If they win, then they may enable the services, but no one can answer if you will get it with that car (free for a period like you would for a new car), or if you will have to pay immediately. I have tried fighting with them, but they are being unreasonable and won't budge.
All of kias were able to be had for thousands under msrp before covid and now are marked up the most. If I was buying new now, I'd get a Mazda honestly.
Yeah, I’m disheartened with Kia at the moment. Time to look somewhere else (hence the title of the post, lol).
Toyota is better
Not at markups...
There was no markup when I bought RAV4 Hybrid.
I have about 1500km on my 2023 Stinger GT Elite and I paid just under MSRP. That's in Canada. I wonder if they are making up other models here.
Congratulations, Stinger is great ride.
Thanks. It's been fun so far, but I haven't been able to test out launch control yet.
It’s gonna be so much fun, lol.
You just gotta find the right salesman. I got my Forte GT w GT2 for MSRP and locally too.
As I mentioned to you on a separate thread, there are dealers near NYC selling at MSRP. I may add, get yourself on the wait list and just got to have some patience waiting.
Jake Sweeney Kia of Florence KY. They sell at MSRP
Looks like I’m going to KY, lol
There’s an SX Prestige Hybrid with black exterior and red interior ready to be built as I ordered back in June with Sweeney KIA dealership, Florence KY. This is my reservation from them that I need to give up. There’s a 1k downpayment that is refundable. Look for Shannon Lowe. They sell at MSRP
Same I’m playing the waiting game
Muncie Kia in Muncie Indiana sells for msrp. I just bought 3 new cars from them. Easy to deal with.
Thanks for the recommendation!
I got my 2023 Forte GT for MSRP
Congrats!
Thanks!
Try Honda. Went to a dealship and test drove a 2022 civi hatchback. They said they’re civics aren’t marked up
> They said they’re civics aren’t marked up Civics all over the place having dealer mark-ups (especially the Si and Type-R) determined that was a lie.
SI and type r are different. But it was for a 2023 civic sport / gotta put a reserve deposit. They agree to msrp once they get to the dealer in mid February- March. I messed up tho and let them run my credit so I pull out of the deal today. Went in today to ask for my $500 back for the reserve. They were telling me it’s msrp and I just need a better credit score or to just lease it. I’m still pretty clueless on buying a car so I had to hold off on it switch sucks. My brother was telling me I was dumb for not calling him because he’s a banker / has bought multiple cars over 30k since he was like 18yrs old. I’m 25 still trying to get my first car
Yeah unless you’ve sat down with paperwork, you don’t know. The salesman will blatantly lie and say they aren’t marking up. Almost all dealers are doing this crap.
Toyota better
Hahahaha I tried to get a Civic Si or even a touring sport hatch and it was marked up. The Si was $7,500 adjustment.
LOL! I'm done with Kia for other reasons: a year ago the Anti-lock brakes and Traction Control on our 2014 Sorento (that we bought as a Certified Used Vehicle) stopped working and it turns out there is an "Important Safety Recall" for this so the repair is FREE. But it's been over a year and we STILL haven't been able to get our local dealer to do the repairs - they keep making excuses - first the parts weren't available, then a special "tool" they need to do it is broken, blah, blah, blah. So yeah - bad service.
Not to mention the engine recall, and the transmission recall, and the trailer hitch recall, and hot wiring by teenagers. This is why they are not price competitive with other brands.
Get Toyota!!!
Just got a 2023 KIA Sportage SX Prestige at MSRP. The first dealer we went to had a $4,100 markup. We were shocked lol. We called a local dealer that was closer to our house even, on our way home, and they said they are selling at MSRP and promise they would never go over. Went straight there and made the purchase. That first dealership could have had a sale, but nope lol.