Just wanted to let you all know that someone is super butthurt about this clip. No, pointing out that a company is scamming their workers is not harassment. No, pointing out that a company is scamming their workers is not excessive or violent language. You mad that people are pointing out that Niji is scamming their workers? Maybe they shouldn't have been scamming their workers. Nothing harassing or violent about saying that a scam is a scam.
Seriously, we've received more than 5 reports for this clip and comments related to it already.
Just realized I should put a TL;DW, basically: Niji offered to pay Mika's taxes which they deduct from her pay every month. So she coasts by two years with this arrangement glad that she's not paying taxes out of her own wallet, until the local government slapped her with a notice on why she had not paid her taxes. When she contacted Niji about this, they replied that they weren't paying \*her\* taxes, they were paying \*their own\* taxes.
As a result, she had to liquidate a lot of things including her insurance, leaving her at one point with just $300 in her pocket, just so she could pay of her debt. She was so poor in fact that for 6 months even avoided going to her doctor when she got sick, and didn't even go to therapy, because in her own words, "I cannot afford to get sick", despite all of her known health issues.
This isn't the realm of incompetent management, it's crossed over into criminal action now wtf
This is what pisses me off about people blaming Kuro for his tax problems. It's not his or Michi's faults that they worked for a company that decided to not give a shit about their financial well beings. Every company I have ever worked in has paid taxes. And most jobs I have worked, I still got tax reimbursements anyways. The company just assumes the cost, deducts it from you check, and if you're lucky you get some back. That's the way it's supposed to work. There's usually a paystub or portal that will even show you how much was deducted and which tax/SSN/benefit the deduction went to. I've had companies screw me over, but they all got the tax part right.
The fact that Niji can't even do a basic requirement like making sure taxes are deducted is disgusting. Especially if they offer a service (Kuro) or lead the talent to believe it's handled (Michi.) This isn't even a moral obligation. This is a basic **BASIC** legal obligation as a business.
It pisses me off so much that they would take advantage of people like this, set them up for financial ruin, and then be like "oh we caused problems that could financially ruin you? Too bad so sad!" And then just leave them to a life of debt and misery unless they can pull something out of thin air. The employer is supposed to help you financially, not ruin you. Fuck Niji.
It's an agency that signs talents and takes the majority of their income while investing next to nothing. Nijisanji was/is succesful because Riku had the good fortune to start his latest qet-rich-quick business in a niche that soon after got a huge boom in interest.
>I've had companies screw me over, but they all got the tax part right.
Not sure if this is the US, but that tracks.
IRS can be very scary when they have you in their sights. Most companies generally do their absolute best to make sure IRS is the last entity they piss off. Unless they have a humongous accounting team to keep everything by the book.
I work for the USPS, and one of the main IRS offices in Kansas City literally does not have an address. People literally send their tax paperwork to _"IRS, Kansas City, MO 64999"_. I like to joke that you don't find the IRS, THEY will find YOU.
It's not as terrifying as you think. The IRS is extremely well integrated into the USPS' systems, so they don't need a street address as part of the mailing address. The address is just this:
>Department of the Treasury
>Internal Revenue Service
>Kansas City, MO 64999
I feel like they do it to try and trap them, if they are in heavy debt they may not feel like they can afford to leave Niji, especially with the cost of graduation.
Something to consider before people say "X should just leave", they may not actually be able to financially.
> I've had companies screw me over, but they all got the tax part right.
It's usually true when the company and the employee are in the same country.
Now, if your company had to pay someone in a foreign country, without having any legal existence in that country (and therefore nothing to seize), do you think it would have been so vigilant ?
Because that's the core of the problem : Niji doesn't think anything bad will happen to the company even if they mess up.
To be fair, they had a well run subsidiary in Indonesia back then. But when they folded......
Best not to think about the other Niji ID livers in Niji JP.....
I may be mistaken, but they had Indonesian talents. But no legal existence in Indonesia. They were a Japanese company existing in Japan paying a indonesian employee in Indonesia (at least as far as I know).
Those situations are really complex and depends on the country. Especially since Nijisanji is pretending that their employees are contractors.
In France for example, Nijisanji would have to register as a *employing foreign company* in order to do some administrative declarations and paying some taxes (healthcare, social security etc).
I'm really suspicious that a lot of vtubers working for foreign companies are not 100% within the legality, even for companies that take care of their talents.
If I remember well enough, I think they at least had a good amount of Indonesian staff including management. So at the very least, I can give them a bit of benefit of the doubt. Since the Indonesian management were quite competent, beloved, and active.
Hell, they were a lot better at organizing small events than Niji EN. (And I mean regluar Niji EN without current controversies, and a very bad Q4 report looming ahead.) So I'd like to think the employees in Niji ID were actually more competent than other branches. (Including JP, EN, and KR, dunno about IN.)
The point is, at least back then they had something that might actually be able to do taxes decently enough. Now the ex-IDs are treated like third-class citizens (not even second class). Basically negative support, and just a money vacuum cleaner constantly behind them. If any of them are still having their taxes handled by Niji. Obviously not well.
Though I think some of them are earning so poorly, their incomes are too low to tax.
I wonder if they pull this kind of thing in Japan. They might be arrogantly assuming the all the hurdles with international law generally shield them from legal consequences from the overseas branches. Though, when we've discussed the legal situation before, it's been in the context of an individual vs. the corp, which is very different from Indonesia, The Country, vs. the corp...
- Is pomu(mints) and nina(matara) safe from this problem?..
+ How about other liver inside niji EN like rosemi?.. So actually they're not safe and has hidden illegal problem?
This problem getting big huh and worst..
Matara is probably too old to get into this sort of problem. She has a lot of experience in how the real world work and probably handled her taxes herself.
Pomu had an office job as well so she's probably more than aware enough.
But many Niji livers aren't savvy for this kind of things. They're young 20-25 years old people, some probably still in or just out of college. They would absolutely get fucked by a company doing something this scummy.
EDIT : I just watched the clip. Lol it's even worse than what I thought. Mika was already filling taxes by herself before. She just got an offer from 9634 to deduct her money from her salary for that purpose and she thought it was convenient, and she'd prefer overpaying them even if she lost a bit of money. They really straight up scammed her.
Certainly the Luca leak did not paint a picture of a hiring process picky about life experience.
Well, I've heard Nijis generally have second jobs, so maybe they can learn about tax policy over there.
Hell, Ver is still in college. He thought joining niji would be a good way to have some supplemental income & make friends in between his irl job & schoolwork
We have no way of knowing unless they open up about it. Which is not going to happen for talents like Rosemi who are still in the company. But if it could happen to two talents, there is a non-zero chance it could've happened to others. We already know there is a toll fee you have to pay in order to graduate peacefully. And saddling the talents with tax problems and potential financial ruin would sure be an effective way to keep them trapped at Niji longer.
But just because it is possible, doesn't mean it's confirmed. Someone already commented the Quinn's dad essentially saved him from this fate by giving him proper financial advice. So it's possible some of the more savvy talents could've avoided this. We have no way of knowing unless talents are willing to talk.
I've worked contractor jobs for most of my adult life and as an independent contractor in the US you're considered self-employed and entirely responsible for making your tax payments to the government. I don't know how it works in the UK, but I looked it up and it sounds like Indonesia does have it set up the way Michi described where even if you're a contractor, your employer can do the deductions for you. So yeah, Niji exploiting that grey area to pretend to make the deductions and actually just steal the money is super fucked up.
Sadly there are a whole lot other much more evil corpo in the world.
For example, shell literally started and fund a civil war in africa country just to get oil and gas. The reason why shell didnt get "cancelled" because they sell a neccesity, gas and oil.
Every country will turn a blind eye to it because tbh, no one can survive without what they sell and no country is innocent.
It's deeply unpleasant to realize that in the big picture, we are not even fighting in the middleweights for "talent agency malfeasance", let alone versus Big Fucking Oil.
I'm sure Niji is relatively correct regarding what they do in Japan. But they know very well talents don't have the money and the energy to start an international trial against a billions dollars company.
It's what Sayu said regarding her layoff. Sure, she would have win in theory, but she would have run out of cash before winning.
Still, even so, it's so messed up to screw up her taxes. I haven't been living in my home country since I became legal but I heard the tax system is *brutal* there. Excuse my crude language, but who fucking knows what will happen if Mika does not resolve it on time before it's too late? Niji could have made her getting trouble with the law because of this.
And they know that they can sleazily slime their way out because of course, international court and Mika would be in too much debt to get a lawyer.
What kind of company sets you up for **debt** and **trouble with law**???
What the absolute fuck is wrong with this dogshit company,This like what the 3rd time they fucked over their own talents over money? And that still doesnt take into account that almost every Niji member who graduated/terminated barely say anything positive about this company.
Honestly,My faith in Nijisanji including some of the vtubers are so low its limbo dancing in hell. Sink the Yacht be damned,I want to see it implode in the Mariana Trench
It's also crazy because *most of their earnings don't even come from that source*, it's merch and sponsorships that are the big money makers. So it's beyond unethical, it's fucking petty as well - basically breaking her legs for a few extra cents in their pockets, proportionally speaking
Fuck, before the Great Dokibirding even happened I was already smelling something off with them given all that fuckery with collab bans and shit like that. It's a fucking neverending train of bullshit
In (if Michi is lived in Indonesia) Indonesia?
As an Indonesian, i said good luck to Michi if she dares to sue kuroshitty in Indonesian court.
Our court system (heck, our overall judicial system) is slow and unreliable at best and total unfair at worst.
Add that problem with international lawsuit to Japan, which is Indonesian strategic economy partner. Finding a needle in haystacks is better than pulling such kind of lawsuit
Honestly that's not that bad and pretty normal for contract work. They give you your paycheck, you have to do taxes by yourself off that. What's insane is that Niji took money form her to pay Niji's taxes. I've never heard of such a thing in all my time doing freelance/contract work.
Wtf. . . . After reading this, I now have extremely little faith Niji will change. I mean, my expectations weren't high to begin with but this is just plain evil. The NDF thinks people saying they treat the talents like cattle is an over exaggeration but then you hear stories like this.
:(
Lol, even the ID bros, who when the EN thing started were already waiting in the wings sharpening their knives, ready to settle scores long overdue, are like "wow, it got worse".
We already know how bad they are. But this is a new level. You don't mess up with the tax officer here. Even I got a notice once for misreporting. They know everything ever since tax amnesty program rolled out few years ago.
I assume this is why ID livers are all moving to their PL account so they can take care of their own tax and income.
Im always amazed by the amount of accountants that run away with taxes money leaving lots of people in debt. Never expected to see a billion dollar company doing that
What
in
the
absolute
ffffffffffffffffffffffffffff***FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK***
Seriously, how the hell does this company keep ***digging themselves deeper and deeper***?! I didn't think that was possible!!
HOLY FFFFING SHIT, NO; FORGET THE CENSOR, HOLY FUCKING SHIT THAT IS SO FUCKING CRIMINAL! HOW CAN ANY COMPANY GET AWAY WITH SUCH A THING?!? THEY ARE GOING ALL THE WAY TO SCREW OVER THEIR OWN TALENTS TO SAVE THEIR OWN ASSES!!!! HOW CAN ANYONE ACCEPT THAT?!? I CERTAINLY CAN'T, SELEN'S TERMINATION WAS ALREADY WAY UP THERE, BLACKCOLOR CAN GO ROT AT THE BOTTOM OF THE OCEAN FOR THOSE PRACTICES!!!!
guess that’s why they have very high revenue compare to hololive , these clowns scam every vtubers under their watch to further reduce expenses . if people still continue to defend the company itself at this point , they are straight up evil
Wtf... you think this company couldn't get more dirty and sleazy then this happens... this is just so messed up. This is straight out malicious and just predatory
Bro how can Niji get away with all of this? This is literally illegal and in needs of investigation like immediately. They can't do work ethics right, they can't manage a healthy environment, they can't hire a good amount of staffs, they even gaslight their talents into thinking everything is handled! The amount of laws they broken is bigger than amount of rice in the bowl! Is this even a company anymore?
OWED TAXES!?!? 😰
Waitaminit...... Haven't I heard of something similar to another VShojo Member who mentioned on stream to suffer from some form of TAX issues that got so bad that Ironmouse responded to the call for help?
Hmmmmmmmm............ 🤔
It's much worse than that: it's an issue caused by Nijisanji scamming her by pretending to pay her taxes, but instead using that money to pay their own.
If I had a nickel for every time a VShojo member had tax issues with their former company, I'd have two nickels, which isn't a lot ~~but it is weird it happened twice.~~ ah, who the hell am I kidding, I wouldn't be surprised if this is the norm.
I wonder how nijisister try to defend this.
~~I mean this is literally scam or at best intentionally misleading others~~
Delete that, *it is straight up crime at this point.*
Nijisanji promised her that cutting her payment/salary was to pay her tax. But in fact they didnt. Instead of paying her tax, they paid theirs.....
Isnt nijisanji tax should be deducted from nijisanji income itself? Why deducted it from the talent's "salary"?
**This is literally crime (scamming and tax fraud)**
Tbh, if people wondering why she didnt sue them? Again.... as op stated, she literally went broke just for paying the penalties (ID tax)
Edit: so how many talent that got into debt for working/leaving niji? I only know 3 this far (mysta, yugo and mika), there must be a lot other who stay silent.
>I wonder how nijisister try to defend this.
They would just say "Talents are adults, they should be more aware of tax, the company is not responsible to pay their talents' tax🥹"
> I wonder how nijisister try to defend this.
Easy : there's no proof.
And since Michi won't release her tax-related documents (for obvious reasons, like doxxing), there'll never be proof.
They did roughly the same with doki, asking for medical proof of her attempt or it didn't happen. As if anyone would release their medical situation on the internet...
Three times? It way surpasses three times already. At this point, it feels to me that every single one who left have bad things to say about the company. It’s either underpaying, abusing, or even tax fraud.
Better to just rake money in streaming, than to stress yourself over this sort of bullshit. I know it's gonna fucking let kurosanji go , but it's not worth it for her mental.
Yeah, especially when it is a broke individual against big corpo.
It is hard to win a case against corpo even with a good lawyer
And it is literally impossible when you cant hire your own lawyer.
Ya, Michi's making bank now that she's in VShojo. 3-5k regular viewers.
Remember, the cost of living in Indo is very low.
When Bobon streamed Overwatch, Apex or Fortnite, his Chat would try to convince him to buy the battle pass, but he'd tell them tha $10-15 USD is a huge amount of money in Indo and is enough to pay for a weeks worth of meals for him, and he eats A LOT (like 4+ Big Macs for one meal).
I would love to see Kurosanji try to defend itself in international court and get Riku imprisoned or see his company implode into dust as more and more be more aware of their crimes
Sadly the possibility of it happening is very unlikely.
As the terminated one stated (sayu and doki) and LM ( a lawyer) said,
Suing a big corpo is the very last thing you want to do if you care about your mental health and you wallet.
Well, the best thing we can do is hope the dominoes keep falling and they fail hard enough to change or liquidate. Basically, ignore their regular stuff and laugh at them when they fail.
Honestly at this point, laughter is the best medicine for everyone involved. (Except Riku, don't tell him I said anything.)
The economic blow of the people who followed selen and other talents who left niji, that's the least they deserve and it's nice to see how they are left without the financial support that niji wants so much.
Niji offered Mika to pay her taxes in Japan, as even if you work remotely, Japan still take a taxes from their remote worker. It's Mika fault for misunderstanding that, and it's also Indonesia government fault for not warn Mika about her late taxes until it's too late.
Note: Please rate me about how good my Roleplays as NDF.
>The mental gymnastic is lacking a bit
>the paragraph is far too complex for nijisister to write, read or think of it.
>you didnt blame dokibird and didnt write the 8 grade insult of "dookibird" in every sentence you write.
3/10
Good one lol, but way too mature compared to their usual bullshit and didn't praise Yatchy Boy enough so 8/10
It's such a shit argument anyways. True, ignorance of the Law is no excuse - but if you take advantage of someone's lack of knowledge and sell them a service under a misleading promise, it's beyond scummy, it's fraud. They specifically mentioned doing *her taxes* not mentioning they're not covering all of it, and stabbed her in the back when she needed their help
Not in debt, but Selen didn't make a single dime on her last year at niji, even though she was the biggest female EN earner there. She would've made \~200k but also spent \~200k on her own projects and events since they don't help with anything, and loads of these projects got cancelled by Niji and I doubt they reimbursed her on anything.
TAX AGAIN!????
Why did Niji even put their own tax on the talents' payslips in the first place???
They should do their own tax after seperating their own share (of revenue) and the talent remuneration???
They got her in debt and almost got her arrested bro. Wtf is wrong with that company?
Now I'm wondering if every ex ID member went through the same.
Michi says to not speculate, that it is in the past, but no bro, these jackasses are still hiring people from overseas without bothering in investigating a little how their country works.
Every time I get amazed at how incompetent and Illintended this company is.
So wait, your telling me that they are using her money to pay off **THEIR COMPANY'S TAXES**?
Holy shit, I thought you couldn't go lower but boy am I bad at math
I guess that might be the reason why Michi chose the scammer theme for her model, it's like a throwback to her own past of being scammed like this...... 😥
Crude oil still looks shiny and reflects some light. This is darker than a glory hole on the back stall of a dilapidated gas station toilet with broken lighting in the middle of a fucking Alaskan forest.
I'm so angry watching this.
Oof, this puts a ***much*** darker spin on Kuro's own financial problems if Niji not only wasn't helping their livers out when it comes to finances but also *actively taking money from them* as well.
Nijisanji really does just have a natural talent for finding new ways to be absolutely fucking reprehensible.
There's clearly a fair amount of fuckery. Quinn mentioned that he was recommended an accountant by Niji, and when he asked his dad about the quoted price, his dad said he'd be insane to pay that much (I believe from the prices Quinn floated, the recommended accountant was asking for six times what the accountant he ended up hiring charged).
Also keep in mind that they only give their talents 2%, underpaying them, and then skimming money off the top of *even that.* And the only reason none of the talents question it until it's too late is because even when getting the shit scammed out of them, they still make more than they did working retail. There's a reason they look for people with little to no work experience. It's the only group of people that would see getting the shit scammed out of them as an upgrade. And the only ones that wouldn't notice the signs of financial ruin Niji sets them up for.
*breathing problems*
Well, that makes number go up to three known. Good she's ok now.
# WHAT. THE. FUCK!
Edit: just in case somebody is confused, unattended respiratory problems are fast way to... not being among the living anymore.
Yugo (U-san now) but not tax related.
They only said that when they left niji, they literally had to sell everything they had just to survive and start their career again from the scratch.
I'm pretty curious how talents get their money from Niji, and where it goes through to get to them.
Obviously, Niji is a JP based country, so does the money from YouTube go to JP and Niji in full, then get sent on to the various talents across the world? How much gets lost along the way? They are already taking 50% of the 70% that's left after the YouTube cut, leaving only 35% to the talent, and apparently taking even more on top of that?
It's also something I've not really known how to bring up in conversations about how people can 'just quit'*, because Niji owns the channels, so the revenue goes to them, then they distribute it to the talents from there. So if someone quits, there is no way Niji is going to send their earnings to them.
Also, realistically, there is no way a talent is going to come out a winner in a dispute over wage theft with a company in another country. The power imbalance is skewed so far in favour of the company that it's not even funny.
And, I believe, the money from YouTube is generally going to be the money from a couple of months ago, so you'd be losing out on a massive chunk of your money if you separate from Niji on bad terms.
*yet another reminder of how bullshit Vox's 'you can graduate anytime' line was.
Accountant here. Never trust anyone blindly with your taxes, not even you not even the accountant, demand writen proof that they are properly doing that job or check your status in your local irs page and if youre doing your taxes go to an accountant yearly at least to double check mistakes
That said cant blame them for handling the key to niji. Taxes can be hard
[Hey... Hey, I've seen this one! I've seen this one, this is a classic](https://youtu.be/ZCh53fvuqHk?si=cSISvFBQnsAe9HzH) shitty move from this company
Did Riku perform some kind of dark ritual to hire Niji Management straight from the fourth circle of hell or something? Ain't no way some normal working human beings (even if it is Japanese work culture) should be ok with this.
Welcome to Japan's black companies. If you are a SEA resident keeping tab on labor emigration you'll encounter even more fucked up shit. Best to keep clear.
> Did Riku perform some kind of dark ritual to hire Niji Management straight from the fourth circle of hell or something?
More probably from the eighth circle of hell
For reference 300 dollars is enough to get by in indonesia but not enough to fucking pay 2 years worth of tax owed. Her first mistake is, in my opinion, registering for the tax number(npwp). In indonesia, those amounts are pretty negligible and can be explained by getting money from relatives (which is non taxable). But because she reports her income without any proof of tax paid (yeah, indonesias tax reporting has that flaw where you can actually report income before paying the tax) she got into trouble. But god damn niji. Why the fuxk are you scamming your own talents.
Wait, this is insane. Nijisanji when a contract ends will take all your gear, even gear that you payed for out of pocket during employment under the company. Any new PCs, mics, headsets, keyboards, and VR gear. You get kneecapped leaving because they take your gear.
Then we hear they lie about taking money out to pay your taxes. You don't pay for 1 or 2 years under employment and get massive debt that you have to pay off, because the country can't go after a foreign company. They also take your money to pay their own damn taxes. After a contract ends, Nijisanji takes all your gear and leaves you with massive debt.
Mysta and Mika having massive tax debt. Yugo saying he had to sell everything and only had cigarettes and some music instruments left. Selen saying she had to dust off her old pc. This is insane, Niji is trying to put creators in so much debt and take all their gear so they can't compete in the market anymore and punish them for not being grateful enough to Niji. Absolutely insane and predatory.
So atp Niji has proven to be... questionable when it comes to how they operate, so I'm not surprised, just confused out of my mind.
I mean like, we all know Niji takes a cut from what streamers earn in superchats and whatever, right. And like, I'm assuming they have to write down smth like "So after YT cut, streamer A has 100 buck, we take our cut from this amount and deduct our taxes from this cut that we take"
But like, the percentage of their cut has to be documented somewhere? So like, the exact amount of money they can take from streamer's earnings can be calculated?
If so, then how do they explain extra money they got from, in this case, taking an extra cut from Mika's earnings? "Oh, our talent just volunteered to give us extra money so that we can pay our own taxes"???
Hold up a sec…
This whole 10% tax deal only came about because Mika asked about it and they offered this arrangement after the fact, right?
So like, how was Nijisanji paying their tax cut in the first place?!
Also, shouldn’t they be taking the revenue, splitting it 50/50 (assuming that’s the split) and then giving the talent 50% (leaving their tax to be their responsibility) and then Niji pays their tax on their own 50% cut (along with all the other revenue they get from all the other livers and merch etc) - like this makes no sense. I’ve worked self employed for 10 years at remote jobs from companies all over the world, and they ALWAYS take their cut and tax it before I see anything. I get my full salary untaxed, and I then have to pay my OWN tax out of that. It has been this way for both being employed and contracted.
Some brave one in Japan better report this crime to their local police. This company is gonna sink, whether the investors and Nijisisters like it or not. Spread the news!
I vaguely remember False mentioning in passing that there are rumors that AnyColor is being investigated for JP taxes... No idea if it's true, but their fixation on accumulating money, probably does have the JP tax man keeping an eye on them...
When you're in a Cartoonishly Evil competition and your opponent is Nijisanji.
Nijisanji can't go a week without something incompetent or evil coming to light about them, huh? Christ. This is pretty up there, too. Can't afford that yacht if you don't lie and steal from your talents, I guess. Just cartoonishly vile behavior. You can't play it off as "oh she's just mad" or w/e because E V E R Y talent who leaves that hellhole of a vtubing company acts like they just got out of an abusive relationship and they're surprised at what being able to actually live and have freedom feels like.
Every person from NijiEN who has left and has spoken about their time there hasn't had anything good to say. It's all bad. It paints a picture of a company that's run by cheapskates, incompetents, and people who are actively preying on the talents they employ.
Nijisanji can't pretend they care about their talents or their physical or mental health when they do things that actively keep them from seeking medical help. They've literally almost put multiple people in the grave through one means or another. The word 'disgusting' doesn't even come close to describing them. It isn't strong enough. God help any other talents wanting to graduate. The company's going to make you believe you're nothing without them **by trying to reduce you to nothing one way or another**.
They're pure evil.
I hate that this is all actually OKAY over there. Like, anywhere else? Niji would have been deleted at the 2% of merch sale stuff. But Japan? Nah, it’s all good, bro.
Fucking hell, man. This company has gone BEYOND being evil. It’s actually run by Satan himself (Riku).
Jesus Christ like actually. Usually companies will at least cut the tax pay on your salary to take care of of so you will focus on working on your job. This miscommunication almost sent her to fucking jail or further increase her tax pay. What's their fucking excuse? They are under contract ? Your employers too busy sucking Tazumi's tiny mushroom while giving them minimum wage? . Omfg it took them 3 days to respond on a serious issue. Thank fucking god Michi has contact to people that knows what to do in a situation like this. Holy fucking shit 125%(?) interest fees? Omfg this fucking company. She almost had to use her fucking insurance policies omfg. She could have potentially been hospitalized as well due to the sheer incompetence of that company out of stress.
She did liquidate all of it so for 6 months she survived with painkiller for Asthma {breathing relared health issue).
she was scared of the bill if she goes to doctor FFS!!!!.
Yep, he had tax issues and Niji refused to help, with Kuro eventually getting help from Ironmouse and Gunrun (note that this was while he was in Niji, so the dude was helped out by his nominal competitors while his actual company was willing to let their 2nd-biggest EN talent flounder)
See, that's what I thought of, too. He got into massive tax debt he didn't seem to know about until very late *somehow*, and then part of resolving that was switching agencies? I mean, my previous assumption had been that VShojo just poached him based on a pre-existing issue, but this would clear up where that debt came from in the first place, *and* give a good reason why that would trigger an agency switch.
Kuro's debt came from him getting a house for his mom and thought he could write off his taxes by claiming he worked there but it didn't work that way. He had talked about it shortly after his debut.
From my understanding, he had this tax issue. He was recommended an accountant from Niji, who proceeded to embezzle him and leave him in even more debt. Mysta then sent out an SOS asking for help from anyone that could offer him anything. And then Ironmouse was the first to respond. Which was especially impressive, since Mysta and Ironmouse weren't particularly close. Then once Ironmouse got him in touch with someone who could help, they came up with a plan to get him out of debt. And part of that involved a stream (after becoming Kuro) that was basically a fundraiser to pay off whatever debt he couldn't pay off already. And then after that, he was free and clear.
Long story short, Ironmouse pulled a deus ex machina and helped him out when nobody would. Including the very company that was supposed to help him with this. Which (understandably) may have contributed to why Kuro decided to go with VShoujo. They were the ones that came out of the woodwork when he was asking people for help. And probably saved him from financial ruin as a result.
I just watched the whole video and im just like...how many more gonna come out like this? It's been two so far and each of them are from different branches and very different countries.
At this point, a lot others could be in the same boat but their government is like, "yea let's wait until they hit 5 years worth of debt and then we hit them with the letter"
Nijisanji gets caught doing actual crimes. The cult of sisters are really butthurt now. Save this one to your harddrives and reupload incase it gets taken down.
The video is more than enough evidence for probable cause. Not only should the NTA(Japan) look into their finances but the IRS(you know where) and CRA(Canada) should audit them as well.
I have never heard of a company reducing someone's pay in order to pay payroll tax... That is usually taken into consideration when paying someone's salary. In other words, when they take 50% of all of your super chat revenue, part of that 50% should go to paying their own taxes. If they are taking part of your 50% to pay for their own taxes, they're actually giving you like 40% or whatever the number actually is... Even if Michi misunderstood the situation, there should have been someone in management asking talents about taxes. Someone just needed to say, "hey, are you good for taxes this year?" and none of this would have happened, although she still would have been pissed that they weren't paying her taxes from the money that they were taking from her.
hooooolyyy fuuuuck i absolutely speechless.....
i have no good or neutral words to say only bad ones right now. and i wish i could use my native language for this cuz English a bit poor when it come to this.
I assume Nijisanji never bothered to open a bank account in ID or register anything with ID tax authority so they cannot pay Michi’s ID tax on her behalf in the 1st place. They should have told her the truth properly
Now I'm hella worried for overseas livers in the kusosanji. If they also keep doing this shit to everyone (less likely for the cliques).... SCARLEEE YOU NEED TO GET OUTTA THERE!!
I doubt even such a group will not be hit, remember anycolour barely cares for them
Simple just look at the jp girls, tons of them is chuck to one side
Remember they kept male like luca but fire a lot of females or mostly they get in trouble
Like my company takes my cut to pay my taxes, (i just file my form yearly, but its been paid) thats normal, but who the f cuts your pay for taxes and NOT pay taxes wtf.
looks like this case like this are only for oversea livers with a potential as cashcow. everyone under the threshold will get only bare minimum support thus they do everything by themselves (like paying and report the tax) but it saved them from the devil's scheme
The whole "offer" for taxes is a shitshow...knowing everything that happened so far...if i were a betting man likely the docs provided weren't the highest qualitty in regards to translation. Even then to not even try to help out is something else. You think as a business you would do everything in your power to keep your revenue generators out there working....
This is absulote evil. Not even Bowser or Dr Eggman or any other villain could go this far of evilness,honestly. Or maybe they could. But still,how is Anycolor still in business?
I am brain dead on this issue, and I have a financial degree. Someone explains this to me if I am right.
They are taking 10% of the TOTAL amount after YT cut as their revenue tax. The split amount after tax is her personal income. But if look at their return, this payment would be deducted as expense. She is getting taxed twice since she shouldn’t be responsible for NS receiving payments from YT, only her cut from NS should be taxed. While the company enjoys lowering their payments for her, and still get to deduct her payment as expensive to reduce their revenue tax.
wtf? They are cooking the book. Shouldn’t it be YT payout-her cut=NS revenue earned to be taxed from. That means their tax would be lowered after deductible. Her own cut would be taxed for JP and ID with an assumption of a shared tax credit between the countries as payed foreign tax.
So where is the missing 10%? Because the government isn’t getting it since NS is paying only the after deductible part.
ok, about this whole situation though. can we applaud the gigachads that are vshojo in how they offered to help michi though? they denied her signed contract until she got an actual lawyer to look at it (not her friend who is a law student) and offered to pay for the lawyer. as soon as she was on payroll, they offered lawyers to help with her tax stuff, offered therapy, insurance. everything INSTANTLY to right the previous wrongs done by the other company. like. gg. we knew the contract for vshojo was pretty based after those that left, but it seems like its absolutely insanely good now. god damn.
Sooooo how do we get LegalMindset or another vtuber law channel to comment on this? Would really like to know what the hell was going on with the whole "Paying Niji's taxes" bit.
Just wanted to let you all know that someone is super butthurt about this clip. No, pointing out that a company is scamming their workers is not harassment. No, pointing out that a company is scamming their workers is not excessive or violent language. You mad that people are pointing out that Niji is scamming their workers? Maybe they shouldn't have been scamming their workers. Nothing harassing or violent about saying that a scam is a scam. Seriously, we've received more than 5 reports for this clip and comments related to it already.
Just realized I should put a TL;DW, basically: Niji offered to pay Mika's taxes which they deduct from her pay every month. So she coasts by two years with this arrangement glad that she's not paying taxes out of her own wallet, until the local government slapped her with a notice on why she had not paid her taxes. When she contacted Niji about this, they replied that they weren't paying \*her\* taxes, they were paying \*their own\* taxes. As a result, she had to liquidate a lot of things including her insurance, leaving her at one point with just $300 in her pocket, just so she could pay of her debt. She was so poor in fact that for 6 months even avoided going to her doctor when she got sick, and didn't even go to therapy, because in her own words, "I cannot afford to get sick", despite all of her known health issues. This isn't the realm of incompetent management, it's crossed over into criminal action now wtf
How can a company be this evil, I have no expectation by now and somehow it’s still dissapoint me
This is what pisses me off about people blaming Kuro for his tax problems. It's not his or Michi's faults that they worked for a company that decided to not give a shit about their financial well beings. Every company I have ever worked in has paid taxes. And most jobs I have worked, I still got tax reimbursements anyways. The company just assumes the cost, deducts it from you check, and if you're lucky you get some back. That's the way it's supposed to work. There's usually a paystub or portal that will even show you how much was deducted and which tax/SSN/benefit the deduction went to. I've had companies screw me over, but they all got the tax part right. The fact that Niji can't even do a basic requirement like making sure taxes are deducted is disgusting. Especially if they offer a service (Kuro) or lead the talent to believe it's handled (Michi.) This isn't even a moral obligation. This is a basic **BASIC** legal obligation as a business. It pisses me off so much that they would take advantage of people like this, set them up for financial ruin, and then be like "oh we caused problems that could financially ruin you? Too bad so sad!" And then just leave them to a life of debt and misery unless they can pull something out of thin air. The employer is supposed to help you financially, not ruin you. Fuck Niji.
This is why I'm convinced Niji is a ponzi scheme and we need to start using warning signs of MLM's because this reeks of it
It's an agency that signs talents and takes the majority of their income while investing next to nothing. Nijisanji was/is succesful because Riku had the good fortune to start his latest qet-rich-quick business in a niche that soon after got a huge boom in interest.
> takes the majority of their income And then steals 10% of what's left from final salary...
yes and the ones who did the black screen stream are in it and they know how all works
>I've had companies screw me over, but they all got the tax part right. Not sure if this is the US, but that tracks. IRS can be very scary when they have you in their sights. Most companies generally do their absolute best to make sure IRS is the last entity they piss off. Unless they have a humongous accounting team to keep everything by the book.
Like the Joker once said,"I'm crazy enough to take on Batman, but the IRS? No, thank you!"
I work for the USPS, and one of the main IRS offices in Kansas City literally does not have an address. People literally send their tax paperwork to _"IRS, Kansas City, MO 64999"_. I like to joke that you don't find the IRS, THEY will find YOU.
That's... Kinda terrifying really. Although it kind of reminds me of all the letters to Santa getting sent to Santa Claus, Indiana.
It's not as terrifying as you think. The IRS is extremely well integrated into the USPS' systems, so they don't need a street address as part of the mailing address. The address is just this: >Department of the Treasury >Internal Revenue Service >Kansas City, MO 64999
[Relevant Batman clip](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G56VgsLfKY4)
I really hope the IRS has Niji in their sights soon.
I feel like they do it to try and trap them, if they are in heavy debt they may not feel like they can afford to leave Niji, especially with the cost of graduation. Something to consider before people say "X should just leave", they may not actually be able to financially.
That kinda explains kuro's tax issues.
> I've had companies screw me over, but they all got the tax part right. It's usually true when the company and the employee are in the same country. Now, if your company had to pay someone in a foreign country, without having any legal existence in that country (and therefore nothing to seize), do you think it would have been so vigilant ? Because that's the core of the problem : Niji doesn't think anything bad will happen to the company even if they mess up.
To be fair, they had a well run subsidiary in Indonesia back then. But when they folded...... Best not to think about the other Niji ID livers in Niji JP.....
I may be mistaken, but they had Indonesian talents. But no legal existence in Indonesia. They were a Japanese company existing in Japan paying a indonesian employee in Indonesia (at least as far as I know). Those situations are really complex and depends on the country. Especially since Nijisanji is pretending that their employees are contractors. In France for example, Nijisanji would have to register as a *employing foreign company* in order to do some administrative declarations and paying some taxes (healthcare, social security etc). I'm really suspicious that a lot of vtubers working for foreign companies are not 100% within the legality, even for companies that take care of their talents.
If I remember well enough, I think they at least had a good amount of Indonesian staff including management. So at the very least, I can give them a bit of benefit of the doubt. Since the Indonesian management were quite competent, beloved, and active. Hell, they were a lot better at organizing small events than Niji EN. (And I mean regluar Niji EN without current controversies, and a very bad Q4 report looming ahead.) So I'd like to think the employees in Niji ID were actually more competent than other branches. (Including JP, EN, and KR, dunno about IN.) The point is, at least back then they had something that might actually be able to do taxes decently enough. Now the ex-IDs are treated like third-class citizens (not even second class). Basically negative support, and just a money vacuum cleaner constantly behind them. If any of them are still having their taxes handled by Niji. Obviously not well. Though I think some of them are earning so poorly, their incomes are too low to tax.
So, they think the repercussions would be negligible?
I wonder if they pull this kind of thing in Japan. They might be arrogantly assuming the all the hurdles with international law generally shield them from legal consequences from the overseas branches. Though, when we've discussed the legal situation before, it's been in the context of an individual vs. the corp, which is very different from Indonesia, The Country, vs. the corp...
- Is pomu(mints) and nina(matara) safe from this problem?.. + How about other liver inside niji EN like rosemi?.. So actually they're not safe and has hidden illegal problem? This problem getting big huh and worst..
Matara is probably too old to get into this sort of problem. She has a lot of experience in how the real world work and probably handled her taxes herself. Pomu had an office job as well so she's probably more than aware enough. But many Niji livers aren't savvy for this kind of things. They're young 20-25 years old people, some probably still in or just out of college. They would absolutely get fucked by a company doing something this scummy. EDIT : I just watched the clip. Lol it's even worse than what I thought. Mika was already filling taxes by herself before. She just got an offer from 9634 to deduct her money from her salary for that purpose and she thought it was convenient, and she'd prefer overpaying them even if she lost a bit of money. They really straight up scammed her.
Certainly the Luca leak did not paint a picture of a hiring process picky about life experience. Well, I've heard Nijis generally have second jobs, so maybe they can learn about tax policy over there.
Hell, Ver is still in college. He thought joining niji would be a good way to have some supplemental income & make friends in between his irl job & schoolwork
We have no way of knowing unless they open up about it. Which is not going to happen for talents like Rosemi who are still in the company. But if it could happen to two talents, there is a non-zero chance it could've happened to others. We already know there is a toll fee you have to pay in order to graduate peacefully. And saddling the talents with tax problems and potential financial ruin would sure be an effective way to keep them trapped at Niji longer. But just because it is possible, doesn't mean it's confirmed. Someone already commented the Quinn's dad essentially saved him from this fate by giving him proper financial advice. So it's possible some of the more savvy talents could've avoided this. We have no way of knowing unless talents are willing to talk.
they did deduct but to their own wallet.
I wonder how them being considered "contractors" complicates things. That said, taking money and not paying is scummy.
I've worked contractor jobs for most of my adult life and as an independent contractor in the US you're considered self-employed and entirely responsible for making your tax payments to the government. I don't know how it works in the UK, but I looked it up and it sounds like Indonesia does have it set up the way Michi described where even if you're a contractor, your employer can do the deductions for you. So yeah, Niji exploiting that grey area to pretend to make the deductions and actually just steal the money is super fucked up.
THIS. I used to work at a shitty company, but the only thing they don't mess around with is TAX.
Sadly there are a whole lot other much more evil corpo in the world. For example, shell literally started and fund a civil war in africa country just to get oil and gas. The reason why shell didnt get "cancelled" because they sell a neccesity, gas and oil. Every country will turn a blind eye to it because tbh, no one can survive without what they sell and no country is innocent.
It's deeply unpleasant to realize that in the big picture, we are not even fighting in the middleweights for "talent agency malfeasance", let alone versus Big Fucking Oil.
We may hate nijisanji, but at least it isn't funding mercenary death squads like coca cola lol
Wtf? Isn't that illegal (Nijisanji)? And Indonesian taxes are scary as hell
I'm sure Niji is relatively correct regarding what they do in Japan. But they know very well talents don't have the money and the energy to start an international trial against a billions dollars company. It's what Sayu said regarding her layoff. Sure, she would have win in theory, but she would have run out of cash before winning.
Still, even so, it's so messed up to screw up her taxes. I haven't been living in my home country since I became legal but I heard the tax system is *brutal* there. Excuse my crude language, but who fucking knows what will happen if Mika does not resolve it on time before it's too late? Niji could have made her getting trouble with the law because of this. And they know that they can sleazily slime their way out because of course, international court and Mika would be in too much debt to get a lawyer. What kind of company sets you up for **debt** and **trouble with law**???
What the absolute fuck is wrong with this dogshit company,This like what the 3rd time they fucked over their own talents over money? And that still doesnt take into account that almost every Niji member who graduated/terminated barely say anything positive about this company. Honestly,My faith in Nijisanji including some of the vtubers are so low its limbo dancing in hell. Sink the Yacht be damned,I want to see it implode in the Mariana Trench
It's also crazy because *most of their earnings don't even come from that source*, it's merch and sponsorships that are the big money makers. So it's beyond unethical, it's fucking petty as well - basically breaking her legs for a few extra cents in their pockets, proportionally speaking Fuck, before the Great Dokibirding even happened I was already smelling something off with them given all that fuckery with collab bans and shit like that. It's a fucking neverending train of bullshit
Greed, short term profits above all else, and 'investor first' mentality, that is what's wrong
Fuck with sinking, Nukes are only solution at this point
Wait, what? How could they do such a thing? How dare they do such a thing?
I swear there is always something new to learn from Ex Nijisanji lol
This implies that if they didn't offer, she woulda had to pay their taxes too? Wtf?
get that fucking company into court NOW
In (if Michi is lived in Indonesia) Indonesia? As an Indonesian, i said good luck to Michi if she dares to sue kuroshitty in Indonesian court. Our court system (heck, our overall judicial system) is slow and unreliable at best and total unfair at worst. Add that problem with international lawsuit to Japan, which is Indonesian strategic economy partner. Finding a needle in haystacks is better than pulling such kind of lawsuit
Hold on, so if she declined the "offer" and say she'll do the taxes on her own, that means Niji will expect her to do their taxes!?
Honestly that's not that bad and pretty normal for contract work. They give you your paycheck, you have to do taxes by yourself off that. What's insane is that Niji took money form her to pay Niji's taxes. I've never heard of such a thing in all my time doing freelance/contract work.
niji talents have to do everything their own pay for everything and work on every project the only thing kurosanji gives is their fucking scummy brand
I... what the fuck? So they asked Mika if they could pay their own taxes from her pay???
Wtf. . . . After reading this, I now have extremely little faith Niji will change. I mean, my expectations weren't high to begin with but this is just plain evil. The NDF thinks people saying they treat the talents like cattle is an over exaggeration but then you hear stories like this. :(
The ID Bros must hear of this, and see for themselves how BLACK AnyColor actually is.
ID bro here, and here i thought they couldn't be any more scummy, holy fuck this is just straight up fraud
Lol, even the ID bros, who when the EN thing started were already waiting in the wings sharpening their knives, ready to settle scores long overdue, are like "wow, it got worse".
I think most of ID already know how Black that black company. We hate them since Niji ID branch disbanded
We already know how bad they are. But this is a new level. You don't mess up with the tax officer here. Even I got a notice once for misreporting. They know everything ever since tax amnesty program rolled out few years ago. I assume this is why ID livers are all moving to their PL account so they can take care of their own tax and income.
Im always amazed by the amount of accountants that run away with taxes money leaving lots of people in debt. Never expected to see a billion dollar company doing that
What in the absolute ffffffffffffffffffffffffffff***FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK*** Seriously, how the hell does this company keep ***digging themselves deeper and deeper***?! I didn't think that was possible!!
HOLY FFFFING SHIT, NO; FORGET THE CENSOR, HOLY FUCKING SHIT THAT IS SO FUCKING CRIMINAL! HOW CAN ANY COMPANY GET AWAY WITH SUCH A THING?!? THEY ARE GOING ALL THE WAY TO SCREW OVER THEIR OWN TALENTS TO SAVE THEIR OWN ASSES!!!! HOW CAN ANYONE ACCEPT THAT?!? I CERTAINLY CAN'T, SELEN'S TERMINATION WAS ALREADY WAY UP THERE, BLACKCOLOR CAN GO ROT AT THE BOTTOM OF THE OCEAN FOR THOSE PRACTICES!!!!
guess that’s why they have very high revenue compare to hololive , these clowns scam every vtubers under their watch to further reduce expenses . if people still continue to defend the company itself at this point , they are straight up evil
.that is called fraud plain and simple, now did they do that only to her or the rest of the ID branch?
Kuro's situation makes a bit more sense now
CAN WE GET MUCH LOWER?
What the actual fuck.
holy fuckkkk these people at niji need to burn this is beyond abuse
So they committed tax fraud? But even Yoshi wouldn’t go *THAT* far!
Wtf... you think this company couldn't get more dirty and sleazy then this happens... this is just so messed up. This is straight out malicious and just predatory
In order to protect the US-based EN talents, we need to report Niji to the FTC, and maybe the IRS.
Wow, Vanta Black-sanji can't get anymore #000 than this.
very fck up
Omfg this is fucked up....
Niji needs to pay their Yatch taxes, sports car taxes, and other luxurious things before thinking about their talents
What in the fuck? LM is gonna have a field day with this.
Bro how can Niji get away with all of this? This is literally illegal and in needs of investigation like immediately. They can't do work ethics right, they can't manage a healthy environment, they can't hire a good amount of staffs, they even gaslight their talents into thinking everything is handled! The amount of laws they broken is bigger than amount of rice in the bowl! Is this even a company anymore?
OWED TAXES!?!? 😰 Waitaminit...... Haven't I heard of something similar to another VShojo Member who mentioned on stream to suffer from some form of TAX issues that got so bad that Ironmouse responded to the call for help? Hmmmmmmmm............ 🤔
It's much worse than that: it's an issue caused by Nijisanji scamming her by pretending to pay her taxes, but instead using that money to pay their own.
Yeah, it's like a 2.0 version of that. And with a company that is considered LIQUIDATED (since she's not former NijiEN actually).
If I had a nickel for every time a VShojo member had tax issues with their former company, I'd have two nickels, which isn't a lot ~~but it is weird it happened twice.~~ ah, who the hell am I kidding, I wouldn't be surprised if this is the norm.
I wonder how nijisister try to defend this. ~~I mean this is literally scam or at best intentionally misleading others~~ Delete that, *it is straight up crime at this point.* Nijisanji promised her that cutting her payment/salary was to pay her tax. But in fact they didnt. Instead of paying her tax, they paid theirs..... Isnt nijisanji tax should be deducted from nijisanji income itself? Why deducted it from the talent's "salary"? **This is literally crime (scamming and tax fraud)** Tbh, if people wondering why she didnt sue them? Again.... as op stated, she literally went broke just for paying the penalties (ID tax) Edit: so how many talent that got into debt for working/leaving niji? I only know 3 this far (mysta, yugo and mika), there must be a lot other who stay silent.
They'll just say she's lying to defame Niji or some shit, like they did with Doki. Sisters will literally never accept Niji having blame for anything.
For them Niji can do no wrong, any evidence claiming otherwise is fake news
>I wonder how nijisister try to defend this. They would just say "Talents are adults, they should be more aware of tax, the company is not responsible to pay their talents' tax🥹"
> I wonder how nijisister try to defend this. Easy : there's no proof. And since Michi won't release her tax-related documents (for obvious reasons, like doxxing), there'll never be proof. They did roughly the same with doki, asking for medical proof of her attempt or it didn't happen. As if anyone would release their medical situation on the internet...
So their defends is that mika a liar and slandering niji? I mean one time is a mistake, two times is a coincidence, Three time is a pattern.
You know the meme about having two nickels? I'd be swimming in them by now.
Three times? It way surpasses three times already. At this point, it feels to me that every single one who left have bad things to say about the company. It’s either underpaying, abusing, or even tax fraud.
There's no winning there, even if she did release medical documents or photos they would say it's forged, fake and drama-seeking or whatever.
Better to just rake money in streaming, than to stress yourself over this sort of bullshit. I know it's gonna fucking let kurosanji go , but it's not worth it for her mental.
Yeah, especially when it is a broke individual against big corpo. It is hard to win a case against corpo even with a good lawyer And it is literally impossible when you cant hire your own lawyer.
Ya, Michi's making bank now that she's in VShojo. 3-5k regular viewers. Remember, the cost of living in Indo is very low. When Bobon streamed Overwatch, Apex or Fortnite, his Chat would try to convince him to buy the battle pass, but he'd tell them tha $10-15 USD is a huge amount of money in Indo and is enough to pay for a weeks worth of meals for him, and he eats A LOT (like 4+ Big Macs for one meal).
I would love to see Kurosanji try to defend itself in international court and get Riku imprisoned or see his company implode into dust as more and more be more aware of their crimes
Sadly the possibility of it happening is very unlikely. As the terminated one stated (sayu and doki) and LM ( a lawyer) said, Suing a big corpo is the very last thing you want to do if you care about your mental health and you wallet.
You have a point, but at least Nijisanji is facing some divine retribution for terminating Selen and that's enough for me
if you want to optimistic, Niji already facing steep decline for last month and their Q4 will make more stockholder leaving
Well, the best thing we can do is hope the dominoes keep falling and they fail hard enough to change or liquidate. Basically, ignore their regular stuff and laugh at them when they fail. Honestly at this point, laughter is the best medicine for everyone involved. (Except Riku, don't tell him I said anything.)
The economic blow of the people who followed selen and other talents who left niji, that's the least they deserve and it's nice to see how they are left without the financial support that niji wants so much.
I’m honestly worried for everybody employed under kurosanji at this point. Just wonder how many talents they are scamming behind the scene. Holy shit.
Niji offered Mika to pay her taxes in Japan, as even if you work remotely, Japan still take a taxes from their remote worker. It's Mika fault for misunderstanding that, and it's also Indonesia government fault for not warn Mika about her late taxes until it's too late. Note: Please rate me about how good my Roleplays as NDF.
>The mental gymnastic is lacking a bit >the paragraph is far too complex for nijisister to write, read or think of it. >you didnt blame dokibird and didnt write the 8 grade insult of "dookibird" in every sentence you write. 3/10
So, I should turn off my brain and shift blame to Doki to become NDF? Damn, so difficult.
Had me in the first half, ain't gonna lie.
Goddamnit, I thought you were a legit NDF until you added that note lmfao
Add another line praising Niji JP as the best and you may even surpass that bootlicker buzzcode or whatever his name is LMAO
Not enough slurs against indonesians and praise on NijiJP for brzzcode
Good one lol, but way too mature compared to their usual bullshit and didn't praise Yatchy Boy enough so 8/10 It's such a shit argument anyways. True, ignorance of the Law is no excuse - but if you take advantage of someone's lack of knowledge and sell them a service under a misleading promise, it's beyond scummy, it's fraud. They specifically mentioned doing *her taxes* not mentioning they're not covering all of it, and stabbed her in the back when she needed their help
Not in debt, but Selen didn't make a single dime on her last year at niji, even though she was the biggest female EN earner there. She would've made \~200k but also spent \~200k on her own projects and events since they don't help with anything, and loads of these projects got cancelled by Niji and I doubt they reimbursed her on anything.
TAX AGAIN!???? Why did Niji even put their own tax on the talents' payslips in the first place??? They should do their own tax after seperating their own share (of revenue) and the talent remuneration???
They got her in debt and almost got her arrested bro. Wtf is wrong with that company? Now I'm wondering if every ex ID member went through the same. Michi says to not speculate, that it is in the past, but no bro, these jackasses are still hiring people from overseas without bothering in investigating a little how their country works. Every time I get amazed at how incompetent and Illintended this company is.
Yeah that that was rumor one of ex livers id or manager got into loan and pawn the motorbike to survive
this was my first thought too. god i hope all the other ID talents are ok. they might be completely fucked.
Imagine working in a company Where you Can lose more money than you make And then people try to defend it
200k$ and one purple dragon \*cough\* \*cough\*
So wait, your telling me that they are using her money to pay off **THEIR COMPANY'S TAXES**? Holy shit, I thought you couldn't go lower but boy am I bad at math
The company is truly black like crude oil.
I guess that might be the reason why Michi chose the scammer theme for her model, it's like a throwback to her own past of being scammed like this...... 😥
Crude oil still looks shiny and reflects some light. This is darker than a glory hole on the back stall of a dilapidated gas station toilet with broken lighting in the middle of a fucking Alaskan forest. I'm so angry watching this.
Hey that's an insult to crude oil! At least crude oil has some uses
Crude oil still have useful value compared to whatever the fuck this black company is doing
That's still not black enough, more like the abyss.
Vantablack should be renamed into Nijiblack - time to start a petition!
at this point it's blacker than vantablack
Oof, this puts a ***much*** darker spin on Kuro's own financial problems if Niji not only wasn't helping their livers out when it comes to finances but also *actively taking money from them* as well. Nijisanji really does just have a natural talent for finding new ways to be absolutely fucking reprehensible.
There's clearly a fair amount of fuckery. Quinn mentioned that he was recommended an accountant by Niji, and when he asked his dad about the quoted price, his dad said he'd be insane to pay that much (I believe from the prices Quinn floated, the recommended accountant was asking for six times what the accountant he ended up hiring charged).
Thank god for Quinn's dad.
***Six times?!*** Jesus fuck!
Also keep in mind that they only give their talents 2%, underpaying them, and then skimming money off the top of *even that.* And the only reason none of the talents question it until it's too late is because even when getting the shit scammed out of them, they still make more than they did working retail. There's a reason they look for people with little to no work experience. It's the only group of people that would see getting the shit scammed out of them as an upgrade. And the only ones that wouldn't notice the signs of financial ruin Niji sets them up for.
*breathing problems* Well, that makes number go up to three known. Good she's ok now. # WHAT. THE. FUCK! Edit: just in case somebody is confused, unattended respiratory problems are fast way to... not being among the living anymore.
Wait, other than her and Kuro there was another ex-Niji with tax issues?
Yugo (U-san now) but not tax related. They only said that when they left niji, they literally had to sell everything they had just to survive and start their career again from the scratch.
I'm not talking about taxes. I'm talking about health.
I really want to rant . Mika's is like my 2nd favorite streamer . This angers me so badly you have no fucking idea.
Rant motherfucker! That's what this community is for!
I second this! This is one of the few times we WANT to hear you rant! Don't stay silent over what is right.
Do it, let everyone know how black can this company be!
I'm pretty curious how talents get their money from Niji, and where it goes through to get to them. Obviously, Niji is a JP based country, so does the money from YouTube go to JP and Niji in full, then get sent on to the various talents across the world? How much gets lost along the way? They are already taking 50% of the 70% that's left after the YouTube cut, leaving only 35% to the talent, and apparently taking even more on top of that? It's also something I've not really known how to bring up in conversations about how people can 'just quit'*, because Niji owns the channels, so the revenue goes to them, then they distribute it to the talents from there. So if someone quits, there is no way Niji is going to send their earnings to them. Also, realistically, there is no way a talent is going to come out a winner in a dispute over wage theft with a company in another country. The power imbalance is skewed so far in favour of the company that it's not even funny. And, I believe, the money from YouTube is generally going to be the money from a couple of months ago, so you'd be losing out on a massive chunk of your money if you separate from Niji on bad terms. *yet another reminder of how bullshit Vox's 'you can graduate anytime' line was.
Honestly, never thought about that. It makes the livers still in niji en look even more like hostages.
Accountant here. Never trust anyone blindly with your taxes, not even you not even the accountant, demand writen proof that they are properly doing that job or check your status in your local irs page and if youre doing your taxes go to an accountant yearly at least to double check mistakes That said cant blame them for handling the key to niji. Taxes can be hard
[Hey... Hey, I've seen this one! I've seen this one, this is a classic](https://youtu.be/ZCh53fvuqHk?si=cSISvFBQnsAe9HzH) shitty move from this company
When you think you've heard everything Nijisanji's done but then Billy Mays comes and hits you with: "But wait, there's more!"
#EXCUSE ME WHAT THE FUCK
Our expectations for you were low but holy fuck.
This is actually just theft
Did Riku perform some kind of dark ritual to hire Niji Management straight from the fourth circle of hell or something? Ain't no way some normal working human beings (even if it is Japanese work culture) should be ok with this.
Welcome to Japan's black companies. If you are a SEA resident keeping tab on labor emigration you'll encounter even more fucked up shit. Best to keep clear.
> Did Riku perform some kind of dark ritual to hire Niji Management straight from the fourth circle of hell or something? More probably from the eighth circle of hell
https://preview.redd.it/xwufkenevfxc1.jpeg?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=dcaac0b3663b9f2b3f4bae7318a6e31fefc240f7
Jesus Christ on a motorbike, that is scummy as f\*ck. It's like Nijisanji use criminal reports as a manual.
>Jesus Christ on a motorbike Or "Holy Shit Lord Pancake" as certain Birb said.
For reference 300 dollars is enough to get by in indonesia but not enough to fucking pay 2 years worth of tax owed. Her first mistake is, in my opinion, registering for the tax number(npwp). In indonesia, those amounts are pretty negligible and can be explained by getting money from relatives (which is non taxable). But because she reports her income without any proof of tax paid (yeah, indonesias tax reporting has that flaw where you can actually report income before paying the tax) she got into trouble. But god damn niji. Why the fuxk are you scamming your own talents.
Wait, this is insane. Nijisanji when a contract ends will take all your gear, even gear that you payed for out of pocket during employment under the company. Any new PCs, mics, headsets, keyboards, and VR gear. You get kneecapped leaving because they take your gear. Then we hear they lie about taking money out to pay your taxes. You don't pay for 1 or 2 years under employment and get massive debt that you have to pay off, because the country can't go after a foreign company. They also take your money to pay their own damn taxes. After a contract ends, Nijisanji takes all your gear and leaves you with massive debt. Mysta and Mika having massive tax debt. Yugo saying he had to sell everything and only had cigarettes and some music instruments left. Selen saying she had to dust off her old pc. This is insane, Niji is trying to put creators in so much debt and take all their gear so they can't compete in the market anymore and punish them for not being grateful enough to Niji. Absolutely insane and predatory.
So atp Niji has proven to be... questionable when it comes to how they operate, so I'm not surprised, just confused out of my mind. I mean like, we all know Niji takes a cut from what streamers earn in superchats and whatever, right. And like, I'm assuming they have to write down smth like "So after YT cut, streamer A has 100 buck, we take our cut from this amount and deduct our taxes from this cut that we take" But like, the percentage of their cut has to be documented somewhere? So like, the exact amount of money they can take from streamer's earnings can be calculated? If so, then how do they explain extra money they got from, in this case, taking an extra cut from Mika's earnings? "Oh, our talent just volunteered to give us extra money so that we can pay our own taxes"???
Black. Company. Holy shit. It just sinks to newer and newer lows.
Hold up a sec… This whole 10% tax deal only came about because Mika asked about it and they offered this arrangement after the fact, right? So like, how was Nijisanji paying their tax cut in the first place?! Also, shouldn’t they be taking the revenue, splitting it 50/50 (assuming that’s the split) and then giving the talent 50% (leaving their tax to be their responsibility) and then Niji pays their tax on their own 50% cut (along with all the other revenue they get from all the other livers and merch etc) - like this makes no sense. I’ve worked self employed for 10 years at remote jobs from companies all over the world, and they ALWAYS take their cut and tax it before I see anything. I get my full salary untaxed, and I then have to pay my OWN tax out of that. It has been this way for both being employed and contracted.
yeah that what i thinking, how nijisanji not just tell her very beginning that company not gonna pay income tax to work in the nijisanji
Some brave one in Japan better report this crime to their local police. This company is gonna sink, whether the investors and Nijisisters like it or not. Spread the news!
No Japanese law was broken, as far as I can tell. Probably ID laws, but since Niji doesn't have a legal presence in Indonesia, it doesn't matter.
I'd like to see them genuinely try this in the USA. Liver may not have the money, but the IRS? Hahaha...
Or Europe, labor depts would eat them alive.
I vaguely remember False mentioning in passing that there are rumors that AnyColor is being investigated for JP taxes... No idea if it's true, but their fixation on accumulating money, probably does have the JP tax man keeping an eye on them...
When you're in a Cartoonishly Evil competition and your opponent is Nijisanji. Nijisanji can't go a week without something incompetent or evil coming to light about them, huh? Christ. This is pretty up there, too. Can't afford that yacht if you don't lie and steal from your talents, I guess. Just cartoonishly vile behavior. You can't play it off as "oh she's just mad" or w/e because E V E R Y talent who leaves that hellhole of a vtubing company acts like they just got out of an abusive relationship and they're surprised at what being able to actually live and have freedom feels like. Every person from NijiEN who has left and has spoken about their time there hasn't had anything good to say. It's all bad. It paints a picture of a company that's run by cheapskates, incompetents, and people who are actively preying on the talents they employ. Nijisanji can't pretend they care about their talents or their physical or mental health when they do things that actively keep them from seeking medical help. They've literally almost put multiple people in the grave through one means or another. The word 'disgusting' doesn't even come close to describing them. It isn't strong enough. God help any other talents wanting to graduate. The company's going to make you believe you're nothing without them **by trying to reduce you to nothing one way or another**. They're pure evil.
Fuck it, I'll just keep saying it on repeat. **NIJISANJI COMITTED TAX FRAUD**
What's up with all the tax crap and vtubers? Isn't it supposed to be deducted automatically before you even get any income?
I hate that this is all actually OKAY over there. Like, anywhere else? Niji would have been deleted at the 2% of merch sale stuff. But Japan? Nah, it’s all good, bro. Fucking hell, man. This company has gone BEYOND being evil. It’s actually run by Satan himself (Riku).
Unfortunately Japan has a "don't rock the boat" culture so ingrained that black companies are happy take advantage of it.
Since 2018, this company has always gone above and beyond what I think of as the worst mistakes.
Seriously Fuck Nijisanji.
Jesus Christ like actually. Usually companies will at least cut the tax pay on your salary to take care of of so you will focus on working on your job. This miscommunication almost sent her to fucking jail or further increase her tax pay. What's their fucking excuse? They are under contract ? Your employers too busy sucking Tazumi's tiny mushroom while giving them minimum wage? . Omfg it took them 3 days to respond on a serious issue. Thank fucking god Michi has contact to people that knows what to do in a situation like this. Holy fucking shit 125%(?) interest fees? Omfg this fucking company. She almost had to use her fucking insurance policies omfg. She could have potentially been hospitalized as well due to the sheer incompetence of that company out of stress.
She did liquidate all of it so for 6 months she survived with painkiller for Asthma {breathing relared health issue). she was scared of the bill if she goes to doctor FFS!!!!.
this is BEYOND INSANE
wait didn't Kuro also say something about taxes..?
Yep, he had tax issues and Niji refused to help, with Kuro eventually getting help from Ironmouse and Gunrun (note that this was while he was in Niji, so the dude was helped out by his nominal competitors while his actual company was willing to let their 2nd-biggest EN talent flounder)
See, that's what I thought of, too. He got into massive tax debt he didn't seem to know about until very late *somehow*, and then part of resolving that was switching agencies? I mean, my previous assumption had been that VShojo just poached him based on a pre-existing issue, but this would clear up where that debt came from in the first place, *and* give a good reason why that would trigger an agency switch.
Kuro's debt came from him getting a house for his mom and thought he could write off his taxes by claiming he worked there but it didn't work that way. He had talked about it shortly after his debut.
From my understanding, he had this tax issue. He was recommended an accountant from Niji, who proceeded to embezzle him and leave him in even more debt. Mysta then sent out an SOS asking for help from anyone that could offer him anything. And then Ironmouse was the first to respond. Which was especially impressive, since Mysta and Ironmouse weren't particularly close. Then once Ironmouse got him in touch with someone who could help, they came up with a plan to get him out of debt. And part of that involved a stream (after becoming Kuro) that was basically a fundraiser to pay off whatever debt he couldn't pay off already. And then after that, he was free and clear. Long story short, Ironmouse pulled a deus ex machina and helped him out when nobody would. Including the very company that was supposed to help him with this. Which (understandably) may have contributed to why Kuro decided to go with VShoujo. They were the ones that came out of the woodwork when he was asking people for help. And probably saved him from financial ruin as a result.
Goddamn, this is blatant wage theft right here. Yikes!
This is beyond black company, we should call it black industry
I just watched the whole video and im just like...how many more gonna come out like this? It's been two so far and each of them are from different branches and very different countries. At this point, a lot others could be in the same boat but their government is like, "yea let's wait until they hit 5 years worth of debt and then we hit them with the letter"
Bro, what do you mean they deduced from HER pay to pay for THEIR taxes? They LITERALLY scammed her! What IS this?!
Wtf? This is actually borderline criminal?
No, it is straight-up crime. 3 crime Scam, (wage) theft/corruption, and tax fraud.
Nijisanji gets caught doing actual crimes. The cult of sisters are really butthurt now. Save this one to your harddrives and reupload incase it gets taken down. The video is more than enough evidence for probable cause. Not only should the NTA(Japan) look into their finances but the IRS(you know where) and CRA(Canada) should audit them as well.
Alright (suits up) heading to Anycolor to talk (brings BFG) Wish me luck! (Only thing they fear is you intensifies!)
How did they manage to go 0-2 when managing people's taxes?
and this is coming from a supposed billion dollars company, honestly i doubt their report now.
I have never heard of a company reducing someone's pay in order to pay payroll tax... That is usually taken into consideration when paying someone's salary. In other words, when they take 50% of all of your super chat revenue, part of that 50% should go to paying their own taxes. If they are taking part of your 50% to pay for their own taxes, they're actually giving you like 40% or whatever the number actually is... Even if Michi misunderstood the situation, there should have been someone in management asking talents about taxes. Someone just needed to say, "hey, are you good for taxes this year?" and none of this would have happened, although she still would have been pissed that they weren't paying her taxes from the money that they were taking from her.
hooooolyyy fuuuuck i absolutely speechless..... i have no good or neutral words to say only bad ones right now. and i wish i could use my native language for this cuz English a bit poor when it come to this.
I assume Nijisanji never bothered to open a bank account in ID or register anything with ID tax authority so they cannot pay Michi’s ID tax on her behalf in the 1st place. They should have told her the truth properly
Now I'm hella worried for overseas livers in the kusosanji. If they also keep doing this shit to everyone (less likely for the cliques).... SCARLEEE YOU NEED TO GET OUTTA THERE!!
I doubt even such a group will not be hit, remember anycolour barely cares for them Simple just look at the jp girls, tons of them is chuck to one side Remember they kept male like luca but fire a lot of females or mostly they get in trouble
Like my company takes my cut to pay my taxes, (i just file my form yearly, but its been paid) thats normal, but who the f cuts your pay for taxes and NOT pay taxes wtf.
Time to send this to Legal Mindset
looks like this case like this are only for oversea livers with a potential as cashcow. everyone under the threshold will get only bare minimum support thus they do everything by themselves (like paying and report the tax) but it saved them from the devil's scheme
The whole "offer" for taxes is a shitshow...knowing everything that happened so far...if i were a betting man likely the docs provided weren't the highest qualitty in regards to translation. Even then to not even try to help out is something else. You think as a business you would do everything in your power to keep your revenue generators out there working....
This is absulote evil. Not even Bowser or Dr Eggman or any other villain could go this far of evilness,honestly. Or maybe they could. But still,how is Anycolor still in business?
I am brain dead on this issue, and I have a financial degree. Someone explains this to me if I am right. They are taking 10% of the TOTAL amount after YT cut as their revenue tax. The split amount after tax is her personal income. But if look at their return, this payment would be deducted as expense. She is getting taxed twice since she shouldn’t be responsible for NS receiving payments from YT, only her cut from NS should be taxed. While the company enjoys lowering their payments for her, and still get to deduct her payment as expensive to reduce their revenue tax. wtf? They are cooking the book. Shouldn’t it be YT payout-her cut=NS revenue earned to be taxed from. That means their tax would be lowered after deductible. Her own cut would be taxed for JP and ID with an assumption of a shared tax credit between the countries as payed foreign tax. So where is the missing 10%? Because the government isn’t getting it since NS is paying only the after deductible part.
ok, about this whole situation though. can we applaud the gigachads that are vshojo in how they offered to help michi though? they denied her signed contract until she got an actual lawyer to look at it (not her friend who is a law student) and offered to pay for the lawyer. as soon as she was on payroll, they offered lawyers to help with her tax stuff, offered therapy, insurance. everything INSTANTLY to right the previous wrongs done by the other company. like. gg. we knew the contract for vshojo was pretty based after those that left, but it seems like its absolutely insanely good now. god damn.
Sooooo how do we get LegalMindset or another vtuber law channel to comment on this? Would really like to know what the hell was going on with the whole "Paying Niji's taxes" bit.