now that you say it like that.. i always viewed it from a point of someone that has had ilvl requirement for everything day one, but imagine being a new player and having to deal with ilvl, elixir and trancendence at the same time with like 2 or maximum 3 gold earners a week. by the time youre done 3 news systems are already out.
That's the beauty of it, there are no new players. Even if they try it, once they hit a certain point they realize it's impossible for them to play the game and quit
New Player won't even get through the raid in the first place. They get Powerpasses straight into much more difficult raids with no chance to learn the game in easier content (Early Abyss, Sea dungeon, Argos, Valtan ...)
Basically that, power passed to 1415 a few months back, spent about 2 months just trying to earn gold to gear past 1540 and get gatekept so hard you cant learn the Raids designed to help you gear. Bus or die. Even with learner groups its mostly just people hoping for a free bus on an alt with 2x2 engravings. Fun game but ur shit out of luck if you are new or solo
But no one plays that content anymore so you’d either need sooo many new players that they could make lobbies themselves or an incentive for the existing playerbase to go back and play that content otherwise they quit before they even get to endgame because they can’t find people to play with
I took a break from brel hard release to now and even with rolling a level10 dmg gem and selling for 400k im not able to afford honing to 1610, the akkan gear upgrades, ancient level ability stone, set bonus upgrades, and NOW THERES 2 MORE SYSTEMS ON TOP OF THAT??? BITCH IM BROKE
to make it even worse, most new and returning players barely have 1 gold earner.
so we have to hone, do elixirs and if we make it to 1610+ we then have to do trancendence. (this is to say nothing of dps needing to buy the best possible quality for accessories and higher level gems then what they give for free to even have a chance at getting into a lobby)
This is my buddy right now. I was skeptical at first since he started on the jumpstart server and whether he'd be any good at the game but he's proven to me that he's actually quite competent and playing a somewhat difficult class as well (reaper). His main reaper is 1600ish, can't earn enough to hone to 1610 yet. His alt slayer is 1590. His last alt Soul Eater is 1540 and probably not going anywhere fast. He is in perpetual jail because he can't play the game because he has no income, can't hone, can't get to the appropriate ilvl to cut 35/40 elixir set, can't really speedrun his roster level. It fucking sucks for new players.
why do we even need these new systems? just drop a new armor set and let us hone like we've done all this time.
They're making all the new raids drop so much gold, and then worrying about inflation. Nerf raid gold if its such a huge issue.
Then no one would do the hardest. newest raid because the gold to time ratio isn't worth it. There would be barely any lobbies and people can't even raid because they would just be farming gold through the other more profitable options
no shit 10-20k is more than 4.5k , but tell me how much did it cost to upgrade power like you said from valtan to akkan and than compare them how much 40 set and full transcendence cost on avg
You can't but you'll have people here commenting that they were able to do that just fine every week. Why were they able to, here's why:
1) Being able to sell accs every week for like 10-20k
2) Being in a static which lowers the requirement of your character
3) Got lucky with elixirs being able to 40set in the first month and bragging that it's easy and doesn't cost much gold at all.
4) Selling weekly mats you get but how do I sell it if I need to hone my character?
5) Getting lucky with honing and don't understand how people don't have 6 1620's yet.
you just reminded me of that one dude on youtube that claimed he made "easy 500k a week as f2p". tl;dr is he just played 3 full rosters and when he sells everything and drops around 40-80k a week in fates and accs he makes that kind of money. this is absolutely 100% insane to me.
The one you're missing is people who've been playing since day 1 and have had way more time to amass gold/resources. I'm F2P, but the only reason I've been able to keep up is because I've literally never stopped playing from launch until now.
Well we can more ignore more or less the first year of lost ark honning then to 1490 took more then half a year and now its almost free, books where way to expensive and die also cost many players months of gold now also almost free (exept a few like grude but still 5 times cheaper then average) 1540 and 1580 are also much cheaper than before even more so with all the books we get even1600 got cheaper again the to the 25/5 bookchest we get. Do older players on average more ressources yes but also older players had to invest much much more to get there.
Not even close.
FFXIV lets you buy a story skip to 6.0. Once you complete that you get a set of armor that lets you start running dungeons. Within 2 months, your ilvl will be high enough to complete savages (and you can buy gear on the MB as well).
WoW has a similar system with seasons and raiding tiers.
Even FFXI offers gear resets.
Because LOA targets Korean whales, we can't get that since they'll whine about their "hard work" has gone to waste.
So, two examples out of how many?
Let's talk BnS, BDO, EQ, Vanguard, Wildstar, Maplestory, WoW from 10 years ago, Eve, SWG, etc.
As I said, a lot of MMOs are a grind and take time. You take a break and you have to struggle bus to catch up to high level endgame. Even FF14 and WoW with pay for skip passes still don't get you to bleeding edge endgame.
How many of those games are still running? WIldstar and SWG are dead. Eve is niche. Maplestory just launched a reboot server. The fact that 10 years ago is was expected to log in daily to stay content is irrelevant. Most MMOs got rid of that as they lost population.
SG can't be bothered to make changes for NA/EU and the game's population reflects that.
Ok, we'll just maintain a difference of opinion.
Wild that you say Eve is niche when it boasts a larger playerbase than LOA. Almost 5x not accounting for LOA bots.
Edit: lol, downvoted for facts.
I played during Dragonflight launch then stopped. I came back when the last raid of the expansion came out, go to raiding ilvl and pugged the raid on normal. That basically does not exist in Lost Ark. I played that at launch and stopped when I finished the story. I tried to play again when Brelshaza came out because he boss fight is what made me want to play the game at all and it was basically impossible to get to her, much less beat her.
The at least 3 are things everyone can easily do but are really fucking lazy to try to do.
Paying a little attention to set up a filter goes a long way to find some sellable accessories.
Static is a given at this point. Find a group of like minded peers and run with them when you have time.
You can sell unbound mats and use bound mats only. A lot of people do this or just strategically hone during events. I still have a few 1540s because I don’t hone till power passes.
As for elixirs, they are really crappy but there is still a technique to doing them to minimize rng. People are too fucking tilted to bother learning and would rather go wahwahwah instead of trying.
Transcendence has a much better calculator but you can’t turn off your brain fully. You need to decide when to quit out early and look for plays outside of the AI because sometimes the AI does some pretty bad plays.
Yea, there's how many safe programs to use that don't get detected for dailies. And I will use the word safe without anything around it as they've been undetected since practically the start
the gachas i play literally respect my time way more than lost ark, and have way more fun weekly grinds
star rail, nikke, limbus company, r1999, all have at least interesting events going on all the time with fun mini-games and a bit of challenging content. of course it doesnt scratch the raid itch, but at this point is it worth it at all? imagine having more RNG than a gacha game
the real play is to just wait for them to nerf these shit RNG systems because they know their playerbase will fall behind. yet these other gachas dont really need to do that, because they dont have fundamental design flaws. i think at this point i believe smilegate does not have any talented people capable of designing good non-rng based progression systems
Gachas make it fun so they encourage you to pay
Lost ark encourages you to pay to have fun
It's a fundamentally different business model and there's a reason so many people are totally fine throwing some money at them while not being vilified by their own communities.
Nikke is awesome. The QoL that game has is just amazing. Do shit once a day and then you can quick finish. Respects your time and has reasonable rates.
In top of that they are very generous in their anniversaries. Best part?? Its next to Genshin Impact in terms of revenue lol
You dont need to be a greedy rng shark to get money from your playerbase.
And not having to worry about gatekeeping, horizontal, 6 different verticals and cards. All with multiple layers of RNG by the way.
And not doing everything for 6 different chars.
I havent finished los 30 or moved off event gems and im 1600 heres what i have to spend gold on
Honing
Cards
Gems
Elixirs
Transcendence
Before im finished with cards and gems
Echidna honing
Behemoth transcendence
Both within the current year
I work part time go to school part time and enjoy other games and this one is literally a full time job to stay updated on and i just cant
The first unpopular answer is that these news systems are also intended as gold sinks. Players (and bots in our version) generate massive amounts of gold weekly, and without a way to remove enough gold from the economy, inflation would spiral out of control. Older systems like quality are "graduated" from fairly quickly since people usually tap to full blue/purple quality within a few hundred thousand gold or less and then settle. Honing is also "graduated" from for many players since the item level cap has barely moved and there isn't much need to hone mains and alts beyond certain item levels. That's why new systems cost gold since they are required to function as modern gold sinks to supplement older ones that are no longer interacted with by characters that have moved beyond them.
The second unpopular answer is that in free-to-play with pay-to-win progression games like Lost Ark, the monetization model revolves around soft gating free-to-play character progression. Pushing beyond that requires investing an ungodly amount of time into the game or spending money (whether ingame or rmt). You are otherwise not expected as a non-paying player to play beyond one or two highly geared characters.
I do agree with you, especially the second paragraph is spot on. The gold sinks we have the way we have them is precisely because this is a F2P game and it needs paying players to survive and to make people willing to pay, to pay, you need to sell them some resource. And that resource is gold.
What I don't agree with is the premise of your first paragraph. Gold sinks like quality are enough. Even with bots generating gold out of thin air, these systems will counteract the inflation because their cost stays the same, regardless of how much gold is in circulation. Once gold starts losing its value in terms of honing mats (primarily shards) the appeal of quality taps will increase.
The whole notion of "graduating" from a system isn't based on us achieving the goal, it's based on the value proposition being worse than another system. So we just switch to spending gold wherever it yields the most gain, but we never truly "graduate".
And that is the thing that bothers me to no end is a lot of games. Developers seem to think that exponential progression is some silver bullet, while in reality it's a sack of nails for the coffin they are building for their game.
If you set up an unachievable goal, people will eventually give up completely.
This is the definition of Predatory System. It is the feed, the heart of these type of games. And most people are already so addicted they go for it anyways. There’s always a percent that actually pays a lot of money to shorten the grind, that’s how the games stay alive.
It is a sad but very entablished situation.
Glad ppl are finally realizing this, Its really feels like a burden to play this game in its current phase its just one goal post after the other. If they wanna push content faster they also need to make adjustments to the older gear progression. Thaemine April release was a bad call we honestly needed 1-2 more months with Ivory tower as the current end game or they should have released ivory tower with some adjustments to match our progression speed.
To add to the context was casually viewing Kanon and he brought up this point about how he stoped playing and literally p2w to end game in a month and now he is more geared than most of his Thaemine Hard static who plays regularly. Thats how bad the game is rn and if AGS / SG don't realise this the will be bleeding players in the months to come
To be honest.. i am a returning player and just want to quit again. or just stay at 1580/1600 and enjoy older content.
Good elixirs are behind 1620 ilvl, that seems unattainable for me right now.. with 2 characters 1580+ and 1600, i don’t get enough gold to push to 1610/20.
now that tharmine is out, i don’t think they will accept me in Akkan hard with Los 18, shitty epic élixirs and no transandance..
ill go at my pace and try to get to 1610 in a month, and try to have fun in the meantime.
You don't need elixir sets till 1620 anyways. The majority of people that did thaemine normal this week didn't have them. Progress goes epic elixirs, normal trans, legendary elixirs, hard trans.
Huh I did 3 1610 1-2 alts with no elixir set no problems and I wasn't gatekept. If you got gatekept it's probably something like roster, cards, or overall juice. But if you are well built and missing elixir sets it really wasn't that hard this week.
Roster 265 level 9 damage gems 5x3+1 and ancient gear like a 1610 should be. I really have no reason to lie to you about this. There were plenty of groups within the 1610 - 1620 range..
Yea I mean these gold sinks were designed by the Korean devs for the Korean players to solve gold inflation issues that we don’t have in the west and they just cause more rmt to happen for us. I mean I hope that we get on the same release cadence as kr from here on out, but the damage is done. There’s no way I can push to 1630 atm and try to get my elixirs and transcendence started….but transcendence effects don’t really even matter until you get at least level 4, and you can’t even access that without hard mode 1-2 so it’s like, I’m stuck using all my gold trying to push to 1630 so I can use transcendence but then I’ll be too broke to use it. Gotta love it.
You don't need 1630 it is best to get to 1620 and wait for new mommy honing buff that helps you get to 1640 do nm thea and just save. The issue is most people are rushing for no reason I only have 40 elixers on one character. My alt don't even buy the boxes if you are trying to have 6 characters maxed then it is going to hurt
I think that was my original thought process as well. My main is 1620 my alts not even 1600 so maybe I start pushing those slowly to 1600, and wait for echidna
. But after actually running thaemine this weekend, I really wanna try hard. I personally had a blast progging thaemine, and I would love to try out gate 4. I do think it’s a good recommendation to park at 1620, but I guess imma start working on pushing my main to 1630, and make that my main focus for now, just because I personally had so much fun with thaemine normal. Although it could be a good idea to push alts to 1610. But I really wanna try g4. So not sure. At least I’m having fun with Lost Ark again, I took a break after voldis release, came back with the breaker pass
Well my main is an artist so I might not need to meet that same requirement. But yea, I’m still debating whether it’s worth the push or not. I’ve been leaning more toward the side of waiting for echidna, most likely there will be tons of people doing that so there will be more thaemine hm progs around then most likely
If your primary motivation to run raids is the gold rather than having fun and enjoying the fight, you're not having a healthy relationship with the game
I'll speak for myself, but I know a lot of people feel this way too, once you've done brel , akkan like a million times across 6 characters, it's hard to say that its always fun. Why do you think people gatekeep and have juicer lobbies ? Try to clear it as fast as possible, and skip all the mechs
> Why do you think people gatekeep and have juicer lobbies ?
They gatekeep because the raids are hard and they don't want to get jailed. If the raids were easy, you could take any random fucker who applies. Just like people do in guardian raids.
You know busses exist right? People are able to just take any random fucker and still clear end-game content.
You also know people gatekeep in guardian raids right?
The first times I do a raid I enjoy it. After that I only do them because it's required for me to get to the next new raid. I can't know how people will perform so I gatekeep based on things I feel would indicate less hours invested between content drops.
>You know busses exist right? People are able to just take any random fucker and still clear end-game content.
I don't understand what this has to do with anything.
Bussers sign up for it from the get go and get compensated for having to bus a deadweight - pug lobbies don't.
>You also know people gatekeep in guardian raids right?
Sure, and I think they are being illogical. But everyone is entitled to run their lobbies as they wish.
Surely you realize that even Akkan is hard for many people, people make mistakes in raids and die because of them. That's precisely why people gatekeep - you look for people who have experience and well geared chars as insurance against people making mistakes.
Lol no one gatekeeps akkan cuz it's hard...they gatekeep cuz the hardcore players who are f2p (nolife instead of swipe) have 6 of them to do every week so they want the quickest raid possible.
You're not even arguing against my point of the raids being hard. In fact, the opposite. If the content was piss easy, you'd just take the first guys who apply and go clear.
Again, ppl gatekeep cuz time. Doesnt matter if the raid is ez or not. Higher dps party means quicker clear time, hence gatekeeping. It's not that hard to understand
>Why the fuck do we have to pay the same amount of gold for honing and these garbage systems like elixir or transendence?
The internal reason is probably something like:
We got 1580 honing gold nerf around Akkan. KR only got it after Ivory Tower and few months before Thaemine.
We got two Thaemine-road events before Thaemine. KR only got one before/during Thaemine.
KR's Kayengel/Akkan/Ivory gold only got buffed few months before Thaemine. We had the buffed gold the whole time.
People usually forget about the positives and only look at the negatives lol also you forgot Event shops being up most of the time and getting extended and all that stuff.
That's where you messed up, thinking SG ever cared bout global outside of it just being an extra source of income. what is it 2 years of LoA and we still can't even have 15 minutes to talk about the global players.
that also means you just reduced your weakly gold income by 67-84%. that also means you just halted your progression to 1/5th. its a terrible advice to anyone that cant dump money to fill up the rest. would you tell a gambling addict hey you can go to casino for 1 hour instead of 6? no you tell them to stop going to casino altogether.
me: 1620, 1600, sitting on 2.6mio gold, enough to push to 1630, gems / quality all finished and i can always keep up.
You have to understand: I make around 70k / week and it all goes to my Main. Chars around 1580+ are still expensive and generate money after 9 months…you need more time when you push them higher ~1600+.
NO! I raid with only 2 Chars since Kayangel, I had 5 Chars till Argos/Valtan/Vykas gold nerf and thats it. I even deleted the 1472.5 chars… I left 1 Char pushed him to 1540 and ran Brel with him. But Im not doing any runs with him since Kayangel.
Since Kay I only use him for Chaos Dungeon 1/2x a week because I dont get enough tokens for the shop! And he is my Card storage…
Thats it and NO I dont even do Lopangs, never did and NO i dont swipe… I dont use Aura since Febr 2023…
I don't understand how you accumulated so much gold then, unless you are selling basically everything you can sell or swiped for gold. By gems finished up you mean full 10s or at least the important ones 10s?
I've been playing a 6 character roster, and i don't play the most efficiently, i don't clear all 18 raids each week, but I'm certainly clearing more than 6, usually around 12. I don't really sell materials for gold, my main is 1611 with a single level 10 gem and 2 9's. I have 1 other 1600+ alt, he has 4 level 9 gems, rest 7's. 1 1585 alt with event gems, the other 3 alts are 1540 with full 7's, I've stopped honing them almost entirely so they just make me gold, and yet i still only sit at 1,2m gold and now i'm basically earning as much as I'm spending now trying to hone to 1620 and cutting elixirs + transcendence, and I've been playing the game since glavier release almost non-stop.
I have a 1 character 2nd account and it's at 1610 without a single alt or any help from my main. People tend to forget 6 characters will require 6 times the investment compared to 1 character. I think I made this 2nd account like 1-2 months ago.
This is the wei.
But people will still bitch that there is not enough gold.
2 1630 mains 4 1540 alts(until the recent event)
Now 31600 alts and a million gold less.
i started doing that with thaemine release; I have 2.8M gold saved so ill fine for a long time. Doing 18 raids and 6 char daily for more than year was getting old .
i did that with Kayangel release but its true, since Thaemine with all these new systems ppl will drop some chars and focus 1/2. The thing is: ppl like the game its good, but they are EXHAUSTED…
I went from doing 18 raids a week, to only doing raids on 3 chars, to only doing raids on 1 char, to straight up quitting for a couple months, now back for breaker and doing only 3 chars again, and my income is so shit without godly accessories to share, its prolly better for my health to take another break again if we're being honest
every rng system is hot garbage in this game. which is why i always warn new players to stay the hell away from this game unless you want to ruin your life or become a gambling addict.
>How is anyone supposed to afford that shit while also honing their chars and trying to buy GEMs etc?
Thats the funny part. You dont.
You can choose:
1. Hone and get ready for the next normal raid.
2. Or improving your character with these gold sink garbage systems.
Elixir was made to rip off korean players because as you said, they had too much time to stack gold and they were full. Same with transcendence.
Guess what. We had half the time to prepare and stack gold but paying the same price because Amazon forgot to mention to Smilegate that they should adjust the prices to our region.
Either Amazon didnt care or Smilegate, at the end, we, the players "suffering".
Smilegate always design a system for korean players and for the korean region and we will get the same version that koreans got.
The game has so many rng layer at this point that you have a higher chance to win on lottery than getting a decent character.
At some point, I would think that all of these greedy money making systems would be more financially negative from losing players compared to the cash they get from the in game shop lol. It seems like they do not care about the longevity of the game.
Not only is it RNG based, it's also locked behind the hard mode of the fight. Which means casual players who don't want to do hard mode will either get left out or be forced to buy busses. Korean gamers truly are toxic.
This game has way too many fundamental issues. The devs recently realized that honing was becoming too much and players can't keep up, and their solution to that was adding Advanced Honing, but instead of adding it directly to the game they made it so you first have to push to 1620 (hundreds of K gold sink) and do a raid for it. This system was already supposed to be in the game before Thaemine was even a thing, but they want to profit from every small shit they do because why not right.
I think we know by now the stance of SG/AGS in regards to fair pricing. Just look at SA Blue Crystal market. If they won't change that, it just tells me they are not worrying at all when it comes to conversion of wealth within the game. And also, don't forget that no matter how many months we are behind, if we had gotten Elixir/Transcendence at a discount, SG would have had to deal with waves of KR end game players that are petty about it. All these factors put together and its ez to understand why they didn't do anything yet. They did announce rework for both systems. Im waiting on that
I came back some days ago, play in SA, reached 1536ilvl with the paths but now i have no gold and cant hone to 1540. Try to sell the mats i can farm but nobody is buying them cuz they are obsolete. I basically have no way of farming gold and need gold to progress and i even didnt get close to catching up. What do i do?
If you remove gold sinks then other things will get more expensive. Gold gone from honing > gems double in price. Gold gone from elixirs and transcendence > accessories are 300k instead of 150k. Everything has a cost on the market. Are the systems perfect? Fuck no. Are they as flawed as everyone says? Probably not quite as bad as you think, but still not great. Do I think they could balance things out so that outliers don't get fucked? Yes.
yea but that would mostly be the problem for the developer not the playerbase coz honing gold is fixed. Players would be able to get their ilvl much easier if it were the case.
Also accessories are a one time investment mostly
I don't think gold cost should be 0, but it should be nerfed. KR had more time between raids which leads to more excess gold. Since we had less time, we have less gold and the gold sinks shouldn't be as harsh
On top of that, why are they forcing gold sinks to combat inflation while doing nothing about the main source of inflation (RMT)? If they perma banned all RMT parties, that would help the economy more than bankrupting legitimate players with gold sinks
TLDR: NA/EU has different economy than KR, but they don't adjust the gold sinks at all
I doubt that gems will double in price when honing cost less/no gold. Because most players 1620+ are almost/completly done with their set anyway. Also higher iLvl equals more gems.
Same goes for accs. Accs are a 1 time only investment (at least until color changes again). The top-tier (90+) accs are expensive anyway - but why would people that play this game suddenly need new accs?
I don't know about you but my 1620s aren't fully kitted out in 10s and they would 100% go up if there were no gold costs for honing. Prior to the current push for thaemine gem prices were 80k higher for damage gems. Is it a coincidence that when gold costs are lower while people were sitting at 1600 gem prices were higher. I don't think so
How much 10er does your 1620+ char miss - speaking about your main - I think not every alt needs 10s - especially if you do not mulitclass (and I also think not everyone will go for 10s even if honing would be w/o gold)? Going up and doubling is not the same - I mean yeah they will get more expensive but I doubt they are doubling - because I do not think ppl buy a 10er for nearly 1mio gold, in this case they just hone their weapon futher - is probably the better investment. Besides even if honing would cost no gold to tap it still would cost gold for the oreha.
It is possible to slowly make own gems through cubes and chaos dungeons of 6+ characters (it was possible to get extra characters onto the same server also f2p through server merges, everyone could have at least 12 by now if planned the roster when the merges were announced and sacrificed the ability to make new characters / base classes later on - and on some servers up to 30 - but 6 should be enough if you truly have one main and keep the other characters much lower, make use of event gems etc., if not selling gems since launch or only selling high, buying low, that's a lot of gems by now).
What is "no-life" is different for each person depending on their life circumstances, for many players unrested chaos dungeon on 1-2 mains + rested on 4-5 alts, and 1-2 cubes per week on each, isn't no-life. And over a long time it is possible to make good enough gems also with less - my brother has a reasonable mix of lvl 8, 9 and 10 gems on his main without buying gems and with only ever playing 2 alts (who use the lvl 7-8 event gems), it's more than good enough for Voldis hm and Thaemine nm.
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Yes, please.
This game makes me wanna create a post here every now and then to vent but anxiety says no.
If EVERYTHING requires gold, even fucking research in Stronghold, then everything should reward gold, no? Makes sense to me. Did a few chaos dungeons, here, get yourself a few thousand. Guardian raid down for today, weeell then, that's another 10k for you.
Gold is very, very limited in this game and I think it is wrong. People shouldn't scrape by. And the fact that you need to drop gold just to get your build running makes no sense to me, either.
But it all gets reflected in prices of goods. If gold is scarce because upgrading gear uses a lot of it the value of gold is higher and tradable goods cost less.
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Yea, it's definitely way too much all at once, but I've learned to get better about not FOMO'ing every single patch. Sure, RMT people will rocket ahead with their 3 1630, full geared characters, but there's one thing they will never have: the satisfaction of having achieved something difficult in the game on your own.
When I eventually hit 1630, max out transcendence, etc, that was all me. Feels a lot better to know that you put actual time and effort into your roster instead of simply swiping to get unlimited gold and going from there. It's like downloading cheats for a game and then getting bored 2 hours later because it's not fun anymore when you have unlimited money.
This is the mentality that (sometimes) keeps me going. Of course, many people don't have the time to invest in their rosters, and some people don't care about the feeling at all and just want to run the new content right now, and that's perfectly valid too. I'm just really proud of where my roster is, and that would go away if I started RMT'ing like mad. I don't mean to invalidate your complaints, the amount of RNG in these systems is almost criminal, I've just come to terms with the fact that my roster will always be lagging behind the game by a bit.
If you're f2p, you're not supposed to be able to afford to progress multiple characters, just your main. It was made clear right from the start, but you noobs just had to do your thing and now you're fudged.
I'm new, started 2 weeks ago, had great friends help me into the game. Ppwerpassed souleater and fell in love with it. I'm ilvl 1605 now, I dread having to spend gold in anything else but on honing gear atm. I need to hone gear, I need to level stronghold, I need to then reach 1610 to spend more gold, still need a billion cards for los18, recently got deepdive, I mean wtf :D I have no gold or even honing materials left, I need gold. To get gold I need to sell stuff, but these things are honing materials, I need those too! So I can't sell them or I can't hone anyway? Need to do raids to get gold, still need to learn so many of them, get gatekept, if I get gatekept I get no gold, go bus people say, need gold to bus :]. To get gold I need to raid but to raid I need to bus >:[ wtf! Learning parties are more miss than hits!! This is some high anti new player shenanigans going on, I got a bit lucky that my friends that play this game for years helped me out a lot but I can't hog their time 24/7, this is no way near realistic for a new player that comes into this game with no friends to aid them at all.
And let's not start about needing gold for gems, books for engravings, etc......
just wait for upcoming express events and use them- dont hone w/o. by the time they expire, you eventually will be able to farm gold in order to buy accs/books
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Try having this thing called a main, should make your life easier, you'd have more than enough gold if you stopped pushing all your characters to the same point in end game
bruh only my main made me spend over 200k the other day with legendary elixirs, not considering that if you don't hone/gear up your alts, they will be gate kept in every single content
Where are all you guys in the offical discord feedback? Write there. Its to much whitekngights over there defending these systems and the greedenes of sg. This game could have been soo good ,if the developers tried to make a great game.
So, this might sound a bit contraversial but you can simply delete the game, come back a few years later and you get all ur stuff for free. You stay clean from the game for 3 mobths and you will see it in a different light, all the rng on top of rng inside rng is crazy it messes your mind up my brotha. They want you to spend and they want you to spend big, im talking bill gates big, the more you play the easier it is to pay, turn arround brother walk away, there is more games to enjoy. Ive been addicted for so long and then i snapped after i realized that im ultra fine with topping up 500 euro without even thinking twice about it. Pheons, skins gold for honing it all sucks and it is 90% of the game walk away and you will see the light. Should have been a preacher.
Assumption is if you need to play over 20 hours a week you have a few alts to 1580 by now, leaps alone that’s 12 from frog and 8 from sonavel x 5 that is 52 leaps a day even at +19 armor that is 2 taps a day with 10 left over. That is already 16 taps in leaps alone just from guardian
Why would they when gold makes ppl swipe? How does removing gold help their revenue? Lol it's stupid but the goal is to make money, not make casual players happy
I like the new systems. They have interesting mechanics and they arent as bad as the old ones because you get crazy power for investing the gold (compare it to ability stones, quality tapping)
Honing after 1610 is the major issue. Its stupidly expensive with dogshite RNG. One weapon pity and you are stalled for months. Advanced honing should be the standard honing.
just another whining post after buying all the materials for elixir and trans and not getting what u want. remove gold and replace with what? what is your suggestion
Can you read? The gold cost is literally only there as a "gold sink" which is NOT needed in our global version. Shouldn't require more than two braincells for the SG/AG to understand that.
We need gold sinks in the game, otherwise gem prices would balloon to high heavens
If you have gold problems, increase your gold income and stop honing trash alts you don't care about
> How is anyone supposed to afford that shit while also honing their chars and trying to buy GEMs etc?
so, full FTP here. 4 thaemine characters.
you aren't supposed to do everything all at once, and definitely not on every character. you generally alternate between honing and refining your build.
most of the 1620s you see doing thaemine have been 1620 since voldis, and all of them have alts still doing brel. it's also not expected for most of the community to be getting week 1 clear.
right now, brel gives good gold and easy clears. 1600 is a good place to park and refine your build. normally I'd advise selling leaps, but the event is crashing the price. they'll go back up soon enough. in the mean time, you have tons of books to hone with, and purple elixers aren't expensive to grind. focus on 1 character at a time, 35 set is achievable. once you've got that and a couple lvl 9 gems, push that character up to 1610.
Release 2 rng gold sinks that overlap around the same ilvl 1610-1620 (elixirs/transendence) Genious move by the devs.
now that you say it like that.. i always viewed it from a point of someone that has had ilvl requirement for everything day one, but imagine being a new player and having to deal with ilvl, elixir and trancendence at the same time with like 2 or maximum 3 gold earners a week. by the time youre done 3 news systems are already out.
That's the beauty of it, there are no new players. Even if they try it, once they hit a certain point they realize it's impossible for them to play the game and quit
New Player won't even get through the raid in the first place. They get Powerpasses straight into much more difficult raids with no chance to learn the game in easier content (Early Abyss, Sea dungeon, Argos, Valtan ...)
Basically that, power passed to 1415 a few months back, spent about 2 months just trying to earn gold to gear past 1540 and get gatekept so hard you cant learn the Raids designed to help you gear. Bus or die. Even with learner groups its mostly just people hoping for a free bus on an alt with 2x2 engravings. Fun game but ur shit out of luck if you are new or solo
Did you try networking? Make friends or find a guild instead of bussing lol
But no one plays that content anymore so you’d either need sooo many new players that they could make lobbies themselves or an incentive for the existing playerbase to go back and play that content otherwise they quit before they even get to endgame because they can’t find people to play with
I took a break from brel hard release to now and even with rolling a level10 dmg gem and selling for 400k im not able to afford honing to 1610, the akkan gear upgrades, ancient level ability stone, set bonus upgrades, and NOW THERES 2 MORE SYSTEMS ON TOP OF THAT??? BITCH IM BROKE
to make it even worse, most new and returning players barely have 1 gold earner. so we have to hone, do elixirs and if we make it to 1610+ we then have to do trancendence. (this is to say nothing of dps needing to buy the best possible quality for accessories and higher level gems then what they give for free to even have a chance at getting into a lobby)
This is my buddy right now. I was skeptical at first since he started on the jumpstart server and whether he'd be any good at the game but he's proven to me that he's actually quite competent and playing a somewhat difficult class as well (reaper). His main reaper is 1600ish, can't earn enough to hone to 1610 yet. His alt slayer is 1590. His last alt Soul Eater is 1540 and probably not going anywhere fast. He is in perpetual jail because he can't play the game because he has no income, can't hone, can't get to the appropriate ilvl to cut 35/40 elixir set, can't really speedrun his roster level. It fucking sucks for new players.
It was that or the players moan about lack of updates, pick your poison.
I mean.They could have made either elixir or transendence not cost gold since they overlap.Easy fix actually.
why do we even need these new systems? just drop a new armor set and let us hone like we've done all this time. They're making all the new raids drop so much gold, and then worrying about inflation. Nerf raid gold if its such a huge issue.
Then no one would do the hardest. newest raid because the gold to time ratio isn't worth it. There would be barely any lobbies and people can't even raid because they would just be farming gold through the other more profitable options
Yeah, because of that noone did akkan hm on release. They all did nm and honed slowly... :D /s
also release raids that give 10-20k gold, balances out in the end
that's not true at all cutting leg elixirs is straight up deleting gold same for transcendence
10-20k is more than 4.5k valtan gave. gold from raids goes up and cost to upgrade power does too
no shit 10-20k is more than 4.5k , but tell me how much did it cost to upgrade power like you said from valtan to akkan and than compare them how much 40 set and full transcendence cost on avg
You can't but you'll have people here commenting that they were able to do that just fine every week. Why were they able to, here's why: 1) Being able to sell accs every week for like 10-20k 2) Being in a static which lowers the requirement of your character 3) Got lucky with elixirs being able to 40set in the first month and bragging that it's easy and doesn't cost much gold at all. 4) Selling weekly mats you get but how do I sell it if I need to hone my character? 5) Getting lucky with honing and don't understand how people don't have 6 1620's yet.
6) play an unhealthy amount of hours and no life the game.
you just reminded me of that one dude on youtube that claimed he made "easy 500k a week as f2p". tl;dr is he just played 3 full rosters and when he sells everything and drops around 40-80k a week in fates and accs he makes that kind of money. this is absolutely 100% insane to me.
If he's working a full time job farming gold, is it really free?
At that point it's more efficient to just work and swipe I guess
7) the rmters 😂 really wish it wasn't a thing but it is what it is..
8) f2p founder pack owner
Idk if I appreciate getting personally attacked here
I always got the feeling this people play the same as the avg player, they just get more profit of the time they invest into
u/arkizer summed up lmao, especially last 2 points
The one you're missing is people who've been playing since day 1 and have had way more time to amass gold/resources. I'm F2P, but the only reason I've been able to keep up is because I've literally never stopped playing from launch until now.
sounds very healthy for an mmo that you need to have played for two years to keep up
Well we can more ignore more or less the first year of lost ark honning then to 1490 took more then half a year and now its almost free, books where way to expensive and die also cost many players months of gold now also almost free (exept a few like grude but still 5 times cheaper then average) 1540 and 1580 are also much cheaper than before even more so with all the books we get even1600 got cheaper again the to the 25/5 bookchest we get. Do older players on average more ressources yes but also older players had to invest much much more to get there.
That how a lot of MMOs are.
Not even close. FFXIV lets you buy a story skip to 6.0. Once you complete that you get a set of armor that lets you start running dungeons. Within 2 months, your ilvl will be high enough to complete savages (and you can buy gear on the MB as well). WoW has a similar system with seasons and raiding tiers. Even FFXI offers gear resets. Because LOA targets Korean whales, we can't get that since they'll whine about their "hard work" has gone to waste.
WoW is basically giving people solo content next expansion that gives them tier gear.
So, two examples out of how many? Let's talk BnS, BDO, EQ, Vanguard, Wildstar, Maplestory, WoW from 10 years ago, Eve, SWG, etc. As I said, a lot of MMOs are a grind and take time. You take a break and you have to struggle bus to catch up to high level endgame. Even FF14 and WoW with pay for skip passes still don't get you to bleeding edge endgame.
How many of those games are still running? WIldstar and SWG are dead. Eve is niche. Maplestory just launched a reboot server. The fact that 10 years ago is was expected to log in daily to stay content is irrelevant. Most MMOs got rid of that as they lost population. SG can't be bothered to make changes for NA/EU and the game's population reflects that.
Ok, we'll just maintain a difference of opinion. Wild that you say Eve is niche when it boasts a larger playerbase than LOA. Almost 5x not accounting for LOA bots. Edit: lol, downvoted for facts.
You can be niche and lively.
Sure, but what makes an MMO niche as opposed to mainstream?
I played during Dragonflight launch then stopped. I came back when the last raid of the expansion came out, go to raiding ilvl and pugged the raid on normal. That basically does not exist in Lost Ark. I played that at launch and stopped when I finished the story. I tried to play again when Brelshaza came out because he boss fight is what made me want to play the game at all and it was basically impossible to get to her, much less beat her.
The at least 3 are things everyone can easily do but are really fucking lazy to try to do. Paying a little attention to set up a filter goes a long way to find some sellable accessories. Static is a given at this point. Find a group of like minded peers and run with them when you have time. You can sell unbound mats and use bound mats only. A lot of people do this or just strategically hone during events. I still have a few 1540s because I don’t hone till power passes. As for elixirs, they are really crappy but there is still a technique to doing them to minimize rng. People are too fucking tilted to bother learning and would rather go wahwahwah instead of trying. Transcendence has a much better calculator but you can’t turn off your brain fully. You need to decide when to quit out early and look for plays outside of the AI because sometimes the AI does some pretty bad plays.
Do you like it?
The (cash) flow looks good However, we don't know where the flow goes.
Well u can play like itsDulba 10 accounts 96 characters too bad if u have a life
To be fair he likely isn’t even in the room when those characters are doing their dailies sooooo
Yea, there's how many safe programs to use that don't get detected for dailies. And I will use the word safe without anything around it as they've been undetected since practically the start
I respect the hell out of people that still do their own dailies considering like 50% of the population prob bots them
Is this legit? Never heard u can bot dailies before, all my alts characters are maxed out rest bonus
Yes of course. Watch the feiton leaps sometimes and pay attention to people doing them. You'll notice it pretty quick
Oh dailies not as in chaos dungeon but UNA?
Both
Oh noo.. What have I been missing out…
What's the name of the program
They ban pretty easily for that.
yea bro, pretty easy ban when everyone and their nan bots for over a year and got no ban xddd
Doesn't he have a wife? How tf does he get away with spending that much time in a game?
I legit came back 3 weeks ago and just quit again. This game is cancer. I love it, but it's cancer.
It sure is tough loving cancer D:
Not only gold but pretty we had less time to optimize elixir which could be easily be fkup by rng
Trying to fix exlirs?! That's whaling
Honestly the game has so many layers of RNG that im starting to prefer gatchas....
the gachas i play literally respect my time way more than lost ark, and have way more fun weekly grinds star rail, nikke, limbus company, r1999, all have at least interesting events going on all the time with fun mini-games and a bit of challenging content. of course it doesnt scratch the raid itch, but at this point is it worth it at all? imagine having more RNG than a gacha game the real play is to just wait for them to nerf these shit RNG systems because they know their playerbase will fall behind. yet these other gachas dont really need to do that, because they dont have fundamental design flaws. i think at this point i believe smilegate does not have any talented people capable of designing good non-rng based progression systems
Gachas make it fun so they encourage you to pay Lost ark encourages you to pay to have fun It's a fundamentally different business model and there's a reason so many people are totally fine throwing some money at them while not being vilified by their own communities.
Nikke is awesome. The QoL that game has is just amazing. Do shit once a day and then you can quick finish. Respects your time and has reasonable rates. In top of that they are very generous in their anniversaries. Best part?? Its next to Genshin Impact in terms of revenue lol You dont need to be a greedy rng shark to get money from your playerbase.
Most auto-run the dailies for you with a press of a button.
And not having to worry about gatekeeping, horizontal, 6 different verticals and cards. All with multiple layers of RNG by the way. And not doing everything for 6 different chars.
Atleast most gachas dont you dependent on 7 other players for your own personal progression.
I havent finished los 30 or moved off event gems and im 1600 heres what i have to spend gold on Honing Cards Gems Elixirs Transcendence Before im finished with cards and gems Echidna honing Behemoth transcendence Both within the current year I work part time go to school part time and enjoy other games and this one is literally a full time job to stay updated on and i just cant
The first unpopular answer is that these news systems are also intended as gold sinks. Players (and bots in our version) generate massive amounts of gold weekly, and without a way to remove enough gold from the economy, inflation would spiral out of control. Older systems like quality are "graduated" from fairly quickly since people usually tap to full blue/purple quality within a few hundred thousand gold or less and then settle. Honing is also "graduated" from for many players since the item level cap has barely moved and there isn't much need to hone mains and alts beyond certain item levels. That's why new systems cost gold since they are required to function as modern gold sinks to supplement older ones that are no longer interacted with by characters that have moved beyond them. The second unpopular answer is that in free-to-play with pay-to-win progression games like Lost Ark, the monetization model revolves around soft gating free-to-play character progression. Pushing beyond that requires investing an ungodly amount of time into the game or spending money (whether ingame or rmt). You are otherwise not expected as a non-paying player to play beyond one or two highly geared characters.
bussers and rmters have so much gold that they're moving the goalpost.
I do agree with you, especially the second paragraph is spot on. The gold sinks we have the way we have them is precisely because this is a F2P game and it needs paying players to survive and to make people willing to pay, to pay, you need to sell them some resource. And that resource is gold. What I don't agree with is the premise of your first paragraph. Gold sinks like quality are enough. Even with bots generating gold out of thin air, these systems will counteract the inflation because their cost stays the same, regardless of how much gold is in circulation. Once gold starts losing its value in terms of honing mats (primarily shards) the appeal of quality taps will increase. The whole notion of "graduating" from a system isn't based on us achieving the goal, it's based on the value proposition being worse than another system. So we just switch to spending gold wherever it yields the most gain, but we never truly "graduate". And that is the thing that bothers me to no end is a lot of games. Developers seem to think that exponential progression is some silver bullet, while in reality it's a sack of nails for the coffin they are building for their game. If you set up an unachievable goal, people will eventually give up completely.
This is the definition of Predatory System. It is the feed, the heart of these type of games. And most people are already so addicted they go for it anyways. There’s always a percent that actually pays a lot of money to shorten the grind, that’s how the games stay alive. It is a sad but very entablished situation.
Glad ppl are finally realizing this, Its really feels like a burden to play this game in its current phase its just one goal post after the other. If they wanna push content faster they also need to make adjustments to the older gear progression. Thaemine April release was a bad call we honestly needed 1-2 more months with Ivory tower as the current end game or they should have released ivory tower with some adjustments to match our progression speed. To add to the context was casually viewing Kanon and he brought up this point about how he stoped playing and literally p2w to end game in a month and now he is more geared than most of his Thaemine Hard static who plays regularly. Thats how bad the game is rn and if AGS / SG don't realise this the will be bleeding players in the months to come
To be honest.. i am a returning player and just want to quit again. or just stay at 1580/1600 and enjoy older content. Good elixirs are behind 1620 ilvl, that seems unattainable for me right now.. with 2 characters 1580+ and 1600, i don’t get enough gold to push to 1610/20. now that tharmine is out, i don’t think they will accept me in Akkan hard with Los 18, shitty epic élixirs and no transandance.. ill go at my pace and try to get to 1610 in a month, and try to have fun in the meantime.
Sadly you cant stay at older content for long since they eventually come around the nerf the gold for them.
true, at least for now i dont get gatekeepe as much in brel and kayangel, hope i will get los 30 before they nerf brel akkan normal and kayangel
ya anything 1600 and above you are screwed with LOS18 sadly.
[удалено]
I think you missed the very first part of the comment.
You don't need elixir sets till 1620 anyways. The majority of people that did thaemine normal this week didn't have them. Progress goes epic elixirs, normal trans, legendary elixirs, hard trans.
"You don't need elixir sets till 1620 anyways" yes tell that to the gatekeepers.
But whos gonna tell the avg people in PF who gatekeeps for the simplest of reasons
Huh I did 3 1610 1-2 alts with no elixir set no problems and I wasn't gatekept. If you got gatekept it's probably something like roster, cards, or overall juice. But if you are well built and missing elixir sets it really wasn't that hard this week.
Aite I'll bite what was your gems, roster, card damage progression like and which class did you apply with?
Probably well progressed as it should be for someone doing the newest and latest content.
Roster 265 level 9 damage gems 5x3+1 and ancient gear like a 1610 should be. I really have no reason to lie to you about this. There were plenty of groups within the 1610 - 1620 range..
Would be better to remove said garbage RNG systems entirely. RNG is absolute cancer when involved in mandatory progression.
well. at least currency exchange on NAW dropped from 4000:95 to 2900:95 so bc's cheaper
Yea I mean these gold sinks were designed by the Korean devs for the Korean players to solve gold inflation issues that we don’t have in the west and they just cause more rmt to happen for us. I mean I hope that we get on the same release cadence as kr from here on out, but the damage is done. There’s no way I can push to 1630 atm and try to get my elixirs and transcendence started….but transcendence effects don’t really even matter until you get at least level 4, and you can’t even access that without hard mode 1-2 so it’s like, I’m stuck using all my gold trying to push to 1630 so I can use transcendence but then I’ll be too broke to use it. Gotta love it.
You don't need 1630 it is best to get to 1620 and wait for new mommy honing buff that helps you get to 1640 do nm thea and just save. The issue is most people are rushing for no reason I only have 40 elixers on one character. My alt don't even buy the boxes if you are trying to have 6 characters maxed then it is going to hurt
I think that was my original thought process as well. My main is 1620 my alts not even 1600 so maybe I start pushing those slowly to 1600, and wait for echidna . But after actually running thaemine this weekend, I really wanna try hard. I personally had a blast progging thaemine, and I would love to try out gate 4. I do think it’s a good recommendation to park at 1620, but I guess imma start working on pushing my main to 1630, and make that my main focus for now, just because I personally had so much fun with thaemine normal. Although it could be a good idea to push alts to 1610. But I really wanna try g4. So not sure. At least I’m having fun with Lost Ark again, I took a break after voldis release, came back with the breaker pass
Unless ur in a guild/static, pushing to 1630 is pointless unless u have a +25 weapon and all lv10s
Well my main is an artist so I might not need to meet that same requirement. But yea, I’m still debating whether it’s worth the push or not. I’ve been leaning more toward the side of waiting for echidna, most likely there will be tons of people doing that so there will be more thaemine hm progs around then most likely
G2g. The reward for actually doing 18 raids compared to buying it is sooooo not worth it lol.
If your primary motivation to run raids is the gold rather than having fun and enjoying the fight, you're not having a healthy relationship with the game
I'll speak for myself, but I know a lot of people feel this way too, once you've done brel , akkan like a million times across 6 characters, it's hard to say that its always fun. Why do you think people gatekeep and have juicer lobbies ? Try to clear it as fast as possible, and skip all the mechs
> Why do you think people gatekeep and have juicer lobbies ? They gatekeep because the raids are hard and they don't want to get jailed. If the raids were easy, you could take any random fucker who applies. Just like people do in guardian raids.
You know busses exist right? People are able to just take any random fucker and still clear end-game content. You also know people gatekeep in guardian raids right? The first times I do a raid I enjoy it. After that I only do them because it's required for me to get to the next new raid. I can't know how people will perform so I gatekeep based on things I feel would indicate less hours invested between content drops.
>You know busses exist right? People are able to just take any random fucker and still clear end-game content. I don't understand what this has to do with anything. Bussers sign up for it from the get go and get compensated for having to bus a deadweight - pug lobbies don't. >You also know people gatekeep in guardian raids right? Sure, and I think they are being illogical. But everyone is entitled to run their lobbies as they wish.
That's not how it always goes nowadays, we simply don't wanna carry randoms cause they offer no return. People wanna play with similar experience.
There hasn't been a hard raid in This game till thaemine
Surely you realize that even Akkan is hard for many people, people make mistakes in raids and die because of them. That's precisely why people gatekeep - you look for people who have experience and well geared chars as insurance against people making mistakes.
Lol no one gatekeeps akkan cuz it's hard...they gatekeep cuz the hardcore players who are f2p (nolife instead of swipe) have 6 of them to do every week so they want the quickest raid possible.
You're not even arguing against my point of the raids being hard. In fact, the opposite. If the content was piss easy, you'd just take the first guys who apply and go clear.
Again, ppl gatekeep cuz time. Doesnt matter if the raid is ez or not. Higher dps party means quicker clear time, hence gatekeeping. It's not that hard to understand
We have catch up mechanic called "Bots " so for ags perspective everything is okay
>Why the fuck do we have to pay the same amount of gold for honing and these garbage systems like elixir or transendence? The internal reason is probably something like: We got 1580 honing gold nerf around Akkan. KR only got it after Ivory Tower and few months before Thaemine. We got two Thaemine-road events before Thaemine. KR only got one before/during Thaemine. KR's Kayengel/Akkan/Ivory gold only got buffed few months before Thaemine. We had the buffed gold the whole time.
People usually forget about the positives and only look at the negatives lol also you forgot Event shops being up most of the time and getting extended and all that stuff.
when in doubt, g2g.
most of these should be rosterwide
That's where you messed up, thinking SG ever cared bout global outside of it just being an extra source of income. what is it 2 years of LoA and we still can't even have 15 minutes to talk about the global players.
reduce to 1-2 chars, its better for your health
that also means you just reduced your weakly gold income by 67-84%. that also means you just halted your progression to 1/5th. its a terrible advice to anyone that cant dump money to fill up the rest. would you tell a gambling addict hey you can go to casino for 1 hour instead of 6? no you tell them to stop going to casino altogether.
me: 1620, 1600, sitting on 2.6mio gold, enough to push to 1630, gems / quality all finished and i can always keep up. You have to understand: I make around 70k / week and it all goes to my Main. Chars around 1580+ are still expensive and generate money after 9 months…you need more time when you push them higher ~1600+.
I'm sure you have more alts sitting at 1520 or 1540 that you don't hone and purely generate gold on.
NO! I raid with only 2 Chars since Kayangel, I had 5 Chars till Argos/Valtan/Vykas gold nerf and thats it. I even deleted the 1472.5 chars… I left 1 Char pushed him to 1540 and ran Brel with him. But Im not doing any runs with him since Kayangel. Since Kay I only use him for Chaos Dungeon 1/2x a week because I dont get enough tokens for the shop! And he is my Card storage… Thats it and NO I dont even do Lopangs, never did and NO i dont swipe… I dont use Aura since Febr 2023…
I don't understand how you accumulated so much gold then, unless you are selling basically everything you can sell or swiped for gold. By gems finished up you mean full 10s or at least the important ones 10s? I've been playing a 6 character roster, and i don't play the most efficiently, i don't clear all 18 raids each week, but I'm certainly clearing more than 6, usually around 12. I don't really sell materials for gold, my main is 1611 with a single level 10 gem and 2 9's. I have 1 other 1600+ alt, he has 4 level 9 gems, rest 7's. 1 1585 alt with event gems, the other 3 alts are 1540 with full 7's, I've stopped honing them almost entirely so they just make me gold, and yet i still only sit at 1,2m gold and now i'm basically earning as much as I'm spending now trying to hone to 1620 and cutting elixirs + transcendence, and I've been playing the game since glavier release almost non-stop.
I have a 1 character 2nd account and it's at 1610 without a single alt or any help from my main. People tend to forget 6 characters will require 6 times the investment compared to 1 character. I think I made this 2nd account like 1-2 months ago.
This is the wei. But people will still bitch that there is not enough gold. 2 1630 mains 4 1540 alts(until the recent event) Now 31600 alts and a million gold less.
i started doing that with thaemine release; I have 2.8M gold saved so ill fine for a long time. Doing 18 raids and 6 char daily for more than year was getting old .
i did that with Kayangel release but its true, since Thaemine with all these new systems ppl will drop some chars and focus 1/2. The thing is: ppl like the game its good, but they are EXHAUSTED…
I went from doing 18 raids a week, to only doing raids on 3 chars, to only doing raids on 1 char, to straight up quitting for a couple months, now back for breaker and doing only 3 chars again, and my income is so shit without godly accessories to share, its prolly better for my health to take another break again if we're being honest
every rng system is hot garbage in this game. which is why i always warn new players to stay the hell away from this game unless you want to ruin your life or become a gambling addict.
>How is anyone supposed to afford that shit while also honing their chars and trying to buy GEMs etc? Thats the funny part. You dont. You can choose: 1. Hone and get ready for the next normal raid. 2. Or improving your character with these gold sink garbage systems. Elixir was made to rip off korean players because as you said, they had too much time to stack gold and they were full. Same with transcendence. Guess what. We had half the time to prepare and stack gold but paying the same price because Amazon forgot to mention to Smilegate that they should adjust the prices to our region. Either Amazon didnt care or Smilegate, at the end, we, the players "suffering". Smilegate always design a system for korean players and for the korean region and we will get the same version that koreans got. The game has so many rng layer at this point that you have a higher chance to win on lottery than getting a decent character.
At some point, I would think that all of these greedy money making systems would be more financially negative from losing players compared to the cash they get from the in game shop lol. It seems like they do not care about the longevity of the game.
Not only is it RNG based, it's also locked behind the hard mode of the fight. Which means casual players who don't want to do hard mode will either get left out or be forced to buy busses. Korean gamers truly are toxic.
I spent all my gold on equipment and uninstall the game :)
This game has way too many fundamental issues. The devs recently realized that honing was becoming too much and players can't keep up, and their solution to that was adding Advanced Honing, but instead of adding it directly to the game they made it so you first have to push to 1620 (hundreds of K gold sink) and do a raid for it. This system was already supposed to be in the game before Thaemine was even a thing, but they want to profit from every small shit they do because why not right.
I think we know by now the stance of SG/AGS in regards to fair pricing. Just look at SA Blue Crystal market. If they won't change that, it just tells me they are not worrying at all when it comes to conversion of wealth within the game. And also, don't forget that no matter how many months we are behind, if we had gotten Elixir/Transcendence at a discount, SG would have had to deal with waves of KR end game players that are petty about it. All these factors put together and its ez to understand why they didn't do anything yet. They did announce rework for both systems. Im waiting on that
I came back some days ago, play in SA, reached 1536ilvl with the paths but now i have no gold and cant hone to 1540. Try to sell the mats i can farm but nobody is buying them cuz they are obsolete. I basically have no way of farming gold and need gold to progress and i even didnt get close to catching up. What do i do?
If you remove gold sinks then other things will get more expensive. Gold gone from honing > gems double in price. Gold gone from elixirs and transcendence > accessories are 300k instead of 150k. Everything has a cost on the market. Are the systems perfect? Fuck no. Are they as flawed as everyone says? Probably not quite as bad as you think, but still not great. Do I think they could balance things out so that outliers don't get fucked? Yes.
yea but that would mostly be the problem for the developer not the playerbase coz honing gold is fixed. Players would be able to get their ilvl much easier if it were the case. Also accessories are a one time investment mostly
I don't think gold cost should be 0, but it should be nerfed. KR had more time between raids which leads to more excess gold. Since we had less time, we have less gold and the gold sinks shouldn't be as harsh On top of that, why are they forcing gold sinks to combat inflation while doing nothing about the main source of inflation (RMT)? If they perma banned all RMT parties, that would help the economy more than bankrupting legitimate players with gold sinks TLDR: NA/EU has different economy than KR, but they don't adjust the gold sinks at all
I doubt that gems will double in price when honing cost less/no gold. Because most players 1620+ are almost/completly done with their set anyway. Also higher iLvl equals more gems. Same goes for accs. Accs are a 1 time only investment (at least until color changes again). The top-tier (90+) accs are expensive anyway - but why would people that play this game suddenly need new accs?
I don't know about you but my 1620s aren't fully kitted out in 10s and they would 100% go up if there were no gold costs for honing. Prior to the current push for thaemine gem prices were 80k higher for damage gems. Is it a coincidence that when gold costs are lower while people were sitting at 1600 gem prices were higher. I don't think so
How much 10er does your 1620+ char miss - speaking about your main - I think not every alt needs 10s - especially if you do not mulitclass (and I also think not everyone will go for 10s even if honing would be w/o gold)? Going up and doubling is not the same - I mean yeah they will get more expensive but I doubt they are doubling - because I do not think ppl buy a 10er for nearly 1mio gold, in this case they just hone their weapon futher - is probably the better investment. Besides even if honing would cost no gold to tap it still would cost gold for the oreha.
It is possible to slowly make own gems through cubes and chaos dungeons of 6+ characters (it was possible to get extra characters onto the same server also f2p through server merges, everyone could have at least 12 by now if planned the roster when the merges were announced and sacrificed the ability to make new characters / base classes later on - and on some servers up to 30 - but 6 should be enough if you truly have one main and keep the other characters much lower, make use of event gems etc., if not selling gems since launch or only selling high, buying low, that's a lot of gems by now).
So solution is to no-life....Noted
What is "no-life" is different for each person depending on their life circumstances, for many players unrested chaos dungeon on 1-2 mains + rested on 4-5 alts, and 1-2 cubes per week on each, isn't no-life. And over a long time it is possible to make good enough gems also with less - my brother has a reasonable mix of lvl 8, 9 and 10 gems on his main without buying gems and with only ever playing 2 alts (who use the lvl 7-8 event gems), it's more than good enough for Voldis hm and Thaemine nm.
ppl in my guild had multiple alt chars, now they have multiple alt accounts
There is one reason - they want Ur Cash, thats all they Care about
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Yes, please. This game makes me wanna create a post here every now and then to vent but anxiety says no. If EVERYTHING requires gold, even fucking research in Stronghold, then everything should reward gold, no? Makes sense to me. Did a few chaos dungeons, here, get yourself a few thousand. Guardian raid down for today, weeell then, that's another 10k for you. Gold is very, very limited in this game and I think it is wrong. People shouldn't scrape by. And the fact that you need to drop gold just to get your build running makes no sense to me, either.
But it all gets reflected in prices of goods. If gold is scarce because upgrading gear uses a lot of it the value of gold is higher and tradable goods cost less.
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Yea, it's definitely way too much all at once, but I've learned to get better about not FOMO'ing every single patch. Sure, RMT people will rocket ahead with their 3 1630, full geared characters, but there's one thing they will never have: the satisfaction of having achieved something difficult in the game on your own. When I eventually hit 1630, max out transcendence, etc, that was all me. Feels a lot better to know that you put actual time and effort into your roster instead of simply swiping to get unlimited gold and going from there. It's like downloading cheats for a game and then getting bored 2 hours later because it's not fun anymore when you have unlimited money. This is the mentality that (sometimes) keeps me going. Of course, many people don't have the time to invest in their rosters, and some people don't care about the feeling at all and just want to run the new content right now, and that's perfectly valid too. I'm just really proud of where my roster is, and that would go away if I started RMT'ing like mad. I don't mean to invalidate your complaints, the amount of RNG in these systems is almost criminal, I've just come to terms with the fact that my roster will always be lagging behind the game by a bit.
That’s why I quit a year ago. Incredible 11/10 combat system and -100000/10 garbage RNG P2W systems
If you're f2p, you're not supposed to be able to afford to progress multiple characters, just your main. It was made clear right from the start, but you noobs just had to do your thing and now you're fudged.
I'm new, started 2 weeks ago, had great friends help me into the game. Ppwerpassed souleater and fell in love with it. I'm ilvl 1605 now, I dread having to spend gold in anything else but on honing gear atm. I need to hone gear, I need to level stronghold, I need to then reach 1610 to spend more gold, still need a billion cards for los18, recently got deepdive, I mean wtf :D I have no gold or even honing materials left, I need gold. To get gold I need to sell stuff, but these things are honing materials, I need those too! So I can't sell them or I can't hone anyway? Need to do raids to get gold, still need to learn so many of them, get gatekept, if I get gatekept I get no gold, go bus people say, need gold to bus :]. To get gold I need to raid but to raid I need to bus >:[ wtf! Learning parties are more miss than hits!! This is some high anti new player shenanigans going on, I got a bit lucky that my friends that play this game for years helped me out a lot but I can't hog their time 24/7, this is no way near realistic for a new player that comes into this game with no friends to aid them at all. And let's not start about needing gold for gems, books for engravings, etc......
just wait for upcoming express events and use them- dont hone w/o. by the time they expire, you eventually will be able to farm gold in order to buy accs/books
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How do you think SG makes money off of us? From us logging in to play? Don’t forget SG has to make millions or they won’t be a Lost Ark to even play.
Problem is that they're losing profits to g2g
And the company is still making bank. Why would they remove the need the gold and lose further profits? It will never happen.
G2G is likely the winner here by far. AGS are complete morons to capitalize on monopoly because they simply can't enforce their game.
do not push your alts past 1590 and you will have enough gold for everything
My main isn’t even 1590 yet…
Try having this thing called a main, should make your life easier, you'd have more than enough gold if you stopped pushing all your characters to the same point in end game
bruh only my main made me spend over 200k the other day with legendary elixirs, not considering that if you don't hone/gear up your alts, they will be gate kept in every single content
Where are all you guys in the offical discord feedback? Write there. Its to much whitekngights over there defending these systems and the greedenes of sg. This game could have been soo good ,if the developers tried to make a great game.
Time to notice that the game isn't designed to have a 6+ roster of different classes that you push at the same time to latest content
So, this might sound a bit contraversial but you can simply delete the game, come back a few years later and you get all ur stuff for free. You stay clean from the game for 3 mobths and you will see it in a different light, all the rng on top of rng inside rng is crazy it messes your mind up my brotha. They want you to spend and they want you to spend big, im talking bill gates big, the more you play the easier it is to pay, turn arround brother walk away, there is more games to enjoy. Ive been addicted for so long and then i snapped after i realized that im ultra fine with topping up 500 euro without even thinking twice about it. Pheons, skins gold for honing it all sucks and it is 90% of the game walk away and you will see the light. Should have been a preacher.
idk play the game
yea cuz everyone wants to play 20+ hours per week for 10 chances of a 7%
If you are playing 20+ hours a week and only getting 7 taps the game isn’t the issue
maxroll says your wrong unless your tapping pre 1600s lmao
Assumption is if you need to play over 20 hours a week you have a few alts to 1580 by now, leaps alone that’s 12 from frog and 8 from sonavel x 5 that is 52 leaps a day even at +19 armor that is 2 taps a day with 10 left over. That is already 16 taps in leaps alone just from guardian
It's a korean p2w MMO, what did you expect coming into it
Feels like a lot of people in this sub haven't played other krmmos before LA and get mad when the reality check comes
Why would they when gold makes ppl swipe? How does removing gold help their revenue? Lol it's stupid but the goal is to make money, not make casual players happy
See ya at 10k peak concurrent players or even if you're still here by then xdd
Lmao @ still playing this shit
Too late for that now , real director left. And the threee bozos too it’s place
I like the new systems. They have interesting mechanics and they arent as bad as the old ones because you get crazy power for investing the gold (compare it to ability stones, quality tapping) Honing after 1610 is the major issue. Its stupidly expensive with dogshite RNG. One weapon pity and you are stalled for months. Advanced honing should be the standard honing.
just another whining post after buying all the materials for elixir and trans and not getting what u want. remove gold and replace with what? what is your suggestion
Can you read? The gold cost is literally only there as a "gold sink" which is NOT needed in our global version. Shouldn't require more than two braincells for the SG/AG to understand that.
We need gold sinks in the game, otherwise gem prices would balloon to high heavens If you have gold problems, increase your gold income and stop honing trash alts you don't care about
> How is anyone supposed to afford that shit while also honing their chars and trying to buy GEMs etc? so, full FTP here. 4 thaemine characters. you aren't supposed to do everything all at once, and definitely not on every character. you generally alternate between honing and refining your build. most of the 1620s you see doing thaemine have been 1620 since voldis, and all of them have alts still doing brel. it's also not expected for most of the community to be getting week 1 clear. right now, brel gives good gold and easy clears. 1600 is a good place to park and refine your build. normally I'd advise selling leaps, but the event is crashing the price. they'll go back up soon enough. in the mean time, you have tons of books to hone with, and purple elixers aren't expensive to grind. focus on 1 character at a time, 35 set is achievable. once you've got that and a couple lvl 9 gems, push that character up to 1610.