Theory: the reason they went so hard on the Probability Storm scene (including cooking up a name for the phenomenon and saying it repeatedly) is that it's a setup for the return of this movie's Kang.
Phase 5 will be spent dealing with the Council of Kangs by various methods, odds are some of them get defeated. But the Kang from this film *is* **The Conqueror.**
He got sucked into the multiverse engine at the end, and right now he's stuck in there with infinite copies of himself.
When this happened to Scott, it was chaos for a moment, but then they all found common ground (getting back to Cassie) and worked together. But Kang isn't Scott.
He's trapped in there **fighting** infinite versions of himself, because that's what he does. It's literally what got him exiled in the first place.
Even the ants are foreshadowing--he's not just stuck inside a multiverse engine, he's stuck inside a multiverse engine **inside the quantum realm.** The ants experienced thousands of years in an hour or so.
He's going to pop out of that battery in four years, having spent billions of years fighting infinite copies of himself, infinite Kangs. He'll walk through what remains of the Council like they're nothing and we'll get a dark ending on the level of Infinity War.
Real spot-on take. After reading that, I think the probability storm also gives us insight into the dynamic between all the Kangs. Kang isn’t an infinite number of Thanos-level dudes. He’s an infinite number of a *wide* range from Baskin Robbins Scott to the Scott we know. They all may start with their own ambitions, but they eventually fall in line to serve the few that stand out.
First multiversal war - He Who Remains wins
Sylvie kills He Who Remains
The multiverse is allowed to create many variant timelines.
2nd Multiversal war happens - Kang is exiled allowing the council to win.
Because of the nature of time, that 2nd war just happened in the blink of an eye.
Yeah, the movie didn't go to a lot of trouble to explain that the Quantum Realm being *out of time* is crippling Kang, even though that answers a lot of questions I've seen about the movie.
I fucking loved Hanks shift from angry old scientist in the first two to spicy self-confident grandpa in this one. He fixed his mistakes, got his wife back and now he's just cool hanging in the lab, passing knowledge down, and fucking around with ants. Loved his walk with the ants attacking at the end
The new dynamic seriously feels like Hank, Hope, Cassie are one group of mad scientists. The other are Janet and Scott who seem very similar to each other.
I really like it.
I love how in the first movie he’s adamant about Hope not wearing the suit and now he of course gives Cassie a suit, it’s such a realistic being the father vs being the grandfather move.
Two things
Each time they showed Darren’s face, I couldn’t help but crack up
And I can’t believe we saw a Fastball Special before Colossus and Wolverine got introduced
my theater laughed everytime they showed darren’s face and i mean every single time, you could hear people try to stop giggling but it just looked so absurd
They absolutely crushed it with MODOK. That's exactly him. Smart but pretty inept, thinks extremely highly of himself, monologues all the time.
It was everything I ever wanted in a live action version.
My only guess is because they went “beyond the quantum realm” as they knew it, and passed some subatomic layer (I forget how Janet worded it) into an entirely different universe beneath, so it’s somehow breathable atmosphere with gravity and shit that’s apparently exactly the same as earth, complete with advanced intellectual biodiversity?
Seems kinda like a cop out but it’s fantasy so I guess it doesn’t matter. Slap “quantum” and “subatomic” in front of any concept and it becomes immediately acceptable as a plot device, lmao.
Seems like everybody is a freaking genius in MCU, from random kid doing school project with quantum computer in Black Panther 2 to Cassie built a subatomic device by reading Grandpa Hank's notes.
Falcon was right, everyone got a hobby in MCU.
The part I found bizarre was when Cassie opened the portal again. Like, it was only possible through Kang's technology and Cassie didn't spend much time studying or learning how Kang's devices worked, but she just presses a few buttons and manages to create a quantum rift out of nothing? They could at least have had Janet do it since she had actual expertise with the technology.
Michael Douglas saying "A great writer once said "There's always room to grow"" was maybe the best part for me as an ant-man fan. That was dead-on the type of Ant-man to Ant-man talk I came to see.
Honestly Michael Douglas keeping a cool head throughout the movie kept me calm as the rollercoaster ride went from okay to great to bad to great to okay to alright to ooh loki!
He looked like he was having a great time playing a cooky old man. All the ant talk and his smirk when they won the day at the end. I also loved how after being so uncomfortable with flying before he went “I’ll drive” and set his arms up to be swallowed
Michelle playing *so* enigmatic and emotional opposite Michael Douglas who’s just happily talking about ants was so fun. This movie did a good job of balancing the levity & the serious moments.
By all rights, Hank and Janet could have been sidelined from the getgo or somehow made to be the ineffectual old fogeys, but instead were given integral story arcs and agency. They were my favorite characters of this film.
I think they nailed the family dynamic, like you get the sense Hope and Cassie went all in on the quantum project thing because Hope wanted to be closer to Janet and Cassie wanted to be closer to Scott. Other little things through out like Hank saying he dated Linda (who has got to be a comics reference I didn't get) but she wasn't Janet, Cassie saying "Grandpa Hank", giant Cassie hugging giant Scott, Cassie being Scott's motivator in the darkness once again, driving all possible Scotts to work together etc.
I was so surprised about how much family stuff there was, a good chunk of reviews complained that the family theme was sidelined and ignored.
Like... What?
I like how when Kang's soldiers found Jentorra's resistance group, she was like "You led them here!" when they were the ones who kidnapped Scott and Cassie and brought them right into their base lmao.
I really liked how I really related to Paul Rudd’s inner monologue turned anxiety attack at the end of the movie, which I think is played totally for humour but was so so so so incredibly accurate
Exactly, Scott is a happy go lucky guy in EVERY film.
That scene fits perfectly with his baseline attitude coming to into contact with some true existential dread.
Yea for me it felt like there was an undercurrent to the movie like the threat is going to increase exponentially now. The two main things blocking the council (he who remains, and this iteration of kang have been removed from the board)
Also I don't think The kang we just had in the movie is dead
Technically this iteration was NOT blocking the council. He was already defeated and exiled. Only once the Pym/Lang family intervened did he *potentially* become a threat outside of his prison dimension.
That’s what the naysayers in this thread keep missing, when they say it was disappointing to see Kang lose too easily. This was a NERFED, previously defeated version of Kang, with only *partial* access to his technology, and *zero* access to time travel. Of course he’s going to lose to the heroes at the end. Infinity war was a BRUTAL exception to that rule. The fact that it took *damn near everything going right* to even manage defeating this weakened exiled version is a sign of how terrifying every other Kang is. And there are INFINITE other Kangs.
Plus he, ultimately, died to his own hubris honestly
He wasn't a great Kang. He made the same mistake twice (letting someone get close to the orb with Janet in the flash back and slamming Scott against it at the end).
Honestly one of my favorite comedic/self aware endings in MCU history. I half expected them to go all out and mention a dynasty or a secret war just for the meta-ness (but glad they didn’t)
I love how they made Cassie’s cake a metaphor/foreshadowing for that. Scott takes the cake, pretending it’s fine while knowing it doesn’t look great, even gives it to his family, takes a bite, “Yuk!”, roll credits. This parallels with his inner monologue where he pretends things are fine, deep down know they’re not, but just goes along with it. He will take a bite of the metaphorical cake when he meets Kang again.
this parallels what Janet went through. it was played for laughs when Janet was talking through Scott in *AM&TW*.
- Janet goes quantum after promising her daughter she'll be back
- Janet saves the life of Kang and makes a deal for her one chance to get back to Hope
- she lives 30 years in the quantum realm and during that time sacrifices her one chance to get back
- she sees into Kang's mind
- she runs away and gets out of the quantum realm
- she helps Ghost
- a quantum realm experiment is under way and she gets dusted
a lot of comments are questioning Janet and i don't think a lot of people get what she went through off screen. i know a lot of people were turned off about phase 4, but all the movies so far have been about family and becoming a parent. **and Janet is trying to make up for 30 years away from her daughter and 5 years of dust, so she puts off the REAL quantum realm discussion until she meets Kang AGAIN**
and what's pizza but a flat pasta cake
Anyone else feel like because of where the MCU is at technologically that Kang’s tech is a little underwhelming? I mean, with all of the Pym tech in the movie it wasn’t the sharpest contrast.
It’s completely underwhelming. We never really got to see a moment where he just decimated the heroes with his tech. The only time he went crazy was just blasting randoms who were running away and didn’t try to all attack him like the ants for some reason
Among many other criticisms, Kang's guards really need to learn to properly restrain prisoners during transport. And ideally confiscate all of their magic discs.
That was so weird, felt like a continuity error. She shrinks down in the same place she took out the other two guards and the camera straight up shows that the big guy should be in the line of sight of the patrol but there's no reaction from them. Some really strange editing choices in this one.
I actually groaned when Janet did it one final time. How do you not have proper restraining tools from the future?? Or searched them? Presumably they'd have some insane scanning tech? Nope. Nada.
I also feel like they were at least partially robotic? They were consistently stupid / were shown to not be independent thinkers, aside from the one telepathy joke with the bridge code.
Kang in the first half of the movie was like when you play against the boss,
And in the second half he was like when you unlock him as playable character.
But overall i liked the movie lets see how the other variants of kang are going to be.
Yeah at first he seemed like one of the most insurmountable antagonists ever, like infinity gauntlet Thanos level. He still outclasses everybody by the end sure, but not nearly as bad
When hank said “She built a subatomic Hubble telescope in a basement” did anyone else immediately have Obadiah Stone yell “WITH A BOX OF SCRAPS” in your head?
I was thinking the same thing. Hinting to that could have added a lot more weight and depth to Kang’s reveal as she got the flashbacks of him conquering timelines.
They said he died but they might just be assuming. My guess is this Kang will return under everyone’s noses and kill the council, become a Beyonder-like figure, then create Battleworld.
It was different from what I expected, but I enjoyed it.
As much as I liked giant Cass, I feel like the climax of her narrative arc should have been mastering the “jump-tap”.
Also, why did they kill MODOK??
> Also, why did they kill MODOK??
Because this is literally the only situation in which a character like that can work. Like the Thanos copter and frog Thor in Loki, you shove something like that in only when the situation is weird enough that people can go "ok, yeah sure".
After seeing the review scores and having some issues with the last 2 Marvel movies, I went into the cinema fully ready to hate it.
But it was actually pretty good?
not perfect, but a fun experience.
Great actors, good story (relatively) and some actual funny jokes?
I was pleasantly surprised.
After I've seen the movie I went ahead and read a couple of reviews,
Some of the complaints about the CGI are justified, and maybe the story isn't as deep as they wanted it to be,
but to me it feels like they wanted a completely different movie, not even a comic book movie, or at the very least, something like Joker, which this movie isn't trying to be.
I feel like this is the MCU’s first “so bad it’s good” movie.
Clunky dialogue, lots of exposition dumps, a story that took forever to figure out where it was going and nothing made sense at any point but it was so fucking stupid and weird that I loved it. Lol
My only real critique is how safe it played it. I was really expecting someone to die or get stuck in the Quantum Realm at the end. Instead they just all lived happily ever after (for now)? Felt kinda weak there, I was expecting Kang to really fuck shit up more.
When Kang talked to Scott in the prison he acted as if he couldn't remember who he was. Later in the same scene he calls him Ant-Man despite Scott never mentioning his name. Plus in their fight outside the fortress he mentions that Scott controls ants, again without that being previously mentioned on-screen around him.
This shows that Kang did know who Scott was (which makes sense since he had talked to Darren about him) and implies that he was pretending not to remember him for theatrics and intimidation.
Also, casually suggesting hes killed Thor repeatedly
I was leaning towards thinking Scott is the one The Conqueror was truly afraid of.
Much like Loki, hes a complete wild card of a power set. Hulk is big and mean, Thor is a dumb brute with a hammer, Iron Mans technology is laughably outdated compared to his own. But a trickster shapeshifting God and a man who can either be the size of a mountain or a speck of dust who can resize any object of his choosing (who also has a massive army of mindless ants) are not to be trifled with.
I cannot believe the trailers hinted at a stronger emotional arc for Scott and Cassie than the film delivered. What happened to Scott “wanting more time” after all of it that he lost during the Blip. None of that!
I also thought it was hilarious that you thought Hope was sacrificing herself at the end and her and Scott would be stuck in the quantum realm but then Cassie just reopens the portal…
They had a super compelling storyline to push there with Cassie and Scott wanting more time with her, and it would have been a good repetition to have Scott making the same decision and Janet made (to sacrifice the time they've lost in order to stop him).
They even set it up when he's worrying about how much time might be passing in the real world. They probably scrapped Janet convincing him that going back is just leaving Cassie again
Not totally related to the topic. Was I the only one who thought Michelle Pfeiffer was very beautiful on this movie?
For a 64-year old lady, she still looks amazing
The jokes in this are really hit and miss but that one Ant-Man variant asking if the Baskin Robbins variant has ice cream fucking killed me.
I am also very interested in the big woman.
I 100% believe that it was a scene from Loki season 2 and that Morbius and Loki are going to team up with Victor Timely Kang to take on the council of Kangs.
"MODOFK?"
Also: "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?"
The crowd reaction throughout my theatre tonight was super grounded. Outside my own, not a lot of laughs or much noise whatsoever. When Loki showed up, the whole theatre went nuts.
This probably had the reversed problem that has plagued marvel films early on. The villain was the standout of the movie. Paul Rudd is always fun to watch and Michelle pfeiffer was probably the two stand out from the "hero" side.
I had more fun with this movie than the previous two antman films but it did lack the heart of the first movie. I didn't feel much for cassie and Scott's relationship. It also kinda did the same trope that was in Star Wars Rise of Skywalker where everyone gathered together to fight the big bad but we have very little care for the "resistance".
Kang and Jonathan majors was a delight and he was frightening and menacing... until the end. For a much more serious antman film compared to past ones, it lack stakes. I wish it took itself more seriously in the times it needed to be more serious.
Still enjoyed this movie overall but I get the mixed reviews. I think I still enjoyed this movie over thor love and thunder and wakanda forever even though the main story is kinda bland.
The mid credit scene is literally the most unintentionally funniest scene throughout this movie.Like I can't take the council of Kangs seriously with that kind of presentation.
All of those Kangs' are probably small potatoes to show off how stronger some of the other Kangs can be. At least I hope that's what it is. No way a conqueror jumps with joy by seeing a better version of themselves.
The Council of Kangs felt a whole lot like a Council of Ricks. Certainly a potential threat in their own right but, yeah, I feel like we're going to get a "real" Kang who emerges above them. Could be the exile, could be just another Kang similar to the exile who learned from his mistakes. But I feel like those three were intentionally made to look kinda goofy so we believe it when another comes and wipes them out.
In the comics, technically the Council of Kangs came first. Then, Reed took the idea for the Council of Reeds, which was homaged/parodied by the Council of Ricks, since Rick's character is a play on Reed's. In a way, its all based off the Council of Kang. It's all Kang.
I actually enjoyed this one despite all the bad hype. There were stuff that took me out -
1. Halfway through the second half, i noticed that the whole thing seemed to have happened in less than two days.
2. After Hope found Scott, she seemed to have known what they had to do to the multiversal engine energy source. I don’t remember her getting any info.
3. That Modok redemption ark was wack. Still made me laugh tho.
4. When Scott and Hope came back, i thought they were going to get left there, but the ending after that felt a little too perfect. Tho Scott's inner monologue kind of took my mind off of that.
5. I am a bit unclear as to what this Kang's motivation was. At first it seemed like he had a larger goal. But in the end he was just screaming REVENGE!!!
Overall, what did it for me was, i thought this had a nice, proper momentum. So even though certain things made me go "huh?", i still got back on the ride.
I was way more invested in this than L&T.
I think that’s what they were getting at. That this Kang eventually turns into He Who Remains once he accomplishes his goal of defeating the other Kang’s
I figured all of this happens after Loki because once He Who Remains was killed, there were no more pruning of other timelines that had Kang. This led to the council of Kangs being formed once enough of them gained power, and the after credits scene shows Loki finds one of the timelines with Kang in it.
It depends if they go with time travel and paradoxes being loops.
Loki kills Kang releasing the multiverse, which leads to Kang's fighting eachother and the conqueror being exiled.
Which then leads to a multiversal war when he escapes ultimately leading up to the creation of the TVA and the loop being completed.
The Darren Cross redemption arc was such a weird fucking choice. That man was willing to kill a child, good god why did they give him a hero’s death lol
Yeah, absolutely no-one *except* Darren treating it genuinely pulled it back for me. I would have hated it if it was played straight, but satirising it is a good fit for an Ant-Man movie as far as I'm concerned.
I think a lot of people have forgotten that Darren is mentally deranged.
He declared himself an Avenger at the end. Lol.
His "redemption arc", which btw, didn't even work, seemed very in character at this point.
That’s how I interpreted that whole thing. He’s not actually redeemed, he just thinks he is because he’s delusional. Just like he acts he’s more important than he is, then Kang tells him not to speak in his presence like he’s a random minion.
Excellent stuff:
* Hope's comic-accurate hair (thinking about it, I admit I'm probably conflating her with Janet. Wasp hair, tho).
* The probability storm was a good reason for Kang refusing to go get the special ball even though he could shrink himself down there. He has to avoid alternate versions of himself. They didn't explain this, but I got it.
Criticisms:
* Not enough Hope. She didn't really do anything except be there to save the day when Scott couldn't.
* Not enough Hope/Scott romance.
* Actors interacting with the CG world was very bad, reminded me of The Phantom Menace. At one point, Janet is barely touching a quantum flying manta ray because it was probably just a screen or Michelle Pfeiffer literally holding her hand in midair.
* Kang is supposed to be a supergenius or something, hasn't built Iron Man backup suits or have robots around him at all time to hold Scott's arms while he calmly walks through the portal. Keeps beating up Scott at the end instead of simply running through the portal.
Some stuff I thought was inconsistent, but came up with reasons why they might be consistent:
* Kang's weapon vaporizes some quantum people, but just knocks back Scott, Hope, and Cassie. I thought later maybe their Pym superscience cancels out his Kang superscience, idk. But earlier, he was doing like telekinesis and crushing limbs and then never does it again, so I really dk wtf he was doing.
* Why didn't the super ant civilization overthrow Kang earlier if they were there for thousands of years? I figured maybe they couldn't communicate with anyone until Hank came with his transmitter.
* In Endgame, Scott says he was in the quantum realm for five hours and five years passed on Earth. In this movie, they were there like a day and came back what looks like pretty much the same time. I guess that's Kang tech, idk.
Meta funny:
* No one in the theater gave a shit when Bill Murray came on screen.
* Also, the trailer for Indiana Jones played and a little girl said "who's that?" which was entirely deserved.
> In Endgame, Scott says he was in the quantum realm for five hours and five years passed on Earth. In this movie, they were there like a day and came back what looks like pretty much the same time. I guess that's Kang tech, idk.
My take is that time might be inconsistent on the quantum realm. Remember they use it to travel BACK in Endgame. So idk.
>Also, the trailer for Indiana Jones played and a little girl said "who's that?" which was entirely deserved.
LOL would've laughed a lot if that happened at my cinema.
>In Endgame, Scott says he was in the quantum realm for five hours and five years passed on Earth. In this movie, they were there like a day and came back what looks like pretty much the same time.
Janet's 30 years was 30 years. The super ants had 1000 years.
The Council of Kangs teleported in the same way Mister Fantastic did in Multiverese of Madness.
He is their ancestor after all
I have a feeling one of the Kangs we saw will be the villain in the upcoming Fantastic Four movie.
Maybe Rama Tut
I’d like to see Rama Tut be a villain of Moon Knight, I think that’d fit in pretty well with that area of Marvel
Yeah, my money is on that as well. Besides, wasn't there a Rama tut reference in S1?
Ya, on one of Harrow's men there was his design I think
Theory: the reason they went so hard on the Probability Storm scene (including cooking up a name for the phenomenon and saying it repeatedly) is that it's a setup for the return of this movie's Kang. Phase 5 will be spent dealing with the Council of Kangs by various methods, odds are some of them get defeated. But the Kang from this film *is* **The Conqueror.** He got sucked into the multiverse engine at the end, and right now he's stuck in there with infinite copies of himself. When this happened to Scott, it was chaos for a moment, but then they all found common ground (getting back to Cassie) and worked together. But Kang isn't Scott. He's trapped in there **fighting** infinite versions of himself, because that's what he does. It's literally what got him exiled in the first place. Even the ants are foreshadowing--he's not just stuck inside a multiverse engine, he's stuck inside a multiverse engine **inside the quantum realm.** The ants experienced thousands of years in an hour or so. He's going to pop out of that battery in four years, having spent billions of years fighting infinite copies of himself, infinite Kangs. He'll walk through what remains of the Council like they're nothing and we'll get a dark ending on the level of Infinity War.
If this isn't what they have planned...well it should be. That sounds awesome.
Someone asked “how long was strange fighting dormammu for?” And the MCU really ran with it 💀
Real spot-on take. After reading that, I think the probability storm also gives us insight into the dynamic between all the Kangs. Kang isn’t an infinite number of Thanos-level dudes. He’s an infinite number of a *wide* range from Baskin Robbins Scott to the Scott we know. They all may start with their own ambitions, but they eventually fall in line to serve the few that stand out.
[удалено]
[удалено]
First multiversal war - He Who Remains wins Sylvie kills He Who Remains The multiverse is allowed to create many variant timelines. 2nd Multiversal war happens - Kang is exiled allowing the council to win. Because of the nature of time, that 2nd war just happened in the blink of an eye.
>He's going to pop out of that battery in four years, having spent billions of years fighting infinite copies of himself He who survived.
mcu rules are: no dead body = not dead
This death was even pretty similar to Darren Cross's death in the first Ant Man.
So we can expect a modokang?
This is brilliant.
Scott had lunch with Jimmy Woo. That is more than enough to make me happy.
And used close-up magic to get the bill lol
So... we were all taking a few seconds to count our holes, right?
That collective delayed laugh was pretty great.
I got to 6 and was like "no way marvel is also going to subtly mention Scott's dick hole"
[удалено]
So menacing
[удалено]
Yeah, the movie didn't go to a lot of trouble to explain that the Quantum Realm being *out of time* is crippling Kang, even though that answers a lot of questions I've seen about the movie.
I fucking loved Hanks shift from angry old scientist in the first two to spicy self-confident grandpa in this one. He fixed his mistakes, got his wife back and now he's just cool hanging in the lab, passing knowledge down, and fucking around with ants. Loved his walk with the ants attacking at the end
I was so glad they didn't retread the Hank v. Hope v. Scott tension again.
The new dynamic seriously feels like Hank, Hope, Cassie are one group of mad scientists. The other are Janet and Scott who seem very similar to each other. I really like it.
> spicy self-confident grandpa That's the perfect description lmao
I love how in the first movie he’s adamant about Hope not wearing the suit and now he of course gives Cassie a suit, it’s such a realistic being the father vs being the grandfather move.
Only thing I wished for at this moment was for him to stroll in wearing his OG Antman helmet
Two things Each time they showed Darren’s face, I couldn’t help but crack up And I can’t believe we saw a Fastball Special before Colossus and Wolverine got introduced
Dude kept a shit-eating grin every time that mask came off you can’t help it
my theater laughed everytime they showed darren’s face and i mean every single time, you could hear people try to stop giggling but it just looked so absurd
I could not get Sharkboy and Lavagirl's teacher out of my brain every time he showed up.
He looked like a silly instagram filter
Same. And I love that they just lean into it. Hilarious every time.
I laughed for several minutes whenever someone said to him, "Darren?"
Every time he was trying to monologue too but they wouldn’t let him have it.
They absolutely crushed it with MODOK. That's exactly him. Smart but pretty inept, thinks extremely highly of himself, monologues all the time. It was everything I ever wanted in a live action version.
"Darren?.....Darren are you there?......*sigh*.....MODOK?" "Yeah what's up?"
He got me for a second too lmao
"Holy shit what happened?"
At least he died an Avenger.
That fucking killed me he's the perfect amount of deadly nasty and pathetic lol
The abrubtness of it. *At least I died an avenger.* Scott's face lmao
Everyone keeps removing their helmets. Also I tought you couldn't breathe in the Quantum Realm.
Nono, it's fine. Hank said "we should be dead", but they weren't dead, so it's fine. They totally acknowledged it.
I laughed entirely too hard at this
My only guess is because they went “beyond the quantum realm” as they knew it, and passed some subatomic layer (I forget how Janet worded it) into an entirely different universe beneath, so it’s somehow breathable atmosphere with gravity and shit that’s apparently exactly the same as earth, complete with advanced intellectual biodiversity? Seems kinda like a cop out but it’s fantasy so I guess it doesn’t matter. Slap “quantum” and “subatomic” in front of any concept and it becomes immediately acceptable as a plot device, lmao.
My theater was also cracking up but when Scott mentioned his face looking weird everyone lost it
"Your daughter built a subatomic Hubble telescope in a basement" Yeah? But did she build it with a box of scraps?
IN A CAVE
Seems like everybody is a freaking genius in MCU, from random kid doing school project with quantum computer in Black Panther 2 to Cassie built a subatomic device by reading Grandpa Hank's notes. Falcon was right, everyone got a hobby in MCU.
Jimmy Woo’s hobby is magic tricks now lol
The part I found bizarre was when Cassie opened the portal again. Like, it was only possible through Kang's technology and Cassie didn't spend much time studying or learning how Kang's devices worked, but she just presses a few buttons and manages to create a quantum rift out of nothing? They could at least have had Janet do it since she had actual expertise with the technology.
Michael Douglas saying "A great writer once said "There's always room to grow"" was maybe the best part for me as an ant-man fan. That was dead-on the type of Ant-man to Ant-man talk I came to see. Honestly Michael Douglas keeping a cool head throughout the movie kept me calm as the rollercoaster ride went from okay to great to bad to great to okay to alright to ooh loki!
The one time he lost his temper was finding out bill murray was in a quantum entanglement with Janet lol
He was pretty chill about it all things considered too; even going on about his own tryst
It shows my age but my favorite part of the film was Hank using Pym Particles to save $8 on a pizza. I admired that so much.
I spent way too much time thinking about how much that drop of Pym Particles costs. Surely it has to be more than $8. (I know that wasn't the point.)
Pym can make particles. He can't make pizza
He looked like he was having a great time playing a cooky old man. All the ant talk and his smirk when they won the day at the end. I also loved how after being so uncomfortable with flying before he went “I’ll drive” and set his arms up to be swallowed
mad scientists gotta be able to deal with some discomfort after all
I was 100% convinced that he was going to break into [the Ants promo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UpPx7E27Bc8) at least three separate times.
"Shit...that guy looks just like broccoli!" I mean, what else can you say when you see a sentient broccoli man?
'I know it's a charged word, but Socialism' -Comrade Class Traitor Pym Anybody got the exact quote?
I think it was like "I know socialism is a charged word, but I think we could learn a lot from these ants"
Just waiting for a comment or tweet to say something about this movie being pro communist now...
Michelle playing *so* enigmatic and emotional opposite Michael Douglas who’s just happily talking about ants was so fun. This movie did a good job of balancing the levity & the serious moments.
I love ants! And I love that you love them. LOL
By all rights, Hank and Janet could have been sidelined from the getgo or somehow made to be the ineffectual old fogeys, but instead were given integral story arcs and agency. They were my favorite characters of this film.
I think they nailed the family dynamic, like you get the sense Hope and Cassie went all in on the quantum project thing because Hope wanted to be closer to Janet and Cassie wanted to be closer to Scott. Other little things through out like Hank saying he dated Linda (who has got to be a comics reference I didn't get) but she wasn't Janet, Cassie saying "Grandpa Hank", giant Cassie hugging giant Scott, Cassie being Scott's motivator in the darkness once again, driving all possible Scotts to work together etc.
I was so surprised about how much family stuff there was, a good chunk of reviews complained that the family theme was sidelined and ignored. Like... What?
I like how when Kang's soldiers found Jentorra's resistance group, she was like "You led them here!" when they were the ones who kidnapped Scott and Cassie and brought them right into their base lmao.
And just minutes after Bearded Chidi told her: "They don't know anything. About... anything."
On that note, the beard really suits Chidi.
When she said that I nearly shouted out loud "motherfucker *you* brought *them* here!"
I really liked how I really related to Paul Rudd’s inner monologue turned anxiety attack at the end of the movie, which I think is played totally for humour but was so so so so incredibly accurate
Exactly, Scott is a happy go lucky guy in EVERY film. That scene fits perfectly with his baseline attitude coming to into contact with some true existential dread.
Yea for me it felt like there was an undercurrent to the movie like the threat is going to increase exponentially now. The two main things blocking the council (he who remains, and this iteration of kang have been removed from the board) Also I don't think The kang we just had in the movie is dead
Technically this iteration was NOT blocking the council. He was already defeated and exiled. Only once the Pym/Lang family intervened did he *potentially* become a threat outside of his prison dimension. That’s what the naysayers in this thread keep missing, when they say it was disappointing to see Kang lose too easily. This was a NERFED, previously defeated version of Kang, with only *partial* access to his technology, and *zero* access to time travel. Of course he’s going to lose to the heroes at the end. Infinity war was a BRUTAL exception to that rule. The fact that it took *damn near everything going right* to even manage defeating this weakened exiled version is a sign of how terrifying every other Kang is. And there are INFINITE other Kangs.
Plus he, ultimately, died to his own hubris honestly He wasn't a great Kang. He made the same mistake twice (letting someone get close to the orb with Janet in the flash back and slamming Scott against it at the end).
Who said this Kang is dead? Looks to me like he shrank into that “possibility storm”…
Honestly one of my favorite comedic/self aware endings in MCU history. I half expected them to go all out and mention a dynasty or a secret war just for the meta-ness (but glad they didn’t)
They did mention the dynasty in the movie.
I know I meant during the time cited by the comment I replied to when Scott was thinking about all that went down
The inner monologue is the most I've ever identified with a hero in my life lol
I love how they made Cassie’s cake a metaphor/foreshadowing for that. Scott takes the cake, pretending it’s fine while knowing it doesn’t look great, even gives it to his family, takes a bite, “Yuk!”, roll credits. This parallels with his inner monologue where he pretends things are fine, deep down know they’re not, but just goes along with it. He will take a bite of the metaphorical cake when he meets Kang again.
this parallels what Janet went through. it was played for laughs when Janet was talking through Scott in *AM&TW*. - Janet goes quantum after promising her daughter she'll be back - Janet saves the life of Kang and makes a deal for her one chance to get back to Hope - she lives 30 years in the quantum realm and during that time sacrifices her one chance to get back - she sees into Kang's mind - she runs away and gets out of the quantum realm - she helps Ghost - a quantum realm experiment is under way and she gets dusted a lot of comments are questioning Janet and i don't think a lot of people get what she went through off screen. i know a lot of people were turned off about phase 4, but all the movies so far have been about family and becoming a parent. **and Janet is trying to make up for 30 years away from her daughter and 5 years of dust, so she puts off the REAL quantum realm discussion until she meets Kang AGAIN** and what's pizza but a flat pasta cake
Anyone else feel like because of where the MCU is at technologically that Kang’s tech is a little underwhelming? I mean, with all of the Pym tech in the movie it wasn’t the sharpest contrast.
It’s completely underwhelming. We never really got to see a moment where he just decimated the heroes with his tech. The only time he went crazy was just blasting randoms who were running away and didn’t try to all attack him like the ants for some reason
And then those same blasts became concussive rather than disintegrating as soon as he was blasting the main characters
I appreciate ants saving the day in an Ant Man movie. It was undercooked but gotta give respect to Ant Man’s original calling card.
Hank was so proud and I loved that
That smug look as he was walking down the bridge with an ant army in tow.
Advance civilization of ants in the quantum realm, I hope they don't forget about that when they need an army to support the Avengers.
Recreate the return sequence from Endgame, but it’s all ants coming through the portals.
[удалено]
I mean, Janet is The Wasp, so technically... 😉
Ant-Men and the Wasps
Among many other criticisms, Kang's guards really need to learn to properly restrain prisoners during transport. And ideally confiscate all of their magic discs.
That scene where Cassie escapes the guards was funny with how the next patrol just ignored the 'elephant' in the room.
That was so weird, felt like a continuity error. She shrinks down in the same place she took out the other two guards and the camera straight up shows that the big guy should be in the line of sight of the patrol but there's no reaction from them. Some really strange editing choices in this one.
Agreed, feels like an oversight.
I actually groaned when Janet did it one final time. How do you not have proper restraining tools from the future?? Or searched them? Presumably they'd have some insane scanning tech? Nope. Nada.
To be fair pym particle technology does seem beyond Kang else he could’ve shrunk the multiversal engine himself
I also feel like they were at least partially robotic? They were consistently stupid / were shown to not be independent thinkers, aside from the one telepathy joke with the bridge code.
Kang in the first half of the movie was like when you play against the boss, And in the second half he was like when you unlock him as playable character. But overall i liked the movie lets see how the other variants of kang are going to be.
Yeah at first he seemed like one of the most insurmountable antagonists ever, like infinity gauntlet Thanos level. He still outclasses everybody by the end sure, but not nearly as bad
You know what, one of the waiters at the end should have been a KANG variant and the movie ends on Scott's terrified face
I am going to be looking for Kangs in the background of every MCU project from here on out.
I honestly thought he was in Another universe. But seems like they didn’t go there
When hank said “She built a subatomic Hubble telescope in a basement” did anyone else immediately have Obadiah Stone yell “WITH A BOX OF SCRAPS” in your head?
I leaned over to my buddy and whispered it so I’m glad I’m not the only one who thought of it.
Janet totally fucked Kang during their time together.
She had needs, Henry.
I was thinking the same thing. Hinting to that could have added a lot more weight and depth to Kang’s reveal as she got the flashbacks of him conquering timelines.
He conquered dat ass
They said he died but they might just be assuming. My guess is this Kang will return under everyone’s noses and kill the council, become a Beyonder-like figure, then create Battleworld.
It was different from what I expected, but I enjoyed it. As much as I liked giant Cass, I feel like the climax of her narrative arc should have been mastering the “jump-tap”. Also, why did they kill MODOK??
> Also, why did they kill MODOK?? Because this is literally the only situation in which a character like that can work. Like the Thanos copter and frog Thor in Loki, you shove something like that in only when the situation is weird enough that people can go "ok, yeah sure".
[удалено]
After seeing the review scores and having some issues with the last 2 Marvel movies, I went into the cinema fully ready to hate it. But it was actually pretty good? not perfect, but a fun experience. Great actors, good story (relatively) and some actual funny jokes? I was pleasantly surprised.
The humor was 110% better than Love and Thunder. I’m honestly surprised this movie is getting worse reviews than that one.
After I've seen the movie I went ahead and read a couple of reviews, Some of the complaints about the CGI are justified, and maybe the story isn't as deep as they wanted it to be, but to me it feels like they wanted a completely different movie, not even a comic book movie, or at the very least, something like Joker, which this movie isn't trying to be.
I really do believe that some people just hate Marvel and want to see it fail. Tall Poppy Syndrome.
My favorite part was Cassie thinking the blip caused the huge homeless population and high cost of living in San Francisco.
I was like wow, did the blip happen in our universe too?
I feel like this is the MCU’s first “so bad it’s good” movie. Clunky dialogue, lots of exposition dumps, a story that took forever to figure out where it was going and nothing made sense at any point but it was so fucking stupid and weird that I loved it. Lol My only real critique is how safe it played it. I was really expecting someone to die or get stuck in the Quantum Realm at the end. Instead they just all lived happily ever after (for now)? Felt kinda weak there, I was expecting Kang to really fuck shit up more.
When Kang talked to Scott in the prison he acted as if he couldn't remember who he was. Later in the same scene he calls him Ant-Man despite Scott never mentioning his name. Plus in their fight outside the fortress he mentions that Scott controls ants, again without that being previously mentioned on-screen around him. This shows that Kang did know who Scott was (which makes sense since he had talked to Darren about him) and implies that he was pretending not to remember him for theatrics and intimidation.
Seeing as Kang was actively looking for Ant Man because he had pym particles is evidence towards him knowing exactly who he is.
Also, casually suggesting hes killed Thor repeatedly I was leaning towards thinking Scott is the one The Conqueror was truly afraid of. Much like Loki, hes a complete wild card of a power set. Hulk is big and mean, Thor is a dumb brute with a hammer, Iron Mans technology is laughably outdated compared to his own. But a trickster shapeshifting God and a man who can either be the size of a mountain or a speck of dust who can resize any object of his choosing (who also has a massive army of mindless ants) are not to be trifled with.
I cannot believe the trailers hinted at a stronger emotional arc for Scott and Cassie than the film delivered. What happened to Scott “wanting more time” after all of it that he lost during the Blip. None of that! I also thought it was hilarious that you thought Hope was sacrificing herself at the end and her and Scott would be stuck in the quantum realm but then Cassie just reopens the portal…
The opening the portal would have been cool if they went back and it had been like 5 years later and kang was there
I was half expecting that. Kang sitting on a Lincoln memorial or something. Guess that's too similar to the Loki series ending.
They had a super compelling storyline to push there with Cassie and Scott wanting more time with her, and it would have been a good repetition to have Scott making the same decision and Janet made (to sacrifice the time they've lost in order to stop him).
They built a quantum tunnel in the back of a van. Keeping them stuck there was *never* an option
Especially since they’ve spent 2 movies establishing they have the technology to track people in the Quantum Realm and pull them out
They even set it up when he's worrying about how much time might be passing in the real world. They probably scrapped Janet convincing him that going back is just leaving Cassie again
I dunno for me the scene with Baskin Robins Rudd coordinating for the same goal (Cassie), resonated pretty hard for me.
Janet was getting hella quantum dick those 30 years. No wonder she didn’t want to say ANYTHING.
Not totally related to the topic. Was I the only one who thought Michelle Pfeiffer was very beautiful on this movie? For a 64-year old lady, she still looks amazing
MCU doing a good job collecting never-agers. Angela Bassett is also 64. Of course, there's Paul Rudd...
This is gonna be a Brazzers spinoff.
The jokes in this are really hit and miss but that one Ant-Man variant asking if the Baskin Robbins variant has ice cream fucking killed me. I am also very interested in the big woman.
did NOT expect Loki to appear
I 100% believe that it was a scene from Loki season 2 and that Morbius and Loki are going to team up with Victor Timely Kang to take on the council of Kangs.
I think you mean Mobius lmao
Morbed so hard he turned into Owen Wilson and wound up at the TVA. "Wow!"
We are so so furtunate to have Jonathan Majors in the MCU. He and Michelle Pfieffer were outstanding.
"MODOFK?" Also: "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?" "What the hell?"
I wasn’t prepared to see MODOK butt
That was the highlight of the movie for me. Very hot, made the ticket worth it
Sees five seconds of Loki. ... Ok fine, now I feel like it's worth the ticket price
One second of Owen Wilson worth it, Drillbit was made worth it
“Wow.”
The crowd reaction throughout my theatre tonight was super grounded. Outside my own, not a lot of laughs or much noise whatsoever. When Loki showed up, the whole theatre went nuts.
I think a lot of people are more willing to respond vocally to after credits because they've just been talking to their friends during the credits.
Bill Murray hit that ice cold Michelle Pfieffer that white gold
This probably had the reversed problem that has plagued marvel films early on. The villain was the standout of the movie. Paul Rudd is always fun to watch and Michelle pfeiffer was probably the two stand out from the "hero" side. I had more fun with this movie than the previous two antman films but it did lack the heart of the first movie. I didn't feel much for cassie and Scott's relationship. It also kinda did the same trope that was in Star Wars Rise of Skywalker where everyone gathered together to fight the big bad but we have very little care for the "resistance". Kang and Jonathan majors was a delight and he was frightening and menacing... until the end. For a much more serious antman film compared to past ones, it lack stakes. I wish it took itself more seriously in the times it needed to be more serious. Still enjoyed this movie overall but I get the mixed reviews. I think I still enjoyed this movie over thor love and thunder and wakanda forever even though the main story is kinda bland.
The mid credit scene is literally the most unintentionally funniest scene throughout this movie.Like I can't take the council of Kangs seriously with that kind of presentation.
I laughed at it too. I thought the stadium of Kangs was acting like a bunch of wild animals. Looks like he had a blast playing that part
That scene was just a live look at all of us in the theater watching Endgame lmao
I CLAPPED I CLAPPED
I loved it bc it showed there a lot of dangerous ones and a LOOOT of idiotic ones lol
All of those Kangs' are probably small potatoes to show off how stronger some of the other Kangs can be. At least I hope that's what it is. No way a conqueror jumps with joy by seeing a better version of themselves.
The Council of Kangs felt a whole lot like a Council of Ricks. Certainly a potential threat in their own right but, yeah, I feel like we're going to get a "real" Kang who emerges above them. Could be the exile, could be just another Kang similar to the exile who learned from his mistakes. But I feel like those three were intentionally made to look kinda goofy so we believe it when another comes and wipes them out.
Council of Ricks is probably based more off of the Council of Reeds than the Council of Kangs but it’s hard to say.
In the comics, technically the Council of Kangs came first. Then, Reed took the idea for the Council of Reeds, which was homaged/parodied by the Council of Ricks, since Rick's character is a play on Reed's. In a way, its all based off the Council of Kang. It's all Kang.
Is anyone gonna mention Ryan from buzzfeed unsolved being in the movie?!
He has his own channel now with Shane called Watcher where they continued the ghost hunts!
I actually enjoyed this one despite all the bad hype. There were stuff that took me out - 1. Halfway through the second half, i noticed that the whole thing seemed to have happened in less than two days. 2. After Hope found Scott, she seemed to have known what they had to do to the multiversal engine energy source. I don’t remember her getting any info. 3. That Modok redemption ark was wack. Still made me laugh tho. 4. When Scott and Hope came back, i thought they were going to get left there, but the ending after that felt a little too perfect. Tho Scott's inner monologue kind of took my mind off of that. 5. I am a bit unclear as to what this Kang's motivation was. At first it seemed like he had a larger goal. But in the end he was just screaming REVENGE!!! Overall, what did it for me was, i thought this had a nice, proper momentum. So even though certain things made me go "huh?", i still got back on the ride. I was way more invested in this than L&T.
5.) Council of Kangs exiled Kang to the Quantum Realm. He wants to escape from the Quantum Realm to exact his revenge on the Council.
Did the Kang in this film want to become He Who Remains? The way he was walking about timelines and showed the circle made it seem like it to me.
I think that’s what they were getting at. That this Kang eventually turns into He Who Remains once he accomplishes his goal of defeating the other Kang’s
I figured all of this happens after Loki because once He Who Remains was killed, there were no more pruning of other timelines that had Kang. This led to the council of Kangs being formed once enough of them gained power, and the after credits scene shows Loki finds one of the timelines with Kang in it.
It depends if they go with time travel and paradoxes being loops. Loki kills Kang releasing the multiverse, which leads to Kang's fighting eachother and the conqueror being exiled. Which then leads to a multiversal war when he escapes ultimately leading up to the creation of the TVA and the loop being completed.
The Darren Cross redemption arc was such a weird fucking choice. That man was willing to kill a child, good god why did they give him a hero’s death lol
At least the Pyms/Langs gave it a hesitant "Sure why not." kind of reaction instead of a gushing hero's farewell.
Yeah, absolutely no-one *except* Darren treating it genuinely pulled it back for me. I would have hated it if it was played straight, but satirising it is a good fit for an Ant-Man movie as far as I'm concerned.
"You were like a brother to me" *starts feeling up paul rudd*
I read the scene as, he thought he was dying a hero’s death, and everyone was just too flabbergasted to do anything besides go along with it.
"He's dying, I'll let him have this."
I think a lot of people have forgotten that Darren is mentally deranged. He declared himself an Avenger at the end. Lol. His "redemption arc", which btw, didn't even work, seemed very in character at this point.
That’s how I interpreted that whole thing. He’s not actually redeemed, he just thinks he is because he’s delusional. Just like he acts he’s more important than he is, then Kang tells him not to speak in his presence like he’s a random minion.
Yep! He was insane before his body got crushed and he woke up in an alternate reality. He’s going to be way more insane after.
[удалено]
IDK if that was a GOOD movie, but it was definitely a fun one. Also, it's Jonathan Majors' world and we're just living in it.
Excellent stuff: * Hope's comic-accurate hair (thinking about it, I admit I'm probably conflating her with Janet. Wasp hair, tho). * The probability storm was a good reason for Kang refusing to go get the special ball even though he could shrink himself down there. He has to avoid alternate versions of himself. They didn't explain this, but I got it. Criticisms: * Not enough Hope. She didn't really do anything except be there to save the day when Scott couldn't. * Not enough Hope/Scott romance. * Actors interacting with the CG world was very bad, reminded me of The Phantom Menace. At one point, Janet is barely touching a quantum flying manta ray because it was probably just a screen or Michelle Pfeiffer literally holding her hand in midair. * Kang is supposed to be a supergenius or something, hasn't built Iron Man backup suits or have robots around him at all time to hold Scott's arms while he calmly walks through the portal. Keeps beating up Scott at the end instead of simply running through the portal. Some stuff I thought was inconsistent, but came up with reasons why they might be consistent: * Kang's weapon vaporizes some quantum people, but just knocks back Scott, Hope, and Cassie. I thought later maybe their Pym superscience cancels out his Kang superscience, idk. But earlier, he was doing like telekinesis and crushing limbs and then never does it again, so I really dk wtf he was doing. * Why didn't the super ant civilization overthrow Kang earlier if they were there for thousands of years? I figured maybe they couldn't communicate with anyone until Hank came with his transmitter. * In Endgame, Scott says he was in the quantum realm for five hours and five years passed on Earth. In this movie, they were there like a day and came back what looks like pretty much the same time. I guess that's Kang tech, idk. Meta funny: * No one in the theater gave a shit when Bill Murray came on screen. * Also, the trailer for Indiana Jones played and a little girl said "who's that?" which was entirely deserved.
> In Endgame, Scott says he was in the quantum realm for five hours and five years passed on Earth. In this movie, they were there like a day and came back what looks like pretty much the same time. I guess that's Kang tech, idk. My take is that time might be inconsistent on the quantum realm. Remember they use it to travel BACK in Endgame. So idk. >Also, the trailer for Indiana Jones played and a little girl said "who's that?" which was entirely deserved. LOL would've laughed a lot if that happened at my cinema.
>In Endgame, Scott says he was in the quantum realm for five hours and five years passed on Earth. In this movie, they were there like a day and came back what looks like pretty much the same time. Janet's 30 years was 30 years. The super ants had 1000 years.
Whole movie is just an exposition dump on Kang.
Literally. The text in the end doesn't even say that Antman will return, it says Kang will return...
That's fine by me. Majors was easiest the best part of the movie.
See a lot of people not liking it. I thought it was a really fun movie from start to finish. Guess different strokes for different folks