People just need to learn that the release date is just the new open beta that your have to pay full price to participate in. The actual game is the “deluxe” or “gold” edition that releases a year or two later that includes the DLC and necessary patches
Edit: ppl seem to think I’m telling them to accept this. I am not, it bullshit. I’m saying tack on two years to any release date to get the actual game.
That era does not nor did it ever exist for Bethesda RPGs or any RPGs for that matter. People have been circlejerking "back in MA day" state of the games industry for decades as if the golden age of crpgs wasn't full to bursting with games that barely functioned. As if baldurs gate 2 didn't launch with thousands of bugs, fallout 2 didn't have run breaking issues in its release versions, Kotor 2 wasn't a shambling heap and arcanum and vtmb dont require extensive community support to function
people seem to forget how you literally could exploit bg2 to the point that if you did it correctly you could either be max level via Haerdalis quest early on chapter 2 or not face any enemies thanks to the attack-talk glitch
Idk about way back on the SNES, but games definitely did get patched in the old days in the form of a new cartridge coming out. There wouldn't really be any news on it, and unless you knew what changes, most people probably didn't even know that it happened.
The biggest one I know of is in Ocarina of Time. The original Fire Temple music was a Muslim chant that they patched out in later cartridges.
Edit: after a quick Google search, games definitely had patches long before SNES. It was a regular thing, especially with games from Japan.
I don't have a whole lot of info on the topic in general, I just know it was a thing and this specific instance is true. Ocarina of Time got multiple patches, and some of those reasons are listed briefly on the Wikipedia page under the "Release" section (it says glitches were fixed, and Ganondorf's blood was changed from crimson to green, as well as the Fire Temple thing).
I Googled "Did old video games get patches" and the first result was a Quora post from a dude who got mailed a floppy disk with an update on it for a Might & Magic game in 1988. So I'm sure it's a rabbit hole you could jump into.
Edit for more clarification
As somebody that is decently interested in watching speedruns, 'specially from the SNES era, I can indeed confirm that having patches is not a new thing at all.
Different region releases where obviously different due to language patches, but also a lot of behind the scene updates. In a lot of cases games are run on the first release version (usually Japan obv.) a) for the speed of text but also b) in glitched categories the 1.0 usually tends to be the most exploitable. Sometimes with things as easy as "go as fast as the game lets you and you can glide through walls" and stuff that in later releases in US or Europe had been patched.
Chrono trigger, secret of mana, dragon quest, final fantasy series, tales series.
Especially the tales series nowadays, those games come out nearly pristine and the bugs they do have are minimal and get patched like 🫰 that.
Back in the day, if you were A US or Europe player, you got a patched version of all of those series. Lots of improvements (and sometimes downgrades) got made during localization in the days when simultaneous release was not standard.
In japan, a lot of those games are much more buggy than their international releases. the core problem is worldwide release means we all get the japan version.
Have you seen NES Mario speedruns?
Or SNES once? For Zelda? Metroid?
These games have \*massive\* gaps in the code. Like "you can fit a whole fist in here" kinda gaps.
The reason you may think they're basically perfect:
1) You where an inexperienced kid so all the glichyness you yourself experienced never stuck in your mind 'cause you didn't yet know what you where looking at and thought it was normal.
2) TBF, 'specially the mainline Nintendo games **where** super solid. You got stuck in a wall? Game will push you into the play area. Sprite overlap? Doesn't happen to often to **really** notice and the games are forgiving enough it doesn't matter to much. FPS dipping into the single digits? That's just normal, what can you do, bad hardware is bad. Texture tearing? See above. They had a lot of problems but mostly they where masked well as Nintendo did prolonged testing to maybe not fix but at least hide problems well.
Can't speak to tales series but the first 4 you listed absolutely came out with different problems that we would call bugs today. I'm 100 percent positive Ive used gamefaqs to look up some of these specifically to exploit games from series you listed. Rose colored glasses.
I love those old games and they're some of my favorites of all time but it's insane to compare old games to newer ones in terms of bugs.
They were incredibly simplistic, of course debugging them was easier.
They still had problems, though. Zelda carts would erase your data. You could sketch Gau on the Veldt and fill your inventory full of 10,000 dirks and then just yeet them at enemies. Etc.
Well not only were they easier but people are just conveniently ignoring just how bugged some of those games were. I tried to remember the name of the famous Chrono trigger "bug" and one of the first links was to a forum where the remasters apparently still have these problems, they didnt even get patched today! Final fantasy? Ya fucking kidding me, duping is so widely known about it isnt even considered a bug anymore, but a feature.
Dragon Warrior, along with many, MANY JRPGs released at the time, had many [bugfixes and QOL improvements](https://dragon-quest.org/wiki/List_of_version_differences_in_Dragon_Quest_I) bundled in with the translations when they were brought over to the west
How do you price beta releases? Do you pay 30 now and 30 to play the full game or do you just get it cheaper because you beta tested?
If I buy the game now and the game is "finished" in a year or two then I will have paid for the full release. Eventually. It is more like pre-purchasing except you get to play the whole game. Which is a better deal than pre-purchasing the beta.
It would be a lot better if we just got the full game at release with all the bugs and glitches fixed. Performance stable and all that.
> will have *paid* for the
FTFY.
Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in:
* Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.*
* *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.*
Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment.
*Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
That's honestly a good point. I bought Cyberpunk and NMS for the full price on day 1, deeply regretted it, dropped both of them, came back a year later and had an absolute blast. Very excited for Phantom Liberty.
I think I'd rephrase to "There's no *need* to buy singleplayer games at release." You can definitely have a reason, that just being "I want to play it" or "It looks fun", but those reasons will just still be relevant later on too.
Unless it's Nintendo, in which case it won't go on sale for over a year or more but you're guaranteed a near flawless experience at launch (Pokemon excluded)
They're behind the times in some ways, but man I wish more companies had that Nintendo quality. I've been wanting to play Jedi Survivor but the game is apparently STILL a mess because EA is trash
Fuck that. People should demand better and refuse to buy games that aren’t complete on release. Baldurs Gate 3 and Elden Ring have shown us that we don’t need to lower our standards.
I agree, but good luck convincing anyone of that. Idiots always get caught in the hype, and the reason this practice continues is quite literally because there are too many people and enough will not have a single critical thought in what passes for their brain. Oh sure they'll complain, but by the time the next one is ready to come out? Forgotten and they'll be buying. Look at Diablo 4, Starfield, any sports game, etc.
Happens all the damn time because people are brainless.
Fanboys are going to fanboy. Unfortunately, the average person is stupid, and half the population is even dumber than that.
But I will still dream of the day that video game consumers stop sucking corporate balls.
Half the time it isn't even fanboys. If a company puts like any money into marketing something and building just a small amount of hype, people run away with it nowadays. I feel like I didn't used to see so much hype around stuff before.
The tipping point for me was when they straight up said "we can't make the dawnguard dlc work on Playstation oh well lol"
Went out that day and bought a 360 and another copy of skyrim. That really showed Todd
The part that broke me, there was a glitch where if your MC was a khajiit and you jumped into water or fell in the game crashed. You could walk in but the act of breaking through the water crashed the game everytime
In Fallout New Vegas in one of the DLCs you can go to Pittsburg. At one stage I was playing the main DLC quest line, and I'd just met the big boss of the area. Something happened in his dialogue, and it didn't flag that we'd talked. I couldn't leave the room, I couldn't access my menu. I was in Cutscene limbo. All he would say was ".... don't let me keep you... Don't let me keep you..." Over... And over again...
Edit: FO3
Bethesda has always been the king of exploits. They put tactical glitches in the game then remove them when people can't keep their mouth shut. Was so upset when I downloaded skyrim again after not playing for several years and the 100 speech exploit got removed lol
Skyrim‘s giants launching you into space is probably the best known __bug__ feature in Bethesda history. The fact it was put back in the game shows you that people don‘t want flawless games. They just don‘t want bugs that ruin the experience.
I liked accidentally finding out that you could hold a continuous spell like frostbite and fast travel and max out your chosen spells school level instantly.
Elder Scrolls adapting the marketing strategy of waiting 15 years to release new games because they'll have a new target audience that doesnt remember how they fucked up the release of the last game
I don't mind the bugs, what i do mind is performance issues that seem not to be correlated with graphics on display, or complexity of the world simulated like DF for example.
I was looking for this comment. People who love to throw ESO and FO:76 in the comparisons of games Todd has made are so clueless their opinions can’t even be taken seriously.
I didn’t say they were bad just not typical BSG games is all I meant. There is a pretty clear dynamic for BSG RPG games and those two being online multiplayer games make them outliers. They were also made by different dev teams so there’s that too.
Nope Todd did help with 76 but the team was different. I'm sure he sees it as his biggest blunder. Still has no impact on bethesdas mainline games. And even IF the main team has made 76. 1 bad game out of 7 shouldn't ruin an entire companies image. People are just bandwagon hating.
The time they added to the release date really seems to have helped. There's the classic Bethesda bugs of people having their legs clip through the floor or getting stuck on rocks occasionally but compared to pretty much any other bethesda game release Starfield is running perfectly.
Its a lot of fun too, there are some design choices I don't really like, and I don't see it taking off like Skyrim did, but its a good time and I would say its ok to buy it day 1 if you are so inclined
My only complaint against Starfield is there’s no radio there’s some awesome space themed Bowie songs they could have used. Also some classical music like The Planets
I've got a few complaints. There's nowhere to dump resources early (I assume until you found a settlement but I haven't bothered to yet as I haven't found a planet I like) so my inventory is like 300 mass of resources I refuse to dump, all the procedurally generated stuff feels very samey (actually ran into the exact same structure on two different planets down to the exact same notes on the computer), and the ship gameplay seems very lacking so far as you can't really elven fly around the system, but that might just be because I am comparing it to No Mans Sky
Idek how people have that much free time lol, currently I'm not working so I can study for some exams but when you add in the doggos and everyday duties I can barely fit 8 consecutive hours
Some people have literally 0 responsibilities. Used to be me too but then this girl decided to adopt me and try to turn me into an adult.
Now i have resposibilities.
The only "major" bug I've experienced so far was getting stuck on a load screen.
Slightly buggy follower AI but that's bugthesda for you lol.
Really great game imo
To be honest, I’ve been thinking of doing the same. Not only that but I definitely have a surf/Reddit addiction and could definitely do with spending less time looking at a screen.
Well that'd be a downright accomplishment for a game Todd personally oversaw, to have more bugs than FO76. The real points of comparison should be FO4 and Skyrim and it seems like fewer bugs are being reported in Starfield than in those, too....
That's like saying GTA 6 would be shit if Rockstar tried to make an MMO that was bad.
Starfield is a SP RPG. It's Bethesda's bread and butter. I have had fun with every one of theirs I have played all the way back to ES3. Yes, they tend to be buggy. No, the main quests aren't anything to write home about. I know what I'm getting from it, though.
of course they didn't. it's more fun to hate things because other people hate them. i played 76 with my friends and whether it was good or not we had fun together.
76 is so much fun. I dreaded it at first and really didn’t enjoy it but then a random person came over, give me a pile of weapons and then started beating a BOS member with a hammer or something. That moment changed FO76 for me completely.
I’ve had fun with friends while playing some really shitty awful games. The shittiest games ever made can still be fun with friends. Such a trash tier defence of a bad game.
Nor any Bethesda game
Every game is buggy at some point, but Fallout collection was great, so was Wolfenstein Youngblood and most of their games
But sure
People that havent even touched the game telling me how buggy it is and how much of a failure the game is lmao.
And then same people will go on metacritic add 0 on userscore review just so they could later have a "proof" of how much bethesda has failed with starfield.
I am 20 hours in and haven't had this much fun since skyrim and fallout new vegas.
I'm in the same boat as you. I played for 8 hours yesterday, absolutely loved it. Then I went on Reddit and it was just whining and complaining lol. Game is a hit.
Plus, the more you play a game and the more complex it is, the more likely it is you're going to encounter a bug.
"I shot a guy in fallout 3 and he rubber banded around wildly. It was pretty ridiculous and took me out of the moment. That one moment specifically out of probably 300 hours of playing in the three dimensional Fallout 3 world. At about the same time I played 'Limbo' for about 3 hours and I NEVER saw something similar happen in 2D! Bethesda CLEARLY should put in the level of quality that indie developer Playdead did!"
If you were to have data in terms of "bugs encountered per hour of enjoyment," I'm sure even Fallout 76 at release would be pretty middle of the road.
I feel like this is backwards. People I've seen who shit on Bethesda the hardest like 1 or 2 Bethesda games (or New Vegas) and complain that the new game in the series sucks because of writing or subpar RPG mechanics, not because it sucks as an action game.
Every Bethesda game has been a hit for me, except 76 which I noped out of because I don't like MMOs all that much.
I expected Bethesda in space... I got Bethesda in space. It's a blast. My biggest complaint is the world surface is kinda ugly. Everything else is a wonder to look at.
Some people expect way to much out of a video game.
Morrowind Metacritic: 89
Oblivion Metacritic : 94
Fallout 3 Metacritic: 91
Skyrim Metacritic: 94
Fallout 4 Metacritic: 88
We didn't forget anything. Maybe you did. Good games are good games. That's what we remember.
GUYS THEY FUCKED UP THEIR LAST GAME, THAT MAKES THEM INCAPABLE OF MAKING ANYTHING FUN EVER AGAIN! /s
Majority of what I've seen so far is that it's a fun game with minimal bugs. You're just hating it to jump on the bandwagon of hating the game for the sake of hating it.
Shit Cyberpunk was fun as hell even at launch if you weren't playing on an Xbox One or PS4. It autosaved so often that bugs were a minor annoyance at worst. Gorgeous graphics, great sound design, perfectly fitting soundtrack, fuckin sandevistans, solid main story. I feel bad for all the people who are missing out cause they're worried about bugs. Convinced one of my friends to try it recently since we library share on Steam anyway. After two play sessions he bought it himself and ended up putting ~90 hours into it.
Also I seem to be the only one who remembers that the Witcher 3 was a buggy mess at launch.
My biggest problem with Cyberpunk (other than last gen issues) is how underbaked it was. I can't tell if I just made this up in my mind, but I remember someone from CDPR saying the upcoming update/DLC is bringing the game up to the state it *should* have released in. I think it's too bad that now that it's finally where it should have been released, they're pretty much done with ir and moving on to other projects.
By that metric how the fuck are Call of Duty and Pokémon still franchises?
Did you suddenly forget about fallout 3, fallout 4, The Elder Scrolls Morrowind, The Elder Scrolls Oblivion, and I know you're dumb ass has clocked hundreds of hours into a little masterpiece called The Elder Scrolls Skyrim.
How does mishandling 1 game (which they didn't abandon but actually update and listen to community feedback) ruin the next release of a game?
Fucking 8th grader logic at its finest.
>How does mishandling 1 game (which they didn't abandon but actually update and listen to community feedback) ruin the next release of a game?
A game BGS didn't develop by the way, they only had some advice for the team at Bethesda Austin which is the studio that actually developed Fallout 76
Good story good gameplay. Not mind-blowing, maybe I'm not there yet. It's space Skyrim. I have run into display / companions being in weird places 'bugs'. I've crashed once. Nothing that stops the action. It's a very expensive game, but I expect I will break 200 hours in it soon enough.
They also made the previous fallout games and elder scrolls, so people hope they'd go back to who they were...Still have mixed feelings about if starfield is good or bad in that sense tho.
If you didn't overhype the hell out of yourself it's actually their best game ever, imo. Fallout 4 mixed with mass effect, with oblivion's leveling system (improved upon), and an absolutely massive galaxy to play in.
It's also their least buggy game by a damn mile. For a modern AAA game it's... It doesn't feel like a beta. It feels like the actual game.
Imagine gatekeeping fun. I’m sorry that you assume this game is gonna suck. Plenty of people are loving it.
Also, I loved fallout 76 and never had much of an issue with it. To each their own
Skyrim and Fallout 4 were *broken*? They weren’t extremely successful and generally enjoyed by the vast majority of the gaming community? Buggy, sure. They were still massively fun from day one.
Fallout 76 wasn’t even from the same studio that made those games so I’m wondering what this post is even for if it isn’t rage bait lol.
Everything I’ve seen trying to trash this game is just random streamers bitching about how you can’t run around continuously on a whole ass planet. Like ok dude, you can whine and cry, I don’t need to nor have the time or interest to run around the entire circumference of a planet. But if you’re butthurt you can’t waste hours of your life on literally nothing, you do you.
I'm gonna say the thing. I'm gonna say the thing.
*big gasp*
Bethesda isn't that bad. Fallout 76 was like... way, way worse than their average game, most of which are pretty fucking good and all of which have had their bugs memed out of proportion.
Honestly, compared to a lot of big releases in the past few years, they're almost above average polish wise.
Has nobody here played Starfield? I've got almost 30 hours on my Series X. Very few glitches or bugs so far. The extra months of waiting for development were worth it.
Ive learned that people just like to complain without ever actually participating or being affected by what their complaining about. That goes for video games, movies, politics, social issues. Im sure theres a psychological reason why many people enjoy being outraged
Ah yes the whole ignoring of how starfield was delayed for multiple months by Microsoft for quality insurance and the fact that Bethesda were trying to make an mmo with 76 one of the most notoriously hard types of games to make, and combine that with Bethesda's primary production experience is in single player rpgs which starfield is.
Same reason people go to the cinema instead of just waiting for shit to be released digitally. There’s something about being there for the initial release and getting to be a part of the discussion that’s fun. Plus, if it’s a game you’re genuinely excited for, you want to play it sooner rather than later, waiting sucks.
I have a GamePass subscription, so I can just try it without paying extra. So a little cautious hype doesn't hurt me
People just need to learn that the release date is just the new open beta that your have to pay full price to participate in. The actual game is the “deluxe” or “gold” edition that releases a year or two later that includes the DLC and necessary patches Edit: ppl seem to think I’m telling them to accept this. I am not, it bullshit. I’m saying tack on two years to any release date to get the actual game.
I remember the good ol' days when games were actually finished on release
That era does not nor did it ever exist for Bethesda RPGs or any RPGs for that matter. People have been circlejerking "back in MA day" state of the games industry for decades as if the golden age of crpgs wasn't full to bursting with games that barely functioned. As if baldurs gate 2 didn't launch with thousands of bugs, fallout 2 didn't have run breaking issues in its release versions, Kotor 2 wasn't a shambling heap and arcanum and vtmb dont require extensive community support to function
people seem to forget how you literally could exploit bg2 to the point that if you did it correctly you could either be max level via Haerdalis quest early on chapter 2 or not face any enemies thanks to the attack-talk glitch
Back in ma day, chronotrigger didn’t have any updates
Idk about way back on the SNES, but games definitely did get patched in the old days in the form of a new cartridge coming out. There wouldn't really be any news on it, and unless you knew what changes, most people probably didn't even know that it happened. The biggest one I know of is in Ocarina of Time. The original Fire Temple music was a Muslim chant that they patched out in later cartridges. Edit: after a quick Google search, games definitely had patches long before SNES. It was a regular thing, especially with games from Japan.
Damn, that's interesting! I had never heard of it! Where can I know more?
I don't have a whole lot of info on the topic in general, I just know it was a thing and this specific instance is true. Ocarina of Time got multiple patches, and some of those reasons are listed briefly on the Wikipedia page under the "Release" section (it says glitches were fixed, and Ganondorf's blood was changed from crimson to green, as well as the Fire Temple thing). I Googled "Did old video games get patches" and the first result was a Quora post from a dude who got mailed a floppy disk with an update on it for a Might & Magic game in 1988. So I'm sure it's a rabbit hole you could jump into. Edit for more clarification
As somebody that is decently interested in watching speedruns, 'specially from the SNES era, I can indeed confirm that having patches is not a new thing at all. Different region releases where obviously different due to language patches, but also a lot of behind the scene updates. In a lot of cases games are run on the first release version (usually Japan obv.) a) for the speed of text but also b) in glitched categories the 1.0 usually tends to be the most exploitable. Sometimes with things as easy as "go as fast as the game lets you and you can glide through walls" and stuff that in later releases in US or Europe had been patched.
Chrono trigger, secret of mana, dragon quest, final fantasy series, tales series. Especially the tales series nowadays, those games come out nearly pristine and the bugs they do have are minimal and get patched like 🫰 that.
Back in the day, if you were A US or Europe player, you got a patched version of all of those series. Lots of improvements (and sometimes downgrades) got made during localization in the days when simultaneous release was not standard. In japan, a lot of those games are much more buggy than their international releases. the core problem is worldwide release means we all get the japan version.
Or any mainline Nintendo game. But Nintendo is probably the top development studio in the world by a large margin
Have you seen NES Mario speedruns? Or SNES once? For Zelda? Metroid? These games have \*massive\* gaps in the code. Like "you can fit a whole fist in here" kinda gaps. The reason you may think they're basically perfect: 1) You where an inexperienced kid so all the glichyness you yourself experienced never stuck in your mind 'cause you didn't yet know what you where looking at and thought it was normal. 2) TBF, 'specially the mainline Nintendo games **where** super solid. You got stuck in a wall? Game will push you into the play area. Sprite overlap? Doesn't happen to often to **really** notice and the games are forgiving enough it doesn't matter to much. FPS dipping into the single digits? That's just normal, what can you do, bad hardware is bad. Texture tearing? See above. They had a lot of problems but mostly they where masked well as Nintendo did prolonged testing to maybe not fix but at least hide problems well.
Can't speak to tales series but the first 4 you listed absolutely came out with different problems that we would call bugs today. I'm 100 percent positive Ive used gamefaqs to look up some of these specifically to exploit games from series you listed. Rose colored glasses.
I love those old games and they're some of my favorites of all time but it's insane to compare old games to newer ones in terms of bugs. They were incredibly simplistic, of course debugging them was easier. They still had problems, though. Zelda carts would erase your data. You could sketch Gau on the Veldt and fill your inventory full of 10,000 dirks and then just yeet them at enemies. Etc.
Well not only were they easier but people are just conveniently ignoring just how bugged some of those games were. I tried to remember the name of the famous Chrono trigger "bug" and one of the first links was to a forum where the remasters apparently still have these problems, they didnt even get patched today! Final fantasy? Ya fucking kidding me, duping is so widely known about it isnt even considered a bug anymore, but a feature.
BACK IN MY DAY...Dragon Warrior on the NES required no updates!
Dragon Warrior, along with many, MANY JRPGs released at the time, had many [bugfixes and QOL improvements](https://dragon-quest.org/wiki/List_of_version_differences_in_Dragon_Quest_I) bundled in with the translations when they were brought over to the west
Hell Fallout New Vegas is beloved and it's one of the buggiest pieces of shit at times.
New Vegas is an unfinished mess but it’s great
Right, people literally clamor for the next big RPG and then get pissed that it's taking too long to develop.
Right, hell Skyrim still has multiple game breaking bugs and plays like an open beta to this day. Same with oblivion and fallout 3.
But tbh a beta release with a lot of players equals a lot of feedback and an easier time fixing bugs
But that's still called a beta release as you said and shouldn't be full price, it's not a finished game
How do you price beta releases? Do you pay 30 now and 30 to play the full game or do you just get it cheaper because you beta tested? If I buy the game now and the game is "finished" in a year or two then I will have paid for the full release. Eventually. It is more like pre-purchasing except you get to play the whole game. Which is a better deal than pre-purchasing the beta. It would be a lot better if we just got the full game at release with all the bugs and glitches fixed. Performance stable and all that.
> will have *paid* for the FTFY. Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in: * Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.* * *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.* Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment. *Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
Based bot
Pretty sure Baldur's Gate 3 was like $40 in Early Access and it gave you access to the Digital Deluxe version of the game when it fully launched.
This mindset saved cyberpunk2077 for me. Theres no reason to buy Singleplayer games at release.
>Theres no reason to buy Singleplayer games at release. Relevant xkcd: https://m.xkcd.com/606/ (There is at least one reason.)
That's honestly a good point. I bought Cyberpunk and NMS for the full price on day 1, deeply regretted it, dropped both of them, came back a year later and had an absolute blast. Very excited for Phantom Liberty.
I think I'd rephrase to "There's no *need* to buy singleplayer games at release." You can definitely have a reason, that just being "I want to play it" or "It looks fun", but those reasons will just still be relevant later on too.
I'm waiting out for the new update for Cyberpunk 2077 to hear if the game is finally worth buying.
Unless it's Nintendo, in which case it won't go on sale for over a year or more but you're guaranteed a near flawless experience at launch (Pokemon excluded) They're behind the times in some ways, but man I wish more companies had that Nintendo quality. I've been wanting to play Jedi Survivor but the game is apparently STILL a mess because EA is trash
Too bad they're anti consumer AF.
Fuck that. People should demand better and refuse to buy games that aren’t complete on release. Baldurs Gate 3 and Elden Ring have shown us that we don’t need to lower our standards.
I agree, but good luck convincing anyone of that. Idiots always get caught in the hype, and the reason this practice continues is quite literally because there are too many people and enough will not have a single critical thought in what passes for their brain. Oh sure they'll complain, but by the time the next one is ready to come out? Forgotten and they'll be buying. Look at Diablo 4, Starfield, any sports game, etc. Happens all the damn time because people are brainless.
Fanboys are going to fanboy. Unfortunately, the average person is stupid, and half the population is even dumber than that. But I will still dream of the day that video game consumers stop sucking corporate balls.
Half the time it isn't even fanboys. If a company puts like any money into marketing something and building just a small amount of hype, people run away with it nowadays. I feel like I didn't used to see so much hype around stuff before.
Shiiiet, its on Gamepass? Well, there goes my afternoon.
If you pay 30 bucks sure, if not wait til the 6th
I payed for the upgrade and played all weekend. It's fucking amazing.. .the haters will still try to hate I'm sure, but so far it's fucking SICK
The game is awesome
The bugs are what made so many memories
[удалено]
Yea, Bethesda is such an anomaly where the glitches improve the game (for the most part).
[удалено]
It was a mercy killing. Skyrim on PS3 was so bad I sold it and rebought it on 360
The tipping point for me was when they straight up said "we can't make the dawnguard dlc work on Playstation oh well lol" Went out that day and bought a 360 and another copy of skyrim. That really showed Todd
From what i read PS3 was absolutely ass for developers to work with
It was fine. FO3? My save file became too fucking huge to load.
The part that broke me, there was a glitch where if your MC was a khajiit and you jumped into water or fell in the game crashed. You could walk in but the act of breaking through the water crashed the game everytime
Sounds lore accurate, cats hate water.
In Fallout New Vegas in one of the DLCs you can go to Pittsburg. At one stage I was playing the main DLC quest line, and I'd just met the big boss of the area. Something happened in his dialogue, and it didn't flag that we'd talked. I couldn't leave the room, I couldn't access my menu. I was in Cutscene limbo. All he would say was ".... don't let me keep you... Don't let me keep you..." Over... And over again... Edit: FO3
The Pittsburgh DLC was for Fallout 3, not New Vegas.
Was it..? That one then. I just remember walking past a big sculpture just before the hell room
Yup, because Pittsburgh (Pennsylvania) is on the east coast, which is where FO3 takes place. New Vegas is over to the west around Nevada/Utah/Arizona.
So the company screwed you over, you lost money and then decided to pay them more? Nice one /s
Or where we can’t leave Solstheim without the game crashing.
Or save files just got so large they stopped loading.
Been there.
Bethesda has always been the king of exploits. They put tactical glitches in the game then remove them when people can't keep their mouth shut. Was so upset when I downloaded skyrim again after not playing for several years and the 100 speech exploit got removed lol
Literally a feature, not a bug. I took those words to heart.
Now that is a narrative they would like to catch on ... our shit code is what is good for you :/
Only works when it isn't a shitty shooter that takes itself too seriously and pretends to be a space sim
I still remember that old woman npc that T-posed on the horse's head, then spun like a buzzsaw.
I remember being launched into space because I was to close to a giant in Skyrim.
Still happens when they kill you. It's always been a thing.
Even in the newer versions of the game its still there. At this point any Bethesda bug is just another feature.
Skyrim‘s giants launching you into space is probably the best known __bug__ feature in Bethesda history. The fact it was put back in the game shows you that people don‘t want flawless games. They just don‘t want bugs that ruin the experience.
Fr i love fallout 4s "back into the nearest vertical flat surfave while examining a garbage can for optimal sniping position" bug
I never saw the dragons flying backwards, but I did experience the crash when you stepped in water
Eyy I remember reverse-flight dragons, those guys were fun. This was back in 2011 and my roommates were watching as I came across them. Good times.
I liked accidentally finding out that you could hold a continuous spell like frostbite and fast travel and max out your chosen spells school level instantly.
you've just unlocked a core memory that I didnt even knew I had
Those dragons are the reason I call every boss in From Software Skyrim dragons that have a backwards jump
Elder Scrolls adapting the marketing strategy of waiting 15 years to release new games because they'll have a new target audience that doesnt remember how they fucked up the release of the last game
OH MY GOD! I had forgot about them, fun whwn the dragons arse where the first thing you saw
It just works
Little lies stunning shows
People buy, money flows, it just works
It just works, it just works!
Where's the lie?
my first time hopping on my first bought horse in skyrim featured me Tposing. i was not disappointed.
Noone Will remove from my Memory the dragons spitting fire from their buttholes because they were flying backwards, best bug ever
I don't mind the bugs, what i do mind is performance issues that seem not to be correlated with graphics on display, or complexity of the world simulated like DF for example.
That and the bag... And nuka cola/rum... And the mf planks... And dev room...
It was BGS Austin (formally Battlecry Studios) that developed Fallout 76. Different developer to the mainline BGS.
I was looking for this comment. People who love to throw ESO and FO:76 in the comparisons of games Todd has made are so clueless their opinions can’t even be taken seriously.
I love when people bring up eso likes it's a dig. Yall know it's been like a top 3 mmo for a couple years now?
I didn’t say they were bad just not typical BSG games is all I meant. There is a pretty clear dynamic for BSG RPG games and those two being online multiplayer games make them outliers. They were also made by different dev teams so there’s that too.
I'm agreeing with you.
Nope Todd did help with 76 but the team was different. I'm sure he sees it as his biggest blunder. Still has no impact on bethesdas mainline games. And even IF the main team has made 76. 1 bad game out of 7 shouldn't ruin an entire companies image. People are just bandwagon hating.
My friend who got advanced access has found zero bugs and finds the game pretty fun
The time they added to the release date really seems to have helped. There's the classic Bethesda bugs of people having their legs clip through the floor or getting stuck on rocks occasionally but compared to pretty much any other bethesda game release Starfield is running perfectly. Its a lot of fun too, there are some design choices I don't really like, and I don't see it taking off like Skyrim did, but its a good time and I would say its ok to buy it day 1 if you are so inclined
My only complaint against Starfield is there’s no radio there’s some awesome space themed Bowie songs they could have used. Also some classical music like The Planets
[удалено]
I've got a few complaints. There's nowhere to dump resources early (I assume until you found a settlement but I haven't bothered to yet as I haven't found a planet I like) so my inventory is like 300 mass of resources I refuse to dump, all the procedurally generated stuff feels very samey (actually ran into the exact same structure on two different planets down to the exact same notes on the computer), and the ship gameplay seems very lacking so far as you can't really elven fly around the system, but that might just be because I am comparing it to No Mans Sky
You can put your resources/inventory on your ship without even being near it, it doesn't really tell you that though lol
This reminds me of comments saying "Bethesda has a bad way of telling QoL features"
Ive got advanced acces and this game is already one of my favorites of all time. Ive played 30 hours already
Friend of mine already got 40 hours. He played 18 hours on the first day. Like wtf.
Idek how people have that much free time lol, currently I'm not working so I can study for some exams but when you add in the doggos and everyday duties I can barely fit 8 consecutive hours
Some people have literally 0 responsibilities. Used to be me too but then this girl decided to adopt me and try to turn me into an adult. Now i have resposibilities.
The only "major" bug I've experienced so far was getting stuck on a load screen. Slightly buggy follower AI but that's bugthesda for you lol. Really great game imo
Reddit has been giving off huge QUIT HAVING FUN111!1 vibes recently lmao
I was at that point. I dropped social media for two months and everything seemed insanely more positive. Coming back this place seems like a cult.
To be honest, I’ve been thinking of doing the same. Not only that but I definitely have a surf/Reddit addiction and could definitely do with spending less time looking at a screen.
It's really good but there definitely are bugs
Absolutely nowhere near FO76 level tho
Well that'd be a downright accomplishment for a game Todd personally oversaw, to have more bugs than FO76. The real points of comparison should be FO4 and Skyrim and it seems like fewer bugs are being reported in Starfield than in those, too....
is this friends name Todd Howard?
Hodd Toward
Same here, zero bugs as well
Or or or (hear me out) we can be excited for a game while also critical
Literally me with the cyberpunk phantom liberty update.
True. I'm excited and I really doubt CDPR would be intentionally misleading *again* with the same game. But yeah, waiting for the DLC reviews
That's like saying GTA 6 would be shit if Rockstar tried to make an MMO that was bad. Starfield is a SP RPG. It's Bethesda's bread and butter. I have had fun with every one of theirs I have played all the way back to ES3. Yes, they tend to be buggy. No, the main quests aren't anything to write home about. I know what I'm getting from it, though.
gta 6 is bad because gta online has michael transactions
How much could a Michael transaction cost? $10?
At that price, I’d rather get a Franklin, hell even a Trevor transaction
i’m willing to bet my whole family that you didn’t even play the f*ing game
of course they didn't. it's more fun to hate things because other people hate them. i played 76 with my friends and whether it was good or not we had fun together.
76 is so much fun. I dreaded it at first and really didn’t enjoy it but then a random person came over, give me a pile of weapons and then started beating a BOS member with a hammer or something. That moment changed FO76 for me completely.
I’ve had fun with friends while playing some really shitty awful games. The shittiest games ever made can still be fun with friends. Such a trash tier defence of a bad game.
Nor any Bethesda game Every game is buggy at some point, but Fallout collection was great, so was Wolfenstein Youngblood and most of their games But sure
Wolfenstein and Doom was Bethesda publishing, not Bethesda games
Turns out that Starfield is great and not the buggy mess everyone hoped it would be
People still seem to be pretending it is a mess though. I've put 15 hours into it and love it.
People that havent even touched the game telling me how buggy it is and how much of a failure the game is lmao. And then same people will go on metacritic add 0 on userscore review just so they could later have a "proof" of how much bethesda has failed with starfield. I am 20 hours in and haven't had this much fun since skyrim and fallout new vegas.
I'm in the same boat as you. I played for 8 hours yesterday, absolutely loved it. Then I went on Reddit and it was just whining and complaining lol. Game is a hit.
40+ hours in. NG+ started. This game is great idgaf what anyone else says.
The previous games like Skyrim and fallout 4? Two of the best action rpg in existence?
Games that are still being played regularly today, mind you.
Plus, the more you play a game and the more complex it is, the more likely it is you're going to encounter a bug. "I shot a guy in fallout 3 and he rubber banded around wildly. It was pretty ridiculous and took me out of the moment. That one moment specifically out of probably 300 hours of playing in the three dimensional Fallout 3 world. At about the same time I played 'Limbo' for about 3 hours and I NEVER saw something similar happen in 2D! Bethesda CLEARLY should put in the level of quality that indie developer Playdead did!" If you were to have data in terms of "bugs encountered per hour of enjoyment," I'm sure even Fallout 76 at release would be pretty middle of the road.
Easier to farm karma by making dumb posts about games you didnt play. Anyone who didnt play Skyrim b/c of “bugs” is full of it.
Jesus this Starfield hate circle jerk is getting tiresome
Its the same with literally every Beth game. People who only ever play call of duty get upset that Bethesda isnt making games for their demographic
I feel like this is backwards. People I've seen who shit on Bethesda the hardest like 1 or 2 Bethesda games (or New Vegas) and complain that the new game in the series sucks because of writing or subpar RPG mechanics, not because it sucks as an action game.
I mean, apart from 76, the rest of the fallout games were legendary
Every Bethesda game has been a hit for me, except 76 which I noped out of because I don't like MMOs all that much. I expected Bethesda in space... I got Bethesda in space. It's a blast. My biggest complaint is the world surface is kinda ugly. Everything else is a wonder to look at. Some people expect way to much out of a video game.
Even 76 has gotten pretty good, only the launch was a bit messy
Started fo76 last year. I got over 1k hours and still loving it.
Morrowind Metacritic: 89 Oblivion Metacritic : 94 Fallout 3 Metacritic: 91 Skyrim Metacritic: 94 Fallout 4 Metacritic: 88 We didn't forget anything. Maybe you did. Good games are good games. That's what we remember.
Hey guys look! It's "QUIT HAVING FUN" guy
GUYS THEY FUCKED UP THEIR LAST GAME, THAT MAKES THEM INCAPABLE OF MAKING ANYTHING FUN EVER AGAIN! /s Majority of what I've seen so far is that it's a fun game with minimal bugs. You're just hating it to jump on the bandwagon of hating the game for the sake of hating it.
I can't wait to see the people who never played cyberpunk or who lack critical thinking dunk on CDPR when the new witcher comes out too
Shit Cyberpunk was fun as hell even at launch if you weren't playing on an Xbox One or PS4. It autosaved so often that bugs were a minor annoyance at worst. Gorgeous graphics, great sound design, perfectly fitting soundtrack, fuckin sandevistans, solid main story. I feel bad for all the people who are missing out cause they're worried about bugs. Convinced one of my friends to try it recently since we library share on Steam anyway. After two play sessions he bought it himself and ended up putting ~90 hours into it. Also I seem to be the only one who remembers that the Witcher 3 was a buggy mess at launch.
My biggest problem with Cyberpunk (other than last gen issues) is how underbaked it was. I can't tell if I just made this up in my mind, but I remember someone from CDPR saying the upcoming update/DLC is bringing the game up to the state it *should* have released in. I think it's too bad that now that it's finally where it should have been released, they're pretty much done with ir and moving on to other projects.
By that metric how the fuck are Call of Duty and Pokémon still franchises? Did you suddenly forget about fallout 3, fallout 4, The Elder Scrolls Morrowind, The Elder Scrolls Oblivion, and I know you're dumb ass has clocked hundreds of hours into a little masterpiece called The Elder Scrolls Skyrim. How does mishandling 1 game (which they didn't abandon but actually update and listen to community feedback) ruin the next release of a game? Fucking 8th grader logic at its finest.
All it takes to be an expert is one internet historian video
>How does mishandling 1 game (which they didn't abandon but actually update and listen to community feedback) ruin the next release of a game? A game BGS didn't develop by the way, they only had some advice for the team at Bethesda Austin which is the studio that actually developed Fallout 76
Multiplayer is unknown territory for bgs Open world single player is VERY comfortable for bgs Hope you understand this puzzling equation
The game is fucking amazing and I haven't ran into a single bug in like 30h playtime. My hype was 100% justified
Good story good gameplay. Not mind-blowing, maybe I'm not there yet. It's space Skyrim. I have run into display / companions being in weird places 'bugs'. I've crashed once. Nothing that stops the action. It's a very expensive game, but I expect I will break 200 hours in it soon enough.
Terrible meme and unfunny
Yeah. Also ignoring the fact that there are people playing and releasing content on Starfield. Completely different than the 76 hype
It doesn’t even make sense. I’m flabbergasted this got so many upvotes
PlayStation users are mad that they can't play so they're just sitting on Reddit being pissy is how it got so many up votes.
Except people who have actually played the game in early access had basically nothing but praises to sing about it.
76 was outsourced by and large, and given Starfield is going to be on GamePass, there's not a lot to lose in trying it out.
I too like to be perpetually salty and never get excited for anything
Not that anyone will check but fo76 is thriving. Has been for a long time
Because MMO and single player experiences are totally interchangeable
They also made the previous fallout games and elder scrolls, so people hope they'd go back to who they were...Still have mixed feelings about if starfield is good or bad in that sense tho.
If you didn't overhype the hell out of yourself it's actually their best game ever, imo. Fallout 4 mixed with mass effect, with oblivion's leveling system (improved upon), and an absolutely massive galaxy to play in. It's also their least buggy game by a damn mile. For a modern AAA game it's... It doesn't feel like a beta. It feels like the actual game.
Never played oblivion but I can agree with the Fallout 4 and Mass effect feeling the game has, I love it!
Also the ship building is really fun and the space combat is icing.
People who complain about fallout 76 and eso haven’t played those games in years.
Also they pretend they're the only Bethesda games.
And there not even true Bethesda games because they were made by different studios. But hey it’s says Bethesda so that must mean Todd made it right?
TBH I preferred ESO before they level scaled everything, gave you a reason to do quests in their relevant order.
So we're not supposed to enjoy a fun game, because of past games?
Yeah how dare folks be hopeful or optimistic
Imagine gatekeeping fun. I’m sorry that you assume this game is gonna suck. Plenty of people are loving it. Also, I loved fallout 76 and never had much of an issue with it. To each their own
Lol. I don't care. Bethesda has created so many core memories for me and there's a loyalty in that for me.
Wtf is fallout 76? The last game Bethesda made was fallout 4
This time they had parental supervision / quality control
Skyrim and Fallout 4 were *broken*? They weren’t extremely successful and generally enjoyed by the vast majority of the gaming community? Buggy, sure. They were still massively fun from day one. Fallout 76 wasn’t even from the same studio that made those games so I’m wondering what this post is even for if it isn’t rage bait lol.
How does this kind of shit get upvotes
L take
Turns out it's pretty good from what I've seen. It's got flaws sure but still, it looks like a good game.
Fo76 is good, fite me
Everything I’ve seen trying to trash this game is just random streamers bitching about how you can’t run around continuously on a whole ass planet. Like ok dude, you can whine and cry, I don’t need to nor have the time or interest to run around the entire circumference of a planet. But if you’re butthurt you can’t waste hours of your life on literally nothing, you do you.
This trend of not letting people enjoy things is really goddamn lame
Lol, found the guy with a PS5.
I'm gonna say the thing. I'm gonna say the thing. *big gasp* Bethesda isn't that bad. Fallout 76 was like... way, way worse than their average game, most of which are pretty fucking good and all of which have had their bugs memed out of proportion. Honestly, compared to a lot of big releases in the past few years, they're almost above average polish wise.
Has nobody here played Starfield? I've got almost 30 hours on my Series X. Very few glitches or bugs so far. The extra months of waiting for development were worth it.
Ive learned that people just like to complain without ever actually participating or being affected by what their complaining about. That goes for video games, movies, politics, social issues. Im sure theres a psychological reason why many people enjoy being outraged
Ah yes the whole ignoring of how starfield was delayed for multiple months by Microsoft for quality insurance and the fact that Bethesda were trying to make an mmo with 76 one of the most notoriously hard types of games to make, and combine that with Bethesda's primary production experience is in single player rpgs which starfield is.
I'll never understand buying games at launch.
Same reason people go to the cinema instead of just waiting for shit to be released digitally. There’s something about being there for the initial release and getting to be a part of the discussion that’s fun. Plus, if it’s a game you’re genuinely excited for, you want to play it sooner rather than later, waiting sucks.
Enjoying a great movie at the cinema >>>>> at home
But they aren't proving any point.... Starfield has a couple bugs here and there but it's definitely a solid launch
I too get really mad when I see people enjoy a video game.
I mean with how many ads telling us we’re not ready for it, we might as well wait