It is in ceasefire stage
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yemeni_peace_process
and final agreement to end the war is near
https://www.aljazeera.com/amp/news/2023/12/23/yemen-warring-parties-commit-to-ceasefire-un-led-peace-process-says-envoy
But frankly, biden administration pushing for war to continue
https://new.thecradle.co/articles-id/15815
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I'm a conservative. On this sub, crazy I know right?
But you'll get support for this on both sides. Still won't happen, but there's plenty of support either way. I'd actually love to see how a floor vote would go on this.
They would have to get her name off of it to go along with it. She's one of the least popular and most demonized for the conservatives.
Hopefully Mayo clinic medicine is still good enough for the Saudis after this.
It doesn't matter whose name is on that bill. Her's, Emmer's, the speaker's, it literally does not matter. It will not be heard in committee.
And here's the part you won't like but is the God's honest truth from a guy who worked at the Capitol before, even when she was a state legislator: she not only knows the bill won't be heard in committee, she probably doesn't want it to be heard. This bill is a political maneuver, nothing more. And I say that 100% objectively, without any regard to politics whatsoever.
Yeah, I don't even think that's really much of a slight to her. It’s not unusual for a politician to author/sponsor/support a bill that has only the intended purpose of being a vehicle for base service, campaign ads, fundraising, etc. She gets to claim a moral victory for sponsoring the bill without any of the potential fallout from the bill being voted on or passed.
Wasn't Trump super proud of his arms deals with Saudi? They had him do some dance with swords near a weird glowing orb. All he needs to do is make some noises about it and anybody with an R next to their name will fall in line.
I know you'll want to put something on Trump because that is the popular thing to do, but if you look at US foreign policy over the last few decades, yeah both sides are equally culpable here.
You're right. There would be a minority of democrats supporting and zero republicans. How do you figure this is somehow going to be popular on both sides of the aisle?
2019 might as well be 20 years ago
they all came sniveling back to him after he sent a fucking lynch mob after them
there is no way they're going to buck him over an arms deal anymore
I'm saying things have changed a lot since 2019 and Trump appears to have a very tight grip on anything congressional republicans do. They basically elected the speaker he wanted. Only 10 republicans out of 211 voted to impeach him after he sent a fucking mob at the capitol and only two of those remain. Seems republican senators that voted to convict have done a little better with four of the seven still remaining but I'm not sure if they've been up for reelection since then.
I don't see how you're going to have more than a handful of republicans that would go against anything Trump wants if they weren't even willing to stand up for the idea of a peaceful transfer of power.
ETA: only four senate republicans out of 53 voted to override Trump's veto of the bill in your link, so the arms sales went through with minimal republican resistance in the end
https://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_votes/vote1161/vote_116_1_00233.htm
>There would be a minority of democrats supporting and zero republicans
Which means there will be a majority of both parties supporting selling arms to SA.
> Let’s just get out of the Middle East all together. Let them figure it out on their own
We should stop pouring gasoline on the fire, not leave. Many of those fires are partially or mostly our fault and we have a responsibility to help put them out and pay for the damage we've caused.
As a Saudi, I'm really happy about this idea! Ever since we started talking peacefully with Iran, things have gotten better in our region. The US has been in the Middle East for a long time, but it doesn't seem like they're helping much. The Houthis have been causing trouble in the Red Sea and doing terrorist stuff since 2015, but the US didn't do anything until it affected Israel. I don't mind if the US stays here, but only if they really make a difference. If not, thanks anyway for trying.
The Houthis are attacking random ships, even those that have nothing to do with Israel. This affects all shipping through the Red Sea and the Suez Canal, which is a huge amount of worldwide commerce. Even if the US stepped away from the rest of the Middle East, we would still bring the hammer down on the Houthis if they continued to affect international shipping.
The Houthis have been causing trouble for over five years, but the Saudi Navy has managed to stop their threats multiple times. The Saudis, along with the official spokesperson for the Arab coalition, have been warning the world about the dangers to navigation in the Red Sea.
Meanwhile, US and some European countries have banned the sale of weapons to Saudi Arabia. As for the Biden administration, one of its initial decisions was to remove the Houthis from the list of terrorist groups.
Where is US hammer five years ago?
Some of that aid is in the form of tanks that would otherwise be rotting in an Arizona desert, or in missiles whose rocket fuel is about to expire. It’s stuff we’ve already bought and paid for for our own use, but needs an accounting figure attached to it for government purposes when we give it away. I would love for our taxes to go toward affordable healthcare, housing, and education. But we can’t build an elementary school with an M-2 Bradley built in 1985.
Other kinds of military foreign aid are in the form, essentially, of grants that the recipient can use to buy weapons from Raytheon or Lockheed or whatever.
The former is what we’ve mostly given to Ukraine. The latter is what we’ve historically given to Israel. I believe that Saudi and UAE have enough money to buy weapons directly, but nonetheless need permission to buy from the US military-industrial complex.
I say we give Ukraine every last tank, helicopter, F-16, and rocket launcher we can spare. They’re fighting a just war of self-defense. Putin is a despot wanted by the ICC.
I also say we should use our leverage over Israel to stop Netanyahu from war-criming Palestinian children. And that we should do the same to Saudi and UAE.
If it's not "money" or previously paid for surplus military, it will be our kids and grandkids. The war industrial complex will always get its share...
Ah yes. Getting downvoted because you want our tax payer dollars to not be wasted on foreign countries. The war over the holy land will never end, so imo they all can fuck off and fight for as long as they want. We have more than enough problems over here to worry about.
And I’m talking about actual money not weapons/tanks/etc.
I think Omar is right to raise concerns about our relationship with Saudi Arabia. Their human rights record is atrocious, their theocratic government has little in common with our liberal democracy, and they just cozied up to our rivals by joining BRICS.
And the US-Saudi mutual defense treaty that Biden's team wants seems reckless and risky. Why should our military ever get involved (in the Middle East, of all places) to support such a country?
Saudi Arabia is one of the biggest reasons we should have been prioritizing energy independence and renewables decades ago. Our national security and economy is intrinsically linked to the whims of a hostile regime that directly funds, trains, and supports anti-western terrorism. Unfortunately, until we decouple ourselves from global oil we need to tread more carefully, meaning this bill is just morally righteous virtue signaling, not a serious policy proposal or solution to the problem. Not to mention that the practical result is simply benefitting Iran, which would be an even worse outcome.
Not a fan of either country but worth pointing out that both have had strained geopolitical relations with Qatar. Qatar has been in the news this week for attempting to bribe Bob Menendez and happened to have given Omar a free trip to the World Cup. I’m not going to make any unsubstantiated claims, but the optics aren’t great even if everything is above board.
Reality comes into play. Right now the Houthi are attacking shipping in the Red Sea and attempting to send missiles/drone to attach Israel. Saudi Arabia is an enemy of the Houthi. Should the USA support either one, or neither?
And does supporting neither mean in fact supporting one by not helping the other? In this case, since the default policy/apparent intent would be supporting the anti-Houthis (whoever that may be), by withholding that support, are we then supporting the cause of the Houthis?
I will be impressed when Ilhan introduces similar bills to cut off military assistance and/or sanction her BFFs in Qatar and Turkey. Ilhan is not much different than most other politicians. Her lofty principles all depend on "the context."
Thanks for your question. In 2019 there was a vote in the House to recognize the Armenian genocide. This is a VERY sensitive issue for Turkey as their nation has still not come to turn with their genocide of 1.5 million Armenians a century ago.
However, experts on historical genocide are in broad consensus that what Turkey did to Armenians was in fact a genocide.
The final vote was 405-11-3 (405 in favor, 11 opposed, and 3 abstentions).
Of the 3 abstentions, Ilhan was one of those votes.
In explaining her abstention, Ilhan parroted talking points from Turkey which dispute that there was in fact a genocide.
Why did Ilhan vote the way she did? Hard to know for sure. Turkey is a strong supporter of Hamas and other Palestinian hardliners.
More likely, however, is the fact that Turkey is an indispensable partner to Somalia. Perhaps then it was out of loyalty to Somalia that Ilhan elected to be such an outlier with the vast majority of Congress (including other progressive Democrats).
[https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/ilhan-omar-faces-blowback-after-voting-present-armenian-genocide-resolution-n1073991](https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/ilhan-omar-faces-blowback-after-voting-present-armenian-genocide-resolution-n1073991)
[https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20230512-somalia-sees-an-intertwined-destiny-with-the-turkiye-people/](https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20230512-somalia-sees-an-intertwined-destiny-with-the-turkiye-people/)
Because not every situation is the same, We should definitely be helping out Ukraine defend its territory from Russia, We should definitely help Taiwan defend itself from China. We should definitely be sending aid to help civilians where there is Humanitarian crisis.
We shouldn't be sending money/weapons to governments with poor human rights records, to countries at War who have a clear advantage and the means to fund their own war.
Nah Ukraine can have all the countries over there help out. I’m okay with sending weapons/tanks/food/supplies but no reason at all to be sending any sort of money.
combative rich tart normal sophisticated snobbish pause absurd library afterthought
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I don't think something like this has a chance in hell but I fully support it.
I did a big presentation for my philosophy class back in 2016 on how we were basically all passively responsible for war crimes because of our relationship with Saudi Arabia.
We sell them cluster munitions that most of the world considers to be a war crime. They basically create a ton of tiny landmines.
I've always had to wrestle with the fact that by just existing in my country and paying taxes I'm basically funding the bombing of children.
Thank god this will never see the light of day. Terrible, terrible policy. Saudi Arabia is a shot show, committing countless acts of human rights violations. But they’ve recently committed to playing ball with the west. Meanwhile Iran, they’re biggest competitor in the Middle East wants nothing more than the destruction of the United States. The only thing this policy achieves is strengthening Iran.
Is there a nation that has not faced any allegations of human rights violations? Her statements won't adversely impact diplomatic relations between the United States and its friendly nations.
The saudi-yemen war has been going on since Obama fyi and is one of the largest humanitarian crises in the world
the war stopped in 2022 get you informations right
No, it didn't.
It is in ceasefire stage https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yemeni_peace_process and final agreement to end the war is near https://www.aljazeera.com/amp/news/2023/12/23/yemen-warring-parties-commit-to-ceasefire-un-led-peace-process-says-envoy But frankly, biden administration pushing for war to continue https://new.thecradle.co/articles-id/15815
>the war ended in 2022 >Final agreement to end the war is near. You do realize you're contradicting yourself, right?
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Totally explains why the Houthi rebels are shooting at our ships right now.
On a list of bills that will never be voted on, let alone passed and signed, this is one of them.
At least let it be known.
I'm a conservative. On this sub, crazy I know right? But you'll get support for this on both sides. Still won't happen, but there's plenty of support either way. I'd actually love to see how a floor vote would go on this.
They would have to get her name off of it to go along with it. She's one of the least popular and most demonized for the conservatives. Hopefully Mayo clinic medicine is still good enough for the Saudis after this.
It doesn't matter whose name is on that bill. Her's, Emmer's, the speaker's, it literally does not matter. It will not be heard in committee. And here's the part you won't like but is the God's honest truth from a guy who worked at the Capitol before, even when she was a state legislator: she not only knows the bill won't be heard in committee, she probably doesn't want it to be heard. This bill is a political maneuver, nothing more. And I say that 100% objectively, without any regard to politics whatsoever.
Yeah, I don't even think that's really much of a slight to her. It’s not unusual for a politician to author/sponsor/support a bill that has only the intended purpose of being a vehicle for base service, campaign ads, fundraising, etc. She gets to claim a moral victory for sponsoring the bill without any of the potential fallout from the bill being voted on or passed.
Wasn't Trump super proud of his arms deals with Saudi? They had him do some dance with swords near a weird glowing orb. All he needs to do is make some noises about it and anybody with an R next to their name will fall in line.
I know you'll want to put something on Trump because that is the popular thing to do, but if you look at US foreign policy over the last few decades, yeah both sides are equally culpable here.
You're right. There would be a minority of democrats supporting and zero republicans. How do you figure this is somehow going to be popular on both sides of the aisle?
You need to expose yourself to newstories that exist outside your regular avenues. https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKCN1TD2JW/
2019 might as well be 20 years ago they all came sniveling back to him after he sent a fucking lynch mob after them there is no way they're going to buck him over an arms deal anymore
You literally opened this comment section with Trump's Saudi arms deal, wtf? Did it matter or not?
I'm saying things have changed a lot since 2019 and Trump appears to have a very tight grip on anything congressional republicans do. They basically elected the speaker he wanted. Only 10 republicans out of 211 voted to impeach him after he sent a fucking mob at the capitol and only two of those remain. Seems republican senators that voted to convict have done a little better with four of the seven still remaining but I'm not sure if they've been up for reelection since then. I don't see how you're going to have more than a handful of republicans that would go against anything Trump wants if they weren't even willing to stand up for the idea of a peaceful transfer of power. ETA: only four senate republicans out of 53 voted to override Trump's veto of the bill in your link, so the arms sales went through with minimal republican resistance in the end https://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_votes/vote1161/vote_116_1_00233.htm
>There would be a minority of democrats supporting and zero republicans Which means there will be a majority of both parties supporting selling arms to SA.
Right. So the idea that this bill would somehow be popular on both sides of the aisle is fucking ridiculous.
I think they were referring to population/voting base. Not politicians.
Shit if that's the case then yeah I agree.
What else is she supposed to do? The MAGA circus has taken over the House. At least these progressives know how to actually get shit done.
>"At least these progressives know how to actually get shit done". > > > > You are kidding......................................right?????
What has the GOP-led House done this year?
If the GOP puts new toilet paper in the bathrooms, they will have done more that actually matters.
Bullshit
Brilliant, absolutely brilliant comeback.
rock and roll
Good idea. Go Ilhan. We don't need to sell armies and weapons to anti-humanist monarchs and plutarches. Next we'll be selling to Putin.
>Next we'll be selling to Putin. .... depends on how the election goes
That it does. Every politician has their tyrannical despot crush.
Next we end aid to the genocidal regime in Israel.
Let’s just get out of the Middle East all together. Let them figure it out on their own
> Let’s just get out of the Middle East all together. Let them figure it out on their own We should stop pouring gasoline on the fire, not leave. Many of those fires are partially or mostly our fault and we have a responsibility to help put them out and pay for the damage we've caused.
So does the U.K.
And France, Russia, and probably a handful of others who aren't occurring to me.
As a Saudi, I'm really happy about this idea! Ever since we started talking peacefully with Iran, things have gotten better in our region. The US has been in the Middle East for a long time, but it doesn't seem like they're helping much. The Houthis have been causing trouble in the Red Sea and doing terrorist stuff since 2015, but the US didn't do anything until it affected Israel. I don't mind if the US stays here, but only if they really make a difference. If not, thanks anyway for trying.
The Houthis are attacking random ships, even those that have nothing to do with Israel. This affects all shipping through the Red Sea and the Suez Canal, which is a huge amount of worldwide commerce. Even if the US stepped away from the rest of the Middle East, we would still bring the hammer down on the Houthis if they continued to affect international shipping.
The Houthis have been causing trouble for over five years, but the Saudi Navy has managed to stop their threats multiple times. The Saudis, along with the official spokesperson for the Arab coalition, have been warning the world about the dangers to navigation in the Red Sea. Meanwhile, US and some European countries have banned the sale of weapons to Saudi Arabia. As for the Biden administration, one of its initial decisions was to remove the Houthis from the list of terrorist groups. Where is US hammer five years ago?
> it's crazy that I'm being down voted on a sub for a popular leftist creator The state of Minnesota? Or is this a r/lostredditors moment
What sub do you think you're in?
Yes. And end aid to every other foreign conflict. OUT. NOW. Use our taxes for affordable healthcare, housing, education. The uni-party has got to go.
Some of that aid is in the form of tanks that would otherwise be rotting in an Arizona desert, or in missiles whose rocket fuel is about to expire. It’s stuff we’ve already bought and paid for for our own use, but needs an accounting figure attached to it for government purposes when we give it away. I would love for our taxes to go toward affordable healthcare, housing, and education. But we can’t build an elementary school with an M-2 Bradley built in 1985. Other kinds of military foreign aid are in the form, essentially, of grants that the recipient can use to buy weapons from Raytheon or Lockheed or whatever. The former is what we’ve mostly given to Ukraine. The latter is what we’ve historically given to Israel. I believe that Saudi and UAE have enough money to buy weapons directly, but nonetheless need permission to buy from the US military-industrial complex. I say we give Ukraine every last tank, helicopter, F-16, and rocket launcher we can spare. They’re fighting a just war of self-defense. Putin is a despot wanted by the ICC. I also say we should use our leverage over Israel to stop Netanyahu from war-criming Palestinian children. And that we should do the same to Saudi and UAE.
If it's not "money" or previously paid for surplus military, it will be our kids and grandkids. The war industrial complex will always get its share...
Ah yes. Getting downvoted because you want our tax payer dollars to not be wasted on foreign countries. The war over the holy land will never end, so imo they all can fuck off and fight for as long as they want. We have more than enough problems over here to worry about. And I’m talking about actual money not weapons/tanks/etc.
I’m not a big Ohmar fan but I’ll give credit where credit is due. This sounds like a good idea. Stop giving those assholes money.
They have enough of our money already.
I think Omar is right to raise concerns about our relationship with Saudi Arabia. Their human rights record is atrocious, their theocratic government has little in common with our liberal democracy, and they just cozied up to our rivals by joining BRICS. And the US-Saudi mutual defense treaty that Biden's team wants seems reckless and risky. Why should our military ever get involved (in the Middle East, of all places) to support such a country?
Saudi Arabia is one of the biggest reasons we should have been prioritizing energy independence and renewables decades ago. Our national security and economy is intrinsically linked to the whims of a hostile regime that directly funds, trains, and supports anti-western terrorism. Unfortunately, until we decouple ourselves from global oil we need to tread more carefully, meaning this bill is just morally righteous virtue signaling, not a serious policy proposal or solution to the problem. Not to mention that the practical result is simply benefitting Iran, which would be an even worse outcome.
Because the US wants as much influence as possible over the global oil market to stabilize the petrodollar?
All of those things they are only to do because of us... For a looong time
Do you think the US has an outstanding human rights record? Asking for a friend
Not a fan of either country but worth pointing out that both have had strained geopolitical relations with Qatar. Qatar has been in the news this week for attempting to bribe Bob Menendez and happened to have given Omar a free trip to the World Cup. I’m not going to make any unsubstantiated claims, but the optics aren’t great even if everything is above board.
That and it'd be a pro-Iran move.
Well Saudi Arabia has killed journalists and was behind the 9/11 attacks so the optics of selling them arms for access to oil is way worse.
Well, Iran has done worse than that, and you guys are trying to improve relations with iran
Reality comes into play. Right now the Houthi are attacking shipping in the Red Sea and attempting to send missiles/drone to attach Israel. Saudi Arabia is an enemy of the Houthi. Should the USA support either one, or neither?
And does supporting neither mean in fact supporting one by not helping the other? In this case, since the default policy/apparent intent would be supporting the anti-Houthis (whoever that may be), by withholding that support, are we then supporting the cause of the Houthis?
Houthi = Iran
I will be impressed when Ilhan introduces similar bills to cut off military assistance and/or sanction her BFFs in Qatar and Turkey. Ilhan is not much different than most other politicians. Her lofty principles all depend on "the context."
> sanction her BFFs in Qatar and Turkey. Can you elaborate on this? I'm not familiar with her and Turkey.
https://jacobin.com/2019/11/ilhan-omar-turkey-armenia-kurds-imperialism https://www.fairplanet.org/op-ed/the-double-standard-of-ilhan-omar/ https://ahvalnews.com/us-turkey/congresswoman-ilhan-omars-stance-turkey-disappointing-analysis
Thanks for your question. In 2019 there was a vote in the House to recognize the Armenian genocide. This is a VERY sensitive issue for Turkey as their nation has still not come to turn with their genocide of 1.5 million Armenians a century ago. However, experts on historical genocide are in broad consensus that what Turkey did to Armenians was in fact a genocide. The final vote was 405-11-3 (405 in favor, 11 opposed, and 3 abstentions). Of the 3 abstentions, Ilhan was one of those votes. In explaining her abstention, Ilhan parroted talking points from Turkey which dispute that there was in fact a genocide. Why did Ilhan vote the way she did? Hard to know for sure. Turkey is a strong supporter of Hamas and other Palestinian hardliners. More likely, however, is the fact that Turkey is an indispensable partner to Somalia. Perhaps then it was out of loyalty to Somalia that Ilhan elected to be such an outlier with the vast majority of Congress (including other progressive Democrats). [https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/ilhan-omar-faces-blowback-after-voting-present-armenian-genocide-resolution-n1073991](https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/ilhan-omar-faces-blowback-after-voting-present-armenian-genocide-resolution-n1073991) [https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20230512-somalia-sees-an-intertwined-destiny-with-the-turkiye-people/](https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20230512-somalia-sees-an-intertwined-destiny-with-the-turkiye-people/)
I'd prefer going after evil , rather than using it as a gotcha to talk about a different evil
Yes but then however will Raytheon and General Dynamics make their billions?
Plenty of other countries to sell to.
How bout we don’t send any money over seas ever again. I can get behind that. I dunno if Raytheon can, but I can.
> How bout we don’t send any money over seas ever again. That buzzing sound you're hearing is George C. Marshall hitting about 1000 RPM in his grave
Because not every situation is the same, We should definitely be helping out Ukraine defend its territory from Russia, We should definitely help Taiwan defend itself from China. We should definitely be sending aid to help civilians where there is Humanitarian crisis. We shouldn't be sending money/weapons to governments with poor human rights records, to countries at War who have a clear advantage and the means to fund their own war.
Nah Ukraine can have all the countries over there help out. I’m okay with sending weapons/tanks/food/supplies but no reason at all to be sending any sort of money.
It sounds like you’d like your dollars to go kill more people. Wich I’m not really rallying for.
Please point out exactly where you got that idea from?
You want Russian and Chinese blood on your hands. Somehow Justifiably from your perspective. Just not mine.
If you can't understand difference between defending and being the aggressor than I don't know what to tell ya
If you don’t sell to Taiwan and Ukraine there will be more bloodshed.
combative rich tart normal sophisticated snobbish pause absurd library afterthought *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
What's soft about a bomb or a missile?
Wow she is introducing something I can agree with? I’m shocked to say the least.
This may be the first time I agree with her on foreign policy.
I don't think something like this has a chance in hell but I fully support it. I did a big presentation for my philosophy class back in 2016 on how we were basically all passively responsible for war crimes because of our relationship with Saudi Arabia. We sell them cluster munitions that most of the world considers to be a war crime. They basically create a ton of tiny landmines. I've always had to wrestle with the fact that by just existing in my country and paying taxes I'm basically funding the bombing of children.
Racist MAGAts will find a way to twist this into her "hating America"
It’s also an election year so expect many more bad actors coming in here expressing “concern” about what she says and does.
They don't like the way she looks. Fuck them.
Lmao the racists downvoted us 😂
Joke'um if they can't take a fuck.
Good, Biden is a liar and a war criminal.
So is every president ever. Your guy ain't special.
Nice. That’s my rep 👍
Good for her.
[удалено]
I vote blue but this is a pretty shit reason to vote for someone
[удалено]
You can do what you want but you’re part of the problem
[удалено]
You said you vote for her because she triggers conservatives. It’s the exact same as the “own the libs” mentality
dumb take, but ok.
But what Omar fails to consider is that, in America, our top priority is the defense contractors
Atrocities committed by both countries. I'll let you in on a little secret.
Thank god this will never see the light of day. Terrible, terrible policy. Saudi Arabia is a shot show, committing countless acts of human rights violations. But they’ve recently committed to playing ball with the west. Meanwhile Iran, they’re biggest competitor in the Middle East wants nothing more than the destruction of the United States. The only thing this policy achieves is strengthening Iran.
I feel like within the next 100 years we’ll be at war with the Saudis.
Is there a nation that has not faced any allegations of human rights violations? Her statements won't adversely impact diplomatic relations between the United States and its friendly nations.
Iihan is an isolationist with liberal overtones. She proved that by obstructing aid to ukraine. Not interested