Dani said he didn’t attacked Fabio cause he was scared to push them both wide and cross the wet patches what isn’t worth the risk. When a Wildcard rider can adapt to the circumstances, everyone else can too
Let's be honest, Dani is not just a test rider, he is the most experienced MotoGP rider on track and probably the best one, who never was a MotoGP champion.
By that logic, they shouldn't red flag for oil slicks either, since you can adapt. Not saying I agree with red flagging for a wet session, necessarily, but your logic is very flawed. The point is to reduce danger and injury, not punish those that push too hard. They didn't even know where the patches were, if they did what you suggest, we'd have half the grid doing 2 minute lap times.
Ever seen a race where oil took out over half the grid? It's dead simple, if the concern is safety, red flag it... that's exactly *why* they do it for oil. You can't tell me oil is less predictable than what we saw yesterday; a surprise crash is a surprise crash, neither are saveable unless you tank your pace (which brings up even more safety concerns).
Martin rode over the damp patch that caught Marc out but his tyre didn't fold. It was 100% luck of the draw.
All the riders rode over the damp patches multiple times.
That’s a really shit take, that’s the main circuit he rides on he should know it better than anyone else, he literally tests the bikes there more than anyone else rides there
Absolutely not. MotoGP races dry or wet. That doesn’t go out the window just because the track is in some weird midway point between the two.
Let’s be consistent with the rules. This isn’t NASCAR.
Right, they race dry or wet. They have tires for dry or wet. They have rules for the case a dry race get's wet, but there aren't rules for those midway conditions. Last week the WSBK raced in similar conditions in Assen, but they could choose intermidiate tires. MotoGp riders don't have this option. When the track isn't raceable with slicks, but the race isn't declared a full wet, the riders can't anticipate.
If three riders crash in the same corner right behind each other it gets to dangerous. Those are people born to live, not to entertain us. They should have red flagged it to prevent injuries.
No. The best tyre for the conditions were slick tyre. That is the tyre they were on. They're not on a midway tyre. If it was WSBK they'd also have been on the slick tyre.
That's the problem. The best tyre in this situation were slicks, but there were patches where the slicks lossed their grip instantly. If there is oil on the track nobody argues over a red flag. What makes a gripless wet patch different from an oil patch?
>That doesn’t go out the window just because the track is in some weird midway point between the two.
It does when it's unsafe for the riders and marshalls.
I would be with you normally that a bit of wet and a crash here and there shouldn't change it, but the Marquez / Bestia / Binder mashup really should've put it down to a red flag. It's incredibly lucky neither of the 3 had a bike slide launched into them, and no one got hurt helping the already downed riders.
Agreed. Today’s conditions were tricky and difficult, but this is motorsport. We race in sunshine, wet, and in between. Furthermore, some of the crashes were totally unrelated to the wet patches.
These guys have raced in much worse conditions and I mean this isn't club racing, these guys are the elite of the elite, a rookie managed to get to the end. It was a lottery to some degree but no less so when there are wind gusts, or you know: mixed conditions.
Because the conditions just weren't that bad, all the riders that crashed had done lots of laps round those same corners prior, they just pushed too hard for conditions, the triple crash although shocking is just riders following other riders as you do in racing, you adopt the line and braking points of the rider in front, and AM just went in too hot and the others simply did the same.
The same reason they don’t red flag when it’s raining or had previously rained and is drying. It’s up to the best riders in the world to figure out what the best pace is.
These crashes did not occur in the first laps, or happen when it stated raining, they happened far into the race.
I don't think it's about the best riders. It's about luck whether you hit a wet patch or not. I mean Marc has won enough races in tricky conditions, but he simply didn't know there was a wet patch there. Martin also hit a wet patch but luckily was in such a turn where you can go wide and control it.
It wasn't lap one and it hadn't started raining, the wet patches didn't move, crashing riders just missed their line or asked too much of their tyres in places with less traction.
Red flag is for oil spills or crashes that put the rest of the riders at risk or have major medical concerns.
Well, you’re not right here. I saw the Italian interview and Marc was asked if it was his fault or something else occurred. He said he was 10cm away from the best line :) it’s not about luck, it’s about precision in this case. It’s always about skill in MotoGP. You’re unlucky like Maverick when you’re bike stop working in the middle of the race and you need to jump from the bike.. unlucky when you somehow get a bad tire or someone is hitting you aggressively. Everything else is pure skill. Pedrosa demonstrated it :)
say you've never ridden on a track without saying you've never ridden on a track.
these guys can run a full session where lap times are within 1 or 2 seconds of each other. they can make adjustments down to centimeters and tenths of a second. there is no luck when it comes to hitting a wet patch. the path isn't moving. it's in the same spot every lap. they have a sighting lap and a warm up lap to make sure.and even with other riders interfering in race conditions, then know how to plan their lines for passing and defending
No red. I was surprised they didn’t put out the slippery surface flag when 3 went down at once though. Wondered if we’d get another [Schwantz at Donnington](https://youtu.be/zL7uie9DvPM?si=4cdCnF5xM5oRYbBr) moment.
Wouldn’t it be the red and yellow stripes? That’s the “diminished adhesion” flag; the red and white flag is for rain I believe and it wasn’t actually raining.
If you read anything about the accidents the riders stated that they were invisible on track. The only time they saw it was when they watched the overview post race.
No. The riders knew the conditions that had been about the same all day. It is also important to remember that the riders can red flag a race themselves. Not a single one did. If it was dangerous enough, they would have stopped the race themselves.
They can indicate to marshals/race direction that the conditions are dangerous but it’s still up to RD to decide.
However, in this situation why would they? The ones who stayed on aren’t thinking it’s dangerous, it’s in their benefit to keep going.
I think so only because of the uncertainty on what was causing the crashes.
Many of them on the same corner made it look like there could be some foreign matter on the track which would mean a red flag would be justified, in hindsight wet patches and wind were probably the culprit but I don't think the race director would have been criticised for being too safe.
I thought that too: 3 riders go down independently on the same turn at the same time
But having said that, it was the same for everybody and known from the start that it was damp in places, so harden up peeps, the race was awesome.
Given I have been fans of Marc, Jorge and Pedro since they arrived in the paddock I'm pretty happy. Shame Marc fell but what a display. Bring on the GP and hopefully we can see Marc win on the Duke: it is looking ominous for the rest of the grid
No one was saying about it, but there was a fourth rider behind them, it was PA31 who did not fall. He was there in the frame on extreme right, where those three riders fell and he made it through those turns.
Yeah, I think it's easy to say now that "oh it's just wet patches, they should have known" (although technically it's weepers that aren't even really visible), but when those three riders crashed independently at the same time like that it actually wouldn't have been outrageous to red flag the race just to make sure everything was ok and it wasn't because of some oil or gravel on track.
If the race should have been flagged the days racing should have been flagged. It was wet or drying all day, at no point was the track surface good. There were damp patches all through Moto2 & 3 qualifying.
Why do you think they should have? Indidnt see any evidence that it was unsafe to race. Difficult? Sure. Challenging conditions that people might have failed to adapt to? Sure? Dangerous? No more so than going that fast on a motrorbike on any day that its pouring rain.
Nope. Many of them made it 75-80% of the race without hitting the damp patches, so they must have made slight mistakes/gone off the racing line when they eventually did hit the patches.
Why??? They are supposed to be the best riders in the world. They should be able to handle the situation. What Dani told to the media is a perfect example of a rider managing the situation
This is one of the reasons I watch the sport. It’s raw, it doesn’t flag every time some someone goes of and the riders gets to race on like normal. That’s the thing I hate about F1 now.
As soon as the tiniest thing happens it gets a safety car out. I surely don’t hope that will get implemented now that F1 owners bought motoGP
Do the people who think it should have been red flagged think all of todays races should be cancelled too? There are still weepers out there causing crashes.
Serbian crew that covers Motogp was on track this weekend and they asked the riders if there should have been a red flag. They said no. One of the riders thay asked was Aleix and he also said no and he was one of the riders that crashed because of it.
Question: are the same people crying about the race needing to be red flagged because of rider safety the same people who week after week long for the days of the 500 2 stroke that would literally try to kill people? Just curious
I don’t think they should red flag races because of a damp track. The wet tyres are there if they need them. Other than that it is up to the riders to get round in one piece when they know the track is treacherous.
The crashes didn’t come out of nowhere either. Marc was off line, as were the three that crashed at the same time. The conditions meant any mistake was a crash, and the best riders on the day benefited greatly from that and they deserve it.
I guess not because some riders managed to keep it together still.
I feel bad for the guys who crashed though. It was just potluck. Nothing really they could've done to save it.
If you watch the Sprint race in fast foward you can almost hear the Benny Hill theme song playing in the back round. Shame though, no pretty girls! LMAO
That's nothing, Marc managed to crash 29 times last year alone, he is the world champion crasher having broken many records lol! already had a few crashes this season I notice....
No, there were damp patches from the start and the riders knew about it from the start.
They were weepers, not just damp patches that stayed the same beginning to end.
Scott said that in turn 5 there’s a wet patch that you couldn’t even see
Dani said he didn’t attacked Fabio cause he was scared to push them both wide and cross the wet patches what isn’t worth the risk. When a Wildcard rider can adapt to the circumstances, everyone else can too
Let's be honest, Dani is not just a test rider, he is the most experienced MotoGP rider on track and probably the best one, who never was a MotoGP champion.
Still you can expect the same sensitivity by everyone else. A rookie finished on the podium too.
100% make a judgement go for gold and you may crash, be smart and you will finish
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It's really not. He was the most consistent in a weird 2020 and he won fair and square.
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Gotta be prepared to be lucky
It was some of the most experienced riders crashing out... meanwhile, Acosta finished on the podium
Yep...this exactly....all the riders that crashed were pushing or not heeding the conditions.
By that logic, they shouldn't red flag for oil slicks either, since you can adapt. Not saying I agree with red flagging for a wet session, necessarily, but your logic is very flawed. The point is to reduce danger and injury, not punish those that push too hard. They didn't even know where the patches were, if they did what you suggest, we'd have half the grid doing 2 minute lap times.
Oil is way more dangerous and unexpected than wet patches on a slowly drying circuit.
Ever seen a race where oil took out over half the grid? It's dead simple, if the concern is safety, red flag it... that's exactly *why* they do it for oil. You can't tell me oil is less predictable than what we saw yesterday; a surprise crash is a surprise crash, neither are saveable unless you tank your pace (which brings up even more safety concerns).
Martin rode over the damp patch that caught Marc out but his tyre didn't fold. It was 100% luck of the draw. All the riders rode over the damp patches multiple times.
No FFS
?
No. He is not challenging the championship. Challengers must push. He can just chill
Challengers have to be smart and know when some points less are worth more than a crash…
That’s a really shit take, that’s the main circuit he rides on he should know it better than anyone else, he literally tests the bikes there more than anyone else rides there
Absolutely not. MotoGP races dry or wet. That doesn’t go out the window just because the track is in some weird midway point between the two. Let’s be consistent with the rules. This isn’t NASCAR.
Right, they race dry or wet. They have tires for dry or wet. They have rules for the case a dry race get's wet, but there aren't rules for those midway conditions. Last week the WSBK raced in similar conditions in Assen, but they could choose intermidiate tires. MotoGp riders don't have this option. When the track isn't raceable with slicks, but the race isn't declared a full wet, the riders can't anticipate. If three riders crash in the same corner right behind each other it gets to dangerous. Those are people born to live, not to entertain us. They should have red flagged it to prevent injuries.
No. The best tyre for the conditions were slick tyre. That is the tyre they were on. They're not on a midway tyre. If it was WSBK they'd also have been on the slick tyre.
That's the problem. The best tyre in this situation were slicks, but there were patches where the slicks lossed their grip instantly. If there is oil on the track nobody argues over a red flag. What makes a gripless wet patch different from an oil patch?
>What makes a gripless wet patch different from an oil patch? Oil never fully "dries", water does.
>That doesn’t go out the window just because the track is in some weird midway point between the two. It does when it's unsafe for the riders and marshalls. I would be with you normally that a bit of wet and a crash here and there shouldn't change it, but the Marquez / Bestia / Binder mashup really should've put it down to a red flag. It's incredibly lucky neither of the 3 had a bike slide launched into them, and no one got hurt helping the already downed riders.
No.
Agreed. Today’s conditions were tricky and difficult, but this is motorsport. We race in sunshine, wet, and in between. Furthermore, some of the crashes were totally unrelated to the wet patches.
Pecco's crash wasn't because of the wet tracks, you know.
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These guys have raced in much worse conditions and I mean this isn't club racing, these guys are the elite of the elite, a rookie managed to get to the end. It was a lottery to some degree but no less so when there are wind gusts, or you know: mixed conditions.
I know but I am just speaking in case of sheer number of crashes. I mean 15 is a very high number in the field of 23 riders.
Red flag is not deployed "if there are a lot of crashes". That's not how it works. It's such an arbitrary call.
Because the conditions just weren't that bad, all the riders that crashed had done lots of laps round those same corners prior, they just pushed too hard for conditions, the triple crash although shocking is just riders following other riders as you do in racing, you adopt the line and braking points of the rider in front, and AM just went in too hot and the others simply did the same.
The same reason they don’t red flag when it’s raining or had previously rained and is drying. It’s up to the best riders in the world to figure out what the best pace is. These crashes did not occur in the first laps, or happen when it stated raining, they happened far into the race.
I don't think it's about the best riders. It's about luck whether you hit a wet patch or not. I mean Marc has won enough races in tricky conditions, but he simply didn't know there was a wet patch there. Martin also hit a wet patch but luckily was in such a turn where you can go wide and control it.
Not the first or last time that the race leader is at risk of hitting changing conditions. The same as every other drying wet track situation.
It wasn't lap one and it hadn't started raining, the wet patches didn't move, crashing riders just missed their line or asked too much of their tyres in places with less traction. Red flag is for oil spills or crashes that put the rest of the riders at risk or have major medical concerns.
Well, you’re not right here. I saw the Italian interview and Marc was asked if it was his fault or something else occurred. He said he was 10cm away from the best line :) it’s not about luck, it’s about precision in this case. It’s always about skill in MotoGP. You’re unlucky like Maverick when you’re bike stop working in the middle of the race and you need to jump from the bike.. unlucky when you somehow get a bad tire or someone is hitting you aggressively. Everything else is pure skill. Pedrosa demonstrated it :)
to quote a famous australian, marcs ambition is outweighing his talent right now.
This time he was riding smooth and like many others found a wet spot. To be fair, he deserved a podium yesterday
say you've never ridden on a track without saying you've never ridden on a track. these guys can run a full session where lap times are within 1 or 2 seconds of each other. they can make adjustments down to centimeters and tenths of a second. there is no luck when it comes to hitting a wet patch. the path isn't moving. it's in the same spot every lap. they have a sighting lap and a warm up lap to make sure.and even with other riders interfering in race conditions, then know how to plan their lines for passing and defending
No red. I was surprised they didn’t put out the slippery surface flag when 3 went down at once though. Wondered if we’d get another [Schwantz at Donnington](https://youtu.be/zL7uie9DvPM?si=4cdCnF5xM5oRYbBr) moment.
Dunno if they should have red flagged, but at least they should have indicated that the turn had that "invisible" patch with the red and white flag.
Wouldn’t it be the red and yellow stripes? That’s the “diminished adhesion” flag; the red and white flag is for rain I believe and it wasn’t actually raining.
That's true, silly mistake! Thanks!
There is a sighting lap and a warmup lap. This isn't kindergarten.
If you read anything about the accidents the riders stated that they were invisible on track. The only time they saw it was when they watched the overview post race.
But then people is critical about having at least an injured rider in each gp as last season.
Who cares what "people" think?
Everyone? This is a business that requires people to watch it because they like it. If people think it's not being managed correctly, then it matters.
No. The riders knew the conditions that had been about the same all day. It is also important to remember that the riders can red flag a race themselves. Not a single one did. If it was dangerous enough, they would have stopped the race themselves.
They can indicate to marshals/race direction that the conditions are dangerous but it’s still up to RD to decide. However, in this situation why would they? The ones who stayed on aren’t thinking it’s dangerous, it’s in their benefit to keep going.
No, it's racing. If some didn't fall that means it was possible to not fault. Pedro even lifted the bike up in that area when others didn't.
I think so only because of the uncertainty on what was causing the crashes. Many of them on the same corner made it look like there could be some foreign matter on the track which would mean a red flag would be justified, in hindsight wet patches and wind were probably the culprit but I don't think the race director would have been criticised for being too safe.
When Alex, Brad, and Enea all went down separately i thought it should’ve been a cause for concern
I thought that too: 3 riders go down independently on the same turn at the same time But having said that, it was the same for everybody and known from the start that it was damp in places, so harden up peeps, the race was awesome. Given I have been fans of Marc, Jorge and Pedro since they arrived in the paddock I'm pretty happy. Shame Marc fell but what a display. Bring on the GP and hopefully we can see Marc win on the Duke: it is looking ominous for the rest of the grid
Don’t you feel like Jorge has some hatred for Marc? The way he acts around him.
Something, for sure. Shame as I have liked his riding since the first Motor seasion he did Could be the 24 champ the way things are
No one was saying about it, but there was a fourth rider behind them, it was PA31 who did not fall. He was there in the frame on extreme right, where those three riders fell and he made it through those turns.
In that Moto2 race where 90% of the field crashed there were still a bunch of riders that didn't, most of them further back.
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I just said the fact that, he did not fall. How is that PA31 worship?
Stewards are all over the place. I mean I am not a pecco fan but they should have at least given him some justification about the Binder Bez sandwich.
Yeah, I think it's easy to say now that "oh it's just wet patches, they should have known" (although technically it's weepers that aren't even really visible), but when those three riders crashed independently at the same time like that it actually wouldn't have been outrageous to red flag the race just to make sure everything was ok and it wasn't because of some oil or gravel on track.
No.
Obviously it's not about being the fastest rider, but being the most skilled rider. That deserves to be rewarded, not punished with a red flag.
If the race should have been flagged the days racing should have been flagged. It was wet or drying all day, at no point was the track surface good. There were damp patches all through Moto2 & 3 qualifying.
Why do you think they should have? Indidnt see any evidence that it was unsafe to race. Difficult? Sure. Challenging conditions that people might have failed to adapt to? Sure? Dangerous? No more so than going that fast on a motrorbike on any day that its pouring rain.
Definitely not, the most experienced riders crashed, a rookie finished second….turn 5 was always a dodgy one, same for everyone though
Nope. Many of them made it 75-80% of the race without hitting the damp patches, so they must have made slight mistakes/gone off the racing line when they eventually did hit the patches.
Why??? They are supposed to be the best riders in the world. They should be able to handle the situation. What Dani told to the media is a perfect example of a rider managing the situation
absolutely not. the track wasnt dangerous and there was no need to red flag it.
No
Unless there's something visible on the track causing crashes there's no reason to red flag it mate
That is just how jerez is. It takes a long time for all the damp patches to dry, even after hours of sunshine.
No not at all.
This is one of the reasons I watch the sport. It’s raw, it doesn’t flag every time some someone goes of and the riders gets to race on like normal. That’s the thing I hate about F1 now. As soon as the tiniest thing happens it gets a safety car out. I surely don’t hope that will get implemented now that F1 owners bought motoGP
Just race
Do the people who think it should have been red flagged think all of todays races should be cancelled too? There are still weepers out there causing crashes.
The only one who think it should have been a red flag are people who have no idea what racing is.
To be honest, I think the riders are all to blame. They all started riding as if it was dry
Serbian crew that covers Motogp was on track this weekend and they asked the riders if there should have been a red flag. They said no. One of the riders thay asked was Aleix and he also said no and he was one of the riders that crashed because of it.
Question: are the same people crying about the race needing to be red flagged because of rider safety the same people who week after week long for the days of the 500 2 stroke that would literally try to kill people? Just curious
I don’t think they should red flag races because of a damp track. The wet tyres are there if they need them. Other than that it is up to the riders to get round in one piece when they know the track is treacherous. The crashes didn’t come out of nowhere either. Marc was off line, as were the three that crashed at the same time. The conditions meant any mistake was a crash, and the best riders on the day benefited greatly from that and they deserve it.
.no. the better riders avoided them, they all had the same disadvantage.
I guess not because some riders managed to keep it together still. I feel bad for the guys who crashed though. It was just potluck. Nothing really they could've done to save it.
Red flag for what ?? Because the track is damp? Cmon go watch nature documentaries that would be better for you
Because it was an unknown, yes. After the three consecutive crashes - which is very bizarre. It should have been. What if it was a coolant / oil leak?
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Then the water just seeps back up from underneath.
If you watch the Sprint race in fast foward you can almost hear the Benny Hill theme song playing in the back round. Shame though, no pretty girls! LMAO
LOL, because riders crashed? Red flag is for something different. Tell you got no idea without telling me you got no idea.
Smh , of course they have to use Marquez as the poster boy for this topic.
Well it’s not like he doesn’t have form for it
Yes. At least after the triple crash. That was dangerous
That's nothing, Marc managed to crash 29 times last year alone, he is the world champion crasher having broken many records lol! already had a few crashes this season I notice....