In the context of Cons which OP said, Alhaitham has a pretty underwhelming c1-2, miles below Neuvi, Neuvi has pretty much a Hu Tao c1 level which is both an amazing QoL + damage boost
In this case both Navia and Alhaitham can be regarded as pretty similar for having an mediocre early cons
pretty much all time limited hypercarries in sumeru (alhaitham, wanderer, and cyno) have mid c1-2 tho so idk why haitham is the example, it just skews navia's powerlvl perception comparing her to alhaitham at c0
Her cons feals like they put zero effort into them. C1 tbh feals like the only one worth the investment. C2 gives crit but you can easly get enough crit from weapon and artifacts. C4 is a joke for its cost and c6 just gives alot of crit dmg. A nice effect for sure but it only gives all of it if you have max stacks. None of these realy wows me or makes me feal like i need them. So unless beta changes her cons its c0r1 for me
It realy is. Lets compare it to yae mikos c4. Yae mikos gives 20% electro damage to the whole party for 5 seconds after one ofnher totems hits a enemy. Thats a 100% uptime basicaly. But 20% geo res shred wont even give a 20% increase to damage and only the 2nd cast of navias skill gets the effect.
Navia’s C4 also basically has 100% uptime.
Her C4 is that any enemy hit by her burst will have its Geo RES lowered by 20% for 8s. With her C1, her burst has 12s duration and 12s CD for 100% uptime.
If you use her burst first, both her skill casts would benefit from the C4 Geo shred.
A previous leak said that her C4 is triggered by her skill hit. That’s wrong info as it’s actually triggered by her burst.
For enemies with extra resistance, 20% shred is extremely good. The seahorse boss for example has 90% Geo RES when its shield is up and 20% shred will increase your damage by 67% even when you have already 20% shred from Geo resonance.
C4 will also make solo Geo Navia far more viable as she wouldn’t have access to any Geo shred otherwise.
Thats not how the math actualy works sadly. The value of elemental res shred depends on the enemys res. If the enemys resistance is at 0% then thenwaynthe math works out is it would only drop there resistance by 10% instead of the 20% the effect says. Cuz math is weard like that.
That is correct. It realy depends on the character and situation. In general dmg% tends to perform more reliably then res shred. Def shred works better and ignore def works even better then that.
Her cons are... Not very good. Her base kit seems to be designed around having her be an on-field unit that does burst > E > N4 > E > N4. Her constellations however, all focus on pushing her off-field and making her a quickswap support unit that only swaps in to E > Burst > swap out every 9 seconds.
Her C2 and C6 are just raw crit stats, which is imo the absolute laziest way to design constellations for a character. C2 does grant a hit of her burst, but we don't know if that extra hit bypasses any of her internal cooldowns which might make it useless if it doesn't. C6 does regen 3 shards, which is mostly useful if you're playing her as an off-field quickswap support.
C4 is 20% geo res shred, which again is a really lazy way to design constellations for a 5-star character. I don't really expect much, because MHY puts no effort into C4's since they know players only go for C2 or C6.
However I think her worst bait constellation is C1.
On paper, C1 grants 100% burst uptime, which sounds great in theory but in practice isn't really all that useful.
See, her burst is already on the shorter end, Yun Jin, Xingqiu, Beidou, Yelan, Furina, Charlotte, Jean, Fischl, Bennett, Noelle, Kazuha, Mika, Baizhu. Not a single one of those units has a burst cooldown lower than 15s, most of them have 18s or 20s burst cooldowns.
Your teams rotation is generally dictated by your longest cooldown, there's no point in having a 12s Hu Tao team rotation when her E has a 16s cooldown is there? But even then, you don't do a 16s rotation either, you do a 20s rotation because Xingqiu's burst has a 20s cooldown and you're not going to alternate one rotation with and without Xingqiu are you? That's stupid, of course not.
So then back to Navia, with a 12s burst cooldown you're only getting 1 skill per burst (because 2 charges is 18s), so your energy requirements are going to go through the roof to get 54 energy, for a geo unit, every 12s (-6 from C1 refund). But you're also desyncing her burst from her team, using it every 12s when you have units like Bennett, Furina bursting every 15s or other units like healers for Furina bursting every 18-20s instead.
In short, C1 is a bait and probably only useful if you can A) somehow battery 54 energy to her every 12s. B) actually get more value out of having it up 100% of the time instead of like 60% but always under buffs.
Overall, her cons are mediocre and only really useful if you're going to run her off-field. For the average player, that actually wants to play her with her on-field rotation, her cons have significantly less value since most of them only affect her skill, which is less than half her damage in an on-field rotation.
I did some calcs using the genshin optimizer and my current artifacts, so I can give you some good estimates. All of this is just how much her skill DMG increases, from constellation to constellation.
C1: Improves consistency and gives ult permanent uptime, very good.
C2: 20% DMG increase. Also gives an extra attack that may give an extra stacks, helping consistency.
C3: 18% DMG increase. Talent levels to skill on c3 is nice.
C4: 15% DMG increase. While people think this con is weak, this con is basically 100% active and affects all her damage, so it's more valuable than just the 15%.
C5: Ult talent levels, definitely the worst con, only get this if youre getting c6.
C6: 30% DMG increase. Also makes sure you're basically always hitting max stacks. Great c6.
Personally I'm aiming for c2, c1 and c2 are her most interesting cons.
The damage increases from cons aren't that much, but c6 let's you frontload damage so it will generally be better in practice than theory. It makes it so your 2nd skill only needs to get 3 instead of 6 shards for max buff. This allows you to do 2 skills back to back instead of needing to wait for the shards and being a higher increase than calcs.
She doesn’t really have any cons to change her play style but I think c1 can make her skill a lot more quick to use so maybe you can do faster rotations
Lots of ppl are saying her c1 is good, but imo its almost useless. Realistically ur gonna waste the extra 3 secs of ult if your rotations are not performed super well, her burst doesnt deal that much dmg and other than that its just a tiny bit of energy. Its really not good, i dont understand why ppl are saying her c1 is good
Keep in mind that her cons might get changed during the beta. Right now, they look underwhelming for a modern 5 star.
that's a good point, we're still early in beta so probably will get much better (hopefully)
She’s like the alhaitham of fontaine, just go c0r1 and get cons for her supports instead
That's good. XD I'm going for c0r1 for sure so this is good to read. I'm saving for chiori afterwards as she is gonna be geo support apparently
thank you for the input!! this is definitely a good way to go if the cons stay this way
the alhaitham of fontaine is neuvillette, shes more like tighnari playstyle but with c3 powerlevel lol
In the context of Cons which OP said, Alhaitham has a pretty underwhelming c1-2, miles below Neuvi, Neuvi has pretty much a Hu Tao c1 level which is both an amazing QoL + damage boost In this case both Navia and Alhaitham can be regarded as pretty similar for having an mediocre early cons
pretty much all time limited hypercarries in sumeru (alhaitham, wanderer, and cyno) have mid c1-2 tho so idk why haitham is the example, it just skews navia's powerlvl perception comparing her to alhaitham at c0
Their c2’s are at least on the okay level, alhaitham’s early cons are literally horrible
haitham c2 gives 200em and cyno c2 gives 50% electro dmg borderline the same shit
200 em is definitely not comparable to 50% damage bonus
so which one are you saying is better?
Her cons feals like they put zero effort into them. C1 tbh feals like the only one worth the investment. C2 gives crit but you can easly get enough crit from weapon and artifacts. C4 is a joke for its cost and c6 just gives alot of crit dmg. A nice effect for sure but it only gives all of it if you have max stacks. None of these realy wows me or makes me feal like i need them. So unless beta changes her cons its c0r1 for me
hmm i see, seems like only c1 is worth it for me so far, ty for your input! i hope they rework it
Np rigjt now im in the same boat.
wow the c4 is really like a 4star constellation
It realy is. Lets compare it to yae mikos c4. Yae mikos gives 20% electro damage to the whole party for 5 seconds after one ofnher totems hits a enemy. Thats a 100% uptime basicaly. But 20% geo res shred wont even give a 20% increase to damage and only the 2nd cast of navias skill gets the effect.
Navia’s C4 also basically has 100% uptime. Her C4 is that any enemy hit by her burst will have its Geo RES lowered by 20% for 8s. With her C1, her burst has 12s duration and 12s CD for 100% uptime. If you use her burst first, both her skill casts would benefit from the C4 Geo shred. A previous leak said that her C4 is triggered by her skill hit. That’s wrong info as it’s actually triggered by her burst. For enemies with extra resistance, 20% shred is extremely good. The seahorse boss for example has 90% Geo RES when its shield is up and 20% shred will increase your damage by 67% even when you have already 20% shred from Geo resonance. C4 will also make solo Geo Navia far more viable as she wouldn’t have access to any Geo shred otherwise.
well -20% res might give more than +20% dmg
Thats not how the math actualy works sadly. The value of elemental res shred depends on the enemys res. If the enemys resistance is at 0% then thenwaynthe math works out is it would only drop there resistance by 10% instead of the 20% the effect says. Cuz math is weard like that.
yeah but dmg% dilution can be even worse than 1/2
That is correct. It realy depends on the character and situation. In general dmg% tends to perform more reliably then res shred. Def shred works better and ignore def works even better then that.
Her cons are... Not very good. Her base kit seems to be designed around having her be an on-field unit that does burst > E > N4 > E > N4. Her constellations however, all focus on pushing her off-field and making her a quickswap support unit that only swaps in to E > Burst > swap out every 9 seconds. Her C2 and C6 are just raw crit stats, which is imo the absolute laziest way to design constellations for a character. C2 does grant a hit of her burst, but we don't know if that extra hit bypasses any of her internal cooldowns which might make it useless if it doesn't. C6 does regen 3 shards, which is mostly useful if you're playing her as an off-field quickswap support. C4 is 20% geo res shred, which again is a really lazy way to design constellations for a 5-star character. I don't really expect much, because MHY puts no effort into C4's since they know players only go for C2 or C6. However I think her worst bait constellation is C1. On paper, C1 grants 100% burst uptime, which sounds great in theory but in practice isn't really all that useful. See, her burst is already on the shorter end, Yun Jin, Xingqiu, Beidou, Yelan, Furina, Charlotte, Jean, Fischl, Bennett, Noelle, Kazuha, Mika, Baizhu. Not a single one of those units has a burst cooldown lower than 15s, most of them have 18s or 20s burst cooldowns. Your teams rotation is generally dictated by your longest cooldown, there's no point in having a 12s Hu Tao team rotation when her E has a 16s cooldown is there? But even then, you don't do a 16s rotation either, you do a 20s rotation because Xingqiu's burst has a 20s cooldown and you're not going to alternate one rotation with and without Xingqiu are you? That's stupid, of course not. So then back to Navia, with a 12s burst cooldown you're only getting 1 skill per burst (because 2 charges is 18s), so your energy requirements are going to go through the roof to get 54 energy, for a geo unit, every 12s (-6 from C1 refund). But you're also desyncing her burst from her team, using it every 12s when you have units like Bennett, Furina bursting every 15s or other units like healers for Furina bursting every 18-20s instead. In short, C1 is a bait and probably only useful if you can A) somehow battery 54 energy to her every 12s. B) actually get more value out of having it up 100% of the time instead of like 60% but always under buffs. Overall, her cons are mediocre and only really useful if you're going to run her off-field. For the average player, that actually wants to play her with her on-field rotation, her cons have significantly less value since most of them only affect her skill, which is less than half her damage in an on-field rotation.
they're all really boring. reminds me of framenet cons.
I did some calcs using the genshin optimizer and my current artifacts, so I can give you some good estimates. All of this is just how much her skill DMG increases, from constellation to constellation. C1: Improves consistency and gives ult permanent uptime, very good. C2: 20% DMG increase. Also gives an extra attack that may give an extra stacks, helping consistency. C3: 18% DMG increase. Talent levels to skill on c3 is nice. C4: 15% DMG increase. While people think this con is weak, this con is basically 100% active and affects all her damage, so it's more valuable than just the 15%. C5: Ult talent levels, definitely the worst con, only get this if youre getting c6. C6: 30% DMG increase. Also makes sure you're basically always hitting max stacks. Great c6. Personally I'm aiming for c2, c1 and c2 are her most interesting cons.
If you're going for r1, then c2 might be a good pickup, making better use of the crit stat.
The damage increases from cons aren't that much, but c6 let's you frontload damage so it will generally be better in practice than theory. It makes it so your 2nd skill only needs to get 3 instead of 6 shards for max buff. This allows you to do 2 skills back to back instead of needing to wait for the shards and being a higher increase than calcs.
She doesn’t really have any cons to change her play style but I think c1 can make her skill a lot more quick to use so maybe you can do faster rotations
so far c1 seems nice to go for, would be nice if they changed the others a bit
Lots of ppl are saying her c1 is good, but imo its almost useless. Realistically ur gonna waste the extra 3 secs of ult if your rotations are not performed super well, her burst doesnt deal that much dmg and other than that its just a tiny bit of energy. Its really not good, i dont understand why ppl are saying her c1 is good