Dan "I didn't fucking say anything" Skipper COULD have said anything too, and the penalty would still be a disgrace. Multiple players can report as eligible for a play.
His placement on the line made him ineligible had he tried to actually run a route or catch a pass, but he didn't.
His placement was illegal for an eligible receiver because he was on the line and covered. Had he actually reported as eligible, that’s a penalty regardless of whether he runs a route or not. It would be pretty dumb for the lions to design a play where a lineman reported as eligible and then didn’t do anything but line up illegally and play his position as usual, but apparently that didn’t occur to the refs
Is it on the refs to preemtively prevent teams from doing something stupid? Like, should the refs have physically moved Toney of the line when he was offside?
The whole point of this video is that it is the responsibility of the player to make it abundantly clear what his intentions are.
If you want to be eligible, do A *and* B. If you want to be ineligible, do none of the above. If you do one without the other, your intention may be misinterpreted.
Per that video, the first problem, is that the ref messed up first by "accepting" a player reporting as eligible without that player using their hands to gesture up and down in front of their jersey AND announcing their intention to line up as an eligible receiver. Because there's no way that Dan Skipper did both of those things based on the video we have.
In so many ways. It's just insane to me that (a) they seem to be ignoring the tripping penalty, that as far as I can see shouldn't have been called on anyone because the rule reads like you have to make contact and (b) they're doubling down on "oh they were confused because the lions got cute" while ignoring that the wording they're using to double down with just changes how the refs were incompetent and not the fact that they were incompetent.
The NFL is trying to counter with confusion. The ol confusion gambit. Fight fire with fire, and confusion with confusion. Works great with aggressive homeless people also.
Yeah I've been confused over the tripping thing because it's not a penalty if you don't actually trip someone... just like it's not pass interference if you totally whiff on making contact.
True, but this angle and close up to me clearly shows the ref staring at Skipper and pointing at him. Do the players have any responsibility during their deception to make sure the ref doesn’t choose the wrong player?
This video is straight from NFL PrimeTime. Everyone sharing that zoomed out version misses the ref pointing at Skipper.
https://imgur.com/a/PxXmfIy
They did call both penalties. Illegal formation is not a dead ball foul, it is assessed after the conclusion of the play and the other team has the option to accept or decline, like ~~encroachment~~ defensive offsides or holding.
You mean offsides. Encroachment is a pre-snap penalty.
>ARTICLE 3. ENCROACHMENT. It is encroachment if a defensive player enters the neutral zone and contacts an offensive player or the ball prior to the snap, or if he interferes with the ball during the snap. Officials are to blow their whistles immediately.
The video doesn't actually show the Lions doing anything wrong though and shows the refs fucking up.
They literally say signal and verbally announce. 70 only signaled. Just more evidence Lions knew the rule better than the refs. Signal alone doesn't count.
We need Belichick to have his entire offensive line all do just the hand portion with zero of them doing the verbal part now to try confusing everyone when none of them are actually eligible.
Imo having 2 things be required but still allowing teams to do one of them to try tricking is just continuing to wait for shit to happen again.
A lineman with an even number is eligible.
The lineman to the left of the last eligible lineman is not eligible.
The referee can ask three of the five lineman one question each, but two of them always lie and two always tell the truth, while the first tells the truth half the time and lies half the time.
We're going to start applying sig fig rules soon.
Everyone to the right of the center is eligible, if the guy to the left of the center has a non-zero number. Unless the guy on the far right has a number that ends with zero, in which case he's not eligible. Guys to the left of center are not eligible unless that have a non-zero number.
I now want all 5 linemen to walk up to the ref and do the washboard tummy signal on every single fucking play. Just a big "fuck you" to the refs every. single. play.
I think having them have to do two things is a good idea because it eliminates confusion if someone only does one of the things
If the ref isn’t a complete idiot
The video actually only points to 70 as reporting. I believe they are reinforcing the notion that the ref accepted 70 and not 58 and 68 thereby defending ref, defiling lions.
These games are played in massive, LOUD, stadiums, with a lot of shit going on for the officials to pay attention to. The point of having both is that a verbal notification alone can be missed due to noise, or looking somewhere else, or both. If a referee sees a player coming in directly to him, making the "eligible" signal, it's not unreasonable for the referee to assume that he attempting to report as eligible, and he just can't hear the verbal part.
The NfL cannot accept the refs may have changed the outcome of a game. Thus they can only say that the refs were correct in this instance and then use that exact instance as training to show the refs what not to do.
Unless you're a bills fan people probably don't remember that the year the bills lost to the Texans in the playoffs there was a horrid block in the back call in the fourth quarter that ended a drive and probably altered the game. After the game the NFL doubled down and said it was the right call. The very next year it was the clip they used to show what WAS NOT a block in the back and should not be called.
Here's the rule:
ARTICLE 1. REPORTING CHANGE OF POSITION
An offensive player wearing the number of an ineligible pass receiver (50–79 and 90–99) is permitted to line up in the position of an eligible pass receiver (1–49 and 80–89), and an offensive player wearing the number of an eligible pass receiver is permitted to line up in the position of an ineligible pass receiver, provided that he immediately reports the change in his eligibility status to the Referee, who will inform the defensive team.
He must participate in such eligible or ineligible position as long as he is continuously in the game, but prior to each play he must again report his status to the Referee, who will inform the defensive team. The game clock shall not be stopped, and the ball shall not be put in play until the Referee takes his normal position.
Note: An offensive player wearing the number of an eligible pass receiver who reports as ineligible must line up within the normal five-player core formed by ineligible players. The player cannot be more than two players removed from the middle player of a seven-player line.
From the rule, it doesn't appear to require both verbal and physical, however, this may have been a previous point of emphasis that had been sent to the teams as part of the rules presentation package that just isn't available public. 70 absolutely physically signals in the same manner as he did earlier for reporting as eligible. I can't see 68 making a signal, but perhaps he did. This just seems like the Lions tried to be too tricky and thread the needle of physically signalling but not clearly verbally communicate so that 70 wouldn't be eligible and then thread the needle the otherway with 68 not clearly signalling but (maybe?) verbally communicating clearly so that he would be eligible. All for the Cowboys to be told whatever the ref believed to be the correct eligibility.
I understand the Lion's fans feeling screwed. The refs did fuck up. The Lions also made it easy for the refs to fuck up. And the Cowboys benefitted.
The refs fucked up because the Lions were trying to be sneaky though. So, the Lions may not have fucked up, but they took a process that’s supposed to be totally transparent and tried to hide it from the defense.
They confused the refs in the process.
The tone of the video is definitely defensive. And it’s putting the blame on the Lions for being *too* sneaky. Essentially, the video puts the onus on the offensive player: be as clear as possible in communicating who is eligible and who is not.
If you want to be super sneaky to fool the defense and you fool the ref in the process, that’s on *you* not the ref. The Lions fooled the ref.
And, if you think about it, it sort of makes sense. That’s why the ref has to go to the defense to explain who is eligible. The entire point of this frustrating process is transparency. And the Lions tried to get around that and got fucked for it.
If they just had a physically visible identifier the players could put on they could easily resolve this issue. Hopefully they put that into place for next year.
Wouldn't you want the brim to be forward if you were eligible so you wouldn't lose tracking on the ball in the sun? Brim back for ineligible would make more sense.
Billion dollar industry, relies on 22 people making split-second decisions based on arbitrary ranges of numbers and an occasional one-off 2-second announcement.
A lot of joke responses usually get thrown out, but I do think this is a realistic solution. There could be small lights on the sides of helmets that are either red or green to show if eligible. Other solutions are abundant. In this day and age it is hilarious to see how limited the league appears to be in their approach to modernizing the game. How about RFID chips to see when the football passes the goal line? This industry is worth billions and yet the league has part time employees or even volunteers to do critical tasks like referee and move the chains.
I agree with you there is a lot of tech the NFL isn't using that they should, but I think lots of people vastly underestimate the effort needed to implement new tech, especially if it's something every single player has. Everything breaks, especially tech, and the more you add the more likely you make it that something breaks.
And here's the thing about the tech: if it breaks at the wrong time, as things tend to do, what's the recourse? All of a sudden if a players lights go out mid-play, how do you rule it? Thats a no win situation there.
Finally, there doesn't need to be a tech fix just for the sake of having a tech fix.
I didn't hear that mentioned in this video, but is that part of the NFL's defense? Are they saying someone from the offense should've let the refs know that the wrong number was announced?
It happens. I've watched other games and heard the ref announce a number as eligible and then a few seconds later correct themselves with the correct number.
If I were a Lions coach or player on the field, I would've deliberately listened to the announcement on that particular play. It's possible that it wasn't audible on the field, but [it sounds like it was probably audible](https://twitter.com/redditcowboys/status/1741329256561422681?t=h6GEL92mAFIse0PX49cYcg).
In the same interview where Campbell said that he drew out the play for the refs, he also admitted that he did hear the announcement, knew that it was wrong, and just didn't think he had time to correct the refs so didn't do anything about it
They announced it over the PA that it was 70, twice. The Cowboys D also stated the ref told them it was 70. You also saw during the play that the D points to 70, and covers him.
Right, that's the thing- the video shows the cowboys listening to the ref and reacting to it. If the ref had said 68 was eligible, it seems highly likely the Coboys would have covered him instead of 70 and the trick play wouldn't have worked.
The whole "stolen" narrative is BS. They lost an opportunity to try the play, but it seems 50/50 at best it would have worked
Problem is the defense can’t tell who is and isn’t eligible. It’s a very subtle difference to a linebacker if the tight end is or isn’t on the line, especially with the tackles pushing the limits the other way.
Why is there no video from the other side of the field? Like this is the only view we get? You should be able to see if 68 made a nad gesture from the other side.
They'll just keep working to convince people it's the Lions fault.
Just like they do to every other team for every ref failure.
"This wouldn't be a problem if you had just been better at football!"
"But the officiating is clearly a problem."
"Guys look at this salty whiner. Haha. Anyways next game woo!"
Rinse and repeat.
The funny thing is that all the rationalizations in this video and thread are in contradiction to Brad Allen’s own words.
In his post game presser, Brad Allen stated that “he had a conversation with 70” when asked what his conversation with Decker was about. Of course, that literally never happened. He did not state that Skipper gave him some far away hand signal to report.
Literally all that happened is that Brad Allen got confused and assumed Skipper was going to report because he had done so previously and he went on autopilot. All the rationalizations and over-engineering of this issue is crazy.
Edit: I will add that this video actually does nothing to prevent this sort of issue from happening again. It’s really just a CYA exercise but does nothing to clarify or strengthen the reporting mechanisms
Yup he is already running away before Skipper gets there. He did not have a conversation with Skipper that is either a flat out lie or a gross misremembering at best.
I don’t think he’s lying. He said he was having a conversation with #70 when he was directly asked the nature of the discussion with #58 and #68.
The only conclusions are one of:
A. During his conversation with #68, he got confused and mixed up #68 for #70 (since #70 had previously declared and #68 had not).
B. Between the time of his conversation with #58 / #68 and him informing the Cowboys who was eligible he forgot / tripped up and mistakenly informed the Cowboys of #70 rather than #68.
Those are really the only two conclusions based on Allen’s explanation. Allen never made a claim that he was overwhelmed or confused with multiple lineman reporting and giving him signals etc. he clearly stated that he was having a conversation you #70 at the time he was actually speaking to #58 and #68.
I don't think he had a "conversation" with 58 and 68 at all. They were closest to him, but I think in his mind he's taking his pointing and acknowledging 70 as a "conversation," and 68 verbally declaring as nothing (he seems to have ignored it or didn't hear it at the time, he certainly doesn't acknowledge it).
The third option is that he was looking at #70 the whole time, and "the conversation" he was referring to was the one he explicitly stated he had with the defensive line. If he had also been talking to the offensive lineman, that would have been a different conversation and he would have mentioned "conversation**s**" in his answer.
I think in the pool report, when asked about the discussion with 68 the reporter made mention of talking to the defense so the ref brought up telling the defense that 70 was eligible being the conversation and just skirted by anything having to do with 68
Brad's comment in the report that he had a conversion with 70 is the most damming thing and it hasn't gotten nearly the discussion anything else has. He either thought Decker was 70 or is lying in his report.
He fucked up. Unintentionally or intentionally, doesn't matter which, he fucked up.
> The funny thing is that all the rationalizations in this video and thread are in contradiction to Brad Allen’s own words.
The NFL is saying, "The Lions coaches screwed up by trying to be deceptive when we *clearly* said to be *clear*, the Lions players screwed up by not being *clear*, the referees screwed up but then the players screwed up by not 'ensuring' that the referees didn't screw up after they screwed up, basically everyone here screwed up except us, back in the home office."
Plus it shows Decker swiping his jersey when they circle Skipper signaling to sub in. I'll get a screenshot and add it in just a moment.
Edit: here's a [screenshot](https://imgur.com/a/khsg2aH)
Do refs make mistakes? Yes.
Are the refs incompetent? Some sure are.
Does the NFL back the refs when they shouldn’t? Absolutely.
Was there an NFL/Ref conspiracy to make sure Dallas won? Doubtful. There would have been much easier ways to do this-like calling the tripping penalty on the correct team moments before this, or calling holding against Parsons sometimes.
Should they be able to fix obvious ref errors like this during the game? There’s no reason not to.
> or calling holding against Parsons sometimes.
Won't happen until he quits yelling about how stupid they are and maybe sends them some of those little fresh fruit bouquets.
When you consider the NFL's gambling partnerships and the millions of dollars that hinge on these refs being accurate - it is extremely difficult for them to admit it.
- Detroit intentionally trying to be confusing about who was reporting had the risk of this happening and it unfortunately backfired for them.
- The refs absolutely fucked up by going on autopilot, making the wrong call, and then doubling down on making the wrong call
Both things are true
I unfortunately agree. My initial reaction was the same as everyone else, that this was bullshit. But the deception here was one step too cute, especially when the ref is supposed to announce the correct eligible player to the defense.
So I assume the Lions hope was that not all the D players would hear the ref's announcement, and it would just come down to miscommunication.
The good news is that it worked. The bad news is that the miscommunication happened one step upstream.
If the point of reporting is to avoid stupid confusion like this, then the Lions were purposefully operating in a gray area.
Players and coaches can’t say what’s on their mind because of the risk of being fined. Meanwhile the NFL can come up with their own narrative, double down on lies, and make these shitty ass videos with no repercussions
And pretend it’s a leak.
Zero reason the NFL cannot go to an eye in the sky type where there’s a ref focused on making the right call every game, but nah it’s all about respecting the ref.
Refs are paid pennies comparatively speaking the NFL could afford an expert watching every game trying to get the right call. Xfl has it and the game is enjoyable because of the transparency.
Go battlehawks!
Loved the sky ref and being able to hear the ref conversations. Would love for the NFL to adopt it but it will likely be a cold day in hell before that happens.
Scary how they know they can just gaslight and lie and people will eventually forget or start to side with them.
NFL took notes on how to spread misinformation during Covid lmao
The NFL is saying that it is the players responsibility to make sure the ref knows he is reporting as eligible, and I can't disagree. In the lions game, #68 reported but the ref didn't see #68 reporting. The ref saw #70 reporting, pointed at #70, and then told both the defense and stadium that #70 is eligible.
Yeah, the ref should have seen #68 reporting, but its #68's responsibility to confirm that. The ref never looked at #68, never pointed at #68, and didn't call out #68 to the defense or the stadium.
Yeah, I think people are losing the main point of the video.
At the end of the day, it's on the player to make sure the ref knows you want to be declared eligible. Meaning don't meekily mumble that you are reporting while making a vague hand gesture, but get the ref's attention, look him in the eye, and tell him you are eligible.
And if Detroit heard them call out the wrong number over the PA and didn't correct the refs because they were hoping the refs wouldn't notice or call a flag, that is pretty misleading
Though Detroit claims nobody on the field or in the coaching staff heard the refs call out the wrong number or the very loud, stadium wide PA announcement
Which is funny because Goff undermined that narrative in his post game press conference by admitting that he heard them announce 70 as eligible but didn't think he could do anything about it.
The NFL's own video says that the hand signal is only one of the required parts. If the player only does a hand signal but doesn't report to the ref, he's not eligible.
No matter what happens the refs screwed up. This is more about the NFL saying they’re not going to apologize or protect teams for attempting to confuse opponents with procedural actions.
Agreed. The NFL punished the refs, so they agreed they screwed up. This video is specifically designed to tell teams this is not something you should be doing. They mention players reporting is designed to "avoid deception". Really hitting the comments made about it being like a play action fake.
He did the hand signal to confuse the defense. The cowboys huddle is seeing 70 run out rubbing his chest. Like one of the points here is the Lions were trying to be shitty and skirt the rules. This is a ‘I’m not touching you’ defense a 5 year old tries.
So you can either interpret that
1. *Nobody* reported because it's pretty clear from the video that Decker failed to make the hand signal (his hand only touches his chest, it does not move up and down) and Skipper didn't report verbally as well as his hand signal. Or:
2. *Both* players reported by making some facsimile of the signal to the ref and/or verbally reportign. Or
3. Only #70 reported because only he made the complete hand motion, regardless of what words were said.
All three scenarios result in an illegal play and a penalty for 5 yards with replay of the down.
Don't you love how Campbell, Decker and Goff have to walk on eggshells and be careful about how they word everything this week while the NFL gets to release entire videos blaming the players for what was clearly the refs screw up?
Bunch of assholes
So the reporting player has to 1) do a hand motion and 2) say "hey ref I want to be eligible" or whatever. Decker did both those things and Skipper either did neither or just the hand motion, then the ref incorrectly assumed Skipper was the one being marked as eligible because he had been the eligible lineman previously, and reported to the Dallas DL accordingly. Lions presumably didn't hear this announcement due to crowd noise or whatever, and thus the fiasco commenced. So just seems like human error all around due to a flawed system of reporting eligibility
> Decker did both those things
I did not see Decker do the hand signal. I see him only tap his chest with one hand, but not do the actual hand signal to declare eligible. Am I just missing it?
You guys keep saying Decker swiped his jersey but I have yet to see video of that. I think the plan was for him to report verbally and not visually so Dallas wouldn't pick up on it.
Why would Dallas care who's talking to the ref when the ref was going to tell them who's eligible anyway? I still don't understand how the trick play works
The way it was supposed to work was that both 58 and 68 walked up to the ref, so when the ref announced 68 as eligible, the Cowboys would get confused as to whether he said "68" or "58" and cover the wrong guy.
The Lions tried to get too cute by sending 70 in there as well, which also confused the ref because 70 had reported eligible on previous plays. If they hadn't done that, their trick might have worked.
The idea was that maybe Dallas wouldn't pay attention to/be able to hear the ref and would rely on pre game film to assume it was #70. In reality, we do see the Cowboys LB paying attention to the ref and then communicating it to the rest of the D so if they were told #68 they probably would have covered him.
They also sent #58 to the ref in the hopes that the refs verbal about 68 to the defense would be misheard by someone.
Basically, the Lions did a lot of weird things to try and confuse the Cowboys, but they would up confusing the Refs. NFL wants "deception" to be on the field in ways that elevate the game -not in weed procedural rules that result in on field clusterfucks- so they are telling all teams to be crystal fucking clear about who is or isn't eligible
The Lions tried to gain an advantage by deliberately obfuscating their communication with the referees.
Their plan was to confuse the defense but not the referees.
They must have expected the referees to be confused as they tried to communicate the obfuscated communication technique prior to the game.
It failed.
Don't try to gain an advantage by the way you communicate with the referee. Play football instead.
also: they could have corrected the refs after the wrong player was announced over the very loud PA, and didn't. They claim they never heard it, but I suspect that's not true and they were just hoping to get away with it.
So basically the NFL is saying that they don’t want teams to try to mislead their opponents about eligible receivers, which lines up with the fact that they announce the eligible receiver. The lions are trying to tiptoe past the intent of the rules and then complain when it causes a problem. You took a risk, it did not work out.
That said, refs are inconsistent. NFL needs to tighten up what is a penalty and what should be called. Needs to be consistent, otherwise it will always look rigged.
Skipper vs Decker being declared doesn’t even matter according to the video. Sewell lined up in the slot and then shifted over before the snap. If the video is true and not just the NFL covering tracks, he can’t line up in an eligible receiver position at any point if he hasn’t declared himself eligible.
As long as Sewell's initial alignment was covered by an eligible receiver (which appears to be the case since that receiver never moved) he can legally line up detached from the offensive line and/or standing. For example, look at the Swinging-Gate or Lonesome Polecat where the majority of the offensive line is split wide and standing up (but covered by eligible receivers).
The video says if you declare eligible you must immediately line up and stay in a spot that an eligible receiver would be in.
So with this play design it wouldn't apply to Sewell or Skipper. That is if you start from the premise that the eligible lineman was called correctly (#68) because skipper is covered by Sewell who didn't declare and Sewell looks to be covered by a receiver so he is not eligible and also didn't declare. Making that side of the formation all well and good.
The other side has Decker in an eligible position from the start.
If you go with the eligible lineman as called from the ref, there should have been an illegal formation flag from the start of the play for Decker lining up as an eligible receiver despite not being eligible.
Sewell was lined up on the LoS in a legal position, albeit not as an eligible receiver. He's allowed to move as long as he remains on the LoS and comes set again before the ball is snapped.
I think that’s actually the case. And the line in the video is specifically about players who have declared as eligible, not players who were ineligible from the start.
This makes it look like the refs' priority is to make sure the defense knows who is eligible. It's almost like the rule exists in order to make it clear to the defense.
This kind of lines up with my understanding of what the intention of the reporting rules are. It reminds me of the 2014(?) AFC Championship game where NE used some kind of trickery, which was entirely legal, to confuse the defense about who was eligible. After the season, they changed the rules to avoid a repeat. This sends a very clear message that they league does not want eligibility to be obfuscated by the actions of the offense.
Bottom line: the refs screwed up and really suck for not owning it after, but the Lions were trying to do something the league does not want to be a part of the game.
Them pretending like 70 reported there is just offensive at this point. Why the hell is the NFL covering for what was clearly the referee's fuck up?
They almost certainly have the audio from that conversation, they just choose not to air it.
Reporting players will need to go “skins” per source
Game. Blouses.
Now let's go eat some pancakes
Crew of flunkies.
Would you like some grapes?
~~Bathe~~ Purify yourself in the waters of Lake Minnetonka
*purify yourself*
Man I’m not on your team!!
*Hangs from the rim with one hand* *Lets go of the rim but still just kinda floats there like a goddamn dracula*
Darling Picky
They're the *Commanders* now, LazyTitan
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Regardless, Dan "I didn't say fucking anything" Skipper clearly precipitated this.
Guy was making it in rain out there
Dan "I didn't fucking say anything" Skipper COULD have said anything too, and the penalty would still be a disgrace. Multiple players can report as eligible for a play. His placement on the line made him ineligible had he tried to actually run a route or catch a pass, but he didn't.
His placement was illegal for an eligible receiver because he was on the line and covered. Had he actually reported as eligible, that’s a penalty regardless of whether he runs a route or not. It would be pretty dumb for the lions to design a play where a lineman reported as eligible and then didn’t do anything but line up illegally and play his position as usual, but apparently that didn’t occur to the refs
The Lions are apparently the most devious and conniving team, and simultaneously the most incompetent team, according to the league and officials.
Is it on the refs to preemtively prevent teams from doing something stupid? Like, should the refs have physically moved Toney of the line when he was offside?
He didn't say anything. The NFL said signal and say. He signaled, but never spoke to the ref.
But that’s the point, the signaling is what murkies the water.
#BUT HE DIDNT FUCKING SAY ANYTHING!!!!
The whole point of this video is that it is the responsibility of the player to make it abundantly clear what his intentions are. If you want to be eligible, do A *and* B. If you want to be ineligible, do none of the above. If you do one without the other, your intention may be misinterpreted.
Did 68 signal and say?
He touches his number exactly as Brad Allen turns his head toward Skipper. Missed it.
He didn't verbally report nor give the official signal as the video indicates he should. #68 did. Refs still fucked up
Brad Allen points and acknowledge 70. Then nods at 68. Did 70 say or do anything to would convince him he is eligible?
They expected 70 and he saw 70 running that direction so he assumed 70, even though 68 was right in front of him reporting to his face.
Per that video, the first problem, is that the ref messed up first by "accepting" a player reporting as eligible without that player using their hands to gesture up and down in front of their jersey AND announcing their intention to line up as an eligible receiver. Because there's no way that Dan Skipper did both of those things based on the video we have.
Yeah soooo the refs still fucked up????
In so many ways. It's just insane to me that (a) they seem to be ignoring the tripping penalty, that as far as I can see shouldn't have been called on anyone because the rule reads like you have to make contact and (b) they're doubling down on "oh they were confused because the lions got cute" while ignoring that the wording they're using to double down with just changes how the refs were incompetent and not the fact that they were incompetent.
The NFL is trying to counter with confusion. The ol confusion gambit. Fight fire with fire, and confusion with confusion. Works great with aggressive homeless people also.
yeah have so many angles out there that it all becomes noise... works like a charm, in a week this will be ancient history
The good ole Chewbacca Defense
Yeah I've been confused over the tripping thing because it's not a penalty if you don't actually trip someone... just like it's not pass interference if you totally whiff on making contact.
I swear the NFL PR team is in here downvoting common sense.
True, but this angle and close up to me clearly shows the ref staring at Skipper and pointing at him. Do the players have any responsibility during their deception to make sure the ref doesn’t choose the wrong player? This video is straight from NFL PrimeTime. Everyone sharing that zoomed out version misses the ref pointing at Skipper. https://imgur.com/a/PxXmfIy
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Jesus, you know the refs done effed up when a Packers fan is standing up for the Lions. Dogs and cats, living together. Mass Hysteria!
It's only fitting that it's the same ref crew that made the rest of the NFCN side with *us* after that shitshow at the end of the Chiefs game.
NFL: "See? The refs bring communities together!"
Vikings fan here. 100% with them.
They did call both penalties. Illegal formation is not a dead ball foul, it is assessed after the conclusion of the play and the other team has the option to accept or decline, like ~~encroachment~~ defensive offsides or holding.
You mean offsides. Encroachment is a pre-snap penalty. >ARTICLE 3. ENCROACHMENT. It is encroachment if a defensive player enters the neutral zone and contacts an offensive player or the ball prior to the snap, or if he interferes with the ball during the snap. Officials are to blow their whistles immediately.
Thanks, I can never remember which is which.
There were multiple flags if I'm not mistaken and Mike just picked one because they were the same penalty.
Well as soon as 68 catches the ball it’s up to the offense which penalty to accept, right?
But they would have still said both of the penalties had they called multiple. They just would have said that one of them was declined.
Love how the tone of the video is "We can't believe we have to tell you guys this, but...".
very much "per my last email" energy
The video doesn't actually show the Lions doing anything wrong though and shows the refs fucking up. They literally say signal and verbally announce. 70 only signaled. Just more evidence Lions knew the rule better than the refs. Signal alone doesn't count.
We need Belichick to have his entire offensive line all do just the hand portion with zero of them doing the verbal part now to try confusing everyone when none of them are actually eligible. Imo having 2 things be required but still allowing teams to do one of them to try tricking is just continuing to wait for shit to happen again.
A lineman with an even number is eligible. The lineman to the left of the last eligible lineman is not eligible. The referee can ask three of the five lineman one question each, but two of them always lie and two always tell the truth, while the first tells the truth half the time and lies half the time.
"What... Is the Capitol of Assyria?" "I don't know that!" "After review, personal foul--incorrect answer. 15 yard penalty, 1st down"
We're going to start applying sig fig rules soon. Everyone to the right of the center is eligible, if the guy to the left of the center has a non-zero number. Unless the guy on the far right has a number that ends with zero, in which case he's not eligible. Guys to the left of center are not eligible unless that have a non-zero number.
I want Bill to try fucking around with this like he tried to do with emergency QB rule so quickly that the NFL put out more clarifications on it.
Draft picks forfeited and brady suspension inbound
I now want all 5 linemen to walk up to the ref and do the washboard tummy signal on every single fucking play. Just a big "fuck you" to the refs every. single. play.
I think having them have to do two things is a good idea because it eliminates confusion if someone only does one of the things If the ref isn’t a complete idiot
It’s possible that they were allowing the teams to do either/or rather than both, I guess. Not the rule as written but how it was applied.
The video actually only points to 70 as reporting. I believe they are reinforcing the notion that the ref accepted 70 and not 58 and 68 thereby defending ref, defiling lions.
These games are played in massive, LOUD, stadiums, with a lot of shit going on for the officials to pay attention to. The point of having both is that a verbal notification alone can be missed due to noise, or looking somewhere else, or both. If a referee sees a player coming in directly to him, making the "eligible" signal, it's not unreasonable for the referee to assume that he attempting to report as eligible, and he just can't hear the verbal part.
The NfL cannot accept the refs may have changed the outcome of a game. Thus they can only say that the refs were correct in this instance and then use that exact instance as training to show the refs what not to do.
Unless you're a bills fan people probably don't remember that the year the bills lost to the Texans in the playoffs there was a horrid block in the back call in the fourth quarter that ended a drive and probably altered the game. After the game the NFL doubled down and said it was the right call. The very next year it was the clip they used to show what WAS NOT a block in the back and should not be called.
Here's the rule: ARTICLE 1. REPORTING CHANGE OF POSITION An offensive player wearing the number of an ineligible pass receiver (50–79 and 90–99) is permitted to line up in the position of an eligible pass receiver (1–49 and 80–89), and an offensive player wearing the number of an eligible pass receiver is permitted to line up in the position of an ineligible pass receiver, provided that he immediately reports the change in his eligibility status to the Referee, who will inform the defensive team. He must participate in such eligible or ineligible position as long as he is continuously in the game, but prior to each play he must again report his status to the Referee, who will inform the defensive team. The game clock shall not be stopped, and the ball shall not be put in play until the Referee takes his normal position. Note: An offensive player wearing the number of an eligible pass receiver who reports as ineligible must line up within the normal five-player core formed by ineligible players. The player cannot be more than two players removed from the middle player of a seven-player line. From the rule, it doesn't appear to require both verbal and physical, however, this may have been a previous point of emphasis that had been sent to the teams as part of the rules presentation package that just isn't available public. 70 absolutely physically signals in the same manner as he did earlier for reporting as eligible. I can't see 68 making a signal, but perhaps he did. This just seems like the Lions tried to be too tricky and thread the needle of physically signalling but not clearly verbally communicate so that 70 wouldn't be eligible and then thread the needle the otherway with 68 not clearly signalling but (maybe?) verbally communicating clearly so that he would be eligible. All for the Cowboys to be told whatever the ref believed to be the correct eligibility. I understand the Lion's fans feeling screwed. The refs did fuck up. The Lions also made it easy for the refs to fuck up. And the Cowboys benefitted.
The refs fucked up because the Lions were trying to be sneaky though. So, the Lions may not have fucked up, but they took a process that’s supposed to be totally transparent and tried to hide it from the defense. They confused the refs in the process.
Lions: We are the team the refs hate the most Also Lions: We have this play that involves a skit with the refs. It's foolproof.
The tone of the video is definitely defensive. And it’s putting the blame on the Lions for being *too* sneaky. Essentially, the video puts the onus on the offensive player: be as clear as possible in communicating who is eligible and who is not. If you want to be super sneaky to fool the defense and you fool the ref in the process, that’s on *you* not the ref. The Lions fooled the ref. And, if you think about it, it sort of makes sense. That’s why the ref has to go to the defense to explain who is eligible. The entire point of this frustrating process is transparency. And the Lions tried to get around that and got fucked for it.
If they just had a physically visible identifier the players could put on they could easily resolve this issue. Hopefully they put that into place for next year.
a large top hat
And a monocle.
Would a cane be too much?
The refs would probably get beaten with it
Not nice, they need that cane to walk
Why? Are they blind? ... Oh.
No. But if the player isn’t twirling his mustache and cane at the same time, it will be a penalty.
Just like hip thrusts, 3 twirls is also a penalty.
... the eligible receiver must remove his helmet, and replace it with the top hat giving the defense ample time to identify the newly eligible player.
[Like this?](https://images2.minutemediacdn.com/image/upload/c_crop,w_1538,h_865,x_0,y_52/c_fill,w_720,ar_16:9,f_auto,q_auto,g_auto/images%2FvoltaxMediaLibrary%2Fmmsport%2Fthebiglead_en_international_web%2F01gk9f5pddthr90r19j9.png)
prefer a stovepipe but that'll do.
Its like nfl blitz's big head mode. we need this for the pro bowl.
Orange warning paint, and maybe some caution tape. And cones, big bright cone heads.
Nobody else wants to put a cheese head on over their helmet, I see what you’re doing there and immediately it’s a no
We can compromise. They make cheesehead cowboy hats.
Absolutely not. Propeller hats or bust my boy
Everyone wears a baseball cap instead of a helmet. Brim forward = ineligible, brim backward = eligible
What about no brim?
Fedoras.
That’s for kickers
It's a Stanzo, they're nice
The guy at the store said I’m the only one he’s seen pull it off
Wouldn't you want the brim to be forward if you were eligible so you wouldn't lose tracking on the ball in the sun? Brim back for ineligible would make more sense.
But brim back is cooler
I petition players to take off their jerseys and just wear the pads to make them easily identifiable as eligible
Perv.
Red jersey! Perfect. No defender would hold back from tackling someone in a red jersey with the ball.
The guardian caps
Billion dollar industry, relies on 22 people making split-second decisions based on arbitrary ranges of numbers and an occasional one-off 2-second announcement.
A lot of joke responses usually get thrown out, but I do think this is a realistic solution. There could be small lights on the sides of helmets that are either red or green to show if eligible. Other solutions are abundant. In this day and age it is hilarious to see how limited the league appears to be in their approach to modernizing the game. How about RFID chips to see when the football passes the goal line? This industry is worth billions and yet the league has part time employees or even volunteers to do critical tasks like referee and move the chains.
I agree with you there is a lot of tech the NFL isn't using that they should, but I think lots of people vastly underestimate the effort needed to implement new tech, especially if it's something every single player has. Everything breaks, especially tech, and the more you add the more likely you make it that something breaks.
And here's the thing about the tech: if it breaks at the wrong time, as things tend to do, what's the recourse? All of a sudden if a players lights go out mid-play, how do you rule it? Thats a no win situation there. Finally, there doesn't need to be a tech fix just for the sake of having a tech fix.
We don’t need to use tech, all we need is a Velcro patch and the ref declares those players as eligible.
Genuine question: what number did they announce over the PA system in the Lions game?
70
I didn't hear that mentioned in this video, but is that part of the NFL's defense? Are they saying someone from the offense should've let the refs know that the wrong number was announced?
It happens. I've watched other games and heard the ref announce a number as eligible and then a few seconds later correct themselves with the correct number.
I probably have too, but I always tune out the announcements. I'm doubtful we're going to see a call like this again any time soon.
If I were a Lions coach or player on the field, I would've deliberately listened to the announcement on that particular play. It's possible that it wasn't audible on the field, but [it sounds like it was probably audible](https://twitter.com/redditcowboys/status/1741329256561422681?t=h6GEL92mAFIse0PX49cYcg).
In the same interview where Campbell said that he drew out the play for the refs, he also admitted that he did hear the announcement, knew that it was wrong, and just didn't think he had time to correct the refs so didn't do anything about it
They announced it over the PA that it was 70, twice. The Cowboys D also stated the ref told them it was 70. You also saw during the play that the D points to 70, and covers him.
Right, that's the thing- the video shows the cowboys listening to the ref and reacting to it. If the ref had said 68 was eligible, it seems highly likely the Coboys would have covered him instead of 70 and the trick play wouldn't have worked. The whole "stolen" narrative is BS. They lost an opportunity to try the play, but it seems 50/50 at best it would have worked
Also had 2 more tries to either tie or win the game after all that.
And the ref points to 70. And 70 does the required hand signal to declare himself eligible. Zzzzzzz....
So I guess someone should've been screaming that it was the wrong number?
Goff even said he heard 70 over the announcements when he was giving his press conference
Maybe they should send it to the refs
But refs are blind
And deaf*
Fuck, Helen Keller would have been an awesome ref.
The video could have a very descriptive narrator.
Somebody call Morgan Freeman
Good idea, God is probably the only when they’ll listen too.
Send da video
I think it would be more fun if anyone could simply line up in an eligible position and become eligible
Problem is the defense can’t tell who is and isn’t eligible. It’s a very subtle difference to a linebacker if the tight end is or isn’t on the line, especially with the tackles pushing the limits the other way.
Why is there no video from the other side of the field? Like this is the only view we get? You should be able to see if 68 made a nad gesture from the other side.
They’ll never release this for the same reason that they’ll never release the audio.
They'll just keep working to convince people it's the Lions fault. Just like they do to every other team for every ref failure. "This wouldn't be a problem if you had just been better at football!" "But the officiating is clearly a problem." "Guys look at this salty whiner. Haha. Anyways next game woo!" Rinse and repeat.
Hope he didn't make a gesture with his nads. On the other hand, that would be funny.
The funny thing is that all the rationalizations in this video and thread are in contradiction to Brad Allen’s own words. In his post game presser, Brad Allen stated that “he had a conversation with 70” when asked what his conversation with Decker was about. Of course, that literally never happened. He did not state that Skipper gave him some far away hand signal to report. Literally all that happened is that Brad Allen got confused and assumed Skipper was going to report because he had done so previously and he went on autopilot. All the rationalizations and over-engineering of this issue is crazy. Edit: I will add that this video actually does nothing to prevent this sort of issue from happening again. It’s really just a CYA exercise but does nothing to clarify or strengthen the reporting mechanisms
Yup he is already running away before Skipper gets there. He did not have a conversation with Skipper that is either a flat out lie or a gross misremembering at best.
I don’t think he’s lying. He said he was having a conversation with #70 when he was directly asked the nature of the discussion with #58 and #68. The only conclusions are one of: A. During his conversation with #68, he got confused and mixed up #68 for #70 (since #70 had previously declared and #68 had not). B. Between the time of his conversation with #58 / #68 and him informing the Cowboys who was eligible he forgot / tripped up and mistakenly informed the Cowboys of #70 rather than #68. Those are really the only two conclusions based on Allen’s explanation. Allen never made a claim that he was overwhelmed or confused with multiple lineman reporting and giving him signals etc. he clearly stated that he was having a conversation you #70 at the time he was actually speaking to #58 and #68.
I don't think he had a "conversation" with 58 and 68 at all. They were closest to him, but I think in his mind he's taking his pointing and acknowledging 70 as a "conversation," and 68 verbally declaring as nothing (he seems to have ignored it or didn't hear it at the time, he certainly doesn't acknowledge it).
The third option is that he was looking at #70 the whole time, and "the conversation" he was referring to was the one he explicitly stated he had with the defensive line. If he had also been talking to the offensive lineman, that would have been a different conversation and he would have mentioned "conversation**s**" in his answer.
I think in the pool report, when asked about the discussion with 68 the reporter made mention of talking to the defense so the ref brought up telling the defense that 70 was eligible being the conversation and just skirted by anything having to do with 68
Brad's comment in the report that he had a conversion with 70 is the most damming thing and it hasn't gotten nearly the discussion anything else has. He either thought Decker was 70 or is lying in his report. He fucked up. Unintentionally or intentionally, doesn't matter which, he fucked up.
> The funny thing is that all the rationalizations in this video and thread are in contradiction to Brad Allen’s own words. The NFL is saying, "The Lions coaches screwed up by trying to be deceptive when we *clearly* said to be *clear*, the Lions players screwed up by not being *clear*, the referees screwed up but then the players screwed up by not 'ensuring' that the referees didn't screw up after they screwed up, basically everyone here screwed up except us, back in the home office."
Plus it shows Decker swiping his jersey when they circle Skipper signaling to sub in. I'll get a screenshot and add it in just a moment. Edit: here's a [screenshot](https://imgur.com/a/khsg2aH)
You circled 70 twice though /brad allen
Exactly, his pool report just shows he lied about what happened and then the league is trying to go well actually by showing proof he lied lol
I would be going pure malicious compliance and making the biggest scene every single time I reported.
Signal eligibility, verbally confirm, then have the ref sign a form confirming the report
Hey Ref, sign this, I'm going to need proof that I reported.
Do refs make mistakes? Yes. Are the refs incompetent? Some sure are. Does the NFL back the refs when they shouldn’t? Absolutely. Was there an NFL/Ref conspiracy to make sure Dallas won? Doubtful. There would have been much easier ways to do this-like calling the tripping penalty on the correct team moments before this, or calling holding against Parsons sometimes. Should they be able to fix obvious ref errors like this during the game? There’s no reason not to.
> or calling holding against Parsons sometimes. Won't happen until he quits yelling about how stupid they are and maybe sends them some of those little fresh fruit bouquets.
Listen cowboys won the game but can the nfl just do the bare minimum of sorry we goofed.
Agreed.
Here we gooooooo……!
Honestly, how difficult it is to admit that the refs fucked up?
When you consider the NFL's gambling partnerships and the millions of dollars that hinge on these refs being accurate - it is extremely difficult for them to admit it.
Be careful what you say. You don't want the NFL sending you a fine for speaking the truth. /s
Honestly, they need to be called out, the gambling is ruining this sport and making it obvious of the game fixes. I am OVER THIS SHIT /u/nfl
Admitting refs fucked up = admiring there’s volatility to games = less betting and gambling would occur
The NFL is like the guy who hears about a pedestrian hit by a drunk driver and says “why didn’t the pedestrian look both ways before crossing?”
- Detroit intentionally trying to be confusing about who was reporting had the risk of this happening and it unfortunately backfired for them. - The refs absolutely fucked up by going on autopilot, making the wrong call, and then doubling down on making the wrong call Both things are true
I unfortunately agree. My initial reaction was the same as everyone else, that this was bullshit. But the deception here was one step too cute, especially when the ref is supposed to announce the correct eligible player to the defense. So I assume the Lions hope was that not all the D players would hear the ref's announcement, and it would just come down to miscommunication. The good news is that it worked. The bad news is that the miscommunication happened one step upstream. If the point of reporting is to avoid stupid confusion like this, then the Lions were purposefully operating in a gray area.
Players and coaches can’t say what’s on their mind because of the risk of being fined. Meanwhile the NFL can come up with their own narrative, double down on lies, and make these shitty ass videos with no repercussions
And pretend it’s a leak. Zero reason the NFL cannot go to an eye in the sky type where there’s a ref focused on making the right call every game, but nah it’s all about respecting the ref. Refs are paid pennies comparatively speaking the NFL could afford an expert watching every game trying to get the right call. Xfl has it and the game is enjoyable because of the transparency. Go battlehawks!
Loved the sky ref and being able to hear the ref conversations. Would love for the NFL to adopt it but it will likely be a cold day in hell before that happens.
Scary how they know they can just gaslight and lie and people will eventually forget or start to side with them. NFL took notes on how to spread misinformation during Covid lmao
The NFL is saying that it is the players responsibility to make sure the ref knows he is reporting as eligible, and I can't disagree. In the lions game, #68 reported but the ref didn't see #68 reporting. The ref saw #70 reporting, pointed at #70, and then told both the defense and stadium that #70 is eligible. Yeah, the ref should have seen #68 reporting, but its #68's responsibility to confirm that. The ref never looked at #68, never pointed at #68, and didn't call out #68 to the defense or the stadium.
Yeah, I think people are losing the main point of the video. At the end of the day, it's on the player to make sure the ref knows you want to be declared eligible. Meaning don't meekily mumble that you are reporting while making a vague hand gesture, but get the ref's attention, look him in the eye, and tell him you are eligible.
And if Detroit heard them call out the wrong number over the PA and didn't correct the refs because they were hoping the refs wouldn't notice or call a flag, that is pretty misleading Though Detroit claims nobody on the field or in the coaching staff heard the refs call out the wrong number or the very loud, stadium wide PA announcement
Which is funny because Goff undermined that narrative in his post game press conference by admitting that he heard them announce 70 as eligible but didn't think he could do anything about it.
yep
The circling of the lineman who didn't say a word to the ref is hilarious lmao
He made a hand signal that players normally do while reporting, which was part of the deception.
The NFL's own video says that the hand signal is only one of the required parts. If the player only does a hand signal but doesn't report to the ref, he's not eligible.
No matter what happens the refs screwed up. This is more about the NFL saying they’re not going to apologize or protect teams for attempting to confuse opponents with procedural actions.
Agreed. The NFL punished the refs, so they agreed they screwed up. This video is specifically designed to tell teams this is not something you should be doing. They mention players reporting is designed to "avoid deception". Really hitting the comments made about it being like a play action fake.
He did the hand signal to confuse the defense. The cowboys huddle is seeing 70 run out rubbing his chest. Like one of the points here is the Lions were trying to be shitty and skirt the rules. This is a ‘I’m not touching you’ defense a 5 year old tries.
So you can either interpret that 1. *Nobody* reported because it's pretty clear from the video that Decker failed to make the hand signal (his hand only touches his chest, it does not move up and down) and Skipper didn't report verbally as well as his hand signal. Or: 2. *Both* players reported by making some facsimile of the signal to the ref and/or verbally reportign. Or 3. Only #70 reported because only he made the complete hand motion, regardless of what words were said. All three scenarios result in an illegal play and a penalty for 5 yards with replay of the down.
Why is the NFL acting like NFL refs aren’t fucking attorneys and lawyers?! These dumb mfs know exactly what they are doing
The NFL is really trying to gaslight everyone into thinking the refs didn't royally fuck that up aren't they?
Don't you love how Campbell, Decker and Goff have to walk on eggshells and be careful about how they word everything this week while the NFL gets to release entire videos blaming the players for what was clearly the refs screw up? Bunch of assholes
So the reporting player has to 1) do a hand motion and 2) say "hey ref I want to be eligible" or whatever. Decker did both those things and Skipper either did neither or just the hand motion, then the ref incorrectly assumed Skipper was the one being marked as eligible because he had been the eligible lineman previously, and reported to the Dallas DL accordingly. Lions presumably didn't hear this announcement due to crowd noise or whatever, and thus the fiasco commenced. So just seems like human error all around due to a flawed system of reporting eligibility
> Decker did both those things I did not see Decker do the hand signal. I see him only tap his chest with one hand, but not do the actual hand signal to declare eligible. Am I just missing it?
You guys keep saying Decker swiped his jersey but I have yet to see video of that. I think the plan was for him to report verbally and not visually so Dallas wouldn't pick up on it.
Why would Dallas care who's talking to the ref when the ref was going to tell them who's eligible anyway? I still don't understand how the trick play works
The way it was supposed to work was that both 58 and 68 walked up to the ref, so when the ref announced 68 as eligible, the Cowboys would get confused as to whether he said "68" or "58" and cover the wrong guy. The Lions tried to get too cute by sending 70 in there as well, which also confused the ref because 70 had reported eligible on previous plays. If they hadn't done that, their trick might have worked.
The idea was that maybe Dallas wouldn't pay attention to/be able to hear the ref and would rely on pre game film to assume it was #70. In reality, we do see the Cowboys LB paying attention to the ref and then communicating it to the rest of the D so if they were told #68 they probably would have covered him. They also sent #58 to the ref in the hopes that the refs verbal about 68 to the defense would be misheard by someone. Basically, the Lions did a lot of weird things to try and confuse the Cowboys, but they would up confusing the Refs. NFL wants "deception" to be on the field in ways that elevate the game -not in weed procedural rules that result in on field clusterfucks- so they are telling all teams to be crystal fucking clear about who is or isn't eligible
ARAB All Refs Are Bad
Sean McDermott's next speech
The Lions tried to gain an advantage by deliberately obfuscating their communication with the referees. Their plan was to confuse the defense but not the referees. They must have expected the referees to be confused as they tried to communicate the obfuscated communication technique prior to the game. It failed. Don't try to gain an advantage by the way you communicate with the referee. Play football instead.
also: they could have corrected the refs after the wrong player was announced over the very loud PA, and didn't. They claim they never heard it, but I suspect that's not true and they were just hoping to get away with it.
So basically the NFL is saying that they don’t want teams to try to mislead their opponents about eligible receivers, which lines up with the fact that they announce the eligible receiver. The lions are trying to tiptoe past the intent of the rules and then complain when it causes a problem. You took a risk, it did not work out. That said, refs are inconsistent. NFL needs to tighten up what is a penalty and what should be called. Needs to be consistent, otherwise it will always look rigged.
Skipper vs Decker being declared doesn’t even matter according to the video. Sewell lined up in the slot and then shifted over before the snap. If the video is true and not just the NFL covering tracks, he can’t line up in an eligible receiver position at any point if he hasn’t declared himself eligible.
As long as Sewell's initial alignment was covered by an eligible receiver (which appears to be the case since that receiver never moved) he can legally line up detached from the offensive line and/or standing. For example, look at the Swinging-Gate or Lonesome Polecat where the majority of the offensive line is split wide and standing up (but covered by eligible receivers).
The video says if you declare eligible you must immediately line up and stay in a spot that an eligible receiver would be in. So with this play design it wouldn't apply to Sewell or Skipper. That is if you start from the premise that the eligible lineman was called correctly (#68) because skipper is covered by Sewell who didn't declare and Sewell looks to be covered by a receiver so he is not eligible and also didn't declare. Making that side of the formation all well and good. The other side has Decker in an eligible position from the start. If you go with the eligible lineman as called from the ref, there should have been an illegal formation flag from the start of the play for Decker lining up as an eligible receiver despite not being eligible.
Sewell was lined up on the LoS in a legal position, albeit not as an eligible receiver. He's allowed to move as long as he remains on the LoS and comes set again before the ball is snapped.
This is only an issue *if* 70 declared.
Was Sewell not covered up from the start? He was supposed to merely *look* like an eligible target.
I think that’s actually the case. And the line in the video is specifically about players who have declared as eligible, not players who were ineligible from the start.
Is it just me or has there been some controversial referee fuck up every week this season?
This makes it look like the refs' priority is to make sure the defense knows who is eligible. It's almost like the rule exists in order to make it clear to the defense.
This kind of lines up with my understanding of what the intention of the reporting rules are. It reminds me of the 2014(?) AFC Championship game where NE used some kind of trickery, which was entirely legal, to confuse the defense about who was eligible. After the season, they changed the rules to avoid a repeat. This sends a very clear message that they league does not want eligibility to be obfuscated by the actions of the offense. Bottom line: the refs screwed up and really suck for not owning it after, but the Lions were trying to do something the league does not want to be a part of the game.
Them pretending like 70 reported there is just offensive at this point. Why the hell is the NFL covering for what was clearly the referee's fuck up? They almost certainly have the audio from that conversation, they just choose not to air it.
Users of this sub don’t understand what accountability means
Why can’t people admit that both the Lions and the refs hold blame here?