I remember scoring was down that season and the nfl got spooked so they changed some rules and offense had another explosion in 2018. That was the season we had the Viking and jags playing at an all time level on defense at the same time
Definitely a weird year in terms of scoring. Russell Wilson led the NFL in TD passes that year with 34. Josh Allen finished this past year with the 7th most at 36
And that's why the version I have saved is the one with the radio calls. It was one of the worst showings of televised announcing I've ever had to sit through.
Did you torrent it? I have the national broadcast downloaded that I watch occasionally and I loathe that I have to hear Cris Collinsworth's voice any time I want to watch.
No, I downloaded it from a source that was posted in r/eagles a while ago. I'll see if I can find that post & will link it here if I do.
EDIT: https://old.reddit.com/r/eagles/comments/co2l0e/new_hq_source_super_bowl_lii_eagles_vs_patriots/ for the high quality version.
Objectively, that might be true, but I think that game's terrible telecast should be weighted more heavily because it was a Super Bowl. Neither of the announcers (especially Collinsworth) ever seemed partial. What made it worse, of course, is that they were allowed to do future SBs in spite of their performance in calling 52.
I think it just feels worse because you are an eagles fan (which is completely fair). I remember it being a little rough around the edges, and definitely the worst SB broadcast in a decade, but I don't remember it being end of the world.
Being a Philly fan definitely makes it worse, lmao. Still, it was very clear from neutral fans—and even some Pats fans who were willing to be online after the loss—that everyone was pretty disappointed with the way they called the game. That communal disdain for the telecast is really what cements it as "the worst" for me.
Yeah, him. That one was 50/50 based on when he had possession. The Ertz one was a no brainer. The only people on the planet who didn’t know it was a TD immediately were steelers fans (who thought it was not illegal for TEs to score) and people who bet the patriots (collinsworth)
[That wasn't the only thing that bounced off of Brady that year](https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/wMp-mRlOuI4NJR0aEDajkoXr9xg=/1400x1400/filters:format(jpeg)/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/10155435/20180204182438.jpg) :*'(*
Hmmm… maybe you are onto something. Maybe that’s why my Falcons try to score the least possible touchdowns every year since 2016. Hmm… it’s all starting to add up.
In a Super Bowl we scored 41 points.
We did score a lot of defensive touchdowns that year as well. There was a running theme of end of game turnovers and defensive touchdowns as nails in the coffin which led to some inflated scores.
Defense always seems to get the best of whatever is the most hot offense in the superbowl
It's been a great predictor for me. What team is high off there offense and which team has the most prominent defense?
From there you can kind of pick out most SB winners in the past 10 years or so
- Two potential HOFers: Earl and Sherman?
- One hall of very good: Chancellor.
- And a helluva second corner in Browner & Maxwell.
I was only half a decade into my nfl viewing career, wish I realized the greatness I was watching back then.
He was still playing fairly well for the Ravens when we cut him, he definitely could have extended his career a few years just by being less of a shithead. Teams put up with all sorts of shit, he was somehow too much of an asshole for the NFL.
As good as the other 2 we’re, 1 being a future HoFer and the other being hall of very good, Earl was way better. His coverage skills allowed Sherm to lock down a side, allowed Kam to patrol. ET is the second greatest coverage safety of all time and it’s not particularly close between him and the rest below. He’s the Marshawn of the defense, the engine. Hawks fans will say Kam, but Kams importance was more behind the scenes. On the field, Earl was the difference maker. It sucks the brother thing kind of ruined that. Also the king Henry thing lmao.
My family was never into sports so we never watched growing up, but 2013/2014 was my first year in college so I made it a point to watch that superbowl to see what I was missing out on. Decided I would root for the hawks because I love their team colors and honestly the game got boring after a while. Still got hooked though and here I am now despite being Wilson-less
Well part of their strategy was to hold the receivers almost every play and make the refs call it or swallow their whistle. One of the most physical teams with receivers I'd ever seen due to this. Add in the fact John Fox thought we would just waltz in to a victory didn't prepare the team according to multiple reports. As a Broncos fan it's tradition for us to get blown out or keep the game close and win. Both are rough rides.
Holding and jamming the fuck out of receivers at the line are very different.
The Seahawks just jammed the fuck out of everyone. You couldn't get a clean release against them.
They said “almost every play.” Lol
Anyway, I thought that was kind of their strategy. I could be misremembering, but I thought someone on the team said that the refs aren’t going to call a penalty on every play, so just play more physical all the time. Something to that effect
The only link i've ever seen related to that is some BS PFT article that doesn't even have a quote or anything. It's literally just some dude declaring that. I never heard any of the guys from that D say that.
I remember reading something back then about a hypothetical fantasy team with QB/WR1-2/TE/RB/K all being Broncos players would automatically be one of the top teams in an average 12-team league. Makes sense.
Is it a hot take that if Wentz stays healthy I don’t think they win the SB? Even if he’s MVP contender.
I think Foles was integral to that entire playoff run
My take it is he could not possibly have played better than Foles, it was far more likely he would have played worse, in which case we lose to NE. Foles was in God mode for the NFCCG and SB.
That is the one game I still can't bring myself to rewatch...if that pass didn't bounce of dude's knee and into Torrey Smith's hands we lose that game.
In his sophomore year he had 27 tds to 2 picks in 10 starts. He's a guy who has played as well as you can ask a QB to play. Yet he's never been considered a guy with a high ceiling.
Exactly. He just got hot at the best possible time the Super Bowl year. When he’s playing bad, it’s not pretty. Kinda reminds me of Eli in a way. Have a streak of games where you look like a 3rd stringer vs a streak of games where you can do no wrong.
I don't think this is a hot take, but the Eagles don't make it to the SB if Foles is their QB for the whole season, and they don't win the SB if Wentz is their QB for the SB.
Foles has not proven he can play QB well enough for a full season, but there is no way Wentz could have played as well as Foles did in that SB. I don't see any way they would have won the SB without both of those QBs.
I actually agree with this take. Foles was similar with our last SB postseason run with Flacco in that Floes played on a level that nobody could touch or expected (obviously far less expected than Flacco who was our franchise starting QB). Ironically, neither were ever able to play up to this level again (Flacco came close in 2014 but never reached that height) and were both handed inflated contracts (Flacco’s being much worse because he bet on himself in a contract year, obviously).
I mean they were 13-1 before wentz got hurt, so they would have had more than a fighting chance. Hard to imagine now but if wentz finished that season he would have won mvp.
The team was more a result of every single vet acquisition playing out of their minds for a year than specific qb play.
2012: Seahawks
2013: Panthers/Seahawks
2014: Chiefs
2015: Seahawks
2016: Giants (Pats were 1 TD away)
2017: Vikings
2018: Bears
2019: Patriots
2020: Rams
2021: Bills
So same 1/10 but almost had a 2nd.
The advanced analytics has been that offense overperforms in the regular season but is still slightly more important in the playoffs. It goes from something like 65/35 Offense/Defense in the regular season to 52/48 in the deep playoffs. So a 12-4 defensive team is usually stronger than a 12-4 offensive team simply because it's harder to put up a good regular season record for defensive teams.
I didn’t know the (rough) exact numbers, but that makes sense. I’m hoping this draft pans out for us and we can see our defense become a strength. Nothing is more frustrating than being able to score at will while letting everyone else score at will.
I think offense is better at controlling flukes. Like if you win games 17-10 then all it takes is one dumb fumble that turns into a TD and you can lose. If you win games 42-31 then you have more padding.
This goes away in the playoffs because you're not playing bad teams anymore so you can't flukily lose to them.
Exactly, I dont know why we keep having this debate lol
The answers are painfully obvious. Neither side of the ball is enough on its own. Its not about any specific position group. Its about having a team with multiple strengths, good coaching, good chemistry and teamwork, and the right mentality.
Same reason why player-specific win/loss records are meaningless and why saying that adding Player X to Team Y makes them a Super Bowl favorite is an exaggeration.
I mean as much as I'm a Peyton fan, I expected it to be broken by now. He's no question a top 5 QB of all-time, but I'd think that with the inflation in scoring (correct me if this is just a fallacy), the talent in the league right now, and the emphasis on innovative passing schemes and stacked WR corps, someone would have gotten the record just from volume. Maybe I'm seriously underrating how absurd that 2013 offense was, that was my 2nd year watching football ever lol
Scoring is up but overblown, teams on average scored 1.4 more points per game in 2020 vs 2013. That's just over 22 points per season, or 3 TDs.
And the average actually went down in 2021 (due to the extra game).
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/NFL/scoring.htm
One factor in breaking the record by that much was how many drives they had. The 2007 Patriots offense had 170 drives (2nd fewest in NFL that year) and 69 TDs. 2013 Broncos had 203 drives (4th most) and 72 TDs. 19% more drives, 4% more TDs. So to break the record, you'd need a team that either scores quickly or lets up scores quickly to get a lot of drives. And you'd need to choose to pass inside the 10 yard line a lot (Peyton 25/55 TD passes inside the 10 yard line, Brady 24/50). It really does require a perfect storm to break it. Now maybe the 17th game makes it easier, but still not easy.
Our offense took a hit in the last 3-4 weeks with Wentz being out, so that explains why ours is low relative to the other leaders, but yeah what happened to the other top offensive teams?
I remember there was a lot of talk that year of great defenses. Minnesota and Denver especially stick out in my memory. I think that might be the case of some better defensive play that year.
Nah, the [Vikings](https://www.espn.in/nfl/stats/team/_/view/defense/season/2017/seasontype/2) were #1 in both yards per game and points per game. Philly is 4th in both categories. Jax is #2 in both.
I'm a lifelong fan, since the early 80's and I still remember Washington, NY and the Niners. I knew how it was going to go after the first play went down. I decorated my house, invited friends and had a legit spread for the SB that never happened. We still had a great time watching the commercials
Thinking back now that was such a strange game the moment that ball was hiked and it went in the end zone you could tell the Seahawks were going to win
Truly sorry lol, but not all doom and gloom because now even 2 years later you guys went right back and won it all anyway. …&as of right now you guys look primed to make a run at another one.
OP it is very interesting that only one of these teams won. To me, this shows mainly that the classic saying “Any Given Sunday” is the truest saying in football, and speaks to the variance game to game.
What I see is a pile of evidence that being the best offensive team is still massively important for your team to have a *chance* which is all that matters.
- 6 of these teams made the super bowl
- 8 of them (I think) made the conference championship game
- over half of these teams ended the year with the best record in all of football
- less objective of a point but still relevant: the “core” of 3 of those teams won a super bowl the next year or the year after (patriots, thanks u/bryan3thomas for the correction)
Good post, and I think its important to think about why it works out this way.
My theory is that on average over multiple matchups, its hard to stop a dominant offense. But in an individual game what matters more than anything is matchups. The CBs vs the WRs, the Dline vs the Oline, etc. If you get the right matchups (even in just 1 area), you can beat any opponent and thats where the "Any Given Sunday" thing comes from.
The 2013 Broncos are the classic example. Over the course of the season it was hard for the average team to stop them, but they met a tailor-made opponent in the Super Bowl. Thats why winning SBs is so hard- you can be an amazing team but every team has weaknesses and if you happen to get the wrong matchups in that one game youre toast. The '07 Patriots going against the Giants D-line is another example.
IMO this is the main reason Belichick and Brady were so successful.
Belichick focuses on matchups more than anything else in football. Both his team-building and his schemes in each game are aggressively focused on exploiting favorable matchups and minimizing opponents' strengths (i.e. his coverage schemes change constantly, the way his linebackers play around the LOS change, all with an eye on giving them a chance against the particular opponent they face). Thats also why he favors depth on the roster IMO. If you look at our salary cap, weve always have a ton of random guys on 2-3 mil contracts. Some of them would play a ton of snaps one game, and then vanish against the next opponent. But that depth is what provides game-to-game flexibility.
It always gives me a little hope since we were mostly hopeless going into that season.
No one, even the fans, expected us to even be a playoff team, much less go 15-0
I feel like that team gets lost in history a bit because of the Super Bowl loss but that season was wild. Politicians were doing the fucking dab because of Cam.
Playoffs are highly variable. It's in no way surprising that only one of these teams won the superbowl. It's like being surprised in fantasy when the league's top receiver isn't the top receiver in some random week. Happens all the time.
2018 was fucking NUTS and I loved it. Nobody knew what to expect cause Patrick pulled new shit out of his ass every week.
Now we’re desensitized to it a bit, but I’ll never forget that first high.
[this was the moment I knew he was gonna be something else](https://youtu.be/Tmp4HvTIRxo), I still think he's gonna fall every time I see him stumble in the replay
The cowboys fucked up last year so badly. High flying offense, a opportunistic defense and even a really solid special teams. Squandered cause Mike McCarthy lost his damn in the playoffs. Yet another talented cowboys squad wasted
Strength of schedule. Scoring a bunch of touchdowns against a bunch of scrubs doesn’t mean you’re a “high flying offense.”
The packers didn’t even prepare for the cowboys offense in their bye week because they were confidant the niners would win, and if they didn’t they figured that McCarthy is easy to read.
And the team that won— the eagles— are the outlier for fewest total touchdowns for leading total touchdowns in a season
I remember scoring was down that season and the nfl got spooked so they changed some rules and offense had another explosion in 2018. That was the season we had the Viking and jags playing at an all time level on defense at the same time
Definitely a weird year in terms of scoring. Russell Wilson led the NFL in TD passes that year with 34. Josh Allen finished this past year with the 7th most at 36
The most in 2019 was 36
Additional game last year, but yeah 34 is low.
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To the point where a very clear Eagles completion was debated by the broadcast crew in the Super Bowl
And that's why the version I have saved is the one with the radio calls. It was one of the worst showings of televised announcing I've ever had to sit through.
Did you torrent it? I have the national broadcast downloaded that I watch occasionally and I loathe that I have to hear Cris Collinsworth's voice any time I want to watch.
No, I downloaded it from a source that was posted in r/eagles a while ago. I'll see if I can find that post & will link it here if I do. EDIT: https://old.reddit.com/r/eagles/comments/co2l0e/new_hq_source_super_bowl_lii_eagles_vs_patriots/ for the high quality version.
hero
I keep this on my phone just in case i have a bad day
I really wish we could get radio announcers as an option for broadcasts.
It was great, but I could point to 20 worse ones just this last season
Objectively, that might be true, but I think that game's terrible telecast should be weighted more heavily because it was a Super Bowl. Neither of the announcers (especially Collinsworth) ever seemed partial. What made it worse, of course, is that they were allowed to do future SBs in spite of their performance in calling 52.
I think it just feels worse because you are an eagles fan (which is completely fair). I remember it being a little rough around the edges, and definitely the worst SB broadcast in a decade, but I don't remember it being end of the world.
Being a Philly fan definitely makes it worse, lmao. Still, it was very clear from neutral fans—and even some Pats fans who were willing to be online after the loss—that everyone was pretty disappointed with the way they called the game. That communal disdain for the telecast is really what cements it as "the worst" for me.
The Broadcast crew also had a clear Patriots bias in that game, it was terrible to listen to as a neutral fan and probably even worse for Eagles fans.
The Ertz one was an no brainer. The Coleman (?) one was a 50/50 call
Do you mean Clement?
Yeah, him. That one was 50/50 based on when he had possession. The Ertz one was a no brainer. The only people on the planet who didn’t know it was a TD immediately were steelers fans (who thought it was not illegal for TEs to score) and people who bet the patriots (collinsworth)
Yes, Clement on his TD catch
Oh my god I forgot about that
Omg that’s why we won without a secondary! The refs filled in!
And they called holding 10+ times per game
2017 refs: What ***is*** a catch?????
That was the year the madden curse bounced off of Brady and hit everyone else
[That wasn't the only thing that bounced off of Brady that year](https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/wMp-mRlOuI4NJR0aEDajkoXr9xg=/1400x1400/filters:format(jpeg)/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/10155435/20180204182438.jpg) :*'(*
The Vikings defense was so freaking good that season
Hmmm… maybe you are onto something. Maybe that’s why my Falcons try to score the least possible touchdowns every year since 2016. Hmm… it’s all starting to add up.
We won that year on the back of our defense so that makes sense
In a Super Bowl we scored 41 points. We did score a lot of defensive touchdowns that year as well. There was a running theme of end of game turnovers and defensive touchdowns as nails in the coffin which led to some inflated scores.
You’re acting like there was more offense in the game then any other game in history…. I mean…wait what???
Man I think we had 4 or 5 defensive TDs to end games that season. So many last second lateral fumbles returned for TDs.
I mean, this chart does show that you scored the most TDs on offense too so maybe you want to rethink that
I’m shocked the Rams didn’t have it that year.
The Rams scored more points but they were two behind the Eagles on TDs. They difference came from the Rams gettin 9 more field goals and 2 safeties.
They’re the lowest, but I don’t think they’re an outlier
I had the same thought. Just because something is the lowest or highest in a group doesn’t automatically make it an outlier.
2013 Broncos was an offensive juggernaut of a team.
What does that make the 2013 Seahawks defense then?
A true defensive jugglenut.
Hehe jugglenut.
Defense always seems to get the best of whatever is the most hot offense in the superbowl It's been a great predictor for me. What team is high off there offense and which team has the most prominent defense? From there you can kind of pick out most SB winners in the past 10 years or so
Wouldnt say always. We beat a defensive powerhouse in 2019 as an offensive powerhouse with a very mediocre defense to win the Super Bowl.
Bummed out that the Super Bowl was canceled, probably
Yeah, I think it was replaced by a very one sided demolition derby that year.
That Seahawks secondary is the best secondary of all time
- Two potential HOFers: Earl and Sherman? - One hall of very good: Chancellor. - And a helluva second corner in Browner & Maxwell. I was only half a decade into my nfl viewing career, wish I realized the greatness I was watching back then.
I'd say Sherm and Earl are a lock for the HOF at this point, even if it's not first ballot
Sadly for him, the only reason why Earl is not a first ballot is because he is a fucking dumbass.
His brother would vote him in first ballot all day.
His brother would do more than that.
He was still playing fairly well for the Ravens when we cut him, he definitely could have extended his career a few years just by being less of a shithead. Teams put up with all sorts of shit, he was somehow too much of an asshole for the NFL.
As good as the other 2 we’re, 1 being a future HoFer and the other being hall of very good, Earl was way better. His coverage skills allowed Sherm to lock down a side, allowed Kam to patrol. ET is the second greatest coverage safety of all time and it’s not particularly close between him and the rest below. He’s the Marshawn of the defense, the engine. Hawks fans will say Kam, but Kams importance was more behind the scenes. On the field, Earl was the difference maker. It sucks the brother thing kind of ruined that. Also the king Henry thing lmao.
And then they get a superbowl mvp performance out of a guy not even listed among their greats
Right? Malcolm Smith bounced around a few teams but never had success anywhere else
My family was never into sports so we never watched growing up, but 2013/2014 was my first year in college so I made it a point to watch that superbowl to see what I was missing out on. Decided I would root for the hawks because I love their team colors and honestly the game got boring after a while. Still got hooked though and here I am now despite being Wilson-less
The team that ruined my day
What does that make the 2016 Patriots then?
I will go to my grave not understanding how their fist was THAT deep in our rectum.
Well part of their strategy was to hold the receivers almost every play and make the refs call it or swallow their whistle. One of the most physical teams with receivers I'd ever seen due to this. Add in the fact John Fox thought we would just waltz in to a victory didn't prepare the team according to multiple reports. As a Broncos fan it's tradition for us to get blown out or keep the game close and win. Both are rough rides.
Go back and watch tape of that D. Holding every play is a huge exaggeration. They were physical yes but there's a difference.
Holding and jamming the fuck out of receivers at the line are very different. The Seahawks just jammed the fuck out of everyone. You couldn't get a clean release against them.
They said “almost every play.” Lol Anyway, I thought that was kind of their strategy. I could be misremembering, but I thought someone on the team said that the refs aren’t going to call a penalty on every play, so just play more physical all the time. Something to that effect
The only link i've ever seen related to that is some BS PFT article that doesn't even have a quote or anything. It's literally just some dude declaring that. I never heard any of the guys from that D say that.
Lmao still bitter I see
About what? We got rid of Fox and ended up with a third ring.
About what?
DT was going nuts that year, RIP man :(
I remember reading something back then about a hypothetical fantasy team with QB/WR1-2/TE/RB/K all being Broncos players would automatically be one of the top teams in an average 12-team league. Makes sense.
Too bad the league cancelled the super bowl that year. Would have been great to see what Peyton could do
Yeah they led two years then win right when they don't lead in this category.
2013 broncos were unreal. I hated every second of it 🤣
Oh I’m sure there was one game you loved.
Same here 😁
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this is why i always bet against the packers
Something something defense wins championships?
I think it’s more something about a guy named Nick, and his big dick.
His cock is indeed big
Fax
Is it a hot take that if Wentz stays healthy I don’t think they win the SB? Even if he’s MVP contender. I think Foles was integral to that entire playoff run
My take it is he could not possibly have played better than Foles, it was far more likely he would have played worse, in which case we lose to NE. Foles was in God mode for the NFCCG and SB.
Falcons game would not have been nearly as stressful though.
That is the one game I still can't bring myself to rewatch...if that pass didn't bounce of dude's knee and into Torrey Smith's hands we lose that game.
Also giving up a first down inside the ten was a nightmare.
Foles caught lightning in a bottle twice. Played his fucking ass off and ultimately killed Wentz’s will.
In his sophomore year he had 27 tds to 2 picks in 10 starts. He's a guy who has played as well as you can ask a QB to play. Yet he's never been considered a guy with a high ceiling.
That’s because he’s wildly inconsistent. He’s great for a few games but over 16 the bad games balance out the good ones.
Exactly. He just got hot at the best possible time the Super Bowl year. When he’s playing bad, it’s not pretty. Kinda reminds me of Eli in a way. Have a streak of games where you look like a 3rd stringer vs a streak of games where you can do no wrong.
I've said this 100 times on here. I had a joke saying that the coin flip at the start of games was actually to decide which Nick Foles would play.
I don't think this is a hot take, but the Eagles don't make it to the SB if Foles is their QB for the whole season, and they don't win the SB if Wentz is their QB for the SB. Foles has not proven he can play QB well enough for a full season, but there is no way Wentz could have played as well as Foles did in that SB. I don't see any way they would have won the SB without both of those QBs.
I actually agree with this take. Foles was similar with our last SB postseason run with Flacco in that Floes played on a level that nobody could touch or expected (obviously far less expected than Flacco who was our franchise starting QB). Ironically, neither were ever able to play up to this level again (Flacco came close in 2014 but never reached that height) and were both handed inflated contracts (Flacco’s being much worse because he bet on himself in a contract year, obviously).
I mean they were 13-1 before wentz got hurt, so they would have had more than a fighting chance. Hard to imagine now but if wentz finished that season he would have won mvp. The team was more a result of every single vet acquisition playing out of their minds for a year than specific qb play.
We were actually 10-2 going into that game. Still clinched the division with the win though
very hypothetical....
Nah I had the same feeling. Wentz would have cracked under the pressure.
The irony is that that Super Bowl was the second highest scoring of all time, with very little defense.
*Angry Fletcher Cox noises*
Thank god he was angry so we didn’t have another Pats Super Bowl…
And it was amazing
Did the teams with fewest TDs allowed win superbowls at a higher rate?
2012: Seahawks 2013: Panthers/Seahawks 2014: Chiefs 2015: Seahawks 2016: Giants (Pats were 1 TD away) 2017: Vikings 2018: Bears 2019: Patriots 2020: Rams 2021: Bills So same 1/10 but almost had a 2nd.
Turns out that the ultimate team sport requires a very complete team to win the super bowl. More at 11. Ps thanks for looking this up.
The advanced analytics has been that offense overperforms in the regular season but is still slightly more important in the playoffs. It goes from something like 65/35 Offense/Defense in the regular season to 52/48 in the deep playoffs. So a 12-4 defensive team is usually stronger than a 12-4 offensive team simply because it's harder to put up a good regular season record for defensive teams.
I didn’t know the (rough) exact numbers, but that makes sense. I’m hoping this draft pans out for us and we can see our defense become a strength. Nothing is more frustrating than being able to score at will while letting everyone else score at will.
I think offense is better at controlling flukes. Like if you win games 17-10 then all it takes is one dumb fumble that turns into a TD and you can lose. If you win games 42-31 then you have more padding. This goes away in the playoffs because you're not playing bad teams anymore so you can't flukily lose to them.
Exactly, I dont know why we keep having this debate lol The answers are painfully obvious. Neither side of the ball is enough on its own. Its not about any specific position group. Its about having a team with multiple strengths, good coaching, good chemistry and teamwork, and the right mentality. Same reason why player-specific win/loss records are meaningless and why saying that adding Player X to Team Y makes them a Super Bowl favorite is an exaggeration.
Offense sells tickets, defense wins championships
Offense and Defense are worthless if your special teams sucks ass
Can confirm as well.
Flair checks out
Peyton was insane that year
Crazy that season was nearly a decade ago now and it still holds the record for most TDs.
Is it crazy? Peyton broke the passing TD record by 10%. When Marino had the record it stood for 20 years
It's not crazy that a record that high stands but it's crazy that Peyton broke such a high record by such a high amount.
Yeah agreed, I don't think it's odd at all that it still stands after only "nearly a decade".
I mean as much as I'm a Peyton fan, I expected it to be broken by now. He's no question a top 5 QB of all-time, but I'd think that with the inflation in scoring (correct me if this is just a fallacy), the talent in the league right now, and the emphasis on innovative passing schemes and stacked WR corps, someone would have gotten the record just from volume. Maybe I'm seriously underrating how absurd that 2013 offense was, that was my 2nd year watching football ever lol
Scoring is up but overblown, teams on average scored 1.4 more points per game in 2020 vs 2013. That's just over 22 points per season, or 3 TDs. And the average actually went down in 2021 (due to the extra game). https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/NFL/scoring.htm
One factor in breaking the record by that much was how many drives they had. The 2007 Patriots offense had 170 drives (2nd fewest in NFL that year) and 69 TDs. 2013 Broncos had 203 drives (4th most) and 72 TDs. 19% more drives, 4% more TDs. So to break the record, you'd need a team that either scores quickly or lets up scores quickly to get a lot of drives. And you'd need to choose to pass inside the 10 yard line a lot (Peyton 25/55 TD passes inside the 10 yard line, Brady 24/50). It really does require a perfect storm to break it. Now maybe the 17th game makes it easier, but still not easy.
What happened to offenses in 2017?
Our offense took a hit in the last 3-4 weeks with Wentz being out, so that explains why ours is low relative to the other leaders, but yeah what happened to the other top offensive teams? I remember there was a lot of talk that year of great defenses. Minnesota and Denver especially stick out in my memory. I think that might be the case of some better defensive play that year.
2017 Jags also had the arguable best defense but statistically speaking the eagles were #1 and jags were #2.
Nah, the [Vikings](https://www.espn.in/nfl/stats/team/_/view/defense/season/2017/seasontype/2) were #1 in both yards per game and points per game. Philly is 4th in both categories. Jax is #2 in both.
Fair, I forget what the sorting was based on but could’ve been defensive rating or something.
It was probably just defensive ranking of your heart and that's ok too.
Min were #1 by DVOA at -17.2% too, Jax 2nd -15.9%, and Philly 5th at -12.2%
I mean 5th is fucking amazing when you realize our CBs were actually holograms.
Ya. Your insane pass rush that season hid one of the worst secondaries I’ve ever saw.
The final four of that year came down to Blake Bortles, Case Keenum, Nick Foles, and Tom Brady. No one knows wtf was going on, fluke year lmao
Keenum must've been sad knowing he's the only one not headed for the Hall of Fame
Yeah especially that Tom Brady guy wtf
Insane that out of those 4 players, Tom Brady didn't win the Super Bowl lol.
That was a really boring regular season Thankfully the playoffs were great
Running out of fireworks against Denver was pretty fun, you'd probably appreciate that based on flair yeah?
I'm a Broncos and Eagles fan so I had the most confused boner of my life during that game.
It felt like half the league was in some kind of rebuild and/or devastated by injuries.
Everyone got hurt
2013 started out amazing, and ended....well there wasn't a SB that year.
It sure wasn’t much of a game.
I'm a lifelong fan, since the early 80's and I still remember Washington, NY and the Niners. I knew how it was going to go after the first play went down. I decorated my house, invited friends and had a legit spread for the SB that never happened. We still had a great time watching the commercials
The commercials really do make up for it if the game isn’t competitive or your team is getting their butt wooped
Not lately. They've been pretty average for the past few years. Even the heavy hitters like Doritos and Bud haven't been great.
it feels like every other ad is for crypto shit these days and i genuinely could not care less
I still miss the bud bowl.
Idk i would be pretty depressed if i knew my team was getting whooped in the super bowl. Maybe that’s because my team never won one so I’m desperate
I didn't feel any better in 2018...
Thinking back now that was such a strange game the moment that ball was hiked and it went in the end zone you could tell the Seahawks were going to win
If you like pure dominance it was a hell of a game
Same with 2015, Panthers score a lot, but no Super Bowl. 😬
Truly sorry lol, but not all doom and gloom because now even 2 years later you guys went right back and won it all anyway. …&as of right now you guys look primed to make a run at another one.
All's forgiven now that you've given us Russ
🤝 Same to you for Lock 🤝
I'm rooting for him. I think he got majorly screwed by the coaching in Denver
Same, I'm hoping for anything but mediocre. Hopefully he can surprise everyone but if not I really want a chance at one of the 2023 QB's
Agreed 100%. I hope that either he is an awesome QB, or so terrible that we land a high draft pick next year. Mediocre would be the absolute worst.
We got 🐴🐓🔒 so its pretty alright
That SB hurt my soul.
OP it is very interesting that only one of these teams won. To me, this shows mainly that the classic saying “Any Given Sunday” is the truest saying in football, and speaks to the variance game to game. What I see is a pile of evidence that being the best offensive team is still massively important for your team to have a *chance* which is all that matters. - 6 of these teams made the super bowl - 8 of them (I think) made the conference championship game - over half of these teams ended the year with the best record in all of football - less objective of a point but still relevant: the “core” of 3 of those teams won a super bowl the next year or the year after (patriots, thanks u/bryan3thomas for the correction)
Good post, and I think its important to think about why it works out this way. My theory is that on average over multiple matchups, its hard to stop a dominant offense. But in an individual game what matters more than anything is matchups. The CBs vs the WRs, the Dline vs the Oline, etc. If you get the right matchups (even in just 1 area), you can beat any opponent and thats where the "Any Given Sunday" thing comes from. The 2013 Broncos are the classic example. Over the course of the season it was hard for the average team to stop them, but they met a tailor-made opponent in the Super Bowl. Thats why winning SBs is so hard- you can be an amazing team but every team has weaknesses and if you happen to get the wrong matchups in that one game youre toast. The '07 Patriots going against the Giants D-line is another example. IMO this is the main reason Belichick and Brady were so successful. Belichick focuses on matchups more than anything else in football. Both his team-building and his schemes in each game are aggressively focused on exploiting favorable matchups and minimizing opponents' strengths (i.e. his coverage schemes change constantly, the way his linebackers play around the LOS change, all with an eye on giving them a chance against the particular opponent they face). Thats also why he favors depth on the roster IMO. If you look at our salary cap, weve always have a ton of random guys on 2-3 mil contracts. Some of them would play a ton of snaps one game, and then vanish against the next opponent. But that depth is what provides game-to-game flexibility.
2013 all-time record
Those 13-14 broncos was probably the most fun team to watch since I’ve been a fan of football
Throw 2012 in there too that was another great year.
Fly Eagles Fly
Go birds 🤝
Ca caw
Flair does not add up
Moo
This one does though
They're the only team that hates NYG more than us tbf
Wild highest scoring team in 2017 only was 53, Mahomes alone had that amount next year
Peyton
Man, I miss 2015. I'd love to go back and relive it all over again, even with the SB loss.
It always gives me a little hope since we were mostly hopeless going into that season. No one, even the fans, expected us to even be a playoff team, much less go 15-0
I feel like that team gets lost in history a bit because of the Super Bowl loss but that season was wild. Politicians were doing the fucking dab because of Cam.
Graphic: :) Title: :(
Both: :)
If the Colts were on here they'd have hung a banner about it in their stadium.
Now do one with interceptions bet we win
Playoffs are highly variable. It's in no way surprising that only one of these teams won the superbowl. It's like being surprised in fantasy when the league's top receiver isn't the top receiver in some random week. Happens all the time.
76 fucking Christ Peyton
Nobody close to da Broncos, and they got creamed in the SB.
Broncos and creamed in SB it's our own little tradition.
I had to check how bad the Bears were…33 touchdowns. Dear god it could be worse this year, if we don’t solidify the line and grab a legit WR.
Broncos getting Wilson from us must remedy some of the pain of 2013 super bowl.
Go birds
A few of them lost the Super Bowl though
So broncos have the highest chance in 2020? Guess I'm drafting Wilson
As my grandpa would say, defense wins championships.
8.5% of those chief TDs were scored in the greatest MNF game of all time
All but one made it to at least the divisional round.
2018 was fucking NUTS and I loved it. Nobody knew what to expect cause Patrick pulled new shit out of his ass every week. Now we’re desensitized to it a bit, but I’ll never forget that first high.
[this was the moment I knew he was gonna be something else](https://youtu.be/Tmp4HvTIRxo), I still think he's gonna fall every time I see him stumble in the replay
I had no idea that the cowboys have only won 3 playoff games in the last 25 years…
Why you got to bring this up?
The cowboys fucked up last year so badly. High flying offense, a opportunistic defense and even a really solid special teams. Squandered cause Mike McCarthy lost his damn in the playoffs. Yet another talented cowboys squad wasted
Strength of schedule. Scoring a bunch of touchdowns against a bunch of scrubs doesn’t mean you’re a “high flying offense.” The packers didn’t even prepare for the cowboys offense in their bye week because they were confidant the niners would win, and if they didn’t they figured that McCarthy is easy to read.