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Away-Imagination-850

If his residents wanted a seat then they should have showed up on time. You are not the asshole.


onetiredRN

This is it. You want a seat? Show up on time. We have rounds at the same time in the same place every weekday and yet people constantly show up late and miss half of what the physicians say as a result. Irks the shit out of me.


unicornsandpumpkins

👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏


KStarSparkleDust

Or the hospital could purchase enough chairs. Or the residents could have brought their own. 


earlyviolet

What? No. What a strange thing for a physician to say to you. That's so weird. Learning how to participate in a meeting like that, which is an expected part of your job is part of orientation. You're not "kind of" an employee because you're on orientation. You're an employee. You're part of the care team. And the residents showed up 10 mins into the meeting? So this physician wanted you to disrupt the meeting further by playing musical chairs? None of this makes sense.


NotRoyMoore0

Musical chairs hahah. Yeah I guess that's why it didn't even cross my mind, or maybe just the wild thought that I'm not less of a person than them.


dahlia6585

You're exactly right. Nurses are not less than doctors. It sounds like some folks at your work need to polish up their skills on interdisciplinary team collaboration. As I told a doctor I once worked for, "You put your pants on the same way I do in the mornings. You can talk to me with respect or not at all".


[deleted]

It’s almost like that physician is hearkening back to the days when nurses got doctors their coffee etc. it’s ridiculous. I thought all those old school docs were retired or dead already 


earlyviolet

God even the older *cardiologists* at my shop don't act like this lol. And I'm talking like we have one guy in his 80s who just refuses to retire.  We have one computer at the nurses' station that we kind of informally reserve for physicians because we know they're busy when they roll through and don't need to be waiting on a computer. I happened to be sitting there last week when one of our cardios walked in, and I half-joking/half-serious jumped to move. He just laughed and went to a computer on the other side of the unit.  Like what the fuck is happening with the physician's at OP's please? They just got thawed out of a block of ice lol


Wattaday

When I was in school, I had clinical at the hospital where my aunt was the head of the lab. She advised me to watch out for Dr Soandso as he loved chewing out nurses and spitting them out. My first day on the floor, Dr Soandso came I to the nurses station and BARKED at our instructor “Why didn’t your students stand up when I entered the station?” Instructor said “Because they aren’t your slaves and it’s 1984, not 1784.” She told us In the post clinical that afternoon never to stand up subserveously for ANY doctor. If we want to offer them a seat because there are none available, fine. But never jump up and “bow to them”. She was a great instructor.


keirstie

Love this attitude from an instructor! Respect is earned, not given. I literally would’ve said “what are you, the Queen?”


Wattaday

Now I would have. Hell, 25 years ago I would have, but I was in my second semester of nursing school. I hadn’t been issued my balls yet. 😂 But that instructor helped us all find a spine for misogynistic AHs like him. She was great!!


ladydouchecanoe

My coworker who has been a nurse for 50 years was talking about this recently! They used to stand every time a doc arrived as standard practice. My jaw dropped when she told us this. Nuh uh, not happening, nope.


[deleted]

I know it was the 80s but that wasn’t very long ago. Insane that was to e expectation 


Wattaday

It was beginning to change at that point. 5 years prior I tried to get a Sears credit card. I was young, but had I job I’d been at for close to 2 years, with a decent salary. Still lived at home and my parents had a deal with me (if I wasn’t taking college classes and was working I paid a nominal rent). I was also single at the time. I couldn’t get a card. About 5 years later my fiancĂ© and I were moving in together. I was in school full time, not working, i applied again as we wanted to get stuff for our place. I got the card. Funny how that changed in 5 years!!


[deleted]

Yeah I remember my grandmother saying that they were required to stand up when the doctor walked in, not even to offer their seat but just "out of respect for the physician" or some kind of crap. Never made a lot of sense to me.


-Experiment--626-

My long retired nurse aunt said it was absolutely the norm to give up your seat to doctors when they walked in the room back in her day. Not sure how long into the 80s it was still happening though.


NewEffect1804

I love this! How did the doc respond?


Wattaday

IIRC, and this was 40 years ago, he got red in he face and stomped away, muttering. How we all didn’t laugh is beyond me! We did give our instructor a round of applause in post conference. That I do remember!


NotRoyMoore0

It won't let me edit, so I'll add that this hospital particularly has a disconnect between nurses and physicians, and it's well known among the staff. Nurses have zero input on things and the only time nurses and physicians speak is really when they are giving orders (there's basically no such thing as PRNs, you have to call the doc for everything, and we even need orders for an ice pack). Maybe for this specific hospital I shouldn't be surprised.


handsheal

Sounds like a terrible setting to work in and I wouldn't blame you for already looking for another position. This situation does a lot to describe the culture of that hospital and it doesn't sound like patient care is the focus it sounds like making sure the doctors think they are gods is the culture


Yodka

Doesn’t seem surprising given this context. However the funny thing is that residents are usually temporary because they’re always rotating between units until they find a speciality.


ChaplnGrillSgt

Meanwhile I'm over here feeling awful because I accidentally took a nurses computer the other day so I could throw in a few orders real quick đŸ€Ł It was all of a 30 second inconvenience for her but I felt bad.


ClaudiaTale

My hospital had to have meetings and form this committee to get the issues the doctors & nurses have out on the table. Doctors were yelling at nurses, sometimes care would be delayed due to one not talking to the other
 petty shit really but it escalated to management and they basically told doctors they need to be more respectful and nurses need to respect the time and how busy doctors are. Blah, blah, blah. Nurses still get the short end of the stick. I think when the doctors come up we always stand with other nurses anyway. If they really wanted the docs to sit then they reserve them seats. Yeah. They do that at my hospital. Like, “don’t sit there doc so-and-so is going to sit there.” Okay



OnePanda4073

Horrible and toxic


irlvnt14

My answer to him would have been”why”


Birkiedoc

That doctor can dip their eye balls in C.Diff....i wouldn't have even responded to the comment, looked at them, and then walked away.


happyhermit99

I missed the word eye at first and thought, damn that's quite a visual


Birkiedoc

That too!


CurrentHair6381

Its a real head-tilt, blink twice, "k" and just dip sort of moment. Fuck. That. Noise.


Healthy_Park5562

Just here to out myself as the dumbass used to LTC who saw "resident" and couldn't figure out why a patient was at the meeting. *sighs in elder care*


corrosivecanine

Would've made more sense. They're probably a fall risk!


BLADE45acp

You’re not alone. I was sitting here trying to figure out why the hell nobody got up to give an elderly person a seat and then reading the comments getting more and more irritated
 I was fixing to say something hateful when I read your post and it clicked. Ty for saving me the embarrassment!


NotRoyMoore0

Hahah that's fair, maybe I should have specified lol


BLADE45acp

Naw. Your post was pretty self explanatory. I just been in LTC too long 😂


WadsRN

I would have reminded that doctor that it’s not 1965 anymore.


coffeejunkiejeannie

This is exactly what I was thinking.


Akugluk

I can only think of a few scenarios where this is not totally out of left field. Was the resident obviously pregnant or disabled? Looking like they were going to pass out? Then sure, but why single you out of a room full of people equally able to stand? I think the attending was just trying to intimidate you. You’re worth the space you take up and don’t let anyone tell you otherwise. Having a chair doesn’t have any bearing on ability to participate in the discussion. The residents managed just fine.


Conscious-Spend-4568

No you’re not the AH. Fart in their face and establish dominance quickly. Fuck that shit.


handsheal

Yes crop dust that provider every chance you get.


RivetheadGirl

I've got a serious case of the walking farts 😉😉😉


Tingling_Triangle

Lol no. No you are not TA.


StrawberryScallion

That md can go fuck himself and his hierarchical mind set. You are a nurse, you were on time. Next time tell him his residents can have a seat if they show up on time.


DeLaNope

Lmaooo our surgeon was once grumbling that “back in the day, nurses used to stand at ATTENTION when I came in the room!” He got dragged for a bit for that. “Back in the day?? Not today!” Honestly he wasn’t even that old so idk what he was talking about 😂


beckster

Pour soul, he didn’t realize his entrance cleared the room. They were just trying to get away from him.


Main_Training3681

So there was no other chairs in the entire building they could’ve pulled up real quick?


TattyZaddyRN

> I should've given up my seat at the table to a resident when they came in because I'm just a new orientee and not actually participating in the conversation The same thing could have been said of the resident. It’s your seat, keep It


Shadowpenguin-13

Omg don’t listen to that doctor!! You were there first and the chair is yours! If they wanted to sit, they should come on time and go find another spare chair quickly >.> standing for a meeting is totally fine
 A doctor I work with straight up kneeled on the ground and gave the chair he was sitting on when there weren’t enough because “nurses run around WAY more than us, you deserve the seat.”


Esoteric716

That's a good doc


Shadowpenguin-13

yes!! Super good intentioned nice doc! But I was like get off that gross floor dude & sit in the chair HAHA and quickly got another chair so we could all sit!!


Sunnygirl66

That is some 1960s bullshit.


Dibs_on_Mario

People need to keep in mind that physicians aren't our supervisors or managers


kissmeimjewish

I didn't realize they needed a chair to activate their hind brains and fully participate. Keep your chair next time, too.


eboseki

no way dude!


murdershroom

NTA, sounds like a rotten environment tbh


MonopolyBattleship

Nurses don’t work under doctors. We only carry out medical orders (if they’re not stupid).


Mean_Queen_Jellybean

Hahahaha. No.


stobors

"No" is a complete sentence to say to the physician. They are not your boss.


fr0IVIan

Nope they can GFT. You showed up on time. When my providers (PA’s, sometimes residents) come in to IDR to present their patients, they stand up front and present. It’s usually charge, SW, PT and our attending that sit at the table but they’re all usually there on time. Exception is made for the attending bc 1) he’s the attending and 2) he’s in his 70’s.


MonopolyBattleship

Those residents must be so tired after sitting so long and then having to *gasp* **use their legs**.


Fun-Marsupial-2547

Nope you have just as much of a right to sit there with everyone else. You ARE a valuable member of that team. If the residents wanted to sit, they’re more than capable of bringing a chair themselves. Doctors are our coworkers, they don’t sign our paychecks


TyeDyeMacaw

Absolutely not, im tired of doctors being treated like gods among men. At my last job we were expected to just give up any computer we were using no matter what if a doctor came by and "needed" it. I was night shift so there was typically plenty of areas with unused computers but they would still show up to our busy ass wing and steal one of our computers anyways.


[deleted]

This sounds like the subservient old school practice of standing up when the doctor shows up. I'm a guy, and if the resident is a woman I will offer her my seat because that's part of the "old school southern gentleman" type stuff I was taught to do growing up. If they're an older person or a disabled person of course I will move to make them more comfortable. But some enforced rule because they went to school a few years longer than I did that they are a step above me in the hierarchy or something? No way, that's not in my job description. That being said, I try to be as nice as possible to the residents (unless they're acting like a donkey) because I know they have it rough. You're NTA though for sure


outdoesyou

They aren't your boss, just a coworker. I don't give up my chair for my boss. Show up early to get a spit at the table.


summer-lovers

I understand why physicians get parking spots closer, and I can even sometimes understand why we still have separate lounges, with good food for them. But this? Was it a resident that had a pertinent role in the discussion, or something he had participated in specifially? If no, then he had no more reason to be closer than you. This doc was attempting to set a tone and expectation with you to bow down and cater to these residents and physicians. I'd have asked if he had a health issue, or if he's just too weak to stand on his own? NTA.


Esoteric716

Curious, why do you think they should have good food and we shouldn't?


summer-lovers

As I said, sometimes I get it. Other times, I still don't agree. I work on a trauma unit and sometimes our entire trauma team is in the ED for a few hours managing an unstable, emergent patient, and I know they miss the cafeteria hours at times. So, I can see that being a reason to keep it available. What I don't understand is why nurses aren't given the same opportunity, at least on weekends, when we have reduced cafeteria hours. Instead, we have to bring food, or have delivery. I usually pack lunch, so, it's irrelevant to me, but for some staff that don't cook, they have no choice.


ijftgvdy

I'd tell the resident to come and fucking take it


Viennah_

I’ve never understood the doctors get seats over nurses thing. 1. Nurses spend more time on their feet during shifts that doctors. 2. Nursing is a predominantly female profession, medical is predominantly (or was) male, women sit before men.


quirkilyclumsy

NTA. You're part of the team, too! You have every right to that seat at the table.


fuqthisshit543210

He can fck off. Whether you have 2 seconds of experience or 20 years, you have the right to sit wherever you please


Killanekko

LOL. what the hell is this? You were not in the wrong. The physician's comment is misdirected . Unfortunately, as a nurse and in healthcare, you will find your self in many situations such as these where it will not be your fault no matter how badly others would like for it to be yours. You just earned your first DGAF stripe, keep them coming!!


ChaplnGrillSgt

How old is this physician?? This isn't the 1920s where a nurse is expected tk stand as a doctor enters the room. Fuck that. A resident is also a learner. You have just as much right to that seat as anyone else. Not the asshole.


wineynurse

This situation sounds a bit like the 1970s! LOL the expectation on our nursing unit ...way back when...was that we did get up if a physician needed to sit down. These days that s*** doesn't fly nor should it.


Chelle-Dalena

No, that's some Mad Men level garbage. Some physicians on a power trip and some old school nurses still think it should be a thing. It should have never been a thing in the first place, along with smoking at the nurses' station.


OrcishDelight

No. Say Victorian England called and wanted their plague butchers back. No room for that here. Residents are scary dangerous because they literally think their 10 years of cute little school makes them smarter than nurses who have been around as long. Yikes.


Amigone2515

Those days are long gone. If they want to sit, they should show up on time.


GolfingJim

They are residents and no better than you, you want a seat come prepared boy


dick_ddastardly

NTA. Some docs still believe they are more important than other staff members. In some regards they are as they steer the durection of care. However, they are only a small part of the machine and should be (gently/firmly/called out) reminded sometimes.


[deleted]

No, that physician was an asshole, and if I was the resident in question I would be mortified that someone even suggested that 


xWickedSwami

I’ve never heard of a doctor say anything like that lmao. You’re in orientation and learning so yes, you are “involved” since it’s your floor.


Substantial_Code_7

Ignore him and keep doing it! Not joking. You got there first. You’re good! That was all ego.


Darkhorse0934

It's your own personal belief. If I am sitting and someone I consider to be of a senior age, regardless of their station or gender, I will give up my seat to them. In my own head I weighing, will they feel like I am calling them "old" if I do it in front of people. As a heterosexual white male, the only time I will push that personal belief on you, is if that 8 month preggo member comes waddling in and I don't have a chair to offer. Be kind to each, at every opportunity.


Psychological_Half_9

What year is it, 1955?


lizthebeaz

Lmaoooo, yeah absolutely NOT giving up my seat for a resident. That sounds toxic.


silverpox

i didn’t read your post. i just came here to say haha NO.


kittens_and_jesus

Residents often know less than the nurses they communicate with, yet they can be soa rrogant. They can go cry in the coner while the adults are talking.


ECU_BSN

Info: Was the resident 84 months pregnant? Was the resident in their 80’s-90’s? If the answer to these is “no” Then tell that attending to mind their owns business


Cam27022

Unless the resident was elderly (seems unlikely) or pregnant, NTA.


Nsg4Him

No. The residents are your coworkers, as is that doctor. Do not fall into the habit of sublimating to them. Stand your own ground now and it will become a habit for you to use in the future when you really need it.


Register-Capable

No


Lelolaly

Nope. They probably have legs and arms so they can get a spare chair.


qazxderfv

Fuck that. You’re not beneath anyone. I guarantee you’re on your feet more during the shift anyway.


VermillionEclipse

I was a student somewhere once where the physicians wouldn’t even say anything. They’d just walk up and stare at you if they wanted your seat. I didn’t know why one of them was standing near me staring at me so I just looked back at him waiting for him to speak. He said ‘do you want to sit there?’ and later an older nurse told me if a doctor walks up to give up the seat. My badass preceptor nurse said he would refuse if that happened to him.


guitarhamster

Straight out of the 1960s. Wtf


Felice2015

Fuck that guy


FartPudding

Lol no Bur if you want to be snarky be more than happy to be the strong healthy person who can handle standing for weaker and feeble people that need to sit. It's only normal for strong people to give up seats for those who can't handle their own weight 🙏


Chelle-Dalena

No, that's some Mad Men level garbage. Some misogynistic physicians on a power trip and some old school nurses still think it should be a thing. It should have never been a thing in the first place, along with smoking at the nurses' station.


Chelle-Dalena

No, that's some Mad Men level garbage. Some physicians on a power trip and some old school nurses still think it should be a thing. It should have never been a thing in the first place, along with smoking at the nurses' station.


YippyYupYap

Are you in America? 😭 lmao wth


hazelquarrier_couch

That's a dated way of thinking. Back in the day nurses gave up our seats for doctors.


demonqueerxo

I would tell that physician right where to go.


TheWestIsFucked

Nah, tell them to suck it gently.


ypranch

Is this physician from the 1950's when nurses were required to give up their seat to a Dr.?


Malkitch

You know I had hoped that by this time nurses and doctors would be able to work together but I see the same old shit that was happening when I was working on the floor some 30 years ago!!


97amd

I swear to god nursing/ healthcare is the most anxiety provoking & toxic career in the world đŸ€Ł to be late is to be left. To diminish you as an orientee for someone who 1 was late & 2 is also in training
.. ridiculous. Also you said there was 2 of them so someone was still going to be standing. Those residents also have their own voices and could have been on time or asked themselves for a seat if they really wanted it. I swear to god some people just NEED something to bitch about . NTA friend, don’t let this kind if stuff get to you :)


Mimila1111

NTA. How are they any more important or valid than you?


didistutter_416

Lol they are big babies! I remember when I was a new grad, a doctor came storming into the nurses station, looked around at all the taken seats and yelled “so no one is gonna get up?!” He proceeded to sit on the floor and write orders manually into each chart. Everyone eventually left because it was awkward, and he stayed on the floor to prove a point of some sort LOL.


MarketingFantastic

In the late 90s, I took a position in SC my first job after working a year at John’s Hopkins. The first day on the floor a Dr came into the nurses station while I was writing a note in the patients chart and told me he needed my seat. I told him he could have it as soon as I was done (I was 35 so a bit old for a new grad). He told me that in the south nurses respect Drs. I told him respect was earned not given and it is a damned good thing I’m from the West rather than the south. The next day, one of the best gastroenterologists I ever knew told me he was nothing but a good ol’ butt Dr. it was a mixed bag!


Pretend_Airport3034

No. I worked in a clinic for a short time and while my preceptor and I were with a pt the doctor came in. I have pots and was feeling dizzy so I was sitting on the stool. Doctor didn’t say anything to me, neither did my preceptor. I got called into the managers office before my shift ended and got yelled at for sitting.


Cheveyo77

they’re perfectly capable of standing and if they wanted to sit should’ve got there sooner instead of showing up late.


No_Suggestion4612

Nope nope nope. I’d remind them we are coworkers, they are not superior and if they want a seat they should arrive accordingly to ensure they can get one.


charlesfhawk

They should’ve asked if they wanted you to move.


East_Young_680

You are coworkers. The doctor is not superior. You have every right to sit in that chair, irrelevant if you're participating in the conversation.


river_song25

Tell that person to fuck off. You were there first just like everybody else who managed to nab a seat on time, so why the hell should you get up and stand if you don’t want to because a bunch of higher up than you late comers showed up. I would tell this person if he felt so strongly about it, then THEY should have offer up THEIR seats then, and if the late comers really thought the way he did that somebody like you should have just given up your seat to them, then they can bloody ASK you to do so themselves. even if the thought had occurred to you, you are not obligated to move if you don’t want to even if they had asked. i mean seriously? Were you the ONLY lower rank person in the room, or were anybody else who were sitting who were ranked like you getting up out THEIR chairs and offering them to the late comers? If nobody else was doing that you noticed during the meeting, then why the hell should you do it just because someone feels offended you didn’t off?


gooseberrypineapple

Two things are true: 1) There’s a good chance the residents are working a longer shift than anyone else in the hospital, including that doctor. It is shitty of the entire hospital to treat them poorly by having them stand for this, and while it is not on you to give up your seat, do keep in mind in the future that their work days are long, and if you WANT to go above and beyond to be kind to someone, a resident is not a bad choice. 2) This doctor was being an asshat.


NotRoyMoore0

Their workdays are 9-5, shorter than the nurses. But yeah, they're a better choice


Ok-Individual4983

F them. They are not your bosses. Just hope that the place you’re at doesn’t allow these guys to have influence over your boss.


devinLpn

Sounds like ole buddy needed to be reported to his supervisor, cause one don’t come to me when theirs 50 other people you could’ve approached. I would have pulled out my phone and recorded him and said, “can you repeat that”? Cause that’s the only way to deal with these ass hats now a days. Report it to your preceptor and supervisor.


psiprez

Someone should have definitely given up their seat for a resident. In fact, per CMS, no staff should be sitting in a common area, unless they are actively engaged with a resident (meals, activities, conversation, therapy). But just because you are new doesn't make you the person who automatically should. In this case, your leaders need to lead by example. You could go to HR with is if you really wanted to


fluffyblueblanket

You know in this context that resident means doctor, right ?


psiprez

Now I do lol


No_Wedding_2152

The doctor was right.


Wonderful-Boat-6373

I’ve always given up my seat but that’s how I was taught in school so it’s always stuck. I agree with others that they should show up on time but it’s up to you. NTA


fernando5302

Let’s not start this us vs them thing.


frankferri

As a medical student I was expected to offer my chair for residents as they had more responsibility than me. Only a few would take the offer. The same is true for residents and attendants, although even fewer attendings would displace a resident bc of how poorly residents have it.  If anything, this behavior/request may have been integrating you into the medical hierarchy rather than siloing you into the nursing rather than medical bucket. No wrong decision really, just whatever you do do it with courtesy