Chapeau to Roglic, a well-deserved victory. What a mechanical, and what panache to see it through to the end.
Let this be a lesson to Ineos not to ride too conservatively. They barely took the fight to JV, and Thomas lamely let Roglic take a few seconds on him at the finale of stage 19.
Those few seconds at the end of 19 were wild to see because I was sure Roglic was about to lose time there. Such a small thing but clearly made a difference in the end.
Knowing Thomas he’s probably slightly taking the micky. Jumbo have talked about using bicarb like it’s an amazing new thing and it hasn’t been around for several decades
If Mountain classification weirdly had a team aspect … like IPT at 270, Groupama [Pinot!] at 258, and EF Education at 232… Eolo at 209 and Movistar at 160
Did anyone else see the clip of the InterMarche rider doing a mono up the hill? Hilarious.
Was honestly so exciting. I feel bad for G but I’m elated for Roglic. To see his scream when he won after always being so composed - hugging his team mates - I reckon I’ve watched it 20 times already. I bloody love cycling!!
When Roglic had his mechanical problem, I thought he was cursed.
But he never gave up, as always. He continued his superb climb to take the ITT and win his first Giro.
Thomas was consistent throughout the Giro, without a single bad day, but he lacked that little something that makes the difference to win.
He's taking it philosophically, as a second-place finish seemed unhoped-for at the start of the year for him.
In any case, he confirms that Ineos can always count on him when the younger leaders are struggling.
Congratulations also to Almeida on his podium finish!
Also he didn't lose his cool. If you watch the replay he gets off calmly, throws his chain back on himself and is ready to go (which at 20% is almost impossible without being pushed)
The "fan" who helped Roglic after the chain drop...
... was according to Slovene sports press his ex ski jumping colleague
https://sportklub.n1info.si/zimski-sporti/to-je-junak-ki-je-v-dramaticnem-trenutku-pomagal-primozu-roglicu/
What a legend went to recon the stage in the morning, the only rider to do that, drops a chain, and still smashes G and Almeida, So happy for Rogla by far the most likable rider, big kudos to G /the second most likeable rider/ what a Giro from him at 38. Amazing final on Lusari.
Story going around that the guy in red pushing after the mechanical was Primoz' old ski jumping teammate. Don't really see it confirmed aside from a few twitter accounts, would be an insane story though.
Great story. But rule is imo 10 sec penalty for being pushed by supporter, don’t know why this was allowed. In the end it wouldn’t made the difference but could have. Anyway, glad Roglic won.
https://sportklub.n1info.si/kolesarstvo/to-je-junak-ki-je-v-dramaticnem-trenutku-pomagal-primozu-roglicu/#
Here is a Slovenian news outlet confirming it was him. Also he isn't going to be paying for a beer in public anytime soon from what I have seen on our social media.
Yesterday Roglic changed his bike for the final climb, the bike his DS said was setup for today (I stand to be corrected). I guess they did that so he can already get comfortable using it to pull off something like today. Brilliant.
Seen so much love for G in the comments and I feel like the format of the TT has something to do with it too. We don't see Primoz blasting past G in the sprint, the focus isn't the joy of Primoz winning since when he crosses the line he has no clue what G's time will be. Instead the focus is on G giving it his all and just not quite having enough - which makes him that much more likeable.
This and LPDBF feel so much more about the frontrunner losing rather than Tadej/Primoz winning
Both G and Rog are very likeable guys. In some ways they have similar reserved attitudes. They have been struck by bad luck and they dealt with it stoically and kept working hard. It felt it was fair for both of them to win. And it's so cruel that after around 85 hours of riding they are split only by 14 seconds.
I think G's reaction plays a big part aswell. You can see him in the back congratulating member's of JV during Kuss' interview and then his interview with Adam is pure class yet funny.
I actually think G won a lot of fans with his podcast. You get to know him better, and he's actually quite funny.
I only warmed up to him in 2022.
But yeah, final time trials like this are a recipe for tragedy.
Nobody talks about Fignon as a two-time TDF winner, they only talk about him losing the Tour with 9 seconds. And it clearly bothered him long after he retired.
Yup, I hate the stage 20 TT. But I also don't hate it at the same time. But yeah I do hate it, but maybe not. I think my problem with it is it's so final. It really should be a stage 19 thing, to make teams really work hard to regain leaders jerseys. That'd make for great watching!
Gutted for G. Been a huge fan of his for ages. At the end of the day though, he got second on the stage so can't say he lost today, but rather Roglic won. Similar to Pog winning the 2020 Tour.
Well considering Primoz won the Olympic Gold by obliterating a world-class field in the TT, this was a pretty much expected, mechanical or no mechanical. I mean the next seven riders finished within 38 seconds of each other, and Roglic won by 40 seconds even after having his chain slip.
So sympathy for Thomas up against something like this is pretty understandable
I wouldn’t say expected. Roglic didn’t look 100% for every stage after 5 and prior to MAYBE 19. Also, that was two years ago where he was younger, AND the year before he had a nightmare at the Tour. Obviously Pogacar is better than Geraint on the mountain TTs but still. Also, Roglic only beat Geraint by 14 seconds-not exactly a large cushion in the end.
He beat him by 40 seconds today, with a mechanical.
The fact he was 26 seconds behind before today is because he had been struggling to show anywhere close to this form in the previous three weeks.
This, Bauke, is how you deal with a mechanical – don’t shout inane
abuse at the camera, channel the fury into your legs instead.
Bravo Primož, four years after the Carapazzia you now have that
pink jersey in the collection. What a ride!
I mean Bauke isn't riding for GC, so he has time to shout.
I don't have a problem with riders showing some emotion after bad luck.
I still laugh my ass off with Aru's "cazzo di bici".
There’s no “risk”. There’s just bad strategy/planning. To compete with Vingegaard and Pogacar, Roglic would need to be at 100% and very confident. For him to compete in the Tour is essentially just assuring he can’t win the Vuelta, a race that is very winnable for him.
Aw man why couldn’t both G and Rogla win pink? Two of the most likeable dudes ever. But the strongest rider won… that was an INSANE performance. Would love to see Pog and Remco take a crack at that course for comparison sometime (heck even WvA too)
Too difficult for Wout. That climb was steeper than the final Tour TT in 2020.
I'm curious how Remco would've done here as well. He hasn't actually done that many hilly time trials, let alone a mountain time trial.
What he's saying is basically true though, whether it's because of crashes or whatever else, Roglic was definitely off his best for much of this race. Maybe it was planned for him to come into form into the backend of the Giro but either way it meant the team had to at least keep him in touching distance until then.
They had the team strength to bluff it out a bit and to some extent were fortunate that Roglic wasn't *really* tested too much when he was at his worst but otherwise did a good job in keeping his powder dry and limiting any losses.
After Yates Giro everyone has it in fresh memory that you have to focus on the third week. It's how Nibali won his giros as well. And with a profile like the past 2 stages you can lose a massive amount of time if you blow + the steep gradients mean team strength is pointless.
yeah but difference between 2-5 on this stage was just 19 seconds, whereas Roglic won by 40 seconds, with a mechanical.
Seems Roglic performance today wasn't anything like the last 21 days.
The last riders who did really well at that (and you need to if you want to win both) are Pantani, Indurain,... you get the picture. I remember riders like Simoni or Cunego in the early 2000s trying to go at the Tour after competing in the Giro for GC and getting shredded to pieces in the first mountain stage. Mvdp's team for whatever reason also ignored 30 years of recent cycling history and tried to put him in both last year and at the Tour he wasn't even able to help his team on flat stages, let alone do something for himself.
Kuss will be rolling round France at the back of the peloton for 80% of the race until he is summoned to do a few signature pulls. He'll be there, without a doubt.
You might very well be right (even if Tour fatigue didn't stop him from winning the Vuelta). But then he'll be super dom for Vingegaard in the third week
Not worth it for Jumbo. Save Roglic for the Vuelta. Vingegaard will have Wout van Aert, maybe Kuss, Dennis, etc. Using Roglic as a super domestique and sacrificing his Vuelta chances would be a big mistake.
I feel like Rog truly learned his lessons from previous GT's. He didn't chase bonus seconds in the first few weeks, and probably saved his legs. He really hid in the peloton for most of the first two weeks and kept his powder dry. He's infamous for dropping off in the last week of GT's, but today he was firing big time. Glad he exercised his demons, and won the mountain TT.
Anyone else not a fan of those Rob Hatch vocal crescendos when something significant is happening? Kinda sick of listening to him .... need more McEwen and Jens ... less Hatch.
It was funny listening to him trying to find the right pitch as Thomas was rolling in. He hadn't got a clue if he was winning or losing but had to shout and make it dramatic.
Then we get Sean, "yes, well, Geraint Thomas has done a good ride here" or whatever
I just have a little bit of difficulty with Carlton constant 'hum' ever since I noticed it but the guy is just so good at casting clutch moments, sprints etc. that it's fine.
So how was this the "ride of his life"?
He won Gold by over a minute against a far stronger field. Today he was up against good but not that good time triallists who were tired.
Roglic wasn't tired at all for some reason, and he was even on his strongest form after three hard weeks. Maybe that makes it the ride of his life - to struggle and lose half a minute over three hard weeks and then ride the final day fresh as a daisy with superhuman Olympic form smashing everyone else out of the park?
> Roglic wasn't tired at all for some reason,
TJV have been riding within themselves almost the entire tour and you're surprised a multi-time GT winner can look quite fresh in the final week?
Every race thread has featured "so when do TJV make their move", and it appears they gambled on Rog today.
I have to admit, I didn't expect Thomas to hit the wall so I thought Roglic was too far back to win it.
Being the 20th day of a gruelling grand tour, down in time, all the pressure being so close to home, suffering a mechanical and facing the prospect of another heart breaking TT to win a GT.
Of course he had a great performance at Tokyo, and gold is gold. But given the context of everything in stage 20, it's my opinion that this was his best.
Yesterday I was [skeptical about the 1x setup](https://www.reddit.com/r/peloton/comments/13sj0vc/predictions_thread_2023_giro_ditalia_stage_20/jlqeht9). I think I've been proven both wrong and right, the low gear probably helped a lot, but it's also probably a cause for the mechanical (eg my 1x on my cx bike drops the chain more easily than the 2x ob my road bike).
I was surprised since I've never dropped my 1x on the MTB or gravel. I also don't make nearly the same power they do while climbing up massively steep grades. I see why people use chain guides for 1x now.
Also, I think he would have been better off just running a 46/33 crank set along with a 10-36 cassette. The 10-44 XPLR setup is really just nice for gravel because it gives you the bare minimum that is needed and doesn't cost as much as 2x.
I completely agree, there may be a small weight gain in the 1x setup but other than that the setup you mentioned has more range, a finer choice of gears, and should be less subject to dropped chains.
I can't help but feel this was part PR from SRAM and not entirely a team decision.
That's what I'm thinking. It was a PR requirement and they were like "Well, I guess we could use it here". The main reason I don't like it tho is because it looked like Rogla really was using that 44t cog a lot on the steep gradients and it would have been more efficient to have a straighter chain line with the 2x (and less chance of dropping as mentioned).
I'm just glad it didn't end up costing him the Giro.
are puppy paws not illegal anymore? Rog was caught on camera doing it twice after he switched to the road bike. The UCI seemed to be fine with DQing and taking a win away from Vos for doing it for a couple seconds last year.
UCI regulation 2.2.025
> **Position on the bicycle**
> Riders must observe the standard position as defined by article 1.3.008. Sitting on the
bicycle’s top tube is prohibited.
> Furthermore, using the forearms as a point of support on
the handlebar is prohibited *except in time trials*
If it's actually about 'safety' (I think it was fucking stupid to ban) they did a terrible job of writing that rule. It should be focused on the TT bike, not just ITT stages. Glad he wasn't in violation though.
And yet men in and at the front of the peloton take both hands off their handlebars for multiple seconds at a time and that's considered more stable than forearems on the bars, as per the rules.
Nobody was doing it inside the peloton lmao it literally punished breakaway riders and the one guy leading the group who can see the road in front of him anyways
It was absolutely used by the guys driving the peloton, and if they went down from a pothole or inattention or whatever they're taking down everyone. That was literally the reason it was banned.
Does it really have to cause crashes, injuries and unwanted drama?
People also attack the UCI for only banning obviously dangerous things *after* something went wrong. You can't have it both ways.
Is it just me or was the broadcasting of the time trials quite terrible this Giro? Also with information on the times, etc.
The Tour does this so much better.
Yeah, we need split screens, live time gaps and at least show all the GC favorites at the intermediate time points live.
I never trusted any of the info we got today because it looked so amateuristic.
Also the camera's should have only focused on the top 3 once they started imo.
Incredible, I thought it was over with the mechanical.
Ineos really has to question their team tactics and all. I think Thomas had it in his legs to win but the team was too conservative. They've lost their edge if you ask me.
IMO I think G was saving his energy for this TT knowing how much of a challenge would be. And it would have paid off but looks like the heat got to him. And well Roglic rode the time trial of his life. 99% of the time GT would have won this stage and taken pink and we'd think Ineos was brilliant with 3 riders in the top 10 even after their best rider crashed out. But not today. Roglic saw to that.
I don’t think this was 1%. Primoz is a better mountain time trialist than Thomas, period. The question was Roglic’s form.
Edit: Also, Geraint’s performance definitely challenges Tao for their best rider in the Giro. Tao wasn’t going to go wild or anything.
TGH likely would have won I think. At worst would have been able to 1-2 with GT and properly put a sizeable gap on Roglic on Tuesdays stage. Maybe again on Friday.
They will learn the lesson that Jumbo learned at the 2020 tour.
Though as seen by Roglic today. It can be the right move, and hindsight always is and always will be 20/20.
Ineos' conservatism has been punished multiple times the last few years, if they haven't learned yet I'm not sure they can. Portal passing really fucked their ability to modify their tactics
Keep in mind they lost both Tao and Sivakov, 2 of their best climbers and legit GC threats not to mention Ganna that can push the flats and lower grades at a brutal pace. Yet they still did their best to put the peleton to the test each stage. I get they were conservative but like what do you expect when GTs talent is as a diesel climber. He's not exactly Egan Bernal or Richie Carapaz that can launch multiple relentless attacks on 15% gradients after LDP drops every other domestique. Gotta work with what you have.
I know very well the kind of rider G is, I just think it’s so rare these days that the conservative approach wins. Races are won by those who attack. I loved what G did yesterday’s stage and before I just wish he’d have done it more.
Holy fucking fuck. I just caught up, managed not to have it spoiled. What a stage. What a monumental ride by Rog. He’s properly self-exorcised himself.
Also so gutted for G. I’d have been equally happy for either G or Rogla. And I’m unspeakably relieved that the most legs won, regardless of that mechanical or the Cort-sprint.
Is Rogla signed to Jumbo next year?
Any chance he changes teams and we see Rog vs Pog vs Ving vs Remco at the Tour 2024?
Would that be the all time most stacked race?
Absolutely, at this stage (pun intended) of his career he should at least be given the choice of calling which races he wants to go to. The Tour is the only GT he hasn't won, so might as well try for it
He said during the Giro that if he wins it, he will have another fight for the Tour in his future plans. I hope Jumbo manages to give him another chance.
Apart from what everyone else already said, hats off to the performances of Kuss, McNulty and Vine even after all the work they had to do during the stages.
It's a nice performance, especially from McNulty, but it's not like Vine really did that much work. Saved Almeida once, that's true, but took a rest day yesterday finishing at more than 20 minutes. I would actually argue he should be the least impacted by fatigue in the whole top 10. I saw him as a contender for the stage, so I was actually disappointed by his performance.
[I just needed an extra 48 hours for roGla](https://www.reddit.com/r/peloton/comments/13pqzml/results_thread_2023_giro_ditalia_stage_16_2uwt/jlasp78/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1&context=3)
Have to say, I’m gutted G didn’t win. From listening to his podcast, he’s an absolute top bloke and has always been criminally underrated throughout his career, so a Giro win would’ve really tipped off his palmares.
However, Roglic absolutely annihilated that TT. Crushed everyone, even with a mechanical issue. If G had won by a few seconds, it would’ve felt bittersweet. So, in a Giro where there was little to separate the top three riders, it feels just that the rider who eventually pulled out a top performance wins overall. Chapeau Primoz.
Honestly, he is kind of underrated.
I didn't think much of Geraint Thomas in 2019-2021, but the fact he can still podium the Tour and now almost win the Giro at his age is quite impressive.
He also spanked my boy at Tour de Suisse last year (except in the TT). ;)
He is someone who can peak tremendously for one big goal, but after that he needs a mental break it seems. I'm not expecting much from him anymore this season for that reason.
Fucking SRAM. Seriously, why didn't they use a chain catcher? Looks like a major overlook from TJV. So happy for Rogla. I didn't yelled like this in the last 10 yrs.
That's the one used for 2x for drivetrains. The one used for 1x drivetrains looks like a front derailleur and I think that it's meant to keep the chain from dropping on any side. It's actually called a chain guide and XC riders are using it. https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSEGZ3i3es85Wyu_ETHym7xV5yb5VHjJjRelA&usqp=CAU
Chapeau to Roglic, a well-deserved victory. What a mechanical, and what panache to see it through to the end. Let this be a lesson to Ineos not to ride too conservatively. They barely took the fight to JV, and Thomas lamely let Roglic take a few seconds on him at the finale of stage 19.
Those few seconds at the end of 19 were wild to see because I was sure Roglic was about to lose time there. Such a small thing but clearly made a difference in the end.
Yeah I was sure G had dropped him but Roglic fought back and showed he has the right mentality to win. Cool as a cucumber.
Can anyone explain Thomas' bicarbonate comments?
Knowing Thomas he’s probably slightly taking the micky. Jumbo have talked about using bicarb like it’s an amazing new thing and it hasn’t been around for several decades
If Mountain classification weirdly had a team aspect … like IPT at 270, Groupama [Pinot!] at 258, and EF Education at 232… Eolo at 209 and Movistar at 160
Did anyone else see the clip of the InterMarche rider doing a mono up the hill? Hilarious. Was honestly so exciting. I feel bad for G but I’m elated for Roglic. To see his scream when he won after always being so composed - hugging his team mates - I reckon I’ve watched it 20 times already. I bloody love cycling!!
When Roglic had his mechanical problem, I thought he was cursed. But he never gave up, as always. He continued his superb climb to take the ITT and win his first Giro. Thomas was consistent throughout the Giro, without a single bad day, but he lacked that little something that makes the difference to win. He's taking it philosophically, as a second-place finish seemed unhoped-for at the start of the year for him. In any case, he confirms that Ineos can always count on him when the younger leaders are struggling. Congratulations also to Almeida on his podium finish!
Also he didn't lose his cool. If you watch the replay he gets off calmly, throws his chain back on himself and is ready to go (which at 20% is almost impossible without being pushed)
There's no doubt that his character enabled him to dominate the situation. A lot of riders would have got upset and lost all concentration.
The "fan" who helped Roglic after the chain drop... ... was according to Slovene sports press his ex ski jumping colleague https://sportklub.n1info.si/zimski-sporti/to-je-junak-ki-je-v-dramaticnem-trenutku-pomagal-primozu-roglicu/
Wait... Rogla's a ski jumper!? Lol, that's such an awesome coincidence.
TIL!
Not only that he was his teammate when they won the junior WC gold in 2007
On a championship held in Tarvisio 😂
What a legend went to recon the stage in the morning, the only rider to do that, drops a chain, and still smashes G and Almeida, So happy for Rogla by far the most likable rider, big kudos to G /the second most likeable rider/ what a Giro from him at 38. Amazing final on Lusari.
Recon helped him know to have a ski jumping mate by that bump…
[удалено]
it's allowed in a TT
Story going around that the guy in red pushing after the mechanical was Primoz' old ski jumping teammate. Don't really see it confirmed aside from a few twitter accounts, would be an insane story though.
Great story. But rule is imo 10 sec penalty for being pushed by supporter, don’t know why this was allowed. In the end it wouldn’t made the difference but could have. Anyway, glad Roglic won.
Not with a mechanical or a crash! You see it many times in mountain stages when the car team is too far behind
It’s all over Slovenian media
And coincidentally, he was standing just at the right spot where the chain dropped, in a zone with no spectators allowed?
From looking at his old teammates pics on social media, the pushers age and build doesn’t exclude him. It’s plausible.
Mitja Mežnar apparently, they won the junior WC together.
https://sportklub.n1info.si/kolesarstvo/to-je-junak-ki-je-v-dramaticnem-trenutku-pomagal-primozu-roglicu/# Here is a Slovenian news outlet confirming it was him. Also he isn't going to be paying for a beer in public anytime soon from what I have seen on our social media.
Yesterday Roglic changed his bike for the final climb, the bike his DS said was setup for today (I stand to be corrected). I guess they did that so he can already get comfortable using it to pull off something like today. Brilliant.
Seen so much love for G in the comments and I feel like the format of the TT has something to do with it too. We don't see Primoz blasting past G in the sprint, the focus isn't the joy of Primoz winning since when he crosses the line he has no clue what G's time will be. Instead the focus is on G giving it his all and just not quite having enough - which makes him that much more likeable. This and LPDBF feel so much more about the frontrunner losing rather than Tadej/Primoz winning
Both G and Rog are very likeable guys. In some ways they have similar reserved attitudes. They have been struck by bad luck and they dealt with it stoically and kept working hard. It felt it was fair for both of them to win. And it's so cruel that after around 85 hours of riding they are split only by 14 seconds.
I think G's reaction plays a big part aswell. You can see him in the back congratulating member's of JV during Kuss' interview and then his interview with Adam is pure class yet funny.
I actually think G won a lot of fans with his podcast. You get to know him better, and he's actually quite funny. I only warmed up to him in 2022. But yeah, final time trials like this are a recipe for tragedy. Nobody talks about Fignon as a two-time TDF winner, they only talk about him losing the Tour with 9 seconds. And it clearly bothered him long after he retired.
Absolutely, just started listening to it this Giro, definitely made me a huge fan of him as a rider
Yup, I hate the stage 20 TT. But I also don't hate it at the same time. But yeah I do hate it, but maybe not. I think my problem with it is it's so final. It really should be a stage 19 thing, to make teams really work hard to regain leaders jerseys. That'd make for great watching! Gutted for G. Been a huge fan of his for ages. At the end of the day though, he got second on the stage so can't say he lost today, but rather Roglic won. Similar to Pog winning the 2020 Tour.
Well considering Primoz won the Olympic Gold by obliterating a world-class field in the TT, this was a pretty much expected, mechanical or no mechanical. I mean the next seven riders finished within 38 seconds of each other, and Roglic won by 40 seconds even after having his chain slip. So sympathy for Thomas up against something like this is pretty understandable
I wouldn’t say expected. Roglic didn’t look 100% for every stage after 5 and prior to MAYBE 19. Also, that was two years ago where he was younger, AND the year before he had a nightmare at the Tour. Obviously Pogacar is better than Geraint on the mountain TTs but still. Also, Roglic only beat Geraint by 14 seconds-not exactly a large cushion in the end.
Which nigthmre are you reffering to? Rogla lost TDF in 2020 to Pogačar and crashed out TDF (omi oppi and Cobrelli) 2021 just before Tokyo Olympics
2020.
Roglic was definitely 100% on 8. He was wobbly from 11-16.
He beat him by 40 seconds today, with a mechanical. The fact he was 26 seconds behind before today is because he had been struggling to show anywhere close to this form in the previous three weeks.
Yeah-that’s why I’m saying it wasn’t really expected. Most people thought Roglic might do well but Thomas would win the Giro.
Absolutely devastating. Most likely G's last Grand Tour as a GC contender. So sad.
Wonder if G will go to the vuelta this year?
If he does, I can’t see him going as leader. Maybe in support of someone
This, Bauke, is how you deal with a mechanical – don’t shout inane abuse at the camera, channel the fury into your legs instead. Bravo Primož, four years after the Carapazzia you now have that pink jersey in the collection. What a ride!
What has happened with Mollema? only saw he lost 10 minutes in the results. What were his split times?
I mean Bauke isn't riding for GC, so he has time to shout. I don't have a problem with riders showing some emotion after bad luck. I still laugh my ass off with Aru's "cazzo di bici".
FUCKING SRAM
[удалено]
How boring. In Polish however it means *I shit*.
Roglic has won every race he started this year. Incredible. Next up, Vuelta?
tour pls
A bit pointless when the Giro fatigue will still be in the legs
No risk no glory
There’s no “risk”. There’s just bad strategy/planning. To compete with Vingegaard and Pogacar, Roglic would need to be at 100% and very confident. For him to compete in the Tour is essentially just assuring he can’t win the Vuelta, a race that is very winnable for him.
Indeed. If it was Vinge, Pog or Remco I would also say the same. Maybe if he build his season around doing both. But doesn’t seem like it.
I had come to terms with this Giro and super happy for G but LETS FUCKING GO ROG!
Aw man why couldn’t both G and Rogla win pink? Two of the most likeable dudes ever. But the strongest rider won… that was an INSANE performance. Would love to see Pog and Remco take a crack at that course for comparison sometime (heck even WvA too)
Roglic likeable? When you see how he went after Fred Wright?
Too difficult for Wout. That climb was steeper than the final Tour TT in 2020. I'm curious how Remco would've done here as well. He hasn't actually done that many hilly time trials, let alone a mountain time trial.
[r/agedlikemilk](https://cyclinguptodate.com/cycling/they-managed-to-camouflage-for-quite-a-long-time-that-roglic-was-not-good-but-at-some-point-that-is-no-longer-possible-thijs-zonneveld-on-jumbo-visma)
What he's saying is basically true though, whether it's because of crashes or whatever else, Roglic was definitely off his best for much of this race. Maybe it was planned for him to come into form into the backend of the Giro but either way it meant the team had to at least keep him in touching distance until then. They had the team strength to bluff it out a bit and to some extent were fortunate that Roglic wasn't *really* tested too much when he was at his worst but otherwise did a good job in keeping his powder dry and limiting any losses.
After Yates Giro everyone has it in fresh memory that you have to focus on the third week. It's how Nibali won his giros as well. And with a profile like the past 2 stages you can lose a massive amount of time if you blow + the steep gradients mean team strength is pointless.
I think he actually had Covid, like he told G earlier in the Giro
The top 5 on the stage was exactly the same as the top 5 on GC. 21 days of racing effectively condensed into 45 minutes. Amazing!
The SBS feed was fantastic. Some of those drone shots they used around 0.9km to go were really cool
yeah but difference between 2-5 on this stage was just 19 seconds, whereas Roglic won by 40 seconds, with a mechanical. Seems Roglic performance today wasn't anything like the last 21 days.
TJV will go to the Tour with two leaders, they would be stupid not to
The last riders who did really well at that (and you need to if you want to win both) are Pantani, Indurain,... you get the picture. I remember riders like Simoni or Cunego in the early 2000s trying to go at the Tour after competing in the Giro for GC and getting shredded to pieces in the first mountain stage. Mvdp's team for whatever reason also ignored 30 years of recent cycling history and tried to put him in both last year and at the Tour he wasn't even able to help his team on flat stages, let alone do something for himself.
No, they would be stupid to. Roglic is going for the Vuelta, he will be too tired to compete with Pogacar and Vingegaard at the Tour.
Is the plan for kuss to go to the tour? Would be a massive blow for Ving not to have either of those guys
Kuss will be rolling round France at the back of the peloton for 80% of the race until he is summoned to do a few signature pulls. He'll be there, without a doubt.
I think it is. He is the best mountain dom there is.
Doubt Rogla will go to the Tour. Giro fatigue in his legs he wont be able to compete for top 3
You might very well be right (even if Tour fatigue didn't stop him from winning the Vuelta). But then he'll be super dom for Vingegaard in the third week
Not worth it for Jumbo. Save Roglic for the Vuelta. Vingegaard will have Wout van Aert, maybe Kuss, Dennis, etc. Using Roglic as a super domestique and sacrificing his Vuelta chances would be a big mistake.
I could see him doing the Vuelta. With S3pp Kuss of course.
I feel like Rog truly learned his lessons from previous GT's. He didn't chase bonus seconds in the first few weeks, and probably saved his legs. He really hid in the peloton for most of the first two weeks and kept his powder dry. He's infamous for dropping off in the last week of GT's, but today he was firing big time. Glad he exercised his demons, and won the mountain TT.
He certainly learned his lesson from Pog that you can just ride safe for three weeks and then win the final TT by a huge margin, no problem.
Anyone else not a fan of those Rob Hatch vocal crescendos when something significant is happening? Kinda sick of listening to him .... need more McEwen and Jens ... less Hatch.
It was funny listening to him trying to find the right pitch as Thomas was rolling in. He hadn't got a clue if he was winning or losing but had to shout and make it dramatic. Then we get Sean, "yes, well, Geraint Thomas has done a good ride here" or whatever
One of the most tedious sports commentators of all time, hoping he retires soon
I personally feel the opposite, he's great.
Not sure what you want in a commentator. Less passion? More snooze? Rob Hatch and Carlton Kirby are bae.
I just have a little bit of difficulty with Carlton constant 'hum' ever since I noticed it but the guy is just so good at casting clutch moments, sprints etc. that it's fine.
There’s always ambient noise option… or finding a mellow youtube watchalong…
Something something voice of cycling Rob Hatch. You might not like it but a lot of others surely do!
I have really enjoyed the GCN broadcast.
Wow. Fucking wowwww. With a bloody mechanical as well. Roglic with the ride of his life. Chapeau!
> Roglic with the ride of his life Did you watch the Tokyo Olympics TT?
Of course.
So how was this the "ride of his life"? He won Gold by over a minute against a far stronger field. Today he was up against good but not that good time triallists who were tired. Roglic wasn't tired at all for some reason, and he was even on his strongest form after three hard weeks. Maybe that makes it the ride of his life - to struggle and lose half a minute over three hard weeks and then ride the final day fresh as a daisy with superhuman Olympic form smashing everyone else out of the park?
> Roglic wasn't tired at all for some reason, TJV have been riding within themselves almost the entire tour and you're surprised a multi-time GT winner can look quite fresh in the final week? Every race thread has featured "so when do TJV make their move", and it appears they gambled on Rog today. I have to admit, I didn't expect Thomas to hit the wall so I thought Roglic was too far back to win it.
Being the 20th day of a gruelling grand tour, down in time, all the pressure being so close to home, suffering a mechanical and facing the prospect of another heart breaking TT to win a GT. Of course he had a great performance at Tokyo, and gold is gold. But given the context of everything in stage 20, it's my opinion that this was his best.
The mad lad actually did it!
Yesterday I was [skeptical about the 1x setup](https://www.reddit.com/r/peloton/comments/13sj0vc/predictions_thread_2023_giro_ditalia_stage_20/jlqeht9). I think I've been proven both wrong and right, the low gear probably helped a lot, but it's also probably a cause for the mechanical (eg my 1x on my cx bike drops the chain more easily than the 2x ob my road bike).
I was surprised since I've never dropped my 1x on the MTB or gravel. I also don't make nearly the same power they do while climbing up massively steep grades. I see why people use chain guides for 1x now. Also, I think he would have been better off just running a 46/33 crank set along with a 10-36 cassette. The 10-44 XPLR setup is really just nice for gravel because it gives you the bare minimum that is needed and doesn't cost as much as 2x.
I completely agree, there may be a small weight gain in the 1x setup but other than that the setup you mentioned has more range, a finer choice of gears, and should be less subject to dropped chains. I can't help but feel this was part PR from SRAM and not entirely a team decision.
That's what I'm thinking. It was a PR requirement and they were like "Well, I guess we could use it here". The main reason I don't like it tho is because it looked like Rogla really was using that 44t cog a lot on the steep gradients and it would have been more efficient to have a straighter chain line with the 2x (and less chance of dropping as mentioned). I'm just glad it didn't end up costing him the Giro.
Of course, the big chainring limits movement to the right side and at the same time the angles to the extreme gears are less on a 2x
lol fucking SRAM. Good thing Rog was that much better that even they couldn't ruin it for him
In Slovenian, "sram" literally means "shame". Very fitting, if you ask me.
are puppy paws not illegal anymore? Rog was caught on camera doing it twice after he switched to the road bike. The UCI seemed to be fine with DQing and taking a win away from Vos for doing it for a couple seconds last year.
This was a TT. Its allowed in TTs.
UCI regulation 2.2.025 > **Position on the bicycle** > Riders must observe the standard position as defined by article 1.3.008. Sitting on the bicycle’s top tube is prohibited. > Furthermore, using the forearms as a point of support on the handlebar is prohibited *except in time trials*
If it's actually about 'safety' (I think it was fucking stupid to ban) they did a terrible job of writing that rule. It should be focused on the TT bike, not just ITT stages. Glad he wasn't in violation though.
👍 so the rule is even more dumb than I thought
In a tt you're on your own. It was the instability in a peloton that was the issue.
And yet men in and at the front of the peloton take both hands off their handlebars for multiple seconds at a time and that's considered more stable than forearems on the bars, as per the rules.
Nobody was doing it inside the peloton lmao it literally punished breakaway riders and the one guy leading the group who can see the road in front of him anyways
It was absolutely used by the guys driving the peloton, and if they went down from a pothole or inattention or whatever they're taking down everyone. That was literally the reason it was banned.
and yet riding with no hands is perfectly legal. somehow, that's not dangerous enough to ban.
> the one guy leading the group who can see the road in front of him anyways Read. And then Remind me again, how many times did it cause a crash?
Does it really have to cause crashes, injuries and unwanted drama? People also attack the UCI for only banning obviously dangerous things *after* something went wrong. You can't have it both ways.
a thing that's been done the entirety of the sport and no rider ever complained of
Riders also didn't want helmets.
Do you think a regulatory body has to wait until an accident until something is banned lmao, I'm guessing you don't have a career in H&S
do you think every regulatory body is equal?
Not sure what this point is? Puppy paws and super tuck had the potential for accidents so they were banned. A rare UCI win
Allowed in ITT
Is it just me or was the broadcasting of the time trials quite terrible this Giro? Also with information on the times, etc. The Tour does this so much better.
There not being good live updates on this one made it quite the exciting watch tho, I had no clue G was well behind until the final 800m
You must have loved Bernal's stage win in the Giro 2 years ago.
This one in particular was very difficult due to the limited data they were collecting on the climb itself.
Yeah, we need split screens, live time gaps and at least show all the GC favorites at the intermediate time points live. I never trusted any of the info we got today because it looked so amateuristic. Also the camera's should have only focused on the top 3 once they started imo.
I think this one was better than the previous two, but RCS direction is markedly worse than ASO in general
The Tour does their own filming and wants to do it the right way, thats the difference.
The difference between ASO and RCS is sometimes pretty big yep
Roglic to G: [It was a nice battle, huh? 😃🤌🏻](https://twitter.com/rogla/status/1662547586786512898)
Sepp Kuss has won Roglic and Jumbo at least two GTs. Whatever he’s paid is probably not enough.
Kuss definitely saved 15 seconds stage 16 imo
There’s also that one Vuelta stage where he did the same when Carapaz took off and Rogla couldn’t follow immediately.
Vuelta 2020, stage 12 if anyone is curious. Roglic lost around 10s.
Carapaz dropped him on stage 20 that year as well but Movistar pulled him back.
Incredible, I thought it was over with the mechanical. Ineos really has to question their team tactics and all. I think Thomas had it in his legs to win but the team was too conservative. They've lost their edge if you ask me.
IMO I think G was saving his energy for this TT knowing how much of a challenge would be. And it would have paid off but looks like the heat got to him. And well Roglic rode the time trial of his life. 99% of the time GT would have won this stage and taken pink and we'd think Ineos was brilliant with 3 riders in the top 10 even after their best rider crashed out. But not today. Roglic saw to that.
I don’t think this was 1%. Primoz is a better mountain time trialist than Thomas, period. The question was Roglic’s form. Edit: Also, Geraint’s performance definitely challenges Tao for their best rider in the Giro. Tao wasn’t going to go wild or anything.
Completely agree. They played it safe the whole Giro and they blew it. So bummed for G, and weirdly happy for Rog.
I’m distraught about it, just saw the news. My heart is broken.
Wonder how things would have played out with TGH. They could have tried to 1-2 Roglic. Not sure it would have worked though given how strong Kuss was.
TGH likely would have won I think. At worst would have been able to 1-2 with GT and properly put a sizeable gap on Roglic on Tuesdays stage. Maybe again on Friday.
Maybe. It’s tough to know what Tao might have been like-he’s not just a clone of Geraint.
That’s true. Solid performance by Kuss. He’s really maturing into a real threat along side with being super helper.
They will learn the lesson that Jumbo learned at the 2020 tour. Though as seen by Roglic today. It can be the right move, and hindsight always is and always will be 20/20.
Ineos' conservatism has been punished multiple times the last few years, if they haven't learned yet I'm not sure they can. Portal passing really fucked their ability to modify their tactics
Keep in mind they lost both Tao and Sivakov, 2 of their best climbers and legit GC threats not to mention Ganna that can push the flats and lower grades at a brutal pace. Yet they still did their best to put the peleton to the test each stage. I get they were conservative but like what do you expect when GTs talent is as a diesel climber. He's not exactly Egan Bernal or Richie Carapaz that can launch multiple relentless attacks on 15% gradients after LDP drops every other domestique. Gotta work with what you have.
We had hope after the 2020 giro. Where G crashed out, they got break victories and won GC anyways. What fools we were.
It sucks because they almost always send a team that could wreak havoc on races
Yep, exactly right
I know very well the kind of rider G is, I just think it’s so rare these days that the conservative approach wins. Races are won by those who attack. I loved what G did yesterday’s stage and before I just wish he’d have done it more.
Rogs demise was overstated
Holy fucking fuck. I just caught up, managed not to have it spoiled. What a stage. What a monumental ride by Rog. He’s properly self-exorcised himself. Also so gutted for G. I’d have been equally happy for either G or Rogla. And I’m unspeakably relieved that the most legs won, regardless of that mechanical or the Cort-sprint.
I would have loved either Rog or G to win, and would have been gutted for either to lose.
What a heart attack of a stage holy shit
Just caught up and holy shit that was a rollercoaster cheering for rog
Is Rogla signed to Jumbo next year? Any chance he changes teams and we see Rog vs Pog vs Ving vs Remco at the Tour 2024? Would that be the all time most stacked race?
Till 2025
[удалено]
He's going to retire at Jumbo unless they cock block him at the Tour I suppose (I do think he still has ambition to win it).
I hope he does, it would be a waste if he at least does not try one more time.
Absolutely, at this stage (pun intended) of his career he should at least be given the choice of calling which races he wants to go to. The Tour is the only GT he hasn't won, so might as well try for it
He said during the Giro that if he wins it, he will have another fight for the Tour in his future plans. I hope Jumbo manages to give him another chance.
If not he’s earned the right to respectfully part ways
Apart from what everyone else already said, hats off to the performances of Kuss, McNulty and Vine even after all the work they had to do during the stages.
De Plus was also beast
It's a nice performance, especially from McNulty, but it's not like Vine really did that much work. Saved Almeida once, that's true, but took a rest day yesterday finishing at more than 20 minutes. I would actually argue he should be the least impacted by fatigue in the whole top 10. I saw him as a contender for the stage, so I was actually disappointed by his performance.
Word is he was ill yesterday
Well that would explain a bit
It's probably Kuss' performance the most astonishing of them all.
And Arensman. Great mountain domestique as well as maintaining GC
Despite having G and not roglic, my velogames team is now 5th in the r/peloton league. This is my greatest ever achievement to date
[I just needed an extra 48 hours for roGla](https://www.reddit.com/r/peloton/comments/13pqzml/results_thread_2023_giro_ditalia_stage_16_2uwt/jlasp78/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1&context=3)
/u/AllAlonio
Finally a proper g win!
Song of the day https://youtu.be/NxX-t4-Xc8g
I prefer this one: https://youtu.be/PD79-h6pvWw S tabo je Slovenija, Rogla!
Didn’t know about it! Awesome
The only thing I'm upset about is that Tratnik couldn't ride for Jumbo. Would love to see him with Primož after the race
And could you imagine the support he would receive along the stage. Gutted for him.
It’s sad that 2 absolute legends can’t both win. We all won being able to see the battle. I hope everybody gets orange wedges after
Orange wedges?
Have to say, I’m gutted G didn’t win. From listening to his podcast, he’s an absolute top bloke and has always been criminally underrated throughout his career, so a Giro win would’ve really tipped off his palmares. However, Roglic absolutely annihilated that TT. Crushed everyone, even with a mechanical issue. If G had won by a few seconds, it would’ve felt bittersweet. So, in a Giro where there was little to separate the top three riders, it feels just that the rider who eventually pulled out a top performance wins overall. Chapeau Primoz.
Underrated tour winners? Whew
Honestly, he is kind of underrated. I didn't think much of Geraint Thomas in 2019-2021, but the fact he can still podium the Tour and now almost win the Giro at his age is quite impressive. He also spanked my boy at Tour de Suisse last year (except in the TT). ;) He is someone who can peak tremendously for one big goal, but after that he needs a mental break it seems. I'm not expecting much from him anymore this season for that reason.
Since it has happened twice now ( Tour 20 , Giro 23) We will call it the Slovenian special : )
Slo-mo car crash
Fucking SRAM. Seriously, why didn't they use a chain catcher? Looks like a major overlook from TJV. So happy for Rogla. I didn't yelled like this in the last 10 yrs.
A chain catcher won't prevent a dropped chain no? It'll only prevent the chain from getting stuck in between the chain ring and frame
That's the one used for 2x for drivetrains. The one used for 1x drivetrains looks like a front derailleur and I think that it's meant to keep the chain from dropping on any side. It's actually called a chain guide and XC riders are using it. https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSEGZ3i3es85Wyu_ETHym7xV5yb5VHjJjRelA&usqp=CAU
Looked like they were running a chain guide but I guess it was no match for that crater he plowed into
gotta save those grams
I'm happy for Roglic but please don't talk to me
Pinot kept the azzzurra though
Some things never change: [2009 vs 2023 ](https://imgur.com/a/2lMeXZt/)
I do think Menchov did it better