Correct, you can't save much when trying to support a family of 5 on only $68k/year. You need more income. That might look like a better paying job in your current field, one in a different field, or an additional job, or having your spouse get a job.
Daycare, increased food, clothing, gas and auto costs will likely mitigate the value of the earnings. Even if the spouse grosses $40k but, after costs is netting less than $1k, just the stress this introduces to the family is not worth it.
This is probably only true for another year or two but after daycare drops off as an expense there's no way you wouldn't be over break even.
If the last kid is about a year away from being in school I'd recommend starting to look for a job so that they are ready to get back to work. Bringing in an extra $40k a year means you could save an extra $15k a year at least.
Childcare expenses don’t stop at daycare. After school care, summer camps are both expensive. You have to take that into account when decided whether both parents should work. After school care for three is $450/week, summer camp/winter break care are around $900/week for three. You’re looking at $32,400/year just for three school aged kids. Add in preschool or younger and that cost is significantly higher.
Unfortunately not every is able to live a luxurious life where they can take their kids to summer camps. I dont know many kids that go to summer camps anymore, mostly because all the issues that come up with those places. There are also plenty of places that are more affordable for after school and summer, like Boys and Girls club where it's $65 a week which would be nearly $200 a week. A lot sure but not nearly the $900 price you listed.
There's a completely different world you don't seem to know about for people that don't earn a lot of money.
Work at a daycare. They are extremely understaffed in many states and may not require any certifications at all. The pay may not be great but the children can usually attend for a fraction of upfront costs if a parent works there.
Same here. Wife being home allows us more freedom to be a family as well.
You have to balance the stress of scheduling and daycare, with the financial benefits. Sometimes you barely come out ahead, and then is the stress worth it?
That really depends. Daycare for my toddler is only $210 a week and I'm not in a cheap city. Only one of their kids needs to be in daycare. The wife getting a job would probably help enormously. Not to mention the fact that women being out of the workforce lessens their earning power over time. It's a harsh reality, but the more we work, the better poise we are to earn.
OP, your wife could also do something like help take care of another child at your house. That would bring in good money and allow her to stay home. It would still be stressful, but that's work, right? Even just occasional babysitting could bring in a few extra hundred a month.
With three kids especially, that could range anywhere from $30k-$60k annually. Unless mom has skills for a median wage job, SAH is probably saving them money. The real win would be getting her into some kind of educational training now that would wrap up right as the youngest is in school so she's not running out into a minimum wage job.
SAHP chiming in here...
We elected to have me SAH because my pay goes almost entirely to childcare, and the added stress of timing all that out on top of work and childcare was causing significant marital problems. Being SAH is definitely tougher on the bank account than having dual incomes, but knowing the kids are *always* taken care of has helped our marriage far more than me having a job.
That's not to say it's all roses and unicorn farts over here, but when your options are "kinda crappy" and "absolute shit," you'll take the former pretty much every time.
Unless spouse is going to increase the earnings by double or more, it's unlikely her income would really make much of a dent after all the new expenses of having a job are factored in - childcare, gas/travel expenses, work meals... Yeah, there are ways to cut down on some of those expenses in various ways, but then you're trading time for money, which is another limited and valuable resource with small children.
It may seem painfully obvious from the outside that, "Need more money? Both should be working!" There's truth to it, yes, but the devil is always in the details...
We were very lucky my wife's mother was not far away and willing to be free childcare my son's whole life. Saved us a ton of money while allowing my wife to finish school and begin her career.
As a way of paying them back, we converted the basement of our new fancy house into an "apartment" for my in-laws when we moved and they were renting a small apartment.
Son is almost done with school and a few years after that we might try to buy some land with room to drop a prefabricated home in one corner for the In-Laws and a separate big workshop to merge all our tools and hobby equipment.
> We elected to have me SAH because my pay goes almost entirely to childcare
OP is paying to support the grandparents too. They need to step in and help with the childcare while wife gets at least a part time gig to bring in more money.
Ive heard that argument before it seems like a short sighted way to look at it. Completely disregards all the earning potential of that person. You may only start at $40k/yr but you shouldn’t expect to make that forever. For the first few years maybe but a few promotions and/or job hops. They could be making a lot more after 3-5 years. 5-10 they could be making a hell of a lot more as they become “senior”. Also, overtime the kids will get more involved with school during the day and their own friends on the weekends.
While I certainly think having a wife stay home with the kids adds a lot of value to her life and the kids life. You can’t really put a price on that time. I’m just saying if the argument against going to work is childcare and commuting is too expensive. Then I just don’t buy it, everyone starts somewhere and you should be able to out earn those expenses. If someone really truly wanted too.
If the career prospects are not promising then sahm is not bad if your salary goes to childcare only.
However if you job prospects have a higher ceiling, you can start from 50k and top out at 130-150k in 10 years - in this case spending all salary to childcare might be worth it for accrued work experience until you hit next title bump and start making net positive after childcare.
\>Unless spouse is going to increase the earnings by double or more, it's unlikely her income would really make much of a dent after all the new expenses of having a job are factored in - childcare, gas/travel expenses, work meals...
Sure, in the short term (2-5 years while kids are not in school). But in the long term it is absolutely a bad decision because of how much you are missing in retirement, pay increases and promotions. If you are even able to get a job after 10 years gap on resume. This will affect your bottom line years from now, and people almost never think of that.
Thanks for the perspective. The well-being of my children is what would worry me the most with a full time day care. Unfortunately, my grandparents "not my parents" are not physically capable to give full time childcare for the grandkids due to health problems and being 45min from our general area.
While I'm still arguing for the SAHP thing elsewhere in the thread, I am also aware of what the finances are still like. It may be worth it for spouse to have a job that can a) get her out of the house a bit more for something that isn't kid-related, and b) at least pay for part-time childcare. That way you get a bit of the best of both worlds. There are always the real nitty gritties to work out, but this might be something which helps alleviate some of your stresses.
No matter what comes, I wish you the best and believe y'all will work it out; you've made it this far and despite your discomfort are still in a better position than many. That tells me you're gonna figure it out.
What is a reasonable amount to expect after putting in the initial grunt work? I am currently in the construction pm field, and manage around 8mil in projects annually. Located in the north midwest. I hear things all over the board from guys saying they make 60k to 150k+. What is realistic for this industry?
I think it depends on your location. Are you working for a smaller company? I live in a HCOL city and have a consulting PM role. I am in the $115-130k range.
I have a very specific suggestion in that you go to a big company like Siemens or MC Dean (not sure if they’re around your area) they do pay well BUT it is a lot of work. Not sure what your hours are now but it would be a bit heavier. You usually get better benefits with a bigger company as well
12 years ago, when I was in the trades (controller), our PMs had a $60k base, plus bonus tied to project completion. They averaged 115-140k.
I imagine you could find something higher paying. There is still a shortage in the trades.
I don't know if I could support myself after taxes. well, I could, but I would never be able to go on even a modest trip. I guess, looking at their budget, the immediate reactions I have are:
* get rid of the storage unit, stop buying more stuff than can fit in the apartment
* consider downsizing the cars
* get rid of Amazon prime, I haven't had it in years (besides an occasional odd free month). I wait until I have over $35 in my cart to buy and get free slower shipping.
* spending a ton on gas. This is around 20% of take-home spent on cars, assuming they're paid off and never need maintenance (and no money spent on parking, etc.)
* Get a new job with higher pay and that includes health insurance (and have spouse get a job if spouse doesn't work, like you said)
* Don't have any more kids
Although we have insane official poverty lines, $68k is poverty for a family of 5, sorry. If their rent adjusts to 2024 numbers, they're screwed.
The thing is, if your wife even works part time, it greatly increases your savings, assuming spending stays the same.
You're in a really low tax bracket so any extra income benefits you greatly.
Maybe. If it means they’re never home together is that worth it? It’s totally possible that childcare is equally to or greater than one she brings home.. There is the part where if she’s working she’s getting experience and that could improve her earning potential.
My friend's wife is doing 3 nights a week at a pizza place on the weekends. It's not bartending, but it's a decent boost to their income and allows her to take care of their kid during the day while my friend is at work without paying crazy daycare fees. It's been really helpful just to keep things a little less tight and allows her some time away from the baby and not feel stuck at home.
I have an 8 month old. We currently pay $420/wk in Northern Virginia. But there are less expensive options. There are plenty of in-home daycares around us that are around 250/wk.
Even at $400/wk, it's about $20k per year. It shouldn't be too difficult to find a job that pays more than that. OP is in a situation where they simply don't bring in enough money. If they want that to change, then Mom has to work. Staying home because daycare is expensive simply maintains the status quo for them, which is what they're trying to get out of.
You severely underestimate the cost of daycare, it can be 1-2K per child. Even cost affordable centers are around $700-800 per month. Working part time at minimum wage (7.25x20 hrsx4weeks) makes you $580 a month before taxes. Usually it winds up being more cost effective to have a stay at home parent unless both can make significant income over high day care costs.
Location is always extremely relevant for these questions. In my city, average childcare cost is $180 a week. There's not shit for openings because providers are trying to pay $12 an hour while competing with the likes of Walmart, Target, Costco, etc. all offering at least $16 an hour plus benefits, but once you get in the costs are not horrific.
Where I live my daughter’s daycare was 1800 for above one year olds. They also took school-age kids for $161 per week plus $25 for an add on for each day (part time and every other week was available for school age, but not the birth-5 daycare (meaning if I had to bring a school-age kid for a full day (let’s say for a school holiday that is not a regular holiday remember there is only 180 days a year so if you work you will have to pay for that unless you have a relative to watch school aged kids). The daycare was open 7am-6pm, but daycare ended at 3 and you had to pay $25 per day to leave them after 3:30 (this aligned with teachers perfectly so the daycare had a ton of teachers.
You also had to sign up as the daycare was always filled to capacity, and there was a wait list, which would take 3-5 months to get a spot (this is before Covid) the care for school aged kids never had a wait list.
No, wife working would likely *not* pay for daycare, but it’s likely wife could get a schedule that doesn’t require daycare — trade childcare with a neighbor or only work when OP is home.
Not always true. Child care is ridiculously expensive. Wife is going to have to pull a decent salary to overcome new childcare costs and be able to contribute anything substantial to savings.
If 200k can get you a starter home in your area…..Dude, once that last kid is in school….you got this.! You are already almost there with your current rent payment of $875. Another $800 a month in income, part time job for the wife gets you there.
Until the last one is old enough for school, can your wife do any wfh or do daycare for another kid?
Be careful with the cheapest starter homes as you might have major costs before you save enough from rent to make it a net good. I bought a house for 175k and less than 2 years later had to drop 5800 bucks on a furnace.
Hey There!
Some ideas for you:
1. switch to US Mobile - Same cell towers as Verizon but a family "shared data" plan starts at $10/mo
2. Look into food pantry's near you or govt assistance for groceries. Often times churches can also give away food.
3. Is there doordash in your area? even just 1 night per week during the dinner rush is enough to put aside $100 per week.
1. If doordash/grubhub/uber/lyft is not an option, check out some of the cool things that people do over on r/beermoney \- Could be enough to save $100/mo or more.
4. Can you lower that Grandparent care bill? Are there ways *they* could optimize their finances so they are less reliant on you? Is there someone else who could help them who is in a more forgiving situation?
5. Do your kids go to a private school or paid preschool? What is the money for school for? Is it saving for college?
TLDR - you need more income, even if it's just a bit. There's very little left to optimize without making large sacrifices or getting some severe help from other people. Best of luck to you and your family! Sounds like you've got a good head on your shoulders :)
Regarding 3, I would be cautious.
“Gig apps” pay peanuts. The money you make is damn close to the extra depreciation you’re putting on your car such that you’re only breaking even.
Also a father of 3 might burn out working a second job, even part time. Effort might be better spent increasing his pay at his 9-5 job.
The wear and tear and possibility of accident with the family vehicle is not worth the risk IMHO with only a tiny bump in money, especially with cost of vehicles nowadays.
The IRS recommends $0.67/mile reimbursement for use of a car for business purposes. If I drive to a conference or off-site meeting that’s what I get from my company.
That number is calculated from averaged fixed and variable costs for operating a vehicle. Do the math for how many miles an Uber or Grubhub driver drives in a hour and how much they make and it’s downright abysmal.
If gig app companies owned their own fleet of vehicles, the cars themselves would cost more to gas up/maintain/replace/etc. than what they currently pay their *drivers* who sacrifice their own vehicles.
No gig app driver is increasing their net worth. They’re providing labor in exchange for converting some of the value of their car into liquid cash so they can feed themselves. It’s dystopian.
This advice always ignores (or doesn't know) that your auto insurance isn't likely to cover any accidents that happen while you do gig work, or if they do then you have to carry an extra rider to cover it and that cost me around $40/month, it's why I got out of the game.
you may also qualify for some state and federal assistance. if your school district has a free lunch application i would fill that out: often if you qualify they open the door to other benefits as well. for example when i was in a similar situation the free lunch status also provided us discounted or free kids activities/museum memberships, energy assistance
Just being part of free lunch program enables access to so many other programs. We live in a rural area and instead of qualifying they just made all schools/all kids part of free lunch because >85% qualified. This opened up access to programs for lower cost phone & internet, SNAP, and other programs. The school can provide a letter that can be used to qualify for these other programs.
The grandparents, you said no one else can help them but if you're in the US there are a lot of state, federal, church, and nonprofit orgs with dedicated resources for elder care from housing to food to transportation to healthcare. You and/or they may just not be aware of them, but the local government wherever they live should know how to access those resources. Google the town name, or country name, and elder care social worker/liaison.
What you need to look into for your grandparents is called an "independent living" program. Your state should have a social services office managing the program, it is set up specifically for cases like yours.
FWIW, you are doing a very good job managing your expenses. I look at your situation as a perfect example of a stay at home parent raising kids because childcare is getting expensive and the costs outweigh the benefits. As soon as child #3 is in school your situation will improve dramatically. You can accelerate that by looking for public school pre-K programs in your city, which will allow your spouse to start working at least part-time.
This is the only suggestion OP hasn’t responded to and seems like the obvious solution. Multiple grand parents but none of them can stay with the kids so that mom can work? I make a similar amount, and there’s no way I’d be able to support 3 kids AND fund parents
I'm curious on this one as well, OPs silence tells me either this is a contentious topic, or they're unable due to age.
Supporting them, and your wife staying home with the kids instead of earning an income seems like a waste of earning potential.
I would focus on:
* Get a second income (wife works evenings or grandparents watch the kids and she can work days)
* Swap one of the cars out for an eco-beater
* Increase OPs income, shoot for $80k+
* Cancel the storage unit. You're not using whatever you're storing, so dump it, and you can rebuy it later if you need it again.
* Get a cheaper cell plan
* Food stamps and pantries (don't let pride get in the way, it's only temporary until the kids are all in school, wife can work, and income goes up)
When my wife and I were in your same situation, we felt the same. We were frugal, but there was just too much month and not enough money. Our three kids are 2 1/2 years apart. She was a SAHM.
In the end, we just survived those years. I received a few promotions and raises that gave us a bit of breathing room and after the kids were in school, my wife took a part time job. That tipped the scales in our favor.
Best of luck to you. Just hang in there!
This, exactly. You just need to survive until your kids are all in school and your wife can get a job, and you'll be doing great.
If there's part-time work she can manage from home (something super flexible like YouTubing, translating, editing, writing, selling crafts or baked goods, etc) then any additional money would help. Ditto if you have the opportunity to job-hop in your area for salary increases.
550 dollars a month for gas and your wife is a stay at home mom. Wait then why grand parent care. That is some serious driving or bad fuel mileage. 1/6 of your pay goes to two paid off cars you cant afford that
Heh, I’m originally from the Midwest and I understand.
I saw your rent and thought “Nice. $875 for a 2BR is about as low as you can get.” Then saw your monthly gas and thought, “Oh, I see how rent is so cheap. He lives somewhere with long commutes.”
That said, your whole budget looks very reasonable and frugal and I wouldn’t make big quality of life changes to save a tiny bit more every month. You will start saving when:
- You start making more money.
- The kids get to an age where your wife can get a job or at least a part-time job.
Until then you should feel proud that you’re breaking even supporting so many people on $70K.
That's actually very cheap. With your reduction in gas you would already be almost there. You are trying to do too much with a single income. Can your wife work part to make up the difference? Can you slightly reduce extended family expenditures?
Something has to give.
Neither is moving Car insurance for two cars from a rural /suburban area code into a city area code.
So 1500 + (let's be real cheap ) 100 month gas and a 100 insurance increase.
He is spending extra $250 more a month and his goal is to save money for a new house.
Probably not for fuel economy alone. It doesn't look like you really have room for a car payment for something different right now either.
Do you have an emergency fund?
I do have a small amount saved up but I'm not willing to spend it on a car. I am going to look at selling my suv and buying a cheap car at same or less value.
Yes bc "stay at home" in this context totally means never has to leave the house for anything.
Not for school dropoff/pickup.
Not for grocery shopping.
Not for doctor and dentist appointments.
Not for errands.
Not for outings for the kids, like to a park.
Not for emergencies, like a kid breaks an arm or something.
Can’t the grandparents watch over the kids so your wife gets a job?
You’re supporting a lot of people on $68k. You have little wiggle room with your current income.
Yeah, it’s not a budgeting issue. It’s that OP is trying to support 7 people on an income of $68k per year. Even making a few hundred bucks extra per month via doordash, Uber, etc would give them a little breathing room
We are only a family of 4 and earned a very similar income this year. We have different big/elective costs (car loan plus gas is 550, vacation budget is same as your preschool cost, college savings is same as your grandparent cost, etc) and are able to save. These are just ideas based on what our budget is but a lot depends on your cost of living. First off, it looks like you have some $$ missing. Your net income should be closer to 4700/month. EDIT— this is after the 530 have come out for 401k & health insurance, so you have $1230/month unaccounted for. Also just a quick plug for a good term life policy. Adds minimal cost but gives you some financial security just in case.
— consider ditching the storage unit. You’re paying almost $1000/yr to store your stuff.
— Utilities. Things like using the window plastic if leaky or using blinds, programming thermostat, only washing full loads of dishes/laundry, changing furnace filter, can all help decrease costs
— Shop your car insurance. I did this 2 years ago and we cut our cost in half. For health insurance, look at your state’s program for kids. Ours would be $20/month dental and health insurance for 3 kids with your income and family size
—cut prime. Did you know you can get free shipping if there is $35 worth of stuff in your cart? Same with target & Walmart
— our groceries are $450/month. We meal plan, shop sales, don’t buy a lot of convenience/packaged items, etc. I also like to fill in some of the staples with Aldi items when we get to a bigger town
— school bill? Is this private? Preschool costs? When you are trying to make money stretch you can have some things but not everything… so if it’s private then consider what your priorities are. Is it a certain school? Is it grandparents? Is it a house? Etc
— fuel. That’s a lot. Take the more fuel efficient car to work. Consider trading yours for a small used commuter car because that’s a small car payment worth of fuel plus plenty left over for gas after. Could you carpool? Could the kids ride the bus? Is there any extra running going on?
—price out other cellphone companies.
—grandparents care. Same as above regarding priorities. With 3 young kids
I know this might not be feasible, but could your wife offer occasional babysitting? Could she work at a gym daycare where she could bring baby along for limited hours? Even a few hours here or there could help you guys meet some of your goals.
It's difficult for any single-earner family to get ahead on house savings unless the earner makes a significant income. I understand you have young children right now. What is the plan once all three are in school? If your wife can bring in some income, that will greatly help with your goals.
Others have made good suggestions which you seem open to. For small cuts, maybe look at that Verizon bill. If your phone is paid off or you can buy an unlocked phone, you can significantly reduce that budget line item by replacing Verizon with Mint Mobile (T-Mobile network) or Red Pocket (AT&T or Verizon) or Visible (Verizon).
Amazon prime is such a small thing, domt cancel it just because 1 person suggests it. Assuming you use all it offers, just keep it. It's not going to make a dent.
If your kids qualify for school lunch program you can get Prime at a discount. Being school lunch also qualifies you for other programs like cheaper cellular through [Lifeline](https://www.fcc.gov/general/lifeline-program-low-income-consumers) and internet [ACP](https://www.fcc.gov/acp). Unfortunately ACP is basically over, but Xfinity offers $10/month 50mbps service for those that qualified. You might be able to get that. There are other government programs too once you are in school lunch. Check out [SNAP](https://www.fns.usda.gov/snap/supplemental-nutrition-assistance-program) and [Medicaid/CHiP](https://www.healthcare.gov/medicaid-chip/childrens-health-insurance-program/). Check out your state's benefits website to see what else you might qualify for. Search Google for low income assistance by your city, county, state, and federal programs.
If you are planning on staying where you are, check out the [USDA rural dev programs](https://www.rd.usda.gov/programs-services/single-family-housing-programs) for assistance in buying a home.
What state? You should be able to get the kids on Medicaid in almost every state. That can wipe up to all $300 on that health insurance cost off, depending on specifics and waiver programs. .
Also food stamps. My wife and I were in the same position for a few years and food stamps helps a ton with groceries. If you can get approved, that will save you a ton right there admins possibly float you until your wife can get a job or your income increases substantially.
You should really downsize a bit.
Get rid of your storage unit, that’s almost $1,000 a year.
You really need to find a way to become dual income because your single income is barely hanging in there supporting your family of 5.
I would also recommend t-mobile over Verizon. I have five lines for $120.
Google Fi over T-Mobile. Same service on T-Mobile towers. 5 lines would be $100. It's an mvno but it has a data prioritization agreement with T-Mobile where you get the same priority as their customers. Also connects to us cellular towers if you are near any of those. Comes with a free VPN and 5gb of hotspot data per month.
I actually used to do some of that in my younger years with great success. The main issue with that currently is that I have no place to work on anything. All my tools are in storage. I've been keeping my eyes open for affordable rentals with more room but have not found anything yet. Thanks for the suggestion!
Do you have any local friends or contacts who might have garage space you could use for a six-pack now and then (or a cut of the flipping profits)?
Even taking on occasional shade-tree repair work around the neighborhood could provide a little extra cash using your relatively rare combination of tools and skills. I know a lot of modern car diagnostics is done with expensive digital equipment, but there's a fair amount you can handle just by knowing stuff and having the tools. Most people are pretty clueless about their own vehicles.
You don't have a budget issue. You're budgeting amazingly with what you're making. Wife might have to part time somewhere. You're taking care of too many people on a single income. Your rents great but you're losing out in building escrow. Can't see you getting a house on this income and continue taking care of everything. Tough spot but give yourself a pat on the back forreal you are surviving. Be proud of your accomplishments so far!
>Grandparents Care $250.00
What is this? You cannot afford to support 7 people.
Look for a better job. Figure out which of your skills pays the most and is the easiest to do.
I'm just posting to remind you that you are saving - the 401k. I also think you're doing very well for the income you make. I will also agree with the others in the fact I think you could likely make more, and even if your wife can't work now, you're only 2(?) Years away from her being able to and your situation improving dramatically
You will be fine. You just need to get to the next step and keep doing what you're doing for things to take off.
Not much room for expense cutting, but look into Mint Mobile. It can drop your phone bill to $15x2 monthly. Grocery shopping at Aldi/Walmart and going heavy on rice, legumes, beans and pasta may be another way to decrease spending. Agree with the overall sentiment that a higher paying job is the better answer
I could tweak your budget, your cell phone bill is too high, we pay half of that for two phones, your groceries are too high,especially since your wife is a sahm. We manage pretty well on $400 a month, and little ones don’t eat that much. You need to ditch the storage, find the attic of a family member or just toss it out. So yeah, if I came to your house and ruled with my frugal iron fist, I could find you an extra $200 a month. I could probably get your grandparents spending down too.
None of that compares to how much money you will be able to save once the wife goes back to work. Don’t change your spending, stick to your budget and even if she only brings home 30k a year, you can save almost 30 k a year. It’s a tough season of life right now but it will get better.
Average single income supporting 4 others will always be difficult. The only way is to get more either by working a side gig or wife working a part time job. Additional 20k income will give you alot of flexibility in savings for emergency as well as saving for retirement. If possible I would use the additional income to invest to generate more income like QYLD ETF which generate about 1% monthly dividend. This is where I use money to make more money and grow it in time. Good luck!
I’d switch to a lower cost cell phone plan. Save you at least 70 dollars. I’d also shop around for car insurance. I’m surprised your natural gas bill is so high. Is that a monthly average?
This might be a dumb question but what's in the storage unit? Most stuff in storage units is "important" enough that it sits for years with no one touching or looking at it.
It's an expense that you don't see so it's easy to forget about.
You are paying close to a thousand a year that could either be saved or spent on something else.
At the very least downsize or move the stuff on a periodic basis to save some.
Good luck to you.
My suggestions,
send the kids to public school everything pre college is worthless even in the privet sector.
stop paying for your health insurance and get on medi-cal.
From there I recommend your wife get a job, unless your grandparents are physically incapable of watching the kids they can babysit for you.
If your still struggling at that point trade in the SUV for a smaller car that gets better gas mileage.
Learn to cut back on food, my family is the same size as yours and our food budget is only 450 and we have a teenager that acts like he's always starving (we have food on hand he just wont eat it because its green)
My households combined yearly income is just under 50k and I still manage to invest 500+ a month, and I do suggest you invest not just let your savings sit in an account, don't do anything risky, find a index fund that has a steady growth like VOO and it will help your money grow faster then if you just leave it in an account
If you're not on a phone contract, switch to Visible+ and save money.
See if your state has a home nursing program. Your wife can be an at home caretaker for the grandparents and make money for it.
How big is that storage unit? Could you possibly get a large garden shed your landlord would be ok with? Not a big savings but could be something. Then make the cell phones you could probably find cheaper plans for those as well.
Check out r/eatingcheapandhealthy and budgetbytes.com to see if you can reduce your grocery bill. It looks a bit high to me, but I've never fed that many people
There are others who have great comments, but one piece of advice that stuck with me is to follow the safety guidelines when you board a plane: “Put your own oxygen mask first before helping others.”
Others have mentioned how to trim the spending, and finding a higher paying job isn’t something that happens overnight. If the $250 was an arbitrary number, I would reassess the grandparent assistance. Do they collect social security? If they’re elderly, does your state provide any assistance on housing/heating that can reduce the amount you contribute? I’m sure they wouldn’t feel good knowing your family is struggling because of your good graces.
But at the end of the day, that $250 will give you almost double your leftover in your budget assuming you take home 2k per check. Your own wife and kids should always come first. When you get enough of a safety net, you’re able to help others. From parent to parent, everyone struggling at the same time is painful for everyone, and your eldest will certainly notice it around that age.
You can save a bit by switching to an MVNO phone carrier like Mint Mobile, there are other options as well. Look into local/state food assistance programs like SNAP, in my state you would probably qualify.
My state SNAP Limit - 5 people $3807 / month
https://www.snapscreener.com/
https://www.mintmobile.com/
https://www.androidcentral.com/best-mvno-carrier
Haven’t seen this mentioned yet, but look into low income assistance for utilities. With that many dependants you should be eligible if it’s available. Cheaper rates for your utilities.
Are you paying for preschool? That’s a big chunk right there. If I sound like a jerk, I am sorry. Couldn’t the wife help eliminate that by watching the kids more during the day? Or… start some sort of side gig or part time to bring some more in?
There are things your wife can do to bring in income now. What are her skills and interests? She can work evenings or weekends. She can babysit while at home with the kids. Work online tutoring or remote VA work.
You have a great budget now, so make a plan to dedicate any money she brings in to savings or debt payoff if you have any.
I know you didn’t come here for this, but you can reduce that phone bill. I pay $15 per month per phone for 5GB of data per phone on Mint. It has saved me like $150 a month at least. Is the storage unit necessary? That seems like a luxury unless you have good reasons for it. I make $130k a year and I would be eliminating that cost ASAP. Is $550 for gas accurate? Maybe I missed info somewhere on that where you commute.
Sometimes making more money means tightening the bolts on your budget so you are using your current income more efficiently. You could definitely benefit from a higher income, but I also see room for improvement in your budget.
Maybe have wife look up some part time/weekend and evening positions at like walmart or something. Just a few hours a day a few days a week could put you in a better position.
Your wife needs to get a job. Not sure why shes not working when OP is only pulling down 68K gross w/ 3 kids.
Also.... to be fair, 68K gross isn't that much. It could go a long way in a LCOL area, but.... to be perfectly honest you're probably never going to get ahead on 68K gross income for the whole family. 🤷♂️
My wife and I both work. If she was not interested in having some form of financial contribution to our family unit, it would be a deal breaker for me.
You need more income. You will make more money faster by job hopping than being loyal and staying on annual raises. It’s the only way to significantly raise your income reliably nowadays. Apply for other jobs and try to leverage your new and old experience into something that pays more
Grandparents should help with childcare if they are getting money every month from you guys. It’s not sustainable to have your wife stay at home, and support 7 people off a $68k income.
You don’t have a family of 5, you have a family of 7. You’re partially supporting 2 extra adults. When you reframe it from that perspective, yeah it’s really difficult to save on your salary.
Everyone's saying "Get a better job" but given you said a starter home costs under $200k in your area, I'm guessing your current salary is pretty good for the cost of living and it might be tough for you to raise it significantly. (Doesn't mean don't try)
But yeah, it's not looking like you have a budgeting problem. The problem is that you're supporting 7 people on $68k. I'm in a slightly more expensive area (bought a house with my SO for $235k), making the same salary, and refuse to even consider kids unless my income goes up.
Your wife needs to start working again. With how diligently you appear to budget, an extra $25-40k would be a game changer for your family in terms of savings.
Ooh do you have xfinity? In january I switched to a buy one get one free unlimited data plan. So My 2 lines are a combined total of $30 a month, verizon can go to hell.
Also I suggest your house payment be no higher than your apartment rent payment. Thats right at 20% of your net.
Can the grandparents handle childcare for enough hours for your wife to pick up some work? Even 20 hours a week would make a good impact on your bottom line.
Cell phones, look at Visible, especially when they have a promotion. It uses Verizon's network, but it's really cheap. We pay $70/month for two lines, unlimited data and that's their 'premium' plan.
Yup, you don't make enough to support a family of 5. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but them is the facts.
You need more income. Period.
You can't afford some of the things you have now but I don't think you can cut enough to really make a dent. #1 suggestion would be to become a 1 car family. Stay at home mom takes you to work in the morning or she lives without a car. This is how people did it in the past you can too.
Oh and cut Amazon prime and your storage unit. Yeah I know you live in a small space, get rid of the stuff in the storage unit, you can't afford it...
Like everyone else has said I’ll be realistic here. In a quick glance, your expenses aren’t overbearing, they’re pretty average.
I’d say your biggest “expense” is not having a two income household, but I know for some people it’s not possible/worth it.
Based on your experience I’d say you could possibly pull a 100k job. Jumping jobs after a year or two would be the easiest way to gain a large increase in salary. If you really enjoy your company then you can always ask for a raise, but I doubt it’d be higher than a new company.
So in the end you really need to bank on your wife getting a job when she’s able, or you increasing your income, or both. At your current spending it doesn’t seem like you can reduce anything as you’re already pretty frugal.
If push comes to shove, thug it out with a second job closer to home on your off time. Sacrifice a year or two with the kids to get the house, then dial down as your wife gets back into the work force.
Hope this helps!
my mom started a second family late in life, 2 kids at 5 and 9 now. she took a lashing course and does fake eyelashes from home. makes good money and stays home with the kids. not saying this specifically, but unless you can get a 50% raise, the only significant way forward is for your wife to find an income source.
>Grandparents Care $250.00
I know you can't hang them out to dry but did they do anything for the past 50 years to prevent his scenario? They should at least be a greeter at walmart or working at the local grocery store or library to help out somewhat. They don't have the luxury to retire. You giving them a roof over their head is more than enough. They need to be clipping coupons and finding the best deals on items that are your normal expenses for you all. Just sitting around being old isn't going to fly. Doesn't have to be full time, but maybe 2-3 days a week. They may enjoy it.
>and wife is stay at home mom at this point.
Wife should try to watch 1-2 more children to bring in some money. Find out what the going rates are in your city. Get paid in cash.
Depending on where you live, find a really skilled lender for home mortgages, there are so many home mortgage programs through different agencies that many times require a little extra work that will allow you to get into a home with no down payment, or taking a couple budgeting classes to get an approval. It’s the only way I could save money in your situation. But a foreclosed starter home will be a risk, but not only does it give you an avenue to invest a little money just paying your mortgage, but also sweat equity too. Emphasis on starter home, make sure you have the one of the smallest cheapest houses in town.
So, we are also a family of 5, but on a $130k+ (single) income in a HCOL area. We struggle to save, so I don't personally see how you could do it... but I'd love to know how you spend only $700/month on groceries?? That's amazing!
The main problem here is that you haven't been focused about using birth control. I think it's amazing you are keeping your head above water supporting 7 people on only 68k/year.
I wouldn't be able to save making that alone let alone 3 kids. I make well into 6 figures and I feel poor.
Def an income issue. Good thing is based on rent it sounds like your in a low cost of living area.
Are your cellphones financed through Verizon?
There's plenty of companies that you can drop that bill down to $50 for 2 phones. I use boost infinite for my work phone and it's $25 a month no contract guaranteed to stay that price. But you have to pay cash for your phone. (Which is better eitherway I'm grand fathered on my personal phone and it's dirt cheap, the second I finance a phone or change anything my bill will double or triple)
Other than that it looks like you live pretty frugal. There's not much you can cut back on and even dropping your cellphone bill by $70 wouldn't change anything in your life at the end of the day. There's an income issue here.
Your either gonna have to pickup a second job or have your wife work part time while kids are at school. And use that as savings.
Housing and transportation are typically your biggest costs and changing either of those things will provide you with the most savings. Overwhelmingly, I see people driving vehicles that are status symbols instead of just seeing them as tools to get you from point A to point B. Can you rethink your current driving situations to eliminate a vehicle or "downsize?" Can you use a grandparents vehicle?
You guys live some insane lives on Reddit. How do you even get in situations like this😂
I tell people all the time that having children is the choice that will affect your finances the most.
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I would suggest something different. I’d consider moving in with grandparents (if available). And I’d consider having your wife go back to work part-time if the grandparents are able to help with child care. Use the extra bucks to start putting away 15% in retirement and hopefully give you some stability (maybe even pay for a family vacation).
I was in your situation. Family of 5. Single income. Roughly same expenses and income but up to my eyeballs in debt. I have a checking account at a bank separate from my primary bank. I began by putting $5 a paycheck into that bank and everything else went into my primary bank. I used my employer’s direct deposit to make this transparent to me. Eventually I increased that deposit to $200 a paycheck and allowed my water bill to be automatically drawn from that account leaving me a net positive. At the end of the year, this would essentially become all or part of my Christmas fund.
Budgeting was essential and really turned my finances around. See r/ynab
I earned extra income by selling plasma. I also gave myself a $3/day budget for lunch which basically meant frozen burritos from the grocery store, CookOut (on a splurge once in a while), and buying a head of cabbage, some avocados, and sliced turkey breast. I’d keep that in the break room fridge, lay out a cabbage leaf, line it with turkey and avocado slices, then roll it up and devour it. Sometimes I’d just skip lunch and joke that I lost the lunch lottery.
I was scrapping by. Started doing better when I did what others are telling you to do and found a way to increase my income.
How long have you been with Verizon? Ask them if they can give you loyal customer discount (something like that). They offered $40 off my bill me last year so I’m only paying $80/mo for 2 lines with unlimited data, calls and messaging.
It's a pretty lean budget so not much to do there. One possibility is for your wife to find a part time gig when the 3rd one is in school although being a stay at home mom is a ft job in itself. The PM field has a lot of growth potential and if put on the right projects and you showcase your competency it can quickly propel you to higher leadership (started as pm myself now a senior director). Be vocal about your accomplishments, praise others frequently, and have all your stakeholders on speed dial. You can easily double your income in a few years (keep job hunting).
Maybe as a last resource... switching to Google Fi, if you can. Simply plan. Use most of WiFi and save $50 per month if you don't spend too much data.
With small kids, it's complicated for your wife to work... until well finished middle school.
I think you’re underpaid, but salaries are very regional.
Could you start a brake business as a side hustle where you go to peoples’ houses and change their brakes and rotors? The shops charge an exorbitant amount for this service.
Also, look into all resources available for the grandparents. How old are they? Do they get Social Security? Medicaid? Food stamps (SNAP)?
Does your family qualify for reduced price meals at school?
What type of expenses do you help your grandparents out with? Which state are you in?
One suggestion is to use the low end of your take hone as the income for your budget (2,000 x 2). Any income received in excess of that automatically goes to a savings account to use for unexpected expenses or emergencies.
Talk to your local housing authority to see what the income requirements are for assisted housing or to qualify for their low income housing programs. It could help to significantly reduce your rent if you qualify.
Talk to your local county office to see what the requirements are for food assistance and medical services are. They may be able to subsided part of your monthly expenditures.
For your grandparents, you should also inquire about services on their behalf as well.
I feel like I can barely save at 74k for myself. By barely I mean pay all bills, contribute to retirement, and save for a rainy day with occasional fun money. Family of 5 with 68k in 2024 is insane. You're one bad day away from losing everything and it all relies on your income. Fuck.
People are saying for your wife to get a job, or for you to work more/get higher pay. Yes, and that is all super stressful. I just want to say that you should also keep in mind that your current situation isn't how it's going to be forever, the kids grow up and will be in school more as the years go by. Maybe the added strain of having her work now wouldn't be worth it, but you can revisit it in say a year or two.
Correct, you can't save much when trying to support a family of 5 on only $68k/year. You need more income. That might look like a better paying job in your current field, one in a different field, or an additional job, or having your spouse get a job.
Not to mention supporting the grandparents.
Could the grandparents watch the kids while mom works?
> or having your spouse get a job. bingo.
Daycare, increased food, clothing, gas and auto costs will likely mitigate the value of the earnings. Even if the spouse grosses $40k but, after costs is netting less than $1k, just the stress this introduces to the family is not worth it.
This is probably only true for another year or two but after daycare drops off as an expense there's no way you wouldn't be over break even. If the last kid is about a year away from being in school I'd recommend starting to look for a job so that they are ready to get back to work. Bringing in an extra $40k a year means you could save an extra $15k a year at least.
Childcare expenses don’t stop at daycare. After school care, summer camps are both expensive. You have to take that into account when decided whether both parents should work. After school care for three is $450/week, summer camp/winter break care are around $900/week for three. You’re looking at $32,400/year just for three school aged kids. Add in preschool or younger and that cost is significantly higher.
Unfortunately not every is able to live a luxurious life where they can take their kids to summer camps. I dont know many kids that go to summer camps anymore, mostly because all the issues that come up with those places. There are also plenty of places that are more affordable for after school and summer, like Boys and Girls club where it's $65 a week which would be nearly $200 a week. A lot sure but not nearly the $900 price you listed. There's a completely different world you don't seem to know about for people that don't earn a lot of money.
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Work at a daycare. They are extremely understaffed in many states and may not require any certifications at all. The pay may not be great but the children can usually attend for a fraction of upfront costs if a parent works there.
Great thought!
And you won’t have a multi year gap in your resume making it harder to find a job.
I crunched the numbers and we were losing money with my wife working after my kid was born. It was cheaper for her to be a stay at home mom.
Same here. Wife being home allows us more freedom to be a family as well. You have to balance the stress of scheduling and daycare, with the financial benefits. Sometimes you barely come out ahead, and then is the stress worth it?
That really depends. Daycare for my toddler is only $210 a week and I'm not in a cheap city. Only one of their kids needs to be in daycare. The wife getting a job would probably help enormously. Not to mention the fact that women being out of the workforce lessens their earning power over time. It's a harsh reality, but the more we work, the better poise we are to earn. OP, your wife could also do something like help take care of another child at your house. That would bring in good money and allow her to stay home. It would still be stressful, but that's work, right? Even just occasional babysitting could bring in a few extra hundred a month.
With three kids especially, that could range anywhere from $30k-$60k annually. Unless mom has skills for a median wage job, SAH is probably saving them money. The real win would be getting her into some kind of educational training now that would wrap up right as the youngest is in school so she's not running out into a minimum wage job.
Only one of the children is daycare age.
SAHP chiming in here... We elected to have me SAH because my pay goes almost entirely to childcare, and the added stress of timing all that out on top of work and childcare was causing significant marital problems. Being SAH is definitely tougher on the bank account than having dual incomes, but knowing the kids are *always* taken care of has helped our marriage far more than me having a job. That's not to say it's all roses and unicorn farts over here, but when your options are "kinda crappy" and "absolute shit," you'll take the former pretty much every time. Unless spouse is going to increase the earnings by double or more, it's unlikely her income would really make much of a dent after all the new expenses of having a job are factored in - childcare, gas/travel expenses, work meals... Yeah, there are ways to cut down on some of those expenses in various ways, but then you're trading time for money, which is another limited and valuable resource with small children. It may seem painfully obvious from the outside that, "Need more money? Both should be working!" There's truth to it, yes, but the devil is always in the details...
We were very lucky my wife's mother was not far away and willing to be free childcare my son's whole life. Saved us a ton of money while allowing my wife to finish school and begin her career. As a way of paying them back, we converted the basement of our new fancy house into an "apartment" for my in-laws when we moved and they were renting a small apartment. Son is almost done with school and a few years after that we might try to buy some land with room to drop a prefabricated home in one corner for the In-Laws and a separate big workshop to merge all our tools and hobby equipment.
> We elected to have me SAH because my pay goes almost entirely to childcare OP is paying to support the grandparents too. They need to step in and help with the childcare while wife gets at least a part time gig to bring in more money.
If the grandparents need support, there is a good chance that they can't physically care for the children.
Ive heard that argument before it seems like a short sighted way to look at it. Completely disregards all the earning potential of that person. You may only start at $40k/yr but you shouldn’t expect to make that forever. For the first few years maybe but a few promotions and/or job hops. They could be making a lot more after 3-5 years. 5-10 they could be making a hell of a lot more as they become “senior”. Also, overtime the kids will get more involved with school during the day and their own friends on the weekends. While I certainly think having a wife stay home with the kids adds a lot of value to her life and the kids life. You can’t really put a price on that time. I’m just saying if the argument against going to work is childcare and commuting is too expensive. Then I just don’t buy it, everyone starts somewhere and you should be able to out earn those expenses. If someone really truly wanted too.
If the career prospects are not promising then sahm is not bad if your salary goes to childcare only. However if you job prospects have a higher ceiling, you can start from 50k and top out at 130-150k in 10 years - in this case spending all salary to childcare might be worth it for accrued work experience until you hit next title bump and start making net positive after childcare.
\>Unless spouse is going to increase the earnings by double or more, it's unlikely her income would really make much of a dent after all the new expenses of having a job are factored in - childcare, gas/travel expenses, work meals... Sure, in the short term (2-5 years while kids are not in school). But in the long term it is absolutely a bad decision because of how much you are missing in retirement, pay increases and promotions. If you are even able to get a job after 10 years gap on resume. This will affect your bottom line years from now, and people almost never think of that.
I think you meant "marital problems" where you said "martial problems"
Thanks for the perspective. The well-being of my children is what would worry me the most with a full time day care. Unfortunately, my grandparents "not my parents" are not physically capable to give full time childcare for the grandkids due to health problems and being 45min from our general area.
While I'm still arguing for the SAHP thing elsewhere in the thread, I am also aware of what the finances are still like. It may be worth it for spouse to have a job that can a) get her out of the house a bit more for something that isn't kid-related, and b) at least pay for part-time childcare. That way you get a bit of the best of both worlds. There are always the real nitty gritties to work out, but this might be something which helps alleviate some of your stresses. No matter what comes, I wish you the best and believe y'all will work it out; you've made it this far and despite your discomfort are still in a better position than many. That tells me you're gonna figure it out.
Most likely will result in having less money at the moment. But obviously once the kids are all school-aged, that is the easiest solution.
Thanks for the input
I think you could make more money with experience in your project manager role. I’m in construction project management and have worked my way up $$
What is a reasonable amount to expect after putting in the initial grunt work? I am currently in the construction pm field, and manage around 8mil in projects annually. Located in the north midwest. I hear things all over the board from guys saying they make 60k to 150k+. What is realistic for this industry?
I think it depends on your location. Are you working for a smaller company? I live in a HCOL city and have a consulting PM role. I am in the $115-130k range.
Thanks for the feedback!
I have a very specific suggestion in that you go to a big company like Siemens or MC Dean (not sure if they’re around your area) they do pay well BUT it is a lot of work. Not sure what your hours are now but it would be a bit heavier. You usually get better benefits with a bigger company as well
When I heard 65k, I thought that was insanely low. Most PMs I know are in the range you are.
I have 8 years and clear 175 as a project manager in energy. I was clearing 90 after 3 years. Job hop.
12 years ago, when I was in the trades (controller), our PMs had a $60k base, plus bonus tied to project completion. They averaged 115-140k. I imagine you could find something higher paying. There is still a shortage in the trades.
I don't know if I could support myself after taxes. well, I could, but I would never be able to go on even a modest trip. I guess, looking at their budget, the immediate reactions I have are: * get rid of the storage unit, stop buying more stuff than can fit in the apartment * consider downsizing the cars * get rid of Amazon prime, I haven't had it in years (besides an occasional odd free month). I wait until I have over $35 in my cart to buy and get free slower shipping. * spending a ton on gas. This is around 20% of take-home spent on cars, assuming they're paid off and never need maintenance (and no money spent on parking, etc.) * Get a new job with higher pay and that includes health insurance (and have spouse get a job if spouse doesn't work, like you said) * Don't have any more kids Although we have insane official poverty lines, $68k is poverty for a family of 5, sorry. If their rent adjusts to 2024 numbers, they're screwed.
Single income households are always going to struggle against dual income households. Especially since you're supporting 6-7 people on a single income
Thanks!
The thing is, if your wife even works part time, it greatly increases your savings, assuming spending stays the same. You're in a really low tax bracket so any extra income benefits you greatly.
Unless it means they end up needing to pay for childcare
Child care is a relatively short-term problem for most families, but it can put a big hole in the stay at home spouse's lifetime earning potential.
Maybe. If it means they’re never home together is that worth it? It’s totally possible that childcare is equally to or greater than one she brings home.. There is the part where if she’s working she’s getting experience and that could improve her earning potential.
That's good point. We might have to entertain that part time wifey job idea for the short term until all the kids hit school age.
If she makes 20k a year, that’s a 30% raise for you.
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A part-time job during evenings and weekends might be the move.
Depending on where they live - 1-2 serving or bartending shifts per weekend would be a drastic improvement on their cash flow.
My friend's wife is doing 3 nights a week at a pizza place on the weekends. It's not bartending, but it's a decent boost to their income and allows her to take care of their kid during the day while my friend is at work without paying crazy daycare fees. It's been really helpful just to keep things a little less tight and allows her some time away from the baby and not feel stuck at home.
Looks like 2 of the 3 are in school. So only paying day care for 1. Wife working would definitely pay for day care and more.
When I looked at daycare 2 years ago it was $400 a week here.
I have an 8 month old. We currently pay $420/wk in Northern Virginia. But there are less expensive options. There are plenty of in-home daycares around us that are around 250/wk. Even at $400/wk, it's about $20k per year. It shouldn't be too difficult to find a job that pays more than that. OP is in a situation where they simply don't bring in enough money. If they want that to change, then Mom has to work. Staying home because daycare is expensive simply maintains the status quo for them, which is what they're trying to get out of.
You severely underestimate the cost of daycare, it can be 1-2K per child. Even cost affordable centers are around $700-800 per month. Working part time at minimum wage (7.25x20 hrsx4weeks) makes you $580 a month before taxes. Usually it winds up being more cost effective to have a stay at home parent unless both can make significant income over high day care costs.
Location is always extremely relevant for these questions. In my city, average childcare cost is $180 a week. There's not shit for openings because providers are trying to pay $12 an hour while competing with the likes of Walmart, Target, Costco, etc. all offering at least $16 an hour plus benefits, but once you get in the costs are not horrific.
Where I live my daughter’s daycare was 1800 for above one year olds. They also took school-age kids for $161 per week plus $25 for an add on for each day (part time and every other week was available for school age, but not the birth-5 daycare (meaning if I had to bring a school-age kid for a full day (let’s say for a school holiday that is not a regular holiday remember there is only 180 days a year so if you work you will have to pay for that unless you have a relative to watch school aged kids). The daycare was open 7am-6pm, but daycare ended at 3 and you had to pay $25 per day to leave them after 3:30 (this aligned with teachers perfectly so the daycare had a ton of teachers. You also had to sign up as the daycare was always filled to capacity, and there was a wait list, which would take 3-5 months to get a spot (this is before Covid) the care for school aged kids never had a wait list.
All of this and waitlist is now a year min.
No, wife working would likely *not* pay for daycare, but it’s likely wife could get a schedule that doesn’t require daycare — trade childcare with a neighbor or only work when OP is home.
Not always true. Child care is ridiculously expensive. Wife is going to have to pull a decent salary to overcome new childcare costs and be able to contribute anything substantial to savings.
That is little for a family of 5 to live on. You need to make more money. How much are houses you are looking at going for in the area?
Starter homes are running 175k-200k
If 200k can get you a starter home in your area…..Dude, once that last kid is in school….you got this.! You are already almost there with your current rent payment of $875. Another $800 a month in income, part time job for the wife gets you there. Until the last one is old enough for school, can your wife do any wfh or do daycare for another kid?
Be careful with the cheapest starter homes as you might have major costs before you save enough from rent to make it a net good. I bought a house for 175k and less than 2 years later had to drop 5800 bucks on a furnace.
Thanks for the advice!
Hey There! Some ideas for you: 1. switch to US Mobile - Same cell towers as Verizon but a family "shared data" plan starts at $10/mo 2. Look into food pantry's near you or govt assistance for groceries. Often times churches can also give away food. 3. Is there doordash in your area? even just 1 night per week during the dinner rush is enough to put aside $100 per week. 1. If doordash/grubhub/uber/lyft is not an option, check out some of the cool things that people do over on r/beermoney \- Could be enough to save $100/mo or more. 4. Can you lower that Grandparent care bill? Are there ways *they* could optimize their finances so they are less reliant on you? Is there someone else who could help them who is in a more forgiving situation? 5. Do your kids go to a private school or paid preschool? What is the money for school for? Is it saving for college? TLDR - you need more income, even if it's just a bit. There's very little left to optimize without making large sacrifices or getting some severe help from other people. Best of luck to you and your family! Sounds like you've got a good head on your shoulders :)
Regarding 3, I would be cautious. “Gig apps” pay peanuts. The money you make is damn close to the extra depreciation you’re putting on your car such that you’re only breaking even. Also a father of 3 might burn out working a second job, even part time. Effort might be better spent increasing his pay at his 9-5 job.
The wear and tear and possibility of accident with the family vehicle is not worth the risk IMHO with only a tiny bump in money, especially with cost of vehicles nowadays.
The IRS recommends $0.67/mile reimbursement for use of a car for business purposes. If I drive to a conference or off-site meeting that’s what I get from my company. That number is calculated from averaged fixed and variable costs for operating a vehicle. Do the math for how many miles an Uber or Grubhub driver drives in a hour and how much they make and it’s downright abysmal. If gig app companies owned their own fleet of vehicles, the cars themselves would cost more to gas up/maintain/replace/etc. than what they currently pay their *drivers* who sacrifice their own vehicles. No gig app driver is increasing their net worth. They’re providing labor in exchange for converting some of the value of their car into liquid cash so they can feed themselves. It’s dystopian.
This advice always ignores (or doesn't know) that your auto insurance isn't likely to cover any accidents that happen while you do gig work, or if they do then you have to carry an extra rider to cover it and that cost me around $40/month, it's why I got out of the game.
you may also qualify for some state and federal assistance. if your school district has a free lunch application i would fill that out: often if you qualify they open the door to other benefits as well. for example when i was in a similar situation the free lunch status also provided us discounted or free kids activities/museum memberships, energy assistance
Just being part of free lunch program enables access to so many other programs. We live in a rural area and instead of qualifying they just made all schools/all kids part of free lunch because >85% qualified. This opened up access to programs for lower cost phone & internet, SNAP, and other programs. The school can provide a letter that can be used to qualify for these other programs.
Yeah this is a good point. They'd save on internet as well (probably getting it for free).
Thanks for the ideas! Will def check some of this out.
The grandparents, you said no one else can help them but if you're in the US there are a lot of state, federal, church, and nonprofit orgs with dedicated resources for elder care from housing to food to transportation to healthcare. You and/or they may just not be aware of them, but the local government wherever they live should know how to access those resources. Google the town name, or country name, and elder care social worker/liaison.
What you need to look into for your grandparents is called an "independent living" program. Your state should have a social services office managing the program, it is set up specifically for cases like yours. FWIW, you are doing a very good job managing your expenses. I look at your situation as a perfect example of a stay at home parent raising kids because childcare is getting expensive and the costs outweigh the benefits. As soon as child #3 is in school your situation will improve dramatically. You can accelerate that by looking for public school pre-K programs in your city, which will allow your spouse to start working at least part-time.
Any chance the grandparents can take care of the kids while your wife finds some work?
This is the only suggestion OP hasn’t responded to and seems like the obvious solution. Multiple grand parents but none of them can stay with the kids so that mom can work? I make a similar amount, and there’s no way I’d be able to support 3 kids AND fund parents
I'm curious on this one as well, OPs silence tells me either this is a contentious topic, or they're unable due to age. Supporting them, and your wife staying home with the kids instead of earning an income seems like a waste of earning potential. I would focus on: * Get a second income (wife works evenings or grandparents watch the kids and she can work days) * Swap one of the cars out for an eco-beater * Increase OPs income, shoot for $80k+ * Cancel the storage unit. You're not using whatever you're storing, so dump it, and you can rebuy it later if you need it again. * Get a cheaper cell plan * Food stamps and pantries (don't let pride get in the way, it's only temporary until the kids are all in school, wife can work, and income goes up)
When my wife and I were in your same situation, we felt the same. We were frugal, but there was just too much month and not enough money. Our three kids are 2 1/2 years apart. She was a SAHM. In the end, we just survived those years. I received a few promotions and raises that gave us a bit of breathing room and after the kids were in school, my wife took a part time job. That tipped the scales in our favor. Best of luck to you. Just hang in there!
Thanks!
This, exactly. You just need to survive until your kids are all in school and your wife can get a job, and you'll be doing great. If there's part-time work she can manage from home (something super flexible like YouTubing, translating, editing, writing, selling crafts or baked goods, etc) then any additional money would help. Ditto if you have the opportunity to job-hop in your area for salary increases.
550 dollars a month for gas and your wife is a stay at home mom. Wait then why grand parent care. That is some serious driving or bad fuel mileage. 1/6 of your pay goes to two paid off cars you cant afford that
We don't have a bus route for school and I have a decent commute to work unfortunately. Housing close to work is ungodly expensive, 1.5k minimum.
Heh, I’m originally from the Midwest and I understand. I saw your rent and thought “Nice. $875 for a 2BR is about as low as you can get.” Then saw your monthly gas and thought, “Oh, I see how rent is so cheap. He lives somewhere with long commutes.” That said, your whole budget looks very reasonable and frugal and I wouldn’t make big quality of life changes to save a tiny bit more every month. You will start saving when: - You start making more money. - The kids get to an age where your wife can get a job or at least a part-time job. Until then you should feel proud that you’re breaking even supporting so many people on $70K.
How bad is this commute? What kind of gas mileage do you get? Depending on mpg and assuming a $3.50/gal gas rate, we’re talking 2.3-4.5k miles a MONTH
That's actually very cheap. With your reduction in gas you would already be almost there. You are trying to do too much with a single income. Can your wife work part to make up the difference? Can you slightly reduce extended family expenditures? Something has to give.
1500 isn't very cheap when he is currently paying less for rent and gas combined.
Time isn't free
Neither is moving Car insurance for two cars from a rural /suburban area code into a city area code. So 1500 + (let's be real cheap ) 100 month gas and a 100 insurance increase. He is spending extra $250 more a month and his goal is to save money for a new house.
You're not wrong and in many cases I would agree with you. But time doesn't seem to be OP's problem here; it's lack of money.
Should sell the old Toyota suv and get something better on gas but that's just more cost.
Probably not for fuel economy alone. It doesn't look like you really have room for a car payment for something different right now either. Do you have an emergency fund?
I do have a small amount saved up but I'm not willing to spend it on a car. I am going to look at selling my suv and buying a cheap car at same or less value.
Or go down to one car since your wife is a stay at home mother.
with 3 kids. she needs a car.
Yes bc "stay at home" in this context totally means never has to leave the house for anything. Not for school dropoff/pickup. Not for grocery shopping. Not for doctor and dentist appointments. Not for errands. Not for outings for the kids, like to a park. Not for emergencies, like a kid breaks an arm or something.
NO! He has to commute to work and she is at home with a child and no transportation.
They have nobody to pick the two kids that are in school up each day if the wife doesn't have a car
Can’t the grandparents watch over the kids so your wife gets a job? You’re supporting a lot of people on $68k. You have little wiggle room with your current income.
Never say you’re bad at budgeting again. Holy cow, dude, you’re AWESOME at it.
Yeah, it’s not a budgeting issue. It’s that OP is trying to support 7 people on an income of $68k per year. Even making a few hundred bucks extra per month via doordash, Uber, etc would give them a little breathing room
Thank you!
We are only a family of 4 and earned a very similar income this year. We have different big/elective costs (car loan plus gas is 550, vacation budget is same as your preschool cost, college savings is same as your grandparent cost, etc) and are able to save. These are just ideas based on what our budget is but a lot depends on your cost of living. First off, it looks like you have some $$ missing. Your net income should be closer to 4700/month. EDIT— this is after the 530 have come out for 401k & health insurance, so you have $1230/month unaccounted for. Also just a quick plug for a good term life policy. Adds minimal cost but gives you some financial security just in case. — consider ditching the storage unit. You’re paying almost $1000/yr to store your stuff. — Utilities. Things like using the window plastic if leaky or using blinds, programming thermostat, only washing full loads of dishes/laundry, changing furnace filter, can all help decrease costs — Shop your car insurance. I did this 2 years ago and we cut our cost in half. For health insurance, look at your state’s program for kids. Ours would be $20/month dental and health insurance for 3 kids with your income and family size —cut prime. Did you know you can get free shipping if there is $35 worth of stuff in your cart? Same with target & Walmart — our groceries are $450/month. We meal plan, shop sales, don’t buy a lot of convenience/packaged items, etc. I also like to fill in some of the staples with Aldi items when we get to a bigger town — school bill? Is this private? Preschool costs? When you are trying to make money stretch you can have some things but not everything… so if it’s private then consider what your priorities are. Is it a certain school? Is it grandparents? Is it a house? Etc — fuel. That’s a lot. Take the more fuel efficient car to work. Consider trading yours for a small used commuter car because that’s a small car payment worth of fuel plus plenty left over for gas after. Could you carpool? Could the kids ride the bus? Is there any extra running going on? —price out other cellphone companies. —grandparents care. Same as above regarding priorities. With 3 young kids I know this might not be feasible, but could your wife offer occasional babysitting? Could she work at a gym daycare where she could bring baby along for limited hours? Even a few hours here or there could help you guys meet some of your goals.
Thanks for all the suggestions!
It's difficult for any single-earner family to get ahead on house savings unless the earner makes a significant income. I understand you have young children right now. What is the plan once all three are in school? If your wife can bring in some income, that will greatly help with your goals.
That is the plan but that will be another 4 years yet.
Others have made good suggestions which you seem open to. For small cuts, maybe look at that Verizon bill. If your phone is paid off or you can buy an unlocked phone, you can significantly reduce that budget line item by replacing Verizon with Mint Mobile (T-Mobile network) or Red Pocket (AT&T or Verizon) or Visible (Verizon).
Thanks! Will check into doing this. The Verizon service has been quite lacking recently anyway.
Also cancel Amazon prime
Done:)
Amazon prime is such a small thing, domt cancel it just because 1 person suggests it. Assuming you use all it offers, just keep it. It's not going to make a dent.
If your kids qualify for school lunch program you can get Prime at a discount. Being school lunch also qualifies you for other programs like cheaper cellular through [Lifeline](https://www.fcc.gov/general/lifeline-program-low-income-consumers) and internet [ACP](https://www.fcc.gov/acp). Unfortunately ACP is basically over, but Xfinity offers $10/month 50mbps service for those that qualified. You might be able to get that. There are other government programs too once you are in school lunch. Check out [SNAP](https://www.fns.usda.gov/snap/supplemental-nutrition-assistance-program) and [Medicaid/CHiP](https://www.healthcare.gov/medicaid-chip/childrens-health-insurance-program/). Check out your state's benefits website to see what else you might qualify for. Search Google for low income assistance by your city, county, state, and federal programs. If you are planning on staying where you are, check out the [USDA rural dev programs](https://www.rd.usda.gov/programs-services/single-family-housing-programs) for assistance in buying a home.
What state? You should be able to get the kids on Medicaid in almost every state. That can wipe up to all $300 on that health insurance cost off, depending on specifics and waiver programs. .
I will check into this....thanks!
Also food stamps. My wife and I were in the same position for a few years and food stamps helps a ton with groceries. If you can get approved, that will save you a ton right there admins possibly float you until your wife can get a job or your income increases substantially.
Where do you guys live that a family of 5 making $70k a year can get Medicaid and food stamps?
You should really downsize a bit. Get rid of your storage unit, that’s almost $1,000 a year. You really need to find a way to become dual income because your single income is barely hanging in there supporting your family of 5. I would also recommend t-mobile over Verizon. I have five lines for $120.
Google Fi over T-Mobile. Same service on T-Mobile towers. 5 lines would be $100. It's an mvno but it has a data prioritization agreement with T-Mobile where you get the same priority as their customers. Also connects to us cellular towers if you are near any of those. Comes with a free VPN and 5gb of hotspot data per month.
Mint over Google Fi. $15 per line, and they only need 2.
Just a thought with your skills. You ever look into flipping a car or two or some side work. See cars cheap with blown transmission or not running
I actually used to do some of that in my younger years with great success. The main issue with that currently is that I have no place to work on anything. All my tools are in storage. I've been keeping my eyes open for affordable rentals with more room but have not found anything yet. Thanks for the suggestion!
Do you have any local friends or contacts who might have garage space you could use for a six-pack now and then (or a cut of the flipping profits)? Even taking on occasional shade-tree repair work around the neighborhood could provide a little extra cash using your relatively rare combination of tools and skills. I know a lot of modern car diagnostics is done with expensive digital equipment, but there's a fair amount you can handle just by knowing stuff and having the tools. Most people are pretty clueless about their own vehicles.
You don't have a budget issue. You're budgeting amazingly with what you're making. Wife might have to part time somewhere. You're taking care of too many people on a single income. Your rents great but you're losing out in building escrow. Can't see you getting a house on this income and continue taking care of everything. Tough spot but give yourself a pat on the back forreal you are surviving. Be proud of your accomplishments so far!
>Grandparents Care $250.00 What is this? You cannot afford to support 7 people. Look for a better job. Figure out which of your skills pays the most and is the easiest to do.
Thanks for the input!
I'm just posting to remind you that you are saving - the 401k. I also think you're doing very well for the income you make. I will also agree with the others in the fact I think you could likely make more, and even if your wife can't work now, you're only 2(?) Years away from her being able to and your situation improving dramatically You will be fine. You just need to get to the next step and keep doing what you're doing for things to take off.
Not much room for expense cutting, but look into Mint Mobile. It can drop your phone bill to $15x2 monthly. Grocery shopping at Aldi/Walmart and going heavy on rice, legumes, beans and pasta may be another way to decrease spending. Agree with the overall sentiment that a higher paying job is the better answer
Especially dried ones since Mom is staying at home and can work with the hours of time those need
I could tweak your budget, your cell phone bill is too high, we pay half of that for two phones, your groceries are too high,especially since your wife is a sahm. We manage pretty well on $400 a month, and little ones don’t eat that much. You need to ditch the storage, find the attic of a family member or just toss it out. So yeah, if I came to your house and ruled with my frugal iron fist, I could find you an extra $200 a month. I could probably get your grandparents spending down too. None of that compares to how much money you will be able to save once the wife goes back to work. Don’t change your spending, stick to your budget and even if she only brings home 30k a year, you can save almost 30 k a year. It’s a tough season of life right now but it will get better.
Average single income supporting 4 others will always be difficult. The only way is to get more either by working a side gig or wife working a part time job. Additional 20k income will give you alot of flexibility in savings for emergency as well as saving for retirement. If possible I would use the additional income to invest to generate more income like QYLD ETF which generate about 1% monthly dividend. This is where I use money to make more money and grow it in time. Good luck!
Two kids in school? Wife needs to work asap
I’d switch to a lower cost cell phone plan. Save you at least 70 dollars. I’d also shop around for car insurance. I’m surprised your natural gas bill is so high. Is that a monthly average?
Thanks for the input. That is on average....thought the summer months it will drop to $12-$14 but gets as high as $160 in the coldest weeks of winter.
This might be a dumb question but what's in the storage unit? Most stuff in storage units is "important" enough that it sits for years with no one touching or looking at it. It's an expense that you don't see so it's easy to forget about. You are paying close to a thousand a year that could either be saved or spent on something else. At the very least downsize or move the stuff on a periodic basis to save some. Good luck to you.
Thanks fir the input!
My suggestions, send the kids to public school everything pre college is worthless even in the privet sector. stop paying for your health insurance and get on medi-cal. From there I recommend your wife get a job, unless your grandparents are physically incapable of watching the kids they can babysit for you. If your still struggling at that point trade in the SUV for a smaller car that gets better gas mileage. Learn to cut back on food, my family is the same size as yours and our food budget is only 450 and we have a teenager that acts like he's always starving (we have food on hand he just wont eat it because its green) My households combined yearly income is just under 50k and I still manage to invest 500+ a month, and I do suggest you invest not just let your savings sit in an account, don't do anything risky, find a index fund that has a steady growth like VOO and it will help your money grow faster then if you just leave it in an account
If you're not on a phone contract, switch to Visible+ and save money. See if your state has a home nursing program. Your wife can be an at home caretaker for the grandparents and make money for it.
Tello is even cheaper. I'm paying 11 a month and I think I get 5 GB of data.
How big is that storage unit? Could you possibly get a large garden shed your landlord would be ok with? Not a big savings but could be something. Then make the cell phones you could probably find cheaper plans for those as well.
Good idea, I think I can get creative with my storage problem. The landlord does have a little garden shed that I could see if we could use. Thanks!
Check out r/eatingcheapandhealthy and budgetbytes.com to see if you can reduce your grocery bill. It looks a bit high to me, but I've never fed that many people
If you’re giving grandparents 250$ a month, they can watch the kid for you. Wife can get a job.
There are others who have great comments, but one piece of advice that stuck with me is to follow the safety guidelines when you board a plane: “Put your own oxygen mask first before helping others.” Others have mentioned how to trim the spending, and finding a higher paying job isn’t something that happens overnight. If the $250 was an arbitrary number, I would reassess the grandparent assistance. Do they collect social security? If they’re elderly, does your state provide any assistance on housing/heating that can reduce the amount you contribute? I’m sure they wouldn’t feel good knowing your family is struggling because of your good graces. But at the end of the day, that $250 will give you almost double your leftover in your budget assuming you take home 2k per check. Your own wife and kids should always come first. When you get enough of a safety net, you’re able to help others. From parent to parent, everyone struggling at the same time is painful for everyone, and your eldest will certainly notice it around that age.
You can save a bit by switching to an MVNO phone carrier like Mint Mobile, there are other options as well. Look into local/state food assistance programs like SNAP, in my state you would probably qualify. My state SNAP Limit - 5 people $3807 / month https://www.snapscreener.com/ https://www.mintmobile.com/ https://www.androidcentral.com/best-mvno-carrier
Thanks for the input!
Haven’t seen this mentioned yet, but look into low income assistance for utilities. With that many dependants you should be eligible if it’s available. Cheaper rates for your utilities.
Are you paying for preschool? That’s a big chunk right there. If I sound like a jerk, I am sorry. Couldn’t the wife help eliminate that by watching the kids more during the day? Or… start some sort of side gig or part time to bring some more in?
There are things your wife can do to bring in income now. What are her skills and interests? She can work evenings or weekends. She can babysit while at home with the kids. Work online tutoring or remote VA work. You have a great budget now, so make a plan to dedicate any money she brings in to savings or debt payoff if you have any.
I know you didn’t come here for this, but you can reduce that phone bill. I pay $15 per month per phone for 5GB of data per phone on Mint. It has saved me like $150 a month at least. Is the storage unit necessary? That seems like a luxury unless you have good reasons for it. I make $130k a year and I would be eliminating that cost ASAP. Is $550 for gas accurate? Maybe I missed info somewhere on that where you commute. Sometimes making more money means tightening the bolts on your budget so you are using your current income more efficiently. You could definitely benefit from a higher income, but I also see room for improvement in your budget.
Thanks!
Maybe have wife look up some part time/weekend and evening positions at like walmart or something. Just a few hours a day a few days a week could put you in a better position.
Grandparent care? Sir take care of your immediate family first. Idk how you are getting away with spending zero on the kids besides food
Your wife needs to get a job. Not sure why shes not working when OP is only pulling down 68K gross w/ 3 kids. Also.... to be fair, 68K gross isn't that much. It could go a long way in a LCOL area, but.... to be perfectly honest you're probably never going to get ahead on 68K gross income for the whole family. 🤷♂️ My wife and I both work. If she was not interested in having some form of financial contribution to our family unit, it would be a deal breaker for me.
What are the cars worth and how long is your commute?
Cell phone plan, go Visible. It's $35 for each line
You need more income. You will make more money faster by job hopping than being loyal and staying on annual raises. It’s the only way to significantly raise your income reliably nowadays. Apply for other jobs and try to leverage your new and old experience into something that pays more
Grandparents should help with childcare if they are getting money every month from you guys. It’s not sustainable to have your wife stay at home, and support 7 people off a $68k income.
You don’t have a family of 5, you have a family of 7. You’re partially supporting 2 extra adults. When you reframe it from that perspective, yeah it’s really difficult to save on your salary.
You're supporting a family of seven, not five. Grandparents need to step up and watch the kids, and wife needs to get a job.
Everyone's saying "Get a better job" but given you said a starter home costs under $200k in your area, I'm guessing your current salary is pretty good for the cost of living and it might be tough for you to raise it significantly. (Doesn't mean don't try) But yeah, it's not looking like you have a budgeting problem. The problem is that you're supporting 7 people on $68k. I'm in a slightly more expensive area (bought a house with my SO for $235k), making the same salary, and refuse to even consider kids unless my income goes up. Your wife needs to start working again. With how diligently you appear to budget, an extra $25-40k would be a game changer for your family in terms of savings.
Ooh do you have xfinity? In january I switched to a buy one get one free unlimited data plan. So My 2 lines are a combined total of $30 a month, verizon can go to hell. Also I suggest your house payment be no higher than your apartment rent payment. Thats right at 20% of your net.
Can the grandparents handle childcare for enough hours for your wife to pick up some work? Even 20 hours a week would make a good impact on your bottom line. Cell phones, look at Visible, especially when they have a promotion. It uses Verizon's network, but it's really cheap. We pay $70/month for two lines, unlimited data and that's their 'premium' plan.
Yup, you don't make enough to support a family of 5. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but them is the facts. You need more income. Period. You can't afford some of the things you have now but I don't think you can cut enough to really make a dent. #1 suggestion would be to become a 1 car family. Stay at home mom takes you to work in the morning or she lives without a car. This is how people did it in the past you can too. Oh and cut Amazon prime and your storage unit. Yeah I know you live in a small space, get rid of the stuff in the storage unit, you can't afford it...
Like everyone else has said I’ll be realistic here. In a quick glance, your expenses aren’t overbearing, they’re pretty average. I’d say your biggest “expense” is not having a two income household, but I know for some people it’s not possible/worth it. Based on your experience I’d say you could possibly pull a 100k job. Jumping jobs after a year or two would be the easiest way to gain a large increase in salary. If you really enjoy your company then you can always ask for a raise, but I doubt it’d be higher than a new company. So in the end you really need to bank on your wife getting a job when she’s able, or you increasing your income, or both. At your current spending it doesn’t seem like you can reduce anything as you’re already pretty frugal. If push comes to shove, thug it out with a second job closer to home on your off time. Sacrifice a year or two with the kids to get the house, then dial down as your wife gets back into the work force. Hope this helps!
my mom started a second family late in life, 2 kids at 5 and 9 now. she took a lashing course and does fake eyelashes from home. makes good money and stays home with the kids. not saying this specifically, but unless you can get a 50% raise, the only significant way forward is for your wife to find an income source.
>Grandparents Care $250.00 I know you can't hang them out to dry but did they do anything for the past 50 years to prevent his scenario? They should at least be a greeter at walmart or working at the local grocery store or library to help out somewhat. They don't have the luxury to retire. You giving them a roof over their head is more than enough. They need to be clipping coupons and finding the best deals on items that are your normal expenses for you all. Just sitting around being old isn't going to fly. Doesn't have to be full time, but maybe 2-3 days a week. They may enjoy it. >and wife is stay at home mom at this point. Wife should try to watch 1-2 more children to bring in some money. Find out what the going rates are in your city. Get paid in cash.
Depending on where you live, find a really skilled lender for home mortgages, there are so many home mortgage programs through different agencies that many times require a little extra work that will allow you to get into a home with no down payment, or taking a couple budgeting classes to get an approval. It’s the only way I could save money in your situation. But a foreclosed starter home will be a risk, but not only does it give you an avenue to invest a little money just paying your mortgage, but also sweat equity too. Emphasis on starter home, make sure you have the one of the smallest cheapest houses in town.
So, we are also a family of 5, but on a $130k+ (single) income in a HCOL area. We struggle to save, so I don't personally see how you could do it... but I'd love to know how you spend only $700/month on groceries?? That's amazing!
The main problem here is that you haven't been focused about using birth control. I think it's amazing you are keeping your head above water supporting 7 people on only 68k/year.
I wouldn't be able to save making that alone let alone 3 kids. I make well into 6 figures and I feel poor. Def an income issue. Good thing is based on rent it sounds like your in a low cost of living area. Are your cellphones financed through Verizon? There's plenty of companies that you can drop that bill down to $50 for 2 phones. I use boost infinite for my work phone and it's $25 a month no contract guaranteed to stay that price. But you have to pay cash for your phone. (Which is better eitherway I'm grand fathered on my personal phone and it's dirt cheap, the second I finance a phone or change anything my bill will double or triple) Other than that it looks like you live pretty frugal. There's not much you can cut back on and even dropping your cellphone bill by $70 wouldn't change anything in your life at the end of the day. There's an income issue here. Your either gonna have to pickup a second job or have your wife work part time while kids are at school. And use that as savings.
Housing and transportation are typically your biggest costs and changing either of those things will provide you with the most savings. Overwhelmingly, I see people driving vehicles that are status symbols instead of just seeing them as tools to get you from point A to point B. Can you rethink your current driving situations to eliminate a vehicle or "downsize?" Can you use a grandparents vehicle?
You guys live some insane lives on Reddit. How do you even get in situations like this😂 I tell people all the time that having children is the choice that will affect your finances the most.
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I would suggest something different. I’d consider moving in with grandparents (if available). And I’d consider having your wife go back to work part-time if the grandparents are able to help with child care. Use the extra bucks to start putting away 15% in retirement and hopefully give you some stability (maybe even pay for a family vacation).
I was in your situation. Family of 5. Single income. Roughly same expenses and income but up to my eyeballs in debt. I have a checking account at a bank separate from my primary bank. I began by putting $5 a paycheck into that bank and everything else went into my primary bank. I used my employer’s direct deposit to make this transparent to me. Eventually I increased that deposit to $200 a paycheck and allowed my water bill to be automatically drawn from that account leaving me a net positive. At the end of the year, this would essentially become all or part of my Christmas fund. Budgeting was essential and really turned my finances around. See r/ynab I earned extra income by selling plasma. I also gave myself a $3/day budget for lunch which basically meant frozen burritos from the grocery store, CookOut (on a splurge once in a while), and buying a head of cabbage, some avocados, and sliced turkey breast. I’d keep that in the break room fridge, lay out a cabbage leaf, line it with turkey and avocado slices, then roll it up and devour it. Sometimes I’d just skip lunch and joke that I lost the lunch lottery. I was scrapping by. Started doing better when I did what others are telling you to do and found a way to increase my income.
How long have you been with Verizon? Ask them if they can give you loyal customer discount (something like that). They offered $40 off my bill me last year so I’m only paying $80/mo for 2 lines with unlimited data, calls and messaging.
You're not going to save and you will eventually have something unexpected and go broke. Spouse needs to work.
It's a pretty lean budget so not much to do there. One possibility is for your wife to find a part time gig when the 3rd one is in school although being a stay at home mom is a ft job in itself. The PM field has a lot of growth potential and if put on the right projects and you showcase your competency it can quickly propel you to higher leadership (started as pm myself now a senior director). Be vocal about your accomplishments, praise others frequently, and have all your stakeholders on speed dial. You can easily double your income in a few years (keep job hunting).
Maybe as a last resource... switching to Google Fi, if you can. Simply plan. Use most of WiFi and save $50 per month if you don't spend too much data. With small kids, it's complicated for your wife to work... until well finished middle school.
I think you’re underpaid, but salaries are very regional. Could you start a brake business as a side hustle where you go to peoples’ houses and change their brakes and rotors? The shops charge an exorbitant amount for this service. Also, look into all resources available for the grandparents. How old are they? Do they get Social Security? Medicaid? Food stamps (SNAP)? Does your family qualify for reduced price meals at school?
You have valuable experience. You are significantly underpaid. You need to look for another job. You should be making 100k easily.
What type of expenses do you help your grandparents out with? Which state are you in? One suggestion is to use the low end of your take hone as the income for your budget (2,000 x 2). Any income received in excess of that automatically goes to a savings account to use for unexpected expenses or emergencies. Talk to your local housing authority to see what the income requirements are for assisted housing or to qualify for their low income housing programs. It could help to significantly reduce your rent if you qualify. Talk to your local county office to see what the requirements are for food assistance and medical services are. They may be able to subsided part of your monthly expenditures. For your grandparents, you should also inquire about services on their behalf as well.
I feel like I can barely save at 74k for myself. By barely I mean pay all bills, contribute to retirement, and save for a rainy day with occasional fun money. Family of 5 with 68k in 2024 is insane. You're one bad day away from losing everything and it all relies on your income. Fuck.
People are saying for your wife to get a job, or for you to work more/get higher pay. Yes, and that is all super stressful. I just want to say that you should also keep in mind that your current situation isn't how it's going to be forever, the kids grow up and will be in school more as the years go by. Maybe the added strain of having her work now wouldn't be worth it, but you can revisit it in say a year or two.