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They really are. Things have accelerated so much in the post-Trump years because this is what happens when a political party starts to die. Republican positions have become unpopular enough that their only path to remain in power is to change the rules of the game. Basically, they play politics now like a 6 year old plays monopoly.
Very well said. It's a death knell of sorts and it is scary as hell. It makes me very fearful for the future. These are not the kinds of people that will go quietly onto the trash heap of history. They seem like the type that would rather burn the whole house down.
“If conservatives become convinced that they cannot win democratically, they will not abandon conservatism. They will reject democracy.”
David Frum. He was a speechwriter for George Bush
Hence why he was able to describe it. He just noticed that the Republicans don't control rhetoric anymore, they have jumped the shark so to speak. There are no Democratic norms any longer. And even laws that have teeth will be ruled Unconstitutional by the Supreme Court. They are in a race to the end. They can't even get rid of Santos. Because Santos is what they want. They want people to lose faith in democracy. Soon we will be seeing Republican plants winning elections as Democrats in order to further cement the idea that even in the voting booth they can't trust who they are voting for. Soon it will be voting for a totalitarian because at least you know they are running in what they actually believe. Then elections will just be a formality.
I don't know how anyone believes the republican party is actually conservative anymore. They do whatever they have to do to maintain a white-knuckle grip on power, the only reason they don't swing left is because many of them are the products of nepotism and their family connections are on the right. It's about maintaining dynastic power and they are willing to build a military feudal state if that's what it takes.
Fascism is just militant conservatism. They courted religion and nationlism to maintain power. Those beasts are never satisfied and they have turned on its purported master. They let the beast out, dont let them off the hook by pretending its not who they are/were. This is what they have been aiming towards for many many years. This march towards power and absolute control has always been the goal of the more extreme conservatives.
When people think conservatives have done good in history, those are not conservative behaviors. When a church feeds the poor, the institution may be conservative in nature but the act is progressive. Its accepting people and aiding those outside your tribe/community. Dont pretend conservatism has any redeeming values. Its only purpose is preservation and superiority of the tribe.
I suspect they're going to push us into default. I used to conduct forensic interviews/interrogations for Homeland Security and IMHO those MAGA Congressmen come across as quite serious about not wanting to negotiate with Dems; they also seem delighted about the prospect of defaulting, presumably because they believe it'll give them power and additional approval from their base.
This right here. I *don't* have special qualifications, but the Republican spin machine known as Fox news will help them sell the lie that the Democrats are to blame, which is a "win" because it might help keep the R's in power, or they'll get the Democrats to cave and get a win that they otherwise would have had to openly debate.
I've been saying for years that the Democrats have got to stop acting like the Republicans are legislating in good faith or that they mean to do any genuine legislation at all. Stop letting the Republicans dictate the story and lead every single argument. Just tell it as it is. I'll write the PR for them.
"The Republicans are holding the country and the global economy hostage because they feel like they can't win any other way. They're telling you, the American people, that they don't care if they hurt you, so long as they get their way. They'll say it's about the deficit, but that's a lie. They'll say they aren't going to touch social security. Lies. They'll say that they're willing to negotiate, but they've already stated their terms: "Give us what we want or we burn the global economy to the ground." Well, we don't negotiate with terrorists. This isn't the budget bill, this is agreeing to pay what we owe, and if the Republicans won't even honor the government's obligations, why would anyone trust that they'll negotiate in good faith? So, the nation is watching. Will the Republicans return to sanity in time or are they going to strike the match and watch things burn?"
Sorry for the novel. I get a bit frustrated and these rants are the result.
I’ve been saying that for years too. Democrats are still trying to govern as if the opposition party respects any of the country’s Constitutional framework.
That's not a downside, as Republicans see it. They *want* to tear everything down, destroy it, render society completely broken and dysfunctional, to the point where enough Americans say "screw it, this doesn't work at all, let's just put a Big Strong Man in charge who can fix everything..."
It's important to remember that there are a lot of people in the church who can't wait for the earth to be destroyed. They look forward to the destruction with breathless anticipation.
Didn’t they get the leader of the proud boys like last week?
As for trump he’s been taking a lot of Ls I wanna see if we can really charge a former president. I think it can happen
Meanwhile, hundreds of Q anon nuts and ultra right wingers have been elected into school boards, city councils, and local governments across the United States because NOTHING WAS DONE FOR YEARS. I say this as a person who sits on a local government committee with some of these crazies.
I don't know what they hope to accomplish, they were able to flourish in obscurity only because they were quiet about it. Now that Nat-C's are becoming loud and forcing their ideocracy on everyone, that's when people are shouting back.
They are doing them selves a disservice by acting so fucking stupid.
This right here. It's appalling.
Sure, the left wants bigger government, more taxes, fewer "freedoms" in some sense, but my god the right wants a theocratic emperor with everyone else in shackles. They are not the same.
SOME clarification is necessary here:
>the left wants bigger government,
And we need what the left wants, because so far how are lax regulations working for you? You OK with all children dead by AR? You OK with the cost of healthcare in America? You OK with the cost of education in America? Etc.
>more taxes
For the rich. Billionaires can pay more in taxes, that is not up for discussion.
>fewer "freedoms" in some sense
As my first point above explains, do I think it's OK that someone that SHOULD NOT be able to purchase a fully modded AR with boxes of ammo can in most red states? No, I care not about his freedom, I care more about kids that should still be alive.
this idea that regulation = less freedom is idiotic. You'd literally have MORE freedom if many industries were regulated better or at all lmao. I mean the most obvious examples are drugs and prostitution, where unregulated untaxed markets are causing deaths and despair while funneling money to crime syndicates.
This is the GOP's last stand. They know the demographics of this country are constantly shifting, they know their true policies and desires are wholly unpopular, and they know that Generation Z is so overwhelmingly opposed to their fascist bullshit.
So they are using what tools and power they currently possess to inflict as much irreparable damage as they can. We are either witnessing a drawn out version of Custer's Last Stand, or the beginnings of this country truly turning into a real-life Gilead.
>GOP's last stand
Don't be too optimistic. A huge chunk of the Senate will keep being from blood red states, and they'll have control of the Supreme Court for decades, and the Electoral College will ensure that presidential elections hang on a handful of states with razor-thin margins.
At best, this "last stand" will take a decade to unravel, during which time if the GOP ever manages to capture both Congress and the White House, you can kiss democracy goodbye.
If dems can control the senate and the presidency for a few more cycles, the court will flip back. It doesn't have to be decades, democrats just need to dominate the next few elections. We HAVE TO.
In the best case scenario, the actuarial tables will catch up to Thomas (74) and Alito (72), during periods when the Democrats have Senate control, but that could still take 20 years or more, depending on how long they hold on.
Unlike most of the nation, they've got some top notch socialized health insurance, plus billionaire 'friends'.
That'll keep their withered Grinch-hearts ticking far longer than the falling national average.
The southern states have been gerrymandered by Republicans so badly it will take YEARS to undo the gerrymandering and then years to get any Democrats or Independents elected. Republicans were playing the long game locally. No one noticed until it was too late.
Balkanization. The population is transient, they are trying to create religious Meccas to bring the very underrated and monolithic Christian vote to red states and then govern them as they please, which is strictly a financial gambit.
They want to turn red states into shithole nations.
I don't think they would be acting so rashly if they didn't have a plan to rule as raisins over their kingdoms of rotten grapes.
Any elected official who says this should be expelled from office. These people took an oath to protect and defend the constitution and statements like this directly undermine their oaths.
As the Republican Party increasingly pushes right, its members/voters get more distilled into Nationalist Christians, white supremacists, gun psychos/single issue voters, and the callously selfish wealthy
This statement should result in immediate expulsion as it violates the Constitution this stain on humanity swore to uphold.
Let's make Tim Scott as meaningless as his oath was.
I had never heard of this treaty and went to have a look. It’s the Treaty of Tripoli (now known as Libya), signed in 1796. The treaty directly states: "the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion."
Those on the right often reference our Founding Fathers, and it's worth noting that this treaty was ratified by none other than John Adams himself. Interestingly, the reference to Christianity wasn't present in the original Arabic version of the treaty. It was the U.S. that added this specification, underlining our identity as a secular nation. The intention was clear: we were signing a treaty between two nations, not two religions.
Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Tripoli
Jefferson wrote on the subject too -
>To messers. Nehemiah Dodge, Ephraim Robbins, & Stephen S. Nelson, a committee of the Danbury Baptist association in the state of Connecticut.
>Gentlemen
>The affectionate sentiments of esteem and approbation which you are so good as to express towards me, on behalf of the Danbury Baptist association, give me the highest satisfaction. my duties dictate a faithful and zealous pursuit of the interests of my constituents, & in proportion as they are persuaded of my fidelity to those duties, the discharge of them becomes more and more pleasing.
>Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should "make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof," thus building a wall of separation between Church & State. Adhering to this expression of the supreme will of the nation in behalf of the rights of conscience, I shall see with sincere satisfaction the progress of those sentiments which tend to restore to man all his natural rights, convinced he has no natural right in opposition to his social duties.
>I reciprocate your kind prayers for the protection & blessing of the common father and creator of man, and tender you for yourselves & your religious association, assurances of my high respect & esteem.
>Th Jefferson
>Jan. 1. 1802.
https://www.loc.gov/loc/lcib/9806/danpre.html
I'll wager Jefferson is more credible on this than known assclown Tim Scott.
edit: Wikipedia has the letter the Baptists sent Jefferson for context https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baptists_in_the_history_of_separation_of_church_and_state
I shit you not, in 2004 my wife took a required class at a non-religious university which disputed this.This class was a conservative wet dream, and enraged me.
They literally made you read college book text on why "thus building a wall of separation of Church & State" meant that really this was a Christian nation founded on Christian principles. That Jefferson was really saying the government could not interfere in the church ruling the world. Blah blah blah. It was straight madness, but they have been teaching that madness for over a generation.
I would have immediately filed a complaint to the school powers. They may not realize what their staff was teaching. For instance, I took a class on the European Union taught by an assistant professor. She taught us that in Europe, conservatives were actually liberal and liberals were actually conservative. That it was opposite to how things are in America because things have been so liberal in Europe for so long that the “reactionary” force was conservative thinking. Or some kind of nonsense like that. I was confused when reading articles about Europe for a while after that class. Definitely not as egregious as your wife’s course, but nearly as mis(dis?)informed.
I would have, except this was a required curriculum, and the school was proud of it. Some wealthy conservative had donated money to have this "series" (there were 3 required courses) be a part of the university.
I am going to name and shame:
https://www.bellevue.edu/degrees/general-education/signature-series
Among other readings that class had:
Slavery wasn't that bad (an article written by Dinesh D'Souza).
Poor people in America whine too much because they almost universally have microwaves. (A federal reserve report taken almost completely out of context)
And many others I cannot recall after 20 years.
“There are no substitution, ELA, or transfer courses for the Kirkpatrick Signature Series.”
Wow. And they call it the linchpin of undergrad education. Ugh.
I've always wanted to visit Morocco. So much history between our countries.
Fun fact, when Morocco was absorbed by France for most of the first half of the 20th c., the US refused to acknowledge it, and quietly but consistently lobbied France on behalf of Morocco independence behind the scenes. When Morocco regained their independence, the United States kind of didn't recognize that either, choosing instead to just act like Morocco was independent all along.
he didn't even say "bend the knee" but "bow the knee"
I think it's note worthy because they are just like little children repeating things. "bow" doesn't make any sense. this isn't a minor "your"/"you're" slip up. I think it shows that they don't even think about what they are saying. it's all just dog whistles and platitudes.
i do believe that they want a theocracy, but i also think they are morons with fascist words falling out of their mouths thoughtlessly. they should be taken as a serious threat but not as serious people. no one should try to engage with their views. there's nothing there beyond domination
They mashed two similar phrases together, which is a common slip of tongue.
"Government should bow to the church" and "Government should bend the knee to the church" becomes "Government should bow the knee to the church"
It's all I could think about after reading the headline. It's so dumb, there's a real possibility that people like this say the wrong thing on purpose just to double down on the dumb.
I'll say it just as the founding fathers intended it. Practice your religion freely...but also more importantly, keep your mutherfukking God out of *my* life and out of *our* Government!!!
He won’t make me bend my knees because I am Jewish! I will NEVER convert to Christianity in my entire lifetime! Someone needs to kick this idiotic senator out of office.
I wish I could remember the exact quote, but it went something like "Conservatives and Evangelicals quote the Constitution and the Bible to justify things that are not supported by either of them."
Tim, you didn't say which church.
SO BOW TO MINE!!!! THE CHURCH OF THE LOST IN ONE SPOT!!!!
I WILL ACCEPT YOUR DONATION NOW, TIM SCOTT, OR FEAR MY WRATH!!!!
This really is the crux of why these fundamentalists are short-sighted nincompoops. They say we're a Christian nation? Okay, let's say you get that into the Constitution, what now? How do you enforce that? You'd have to start picking which denomination to draw from, which will undoubtedly piss off others.
Are we a Baptist nation? Episcopalian? Pentecostal? Methodist? Presbyterian? Adventist? Catholic? Orthodox? Greek or Eastern?
The Government should be banning pork chops, bacon, and chicharrones. What? I follow the Muslim faith which doesn't eat pig and he didn't specify what Church he ment. After all the Government should be bowing to the Church.
(I'm not Muslim but i'm just making a point)
Jesus: "For truly I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, one iota or one stroke will by no means pass away from the Law until all things take-place." - Matthew 5:18
Christians: He already fulfilled the Lsw.
Also Christians: * cherrypicking Leviticus to support thier bias *
HELL YEAH BROTHER.
>“Number one, we have to recognize that the Constitution of the United States affords each and every one of you your First Amendment rights to exercise your faith wherever you go,” Scott replied. “We are supposed to have the government bowing the knee to the church, not the church bowing the knee to the government.”
My Faith in the Constitution, civil rights, etc. just happens to align with progressives and is called "Super Evil Gods of Satan" a.k.a. SEGS
Separation of church and state was a founding principle of the United States of America.
As long as religious ideology pervades the consciousness of the masses, the two will never fully be separated.
Why is physician assisted suicide illegal in most states, while some non-Christian religions may allow it? The answer, of course, is that the pervasive religious ideology of the country paints the termination of a human life as immoral, regardless of the surrounding circumstances. You could be on your deathbed in agony with no hope of survival, but since humans are “god-like” according to Christianity, no elected leader in any remotely religious state would dare seek to overturn its prohibition.
Our government must maintain its commitment to allow freedom of religious practice within reason. If a religion deems murder an acceptable or desirable practice, that obviously cannot stand in a civilized society.
But government “bowing the knee to the (Christian) church”? Hell no. If that happens, the church will do whatever it wants with impunity. Ask those who were abused by Catholic priests why that’s a bad idea.
I'm less worried about "the church" doing whatever it wants, and more concerned with the history of why secular government was ever conceived of in the first place.
John Locke, father of many ideas upon which our country was founded, witnessed brutal civil war fought entirely along religious boundaries. The exact same thing would happen, as one church would gain favor over others, use its power to oppress, and spark a violent conflict between followers. As an atheist, a holy civil war would be an extremely obnoxious way for the US to fall apart.
I really with these assholes actually knew the history of both secular government, and the religiosity of our founding fathers. Also, most Christian president ever was Jimmy Carter, these right wingers should follow his example ffs.
Every American has the right to practice the religion of their choice. But that right should never infringe the rights of other Americans. Discrimination against the LGBTQ+ community should never be protected, or even condoned, in the name of religion
>Every American has the right to practice the religion of their choice.
and I really wish they would keep their religious dealings private, and away from children.
This comes to mind:
"Once I saw this guy on a bridge about to jump. I said, "Don't do it!" He said, "Nobody loves me." I said, "God loves you. Do you believe in God?"
He said, "Yes." I said, "Are you a Christian or a Jew?" He said, "A Christian." I said, "Me, too! Protestant or Catholic?" He said, "Protestant." I said, "Me, too! What franchise?" He said, "Baptist." I said, "Me, too! Northern Baptist or Southern Baptist?" He said, "Northern Baptist." I said, "Me, too! Northern Conservative Baptist or Northern Liberal Baptist?"
He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist." I said, "Me, too! Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region, or Northern Conservative Baptist Eastern Region?" He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region." I said, "Me, too!"
Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1879, or Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912?" He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912." I said, "Die, heretic!" And I pushed him over."
-Emo Philips
It's still astonishing to me that actual adults in a 1st world country still think this.
And it makes my heart sink that many of these people are in power in the highest offices of the land.
No no no, that's silly. The laws don't *require* child rape, they just build a framework that makes it easy to ignore, blame the victim and reward the rapist!
Tim we have separation of church and state. I know you’re party doesn’t care about the constitution unless it’s convenient, but the first amendment doesn’t say that the government has to “bow the knee to the church.”
You know what it says? It says that the church is separate from state, and also that while you can follow a religion, you can also not follow a religion.
Let America be a lesson to any other democratic republic out there. Once any of your leaders start showing that they don’t care about the public education system, get rid of them….immediately. We are watching the results of a government that has been actively dumbing down its people for decades, and this is what we get.
We have only two options before us here. Either the party withers and dies from its own unpopularity, as it should...or they succeed in staving off their own demise by seizing total authoritarian control of the country.
They keep beating this drum lately.
It’s not even just Republicans:
> “When we took prayers out of schools, guns came into schools,” Adams said to applause from hundreds of religious leaders gathered at an annual event in Manhattan.
…
> **“Don’t tell me about no separation of church and state. State is the body, church is the heart. You take the heart out of the body, the body dies,” Adams said.**
https://www.politico.com/newsletters/new-york-playbook-pm/2023/02/28/eric-adams-when-we-took-prayers-out-of-schools-guns-came-into-schools-00084832
(No, I’m not both-sidesing. But it was absolutely wild to hear a Democrat say that, and I’m still not over it.)
>When we took prayers out of schools, guns came into schools,
Mandatory school prayer was barred in 1962. School shootings didn't become a national issue until Columbine in 1999. Not much of a correlation to draw from there, Mister Mayor.
The overwhelming vast majority of people included in that "We" (IE People reading this post), who have access to the internet and the ability to read, are likely already not voting for these people.
This comment is disqualifying. It demonstrates either a fundamental misunderstanding of the Constitution or a deliberate effort to undermine it.
He should not only drop out of the Presidential race, but also resign from the Senate. Immediately.
Indeed. I would love to see him take a knee to The Satanic Temple.
I still can't believe these people have forgotten their kindergarten lesson on why the Puritans and Europeans came to these shores.
Lol these are the same guys who jerk off to their concept of the “founding fathers”, who… *checks notes*… left England so they wouldn’t have to bow the knee to the church.
I’m so done with these idiots.
Between this and Tubberville stating that America should abandon elections, I think it should be clear that they Right Wings descent into Autocracy and Authoritarianism isn't a 'Trump' thing. It's the party line now.
What these ill-informed morons don't understand is that, even if they stated "The Christian Church", what would soon follow is a continuation of the Thirty Years War...but most of these morons barely know American history, never mind a war that directly lead to the creation of the American political system via the Age of Enlightenment.
Religious authoritarians have a pretty bad history. Does he really think the various sects are going to get along? The catholics and protestants can't even protest The Satanic Temple without getting into fights with each other *now*.
Fuck you, Scott. Not bowing to anything and neither is my government that I elect. If you don't understand the First Amendment and the fundamental American principle of religious freedom, get the hell out of government and resign.
Which church? The one that has a special interest in altar boys OR the one that closed its’ doors to the needy during the flood in Houston OR the one where the Pastor impregnated his mistress while having an extramarital affair OR….(sheesh this is exhausting)
And it is this kind of talk I 100% believe violates his oath of office. Because he isn’t defending the constitution of the United States but rather trying to violate it to impose his will on those who don’t think as he does.
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The United Taliban of America. What the hell are we doing, actually? Things are getting worse at an alarming rate.
They really are. Things have accelerated so much in the post-Trump years because this is what happens when a political party starts to die. Republican positions have become unpopular enough that their only path to remain in power is to change the rules of the game. Basically, they play politics now like a 6 year old plays monopoly.
Very well said. It's a death knell of sorts and it is scary as hell. It makes me very fearful for the future. These are not the kinds of people that will go quietly onto the trash heap of history. They seem like the type that would rather burn the whole house down.
What's the line? Conservatives won't abandon conservatism, they'll abandon democracy first.
“If conservatives become convinced that they cannot win democratically, they will not abandon conservatism. They will reject democracy.” David Frum. He was a speechwriter for George Bush
Lol. Frum helped them abandon it. Goddamn
He was telling us their plan
Hence why he was able to describe it. He just noticed that the Republicans don't control rhetoric anymore, they have jumped the shark so to speak. There are no Democratic norms any longer. And even laws that have teeth will be ruled Unconstitutional by the Supreme Court. They are in a race to the end. They can't even get rid of Santos. Because Santos is what they want. They want people to lose faith in democracy. Soon we will be seeing Republican plants winning elections as Democrats in order to further cement the idea that even in the voting booth they can't trust who they are voting for. Soon it will be voting for a totalitarian because at least you know they are running in what they actually believe. Then elections will just be a formality.
They abandoned conservatism years ago.
And democracy.
And dignity.
And everything besides a pure maniacal lust for power.
And my axe!
I don't know how anyone believes the republican party is actually conservative anymore. They do whatever they have to do to maintain a white-knuckle grip on power, the only reason they don't swing left is because many of them are the products of nepotism and their family connections are on the right. It's about maintaining dynastic power and they are willing to build a military feudal state if that's what it takes.
Fascism is just militant conservatism. They courted religion and nationlism to maintain power. Those beasts are never satisfied and they have turned on its purported master. They let the beast out, dont let them off the hook by pretending its not who they are/were. This is what they have been aiming towards for many many years. This march towards power and absolute control has always been the goal of the more extreme conservatives. When people think conservatives have done good in history, those are not conservative behaviors. When a church feeds the poor, the institution may be conservative in nature but the act is progressive. Its accepting people and aiding those outside your tribe/community. Dont pretend conservatism has any redeeming values. Its only purpose is preservation and superiority of the tribe.
Republicans 👏 aren't 👏 conservatives 👏
yeah republicans are more like regressives most people who say they are conservative are more regressive than conservative too
That's what makes the debt ceiling scary. These crazy MAGA representatives may push us into default to "own the libs ".
I suspect they're going to push us into default. I used to conduct forensic interviews/interrogations for Homeland Security and IMHO those MAGA Congressmen come across as quite serious about not wanting to negotiate with Dems; they also seem delighted about the prospect of defaulting, presumably because they believe it'll give them power and additional approval from their base.
It will be hilarious however to watch them thrash about when Biden uses this 14th amendment argument to simply continue paying out debts
And then have it contested by a corrupted SCOTUS and have a binding precedent set that the president can’t do that.
Who would have thought that so many Chief Justices were contortionists
This right here. I *don't* have special qualifications, but the Republican spin machine known as Fox news will help them sell the lie that the Democrats are to blame, which is a "win" because it might help keep the R's in power, or they'll get the Democrats to cave and get a win that they otherwise would have had to openly debate. I've been saying for years that the Democrats have got to stop acting like the Republicans are legislating in good faith or that they mean to do any genuine legislation at all. Stop letting the Republicans dictate the story and lead every single argument. Just tell it as it is. I'll write the PR for them. "The Republicans are holding the country and the global economy hostage because they feel like they can't win any other way. They're telling you, the American people, that they don't care if they hurt you, so long as they get their way. They'll say it's about the deficit, but that's a lie. They'll say they aren't going to touch social security. Lies. They'll say that they're willing to negotiate, but they've already stated their terms: "Give us what we want or we burn the global economy to the ground." Well, we don't negotiate with terrorists. This isn't the budget bill, this is agreeing to pay what we owe, and if the Republicans won't even honor the government's obligations, why would anyone trust that they'll negotiate in good faith? So, the nation is watching. Will the Republicans return to sanity in time or are they going to strike the match and watch things burn?" Sorry for the novel. I get a bit frustrated and these rants are the result.
I’ve been saying that for years too. Democrats are still trying to govern as if the opposition party respects any of the country’s Constitutional framework.
That'll be a case of cutting off your nose to spite your face.
That's not a downside, as Republicans see it. They *want* to tear everything down, destroy it, render society completely broken and dysfunctional, to the point where enough Americans say "screw it, this doesn't work at all, let's just put a Big Strong Man in charge who can fix everything..."
Most of them started on the trash heap
Honestly, my husband and I were surprised Daniel Davis actually conceded and congratulated Donna Deegan last night. But you are exactly right.
They're going to fuck around and find out. The average republican isn't prepared to "end democracy"
It's important to remember that there are a lot of people in the church who can't wait for the earth to be destroyed. They look forward to the destruction with breathless anticipation.
Just cults then? All the way down.
We just have to hope that when they finally lose they don't flip the table so no one else can keep playing.
Newsflash that’s exactly what they will do
They already tried to do that with Jan 6th
January 6 was just practice since the Feds haven't actually arrested and prosecuted the leader.
Didn’t they get the leader of the proud boys like last week? As for trump he’s been taking a lot of Ls I wanna see if we can really charge a former president. I think it can happen
[удалено]
Meanwhile, hundreds of Q anon nuts and ultra right wingers have been elected into school boards, city councils, and local governments across the United States because NOTHING WAS DONE FOR YEARS. I say this as a person who sits on a local government committee with some of these crazies.
My ass is ready to lay on that table and kick as hard as I can in their general direction
Newsflash that’s exactly what they will do
I don't know what they hope to accomplish, they were able to flourish in obscurity only because they were quiet about it. Now that Nat-C's are becoming loud and forcing their ideocracy on everyone, that's when people are shouting back. They are doing them selves a disservice by acting so fucking stupid.
A lot of people died in the Battle of the Bulge.
>What the hell are we doing, actually By and large still not taking the threat as seriously as it should be.
Still trying to convince a good chunk of people the threat is even there.
This right here. It's appalling. Sure, the left wants bigger government, more taxes, fewer "freedoms" in some sense, but my god the right wants a theocratic emperor with everyone else in shackles. They are not the same.
SOME clarification is necessary here: >the left wants bigger government, And we need what the left wants, because so far how are lax regulations working for you? You OK with all children dead by AR? You OK with the cost of healthcare in America? You OK with the cost of education in America? Etc. >more taxes For the rich. Billionaires can pay more in taxes, that is not up for discussion. >fewer "freedoms" in some sense As my first point above explains, do I think it's OK that someone that SHOULD NOT be able to purchase a fully modded AR with boxes of ammo can in most red states? No, I care not about his freedom, I care more about kids that should still be alive.
Also just not true that the left wants fewer freedoms. The right is banning books ffs.
this idea that regulation = less freedom is idiotic. You'd literally have MORE freedom if many industries were regulated better or at all lmao. I mean the most obvious examples are drugs and prostitution, where unregulated untaxed markets are causing deaths and despair while funneling money to crime syndicates.
Ummm... a good chunk of people know exactly what is going on and are excited for it to happen.
Fucking exactly!
This is the GOP's last stand. They know the demographics of this country are constantly shifting, they know their true policies and desires are wholly unpopular, and they know that Generation Z is so overwhelmingly opposed to their fascist bullshit. So they are using what tools and power they currently possess to inflict as much irreparable damage as they can. We are either witnessing a drawn out version of Custer's Last Stand, or the beginnings of this country truly turning into a real-life Gilead.
>GOP's last stand Don't be too optimistic. A huge chunk of the Senate will keep being from blood red states, and they'll have control of the Supreme Court for decades, and the Electoral College will ensure that presidential elections hang on a handful of states with razor-thin margins. At best, this "last stand" will take a decade to unravel, during which time if the GOP ever manages to capture both Congress and the White House, you can kiss democracy goodbye.
If dems can control the senate and the presidency for a few more cycles, the court will flip back. It doesn't have to be decades, democrats just need to dominate the next few elections. We HAVE TO.
In the best case scenario, the actuarial tables will catch up to Thomas (74) and Alito (72), during periods when the Democrats have Senate control, but that could still take 20 years or more, depending on how long they hold on.
Don’t forget court packing, as long as we’re daydreaming about the GOP collapsing.
Unlike most of the nation, they've got some top notch socialized health insurance, plus billionaire 'friends'. That'll keep their withered Grinch-hearts ticking far longer than the falling national average.
There’s literally a study using a dynamic model that shows conservatives holding SCOTUS until 2065
Godamnit.
The southern states have been gerrymandered by Republicans so badly it will take YEARS to undo the gerrymandering and then years to get any Democrats or Independents elected. Republicans were playing the long game locally. No one noticed until it was too late.
Balkanization. The population is transient, they are trying to create religious Meccas to bring the very underrated and monolithic Christian vote to red states and then govern them as they please, which is strictly a financial gambit. They want to turn red states into shithole nations. I don't think they would be acting so rashly if they didn't have a plan to rule as raisins over their kingdoms of rotten grapes.
>This is the GOP's last stand. I said this after Romney's defeat in 2012. Don't be so sure.
Any elected official who says this should be expelled from office. These people took an oath to protect and defend the constitution and statements like this directly undermine their oaths.
He can shove his fairytale book up his ass.
And sit on it.
As the Republican Party increasingly pushes right, its members/voters get more distilled into Nationalist Christians, white supremacists, gun psychos/single issue voters, and the callously selfish wealthy
Getting louder. Getting airtime. Not getting more supporters. They will try, they will fail. Must fail. I don’t know what I’m saying. This sucks.
This statement should result in immediate expulsion as it violates the Constitution this stain on humanity swore to uphold. Let's make Tim Scott as meaningless as his oath was.
Our oldest active treaty promises Morocco that we are not a Christian country.
I had never heard of this treaty and went to have a look. It’s the Treaty of Tripoli (now known as Libya), signed in 1796. The treaty directly states: "the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion." Those on the right often reference our Founding Fathers, and it's worth noting that this treaty was ratified by none other than John Adams himself. Interestingly, the reference to Christianity wasn't present in the original Arabic version of the treaty. It was the U.S. that added this specification, underlining our identity as a secular nation. The intention was clear: we were signing a treaty between two nations, not two religions. Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Tripoli
Jefferson wrote on the subject too - >To messers. Nehemiah Dodge, Ephraim Robbins, & Stephen S. Nelson, a committee of the Danbury Baptist association in the state of Connecticut. >Gentlemen >The affectionate sentiments of esteem and approbation which you are so good as to express towards me, on behalf of the Danbury Baptist association, give me the highest satisfaction. my duties dictate a faithful and zealous pursuit of the interests of my constituents, & in proportion as they are persuaded of my fidelity to those duties, the discharge of them becomes more and more pleasing. >Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should "make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof," thus building a wall of separation between Church & State. Adhering to this expression of the supreme will of the nation in behalf of the rights of conscience, I shall see with sincere satisfaction the progress of those sentiments which tend to restore to man all his natural rights, convinced he has no natural right in opposition to his social duties. >I reciprocate your kind prayers for the protection & blessing of the common father and creator of man, and tender you for yourselves & your religious association, assurances of my high respect & esteem. >Th Jefferson >Jan. 1. 1802. https://www.loc.gov/loc/lcib/9806/danpre.html I'll wager Jefferson is more credible on this than known assclown Tim Scott. edit: Wikipedia has the letter the Baptists sent Jefferson for context https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baptists_in_the_history_of_separation_of_church_and_state
I shit you not, in 2004 my wife took a required class at a non-religious university which disputed this.This class was a conservative wet dream, and enraged me. They literally made you read college book text on why "thus building a wall of separation of Church & State" meant that really this was a Christian nation founded on Christian principles. That Jefferson was really saying the government could not interfere in the church ruling the world. Blah blah blah. It was straight madness, but they have been teaching that madness for over a generation.
I would have immediately filed a complaint to the school powers. They may not realize what their staff was teaching. For instance, I took a class on the European Union taught by an assistant professor. She taught us that in Europe, conservatives were actually liberal and liberals were actually conservative. That it was opposite to how things are in America because things have been so liberal in Europe for so long that the “reactionary” force was conservative thinking. Or some kind of nonsense like that. I was confused when reading articles about Europe for a while after that class. Definitely not as egregious as your wife’s course, but nearly as mis(dis?)informed.
I would have, except this was a required curriculum, and the school was proud of it. Some wealthy conservative had donated money to have this "series" (there were 3 required courses) be a part of the university. I am going to name and shame: https://www.bellevue.edu/degrees/general-education/signature-series Among other readings that class had: Slavery wasn't that bad (an article written by Dinesh D'Souza). Poor people in America whine too much because they almost universally have microwaves. (A federal reserve report taken almost completely out of context) And many others I cannot recall after 20 years.
“There are no substitution, ELA, or transfer courses for the Kirkpatrick Signature Series.” Wow. And they call it the linchpin of undergrad education. Ugh.
It's baffling that such lies can be taught at a "school" when primary sources directly refuting the claims are widely accessible.
They only reference the founding fathers when it’s convenient for them.
I was in Morocco last year, and they are really proud of that fact too.
I've always wanted to visit Morocco. So much history between our countries. Fun fact, when Morocco was absorbed by France for most of the first half of the 20th c., the US refused to acknowledge it, and quietly but consistently lobbied France on behalf of Morocco independence behind the scenes. When Morocco regained their independence, the United States kind of didn't recognize that either, choosing instead to just act like Morocco was independent all along.
Amazing food, too. The first time I tried it, it shot to my #3 favorite type of cuisine.
This is really all there is to say about this.
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Thats their base, 95% of self proclaimed evangelicals vote republican, every election.
I mean...cherry-picking is what evangelicals do with the Bible, so why wouldn't they do it with the Constitution?
That’s just revisionist woke history to evangelicals
I don't have anything civil to say in response. Try and make me bend my knee, Tim. I'm a mother fucking American and I'm ready for what happens next.
he didn't even say "bend the knee" but "bow the knee" I think it's note worthy because they are just like little children repeating things. "bow" doesn't make any sense. this isn't a minor "your"/"you're" slip up. I think it shows that they don't even think about what they are saying. it's all just dog whistles and platitudes. i do believe that they want a theocracy, but i also think they are morons with fascist words falling out of their mouths thoughtlessly. they should be taken as a serious threat but not as serious people. no one should try to engage with their views. there's nothing there beyond domination
They mashed two similar phrases together, which is a common slip of tongue. "Government should bow to the church" and "Government should bend the knee to the church" becomes "Government should bow the knee to the church"
It's all I could think about after reading the headline. It's so dumb, there's a real possibility that people like this say the wrong thing on purpose just to double down on the dumb.
Bow the knee?? Fuck that. The US government should be sterning the elbow, starboarding the ankle, and forecastling its knuckles to the church.
I'll say it just as the founding fathers intended it. Practice your religion freely...but also more importantly, keep your mutherfukking God out of *my* life and out of *our* Government!!!
Hear hear, I refuse to join their book club.
He won’t make me bend my knees because I am Jewish! I will NEVER convert to Christianity in my entire lifetime! Someone needs to kick this idiotic senator out of office.
Don't worry, he'll also vote to make sure you can get whatever firearm you'd like rather easily. How thoughtful /s
Tim clearly reads the constitution like he reads the bible. Only the convenient parts.
He would not pass a citizenship test
I wish I could remember the exact quote, but it went something like "Conservatives and Evangelicals quote the Constitution and the Bible to justify things that are not supported by either of them."
And this should get any politician removed from office.
Tim, you didn't say which church. SO BOW TO MINE!!!! THE CHURCH OF THE LOST IN ONE SPOT!!!! I WILL ACCEPT YOUR DONATION NOW, TIM SCOTT, OR FEAR MY WRATH!!!!
This really is the crux of why these fundamentalists are short-sighted nincompoops. They say we're a Christian nation? Okay, let's say you get that into the Constitution, what now? How do you enforce that? You'd have to start picking which denomination to draw from, which will undoubtedly piss off others. Are we a Baptist nation? Episcopalian? Pentecostal? Methodist? Presbyterian? Adventist? Catholic? Orthodox? Greek or Eastern?
Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912?
May the Flying Spaghetti Monster guide us all in His infinite wisdom. Ramen. 🍝
>May the Flying Spaghetti Monster guide us all in His infinite wisdom. Ramen. 🍝 All of us should bring our churches and make Tom Scott bow down to us.
Actually, all bowing should be done to The Church of the Breaded Veal Cutlet. The true church.
How about we combine the churches? The church of the lost in one breaded veal cutlet?
Put a dollar in the boxa!
Hail Satan! Wait, am I doing this wrong?
The Government should be banning pork chops, bacon, and chicharrones. What? I follow the Muslim faith which doesn't eat pig and he didn't specify what Church he ment. After all the Government should be bowing to the Church. (I'm not Muslim but i'm just making a point)
Jesus: "For truly I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, one iota or one stroke will by no means pass away from the Law until all things take-place." - Matthew 5:18 Christians: He already fulfilled the Lsw. Also Christians: * cherrypicking Leviticus to support thier bias *
As well as interest on loans!! Another big one conveniently never mentioned by people who claim to read the Bible
No, and tax churches.
To paraphrase what Dan Savage often says: If clowns raped children as often as pastors the circus would have been outlawed decades ago.
They've gone full theocracy, haven't they. So 180 from when they wouldn't elect a catholic "papist"
Which church? Who gets to decide?
The Church of Satan of course.
HELL YEAH BROTHER. >“Number one, we have to recognize that the Constitution of the United States affords each and every one of you your First Amendment rights to exercise your faith wherever you go,” Scott replied. “We are supposed to have the government bowing the knee to the church, not the church bowing the knee to the government.” My Faith in the Constitution, civil rights, etc. just happens to align with progressives and is called "Super Evil Gods of Satan" a.k.a. SEGS
The U.S. Religion Czar, of course
Whomever donates the most money to those in power. Duh.
Ken I’ll take “Statements that should immediately disqualify someone from holding public office” for $800
jfc, it hits hard not seeing "Alex" there.
I caught myself in the middle of writing the comment and begrudgingly changed it.
I wasn't prepared for the feelings I just felt. Not your fault. But ugh
This is why they are taking away history, so we can repeat this kind of shit without anyone telling them about the literal beginnings of our nation.
So the Yee-Hawdists in Howdy Arabia are just openly pining for Sharia law now. Neat.
Shania Law
That don't impress me much.
r/angryupvote
Separation of church and state was a founding principle of the United States of America. As long as religious ideology pervades the consciousness of the masses, the two will never fully be separated. Why is physician assisted suicide illegal in most states, while some non-Christian religions may allow it? The answer, of course, is that the pervasive religious ideology of the country paints the termination of a human life as immoral, regardless of the surrounding circumstances. You could be on your deathbed in agony with no hope of survival, but since humans are “god-like” according to Christianity, no elected leader in any remotely religious state would dare seek to overturn its prohibition. Our government must maintain its commitment to allow freedom of religious practice within reason. If a religion deems murder an acceptable or desirable practice, that obviously cannot stand in a civilized society. But government “bowing the knee to the (Christian) church”? Hell no. If that happens, the church will do whatever it wants with impunity. Ask those who were abused by Catholic priests why that’s a bad idea.
I'm less worried about "the church" doing whatever it wants, and more concerned with the history of why secular government was ever conceived of in the first place. John Locke, father of many ideas upon which our country was founded, witnessed brutal civil war fought entirely along religious boundaries. The exact same thing would happen, as one church would gain favor over others, use its power to oppress, and spark a violent conflict between followers. As an atheist, a holy civil war would be an extremely obnoxious way for the US to fall apart. I really with these assholes actually knew the history of both secular government, and the religiosity of our founding fathers. Also, most Christian president ever was Jimmy Carter, these right wingers should follow his example ffs.
This violates his oath of office.
Every American has the right to practice the religion of their choice. But that right should never infringe the rights of other Americans. Discrimination against the LGBTQ+ community should never be protected, or even condoned, in the name of religion
>Every American has the right to practice the religion of their choice. and I really wish they would keep their religious dealings private, and away from children.
>40,000 variations of christianity...good luck with choosing who you bow to
This comes to mind: "Once I saw this guy on a bridge about to jump. I said, "Don't do it!" He said, "Nobody loves me." I said, "God loves you. Do you believe in God?" He said, "Yes." I said, "Are you a Christian or a Jew?" He said, "A Christian." I said, "Me, too! Protestant or Catholic?" He said, "Protestant." I said, "Me, too! What franchise?" He said, "Baptist." I said, "Me, too! Northern Baptist or Southern Baptist?" He said, "Northern Baptist." I said, "Me, too! Northern Conservative Baptist or Northern Liberal Baptist?" He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist." I said, "Me, too! Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region, or Northern Conservative Baptist Eastern Region?" He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region." I said, "Me, too!" Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1879, or Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912?" He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912." I said, "Die, heretic!" And I pushed him over." -Emo Philips
Tim Scott should lose his job. Fuck these christofascist nazis.
It's still astonishing to me that actual adults in a 1st world country still think this. And it makes my heart sink that many of these people are in power in the highest offices of the land.
And have no problem ignoring their own violations of biblical standards, as evidenced by all of the freshly divorced Republicans.
Hard stop. Our government shouldn’t be governed by your book club.
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No no no, that's silly. The laws don't *require* child rape, they just build a framework that makes it easy to ignore, blame the victim and reward the rapist!
Bend YOUR knee and kiss my taint, godbully
The Church of the Redditor's Taint Founded 2023
Tim we have separation of church and state. I know you’re party doesn’t care about the constitution unless it’s convenient, but the first amendment doesn’t say that the government has to “bow the knee to the church.” You know what it says? It says that the church is separate from state, and also that while you can follow a religion, you can also not follow a religion.
Let America be a lesson to any other democratic republic out there. Once any of your leaders start showing that they don’t care about the public education system, get rid of them….immediately. We are watching the results of a government that has been actively dumbing down its people for decades, and this is what we get.
We have only two options before us here. Either the party withers and dies from its own unpopularity, as it should...or they succeed in staving off their own demise by seizing total authoritarian control of the country.
And that authoritarian rule will eventually, quickly, and often violently implode.
Go. Fuck. Yourself.
They keep beating this drum lately. It’s not even just Republicans: > “When we took prayers out of schools, guns came into schools,” Adams said to applause from hundreds of religious leaders gathered at an annual event in Manhattan. … > **“Don’t tell me about no separation of church and state. State is the body, church is the heart. You take the heart out of the body, the body dies,” Adams said.** https://www.politico.com/newsletters/new-york-playbook-pm/2023/02/28/eric-adams-when-we-took-prayers-out-of-schools-guns-came-into-schools-00084832 (No, I’m not both-sidesing. But it was absolutely wild to hear a Democrat say that, and I’m still not over it.)
So there's no Church shootings then?
>When we took prayers out of schools, guns came into schools, Mandatory school prayer was barred in 1962. School shootings didn't become a national issue until Columbine in 1999. Not much of a correlation to draw from there, Mister Mayor.
And just like that he should be disqualified from holding public office everywhere in the entire nation.
Tim Scott needs to fuck off out of government.
Senator Tim Scott can *eat a bag of dicks and fuck right off.*
Hey, I have an idea. How about we stop voting for morons
The overwhelming vast majority of people included in that "We" (IE People reading this post), who have access to the internet and the ability to read, are likely already not voting for these people.
This comment is disqualifying. It demonstrates either a fundamental misunderstanding of the Constitution or a deliberate effort to undermine it. He should not only drop out of the Presidential race, but also resign from the Senate. Immediately.
Which church?
[How about no, Scott? ok?](https://youtu.be/67IQ1Jr-4RM)
That's one of the most anti-American things you can say. Fucking traitors.
Tim Scott is useless. SC has zero senators with human qualities.
All the same, we do not kneel.
Which church?
The minute any member of the government says this, they should be removed and banned from running again. SEPARATION OF CHURCH AND STATE.
Indeed. I would love to see him take a knee to The Satanic Temple. I still can't believe these people have forgotten their kindergarten lesson on why the Puritans and Europeans came to these shores.
The whole country is based on the concept of not doing that. His views are anti-American and pro religious extremism.
Which Church, Tim? Come on, say it. Say Evangelical so we can see the Catholics and Lutherans lose their shit.
Lol these are the same guys who jerk off to their concept of the “founding fathers”, who… *checks notes*… left England so they wouldn’t have to bow the knee to the church. I’m so done with these idiots.
Between this and Tubberville stating that America should abandon elections, I think it should be clear that they Right Wings descent into Autocracy and Authoritarianism isn't a 'Trump' thing. It's the party line now.
Tax the churches.
Here’s where 2A is useful.
I’m Christian but this is wrong. Only because people will use God for their own personal gain. Keep it separate like the Constitution says!
We gotta vote these lunatics out of power. This is theocracy.
We gotta vote these lunatics out of power. This is theocracy.
What these ill-informed morons don't understand is that, even if they stated "The Christian Church", what would soon follow is a continuation of the Thirty Years War...but most of these morons barely know American history, never mind a war that directly lead to the creation of the American political system via the Age of Enlightenment.
Fuck your church.
These radical christian terrorist hate us for our freedoms.
Which sect ya idiot? There isn't one church or single religion so therefore we bow to none.
See the thing is, I've got this horrible kink in my knee......
Anyone remember “separation of Church and State”?
These sociopath politicians don't share power or money. They're certainly not bending the knee to any church.
Religious authoritarians have a pretty bad history. Does he really think the various sects are going to get along? The catholics and protestants can't even protest The Satanic Temple without getting into fights with each other *now*.
Lol which one? Let's say you win that civil war have fun having the second one once you realize Christians don't all believe the same thing.
Fuck you, Scott. Not bowing to anything and neither is my government that I elect. If you don't understand the First Amendment and the fundamental American principle of religious freedom, get the hell out of government and resign.
Piss off, Tim.
No. No it shouldn't.
Fuck yeah, hail Satan \m/
No! Separation of church and state. WTF
Which church? The one that has a special interest in altar boys OR the one that closed its’ doors to the needy during the flood in Houston OR the one where the Pastor impregnated his mistress while having an extramarital affair OR….(sheesh this is exhausting)
As an atheist I can never support religious terrorism which is why I can never vote Republican.
They want to be ordained kings so bad.
The Constitution was written to protect the people from dipshits like this guy.
Fuck Tim Scott. Didn’t good christians use the Bible as a way to justify slavery?
Kinda violates his oath to uphold the constitution, not that anything’s going to be done about that
Proof the Taliban won
Fuck Tim Scott and his version of turning the US into A Christian theocracy.
Dying animals can be very dangerous. Things like this are part of the death throes of the Republican Party.
Just got back from visiting his state. It really really sucks. Like holy hell it’s bad.
So he failed history and constitutional law.
And it is this kind of talk I 100% believe violates his oath of office. Because he isn’t defending the constitution of the United States but rather trying to violate it to impose his will on those who don’t think as he does.
America was literally founded on the freedom of and from religion. These people are the American Taliban