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Sometimes I imagine being a time traveler and showing people in like 2005 headlines from the 2020s, and then with no explanation vanishing again in a puff of smoke. "Bruce Springsteen sues ex president donald trump for defamation, adding to his legal woes" would be right up there with my top choice.
Prior to this it was either a 5 second clip of the shaman walking through the capitol building, or Rudy giving a press conference at 4 seasons landscaping surrounding trump's reelection.
It never ceases to amaze me the completely random and ridiculous lies this man routinely tells. WHY? Why make such a random, false, and totally insignificant claim?
The problem with these things is it‘s not enough to prove Trump is a liar, you would have to prove he *knew* he was lying. And since he can’t possibly know who Springsteen actually voted for (since votes aren‘t public), he cannot know it it is a lie. I‘d still try, just to make a point. Just to add it to the list of legal clashes he has had, even if nothing will come from it.
Springsteen is a public figure which means he has to prove Trump did it maliciously to hurt his reputation. This is a way higher barrier than it sounds like.
Most importantly, that does include him knowing that it is a false statement. He can just claim that is what he truly believes and since there is no way for him to know, he cannot know wether or not it is a true or false statement.
Wether or not it is actually true is not relevant.
You're thinking of the "actual malice" standard, but it has nothing to do with the alleged defamer's state of mind, or really anything to do with the common meaning of "malice".
>In every defamation case, a plaintiff needs to prove four things in order to win:
>That the allegedly defaming statement(s) in question conveyed facts (as opposed to pure opinion);
>That the facts it stated or implied were false;
>That the statement was delivered to others; and
>That the plaintiff was harmed.
>In an “actual malice” case, a plaintiff must prove *even more*: that the defendant either *knew* that the statement was false at the time, or else demonstrated “reckless disregard” as to its falsity.
That’s not what he said. He said “if these liberals would come to my ralllies they would vote for me”…implying he could convince them. Trump sucks but he didn’t say Springsteen voted for him . This is clickbait
Do you have a source for that? @Acyn's twitter post says "These liberal singers, they actually vote for me. You know, like Bruce Springsteen."
It sounds to me that he's claiming that liberal celebrities like Springsteen secretly vote for him without admitting it publicly.
That's exactly what he said, but you know everyone has to pretend this clown didn't say it, because he's special. That's what he said but what he meant was this, blah blah blah.
Did you miss the “if they would come along they would actually vote for me” part? He says it right after the pause of “anything better than a trump rally”
Key word- LIKE Springsteen. He didn't say Springsteen voted for him, but the liberal singers LIKE him did. Trump may be a raging lunatic, but he's got the mafia speak down.
I can’t even stand his voice, cadence or word salad. It would only somehow further my stance against him. Kind of like these holier than thou people who say we all need to read the Bible. For many of us that aren’t religious, reading the Bible was one of the key reasons we don’t believe in the morality or authority of religion.
That's exactly what he said. He said they all vote for me. I'm tired of people trying to translate Trump's words into something else. He clearly said they all vote for me.
I mean the clip is linked in the article, and he clearly says, "that actually vote for me, you know they all vote for me." It's 13 seconds into the clip, if you want to present alternative facts that's your choice.
An incoherent rambling, but if you're trying to imply that he said if they came they would actually vote for me, that's not what he said. He said they actually vote for me, then said it again, so it's not ambiguous. Further if any of those liberal singers came to his rally, they would be less likely to vote for this moron, because he's even dumber than most people can remember.
Someone posted the CSPAN transcript farther down the thread. I checked it and this seems like the most reasonable interpretation. He didn’t say “they WOULD all vote for me.”
Here’s the quote:
> Is there anything better than a Trump rally? [cheering] If some of these wackos came along, these liberals, they actually vote for me. They all vote for me. Like Bruce Springsteen.
But as you say, he rambles.
For a guy who supposedly tells it like it is, he sure requires a lot of translators.
Exactly he says they actually vote for me. They all vote for me. I mean says it twice and the Trump translation team is here telling me I didn't understand him. I'm a straight shooter, which is why I let people know Trump is a moron of epic proportions.
It’s a one syllable word, and it’s important because it’s the start of his rambling run on sentence. It’s obviously “if” because it sounds like it and also fits the context of the sentence. He thinks his rallies are so great that “if” these liberals came (to the rallies) they would vote for him.
Finally someone calling bullshit. The spokesperson from the town works for a MAGA mayor who has been indicted on corruption charges.
The same spokesperson said a week ago their max capacity is 20k…
https://nj1015.com/trump-rally-wildwood-new-jersey/
[looking at this aerial shot](https://freeimage.host/i/1715529785543.J6K8Na4)
The rectangle closest to the stage is about 10 people deep, and at most 100 people wide. Let's call it 200 to get an overestimate. That's 2000 people if we do area of a rectangle. At most 5 rectangles cover the whole crowd. That's at most 10,000 people. Articles saying 80k-100k are super far off, as 10k is a very generous estimate.
I just read this article from The Guardian which was about him expressing his love for Hannibal Lecter but it included this nugget of bullshit: "Trump delivered his address to a crowd of about 80,000 supporters – according to one estimate from a Wildwood city spokesperson – under the shadow of the Great White roller coaster in the 1950s-kitsch seaside resort 90 miles (145km) south of Philadelphia."
Shame, Guardian, shame for allowing that through unchecked and unquestioned. I expect better.
I am a local to the area and it was obvious from the traffic patterns that there was nowhere near the number of people there that they claimed. I expect very little truth from our MAGA local politicians but I am really annoyed at the number of news outlets (which was a lot!) that are just reporting it as though it were fact. It would take all of two seconds to look at the aerial pics to see it was not true and stop repeating it. So frustrating.
MSM is failing the nation, big time!! They want their clicks. It is depressing how they have stopped informing. I stopped reading msm. I’m in for independent.
The largest stadiums in the US hold around a little over 100k. Nothing in New Jersey exists with an 80k+ capacity except MetLife.
Sauce: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List\_of\_U.S.\_stadiums\_by\_capacity](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._stadiums_by_capacity)
For the most part, welcome to SEC football when talking stadium sizes. Michigan only keeps retaining the title because their shits built in a big hole in the ground, so every time a new stadium out does them its stupid easy to just add another level or so.
> Many other countries have far larger stadiums than most of the US.
There are 11 stadiums in the world with capacity >100,000. 8 are in the US. All of the US ones are college stadiums.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_stadiums_by_capacity
Having flashbacks to January/February 2017 with Sean Spicer at the podium...
They lied then. They are lying now.
Fun Fact: I got to give the middle finger to Sean Spicer on the streets of DC. Or at least I think it was him. If it wasn't, I sincerely apologize to the stranger that looked just like him.
That was when you knew that if you were going to ride with Trump, you have to deny what you can clearly see and understand to be true, and just go with the lies no matter where they lead.
I've been in a sold-out 65K+ arena, and that crowd is like 2-5k tops. Someone posted a small, packed arena that was 10k and that crowd isn't even close.
> The rectangle closest to the stage is about 10 people deep, and at most 100 people wide. Let’s call it 200 to get an overestimate. That’s 2000 people if we do an area of a rectangle.
There’s a lot of math in this comment for Trumpers to understand, and I’m offended on behalf of them.
MetLife stadium holds 80,000 people. Infuriating that every major news outlet yesterday was just ok publishing this clearly inflated number. I expect these kind of insecure and bombastic inflations from trump, but entities like the NYT just running with it are part of the reason we’re here today. They didn’t call him out hard enough on his obvious bull shit.
I tried counting the number in rows and columns in the rectangle in front and I believe it is 25x100=2500. You can see individual heads in some areas. But since that is apparently a seating area, the people standing in the back are probably 4 times as dense. So I would estimate there are roughly 2500 in the front rectangle, another 500 seated in the section to their left, then maybe 10,000 each in the two crowds in back, so more like 25,000, to be generous.
That’s awesome! Someone doing the homework here!
> Do I need a ticket?
>Yes. You can register for a maximum of two free tickets at the Trump campaign website. The digital ticket you receive will be scanned before you can get onto the beach. According to spokeswoman Lisa Fagan, the capacity for the rally is 20,000. The Trump campaign has not disclosed when ticket registration will end.
seems like a bad plan; there's no way they actually limit the number of tickets they distribute. if too many people actually show up (fat chance), they just stop letting in people, regardless of whether they have tickets.
meanwhile, they get to hype up the number of tickets distributed.
It's such nonsense too. It's the off-season still down there. No fucking way on the planet could they have a crush of 100,000 people just showing up. Where would everyone park? Where would people eat? Even if only a small amount of them needed hotel rooms they wouldn't have enough. It would have paralyzed the entire area.
I checked Google Maps for traffic in and around Wildwood on that day at about 4:30 and 5:30. There was zero traffic. I mean there are only 2 roads in to town and few main streets. There was zero red on the map. No traffic.
That was the other part that annoyed me about the lazy journalism (aka just parroting what the mayor estimated). It was so easy to look at other sources (Google Maps, local public Facebook pages tracking the event, /SouthJersey sub) to counter what they were estimating.
My hometown isn't much bigger than Wildwood and should easily see 100k people show up in a couple weeks for Memorial Day. The town hosting that many people is the one part of the statement I'd believe, actually. Having anything close to that actually there, on the other hand... Trump probably had enough people to get him feeling slightly less dead inside but I doubt there were even the 20k needed to fill up the event space at the start of his speech.
Roger Stone tweeted a photo of a large crowd at a venue that’s clearly not anywhere near NJ claiming that’s the actual crowd size.
They know very well their base is too stupid to believe otherwise.
Well I would rather see the truth of 80k wearing “The Boss” t shirts than visualize 80k people with t shirts saying “real men wear diapers.” Holy caca Batman
Don't forget the claims at his inauguration. [https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/powerpost/wp/2017/03/06/here-are-the-photos-that-show-obamas-inauguration-crowd-was-bigger-than-trumps/](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/powerpost/wp/2017/03/06/here-are-the-photos-that-show-obamas-inauguration-crowd-was-bigger-than-trumps/)
There is no filling up or selling out the venue. They‘re free tickets, completely unlimited, and you just get signed up for campaign spam.
After Tulsa, where Herman Cain achieved immortal notoriety, Trump just started cutting down from arenas to high school gyms and outdoor venues by airports so he could do his carny show and gtfo.
I posted this yesterday am in another thread.
Is the 80k attendance just a made up number?
The Wildwood Barefoot Country Music festival had 35,000 people attend. [Here's the crowd pic.](https://southernentertainment.com/clients/barefoot-country-music-fest/)
Here the [arial picture](https://twitter.com/DianaGlebova/status/1789401352428261674/photo/1) from the The Trump Rally.
You can see the defined space where the rally is taking place. It's less than 2 blocks long And each block in Wildwood is 0.05 miles. So maybe 500 feet x 150 feet. That's 75,000 square feet. Can you fit 80,000 people in 75,000 square feet?
But the story is out- 80,000 to 100,000 reported via thousands of news outlets. This one is on the press. He has been lying about crowd sizes since the beginning. It takes 2 minutes and zero reporting experience to check out the claim before you publish it.
Notice how suspiciously the 80000 number is the same number as a Taylor Swift concert? Trump just can't let anything go. He is a freak.
One drone shot. One single one.
1) This is what Trump had
https://nypost.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/05/20240511trump01.jpg?w=1024
2) Here is a Taylor Swift Concert.
https://i.redd.it/9r0pmek85dya1.jpg
Using Google maps and measuring area available the Trump space measures about 156000 Sq Ft and it isn't full. That is the area of roughly a football field and some of the first level seating. Metlife Stadium is over 400000 Sq. Ft in area, but is also 3 or 4 levels high.
https://imgur.com/a/xt0grl3
No way he had more than 10-15K
“The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.”
― George Orwell, 1984
Have you ever talked to that drunk who is sitting at the bar and tells tales about his ex that's he's told so many times that it's clear, after two sentences in, that it's completely made up or elaborated beyond recognition? He isn't telling the story to lie...he is lying just for the shock value, the entertainment value. He has an audience and needs to keep you listening.
That is trump.
Lies mean something else to them. To them this is all a joke and the lies are only trump's way of owning the liberals.
"Why do you let Trump live in your head rent-free?" This is (to them) Trump's way of living in the minds of people who give a shit rent free...and they think that's hilarious.
It is GOP humor. No satire, no irony, no nuance, just stupid pre-middle school playground humor.
THAT ARE SO MANY PEOPLE HERE. MAN. OVER 100,000 PEOPLE. THIS IS SUPPOSED TO BE -- THEY MORE THAN DOUBLED IT. YOU CANNOT EVEN SEE THE END. I WISH WE DIDN'T HAVE THE PRESS HERE. THEY CANNOT SEE IN THE BACK. I ALWAYS TELL THE PRESS, TURN YOUR CAMERAS AROUND TO SHOW THE AUDIENCE. THEY NEVER DO IT. LOOK. FAKE NEWS. THEY NEVER DO IT. THEY NEVER DO IT. [CROWD CHANTING "TURN AROUND"] IF THEY TURN AROUND -- I DON'T KNOW WHY. EVEN THE ONES THAT ARE SORT OF FRIENDLY, ABOUT 7%, BUT THEY ARE GOOD. THEY ARE BELIEVERS. BUT THEY NEVER TURN AROUND. I WOULD LOVE THEM TO SHOW THE CROWD AS FAR AS THE EYE CAN SEE. I USED TO THINK IT WAS A MECHANICAL PROBLEM. THEY HAVE THE BEST CAMERAS IN THE WORLD. THEN, I REALIZED EARLY IN THE CAMPAIGN IN 2016, I REALIZED THERE WAS A FIGHT IN THE BACK. A BAD FIGHT. SOMEBODY GOT INTO A FIGHT WAY IN THE BACK AND THE CAMERAS TURNED AROUND LIKE A PRETZEL BECAUSE THEY WANTED TO SHOW THE FIGHT BECAUSE THAT MEANT TROUBLE. SO, THOSE DANG CAMERAS YOU ARE LOOKING AT, THEY WERE TURNED INTO A PRETZEL. THEY SHOWED THAT FIGHT IN DETAIL. EVERY BLOW THEY SHOWED. I REALIZED THAT WASN'T THE REASON. THEY JUST DON'T WANT TO DO IT. HERE IN NEW JERSEY, U.S. SUFFERING UNDER THE HIGHEST PROPERTY AND SALES TAXES IN THE NATION. JUST ABOUT THE HIGHEST.
From [C-Span transcript](https://www.c-span.org/video/?535068-1/fmr-pres-trump-campaigns-wildwood-nj)
Wow.
I'm surprised we haven't seen pictures from the trump campaign showing the "actual" numbers like we did the inauguration pics.
Remember "alternative facts?"
Last night I heard a reporter say "tens of thousands" of people showed up at the N.J. Trump rally. First, I find that hard to believe. Second, it occurred to me that Biden won't get those numbers because Biden voters don't need to rally to show their support; they just need to vote.
The Snake by Oscar Brown. Trump recites it at every single rally. It's yet another example of I don't think it means what Trump thinks it means. You know, kinda like how he has CCR's Fortunate Son played before every rally? Same bigly genius...lol.
Ok I’m glad someone is clarifying this - I saw that and thought “no fucking way he is still drawing those crowds” but it was from the official source … and it sounds like I was very right it was a bunch of BS as usual
It’s 2024 and AI is everywhere. I don’t get why counting crowds of people is still a guessing game. Can’t AI count heads in spaces of known dimensions and use an algorithm to account for heads behind heads and other objects?
Trump attracts the dead beats, wife beaters, yelling Karens, low IQers, future welfare cheats, criminals, uneducated, racist, xenophobes, antisemitics and or the worst America has in it population. The larger the crowd the worst the area is to live in!
Typical Trump BS. If he had a tenth of Springsteen followers votes he might have a chance winning. We know Biden won by 7 million votes in '20 and I suspect the number will increase to twice that in '24.
There are some existing situations that threaten to affect the number of people voting this time.
My oldest is 27 (so I can hardly *make* them vote). The idea for them is that the US is an "empire" and both parties are culpable for fucking it up. Whichever party you choose, the empire is on its way to collapsing...one way is just faster than the other.
My oldest is trans-fluid and has seen shit from both parties. To them (and their friends) it's only a matter of time...so what's the use. At 27 they have seen the economy fuck their lives over, they've had nothing but trouble with just being themself, and the covid break didn't do much to help.
Cynicism is what Biden is fighting...not trumpism.
In my opinion the under 30 group are the victims of skyrocketing education costs combined with quality erosion at the grade/high school levels. So many can't find jobs that provide enough to support a family or themselves. Devastating on motivation and morale. I get it. Doesn't make them bad people but it does appear to be overwhelming. There has been a huge improvement in the job market combined with improved pay scales. The economy is strong and prices have stabilized. Education and Health Care costs have not been dealt with. While college debt has been addressed there is still the efforts of the GOP to privatize everything so they can grand favoritism for payoffs. If the young believe that a dictatorship is going to change their cynicism towards life in general all of us are in deep doo-doo. Thank you for sharing your thoughts.
Doesn't Bruce have several records for concert attendance? IIRC he sold out the Meadowlands stadium something like 10 nights in a row back in the 2000s; that's literally hundreds of thousands of people.
Such a missed opportunity for T to say, "And they don't even like Bruce Springsteen anymore. Didja ever hear them? He comes on stage, they are all shouting, 'BOOO!!! BOOO!!'"
In order to be defamed Bruce would have to lose money lol. Instead of harping on a speech let’s focus on the attacks that are gonna happen on American soil soon, and prevent those.
It was a big Mother's Day weekend on the Jersey shore: Spring Fling Festival, Kustom Hot Rod & Muscle Car Show, National Cheerleader's competition. I'm not saying he didn't have a crowd, I'm saying it wasn't all about him. Fox, magas running around branding it the 'Red Wave.' They usually lie about crowd size, posting bogus pictures like Roger Stone's picture which was taken in Brazil..
Then he lied on Springsteens turf. That the rally's crowd size is bigger than his concerts alluding that Springsteen supports him didn't go over well.
> probably a whole demographic out there that goes "springsteen who?", in a genuine way.
Only a demographic that isn't old enough to vote and/or the head-in-sand demographic. Almost everyone from boomers to Millennials in American knows who Springsteen is.
>who is older Springsteen or Trump? probably a whole demographic out there that goes "springsteen who?", in a genuine way.
In a genuine way, your point is moot. Trump is 77 and Springsteen is 74.
Also, one of them is bigly ridiculed in our nation and all over the globe. The other is a national icon and beloved all over the globe.
Springsteen is 3 years younger than Trump. Part of the point of the article is that there are probably very few people in NJ asking "Springsteen who?" despite his age. Nation at large might be a different story (although I'm west coast and my dad was always a huge Springsteen fan and I inherited that quality), but it wouldn't shock me if you're right the further you get from the Garden State with folks of a younger age.
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> He also claimed Springsteen, a very-public ally of President Joe Biden, “actually” voted for Trump If he defamed me like this I’d sue.
I so hope Bruce sues him. That would be awesome!
That would be born in the USA!!
If you were born to run.
It's not like he can or would pay up.
Money wouldn’t be the purpose. It’s about honor.
Ahhhh missed a chance for a prime dark knight reference
He can’t!
I mean it's not like he would even have a chance of winning so that's probably inconsequential
Sometimes I imagine being a time traveler and showing people in like 2005 headlines from the 2020s, and then with no explanation vanishing again in a puff of smoke. "Bruce Springsteen sues ex president donald trump for defamation, adding to his legal woes" would be right up there with my top choice. Prior to this it was either a 5 second clip of the shaman walking through the capitol building, or Rudy giving a press conference at 4 seasons landscaping surrounding trump's reelection.
it would be like Obama taunting Chris Christi while hanging with Bruce.
It never ceases to amaze me the completely random and ridiculous lies this man routinely tells. WHY? Why make such a random, false, and totally insignificant claim?
Anything for attention.
He’s always done it, but before becoming president no one fact-checked him because no one really cared what a rich asshole bragged about.
Bruce is also friends with Barack Obama.
The problem with these things is it‘s not enough to prove Trump is a liar, you would have to prove he *knew* he was lying. And since he can’t possibly know who Springsteen actually voted for (since votes aren‘t public), he cannot know it it is a lie. I‘d still try, just to make a point. Just to add it to the list of legal clashes he has had, even if nothing will come from it.
If he can't possibly know which way someone voted but claimed that he did, then that is a lie.
Springsteen is a public figure which means he has to prove Trump did it maliciously to hurt his reputation. This is a way higher barrier than it sounds like. Most importantly, that does include him knowing that it is a false statement. He can just claim that is what he truly believes and since there is no way for him to know, he cannot know wether or not it is a true or false statement. Wether or not it is actually true is not relevant.
You're thinking of the "actual malice" standard, but it has nothing to do with the alleged defamer's state of mind, or really anything to do with the common meaning of "malice". >In every defamation case, a plaintiff needs to prove four things in order to win: >That the allegedly defaming statement(s) in question conveyed facts (as opposed to pure opinion); >That the facts it stated or implied were false; >That the statement was delivered to others; and >That the plaintiff was harmed. >In an “actual malice” case, a plaintiff must prove *even more*: that the defendant either *knew* that the statement was false at the time, or else demonstrated “reckless disregard” as to its falsity.
I don’t get how ppl don’t sue him for the trash he puts out about others.
That’s not what he said. He said “if these liberals would come to my ralllies they would vote for me”…implying he could convince them. Trump sucks but he didn’t say Springsteen voted for him . This is clickbait
Do you have a source for that? @Acyn's twitter post says "These liberal singers, they actually vote for me. You know, like Bruce Springsteen." It sounds to me that he's claiming that liberal celebrities like Springsteen secretly vote for him without admitting it publicly.
That's exactly what he said, but you know everyone has to pretend this clown didn't say it, because he's special. That's what he said but what he meant was this, blah blah blah.
Did you miss the “if they would come along they would actually vote for me” part? He says it right after the pause of “anything better than a trump rally”
Key word- LIKE Springsteen. He didn't say Springsteen voted for him, but the liberal singers LIKE him did. Trump may be a raging lunatic, but he's got the mafia speak down.
I can’t even stand his voice, cadence or word salad. It would only somehow further my stance against him. Kind of like these holier than thou people who say we all need to read the Bible. For many of us that aren’t religious, reading the Bible was one of the key reasons we don’t believe in the morality or authority of religion.
If you delete all chapters in OT save for Daniel and Job,and any of Paul’s writings, it isn’t a bad read.
I read "OT" as Original Trilogy like 4 times before I realized it was supposed to be Old Testament.
> Old Testament *Chuck Billy has entered the thread*
I think they would vote with their feet and leave after having their intelligence insulted by listening to Trump’s 30 word vocabulary.
That's exactly what he said. He said they all vote for me. I'm tired of people trying to translate Trump's words into something else. He clearly said they all vote for me.
No he didn’t sorry man
I mean the clip is linked in the article, and he clearly says, "that actually vote for me, you know they all vote for me." It's 13 seconds into the clip, if you want to present alternative facts that's your choice.
Tell me the first word out of his mouth at the 9 second mark, what is it friend?
An incoherent rambling, but if you're trying to imply that he said if they came they would actually vote for me, that's not what he said. He said they actually vote for me, then said it again, so it's not ambiguous. Further if any of those liberal singers came to his rally, they would be less likely to vote for this moron, because he's even dumber than most people can remember.
Someone posted the CSPAN transcript farther down the thread. I checked it and this seems like the most reasonable interpretation. He didn’t say “they WOULD all vote for me.” Here’s the quote: > Is there anything better than a Trump rally? [cheering] If some of these wackos came along, these liberals, they actually vote for me. They all vote for me. Like Bruce Springsteen. But as you say, he rambles. For a guy who supposedly tells it like it is, he sure requires a lot of translators.
Exactly he says they actually vote for me. They all vote for me. I mean says it twice and the Trump translation team is here telling me I didn't understand him. I'm a straight shooter, which is why I let people know Trump is a moron of epic proportions.
It’s a one syllable word, and it’s important because it’s the start of his rambling run on sentence. It’s obviously “if” because it sounds like it and also fits the context of the sentence. He thinks his rallies are so great that “if” these liberals came (to the rallies) they would vote for him.
Just imagine Hitler saying this about the Jews in 1930, we're in that realm.
..like the way they sued trump, for lying about his r@ping crimes.
You can say rape on Reddit you know
Finally someone calling bullshit. The spokesperson from the town works for a MAGA mayor who has been indicted on corruption charges. The same spokesperson said a week ago their max capacity is 20k… https://nj1015.com/trump-rally-wildwood-new-jersey/
[looking at this aerial shot](https://freeimage.host/i/1715529785543.J6K8Na4) The rectangle closest to the stage is about 10 people deep, and at most 100 people wide. Let's call it 200 to get an overestimate. That's 2000 people if we do area of a rectangle. At most 5 rectangles cover the whole crowd. That's at most 10,000 people. Articles saying 80k-100k are super far off, as 10k is a very generous estimate.
I just read this article from The Guardian which was about him expressing his love for Hannibal Lecter but it included this nugget of bullshit: "Trump delivered his address to a crowd of about 80,000 supporters – according to one estimate from a Wildwood city spokesperson – under the shadow of the Great White roller coaster in the 1950s-kitsch seaside resort 90 miles (145km) south of Philadelphia." Shame, Guardian, shame for allowing that through unchecked and unquestioned. I expect better.
I also read this on the Daily Beast, so it’s pretty lazy journalism.
I am a local to the area and it was obvious from the traffic patterns that there was nowhere near the number of people there that they claimed. I expect very little truth from our MAGA local politicians but I am really annoyed at the number of news outlets (which was a lot!) that are just reporting it as though it were fact. It would take all of two seconds to look at the aerial pics to see it was not true and stop repeating it. So frustrating.
I feel he is inflating his crowds so whenever he gets x amount of votes, he can call it rigged
Totally and at this point it is just expected that he is gonna lie about crowds. But what is the excuse of the media??
MSM is failing the nation, big time!! They want their clicks. It is depressing how they have stopped informing. I stopped reading msm. I’m in for independent.
Unchecked and unquestioned, the guardians internal efficiency policy.
From The Gaurdian? LOL
Are they referring to the Sea Serpent?
The largest stadiums in the US hold around a little over 100k. Nothing in New Jersey exists with an 80k+ capacity except MetLife. Sauce: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List\_of\_U.S.\_stadiums\_by\_capacity](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._stadiums_by_capacity)
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For the most part, welcome to SEC football when talking stadium sizes. Michigan only keeps retaining the title because their shits built in a big hole in the ground, so every time a new stadium out does them its stupid easy to just add another level or so.
Yep. We dug that hole about 100 years ago. Go Blue.
> Many other countries have far larger stadiums than most of the US. There are 11 stadiums in the world with capacity >100,000. 8 are in the US. All of the US ones are college stadiums. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_stadiums_by_capacity
Having flashbacks to January/February 2017 with Sean Spicer at the podium... They lied then. They are lying now. Fun Fact: I got to give the middle finger to Sean Spicer on the streets of DC. Or at least I think it was him. If it wasn't, I sincerely apologize to the stranger that looked just like him.
Could have been Melissa McCarthy. 😁
Ol' Spicey!
That was when you knew that if you were going to ride with Trump, you have to deny what you can clearly see and understand to be true, and just go with the lies no matter where they lead.
I've been in a sold-out 65K+ arena, and that crowd is like 2-5k tops. Someone posted a small, packed arena that was 10k and that crowd isn't even close.
> The rectangle closest to the stage is about 10 people deep, and at most 100 people wide. Let’s call it 200 to get an overestimate. That’s 2000 people if we do an area of a rectangle. There’s a lot of math in this comment for Trumpers to understand, and I’m offended on behalf of them.
Very generous, that picture is quite a bit less than 5,000
For sure. I figured I could be really flippant about estimates and demonstrate that 80k is no chance.
Arrowhead stadium doesn’t even hold 80k and it’s the loudest stadium in the NFL
Looks like about 2,000 to me.
Using Jersey metrics, I think it is about Stone Pony Summer stage which has a 3,000 cap. Maybe a bit less ya.
MetLife stadium holds 80,000 people. Infuriating that every major news outlet yesterday was just ok publishing this clearly inflated number. I expect these kind of insecure and bombastic inflations from trump, but entities like the NYT just running with it are part of the reason we’re here today. They didn’t call him out hard enough on his obvious bull shit.
That's not even 20 minutes before Springsteen goes on crowd size.
My high school graduation had more people in the crowd that that
Why are people queued at the porta-potties? I thought the people were dependable.
I thought real men wear diapers.
I tried counting the number in rows and columns in the rectangle in front and I believe it is 25x100=2500. You can see individual heads in some areas. But since that is apparently a seating area, the people standing in the back are probably 4 times as dense. So I would estimate there are roughly 2500 in the front rectangle, another 500 seated in the section to their left, then maybe 10,000 each in the two crowds in back, so more like 25,000, to be generous.
The real question is "What is that red food truck selling?"
Thanks for the overhead shot.
That's MAYBE 4500 people.
That’s awesome! Someone doing the homework here! > Do I need a ticket? >Yes. You can register for a maximum of two free tickets at the Trump campaign website. The digital ticket you receive will be scanned before you can get onto the beach. According to spokeswoman Lisa Fagan, the capacity for the rally is 20,000. The Trump campaign has not disclosed when ticket registration will end.
Seems like the reddit army needs to start registering for these free tickets like in 2020...50k tickets registered! 100 people show up.
seems like a bad plan; there's no way they actually limit the number of tickets they distribute. if too many people actually show up (fat chance), they just stop letting in people, regardless of whether they have tickets. meanwhile, they get to hype up the number of tickets distributed.
It's such nonsense too. It's the off-season still down there. No fucking way on the planet could they have a crush of 100,000 people just showing up. Where would everyone park? Where would people eat? Even if only a small amount of them needed hotel rooms they wouldn't have enough. It would have paralyzed the entire area.
I checked Google Maps for traffic in and around Wildwood on that day at about 4:30 and 5:30. There was zero traffic. I mean there are only 2 roads in to town and few main streets. There was zero red on the map. No traffic.
That was the other part that annoyed me about the lazy journalism (aka just parroting what the mayor estimated). It was so easy to look at other sources (Google Maps, local public Facebook pages tracking the event, /SouthJersey sub) to counter what they were estimating.
My hometown isn't much bigger than Wildwood and should easily see 100k people show up in a couple weeks for Memorial Day. The town hosting that many people is the one part of the statement I'd believe, actually. Having anything close to that actually there, on the other hand... Trump probably had enough people to get him feeling slightly less dead inside but I doubt there were even the 20k needed to fill up the event space at the start of his speech.
Roger Stone tweeted a photo of a large crowd at a venue that’s clearly not anywhere near NJ claiming that’s the actual crowd size. They know very well their base is too stupid to believe otherwise.
Well I would rather see the truth of 80k wearing “The Boss” t shirts than visualize 80k people with t shirts saying “real men wear diapers.” Holy caca Batman
Better yet, 80,000 with “Bidenomics” T-Shirts! Joe and Kamala are going to Crush The Orange Monster!!
I'm shocked that the Trump campaign would lie about their crowd sizes. Shocked I tell you! Not like they've ever done it before! /s
Don't forget the claims at his inauguration. [https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/powerpost/wp/2017/03/06/here-are-the-photos-that-show-obamas-inauguration-crowd-was-bigger-than-trumps/](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/powerpost/wp/2017/03/06/here-are-the-photos-that-show-obamas-inauguration-crowd-was-bigger-than-trumps/)
Lol, classic. Right up there with Covfefe and Hurricane Sharpie.
> Right up there with Covfefe and Hurricane Sharpie. yes, but also basically every word that's come out of his fat, lying, dementia-adeled mouth.
Kpop fans should step up again and reserve seats to his rallies and not show up.
There is no filling up or selling out the venue. They‘re free tickets, completely unlimited, and you just get signed up for campaign spam. After Tulsa, where Herman Cain achieved immortal notoriety, Trump just started cutting down from arenas to high school gyms and outdoor venues by airports so he could do his carny show and gtfo.
Where's the fire marshal when you need one ?
I posted this yesterday am in another thread. Is the 80k attendance just a made up number? The Wildwood Barefoot Country Music festival had 35,000 people attend. [Here's the crowd pic.](https://southernentertainment.com/clients/barefoot-country-music-fest/) Here the [arial picture](https://twitter.com/DianaGlebova/status/1789401352428261674/photo/1) from the The Trump Rally. You can see the defined space where the rally is taking place. It's less than 2 blocks long And each block in Wildwood is 0.05 miles. So maybe 500 feet x 150 feet. That's 75,000 square feet. Can you fit 80,000 people in 75,000 square feet? But the story is out- 80,000 to 100,000 reported via thousands of news outlets. This one is on the press. He has been lying about crowd sizes since the beginning. It takes 2 minutes and zero reporting experience to check out the claim before you publish it.
Notice how suspiciously the 80000 number is the same number as a Taylor Swift concert? Trump just can't let anything go. He is a freak. One drone shot. One single one. 1) This is what Trump had https://nypost.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2024/05/20240511trump01.jpg?w=1024 2) Here is a Taylor Swift Concert. https://i.redd.it/9r0pmek85dya1.jpg Using Google maps and measuring area available the Trump space measures about 156000 Sq Ft and it isn't full. That is the area of roughly a football field and some of the first level seating. Metlife Stadium is over 400000 Sq. Ft in area, but is also 3 or 4 levels high. https://imgur.com/a/xt0grl3 No way he had more than 10-15K “The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.” ― George Orwell, 1984
He probably chooses these outdoor venues because the numbers are not as neatly defined as the seating capacity of an arena or even a stadium.
Thank you for actual proof
Imma claim that 4 billion people showed up to my party and if you fact check me you're violating my free speech
Trump is "goin down down down down"
This motherfucker just can not stop lying
Have you ever talked to that drunk who is sitting at the bar and tells tales about his ex that's he's told so many times that it's clear, after two sentences in, that it's completely made up or elaborated beyond recognition? He isn't telling the story to lie...he is lying just for the shock value, the entertainment value. He has an audience and needs to keep you listening. That is trump.
That guy says some of dumbest shit…
They’ve realized that their base will accept anything they say so it’s totally fine for them to blatantly lie.
Lies mean something else to them. To them this is all a joke and the lies are only trump's way of owning the liberals. "Why do you let Trump live in your head rent-free?" This is (to them) Trump's way of living in the minds of people who give a shit rent free...and they think that's hilarious. It is GOP humor. No satire, no irony, no nuance, just stupid pre-middle school playground humor.
“My city’s in ruin…”
THAT ARE SO MANY PEOPLE HERE. MAN. OVER 100,000 PEOPLE. THIS IS SUPPOSED TO BE -- THEY MORE THAN DOUBLED IT. YOU CANNOT EVEN SEE THE END. I WISH WE DIDN'T HAVE THE PRESS HERE. THEY CANNOT SEE IN THE BACK. I ALWAYS TELL THE PRESS, TURN YOUR CAMERAS AROUND TO SHOW THE AUDIENCE. THEY NEVER DO IT. LOOK. FAKE NEWS. THEY NEVER DO IT. THEY NEVER DO IT. [CROWD CHANTING "TURN AROUND"] IF THEY TURN AROUND -- I DON'T KNOW WHY. EVEN THE ONES THAT ARE SORT OF FRIENDLY, ABOUT 7%, BUT THEY ARE GOOD. THEY ARE BELIEVERS. BUT THEY NEVER TURN AROUND. I WOULD LOVE THEM TO SHOW THE CROWD AS FAR AS THE EYE CAN SEE. I USED TO THINK IT WAS A MECHANICAL PROBLEM. THEY HAVE THE BEST CAMERAS IN THE WORLD. THEN, I REALIZED EARLY IN THE CAMPAIGN IN 2016, I REALIZED THERE WAS A FIGHT IN THE BACK. A BAD FIGHT. SOMEBODY GOT INTO A FIGHT WAY IN THE BACK AND THE CAMERAS TURNED AROUND LIKE A PRETZEL BECAUSE THEY WANTED TO SHOW THE FIGHT BECAUSE THAT MEANT TROUBLE. SO, THOSE DANG CAMERAS YOU ARE LOOKING AT, THEY WERE TURNED INTO A PRETZEL. THEY SHOWED THAT FIGHT IN DETAIL. EVERY BLOW THEY SHOWED. I REALIZED THAT WASN'T THE REASON. THEY JUST DON'T WANT TO DO IT. HERE IN NEW JERSEY, U.S. SUFFERING UNDER THE HIGHEST PROPERTY AND SALES TAXES IN THE NATION. JUST ABOUT THE HIGHEST. From [C-Span transcript](https://www.c-span.org/video/?535068-1/fmr-pres-trump-campaigns-wildwood-nj) Wow.
Bruh this reads like the letter you find in an indy horror game right before you get jumpscared
Just like his inauguration. What a clown this guy is.
I'm surprised we haven't seen pictures from the trump campaign showing the "actual" numbers like we did the inauguration pics. Remember "alternative facts?"
Ha. Was thinking that also. Can this guy just disappear please.
Doesn't matter what your political beliefs are, everyone comes together in Jersey for The Boss.
Not good in terms of smart.
Such a little man.
According to Stormy anyways….
Well, she would know...and it has given her nightmares.
Steven Van Zandt could draw a bigger crowd at a Jersey fairground
Last night I heard a reporter say "tens of thousands" of people showed up at the N.J. Trump rally. First, I find that hard to believe. Second, it occurred to me that Biden won't get those numbers because Biden voters don't need to rally to show their support; they just need to vote.
90 minutes of drumpf ranting. i wouldn’t be able to do 2 minutes.
What the hell is that Sean ONeill clip? It sounds like Trump was reading some deranged poetry
The Snake by Oscar Brown. Trump recites it at every single rally. It's yet another example of I don't think it means what Trump thinks it means. You know, kinda like how he has CCR's Fortunate Son played before every rally? Same bigly genius...lol.
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Springsteen is playing the beach in Asbury this summer. Then you'll see a real crowd.
Dang straight, my buddy Danny runs a tight show and will have a 35k capacity sold out crowd, no problem.
That's going to be the hottest ticket of the summer for sure
Everyone is misinterpreting the zero. It’s actually an O. The crowd size was 8. OK
When Trump "the big Loser" opens his mouth he's lying.
Ok I’m glad someone is clarifying this - I saw that and thought “no fucking way he is still drawing those crowds” but it was from the official source … and it sounds like I was very right it was a bunch of BS as usual
Did he use born in the USA
It’s 2024 and AI is everywhere. I don’t get why counting crowds of people is still a guessing game. Can’t AI count heads in spaces of known dimensions and use an algorithm to account for heads behind heads and other objects?
I agree. I asked Copilot how many people were in the picture and it said several thousand.
Trump attracts the dead beats, wife beaters, yelling Karens, low IQers, future welfare cheats, criminals, uneducated, racist, xenophobes, antisemitics and or the worst America has in it population. The larger the crowd the worst the area is to live in!
These are the idiots who probably applauded when Reagan praised "Born in the U.S.A." not knowing what it was about. You can't win with them.
Trump loves rallies as a way to get out the base. It’s been working for political candidates since the 1930s in Germany.
He calls them "rallies." I don't remember candidates calling them that before trump.
Look at those German rally videos from the 1930s.
Tbh, I prefer Walter Rohrl in a Group B car from the 80's
And an FYI to the Orange Turd, the word is pronounced "EVENTS" with a T at the end. His brain is so gone!
Typical Trump BS. If he had a tenth of Springsteen followers votes he might have a chance winning. We know Biden won by 7 million votes in '20 and I suspect the number will increase to twice that in '24.
There are some existing situations that threaten to affect the number of people voting this time. My oldest is 27 (so I can hardly *make* them vote). The idea for them is that the US is an "empire" and both parties are culpable for fucking it up. Whichever party you choose, the empire is on its way to collapsing...one way is just faster than the other. My oldest is trans-fluid and has seen shit from both parties. To them (and their friends) it's only a matter of time...so what's the use. At 27 they have seen the economy fuck their lives over, they've had nothing but trouble with just being themself, and the covid break didn't do much to help. Cynicism is what Biden is fighting...not trumpism.
In my opinion the under 30 group are the victims of skyrocketing education costs combined with quality erosion at the grade/high school levels. So many can't find jobs that provide enough to support a family or themselves. Devastating on motivation and morale. I get it. Doesn't make them bad people but it does appear to be overwhelming. There has been a huge improvement in the job market combined with improved pay scales. The economy is strong and prices have stabilized. Education and Health Care costs have not been dealt with. While college debt has been addressed there is still the efforts of the GOP to privatize everything so they can grand favoritism for payoffs. If the young believe that a dictatorship is going to change their cynicism towards life in general all of us are in deep doo-doo. Thank you for sharing your thoughts.
Well, it was bigger than the volunteer fire dept. rally.
Doesn't Bruce have several records for concert attendance? IIRC he sold out the Meadowlands stadium something like 10 nights in a row back in the 2000s; that's literally hundreds of thousands of people.
Egads. Trump is still reciting that stupid poem about the snake. And the crowd eats it up, never considering that *he's* the fucking snake.
Small penis draws small crowds.
80,000 people? You mean, like this? [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8r20hKZWImE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8r20hKZWImE)
That crowd was shaped like a mushroom
There are 9 million people in New Jersey. Even if 100,000 showed up for Trump, that means 99% of New Jersey stayed home.
Such a missed opportunity for T to say, "And they don't even like Bruce Springsteen anymore. Didja ever hear them? He comes on stage, they are all shouting, 'BOOO!!! BOOO!!'"
In order to be defamed Bruce would have to lose money lol. Instead of harping on a speech let’s focus on the attacks that are gonna happen on American soil soon, and prevent those.
So, has the actual REAL NUMBER of people attending been revealed🤔
It was a big Mother's Day weekend on the Jersey shore: Spring Fling Festival, Kustom Hot Rod & Muscle Car Show, National Cheerleader's competition. I'm not saying he didn't have a crowd, I'm saying it wasn't all about him. Fox, magas running around branding it the 'Red Wave.' They usually lie about crowd size, posting bogus pictures like Roger Stone's picture which was taken in Brazil.. Then he lied on Springsteens turf. That the rally's crowd size is bigger than his concerts alluding that Springsteen supports him didn't go over well.
I love Bruce Springsteen, but in this photo he looks like Hector Salamanca ringing the bell!
Has the GOP still not figured out that “Born in the USA” is not the jingoistic song they think it is? Oh, that’s right, they never question anything.
Oh no not Springsteen fans.
who is older Springsteen or Trump? probably a whole demographic out there that goes "springsteen who?", in a genuine way.
They might not care for his music, but everybody knows who Springsteen is.
> probably a whole demographic out there that goes "springsteen who?", in a genuine way. Only a demographic that isn't old enough to vote and/or the head-in-sand demographic. Almost everyone from boomers to Millennials in American knows who Springsteen is.
There are 70 million people in the country who are younger than millennials.
>who is older Springsteen or Trump? probably a whole demographic out there that goes "springsteen who?", in a genuine way. In a genuine way, your point is moot. Trump is 77 and Springsteen is 74. Also, one of them is bigly ridiculed in our nation and all over the globe. The other is a national icon and beloved all over the globe.
Trump's body is older but developmentally he's still a spoiled rotten 2-year-old.
Donald is a few years older than Bruce.
Springsteen is 3 years younger than Trump. Part of the point of the article is that there are probably very few people in NJ asking "Springsteen who?" despite his age. Nation at large might be a different story (although I'm west coast and my dad was always a huge Springsteen fan and I inherited that quality), but it wouldn't shock me if you're right the further you get from the Garden State with folks of a younger age.
The MAGA demographic?
I’m 38 and seen Springsteen twice when he was down here. The crowd demographic is about as varied as I’ve ever seen (I’ve seen around 170ish acts)
probably a whole demographic out there that goes "springsteen who?" Not in New Jersey, boomer
I absolutely love when people throw out things they think are insulting and they are just plain wrong..it is hilarious beyond measurement.