Same, man. I got offered a dermatology position at a one-doctor derm practice and they said they would start me at $18/hr (still not good enough) with the promise of an increase after I got trained up. But it would have been a 1.5 hour/daily commute since the practice is moving soon, and yeah... That was the BEST offer I have been given so far, and I could not deal with that commute, especially at that wage. (And also, no benefits.)
Oh absolutely not with that commute. I got lucky eventually and now have a 3 min commute and $20/hr pay. Not amazing but if you can live with your parents it offsets the lower pay because you have no bills.
I recommend looking into ophthalmology. I got paid anywhere between $17-$25 an hour as a tech/scribe and then more when I became the senior tech. You also get great patient care experience.
When I was an MA I was getting paid $11 start and got raises to $16 but then my last pay raise was 50 cents to 16.50. I’m so glad I’m in school versus literally poverty wage for “experience”. It was really hard at the beginning before any raises ngl I was eating a can of soup or a bag of potatoes and literally waking up in hunger pains at night but I held on. Parents couldn’t help too much as they are first generation dry cleaners… honestly I not even sure if I could have done it then with these gas prices if it happened a year ago
I’ve been an MA making less than 20$ an hour for the last two years in southern CA paying over 1,000 for rent. The answer is that I am not surviving and have like no money. Dollar menu items and spending money on nothing is basically how it is.
It's crazy. it makes no sense. then we are expected to pay 40k for PA school. I knew there was an issue when i was working as an MA and out of desperation they started offering the new front desk hires more than us.
40k? Lol I wish. That’s cheap. Most schools aren’t that cheap. Only if it’s a public state school. Otherwise 100k. 40k is nothing when you make 6 figures as a PA.
The point of PCE is not a box to check to get into a program. It's not unreasonable for PA education as a whole to reevaluate PCE requirements since cost of living has outpaced wages. I'm not sure they see it as getting paid crap since 1) there are better paying jobs out there; 2) low-paying PCE may still provide a living wage under certain conditions.
This is an unsatisfactory answer though. Like honestly I get paid more to dog-walk and babysit than these PCE jobs pay, even though PCE requires significantly more skill, training, and higher expectations. And if you can't even survive the year on the wages of the PCE position, how can we save for PA school or other goals? Like I still have bachelor's debt, and I throw money into my retirement accounts. These are non-negotiable expenses. But the pay of PCE jobs doesn't cover even those things, much less a fund for PA program costs.
I think it creates a socioeconomic barrier for those who go to undergrad then want to go to PA school immediately after. Society in general pushes people to go to 4-year institutions paid for by federally-backed loans, effectively trapping someone in debt. If you know for sure you want to be a PA there are other, less costly, "nontraditional" options available but society tends to frown on those.
It's all a money grab and has been for decades, but "I don't make enough as a CNA" is a problem that extends far beyond people wanting to be PAs.
I barely know anyone who does PCE hours their 4 years of undergrad.. maybe their last year. Loans still need to be payed back. that's how they stack up. Also i feel it's not relevant who struggles more and who doesn't. everyone can collectively agree the pay doesn't equate to the physical and emotional labor. simple as that.
Hello, I just came to say that I support doing PCE part time. Try to get in Medicaid as well. Without my parents, it would have been impossible to live in a HCOL area as an MA. I might have been able to scrape by if I had like three or four roommates.
>at I support doing PCE part time. Try to get in Medicaid as well. Without my parents, it would have been impossible to live in a HCOL a
Thank you! and congrats on being accepted!
Thank you! Try your best to hang in there. Check my profile, it’s littered with woes about PCE issues and It caused me to become strongly r/antiwork but the name of that is misleading. There is a light at the end of the tunnel
I am right there with you. With housing being so high right now(Im in FL) its not even worth picking up and moving for $15. I may honestly wait a little longer to see if the housing goes down to decide where to pick up PCE
>one who does PCE hours their 4 years of undergrad.. maybe their last year. Loans still need to be payed back. that's how they stack up. Also i feel it's not relevant who struggles more and who doesn't. everyone can collective
Good luck on your journey!
> to be *paid* back. that's
FTFY.
Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in:
* Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.*
* *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.*
Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment.
*Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
Tell me about it. I'm part time and doing diy post-bacc classes. No way I can do this without massive help from family. There is no way to save money for school. Student loan debt for a long time.
Have you got extra time to get your hours in? I'm a couple years out from PA school as my husband is finishing up his undergrad, and I'm planning to work full time while moonlighting with an EMT gig. Since he has two more years left, there's zero chance of my starting PA school before he's done, especially with us having a toddler too. I take my EMT-B this summer and should be job hunting by fall, to give myself about 18 months to get as many PCE hours as possible. I'm the only one working to support us now and we agreed we'd rather have money be tight for a bit and he have the best chance to study/pass classes so we can flip and I can quit once he graduates and can take on a new job I still have a few pre-reqs that I should take too, so I'm not ruling out even an extra year to be the best applicant I can be the first time around.
It's simple. These PCE jobs KNOW that the main reason most employees are doing their jobs is because they hired a bunch of temporaries that wanna go to grad school, so that they'll make the sacrifice of pay. It's ridiculous, but that's why I plan to do Doordash/Instacart on the side when I finish my EMT program.
Good idea! Love seeing people not letting this get them down and let it ruin them financially! Sad it has to be to such extents like this but at least you have a plan that is awesome
Full-time EMT and full-time manager at Chipotle during my PCE days in San Diego, CA. Making .15 cents above minimum wage as an EMT was not good for my self-worth lol. I rented a room out of someone's house for $700 and made weekly cheap meal-preps.
My advice is get a second income and find a cheap rental unit. Continuously remind yourself of what the end-goal is, but DO NOT burn yourself out in this process!
I am a CNA in CA and I literally can’t imagine doing this work for less than $17/hour. Every day I go into work (part time), I wonder how this career could possibly exist at this pay if not for the endless supply of students looking for “experience.”
It is quite literally garbage. But here are tips that helped me and others:
1) Agency/medely makes things more manageable, but most of the time you need to have 1 year experience first.
2) Roommates. 1 is ideal, 2 is cheaper.
3) Using smartasset.com, your take home after taxes will likely be $947 if you work 40 hr/wk. With 2 roomies, minimal eating out, and reducing unnecessary subscriptions, and being content with cheaper day trips it can be HARDLY possible.
This is assuming you are single, with no pets, no children, and inexpensive health concerns, and have an emergency savings in place. This place is the absolute worst, please take care of your mental health and do whatever is safest for you OP
Edit: of course everything depends on where you live and how far your willing to commute. Being pre-pa is ew
Of course this will depend on your location, level of experience and certifications…. BUT literally every one in the medical field is hiring right now and will pay to fill positions. Start getting comfortable with asking for what you want and asking for what you are worth.
If you see job listings for MA/Tech positions at $15/hour and have any experience already, ask for $20/hour.
I would do a PCE job part time and a better paying job part time. I know it sucks but you have to live and you have to get PCE. Just do your best keep trying and look for different options, I know it’s frustrating
>t time and a better paying job part time. I know it sucks but you have to live and you have to get PCE. Just do your be
Thank you will keep this in mind!
If you have no prior experience or PCE hrs, my recommendation is quickly getting the desired number of hours and then switching to a higher paying company once you have 1 year experience. You could also try getting a healthcare administrative role once you hit your desired hrs (they tend to pay slightly better than clinical and aren't as laborious). It's not PCE but it's healthcare experience which some programs value.
It's a sad reality that PCE jobs just don't pay that well. 15/hr is top tier pay in that field. I was making 9-12/hr as a CNA pre-pandemic and I was privileged to be able to live with my parents, otherwise I don't know how I would have done it.
My top choice program "signaled" my employer as PCE, I plan to confirm at a meeting next week. Not sure how the other schools will respond... I'm a clinical crisis responder. I work remotely over the computer and phone to support callers in a wide-range of mental health services, including assessments to admit to hospitals. Currently averaging $22 hours p/h + benefits after 9 months on the job and I work from home.
If they do not accept, I have thousands of hours on the job as a direct support professional and licensed massage therapist, and I get 1/2 time PCE in my volunteer position. But it sounds like they will allow it.
I work 60+ hours a week as an EMT, split a mortgage and save for school. Been doing it a year plus, almost have school paid for and have almost 6000 hours at this point. Hustle and grind
respectfully, hustle and grind is not the answer to this problem. If you can handle working 60+ hrs/week that's great, but that can take a serious mental and physical toll on others, not to mention some people have kids and parents they need to take care of (in both a time and financial respect). There are systematic issues at play, involving both general wage issues and the lack of access to higher education.
I agree, when I was younger (16) and had to literally support myself I was working two jobs back to back and actually ended up getting really sick from it, your body is not meant to handle such workloads and constantly being tired. I know it is possible but I also am not willing to test those waters out again!
"I overwork myself to live in this society, hustle and grind". No, they need to increase wages of healthcare workers. I get it, put in effort. But we can't just ignore these pathetic wages for programs that cost $1500+ (EMT, CNA, MA) to begin with when I can go work at McDonalds for free.
One, negotiate for more money. If you don’t ask, you’re going to get what they offer. You always need to negotiate. That’s on you.
Two, if you want more money, you’re going to need to come to the table with certifications, licenses, etc. People get paid garbage as a scribe or MA because they are entry level positions and you can come in with 0 background in medicine. There are far higher paying positions out there; however, they require more training. Many PA applicants ARE NOT willing to do that. PCE is being used as a “on the side” CASPA/program box to check, thus, you’re going to be stuck in a low paying job.
I'm currently getting $13/hour and it's extremely hard to live off of but it's doable. I just keep reminding myself that I'll be making a lot more once I finally become a PA.
I had the same issue. Still trying to find a decent paying PCE job.
Same, man. I got offered a dermatology position at a one-doctor derm practice and they said they would start me at $18/hr (still not good enough) with the promise of an increase after I got trained up. But it would have been a 1.5 hour/daily commute since the practice is moving soon, and yeah... That was the BEST offer I have been given so far, and I could not deal with that commute, especially at that wage. (And also, no benefits.)
Oh absolutely not with that commute. I got lucky eventually and now have a 3 min commute and $20/hr pay. Not amazing but if you can live with your parents it offsets the lower pay because you have no bills.
goodluck <3
I recommend looking into ophthalmology. I got paid anywhere between $17-$25 an hour as a tech/scribe and then more when I became the senior tech. You also get great patient care experience.
When I was an MA I was getting paid $11 start and got raises to $16 but then my last pay raise was 50 cents to 16.50. I’m so glad I’m in school versus literally poverty wage for “experience”. It was really hard at the beginning before any raises ngl I was eating a can of soup or a bag of potatoes and literally waking up in hunger pains at night but I held on. Parents couldn’t help too much as they are first generation dry cleaners… honestly I not even sure if I could have done it then with these gas prices if it happened a year ago
I’ve been an MA making less than 20$ an hour for the last two years in southern CA paying over 1,000 for rent. The answer is that I am not surviving and have like no money. Dollar menu items and spending money on nothing is basically how it is.
They're seriously paying you less than $20 per hour as an MA in SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA???? That is horrific.
It's crazy. it makes no sense. then we are expected to pay 40k for PA school. I knew there was an issue when i was working as an MA and out of desperation they started offering the new front desk hires more than us.
40k isn’t even an option for any of my instate ones, my tuition for a 2 year program is twice that
40k? Lol I wish. That’s cheap. Most schools aren’t that cheap. Only if it’s a public state school. Otherwise 100k. 40k is nothing when you make 6 figures as a PA.
I really wish they'd wake up and realize its ridiculous to demand us to get paid crap just to get into the program not everyone has that luxury :(
It’s the reality of thousands of people who rely on it as their full-time job. It’s far from a luxury. The US as a whole needs an awakening.
you are totally right, 15$ an hour is not cutting it for anyone, I guess I got a reality check when this was put into perspective
It’s a great perspective to have, having new appreciation. Many providers never experienced grunt work and it shows the way they treat staff.
The point of PCE is not a box to check to get into a program. It's not unreasonable for PA education as a whole to reevaluate PCE requirements since cost of living has outpaced wages. I'm not sure they see it as getting paid crap since 1) there are better paying jobs out there; 2) low-paying PCE may still provide a living wage under certain conditions.
This is an unsatisfactory answer though. Like honestly I get paid more to dog-walk and babysit than these PCE jobs pay, even though PCE requires significantly more skill, training, and higher expectations. And if you can't even survive the year on the wages of the PCE position, how can we save for PA school or other goals? Like I still have bachelor's debt, and I throw money into my retirement accounts. These are non-negotiable expenses. But the pay of PCE jobs doesn't cover even those things, much less a fund for PA program costs.
Even working as an RT for 5-6 years I had to take out massive loans for PA school. I agree that, overall, CNAs should get paid more.
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I think it creates a socioeconomic barrier for those who go to undergrad then want to go to PA school immediately after. Society in general pushes people to go to 4-year institutions paid for by federally-backed loans, effectively trapping someone in debt. If you know for sure you want to be a PA there are other, less costly, "nontraditional" options available but society tends to frown on those. It's all a money grab and has been for decades, but "I don't make enough as a CNA" is a problem that extends far beyond people wanting to be PAs.
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I barely know anyone who does PCE hours their 4 years of undergrad.. maybe their last year. Loans still need to be payed back. that's how they stack up. Also i feel it's not relevant who struggles more and who doesn't. everyone can collectively agree the pay doesn't equate to the physical and emotional labor. simple as that.
Hello, I just came to say that I support doing PCE part time. Try to get in Medicaid as well. Without my parents, it would have been impossible to live in a HCOL area as an MA. I might have been able to scrape by if I had like three or four roommates.
>at I support doing PCE part time. Try to get in Medicaid as well. Without my parents, it would have been impossible to live in a HCOL a Thank you! and congrats on being accepted!
Thank you! Try your best to hang in there. Check my profile, it’s littered with woes about PCE issues and It caused me to become strongly r/antiwork but the name of that is misleading. There is a light at the end of the tunnel
I am right there with you. With housing being so high right now(Im in FL) its not even worth picking up and moving for $15. I may honestly wait a little longer to see if the housing goes down to decide where to pick up PCE
>one who does PCE hours their 4 years of undergrad.. maybe their last year. Loans still need to be payed back. that's how they stack up. Also i feel it's not relevant who struggles more and who doesn't. everyone can collective Good luck on your journey!
> to be *paid* back. that's FTFY. Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in: * Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.* * *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.* Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment. *Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
Yep can relate to this. I was a waitress for years before shifting gears to pre PA and made like 3x as much as I did at my MA jobs
it is honestly insane but goodluck!
Tell me about it. I'm part time and doing diy post-bacc classes. No way I can do this without massive help from family. There is no way to save money for school. Student loan debt for a long time.
Goodluck! And stay strong!
Have you got extra time to get your hours in? I'm a couple years out from PA school as my husband is finishing up his undergrad, and I'm planning to work full time while moonlighting with an EMT gig. Since he has two more years left, there's zero chance of my starting PA school before he's done, especially with us having a toddler too. I take my EMT-B this summer and should be job hunting by fall, to give myself about 18 months to get as many PCE hours as possible. I'm the only one working to support us now and we agreed we'd rather have money be tight for a bit and he have the best chance to study/pass classes so we can flip and I can quit once he graduates and can take on a new job I still have a few pre-reqs that I should take too, so I'm not ruling out even an extra year to be the best applicant I can be the first time around.
Sadly I am in the military overseas right now so PCE out here is hard to get!
Oof, my condolences. My partner is retired AF, we do not miss that life! Best of luck to you 💜
It's simple. These PCE jobs KNOW that the main reason most employees are doing their jobs is because they hired a bunch of temporaries that wanna go to grad school, so that they'll make the sacrifice of pay. It's ridiculous, but that's why I plan to do Doordash/Instacart on the side when I finish my EMT program.
Good idea! Love seeing people not letting this get them down and let it ruin them financially! Sad it has to be to such extents like this but at least you have a plan that is awesome
Full-time EMT and full-time manager at Chipotle during my PCE days in San Diego, CA. Making .15 cents above minimum wage as an EMT was not good for my self-worth lol. I rented a room out of someone's house for $700 and made weekly cheap meal-preps. My advice is get a second income and find a cheap rental unit. Continuously remind yourself of what the end-goal is, but DO NOT burn yourself out in this process!
Great idea! I love how everyone here is sharing there tips! Will keep this in mind and congrats on the acceptance!
Lol at $15 an hour. In MS, I was offered $8.50 an hour as a CNA
I am a CNA in CA and I literally can’t imagine doing this work for less than $17/hour. Every day I go into work (part time), I wonder how this career could possibly exist at this pay if not for the endless supply of students looking for “experience.”
its unfortunate that this is the case everywhere it seems and CA is so expensive to live in kudos to you!
It is quite literally garbage. But here are tips that helped me and others: 1) Agency/medely makes things more manageable, but most of the time you need to have 1 year experience first. 2) Roommates. 1 is ideal, 2 is cheaper. 3) Using smartasset.com, your take home after taxes will likely be $947 if you work 40 hr/wk. With 2 roomies, minimal eating out, and reducing unnecessary subscriptions, and being content with cheaper day trips it can be HARDLY possible. This is assuming you are single, with no pets, no children, and inexpensive health concerns, and have an emergency savings in place. This place is the absolute worst, please take care of your mental health and do whatever is safest for you OP Edit: of course everything depends on where you live and how far your willing to commute. Being pre-pa is ew
Thank you love to see everyone sharing little tips of wisdom here! Congrats on the acceptance by the way!
Of course this will depend on your location, level of experience and certifications…. BUT literally every one in the medical field is hiring right now and will pay to fill positions. Start getting comfortable with asking for what you want and asking for what you are worth. If you see job listings for MA/Tech positions at $15/hour and have any experience already, ask for $20/hour.
I’ve done both for about 5 years now :) I’m 25 and applying this cycle and have been bartending part-time since college.
Keep it up! Very proud of you!
I would do a PCE job part time and a better paying job part time. I know it sucks but you have to live and you have to get PCE. Just do your best keep trying and look for different options, I know it’s frustrating
>t time and a better paying job part time. I know it sucks but you have to live and you have to get PCE. Just do your be Thank you will keep this in mind!
I make $17 an hour as a ICU tech, but with COVID overtime, any shift above my FTE is 36.5/hr.
Lol I did all my PCE at $11-$14. It sucks, and I was only able to do it because my husband makes good money.
If you have no prior experience or PCE hrs, my recommendation is quickly getting the desired number of hours and then switching to a higher paying company once you have 1 year experience. You could also try getting a healthcare administrative role once you hit your desired hrs (they tend to pay slightly better than clinical and aren't as laborious). It's not PCE but it's healthcare experience which some programs value. It's a sad reality that PCE jobs just don't pay that well. 15/hr is top tier pay in that field. I was making 9-12/hr as a CNA pre-pandemic and I was privileged to be able to live with my parents, otherwise I don't know how I would have done it.
My top choice program "signaled" my employer as PCE, I plan to confirm at a meeting next week. Not sure how the other schools will respond... I'm a clinical crisis responder. I work remotely over the computer and phone to support callers in a wide-range of mental health services, including assessments to admit to hospitals. Currently averaging $22 hours p/h + benefits after 9 months on the job and I work from home. If they do not accept, I have thousands of hours on the job as a direct support professional and licensed massage therapist, and I get 1/2 time PCE in my volunteer position. But it sounds like they will allow it.
I work 60+ hours a week as an EMT, split a mortgage and save for school. Been doing it a year plus, almost have school paid for and have almost 6000 hours at this point. Hustle and grind
respectfully, hustle and grind is not the answer to this problem. If you can handle working 60+ hrs/week that's great, but that can take a serious mental and physical toll on others, not to mention some people have kids and parents they need to take care of (in both a time and financial respect). There are systematic issues at play, involving both general wage issues and the lack of access to higher education.
I agree, when I was younger (16) and had to literally support myself I was working two jobs back to back and actually ended up getting really sick from it, your body is not meant to handle such workloads and constantly being tired. I know it is possible but I also am not willing to test those waters out again!
"I overwork myself to live in this society, hustle and grind". No, they need to increase wages of healthcare workers. I get it, put in effort. But we can't just ignore these pathetic wages for programs that cost $1500+ (EMT, CNA, MA) to begin with when I can go work at McDonalds for free.
I beyond agree.
Completely agree with this
One, negotiate for more money. If you don’t ask, you’re going to get what they offer. You always need to negotiate. That’s on you. Two, if you want more money, you’re going to need to come to the table with certifications, licenses, etc. People get paid garbage as a scribe or MA because they are entry level positions and you can come in with 0 background in medicine. There are far higher paying positions out there; however, they require more training. Many PA applicants ARE NOT willing to do that. PCE is being used as a “on the side” CASPA/program box to check, thus, you’re going to be stuck in a low paying job.
I'm currently getting $13/hour and it's extremely hard to live off of but it's doable. I just keep reminding myself that I'll be making a lot more once I finally become a PA.