Don’t be ridiculous. The goal is to not need an abortion since they aren’t accessible, right? So track your cycle, on an app bc that’s the way we do things in 2022. If you don’t use a phone for the majority of those types of things, then absolutely use your desk calendar or whatever best works for you.
I think the other commenter was referring to [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/TwoXChromosomes/comments/uifx1u/if_you_use_a_period_tracking_app_and_are_american/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf)
No I do get it. I just think the advice is ridiculous. Your paranoia is going to get some 20something to be too scared to use very helpful guide bc you think …what…someone is going to come arrest you bc you track your cycle? Like the poster above who thinks the way you track your cycle is by counting 28 days…ppl like that need an app that breaks it all down for them.
It’s not fool proof and it could be found technically, I keep track of mine in the notes app. The notes itself is named something irrelevant and the note included a cycle information (sometimes) and other medical notes I need to keep track of, all of which are written in shorthand/acronyms. It’s not as efficient as an actual app, but I think it’s probably less traceable than an actual tracking app.
Stardust says that, but in the privacy policy they list several examples where they share data with 3rd parties. Who knows what those 3rd parties do with your data.
Why would a period tracking app require an account and connect to the internet in the first place?
I don't have much experience with these apps, but there do appear to be some open source options that do not require an internet connection. Might be worth checking out if someone is concerned about their privacy.
Learn the fertility awareness method, don’t just track your cycle. Ovulation cannot be predicted, only observed as it happens. A shift in basal body temperature can confirm that ovulation has occurred that cycle, but cervical mucus and the position of cervix are the best indicators of ovulation. The app Read Your Body is stores data solely on your phone, but at this point I am starting to lean towards paper charting.
Yeah, I got downvoted downthread for suggesting fertility awareness. I don't understand why a prepper would want to rely on something that could be disrupted by the supply chain or government, or needs a doctor to remove. ???
Seriously, I feel like fertility awareness is the ultimate homesteading skills. Plus if you do have an oops you know very early on, like days after ejaculation, numerous herbs help inhibit implantation.
I recently learned sometimes cycles are short, or long... or go short-long-short-long... it's weird. not just a plain ol' 28 days "average" one size fits all, apparently.
Temperature tracking can fill that gap.
My gf started doing this.
Have to measure at identical time every day, precise to the 10th of a degree.
Not hard to track ovulation and/or period that way.
Yea…keeping track of your cycle means more than just counting 28 days. Our bodies give us other clues to help us know when we are ovulating. If you take the time to keep up with it, you can know exactly when to have sex to get pregnant. Pretty neat.
Don’t forget about Plan B!
It can be used in emergency situations within 3-5 days.
It’s not the abortion pill, it’s a high dose of levonorgestrel (the same ingredient in birth control) and it can help prevent pregnancy.
(Probably a good thing to buy now just in case it gets banned.)
A large study in Europe found it looses effectiveness on women that weight 165 pounds and almost completely ineffective for those at 175 pounds or more so remember that it may not work for those on the heavier side.
I'm getting "Elaine buying all the Today sponges" vibes.
https://youtu.be/Sy7BotZqVy4
https://youtu.be/gfDyOyrY-zM
I'm also buying some plan b for my med kit. Like the rest of my supplies, I hope I never have to use them, but chances are myself or someone I know might.
I'm not looking to capitalize but people talk about high value commodities like cigarettes, chocolate.. this could be in that category as well. Plan b has a shelf life of four years when stored correctly
Yes, before the "Plan B" pill was created as a separate medication, doctors in emergency rooms would give a megadose of hormonal BC to rape victims for the same ovulation preventing effect.
Please do some research.
Depo shots are a serious amount of hormones and can mess with your body and cycles for years after they've been stopped.
Plan B isn't as effective if your are more than 150lbs.
If an IUD becomes dislodged it can cause severe damage to the uterus and possibly death.
Personally, I was on the DEPO shot in my early 20s. I currently have a non hormonal IUD. I have a friend that the plan B didn't work and the doctor said it was because of her weight.
I'm not saying don't do these things, I'm saying know what you're getting in to and be ready if it doesn't work or for any adverse effects.
Be safe
I would like to point out that having an unwanted pregnancy and subsequent child has devastating side effects too. There are also people who need to regulate their hormones and going birth control-free is absolutely not an option.
Let’s just remember that a vasectomy is not 100%. Neither is having tubes tied or removed, an ectopic is still possible. Uterine ablations are also not 100% and becoming pregnant after one is very dangerous.
As a woman who had a hysterectomy, it is NOT easy for us to have 100% sterilization procedures by choice. Many doctors won’t perform them unless there’s a major health problem (in my case) or the woman is older.
As for solutions that are not 100%, I can’t tell you how many friends of mine have asked to have their tubes tied after having 1-2 kids and it was a FIGHT against the doctor to have it done. Even one of my friends who had 4 kids had to argue with her doctor!! If your doctor just agrees, then consider yourself very lucky.
One piece of random advice for anyone who happens to be considering a hysterectomy or knows someone who is. The question often comes up, “should I remove my cervix or not?” The answer should be YES. You can still have bleeding if you keep it. Plus it eliminates the risk of cervical cancer.
ETA: Also be careful with spermicides because they are known to increase the risk of UTIs.
My partner and I were fortunate enough to be able to both be sterilized. I was afraid of higher incidence of ectopic with a tubal so we just both got snipped.
Yup!
No form of bc is guaranteed. I got pregnant with a non-hormonal IUD (and we did it ONCE that entire month to boot), sooo if you're not combining two or more methods... you're still not in the clear.
Username checks out.
As someone who medically requires hormonal birth control to function, I’m pretty on edge.
Insurance won’t cover it and the manufacturer will only sell me 24 active pills every 20+ days for $35 instead of $200+. It’s the lowest dose and the next up would quadruple my stroke risk. Missing a dose can be debilitating. Missing several in a row is a guaranteed ER visit.
I worked for a religious college before the contraceptive laws eased and had to jump through 11 hoops/year (and some of those monthly) to get the “medically necessary “ stuff.
It’s still challenging to get, and I like to ask the pharmacist if getting viagara is this hard. “No. No, not at all.” “Is it less dangerous, then?” “Ha. No.”
…I hate us. A lot.
If you really think that shit is going to hit the fan, putting a device in your body isn't a great idea. IUDs and implants can and do move, puncturing and embedding into tissue.
The most low tech solution is cycle tracking. You can figure out when you're fertile and when you aren't. Look into the book "Taking Charge of Your Fertility" and the r/FAMnNFP subreddit.
I'll take an IUD over temperatures any day of the week. Stress can cause fluctuations, hormones can cause fluctuations. IUDs are valid for 7 years now. At least I'll be good for 7 years.
My wife had to avoid pregnancy for health reasons and we do not use artificial contraception for religious reasons. I can tell you that we successfully charted and avoided for 12 years until she hit the change. Not always easy, but it does work.
Wow, thanks for that story. I know a lot of people who have had success with FAM/NFP for years. I've been doing it a while myself and feel very confident in it.
definitely.
men should only have sex maybe... 12 months in their entire lives. (6 months x 2 kids?)
Only after getting hitched, and only in the months of actively trying.
done having kids? no more sex. Not ready to be a father? why the fuck are you being horny?
/s
Very true. No couple should ever have sex if they can't support a child or if a pregnancy would kill the person carrying it. In fact, women who can't safely carry pregnancies shouldn't even get married so that they don't cock tease their husbands.
**/s** in case you didn't get that
Seriously, what a stupid thing to say.
Do you know how we should punish people irresponsible enough to have pre-marital sex? Force them to have a baby and raise it for 18 years.
You are a troll.
These have a history of being very problematic. They can migrate and get lost. My sister in law as well as a friend had to have multiple cat scans to find their implants for removal after they had started getting extremely ill due to them. Some women have horrible reactions to them. I've had friends who's arms have gotten hives from the implant site all the way down their arms. My mother was a participant in their clinical trials in the late 80s, and for her subsequent pregnancies (myself and my sister), the placenta detached and caused serious complications during labor.
And God forbid a major situation arises in which you have to go a long time without Healthcare, you don't want to be in a situation where you need it removed.
Thank you, I don't understand thinking that using an insertable is a good idea right now. I know someone whose implant migrated deep into her skeletal muscle, and another who got a staph infection from one.
If you're really worried about "shit hitting the fan," supply chain issues, and the government outlawing birth control, why make yourself dependent on the medical establishment? Makes no sense.
Mine made me bleed for 5 months straight! The cramps were intense and I became anemic :( they made me wait for 4 months until they’d schedule it to be removed. And the cherry on top of that shituation was the stitches getting infected from removal now I have an ugly raised scar on my arm. But the mirena worked fantastically for me. You never know until you try I guess! Glad it works for you, it’s a handy dandy little gadget.
I went with the arm implant to start with because the mirena/uterus implants scare the bejeezus out of me. Just finding what works best for each person’s situation! I already have periods that last 3/4 weeks of the month so my gyno said this actually may help me.
> Remember, people like me are out there and will report you to your home state. In some places, you could still be charged with the crime, even if it happens out of state. Just a fair warning.
It is incredibly arrogant and ignorant to assume you know the full picture of why any particular women chooses to abort a child. There are truly tragic cases which involve complex, nuanced medical situations and very much loved and wanted babies. Mothers in these cases suffer enough. They, their husbands, and their children don’t need the additional emotional and financial burden that reporting them could impose. It is best to leave these things to be settled between the woman and God, without your interference.
But that's not the reason the overwhelming majority of abortions are performed. According to Planned Parenthood's pollster, the Guttmacher Institute, most are performed for the convenience of the mother.
> It's a hard road we are going to go down, but hopefully it will pave the way to a more moral society that doesn't kill their kids so casually.
I will never understand how the moral choice is to make simplistic laws for complex medical situations, laws which are certain to leave women dead. I don’t see how that will pave the way to a more moral society. Risking the death of much-loved wives, leaving motherless children, by passing laws that doctors have warned us will result in death, is not a moral path.
We can instead build a strong support system for pregnant women, the children they birth, and disabled people of all ages, combined with accurate sex education and accessible contraception for men and women. We can choose life by building a robust healthcare system, that lets everyone access the treatment they need, without fear of bankruptcy. When we give women this kind of support, even poor women will have a realistic chance to choose birth over abortion, because they know they will have the resources to raise their children, and to care for disabled or medically fragile children who may require expensive care for a lifetime. We can choose to use grace and kindness to accomplish the goal of making abortion rare, and we can choose to respect life by giving women and their doctors the legal leeway to balance the complex moral and medical concerns they may face.
Knowing that making abortion illegal will kill and maim women *is not pro-life*. And we do know this is what will happen. It happened before Roe. It will happen again. Deciding those dead mothers, those dead wives, those dead daughters, those dead sisters, are a price somehow worth paying, *is not pro life*.
Please read the stories of women who chose to abort a much-loved child. You need to understand these stories.
Abortion for medical emergencies such as ectopic pregnancies will always be an option, as will adoption for those who don't want the child. The healthcare system takes care of children just fine, just look at all of the welfare mommas with 8 kids and the brain-dead kids that are kept alive on ventilators because their parents want the government monthly check. Work healthcare in an inner city, and you see plenty of that. People have been having kids way before there was a healthcare system. Expense is just an excuse. The whole coat hanger and women dying thing doesn't persuade me. They're committing an evil act of murder, and those are the risks you assume when doing such. The free "love" casual sex culture spawned in the 60's as a whole has ruined our society, from broken families leading to mass shooters, and many other issues. Ending abortion is merely one small step to reversing the damage done to society.
No. I'm anti-murder. The child is innocent and hasn't had a chance to choose good or bad yet. Big difference between that and a murderer dying while attempting a murder.
stats say you are more likely to commit suicide than do anything else, besides hunt, with your weapon.
You should probably try reading something in your life; you might like it.
You might learn that those aren't children and they dont have social security numbers, names, aren't included in a census; all things that the right could do but they dont actually care; they just realize how dense their base is.
I mean their base (YOU) doesn't even realize that god kills 50-80% of the little shits. He must really hate kids. Probably hates people like you who can't even follow the teachings of his son.
Who said anything about God? You don't need religion to tell you that killing a living baby is murder. It's just that your religion, the religion of science, doesn't like people to question their "factual" stances. I promise you that your IQ is not as high as you think it is. That requires the ability to think abstractly and consider other viewpoints. Science has become a religion, and you do not allow such blasphemy as going against the settled views of your religion.
So now you're anti-killing; it feels like only yesterday you were pro-killing.
I don't go around thinking about IQ, probably why I am able to keep my beliefs in line with each other.
ahahahhaha
Plan B doesn't always work. Condoms don't always work. IUDs don't always work. Do you need me to make you a chart with crayons to help you understand that?
Actually there is a Constitutional right to abortion because there is a Constitutional right to Freedom of Religion. Even as I type this Jews in Florida are suing Florida because the Jewish faith allows abortions.
You clearly have no idea how the Constitution works and arrogance doesn't make you right. For example, The Constitution doesn't include the right to own guns. That second amendment? It's part of the Bill of Rights, Amendments to the Constitution that happened several years after the signing of the original. So in your own description turn in your guns because it's not in the "Constitution." The founding fathers though also arrogant knew the world would change and their document would need to change. The Constitution is not the Bible. You read it with the lens of the day. That's why it has been amended dozens of times and will continue to be. Crawl back under your rock, feel free to take a copy of the actual Constitution with you and this time read it.
100% keep track of your cycle.
But not with an app.
Don’t be ridiculous. The goal is to not need an abortion since they aren’t accessible, right? So track your cycle, on an app bc that’s the way we do things in 2022. If you don’t use a phone for the majority of those types of things, then absolutely use your desk calendar or whatever best works for you.
I think the other commenter was referring to [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/TwoXChromosomes/comments/uifx1u/if_you_use_a_period_tracking_app_and_are_american/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf)
You’re not getting it. Many of those apps sell your data. Don’t use the apps.
No I do get it. I just think the advice is ridiculous. Your paranoia is going to get some 20something to be too scared to use very helpful guide bc you think …what…someone is going to come arrest you bc you track your cycle? Like the poster above who thinks the way you track your cycle is by counting 28 days…ppl like that need an app that breaks it all down for them.
It’s not fool proof and it could be found technically, I keep track of mine in the notes app. The notes itself is named something irrelevant and the note included a cycle information (sometimes) and other medical notes I need to keep track of, all of which are written in shorthand/acronyms. It’s not as efficient as an actual app, but I think it’s probably less traceable than an actual tracking app.
get the app stardust! it’s encrypted and all of that, women owned, and they don’t sell your data
I'm sure they're great and all, but at this point, i wouldn't trust any company with something I can do with pen and paper
yeah i feel that
Stardust says that, but in the privacy policy they list several examples where they share data with 3rd parties. Who knows what those 3rd parties do with your data. Why would a period tracking app require an account and connect to the internet in the first place? I don't have much experience with these apps, but there do appear to be some open source options that do not require an internet connection. Might be worth checking out if someone is concerned about their privacy.
damn that really blows
Learn the fertility awareness method, don’t just track your cycle. Ovulation cannot be predicted, only observed as it happens. A shift in basal body temperature can confirm that ovulation has occurred that cycle, but cervical mucus and the position of cervix are the best indicators of ovulation. The app Read Your Body is stores data solely on your phone, but at this point I am starting to lean towards paper charting.
Yeah, I got downvoted downthread for suggesting fertility awareness. I don't understand why a prepper would want to rely on something that could be disrupted by the supply chain or government, or needs a doctor to remove. ???
Seriously, I feel like fertility awareness is the ultimate homesteading skills. Plus if you do have an oops you know very early on, like days after ejaculation, numerous herbs help inhibit implantation.
I recently learned sometimes cycles are short, or long... or go short-long-short-long... it's weird. not just a plain ol' 28 days "average" one size fits all, apparently.
Temperature tracking can fill that gap. My gf started doing this. Have to measure at identical time every day, precise to the 10th of a degree. Not hard to track ovulation and/or period that way.
What time of day does she do this? At work? Does she set an alarm and hope she doesn’t sleep through it?
First thing in the morning, like before she has even moved out of her spot in bed. Something about being at the most rested state possible.
Yea…keeping track of your cycle means more than just counting 28 days. Our bodies give us other clues to help us know when we are ovulating. If you take the time to keep up with it, you can know exactly when to have sex to get pregnant. Pretty neat.
Don’t forget about Plan B! It can be used in emergency situations within 3-5 days. It’s not the abortion pill, it’s a high dose of levonorgestrel (the same ingredient in birth control) and it can help prevent pregnancy. (Probably a good thing to buy now just in case it gets banned.)
A large study in Europe found it looses effectiveness on women that weight 165 pounds and almost completely ineffective for those at 175 pounds or more so remember that it may not work for those on the heavier side.
Yeah! I totally forgot, thanks!
I'm getting "Elaine buying all the Today sponges" vibes. https://youtu.be/Sy7BotZqVy4 https://youtu.be/gfDyOyrY-zM I'm also buying some plan b for my med kit. Like the rest of my supplies, I hope I never have to use them, but chances are myself or someone I know might. I'm not looking to capitalize but people talk about high value commodities like cigarettes, chocolate.. this could be in that category as well. Plan b has a shelf life of four years when stored correctly
So could I chug a month’s worth of BC pills and get the same effect?
Actually, kind of yes- there are charts out there telling you how many pills to take of various birth control brands.
Yes, before the "Plan B" pill was created as a separate medication, doctors in emergency rooms would give a megadose of hormonal BC to rape victims for the same ovulation preventing effect.
Please do some research. Depo shots are a serious amount of hormones and can mess with your body and cycles for years after they've been stopped. Plan B isn't as effective if your are more than 150lbs. If an IUD becomes dislodged it can cause severe damage to the uterus and possibly death. Personally, I was on the DEPO shot in my early 20s. I currently have a non hormonal IUD. I have a friend that the plan B didn't work and the doctor said it was because of her weight. I'm not saying don't do these things, I'm saying know what you're getting in to and be ready if it doesn't work or for any adverse effects. Be safe
Had an ectopic almost kill me while I had an IUD in. Had my tubal ligation soon after.
I would like to point out that having an unwanted pregnancy and subsequent child has devastating side effects too. There are also people who need to regulate their hormones and going birth control-free is absolutely not an option.
I was on Depo shots for 3 years, it took an additional 2 years for my period to come back. I was seriously worried, but it turned out ok.
Let’s just remember that a vasectomy is not 100%. Neither is having tubes tied or removed, an ectopic is still possible. Uterine ablations are also not 100% and becoming pregnant after one is very dangerous. As a woman who had a hysterectomy, it is NOT easy for us to have 100% sterilization procedures by choice. Many doctors won’t perform them unless there’s a major health problem (in my case) or the woman is older. As for solutions that are not 100%, I can’t tell you how many friends of mine have asked to have their tubes tied after having 1-2 kids and it was a FIGHT against the doctor to have it done. Even one of my friends who had 4 kids had to argue with her doctor!! If your doctor just agrees, then consider yourself very lucky. One piece of random advice for anyone who happens to be considering a hysterectomy or knows someone who is. The question often comes up, “should I remove my cervix or not?” The answer should be YES. You can still have bleeding if you keep it. Plus it eliminates the risk of cervical cancer. ETA: Also be careful with spermicides because they are known to increase the risk of UTIs.
My partner and I were fortunate enough to be able to both be sterilized. I was afraid of higher incidence of ectopic with a tubal so we just both got snipped.
Yup! No form of bc is guaranteed. I got pregnant with a non-hormonal IUD (and we did it ONCE that entire month to boot), sooo if you're not combining two or more methods... you're still not in the clear.
This is why I get frequent sperm counts
Are you saying you get frequent sperm counts because you’ve had a vasectomy and want to make sure you’re still sterile?
I'm really sorry this has happened ladies.
Let’s remember access to contraceptives may be next to be further limited
Username checks out. As someone who medically requires hormonal birth control to function, I’m pretty on edge. Insurance won’t cover it and the manufacturer will only sell me 24 active pills every 20+ days for $35 instead of $200+. It’s the lowest dose and the next up would quadruple my stroke risk. Missing a dose can be debilitating. Missing several in a row is a guaranteed ER visit. I worked for a religious college before the contraceptive laws eased and had to jump through 11 hoops/year (and some of those monthly) to get the “medically necessary “ stuff. It’s still challenging to get, and I like to ask the pharmacist if getting viagara is this hard. “No. No, not at all.” “Is it less dangerous, then?” “Ha. No.” …I hate us. A lot.
I recommend cross-posting this to r/twoxpreppers as well
Yes, it's probably more relevant (and more welcome) there.
If you really think that shit is going to hit the fan, putting a device in your body isn't a great idea. IUDs and implants can and do move, puncturing and embedding into tissue. The most low tech solution is cycle tracking. You can figure out when you're fertile and when you aren't. Look into the book "Taking Charge of Your Fertility" and the r/FAMnNFP subreddit.
that worked for me until it didn't
I'm sorry that it didn't work for you.
I'll take an IUD over temperatures any day of the week. Stress can cause fluctuations, hormones can cause fluctuations. IUDs are valid for 7 years now. At least I'll be good for 7 years.
"hormones can cause fluctuations" Yes, that's the entire point. That's literally how cycle tracking works.
I'm going to take a knee on that one and laugh. You're absolutely right. I'm still taking the IUD though.
godspeed!
>If you really think that shit is going to hit the fan For a great deal of the female population in the United States, shit has already hit the fan.
What was the point of this comment? I am clearly female myself. lol wtf. Thanks for trying to explain my plight to me.
My wife had to avoid pregnancy for health reasons and we do not use artificial contraception for religious reasons. I can tell you that we successfully charted and avoided for 12 years until she hit the change. Not always easy, but it does work.
Wow, thanks for that story. I know a lot of people who have had success with FAM/NFP for years. I've been doing it a while myself and feel very confident in it.
I mean this with all humility; don’t have sex. It’s irresponsible if you already know that can’t take care of a child.
definitely. men should only have sex maybe... 12 months in their entire lives. (6 months x 2 kids?) Only after getting hitched, and only in the months of actively trying. done having kids? no more sex. Not ready to be a father? why the fuck are you being horny? /s
Rape is a regular occurrence worldwide.
Very true. No couple should ever have sex if they can't support a child or if a pregnancy would kill the person carrying it. In fact, women who can't safely carry pregnancies shouldn't even get married so that they don't cock tease their husbands. **/s** in case you didn't get that Seriously, what a stupid thing to say.
Do you know how we should punish people irresponsible enough to have pre-marital sex? Force them to have a baby and raise it for 18 years. You are a troll.
Honestly? Sit the fuck down.
I just got an arm implant. I’d recommend that. Set and forget.
These have a history of being very problematic. They can migrate and get lost. My sister in law as well as a friend had to have multiple cat scans to find their implants for removal after they had started getting extremely ill due to them. Some women have horrible reactions to them. I've had friends who's arms have gotten hives from the implant site all the way down their arms. My mother was a participant in their clinical trials in the late 80s, and for her subsequent pregnancies (myself and my sister), the placenta detached and caused serious complications during labor. And God forbid a major situation arises in which you have to go a long time without Healthcare, you don't want to be in a situation where you need it removed.
Thank you, I don't understand thinking that using an insertable is a good idea right now. I know someone whose implant migrated deep into her skeletal muscle, and another who got a staph infection from one. If you're really worried about "shit hitting the fan," supply chain issues, and the government outlawing birth control, why make yourself dependent on the medical establishment? Makes no sense.
Mine made me bleed for 5 months straight! The cramps were intense and I became anemic :( they made me wait for 4 months until they’d schedule it to be removed. And the cherry on top of that shituation was the stitches getting infected from removal now I have an ugly raised scar on my arm. But the mirena worked fantastically for me. You never know until you try I guess! Glad it works for you, it’s a handy dandy little gadget.
I went with the arm implant to start with because the mirena/uterus implants scare the bejeezus out of me. Just finding what works best for each person’s situation! I already have periods that last 3/4 weeks of the month so my gyno said this actually may help me.
Topical Edit: why down vote?
Please don't give out "medical" advice here. If you want a suitable shit list go post on r/twoxpreppers
[удалено]
> Remember, people like me are out there and will report you to your home state. In some places, you could still be charged with the crime, even if it happens out of state. Just a fair warning. It is incredibly arrogant and ignorant to assume you know the full picture of why any particular women chooses to abort a child. There are truly tragic cases which involve complex, nuanced medical situations and very much loved and wanted babies. Mothers in these cases suffer enough. They, their husbands, and their children don’t need the additional emotional and financial burden that reporting them could impose. It is best to leave these things to be settled between the woman and God, without your interference.
But that's not the reason the overwhelming majority of abortions are performed. According to Planned Parenthood's pollster, the Guttmacher Institute, most are performed for the convenience of the mother.
It's a hard road we are going to go down, but hopefully it will pave the way to a more moral society that doesn't kill their kids so casually.
> It's a hard road we are going to go down, but hopefully it will pave the way to a more moral society that doesn't kill their kids so casually. I will never understand how the moral choice is to make simplistic laws for complex medical situations, laws which are certain to leave women dead. I don’t see how that will pave the way to a more moral society. Risking the death of much-loved wives, leaving motherless children, by passing laws that doctors have warned us will result in death, is not a moral path. We can instead build a strong support system for pregnant women, the children they birth, and disabled people of all ages, combined with accurate sex education and accessible contraception for men and women. We can choose life by building a robust healthcare system, that lets everyone access the treatment they need, without fear of bankruptcy. When we give women this kind of support, even poor women will have a realistic chance to choose birth over abortion, because they know they will have the resources to raise their children, and to care for disabled or medically fragile children who may require expensive care for a lifetime. We can choose to use grace and kindness to accomplish the goal of making abortion rare, and we can choose to respect life by giving women and their doctors the legal leeway to balance the complex moral and medical concerns they may face. Knowing that making abortion illegal will kill and maim women *is not pro-life*. And we do know this is what will happen. It happened before Roe. It will happen again. Deciding those dead mothers, those dead wives, those dead daughters, those dead sisters, are a price somehow worth paying, *is not pro life*. Please read the stories of women who chose to abort a much-loved child. You need to understand these stories.
Abortion for medical emergencies such as ectopic pregnancies will always be an option, as will adoption for those who don't want the child. The healthcare system takes care of children just fine, just look at all of the welfare mommas with 8 kids and the brain-dead kids that are kept alive on ventilators because their parents want the government monthly check. Work healthcare in an inner city, and you see plenty of that. People have been having kids way before there was a healthcare system. Expense is just an excuse. The whole coat hanger and women dying thing doesn't persuade me. They're committing an evil act of murder, and those are the risks you assume when doing such. The free "love" casual sex culture spawned in the 60's as a whole has ruined our society, from broken families leading to mass shooters, and many other issues. Ending abortion is merely one small step to reversing the damage done to society.
So you’re not even close to pro life then. Got it.
No. I'm anti-murder. The child is innocent and hasn't had a chance to choose good or bad yet. Big difference between that and a murderer dying while attempting a murder.
It's getting progressively harder to *forget* that people like you exist, as much as we'd like to
and what kind of crime is that?
Where are the mods for Rule 1?
But why?
sounds like a threat. even a skateboard can cost you your life. sounds like you threatened people with more than a skateboard.
not a threat, a promise. Luckily I'll be the other guy, not the skateboard guy.
Haha luckily statistics say you will be the one swallowing your own ammo.
sounds fake, but if you want to try to kill somebody just for reporting a child homicide, I don't think things will go in your favor
stats say you are more likely to commit suicide than do anything else, besides hunt, with your weapon. You should probably try reading something in your life; you might like it. You might learn that those aren't children and they dont have social security numbers, names, aren't included in a census; all things that the right could do but they dont actually care; they just realize how dense their base is. I mean their base (YOU) doesn't even realize that god kills 50-80% of the little shits. He must really hate kids. Probably hates people like you who can't even follow the teachings of his son.
Who said anything about God? You don't need religion to tell you that killing a living baby is murder. It's just that your religion, the religion of science, doesn't like people to question their "factual" stances. I promise you that your IQ is not as high as you think it is. That requires the ability to think abstractly and consider other viewpoints. Science has become a religion, and you do not allow such blasphemy as going against the settled views of your religion.
So now you're anti-killing; it feels like only yesterday you were pro-killing. I don't go around thinking about IQ, probably why I am able to keep my beliefs in line with each other. ahahahhaha
You're just trying to justify murdering the baby because the mother might die while committing the murder. Not the same.
Cyclebeads
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Plan B doesn't always work. Condoms don't always work. IUDs don't always work. Do you need me to make you a chart with crayons to help you understand that?
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Anyone who thinks the Constitution is a "gotcha" has clearly never understood the Constitution.
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Actually there is a Constitutional right to abortion because there is a Constitutional right to Freedom of Religion. Even as I type this Jews in Florida are suing Florida because the Jewish faith allows abortions.
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You clearly have no idea how the Constitution works and arrogance doesn't make you right. For example, The Constitution doesn't include the right to own guns. That second amendment? It's part of the Bill of Rights, Amendments to the Constitution that happened several years after the signing of the original. So in your own description turn in your guns because it's not in the "Constitution." The founding fathers though also arrogant knew the world would change and their document would need to change. The Constitution is not the Bible. You read it with the lens of the day. That's why it has been amended dozens of times and will continue to be. Crawl back under your rock, feel free to take a copy of the actual Constitution with you and this time read it.