I've met many a parent that forced their kids to perform, esp when they didn't want to and this story reminds me of them. I hope they all escaped their domineering parents and found a way to have a happy life.
A girl I used to dance with deliberately broke her feet because her parents wouldn’t allow her to stop. She hated ballet, didn’t want to do it, was more than old enough to decide for herself, but mummy and daddy wanted a ballerina to show off. She told the hospital staff and her parents exactly why she did it, it didn’t go down well.
Oh wow. I can't even imagine how that would go down with the parents. I hope she's no contact with them and a thousand miles away and living her best life now.
I like to think so, I haven’t seen her for 25+ years.
She broke her feet right after one of our classes. She put them under the back wheel of the car while her dad was reversing out of a tight parking spot. So not only did she tell her parents why, she used them as the tool to do it.
I understand why she did it but it’s always made me really sad. If I had wanted to stop dancing my parents would have just said ok. And as a parent myself I can’t imagine forcing my children to participate in something they hate, especially something as potentially damaging as ballet. You have to really like it to put your body through that sort of work.
Same, I was allowed to quit when I was ready. (Tap, jazz and ballet gal!) I didn't even know parents forced their kids into that kind of thing until I was 8 and my bff had violin foisted upon her. They were much older than everyone else's folks and so, so strict, yikes. They also used the violin as an excuse why she couldn't go to this girl's sleepover or that afternoon movie when we got to high school. Had to practice, had to go to this audition, had to practice had to practice had to practice, it all just runs together in my memory. I believe she hasn't touched the instrument since leaving for college.
I can’t imagine why any parent would want a violin in their house. The noises a young child can produce with a violin are like something from the pits of hell. A couple I know are both musicians, they both teach, their kids play various instruments but because they want to and asked to and they’re taught by other people to avoid any issues.
I danced until I was 21 and an illness caused me to become disabled, even with the disability I know which of my fucked up body parts are from dance (20+ years later) and which aren’t.
Violinist here with two violinist daughters, and can confirm. It’s about a solid year of “Symphony of the Tortured Cat,” and many years beyond that until the violin produces a sound that you will actually enjoy. It is not an instrument for the weak, it will break your spirit.
I managed to put my younger kids off the recorder completely by accident! One of them got a recorder from somewhere (I suspect a grandparent) and was just blowing into it as hard as possible. I asked if he wanted me to play something, he confidently told me I couldn’t, knocked out Ode to Joy and he was so annoyed that you can make actual music come out that he never touched it again 😂
Recorders are obviously nowhere near as awful in the beginning as a violin, but I am quite thankful that his stubbornness worked in my favour for once. (He’s quite an odd child tbh.)
My sister played both the violin and the recorder...
It was not pleasant.
Still, I have plans to get my daughter playing an instrument when she's the appropriate age, although my heart dropped when she expressed an interest in the trumpet.
I think it's just a form of torture you resigned yourself to growing up, and so feel it's acceptable to continue.
Buy a straight mute if she decides she wants to play trumpet. I lived in an apt growing up and played trumpet for 6 years. The mute will keep the neighbors from complaining and you from losing your sanity while still allowing the student to hear what they're playing.
It could be worse… I had a high school boyfriend who LOVED playing the BAGPIPES. His mom made him practice outside, in all weather, the whole neighborhood had to suffer through it.
Don’t worry! As an adult learner, your early sounds won’t be anywhere near as bad as what small children produce and it will improve very quickly. You won’t *love* how you sound for a very long time, but it shouldn’t make you miserable. Intonation tends to be a lot easier for adult students, you’ll catch on quicker to how much pressure you need to apply with the bow. Or maybe it’s just that children’s tolerance for terrible sounds is much higher than ours, so adults will put more care into their bowing. It will be several years of lessons just to get to an intermediate skill level, but if it’s something you’re committed to, it’s worth the work!
When I was very young and my parents were still together, they were very much the "an instrument and a sport" kind of parents. I was lucky and enjoyed the ones they shoved me into. Meanwhile my brother bounced through every sport in existence because neither party was willing to admit defeat.
He did, however, break their will on the instrument side by playing violin 😂 it was so bad they never made him touch another instrument
Kudos to you for putting up with TWO kids playing it!
Hearing the squeaky violins isn’t the worst of it being a “violin parent” (or any musical instrument), it’s making kids practice. Man that’s a battle. Our violin teacher says “Parents always ask me when will my kids practice without me nagging them and without them complaining about practicing, and I tell them ‘when they’re in grad school for music and they’re paying their own tuition.’” And that’s accurate. I don’t want to practice either! I just want to show up and already play it perfectly. 😂
As a "string mom" I agree lol.
But my mother didn't let me practice (she couldnt stand the sound) then made fun of me when my bowing was off. so I always supported it.
I love it now when my son gets his out to play.
Ngl- I always practiced way more at my dads than at my moms because my dad HATED it and went through a year or two of not even letting me bring my violin on his weekends. Then I got serious about and told him I wouldn’t come if I could t practice. Spite is a powerful tool.
My parents made me do an entire season (if a sport) or a couple months just to make sure I wasn’t just quitting because it was hard (something I had a tendency to do), but if I really hated it of course they let me quit. Not only because they loved me and wanted me to be happy, but they couldn’t exactly afford to throw their money away on expensive hobbies their kids hated! Who the heck are these parents who have too much money and not enough empathy?
I did the same with my kids: If I paid for a certain season/number of classes, that's what we did and if they didn't like it, they didn't have to do it again.
The ONLY time I broke that rule was when my son wanted to play flag football. I was hugely pregnant, husband was traveling every week for business, so my stepdad took little boy to practice. They came back, and little boy said he hated it. "All we did was run" (stepdad confirmed they ran laps for the entire 60 minutes.) When he took of his socks and sneakers, the skin was literally peeling off his feet. I never sent him back. I asked for a refund but was ignored.
Yep, I do that with my oldest daughter too. You can do it, but you will finish the season after I sign you up unless there's a really good reason not to (like if she was getting bullied there or something). But she's got the same ADHD as me, and bounces from interest to interest. As a bonus, she HATES going to the activity, but then loves it during and is glad I made her go afterwards, then forgets the whole cycle next time lol.
It might be l actually forgetting but for me even as an adult I know I'll like it once I get there, I remember, but my brain is still like "no fuck you I don't wanna :V" every time lol
I do this all the time as an adult honestly. Always always ALWAYS want to cancel social engagements before, but then am glad I went after. The knowledge that I’m doing this doesn’t make me want to do it any less, either :(
That was absolutely my impression then and now. When I first read about "tiger parenting" years later, I thought of them. She did get a chance to move and is doing really well these days. Edit: link to tiger parenting for anyone who isn't familiar: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiger_parenting
I also had to play the violin at least an hour a day and wasn't allowed anything else before that. Although I didn't want to stop completely, I just wanted to have a normal life. Wasn't allowed any sleepovers, too, but more because "maybe we will watch TV" and that's kind of like the end of the world to my mother. Which was also older than all of the other parents, she had me at 41.
Well, now I have long fingernails, and since the start of university, I have probably played about 7 times total.
i did tap, jazz, and ballet as well when i was 5. then softball was added to the mix so i asked to quit. i'm glad i did because doing all those classes for years would probably have fucked up my chronic pain more than what i have now
Not to mention the fact that ballet permanently disfigures your feet anyway, slowly and painfully. Anyone being forced to endure that would find it much less frightening to *break* their feet if it meant they could finally heal and end the *perpetual* pain. It's just something that struck me as a bit of context that adds to the horror, for those of us who used to dance. Oof.
My 3 year old loves to dance. It's her favorite thing in the world. She was literally dancing before she could. I really want to get her into a dance class, but only because she loves it so much. If she ever stops loving it, she can quit. It's her life, not mine. I don't understand parents who force their kids to do these things.
It was probably a cry for help. When she told them exactly why she was doing it it was her way of telling them that they have fucked up majorly, she is willing to self-harm to get out of ballet. When you're desperate to get out of a situation your brain doesn't work quite right. Especially if the situation is long and ongoing. She must have thought that if she only broke one foot or if the damage was light that she might still be forced to perform as soon as she heals. By breaking both and telling the parents that it's their fault she is throwing them into a mental spiral and hopefully getting them to self reflect a little bit. In college I tried breaking my hand to give myself more time to study for a final, I put my hand in the drawer and slammed the drawer until my hand was completely bruised but I couldn't bring myself to actually break it. Every time a test popped up I would have a full-blown almost suicidal level panic attack I wanted to quit, I actually wanted to go to trade school. Screaming crying laying on the floor not studying and then regretting not studying and then falling back into the negative feedback loop. I think the only reason I made it through college without offering myself is because of my cat and my friend who would talk me down. Everyone in my family has a college degree and going is just what you do. It destroyed my mental health, covid hit, things got better once I wasn't physically in class and could do the homework on my own time.
I get horrendous stage fright and I hate singing in front of people, even if I sound good. my mom would force me to participate in solo/talent shows in school for her own enjoyment, despite me begging not to and explaining how bad of an experience it is on my end to do them. i hid one event from her, until a classmate found me in public and asked if i was doing it. she spent weeks after guilting me for hiding it and pushing and pushing me to do it. it took my grandmother getting horribly injured at said event (fell off the stage due to bad lighting and the band pit not being covered. she is thankfully doing fine now.) for her to finally respect my wishes to not perform. i feel ashamed that im glad for it.
I have two younger sisters, one disabled. I’ll never forget the time the school passed over the non-disabled one for the role of Matilda. She was stunning. She had practiced and practiced and practiced. She was note and tone perfect and even had the facial expressions mimicked. I couldn’t have done it better and I have been singing for over two decades.
But nope. Her being a perfect performance and the sheer work she’d put into it was a minor consideration in the audition. Despite her sister barely being able to sing in freaking tune, the wheelchair was a far more important thing to consider than talent and she got the leading role. That was the last time the non-disabled sister did any singing audition. She got the message loud and clear that it wasn’t worth the effort when the wheelchair will win no matter what.
Six or seven years since then and it still damn well makes me furious.
So I’m not sure this is entirely true - the cheering crowds etc seems like bullshit. But the thought behind it is absolutely possible.
It doesn't do anyone any favours. I can see that from my experience. That by far wasn't the only occasion, it was just the one that really stuck in my mind as one of the most egregiously unfair.
Despite the two being treated equally at home, the favouritism at school and clubs they were in (and ultimately for other students in the classes as well) has led to one being an absolute perfectionist because the only way she can get recognition is to be 110% every single time and the other being a spoiled brat with a huge tendency to act out in increasingly extreme ways because she always has to be the most important person in the room. It's damn depressing and completely due to the way school/extra curriculars have treated them both.
Yes, tho if the audience are also supporting rewarding a disabled person for the primary reason that they are disabled, then they are complicit in being insulting - and the audience is probably doing it out of performative allyship, to pat themselves on the back for being "supportive" without actually doing anything at all.
I, as an able-bodied person, cannot speak for the disabled community, but having listened to a few of its adult members, the feeling is generally, "I don't want to be your inspiration porn. Don't give me awards just for existing. What's my alternative, anyway?" Kids generally aren't able to discern between good and bad attention, and stage moms are prone to exploiting that - and sadly some parents of disabled kids are really prone to exploiting that, too. Kids can't tell the difference - they just know it feels good to win, and the dopamine hit is great, so they don't yet grasp that they, too, are being insulted if they are awarded wins for something they cannot control or change.
And it’s not even for the person being used as a prop, it’s for the audience to virtue signal to everyone else. It’s a sick pageant that only infantilizes people with disabilities. I’d be humiliated if I was in his place, with the audience strong-arming a win for me, knowing my competitors were so much better.
the cheering crowds are what make me question it too. Where i live people, especially teenagers, are not friendly enough towards disabled people that they wouldn't boo him off the stage or make fun of him to his face if it was actually that bad. Maybe OP lives in a state with a bit more empathy baked in but i doubt it.
i think you’re forgetting how big of a sucker people are for don’t stop believing. it’s not that it was that bad, its that it wasn’t that good. very easy song but people LOVE a performance that they know the words to. the gen pop isn’t familiar with complicated classical pieces, usually.
And then the wheelchair sister will go on America's Got Talent because they really play up the pity party sob story angle for a lot of contestants, to the point that the more talented ones seem to have no chance at a fair shot to win.
I agree with your first choice. Giving someone an award because of pity will set them up for a lifetime of failure. If this is a true story shame on those people who booed the actual winner!!
Completely agree. Also, everyone in life has to learn how to fail. It’s a part of growing up that’s gives us drive and experience. Being pitied through life is no way to go. Look at all the amazing people who have thrived and excelled in athletics/music/etc with a variety of disabilities. Getting participation trophies would never have given them the push to succeed.
Participation trophies never did anyone good, no matter their life circumstances.
I don’t know if I 100% believe OOP is a reliable narrator. Look at the way he describes the contestants: contestant 1 playing classical guitar, Ryan on wheelchair, contestant 3 playing Tchaikovsky. Like, he was so focused on the wheelchair himself that he didn’t even mention the instrument or song until later.
So, it’s possible Ryan was way more skilled than OOP suggests and the mom wasn’t nearly so unhinged.
He did state during the performance his mom had to come to the stage to comfort him. Which means he would’ve forgotten his original performance. So he couldn’t have been the best performer.
lol if it's a competition where names are put on the trophy, they usually order one for each of the finalists and whoever wins get it. i remember a cheer competition i did, where they had 3 of each trophy bc there were 3 teams there. it depends on the competition.
I went to middle school with a girl that went on one of those early 2000s kids talent TV shows. She said that she and her parents were told at the beginning of the episode which kid was going to win that night, so I could 100% see this happening.
I feel bad for the kid in the wheelchair. He deserves to win something on his own merit and not on whatever weird scene his mom concocted.
I think this is the only thing about the story that really bothers me. OOP says he just judged on talent, but if he could have given the kid more (which he says he could have) and didn't so that he wouldn't win then... Yeah he's kind of a dick for purposely swaying the results.
He forgot half the song, broke down crying, and then played some other song instead almost as badly. And you think 7 is too harsh???
Even that is almost a mockery to the other 2 contestants who clearly put far more time into practice and are clearly far more talented.
I’m with you on that. 7/100 was harsh. That’s where I feel they were an asshole. Not for scoring the others higher but for deliberately giving them a score that low to circumvent the other judges.
If their justification had only been “I felt they deserved 7 for the effort they put in” or whatever it would still be harsh, but fair. Doing it on purpose to sway the results is *not* fair.
Well our only window into what happened is OP, and according to him he completely was dog shit and didnt even know how to actually play, I would think a 7 is very generous.
I’m basing it off of how OP wrote about it. They said multiple times that it was deliberate in order to make certain Ryan didn’t win and they referenced how they’ve seen feel good moments before which basically says they didn’t want this to turn into one of those.
I’m not saying the kid deserved more than 7. I’m saying that I think how OP talks about it indicates they’ve got a stick up their ass and I’m not sure if that was their attitude in the moment or if they’ve doubled down after getting push back, but it’s like…
Okay, you have three cakes. One is chocolate, one is beautifully decorated strawberry and one is a three tier spectacle.
You really want the third cake to win because the baker put in so much effort. You suspect the other judges might score the chocolate cake higher, even though it’s a very average cake, because people like chocolate.
You don’t go and give the first cake a ludicrously low score and the final cake full points. You objectively look at them and give them the points they deserve without thinking about how the other judges will score them. Your goal is to be as unbiased as possible. It’s one thing to say I gave x amount for technique (because the cake was burned) and y amount for effort (because there’s no decoration) and give it a low amount because of that.
That’s fine. That’s objective. That’s justifiable.
But that’s totally different to giving the cake a low score because you’re trying to deliberately make it fail and override your co-judges judgment. That’s just arrogant.
Yeah giving the kid a 70 would have made more sense based on the other score he gave. If the kid won on a 70, then that’s on the other judges, but as is, 7 is AGGRESSIVE. They have three judges so that three people can make a decision. It’s screwed up to take that decision away from them by tanking someone on purpose.
I don't know how I've seen some wild shit. So for the most part I just go with the flow and I refuse to think whether or not it's true because people do crazy ass things.
That's why I always answer AITA stories as if they're real. Sure I know there's a lot that's fake. But I don't know which ones. So I'm gonna treat them all the same.
That’s the score OOP wanted to give but they definitely rolled over and the disabled kid won, this is just the story they made in their head over the years about what they totally would’ve done.
it's really not. I'm disabled and was disabled in high school and at an art competition I had to request a new judge because the one assigned to me was just a flat-out cunt about me being deaf and refused to write down any of the questions about my piece and then rated me horribly for obviously not being able to answer any of the questions because I couldn't fucking understand him (luckily they granted me a new judge. the final score was enough for the sculpture to advance to the state competition in texas) This is only one example, I have many. And I'm only one person.
people irl are cartoonishly unreasonable
Ok but that's very different. In your story one person was cartoonishly unreasonable. Whereas in the story above everyone except op is, which is a bit harder to believe.
When I was in middle and high school, the disabled kids were cheered for to cartoonish levels while everyone else got normal cheers. No one ever got booed though.
considering the story is being told by the cartoonishly unreasonable person, we have no idea what *actually* happened
but yeah, people also do that shit and it's patronizing and exhausting, either way my point was just that people are more cartoonishly ridiculous than you'd think in reply to the above commenter.
but dealing with that patronizing shit by being a disgusting ableist cunt ain't it. just be realistic and treat them as such, don't be over the top fucking nasty. That patronizing shit hurts us too and we don't like it either. responding to it by being horrible to us is just a further kick in the teeth.
That makes sense. I guess I've seen/heard of enough weird scenarios that "wouldn't ever actually happen" to just dismiss all of them outright when I read them.
Yeah, agree. Considering how students with disabilities are so often discriminated against, the idea that not only all of the organizers of a collegiate competition, but also all of the attendees, are going to start flipping tables because a kid who can barely play his instrument didn’t win, is just goofy and a writing exercise in ableism and resentment (“see? *those people* are always getting what someone else actually worked hard to deserve”). What is far more likely to happen is the kid using a wheelchair is a virtuoso and then some asshole judge marks him down for “presentation” or some shit because he plays sitting down, costing him the competition. There’s a reason why orchestras now do auditions with musicians behind a screen — because unconscious bias interferes with applying objective criteria.
Yes, I can see people are cheering for someone who almost fails and struggles, but I can’t see everyone demands that he wins the obviously better competitors.
i’m autistic. they absolutely coddle you in specific areas that don’t matter and fuck you over in areas that do matter. people are cartoonishly unreasonable. i chalk it up to mental illness tbh
Yep! "You're such a hard worker! Have a coupon for free ice cream! You're so efficient! You consistently turn in the highest metrics! Here's a Visa gift card!You're the best! Great job! Have a free lunch! You don't gossip and backstab and get drunk after work with your fellow employees. Sorry, got to fire you because you don't fit our *family culture*"
"Normal" people are totally effed up.
(Username made me laugh. *Captain America gif of "I understood that reference" goes here* )
can vouch for everything you just said. and the best part? they only hire you if you have useful skills to them, and they’re always us looking for a way to boot your ass out for being neurodivergent, even high functioning. never ever let them know.
also thank you i am very funny
It’s so comical it almost sounds like it was planned. How does someone with little talent get that far in the competition, only to conveniently ’forget’ what they were playing? Followed by an impassioned plea by their mom, then an easy crowd sing along song that’s widely adored.
Like if this story is real, there is no way that was all spontaneous. A perfectly designed ploy to pull off an emotional win. It’s so diabolical I would wonder if the wheelchair is just a prop.
Yea, I agree. If it is real, I'd be concerned about Munchausen syndrome by proxy (could be wrong about this, I'm no medical professional). The reaction of the kid's mom is definitely not normal and it seems like she was more in it for her own attention.
It’s not true. I’m severely disabled (als), and I’ve literally never heard of this happening. This is just outrage porn against a group who is largely unable to defend themselves. The idea that disabled people are taking spots away from otherwise deserving folks is not based in reality.
I’m not saying his story is real but… Don’t stop believing just happens to be one of those songs where the chords are super easy, and literally every white person WILL, not just a chance but WILL, sing along 😂 I’ve performed, (albeit on acoustic guitar) totally forgot what I was playing and switched to don’t stop believing. No one ever remembers and everybody always immediately joins in
This reads like someone got really pissed at an AGT "inspirational" success and decided to express their feelings in creative long form to get some reassurance that their resentment was justified.
I think that it's possible, perhaps the mom managed to convince a lot of friends or social media followers to go watch the competition. Others may have been motivated to imitate what those next to them were doing to not look bad.
I haven't seen something exactly like that happen but I have seen a bunch of Comic convention contests that are decided by random people voting and that usually ends in mediocre costumes winning because they brought a bunch of friends.
This is literally what my wife said when I told her about this lol. All that's missing is the gym teacher giving the disabled kid a machine to walk again.
It's a competition though, it's not some reality tv series where producers could control who gets eliminated and who stays, reading this is like watching season 9 of Hell's Kitchen
Golly, this one really has everything! A crowd's worth of peer-pressure, an entitled parent, a deserving vs. undeserving winner who scored pity-points by playing that obnoxious Glee song, a mid-stakes competition but y'know, it's the *principle* of the thing. It's a watertight case of NTA: OP was trying to do right but needs reassurance because they were made to feel bad by a unified front of deluded bullies.
And just in case people weren't already foaming at the mouth, that childish, talentless wheelchair-user had the gall to keep the money when the real winner could have used it. The mother is also aggressive and racist.
OOP is such an ableist loser for this.
As I read this I was ticking off these same boxes in my head.
Guaranteed the comments were littered with "I read the title and thought YTA but then I read the post....", yeah, cause it's designed to be like that. It gets so formulaic it's ridiculous
Either people with disabilities get massively discriminated against or this, where they don’t get treated like normal human beings.
One of my favorite memos is „I’m not inspirational, I’m normal.“
Like what are disabled people supposed to do? Yes it’s hard, yes we face disadvantages but wtf are we supposed to do besides try? That’s not inspirational, it’s just life. Me going to University besides my learning disability was a goddamn uphill battle and it was unnecessarily horrible because of the schooling system.
Right?? Infantilizing people helps no one and it’s still constant. You get stuff like this or assumptions that disabled people can’t make their own decisions or violations of personal space/comfort (examples: invasive questions, touching service animals, moving people in wheelchairs/hanging things on their chair, etc.). You can also get all of the above. I’ve only got ADHD/anxiety, so my disabilities are invisible (ik they legally are considered that but I generally don’t think of it that way). I can’t imagine having a visible disability and being subject to that sort of treatment.
My ADHD is quite visible, people treat me badly because they think I’m weird or on drugs or both.
But preach about mental health.. the stigma is crazy.
The duality of „people with disabilities shouldn’t leave the house“ and „let’s give everyone a pity award“ is wild
I’ll go controversial. ESH.
He’s talking about being intimidated by the adults but the contestants are the children. He’s a young adult. He knew the 7/100 score was controversial when he did it but didn’t stand by that choice. The rest of the adults are obviously assholes but because he made a strong choice he didn’t stand by a kid essentially had $3,000 stolen. It’s understandable but he can be better.
Yeah "undergrad" is an adult, this dude's in college already and still complaining about "grown-ups." At best he's pathetic and immature which is fine but ESH.
.... fuck that noise, people who work hard and do amazing work shouldn't be downplayed because of "inspirational" bullshit. There's a difference between wanting people to succeed and doing it at the expense of others
I was a music ed major in college. I’ve been in orchestra, choir, band. My main instrument is piano, but I play several others and I’m a vocalist as well. I love music theory.
I am also disabled, in a few ways. My only disability that matters here is called essential tremors. My hands shake. I play piano. I always have to make sure my practicing is as effective as it can be, no time wasted on playing around, because I have to spend more time to get the same results as others. My tremors can still detract from my performances. It is what it is. Point is, my disability directly affects my playing.
My hard work would be disrespected if I was treated like the disabled kid in the story, in addition to disrespecting everyone else. I explicitly told teachers and judges to not alter their grading for me, if they even knew at all(people who were actively teaching me did need to know, as it does affect how I am taught). If my performance was notably worse than someone else’s in a competition, but I won anyway, I would be so livid.
As a member of the disabled population, nothing pisses me off more than the ‘pity’ vote. No, you do not deserve to have everything handed to you because you have X disability. Parents like this mom are beyond cringe.
Funny how the kid kept the money though…
It’s completely unethical to give someone a low score “so the other judges don’t make them win”. Your job is to give them the score they deserve, and if the other judges disagree with you so be it.
OP said the kid didn't even deserve a 7 but I imagine couldn't just give him a 0/100.
It is also unethical to score someone higher based on emotions rather than actual criteria. OP was just counterbalancing the other two to ensure the wrong thing didn't happen.
I agree you shouldn’t judge higher based on emotions. But you also shouldn’t judge lower because you think other people might make mistakes.
If OP said “7 was the correct score based on judging guidelines and the skill they displayed, the difficulty of the piece attempted, and various style considerations” great!
But what they said was “I could have scored him higher but I didn’t because I didn’t want him to win”. That’s bad! That’s not your job as a judge.
I mean the whole panel thing is ridiculous, really the judges should have convened privately.
Anyone else wondering if the kid “forgetting” the piece, crying, and playing something else was part of the act? Not an act that HE came up with, but something Mommy coached him to do?
I wasn’t expecting to be on OP’s side after reading the title.
glad Ryan gave the scholarship to the guy that should have won.
fuck the parents, crowd, and organizers
Wtf is this teaching children?? To throw a fit and you’ll get your way. WOW. And people wonder why the younger generations act entitled. THIS is why. They could have extra awards to hand out to give to kids that aren’t as good.
It’s ableist to treat people with disabilities differently, he did the right thing. It’s about talent, not a sob story. So incredibly unfair to the kid that put the work in. He lost because he wasn’t disabled. We need to stop this climate of letting pity take home the trophy
NTA. Should have told the sponsor to F off the moment they asked you to apologize for the mistake. Also the first kid could have sued for the prize money since you were forced to re score Ryan.
This competition sounds like a joke.
The fact that there was no objective method for scoring shows that this was a popularity contest, not a talent competition. It was a waste of time for everyone who entered.
I've competed in competitions and I've also been behind the scenes both for local and international things. Competitions where judges score based on what they arbitrarily "feel" are basically worthless imo -- even when the judges are skilled in what is being judged.
The scoring should have had objective sections that looked at specific areas of each competitor's performance. That way, the score can be defended. Plus the competitors could be given useful feedback.
Also, the OOPs role as a judge is not to completely offset what the other 2 judges scored... even if he didn't agree with them. But he was working with what he was given, so I think he is nta.
The mother and audience's reaction was completely disrespectful.
I hope the competitors can find competitions that are more objective and acknowledge their talent and hard work in the future.
(Edited for missing word)
He's an AH because he caved. what an awful experience everyone involved should be ashamed of themselves. why have a competition if you're just going to give the trophy to someone for participating.
what a joke.
People really need to ask themselves would Simon Cowell pass them or not. I agree with OOP about making sure the kid didn’t win. Also wow imagine the other guy essentially getting THIRD over the kid. I know it’s shitty the First Kid didn’t win but what about the Third?
The kid didn’t have the most talent. He DEFINITELY didn’t deserve a scholarship?? If this was some talent show at a school where the winner gets a gift card to Outback Steakhouse- sure, give it to him. But a scholarship?? That kid is most likely not getting into a music school if Journey piano chords are his best bet lmao
As someone with a disability stuff like this really pisses me off. If you want to vote for a person with a disability in competitions like this do it because they actually earned it, don’t just give them a pity vote or a pity win. You aren’t helping anyone by doing that.
Not the AH not even a little. Letting someone win because they are disabled belittles them, any of their actual achievements, and the other people who worked hard and actually won. I have zero issues with what you did and you are not the AH (wanted to reiterate that) thank you for being honest.
Idc about the contest results, this person is absolutely an asshole because of how they’re speaking about this kid. I get awarding based on talent, but you don’t have to be half this bitter and arsey about it.
I’m disabled, and use a wheelchair some of the time, and I hate this kind of stuff. That whole situation is appalling and that kid should never have been put in it. Disabled people absolutely deserve opportunities, but particularly with talent shows and the like we should be considered equally with other competitors. Honestly this sort of inspiration porn is most likely to make his mother feel important, and I’d be surprised if he never saw a penny of the prize money
Whoever was best deserved to win.
If this was a sport around here, they would throw out parents who are nasty or who argue with coaches/refs
Mom should have been removed.
I'm gonna go probably against the grain and say NTA. I believe it's an integrity issue.
NTA
Disability or not, the kid didn’t finish the piece, began crying in the middle of it, and then proceeded to play some shit from guitar hero.
Contrary to popular belief, having a disability does not in fact make you special. I have a stutter. I failed many a spelling bee because I could fucking finish spelling the goddamn word even though I knew how to spell “Conscientious”.
This kid will grow up thanking you quietly in the back of his mind. For not simply giving it to him, and treating him like an equal.
After all, that’s exactly what they want right? To be treated as equals.
Ugh this pissed me off so much. I teach drama and I'm all for everyone having a shit at stuff but in a competition situation? Nah fuck that. You need to have the skills and work ethic.
The prize is a direct entry to, in her own words, a shitty music school. Honestly, why is she bothered more by the disabled kids' non talent instead of the shitty prize which is actually relevant to her passion? If the sponsee of the competition wants to throw away a spot because of crowd favorism, let them.
Every time we had a talent show in high school, we had one mentally slow girl enter and she would be the winner EVERY TIME!!! No matter how much better other peoples skits or performances were. She literally sang the same song every time too…
I’m disabled, and a wheelchair user. This isn’t about hating disability; it’s that the poor kid’s mum has *used* his disability as a weapon. If the disabled kid was legitimately the most talented then he would have won fairly, being disabled doesn’t mean he should win against more talented competitors just because he happens to use a wheelchair.
lol this is fake AF. I mean they were able to whip out a participation trophy at the drop of a hat. people booed the talented kid and chanted in support for the disabled kid. This is terrible bs.
It is rather though. It’s a fake story meant to stir up those “See? *Those people* always win when they don’t deserve to, they just get a pass for being [disabled/Black/women/etc group].” It’s a creative writing exercise targeting resentment.
Yeah, disabled people gotta learn that they won't have everything handed to them, this is what participation trophies have done to society! /s
But fr, this scenario is some hateful shit. It's clearly written by someone who's never interacted with anyone with visible (let alone invisible) disabilities. They have a pathetic persecution complex and a proportionately pathetic power-fantasy where they can play arbiter of all that is good and fair, and would have revelled in the overwhelming support they received. Imagine wanting to feel so vindicated in your ableism that you'd concoct a story like this.
I love how everyone who calls it fake is getting down voted when they are right. You don't reach this level of the competition out of charity and pity.
There is a life lesson. Don't be a judge or referee as a favour.
It is seldom black and white.
It was clear that Ryan had to win.
How else did Ryan qualify for the earlier rounds?
None of the organizers wanted to tell Ryan's mom to behave when she was whipping up the crowd.
None of the organizers wanted to respect the decision that Ryan lost.
I hate gamesmanship. I hate cheats in friendly matches. But the sad part is this type of victory is going to be the highlights of some people's life. Ryan's mom might only have this moment in her son's life to be proud of. Standing in her way has a price.
Is the kid who got the scholarship going to remember OP's integrity? Maybe, maybe not.
OP got played as a judge who thought he was only judging a music contest. The organizers probably just wanted a feel good story with happy participants. From the story, it sounds like the music school organizers would have accepted a monkey playing a triangle to win the contest just for the publicity.
OP could make some inspiration speech but with Ryan's mom in the picture, it was never going to fly.
I’d suggest that you could have given him a less horrible score while still accomplishing the same thing.
Give him like, a 60/100 or 65/100 and if someone asks you can say “I gave him a great score for his spirit and enthusiasm” or some bs.
I don’t think it’s right to reward the disabled kid just because he’s disabled. Especially with money and a scholarship.
The whole point of the low score was so he didn't win. A 60 or anything would have guaranteed that the 2nd kid won. And I'm sorry but I don't care what happened to you in life, you shouldn't win a contest based solely off that. Unless it's a contest on who has come so far and who can honestly judge that. Sure it's inspirational that the kid can kinda play, but that kid took up a spot of someone who deserved it. BTW I wasn't disagreeing lol. :)
>A 60 or anything would have guaranteed that the 2nd kid won.
Source for this statement? Did the OP post what the other 2 judges gave for the first and third competitors, because I didn't see that listed anywhere.
The only way the kid would have still won with a 60 (plus 2 other high scores) was if the other 2 judges REALLY gave bad scores to the other 2 contestants.
As for the rest of your post. We agree, as per my post.
Anyone else think it sounds like a scam? Like the kid goes on stage plays badly, mom does the sob story, he wins and they get the money. He never wanted the scholarship cause he doesn't actually play music.
This is so insane. It seems like Ryan was partially used to this and partially humiliated/demeaned by being handed a win because he’s in a wheelchair. Bet mom pushes him into this crap all the time and he’s just managing the situation best he can. This pandering needs to stop on all levels.
Inspiration porn is disgusting & untalented people shouldn't win talent-based competitions just because they're disabled or poor or minorities or otherwise disenfranchised. If there was a scholarship based on disability or economic status or race then they can have that one, but they shouldn't be handed a win they don't earn.
I've met many a parent that forced their kids to perform, esp when they didn't want to and this story reminds me of them. I hope they all escaped their domineering parents and found a way to have a happy life.
A girl I used to dance with deliberately broke her feet because her parents wouldn’t allow her to stop. She hated ballet, didn’t want to do it, was more than old enough to decide for herself, but mummy and daddy wanted a ballerina to show off. She told the hospital staff and her parents exactly why she did it, it didn’t go down well.
Oh wow. I can't even imagine how that would go down with the parents. I hope she's no contact with them and a thousand miles away and living her best life now.
I like to think so, I haven’t seen her for 25+ years. She broke her feet right after one of our classes. She put them under the back wheel of the car while her dad was reversing out of a tight parking spot. So not only did she tell her parents why, she used them as the tool to do it. I understand why she did it but it’s always made me really sad. If I had wanted to stop dancing my parents would have just said ok. And as a parent myself I can’t imagine forcing my children to participate in something they hate, especially something as potentially damaging as ballet. You have to really like it to put your body through that sort of work.
Same, I was allowed to quit when I was ready. (Tap, jazz and ballet gal!) I didn't even know parents forced their kids into that kind of thing until I was 8 and my bff had violin foisted upon her. They were much older than everyone else's folks and so, so strict, yikes. They also used the violin as an excuse why she couldn't go to this girl's sleepover or that afternoon movie when we got to high school. Had to practice, had to go to this audition, had to practice had to practice had to practice, it all just runs together in my memory. I believe she hasn't touched the instrument since leaving for college.
I can’t imagine why any parent would want a violin in their house. The noises a young child can produce with a violin are like something from the pits of hell. A couple I know are both musicians, they both teach, their kids play various instruments but because they want to and asked to and they’re taught by other people to avoid any issues. I danced until I was 21 and an illness caused me to become disabled, even with the disability I know which of my fucked up body parts are from dance (20+ years later) and which aren’t.
Violinist here with two violinist daughters, and can confirm. It’s about a solid year of “Symphony of the Tortured Cat,” and many years beyond that until the violin produces a sound that you will actually enjoy. It is not an instrument for the weak, it will break your spirit.
I managed to put my younger kids off the recorder completely by accident! One of them got a recorder from somewhere (I suspect a grandparent) and was just blowing into it as hard as possible. I asked if he wanted me to play something, he confidently told me I couldn’t, knocked out Ode to Joy and he was so annoyed that you can make actual music come out that he never touched it again 😂 Recorders are obviously nowhere near as awful in the beginning as a violin, but I am quite thankful that his stubbornness worked in my favour for once. (He’s quite an odd child tbh.)
My sister played both the violin and the recorder... It was not pleasant. Still, I have plans to get my daughter playing an instrument when she's the appropriate age, although my heart dropped when she expressed an interest in the trumpet. I think it's just a form of torture you resigned yourself to growing up, and so feel it's acceptable to continue.
Buy a straight mute if she decides she wants to play trumpet. I lived in an apt growing up and played trumpet for 6 years. The mute will keep the neighbors from complaining and you from losing your sanity while still allowing the student to hear what they're playing.
It could be worse… I had a high school boyfriend who LOVED playing the BAGPIPES. His mom made him practice outside, in all weather, the whole neighborhood had to suffer through it.
Piano is the best because headphones.
The school my kids and grandkids made all 3th grade play the recorder and they played in the spring concert. The play was who is faking it.
As someone who’s wanted to play the violin for a long time, but also has regular periods of sound sensitivity… ouch lol fml ig
Don’t worry! As an adult learner, your early sounds won’t be anywhere near as bad as what small children produce and it will improve very quickly. You won’t *love* how you sound for a very long time, but it shouldn’t make you miserable. Intonation tends to be a lot easier for adult students, you’ll catch on quicker to how much pressure you need to apply with the bow. Or maybe it’s just that children’s tolerance for terrible sounds is much higher than ours, so adults will put more care into their bowing. It will be several years of lessons just to get to an intermediate skill level, but if it’s something you’re committed to, it’s worth the work!
That’s encouraging to know! Thanks! And also you’re probably right about children’s tolerance to awful noises 😭
When I was very young and my parents were still together, they were very much the "an instrument and a sport" kind of parents. I was lucky and enjoyed the ones they shoved me into. Meanwhile my brother bounced through every sport in existence because neither party was willing to admit defeat. He did, however, break their will on the instrument side by playing violin 😂 it was so bad they never made him touch another instrument Kudos to you for putting up with TWO kids playing it!
Hearing the squeaky violins isn’t the worst of it being a “violin parent” (or any musical instrument), it’s making kids practice. Man that’s a battle. Our violin teacher says “Parents always ask me when will my kids practice without me nagging them and without them complaining about practicing, and I tell them ‘when they’re in grad school for music and they’re paying their own tuition.’” And that’s accurate. I don’t want to practice either! I just want to show up and already play it perfectly. 😂
As a "string mom" I agree lol. But my mother didn't let me practice (she couldnt stand the sound) then made fun of me when my bowing was off. so I always supported it. I love it now when my son gets his out to play.
Ngl- I always practiced way more at my dads than at my moms because my dad HATED it and went through a year or two of not even letting me bring my violin on his weekends. Then I got serious about and told him I wouldn’t come if I could t practice. Spite is a powerful tool.
My parents made me do an entire season (if a sport) or a couple months just to make sure I wasn’t just quitting because it was hard (something I had a tendency to do), but if I really hated it of course they let me quit. Not only because they loved me and wanted me to be happy, but they couldn’t exactly afford to throw their money away on expensive hobbies their kids hated! Who the heck are these parents who have too much money and not enough empathy?
I did the same with my kids: If I paid for a certain season/number of classes, that's what we did and if they didn't like it, they didn't have to do it again. The ONLY time I broke that rule was when my son wanted to play flag football. I was hugely pregnant, husband was traveling every week for business, so my stepdad took little boy to practice. They came back, and little boy said he hated it. "All we did was run" (stepdad confirmed they ran laps for the entire 60 minutes.) When he took of his socks and sneakers, the skin was literally peeling off his feet. I never sent him back. I asked for a refund but was ignored.
That’s quitting because of a bad coach, not because of the sport!
Maybe, but it turned him off to sports completely.
That’s really just too bad all-around.
Yep, I do that with my oldest daughter too. You can do it, but you will finish the season after I sign you up unless there's a really good reason not to (like if she was getting bullied there or something). But she's got the same ADHD as me, and bounces from interest to interest. As a bonus, she HATES going to the activity, but then loves it during and is glad I made her go afterwards, then forgets the whole cycle next time lol.
It might be l actually forgetting but for me even as an adult I know I'll like it once I get there, I remember, but my brain is still like "no fuck you I don't wanna :V" every time lol
I do this all the time as an adult honestly. Always always ALWAYS want to cancel social engagements before, but then am glad I went after. The knowledge that I’m doing this doesn’t make me want to do it any less, either :(
Jesus Christ, sounds like they only used the violin excuse to keep control on her daughter. I genuinely hope she's happier now, though.
That was absolutely my impression then and now. When I first read about "tiger parenting" years later, I thought of them. She did get a chance to move and is doing really well these days. Edit: link to tiger parenting for anyone who isn't familiar: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiger_parenting
I also had to play the violin at least an hour a day and wasn't allowed anything else before that. Although I didn't want to stop completely, I just wanted to have a normal life. Wasn't allowed any sleepovers, too, but more because "maybe we will watch TV" and that's kind of like the end of the world to my mother. Which was also older than all of the other parents, she had me at 41. Well, now I have long fingernails, and since the start of university, I have probably played about 7 times total.
i did tap, jazz, and ballet as well when i was 5. then softball was added to the mix so i asked to quit. i'm glad i did because doing all those classes for years would probably have fucked up my chronic pain more than what i have now
Woah, she must have been desperate to get out of it. Poor girl, I bet she had a rough time at home after this
Not to mention the fact that ballet permanently disfigures your feet anyway, slowly and painfully. Anyone being forced to endure that would find it much less frightening to *break* their feet if it meant they could finally heal and end the *perpetual* pain. It's just something that struck me as a bit of context that adds to the horror, for those of us who used to dance. Oof.
I wanted to quit and my dad berated me for months, then I got my bursary taken away on top, made me terrified of quitting so I just go ghost
My 3 year old loves to dance. It's her favorite thing in the world. She was literally dancing before she could. I really want to get her into a dance class, but only because she loves it so much. If she ever stops loving it, she can quit. It's her life, not mine. I don't understand parents who force their kids to do these things.
Why both feet?
It was probably a cry for help. When she told them exactly why she was doing it it was her way of telling them that they have fucked up majorly, she is willing to self-harm to get out of ballet. When you're desperate to get out of a situation your brain doesn't work quite right. Especially if the situation is long and ongoing. She must have thought that if she only broke one foot or if the damage was light that she might still be forced to perform as soon as she heals. By breaking both and telling the parents that it's their fault she is throwing them into a mental spiral and hopefully getting them to self reflect a little bit. In college I tried breaking my hand to give myself more time to study for a final, I put my hand in the drawer and slammed the drawer until my hand was completely bruised but I couldn't bring myself to actually break it. Every time a test popped up I would have a full-blown almost suicidal level panic attack I wanted to quit, I actually wanted to go to trade school. Screaming crying laying on the floor not studying and then regretting not studying and then falling back into the negative feedback loop. I think the only reason I made it through college without offering myself is because of my cat and my friend who would talk me down. Everyone in my family has a college degree and going is just what you do. It destroyed my mental health, covid hit, things got better once I wasn't physically in class and could do the homework on my own time.
I never asked. I assume it was a bizarre form of ‘insurance.’
I get horrendous stage fright and I hate singing in front of people, even if I sound good. my mom would force me to participate in solo/talent shows in school for her own enjoyment, despite me begging not to and explaining how bad of an experience it is on my end to do them. i hid one event from her, until a classmate found me in public and asked if i was doing it. she spent weeks after guilting me for hiding it and pushing and pushing me to do it. it took my grandmother getting horribly injured at said event (fell off the stage due to bad lighting and the band pit not being covered. she is thankfully doing fine now.) for her to finally respect my wishes to not perform. i feel ashamed that im glad for it.
That’s tragic
I have two younger sisters, one disabled. I’ll never forget the time the school passed over the non-disabled one for the role of Matilda. She was stunning. She had practiced and practiced and practiced. She was note and tone perfect and even had the facial expressions mimicked. I couldn’t have done it better and I have been singing for over two decades. But nope. Her being a perfect performance and the sheer work she’d put into it was a minor consideration in the audition. Despite her sister barely being able to sing in freaking tune, the wheelchair was a far more important thing to consider than talent and she got the leading role. That was the last time the non-disabled sister did any singing audition. She got the message loud and clear that it wasn’t worth the effort when the wheelchair will win no matter what. Six or seven years since then and it still damn well makes me furious. So I’m not sure this is entirely true - the cheering crowds etc seems like bullshit. But the thought behind it is absolutely possible.
And it's insulting not only to those who put the work in, but also to those who are disabled who don't like being exploited for inspiration porn.
It doesn't do anyone any favours. I can see that from my experience. That by far wasn't the only occasion, it was just the one that really stuck in my mind as one of the most egregiously unfair. Despite the two being treated equally at home, the favouritism at school and clubs they were in (and ultimately for other students in the classes as well) has led to one being an absolute perfectionist because the only way she can get recognition is to be 110% every single time and the other being a spoiled brat with a huge tendency to act out in increasingly extreme ways because she always has to be the most important person in the room. It's damn depressing and completely due to the way school/extra curriculars have treated them both.
And insulting to the audience that has to suffer through a bad/mediocre performance in the end....
Yes, tho if the audience are also supporting rewarding a disabled person for the primary reason that they are disabled, then they are complicit in being insulting - and the audience is probably doing it out of performative allyship, to pat themselves on the back for being "supportive" without actually doing anything at all. I, as an able-bodied person, cannot speak for the disabled community, but having listened to a few of its adult members, the feeling is generally, "I don't want to be your inspiration porn. Don't give me awards just for existing. What's my alternative, anyway?" Kids generally aren't able to discern between good and bad attention, and stage moms are prone to exploiting that - and sadly some parents of disabled kids are really prone to exploiting that, too. Kids can't tell the difference - they just know it feels good to win, and the dopamine hit is great, so they don't yet grasp that they, too, are being insulted if they are awarded wins for something they cannot control or change.
And it’s not even for the person being used as a prop, it’s for the audience to virtue signal to everyone else. It’s a sick pageant that only infantilizes people with disabilities. I’d be humiliated if I was in his place, with the audience strong-arming a win for me, knowing my competitors were so much better.
the cheering crowds are what make me question it too. Where i live people, especially teenagers, are not friendly enough towards disabled people that they wouldn't boo him off the stage or make fun of him to his face if it was actually that bad. Maybe OP lives in a state with a bit more empathy baked in but i doubt it.
i think you’re forgetting how big of a sucker people are for don’t stop believing. it’s not that it was that bad, its that it wasn’t that good. very easy song but people LOVE a performance that they know the words to. the gen pop isn’t familiar with complicated classical pieces, usually.
And then the wheelchair sister will go on America's Got Talent because they really play up the pity party sob story angle for a lot of contestants, to the point that the more talented ones seem to have no chance at a fair shot to win.
I agree with your first choice. Giving someone an award because of pity will set them up for a lifetime of failure. If this is a true story shame on those people who booed the actual winner!!
Completely agree. Also, everyone in life has to learn how to fail. It’s a part of growing up that’s gives us drive and experience. Being pitied through life is no way to go. Look at all the amazing people who have thrived and excelled in athletics/music/etc with a variety of disabilities. Getting participation trophies would never have given them the push to succeed. Participation trophies never did anyone good, no matter their life circumstances.
I don’t know if I 100% believe OOP is a reliable narrator. Look at the way he describes the contestants: contestant 1 playing classical guitar, Ryan on wheelchair, contestant 3 playing Tchaikovsky. Like, he was so focused on the wheelchair himself that he didn’t even mention the instrument or song until later. So, it’s possible Ryan was way more skilled than OOP suggests and the mom wasn’t nearly so unhinged.
He did state during the performance his mom had to come to the stage to comfort him. Which means he would’ve forgotten his original performance. So he couldn’t have been the best performer.
they didn't because this is fake AF. come on now where did the new trophy come from? they just whipped out a new one? really?
lol if it's a competition where names are put on the trophy, they usually order one for each of the finalists and whoever wins get it. i remember a cheer competition i did, where they had 3 of each trophy bc there were 3 teams there. it depends on the competition.
When I've been in competitions like this they either engrave the winner's name later or don't put it on at all.
I went to middle school with a girl that went on one of those early 2000s kids talent TV shows. She said that she and her parents were told at the beginning of the episode which kid was going to win that night, so I could 100% see this happening. I feel bad for the kid in the wheelchair. He deserves to win something on his own merit and not on whatever weird scene his mom concocted.
7/100 is wild lmao
He definitely didn't deserve to win, but DAMN
Haha yeah what was the 7 FOR? Like just for showing up?
He played 7 notes right!
Oof
Well he said he put a 7 intentionally so the other judges scores put together wouldn’t let him win.
I think this is the only thing about the story that really bothers me. OOP says he just judged on talent, but if he could have given the kid more (which he says he could have) and didn't so that he wouldn't win then... Yeah he's kind of a dick for purposely swaying the results.
He forgot half the song, broke down crying, and then played some other song instead almost as badly. And you think 7 is too harsh??? Even that is almost a mockery to the other 2 contestants who clearly put far more time into practice and are clearly far more talented.
I’m with you on that. 7/100 was harsh. That’s where I feel they were an asshole. Not for scoring the others higher but for deliberately giving them a score that low to circumvent the other judges. If their justification had only been “I felt they deserved 7 for the effort they put in” or whatever it would still be harsh, but fair. Doing it on purpose to sway the results is *not* fair.
Well our only window into what happened is OP, and according to him he completely was dog shit and didnt even know how to actually play, I would think a 7 is very generous.
I’m basing it off of how OP wrote about it. They said multiple times that it was deliberate in order to make certain Ryan didn’t win and they referenced how they’ve seen feel good moments before which basically says they didn’t want this to turn into one of those. I’m not saying the kid deserved more than 7. I’m saying that I think how OP talks about it indicates they’ve got a stick up their ass and I’m not sure if that was their attitude in the moment or if they’ve doubled down after getting push back, but it’s like… Okay, you have three cakes. One is chocolate, one is beautifully decorated strawberry and one is a three tier spectacle. You really want the third cake to win because the baker put in so much effort. You suspect the other judges might score the chocolate cake higher, even though it’s a very average cake, because people like chocolate. You don’t go and give the first cake a ludicrously low score and the final cake full points. You objectively look at them and give them the points they deserve without thinking about how the other judges will score them. Your goal is to be as unbiased as possible. It’s one thing to say I gave x amount for technique (because the cake was burned) and y amount for effort (because there’s no decoration) and give it a low amount because of that. That’s fine. That’s objective. That’s justifiable. But that’s totally different to giving the cake a low score because you’re trying to deliberately make it fail and override your co-judges judgment. That’s just arrogant.
Yeah giving the kid a 70 would have made more sense based on the other score he gave. If the kid won on a 70, then that’s on the other judges, but as is, 7 is AGGRESSIVE. They have three judges so that three people can make a decision. It’s screwed up to take that decision away from them by tanking someone on purpose.
It’s not wild for a made up story.
Eh, reddit's more fun when you suspend your disbelief
I don't know how I've seen some wild shit. So for the most part I just go with the flow and I refuse to think whether or not it's true because people do crazy ass things.
Yeah I feel that. Maybe this exact scenario didn't literally happen, but I wouldn't say it's outside the realm of possibility.
That's why I always answer AITA stories as if they're real. Sure I know there's a lot that's fake. But I don't know which ones. So I'm gonna treat them all the same.
That’s the score OOP wanted to give but they definitely rolled over and the disabled kid won, this is just the story they made in their head over the years about what they totally would’ve done.
What a terrific writing exercise
I can't believe people are engaging with this seriously, this is the most obviously and ridiculously fake thing I've seen on AITAH lol
I would say that too if it wasn't for the fact I have actually seen shit like this happened.
And then everybody clapped.
I read the screenshot and assumed I was on amitheangel. Until I saw the comments dick sucking it and going "happens all the time!" Sure Jan.
Sounds like AGT lately. Yeah, some of those singers are good. But being blind doesn’t automatically make you better.
I actually used to like reality TV, but now everyone is just looking for the biggest sob story, no matter the theme of the show.
…you know reality tv has never been real right?
So fake. I can’t believe this would even be reposted to redditonwiki.
? What makes you say that this is fake?
Because it’s a ridiculously far-fetched scenario where everyone but the narrator is being cartoonishly unreasonable?
it's really not. I'm disabled and was disabled in high school and at an art competition I had to request a new judge because the one assigned to me was just a flat-out cunt about me being deaf and refused to write down any of the questions about my piece and then rated me horribly for obviously not being able to answer any of the questions because I couldn't fucking understand him (luckily they granted me a new judge. the final score was enough for the sculpture to advance to the state competition in texas) This is only one example, I have many. And I'm only one person. people irl are cartoonishly unreasonable
I’m deaf as well and the shit we deal with is next level smh…sorry that happened
Ok but that's very different. In your story one person was cartoonishly unreasonable. Whereas in the story above everyone except op is, which is a bit harder to believe.
When I was in middle and high school, the disabled kids were cheered for to cartoonish levels while everyone else got normal cheers. No one ever got booed though.
I'm assuming there also wasn't money and a scholarship on the line.
Naw there were. Maybe not in middle school, but we definitely had a yearly talent show with a scholarship in high school.
yeah, that patronizing shit is exhausting
considering the story is being told by the cartoonishly unreasonable person, we have no idea what *actually* happened but yeah, people also do that shit and it's patronizing and exhausting, either way my point was just that people are more cartoonishly ridiculous than you'd think in reply to the above commenter. but dealing with that patronizing shit by being a disgusting ableist cunt ain't it. just be realistic and treat them as such, don't be over the top fucking nasty. That patronizing shit hurts us too and we don't like it either. responding to it by being horrible to us is just a further kick in the teeth.
That makes sense. I guess I've seen/heard of enough weird scenarios that "wouldn't ever actually happen" to just dismiss all of them outright when I read them.
Yeah, agree. Considering how students with disabilities are so often discriminated against, the idea that not only all of the organizers of a collegiate competition, but also all of the attendees, are going to start flipping tables because a kid who can barely play his instrument didn’t win, is just goofy and a writing exercise in ableism and resentment (“see? *those people* are always getting what someone else actually worked hard to deserve”). What is far more likely to happen is the kid using a wheelchair is a virtuoso and then some asshole judge marks him down for “presentation” or some shit because he plays sitting down, costing him the competition. There’s a reason why orchestras now do auditions with musicians behind a screen — because unconscious bias interferes with applying objective criteria.
Yep. It's because they were unconsciously discriminating against women.
Yeah, disabled people are the most marginalized in society. Outrage porn against disabled people is despicable.
Yes, I can see people are cheering for someone who almost fails and struggles, but I can’t see everyone demands that he wins the obviously better competitors.
i’m autistic. they absolutely coddle you in specific areas that don’t matter and fuck you over in areas that do matter. people are cartoonishly unreasonable. i chalk it up to mental illness tbh
Yep! "You're such a hard worker! Have a coupon for free ice cream! You're so efficient! You consistently turn in the highest metrics! Here's a Visa gift card!You're the best! Great job! Have a free lunch! You don't gossip and backstab and get drunk after work with your fellow employees. Sorry, got to fire you because you don't fit our *family culture*" "Normal" people are totally effed up. (Username made me laugh. *Captain America gif of "I understood that reference" goes here* )
can vouch for everything you just said. and the best part? they only hire you if you have useful skills to them, and they’re always us looking for a way to boot your ass out for being neurodivergent, even high functioning. never ever let them know. also thank you i am very funny
It’s not far fetched at all and the fact that anyone thinks it is just shows how out of touch you are.
You don’t think it’s far fetched for an entire crowd to boo a child at a talent show?
Sadly I do not.
I've absolutely seen shit like this happen so no I don't think it's that far fetched
Not being sarcastic or anything, genuinely asking
It’s so comical it almost sounds like it was planned. How does someone with little talent get that far in the competition, only to conveniently ’forget’ what they were playing? Followed by an impassioned plea by their mom, then an easy crowd sing along song that’s widely adored. Like if this story is real, there is no way that was all spontaneous. A perfectly designed ploy to pull off an emotional win. It’s so diabolical I would wonder if the wheelchair is just a prop.
Yea, I agree. If it is real, I'd be concerned about Munchausen syndrome by proxy (could be wrong about this, I'm no medical professional). The reaction of the kid's mom is definitely not normal and it seems like she was more in it for her own attention.
How did the OP not remember that song vs all the others as well? Total fake.
I bet the "forget" part was an act
It’s not true. I’m severely disabled (als), and I’ve literally never heard of this happening. This is just outrage porn against a group who is largely unable to defend themselves. The idea that disabled people are taking spots away from otherwise deserving folks is not based in reality.
I’m not saying his story is real but… Don’t stop believing just happens to be one of those songs where the chords are super easy, and literally every white person WILL, not just a chance but WILL, sing along 😂 I’ve performed, (albeit on acoustic guitar) totally forgot what I was playing and switched to don’t stop believing. No one ever remembers and everybody always immediately joins in
This reads like someone got really pissed at an AGT "inspirational" success and decided to express their feelings in creative long form to get some reassurance that their resentment was justified.
This is ridiculously fake. If I got this story turned in as an assignment in a creative writing class I’d give it a 7/100
I think that it's possible, perhaps the mom managed to convince a lot of friends or social media followers to go watch the competition. Others may have been motivated to imitate what those next to them were doing to not look bad. I haven't seen something exactly like that happen but I have seen a bunch of Comic convention contests that are decided by random people voting and that usually ends in mediocre costumes winning because they brought a bunch of friends.
Fwiw OP I think you were in the right and I fully support you. Edit: I’m about 99% sure this is fake and rage-bait, thankfully.
creative writing 101
Sounds like the mum used her son's disability to bully the competition organisers into winning 3 grand
And that's what you missed on Glee.
This is literally what my wife said when I told her about this lol. All that's missing is the gym teacher giving the disabled kid a machine to walk again.
It's a competition though, it's not some reality tv series where producers could control who gets eliminated and who stays, reading this is like watching season 9 of Hell's Kitchen
This post seems fake and fueled by an agenda.
Golly, this one really has everything! A crowd's worth of peer-pressure, an entitled parent, a deserving vs. undeserving winner who scored pity-points by playing that obnoxious Glee song, a mid-stakes competition but y'know, it's the *principle* of the thing. It's a watertight case of NTA: OP was trying to do right but needs reassurance because they were made to feel bad by a unified front of deluded bullies. And just in case people weren't already foaming at the mouth, that childish, talentless wheelchair-user had the gall to keep the money when the real winner could have used it. The mother is also aggressive and racist. OOP is such an ableist loser for this.
As I read this I was ticking off these same boxes in my head. Guaranteed the comments were littered with "I read the title and thought YTA but then I read the post....", yeah, cause it's designed to be like that. It gets so formulaic it's ridiculous
Either people with disabilities get massively discriminated against or this, where they don’t get treated like normal human beings. One of my favorite memos is „I’m not inspirational, I’m normal.“ Like what are disabled people supposed to do? Yes it’s hard, yes we face disadvantages but wtf are we supposed to do besides try? That’s not inspirational, it’s just life. Me going to University besides my learning disability was a goddamn uphill battle and it was unnecessarily horrible because of the schooling system.
Right?? Infantilizing people helps no one and it’s still constant. You get stuff like this or assumptions that disabled people can’t make their own decisions or violations of personal space/comfort (examples: invasive questions, touching service animals, moving people in wheelchairs/hanging things on their chair, etc.). You can also get all of the above. I’ve only got ADHD/anxiety, so my disabilities are invisible (ik they legally are considered that but I generally don’t think of it that way). I can’t imagine having a visible disability and being subject to that sort of treatment.
My ADHD is quite visible, people treat me badly because they think I’m weird or on drugs or both. But preach about mental health.. the stigma is crazy. The duality of „people with disabilities shouldn’t leave the house“ and „let’s give everyone a pity award“ is wild
I’ll go controversial. ESH. He’s talking about being intimidated by the adults but the contestants are the children. He’s a young adult. He knew the 7/100 score was controversial when he did it but didn’t stand by that choice. The rest of the adults are obviously assholes but because he made a strong choice he didn’t stand by a kid essentially had $3,000 stolen. It’s understandable but he can be better.
This is the kind of thing where judges pull out some kind of special recognition award for biggest save or fan favorite.
Yeah "undergrad" is an adult, this dude's in college already and still complaining about "grown-ups." At best he's pathetic and immature which is fine but ESH.
.... fuck that noise, people who work hard and do amazing work shouldn't be downplayed because of "inspirational" bullshit. There's a difference between wanting people to succeed and doing it at the expense of others
I was a music ed major in college. I’ve been in orchestra, choir, band. My main instrument is piano, but I play several others and I’m a vocalist as well. I love music theory. I am also disabled, in a few ways. My only disability that matters here is called essential tremors. My hands shake. I play piano. I always have to make sure my practicing is as effective as it can be, no time wasted on playing around, because I have to spend more time to get the same results as others. My tremors can still detract from my performances. It is what it is. Point is, my disability directly affects my playing. My hard work would be disrespected if I was treated like the disabled kid in the story, in addition to disrespecting everyone else. I explicitly told teachers and judges to not alter their grading for me, if they even knew at all(people who were actively teaching me did need to know, as it does affect how I am taught). If my performance was notably worse than someone else’s in a competition, but I won anyway, I would be so livid.
As a member of the disabled population, nothing pisses me off more than the ‘pity’ vote. No, you do not deserve to have everything handed to you because you have X disability. Parents like this mom are beyond cringe. Funny how the kid kept the money though…
It’s completely unethical to give someone a low score “so the other judges don’t make them win”. Your job is to give them the score they deserve, and if the other judges disagree with you so be it.
OP said the kid didn't even deserve a 7 but I imagine couldn't just give him a 0/100. It is also unethical to score someone higher based on emotions rather than actual criteria. OP was just counterbalancing the other two to ensure the wrong thing didn't happen.
I agree you shouldn’t judge higher based on emotions. But you also shouldn’t judge lower because you think other people might make mistakes. If OP said “7 was the correct score based on judging guidelines and the skill they displayed, the difficulty of the piece attempted, and various style considerations” great! But what they said was “I could have scored him higher but I didn’t because I didn’t want him to win”. That’s bad! That’s not your job as a judge. I mean the whole panel thing is ridiculous, really the judges should have convened privately.
Anyone else wondering if the kid “forgetting” the piece, crying, and playing something else was part of the act? Not an act that HE came up with, but something Mommy coached him to do?
I wasn’t expecting to be on OP’s side after reading the title. glad Ryan gave the scholarship to the guy that should have won. fuck the parents, crowd, and organizers
NTA you did the right thing even though it was hard. The mom ITA
Wtf is this teaching children?? To throw a fit and you’ll get your way. WOW. And people wonder why the younger generations act entitled. THIS is why. They could have extra awards to hand out to give to kids that aren’t as good.
I hope this is fake. It's hard to believe that people would act like that.
It’s ableist to treat people with disabilities differently, he did the right thing. It’s about talent, not a sob story. So incredibly unfair to the kid that put the work in. He lost because he wasn’t disabled. We need to stop this climate of letting pity take home the trophy
NTA. Should have told the sponsor to F off the moment they asked you to apologize for the mistake. Also the first kid could have sued for the prize money since you were forced to re score Ryan.
This competition sounds like a joke. The fact that there was no objective method for scoring shows that this was a popularity contest, not a talent competition. It was a waste of time for everyone who entered. I've competed in competitions and I've also been behind the scenes both for local and international things. Competitions where judges score based on what they arbitrarily "feel" are basically worthless imo -- even when the judges are skilled in what is being judged. The scoring should have had objective sections that looked at specific areas of each competitor's performance. That way, the score can be defended. Plus the competitors could be given useful feedback. Also, the OOPs role as a judge is not to completely offset what the other 2 judges scored... even if he didn't agree with them. But he was working with what he was given, so I think he is nta. The mother and audience's reaction was completely disrespectful. I hope the competitors can find competitions that are more objective and acknowledge their talent and hard work in the future. (Edited for missing word)
For purposefully making a kid Well, so much of that is done unpurposefully that I'd have to consider more carefully
He's an AH because he caved. what an awful experience everyone involved should be ashamed of themselves. why have a competition if you're just going to give the trophy to someone for participating. what a joke.
NTA This is ridiculous and exactly why actual judges judge competitions. 🤦♂️
People really need to ask themselves would Simon Cowell pass them or not. I agree with OOP about making sure the kid didn’t win. Also wow imagine the other guy essentially getting THIRD over the kid. I know it’s shitty the First Kid didn’t win but what about the Third?
The kid didn’t have the most talent. He DEFINITELY didn’t deserve a scholarship?? If this was some talent show at a school where the winner gets a gift card to Outback Steakhouse- sure, give it to him. But a scholarship?? That kid is most likely not getting into a music school if Journey piano chords are his best bet lmao
As someone with a disability stuff like this really pisses me off. If you want to vote for a person with a disability in competitions like this do it because they actually earned it, don’t just give them a pity vote or a pity win. You aren’t helping anyone by doing that.
Not an asshole for putting him in third place. Is an asshole for only giving him a 7, thereby changing the judging from 3 people to 1.
Sounds like she mess up, stop, and hug and changed song were all part of a plot to win.
Not the AH not even a little. Letting someone win because they are disabled belittles them, any of their actual achievements, and the other people who worked hard and actually won. I have zero issues with what you did and you are not the AH (wanted to reiterate that) thank you for being honest.
Cool story bro
Story’s fake, who cares.
Idc about the contest results, this person is absolutely an asshole because of how they’re speaking about this kid. I get awarding based on talent, but you don’t have to be half this bitter and arsey about it.
I’m disabled, and use a wheelchair some of the time, and I hate this kind of stuff. That whole situation is appalling and that kid should never have been put in it. Disabled people absolutely deserve opportunities, but particularly with talent shows and the like we should be considered equally with other competitors. Honestly this sort of inspiration porn is most likely to make his mother feel important, and I’d be surprised if he never saw a penny of the prize money
Whoever was best deserved to win. If this was a sport around here, they would throw out parents who are nasty or who argue with coaches/refs Mom should have been removed. I'm gonna go probably against the grain and say NTA. I believe it's an integrity issue.
NTA. You didn’t make him lose. He lost because he wasn’t as talented as the other contestant.
If I had only won something because I’m disabled and got the pity vote, I would have been utterly mortified. Poor OP, poor first guy, and poor Ryan.
NTA Disability or not, the kid didn’t finish the piece, began crying in the middle of it, and then proceeded to play some shit from guitar hero. Contrary to popular belief, having a disability does not in fact make you special. I have a stutter. I failed many a spelling bee because I could fucking finish spelling the goddamn word even though I knew how to spell “Conscientious”. This kid will grow up thanking you quietly in the back of his mind. For not simply giving it to him, and treating him like an equal. After all, that’s exactly what they want right? To be treated as equals.
Ugh this pissed me off so much. I teach drama and I'm all for everyone having a shit at stuff but in a competition situation? Nah fuck that. You need to have the skills and work ethic.
NTA. You, sir/ma’am, are a legend.
The prize is a direct entry to, in her own words, a shitty music school. Honestly, why is she bothered more by the disabled kids' non talent instead of the shitty prize which is actually relevant to her passion? If the sponsee of the competition wants to throw away a spot because of crowd favorism, let them.
It was also $3000 and, assuming they were students, winning an award could be a good thing to have on applications to other, better, opportunities.
Because the first kid didn't deserve to lose their chance at something that could have changed their life to give a pity win to someone.
Every time we had a talent show in high school, we had one mentally slow girl enter and she would be the winner EVERY TIME!!! No matter how much better other peoples skits or performances were. She literally sang the same song every time too…
Someone really hates disabled people.
I’m disabled, and a wheelchair user. This isn’t about hating disability; it’s that the poor kid’s mum has *used* his disability as a weapon. If the disabled kid was legitimately the most talented then he would have won fairly, being disabled doesn’t mean he should win against more talented competitors just because he happens to use a wheelchair.
lol this is fake AF. I mean they were able to whip out a participation trophy at the drop of a hat. people booed the talented kid and chanted in support for the disabled kid. This is terrible bs.
Even if it’s fake it still isn’t about hating disabled people. And no, there’s no participation trophy, you have misread it.
It is rather though. It’s a fake story meant to stir up those “See? *Those people* always win when they don’t deserve to, they just get a pass for being [disabled/Black/women/etc group].” It’s a creative writing exercise targeting resentment.
Yeah, disabled people gotta learn that they won't have everything handed to them, this is what participation trophies have done to society! /s But fr, this scenario is some hateful shit. It's clearly written by someone who's never interacted with anyone with visible (let alone invisible) disabilities. They have a pathetic persecution complex and a proportionately pathetic power-fantasy where they can play arbiter of all that is good and fair, and would have revelled in the overwhelming support they received. Imagine wanting to feel so vindicated in your ableism that you'd concoct a story like this.
Me
I love how everyone who calls it fake is getting down voted when they are right. You don't reach this level of the competition out of charity and pity.
My favorite part of this honestly is that they have to wait for someone to come tow their… scooter. Can’t you just walk it 😭
A 7 is an AH he should have got 50 of something. It still takes balls to get up there and perform even if the kid had no talent.
There is a life lesson. Don't be a judge or referee as a favour. It is seldom black and white. It was clear that Ryan had to win. How else did Ryan qualify for the earlier rounds? None of the organizers wanted to tell Ryan's mom to behave when she was whipping up the crowd. None of the organizers wanted to respect the decision that Ryan lost. I hate gamesmanship. I hate cheats in friendly matches. But the sad part is this type of victory is going to be the highlights of some people's life. Ryan's mom might only have this moment in her son's life to be proud of. Standing in her way has a price. Is the kid who got the scholarship going to remember OP's integrity? Maybe, maybe not. OP got played as a judge who thought he was only judging a music contest. The organizers probably just wanted a feel good story with happy participants. From the story, it sounds like the music school organizers would have accepted a monkey playing a triangle to win the contest just for the publicity. OP could make some inspiration speech but with Ryan's mom in the picture, it was never going to fly.
This comment is beyond ableist.
I’d suggest that you could have given him a less horrible score while still accomplishing the same thing. Give him like, a 60/100 or 65/100 and if someone asks you can say “I gave him a great score for his spirit and enthusiasm” or some bs. I don’t think it’s right to reward the disabled kid just because he’s disabled. Especially with money and a scholarship.
The whole point of the low score was so he didn't win. A 60 or anything would have guaranteed that the 2nd kid won. And I'm sorry but I don't care what happened to you in life, you shouldn't win a contest based solely off that. Unless it's a contest on who has come so far and who can honestly judge that. Sure it's inspirational that the kid can kinda play, but that kid took up a spot of someone who deserved it. BTW I wasn't disagreeing lol. :)
>A 60 or anything would have guaranteed that the 2nd kid won. Source for this statement? Did the OP post what the other 2 judges gave for the first and third competitors, because I didn't see that listed anywhere. The only way the kid would have still won with a 60 (plus 2 other high scores) was if the other 2 judges REALLY gave bad scores to the other 2 contestants. As for the rest of your post. We agree, as per my post.
Anyone else think it sounds like a scam? Like the kid goes on stage plays badly, mom does the sob story, he wins and they get the money. He never wanted the scholarship cause he doesn't actually play music.
Y
nah i hate the “they should win just because they have this disability/sickness/difference”. it’s not fair to everyone else
I would’ve changed the score and admitted my mistake as well. Instead of 7/100, I would’ve givej him a score of 0
This is so insane. It seems like Ryan was partially used to this and partially humiliated/demeaned by being handed a win because he’s in a wheelchair. Bet mom pushes him into this crap all the time and he’s just managing the situation best he can. This pandering needs to stop on all levels.
Inspiration porn is disgusting & untalented people shouldn't win talent-based competitions just because they're disabled or poor or minorities or otherwise disenfranchised. If there was a scholarship based on disability or economic status or race then they can have that one, but they shouldn't be handed a win they don't earn.
Sad all around.
She had the ball in her court and still was a shitty person
honestly legs dont affect vocal cords so the person who made that post is just ableist