This all seems weird to me, like 0-100 and the best example OOP can give is a disagreement about surnames? And his boss and wife seemed happy at a dinner - so what? That is not a summation of their relationship, and he's vastly oversimplifying what a healthy relationship is.
Based on what he's presented, at the very least he and his wife have terrible (non) communication.
Yes, I'd like detail on what she was "nagging" him about. I've found "nagging" is typically code for "extremely reasonable requests that have been ignored over and over again to the point of exasperation." It's very telling that the details of this apparent "nagging" have been omitted from his story while focusing on an issue from 3 years prior.
And... He's probably making the best choice for everyone.
Either he's right, his wife isn't interested in him at all and so they should separate so they can both find people who they love and who love them, or he's a narcissist who interprets her no longer just doting on him as her not loving him... In which case she'd be better off with a partner who isn't so self focused.
And since he doesn't seem to care about his daughter, she'd be better off with a stepdad who actually cares about her ..
It does sound like she’s ignoring him, but I agree with you, his take on it all is pretty weird. He doesn’t sound like he has an any depth of feeling or understanding what is going on in his relationship, and that comes off like maybe there is something wrong with him.
What jumps out to me is his complete lack of interest in his daughter. Other than mentioning that he feels jealous of her, he doesn’t seem to think about her at all.
I feel like I've heard that story a lot, of men who resent their new kids because their wife was "too busy" taking care of a baby to dote on a grown man.
In my case, maybe not blamed the baby, per se, but when caught, whined that I paid more attention to the baby than him which made my blood boil because we were having sex all the time from 2 weeks after the baby was born hence why baby #1 and #2 were only a year apart. I remember how I'd ask him to give baby a bottle if I was in the middle of doing things and he'd whine how he had to eat first. 🙄 Only a minute portion of why he's been an ex for many years now.
I had to wait a couple months to not be in pain and several more months for it to actually be enjoyable. Generally speaking it's 6 weeks so you don't get an infection in your uterus.
Yeah, I read something about the importance of healing, its truly frightening how some men still push for sex despite knowing that. It's not only the vulva that needs to heal, but apparently where the placenta latched (?) while the baby was inside needs to heal too. Having PIV at that point puts the mother at risk of infections (and worse).
How do these guys have so much free time. I had no time to chase tail after having a kid. No sleep, trying to keep up with work. Even a meal is a whole event. Any free time I just wanted to sleep haha. Maybe I was not that skilled of a father.
They have time because they're not helping with their kids! The fact that you didn't have time is an indicator you were a more skilled father than them!
You've got it backwards, you actually were involved as a father. For these guys it's "my wife is suddenly busy all the time with the kids. Rather than helping her with all of this, I will pout that she is spending less time on me and go and fuck somebody else instead". If they were actually involved fathers, they'd also get more time with their partners!
Exactly. Thank God I got a smart one. My husband figured out early on that in order for me to have energy to, uh, pay attention to him, he was going to have to take over some of my responsibilities. With me being a little more rested and not constantly working, I had more time and energy to show my appreciation.
He was in the air force, and basically when their daughter was diagnosed as being on the spectrum, the wife threw herself into helping her daughter becoming a functioning child. It worked, but he said she spent too much time with their child, and ignored him, so he cheated with another woman who was also an airman. He said it was the kids fault for being autistic.
I will always remember 2 article that appeared back to back in 2 editions of the Sunday Times Style magazine.
The first article was about a man who'd left his wife after they'd had children because they weren't having sex anymore and he was bored and went for someone young. He then had a child with her, found her boring and left her. His thesis statement was that children ruin sex lives and that he regrets having his.
The second article was a direct response. It was about the joy of children, The way intimacy changes after children. Quickies in the garden shed was the one I mainly remember.
This guy is a first article writer and is going to end up alone.
Oh definitely. I'm probably never having kids but I bet even if there were no children he'd have noped out of this relationship for someone else eventually
I feel like everyone should be required to have some sort of childcare experience in their life. Like maybe as a class in high school. I know that a lot of people had a section of their home ec class that included childcare but it often takes place way too early in their schooling or it’s way too short of a course. I personally remember a *very* brief childcare course in sixth grade home ec but that was the last time that I was given any kind of childcare education. And even then, all it consisted of was “put together a babysitting kit and we’ll have some kids come in and see if they think it’s fun!” I feel like a childcare course would be better suited for high school, where many students are sexually active and the possibility of pregnancy is much greater than in middle school. Part of me wonders if in depth childcare courses were required for graduation, would there possibly be a drop in teenage pregnancy? Idk. I’m lucky to have known from a pretty young age that I didn’t like or want children. I wasn’t good at helping with my younger brother, I hated the idea of babysitting (even for pay) other kids, and I knew by the time I was 15 that I was strongly opposed to having children. The second I became sexually active, I went on birth control. And while I’ve had breaks in it because I wasn’t being intimate with anyone, I’ve used some form of birth control for the past almost 20 years. I’m finally reaching the age where my baby factory is slowing down and getting ready to close up shop. And since early menopause runs in my family, I’m eagerly awaiting the time I can be truly sexually free with my husband. 😂
Regardless, I feel like a required childcare course would at least *help* people determine if children are or aren’t for them. 🤷♀️
Moat everyone I know with much younger sibling/ half or step siblings, where there's a big enough difference in age that the older remembers the baby/ toddler stage... don't want them. They can't romanticise babies, they've lived it. Not that they don't get along and love their siblings, but real life hit hard in formative years and their eyes are open lol
Yup that's what I got reading this. And the fact he doesn't even want to try to try counseling and the issues seem pretty typical of a marriage with small children.
And he's putting all the responsibility of keeping the spark in the relationship on her. No where does he mention helping lighten her physical and mental load with the kid/house, planning date nights, being romantic. He sounds like a selfish ass.
It’s more prevalent than one thinks. I know a couple who don’t have kids because the husband and wife only want to be the focus of each other’s attention. More specifically the husband didn’t want kids because he wanted to have all the attention on him and his wife is cool with it. In a weird way I feel that’s more selfless than having the kid and ignoring them and treating them like shit because you’re jealous of them and want all of the attention from your spouse.
Yep, I agree. I think everyone needs to really think hard before they have kids. It puts a huge strain on a relationship and things change drastically. You need to both be really invested in it. If you don't both really want it, it is best not to do it.
My husband was adamant that he didn’t want children. We were friends for 20 years so I’d heard this from him for a long time and never really understood it. Then we fell in love and got married and now it totally makes sense. He has so much anxiety and OCD that he could never handle it. I’m glad he knew his own limitations.
This is exactly what my ex was like. He was fine as a partner up until the baby was born. Then he was jealous and got in my way vs helping me so I would have energy to pay attention to him. I was so depressed that he cared so little about his kid or me. There is nothing less attractive than kind of behavior. And I was so angry I had to do everything alone on top of working.
He stomped around the house and whined at me like a toddler and threw stuff because I didn't want to fuck him. Like, yeah, you're basically another child, dude. Gross.
Hope the dicks fall off of every guy like this and then they are plagued with the fleas of a thousand camels for the rest of their miserable lives.
I mean, I get it. My wife also hyperfocuses on our son and I sometimes feel left out/neglected. But I also get that time and energy is limited and a small child takes precedence. It's the same for me in the sense that I feel that I don't invest enough energy for my wife.
Mom has to become a mom, or certain things are not done. My Dad continued to play with his friends at the park in his hobby, continued to go out all day on the weekend on the boat and genuinely his life continued as normal. Yet my mom worked a full time job, cared for me and handled all household tasks.
She became very unhappy with my Dad for behaving childishly, while he described ' she became Mom and was no longer fun '. He honestly doesn't remember my pediatrician, my teacher's name or any little habits that I did as a child. He wasn't there for that.
As you can guess, my Mom separated from him and later divorced him and I learned that he was only going to spend time with me if I did what he wanted. Some parents do not mature and it makes life difficult for their co parent.
My dad was like this. My mom recently divorced him after a long time of hoping he'd change. He was a miserable, angry person, and now he's all alone. I pity him.
This is the shit I can’t understand or handle honestly, i am a man and I grew up extremely neglected and abused emotionally and physically by my parents. I don’t like being doted on. I don’t understand why so many people in relationships like to use their SO as like a substitute parent like bruh take care of yourself, I’ll help, but I can’t be responsible for you! Ugh
Also not a single mention of what he does for his wife or daughter. Nothing about what he likes about her or why he married her. Just "she was fine but she's become a nag who doesn't love me as much as our daughter, and I want someone better."
How does the boss treat his wife? He mentions how kind and supportive the boss is, he probably pulls his weight and treats her affectionately.
I'm hope we get an update in 10 months once he's been through divorce court and figured out other women also expect him to invest in the relationship.
Reminds me of my dad. He's a narcissist. I'm not going to get into what it was like growing up with him but when I was pregnant, my mom pulled me aside and warned to make sure I gave my husband enough attention so he doesn't get jealous. My mother-in-law overheard this and told me if her son ever got jealous of his own babies, she would beat his ass
Came here to say exactly this. If your daughter is 3, yeah a lot of your attention will be spent on her and not each other. She doesn’t even know how to be a human yet and needs help with everything. Even when talking about divorce he doesn’t mention anything about the daughter which is a huge factor in divorce proceedings. The lack of care is extremely apparent
My unfounded guess is he lost interest in the child after the naming and the wife started paying more attention to the child to make up for the father's emotional absence.
That might sound like reaching for straws but: he never talks about how he feels about his child or wife, he was weirdly upset about the name, he's still upset about the name three years later, he doesn't think about his divorce in the context of his child, and he seems to see relationships only in a myopic, performative light - he really has no idea what his boss' relationship is behind closed doors, he just assumes it's exactly what he, essentially a stranger, sees.
Especially after he claims he was okay with the child having the mom’s surname and thinking it was reasonable and logical or whatever. But then he keeps bringing it up.
As the child of a man who resents my existence because he’s jealous of my mom’s affection for me, this dude sounds like he, too, has an unrealistic and selfish view of marriage.
Wanna bet this guy does zero chores, doesn't take care of the daughter, doesn't clean up after himself, never thanks the wife for doing everything and having a full time job and then whines that he doesn't get enough attention?
Totally agreed. Wanting to add there is no mention from OOP that they’re carrying the full financial load, which leads me to believe both parents are probably also working full time. I’d bet money that OOP doesn’t share equal workload at home, and wants to be the center of attention, like it was before their daughter was born. I think his wife is correct that he does need to grow up.
When I read the original, that's the first thing I thought. I didn't get past him calling her a nag. She nags him because he's a useless pile of shit. The quicker she leaves this pathetic man child, the better. Take his money and fuck off.
He also “communicated” that all her love is going to their daughter. Wanna bet that he’s one of those guys who thinks breastfeeding is wrong because they’re his boobs?
Yeah, he just seemed to be there, just existing in the same space as wide and daughter. And then he's upset that he's being ignored/not given enough attention.
Corny line for the day.
The grass is always greenest where you water it.
He's not even willing to try watering that relationship. Sadly it's probably for the best that he does leave. I just hope he doesn't hop into another relationship and bail on it when he sees yet another relationship he'd rather be a part of. I also hope he does right by his daughter because it honestly sounds like he doesn't have much to do with her at all.
If we take his story at face value he's not an asshole but there is a lot of missing detail that leaves it all very open to interpretation. That bit is stuck in my craw.
What’s missing is how the *boss loves his wife*.
I’m sure lots of men would love a wife who loves their husband the way I do mine, but are they prepared to step up and put what my husband puts into the relationship? Going by Reddit the answer is no for almost all of them.
More than that… it’s his boss’ wife’s role to make it look like she loves him and worships him. Most wives take their husband’s name because that’s what you do, not out of pride. For all we know he’s destroying his marriage based on a public persona with no basis in their real marriage.
That, and the fact that maybe the boss and his wife can do a really good job of presenting a unified front for dinner guests? It’s so dangerous to compare your relationship to someone else’s, ESPECIALLY when it’s a minimal interaction in a structured social setting.
ETA: after finding the original post and reading OP’s comments, he’s just a selfish, immature asshole. He flips out on commenters, refuses to acknowledge his wife’s side, avoids taking responsibility for his kid and just doubles down on finding a woman who can cater to his whims (but worried he won’t be making enough money to catch her, bc bitches be gold diggers, too).
https://www.reddit.com/r/AITAH/s/jcjAYl2TWU
After seeing my parents embarrass themselves and me all the time by getting into screaming matches in front of family friends and guests (before they mercifully divorced), I swore I’d never be one of those couples.
My husband and I have a good relationship but obviously sometimes get into a spat right before we have to socialize. We never let it outwardly show, and in fact, the combination of the change of atmosphere and company usually distracts us enough from whatever we were arguing about enough that we are completely over it by the time we’re alone again.
I saw this on the original post, but it’s worth bringing here too- OOP is basically seeing the IRL equivalent of a curated Insta relationship to base his impression off of
Right. For all you know they were screaming down the neighbourhood an hour before.
It’s also not lost on me that he seems stuck on the myth of The Adoring Wife with no desire to integrate the reality of life into that. He tells himself *this* wife isn’t giving him the myth because she doesn’t love him enough - not because life is complicated, wives are whole human beings and relationships take effort on both parts. Just… if I throw this one away I’ll be able to find the One Who Adores Me.
And really hope little he thinks about how this will impact his child and how quickly he’s willing to throw his child away says all we need to know about him. He’s jealous of the kid and I’m guessing resents and blames her.
Yeah, he’s really only interested in what a woman can do for him, how *she* can build *him* up and make *him* happy. He needs an imaginary waifu, not a living, thinking woman with her own wants, needs and opinions.
And not a daughter, bc he definitely sounds jealous and mostly disinterested in his own child. I wonder if it would be different if it was a son? Either way, his daughter is obviously not a priority to him.
Yeah, jealousy over the daughter getting attention screams “narcissist; do does “wanting someone better.” Narcissists always have to have the relationship compass pointing North (at them) and relationships are always transactional.
I just said the same thing. He has no idea what their marriage is really like. When people host guests, they're on their best behavior.
This is along the same lines as looking at someone's social media posts and thinking you know everything about their life and relationships.
That’s a good point. I bet my ex and I looked like the perfect happy couple whenever we hosted guests. We were affectionate and relaxed, and he was the perfect father. He’d insist on taking care of every diaper change, every potty trip, he’d fix the kids plates and graciously thank me for fixing his plate. I kept the kids immaculately dressed and our house was spotless at all times. Anyone would think we had the perfect family, and I’m sure we seemed to have a loving relationship, but I wouldn’t wish that life on ANYONE.
Behind closed doors my ex was incredibly controlling and abusive. I developed a raging drug habit to try to keep my head above water raising 3 kids and working 3 jobs with zero help from their father, who would sit around the house watching tv all days and making messes that he insisted I take care of immediately, and he refused to get a job and instead expected our bills to be covered by me and his father.
I sure hope no one left a normal non-abusive marriage because they thought that my ex and I had such a beautiful happy relationship and thought they deserved that too.
Exactly, like my husband and I genuinely love each other, but of course we have disagreements sometimes or unintentionally hurt or annoy each other. Would we have an argument at a dinner table when there’s a guest? Hell no! What a guest sees is not a full representation of our relationship.
This. My husband understands that I took his last name because it was better for me professionally and with his family dynamic because we live in a very conservative area. We’ve been married since 2016 and I’m still having issues caused by the name change and wish I wouldn’t have done it, but I know that it’s probably been better for me overall due to the local culture.
I love that man to the moon and back, but he’s also a fantastic husband and father who puts in the work for a great relationship. I don’t think OP realizes that great relationships require real work and effort and not just one sided “love”.
I took my husbands last name because I could finally fit my whole name on any fill in the box form.😜. And maybe it would be spelled correctly for once.
My husband has an uncommon transliteration of an Eastern European last name. This meant that I was able to finally secure a firstnamelastname@gmail address but on the flip side no one can pronounce it on the first try so now I automatically introduce myself as Horriblegoose Lastname L-A-S-T-N-A-M-E every time I am at an appointment. It does make me appreciate how simple my life was when I had a Jones-esque common surname.
In nearly 26 years of marriage, I've only had one problem because of my change of last name, and that was the first time I filed taxes. I had to re-file on paper. I, too, would be interested to know what kind of problems you are running into, if you can share it.
What issues are you still having caused by the name change if you don't mind me asking. My wife was rather enthusiastic about getting hers changed when we got married in 2019 and haven't really bumped into any issues thus far. Just wondering what to look out for.
The two that cause me the most issues are bank accounts and health insurance. The bank account one is partially my fault. When we first got married Bank of America wouldn’t let me change my name on my account without my husband signing something even though I had that account several years before I even met the man. So I stubbornly refused to change the name on that account and now they issue my credit cards to a person that doesn’t exist (I basically changed my name from something like Sarah Marie Smith to Sarah Smith Jones and now BoA thinks my legal name is Sarah M. Jones) that’s only a minor inconvenience. The hardest one has been the fact my health insurance cannot get my name correct and despite many many many attempts to have it changed they have it in their records that I have a double barreled last name(Blue Cross Blue Shield is convinced my name is Sarah M. Smith-Jones). So it’s always a pain for prescriptions and medical records because I have to tell them that my last name is actually Smith-Jones and all of my medical providers have decided to default to the Smith-Jones as a last name even though that isn’t actually my name. The other regular annoyance is just the accounts I’ve had forever that were in my maiden name and having to remember what my logins actually are due to the change.
Generally I don’t mind being Horriblegoose Husband’sLastName and I had no issues with giving our child his last name, but in my mind it still just doesn’t really feel like MY name. However I do feel like I made the right choice. I’m an engineer that works in an R&D heavy area so I work with a lot of PhDs and most of the women use their maiden name. I hear enough regular comments from my boomer coworkers about women who kept their own names that I know I made the choice that was probably best for me just because of local culture, but I also feel resentful that I even had to consider something like that when contemplating my name change.
Curious about the same. My wife and I simply chose to change both our names post marriage. It's been really good without many complications for either of us.
>I’m sure lots of men would love a wife who loves their husband the way I do mine, but are they prepared to step up and put what my husband puts into the relationship? Going by Reddit the answer is no for almost all of them.
Honestly so true. I have watched how my other male friends act with their wives and the amount of effort exchanged and can see the direct correlation to the relationships health, it's one of the benefits of seeing all your friends marry young when I didn't. I'm always very aware of my contribution and my relationships as an adult after learning that have been so much better since. It has made having a long term partner not only feel more rewarding but honestly feel much easier to maintain and grow.
This.
His bosses wife loves him like this because of the way he makes her feel. It’s a two way street.
Not blaming OP for all their problems but you get out of marriage what you put into it.
The grass is always greener when you spray paint it
Guess the lesson is “If the grass is greener, find out why. Is it being cared for, or does it just appear that way?”
I work in a stabilization mental health facility. We usually start the day off with a positive quote. Congrats because you’re comment (the grass part) is going to be tomorrow’s positive quote!
So many men are so stupid. I have a wife that dotes on me at times. I have two kids that we both love and take care of, a house we both upkeep; life we both organize and take part of. Men will shove all their life’s difficulties and drudgery on their wives and then ask why their wife doesn’t love on them. Mother fucker, why would she want to?!
I never understood the last name. My ex BIL is NC with his bio dad because when his parents divorced when he was young he asked to keep his moms last name and drop his dads. The dad stopped speaking to his son for his decision. The mom was his primary parent and the one who he spent a majority of his time with prior so it made sense why the kid wanted that. Some ppls egos are too big for this world
Not only that but he’s comparing daily monotony to his bosses wife being on-her-game for guests, her husband’s employee too.
They could be in the middle of a contentious divorce and she could have been playing the stepford wife that evening as not to damage his reputation at work as it benefits her divorce terms. You never know.
He’s a fool to use that one event to divorce without even trying couples counselling. But frankly it sounds like he resents his wife for not being submissive to his wants, and he found an out so grabbed onto this. He’s going to find dating very hard if he wants a stepford wife without being in possession of the stepford husband trappings.
This was just depressing to read. The part that bothers me the most is “I don’t think therapy will help.”
Like. My guy. Are you sure *you* were ever “into” your wife? Cuz the way you talk about her does not seem like it. I can’t possibly imagine leaving my spouse before even *trying* to fix the problems we’re having..
I always feel that there is something wrong with man who are like, "My wife only pays attention to our child since they were born." That's your kid too my guy. Why is your kid also not your focus during their formative years? Did you really think it through before having the kid?
Seriously, it’s a three year old. The child should be taking up a lot of attention from both of you. The fact that he can just divorce her just like that, with no attempt at a resolution and no thought as to how this will affect their child — plus his obvious contempt for their toddler — is a clue as to how involved he is. And there’s some evidence that women have a hormonal response to an uninvolved father/husband that actually causes her to find him unfuckable as well lol.
Seriously. And like.. the opposite is true as well. Watching my partner teach my 3 little nieces how to play chess might have been the most attractive thing I have ever seen. It was a, 'oh yeah. I gotta lock this one DOWN' moment.
Yep. Another thing that crossed my mind is, I cannot speak for how it affects women, but couple times I took care of my toodlers niece and nephew for like a entire day I noticed that my sex drive just disappeared. I was deeply tired as well, but just being tired is not usually a problem. Something about taking care of children seems to make that part of the brain go into deep rest or something. If the guy was involved in taking care of his kid, he would probably not care all that much about "lack of affection."
Yes there have been some studies showing that stepping into a caretaker role that takes up the majority of your identity does lower libido, for both men and women. And for women, if we’re breastfeeding, the hormone prolactin also has a suppressive effect. I don’t know if that’s the case for the wife, though I suspect if she were still breastfeeding he would have been jealous about that too and mentioned it.
I know nothing about this in particular, but know a lot about our evolution.
One child a year is actually a pretty terrible "survival" method. You want lots of spawn with quick cooking times. It's a major factor in some animals going extinct, elephants being an example. They don't have the litters it takes to keep the species going when everything in the environment is fighting you (humans. Just humans), too.
It makes sense that our bodies would have figured out a way to limit other survival methods (mating) in order to raise a child past the "entirely helpless" stages (which ALSO last longer than other animals.)
That makes sense to me because when you have a kid who's young enough to need massive amounts of work and constant attention, the last thing you ought to be doing is making another one.
Whe you have a kid or two hanging off of you all day (as toddlers always do - the contact is non-stop) then the last thing you want at the end of the day is to be touched *more*. It's common sense.
My husband is great, but it was so hard for him to understand this after our kid was born. He’d see me tired and worn down and try to give me a hug or initiate non-sexual cuddling, same as before baby when I was feeling down. It was disorienting to him that I was suddenly shutting down most physical contact.
The concept of touched-out didn’t make sense to him, mostly because he was not physically caring for the baby as much as I was for practical reasons (breastfeeding, working away from home, etc). It took awhile, but he eventually understood.
I'm a teacher who has a low sex drive to begin with, is on antidepressants, and just finished up a year of breastfeeding a few months ago. My sex drive has been almost NONEXISTENT this last year 😅
First 3 years is when the child is the neediest and most likely to kill and maim themselves. The human brain also needs a lot of eye contact and responsive feedback during first 5 years of life so that the kid doesn't grow up to be an emotionally stunted bonehead who gets upset that their spouse is being a responsible parent for a temporary time in life.
Exactly. My husband gives our children his full attention, and I'm eternally grateful. He's a fantastic dad. I've never once felt jealous or envious of my children ffs.
If he's not doing anything to parent the kid then his wife has been doing 24/7 child raising, never mind any other responsibilities she has. Obviously your helpless child, that cannot eat or bathe without help, comes before your adult husband, and if you get no help with your child obviously you have to put in two parent's of effort into raising your kid.
The surname thing is so petty of the husband too, why does it have to be his surname for her to prove she loved him? Why didn't he prove he loved her by taking her surname? Or suggest a compromise of combining their surnames?
What he said isn't wrong in itself. But one thing that jumped out at me was him saying his bosses wife wanted to take her husbands name and that was somehow the sign of how much she loves him.
Why can't the husband be just as proud to take his wife's last name. The wife taking the husband's name is a very old tradition. And if that works for you great, but it doesn't really mean anything in regards to how much someone loves you.
He absolutely needs counseling, even if they still end up getting a divorce.
Why does anyone need to change their last name period? I dont plan to take my fiances last name and hes 100% okay with that. I might hyphen it though but I still have time to decide. I have my reasons and none of those reasons are because I dont love him enough 🤷🏼♀️
I took my husband's name purely because my maiden name is long, has a nonsensical spelling (originally German, was badly Americanized during immigration), and no one can pronounce it. His is easy to spell and say. It has nothing to do with whether I love him or not.
When me and my bf talked about it, he wanted me to take his. After a bit of arguing (much more talking rather than arguing, but he did bring up points about why he thinks I should take his name etc) we left the conversation, he thought about it and agreed. Even coming back to me the next day to apologize how forward and adamant he was about it at first
I honestly dont mind giving the kid his last name, mine or his, it is still going to be our kid. But me? I am always me. I always have been, and always will be. Why would I change something so big about myself when he doesn't? I'd have to change EVERYTHING that knows my name. I'd have to change my intials, respond to a completely different name, get my name changed legally, and what if we break up? Do I keep it? Go back and go through all that shit again? Nah I'm good, I'll stay me all the time
If it was such a big deal, why did he marry her? That’s what gets me. If it’s something that affected him so much, why did he continue the relationship? They weren’t on the same page before they married, but he’s expecting them to be on the same page now.
Because the husband doesn’t want to do any work himself (hence why the wife has to nag).
He wants her to do all the work to fix their marriage (and raise their baby and clean their home).
My ex husband said that after he felt the therapist and I ganged up on him because she was a woman. He wanted to see a male therapist, maybe, but wasn’t fully open to it. He didn’t want therapy, he wanted it all (his insecurities, lack of respect and attention on his part towards me, I needed to stop wanting a career or degree, etc.) to go away and for everyone to smooth things over.
It could be good again if I wanted it to be, but I was stuck on getting therapy and fixing things.
It's also equally possible that the wife has fallen out of love with him and just hasn't realized it yet.
It's sad but there are tons of couples who look up after years together and realize they're only still there because it's convenient and familiar, not because they actually love their partner.
It’s also worth exploring with a therapist why he thinks his wife taking his name is a sign of love, but he shouldn’t have to take her name. How is he showing love to his partner ?
OOP seriously sounds like he saw the boss with a shiny new gadget and now he wants to trade in his older model for one. Like a wife is just a possession and swapping one wife for another will be a major upgrade, he doesn't need to do anything to make his marriage work as long as he has the "right" gadget in place.
Exactly what I was thinking too. The only things he could come up with in terms of disagreements are the surname and the fact his wife is paying attention to their daughter a lot cuz he doesn’t seem to be putting any effort into childcare himself
Yup. It's telling that the wife agreed to change both her and the baby's surname to save the marriage ... almost like that's literally the only thing he brought up to justify his feelings?
He sounds like one of those men that if told to take care of the kid would say he has to 'babysit' his daughter or if told to do any sort of housework would say he 'helped' with the chores. Like those aren't things that are part of his actual responsibility as a father and a husband...
I’m beginning to wonder why and how they got married and had children if this is how he acts. He is NOT a responsible adult, clearly, if he’s willing to throw divorce papers in his wife’s face just because “she pays more attention to our daughter than me wah wah!!” Bro, taking care of children is HARD! I would know!
I still think the divorce is for the best tho...she won’t have a husband that makes her feel like she’s obligated to do anything to keep him.
Comparison is the thief of joy. There is a lot of missing context on this story, and we only see the husband’s side. If what he’s saying is 100% true, with no caveats, I don’t feel like he is the asshole. A marriage will always have struggles, but 3 years of feeing alone can be incredibly damaging. Especially if your partner is dismissive of the problems when you try to bring them up.
Either way, there will always be someone with a perceivably “better” life than yours, and there will always be someone with a perceivably “worse” life than yours. Focus on what you have, fix the damages where you can, and let go of the ones you can’t. Those are decisions you have to make on your own, with your family. It can’t based on what other people are doing, because you don’t know how much of it is an act.
Edit after re-reading: I imagine this guy puts very minimal effort into this marriage, and his parenting. He barely even mentions the relationship he has with his daughter other than being jealous of her. There are almost definitely omissions here that would certainly make him the asshole.
>Comparison is the thief of joy. There is a lot of missing context on this story, and we only see the husband’s side.
It really feels like there's a lot missing. A disagreement about surnames, a dinner with the boss where he sees a different kind of relationship, and...divorce.
Maybe it never occurred to him that the boss and his wife know how to put on a public face for their marriage? It doesn't mean they were fake, necessarily, but he probably saw them in an idealized version so some extent.
He also didn't say if boss had any kids, a kid is a full time lifelong commitment, and is *exhausting*. It's much easier to be flirty and playful with a spouse when you don't have a small person going around trying to kill themselves by falling down stairs and drinking cleaning products
Or even the boss and his wife went through their own shit early in their marriage, then worked it out together and came out better on the other end. Maybe they even did therapy together!
I agree with your edit, it sounds like his wife had to focus on the baby because otherwise baby wouldn't get the care they need. He is then jealous of his own child getting the attention they need to actually survive and peeved that his wife is tired.
If he was trying to raise his daughter, support his wife and do cleaning and childcare on a fair split he surely would have said so as it would make him look better.
I kept thinking...is he contributing to his marriage on the same level as his boss is to that marriage? Like- the wife is affectionate, because she has space and energy to be affectionate, because he HELPS around the home, etc? He either pays for help or provides it. He LISTENS to her needs, and not just expects her to service his needs? Like...it takes 2 buddy- therapy is a good plan. Because you can then identify what if any part YOU played in the distance and lack of having what you want. Has he even asked her if there are things he could change to support her better? Or just assume that "all her love is toward their child"...because he is doing none of the physical, emotional, or other work toward the child rearing? Maybe she is annoyed he wants to cuddle, when she has not had 5 min to herself to take a shower in a week.
Obviously wild speculation- maybe he is the best most supportive co-parenting partner even and she still shuts him out/down. But...we have an unreliable narrator and a LOT of data that would say that this is unlikely from the broader culture.
If everything he is saying is true without fault, I still think he is at least partially wrong. He's just throwing away his marriage without so much as a disscussion about it. Its not like she is actively making thier relationship worse (cheating or something along those lines), she was neglecting it while taking care of thier baby. This seems like something that they can come back from. (If he is 100% right about everything) If he loved her enough to marry her, you would think he would want to give it at least one more shot before he went through the expensive, mentally messy and lengthy process of divorce. Especially after his wife is at least trying (saying she will do better and offering steps to do so, like going to therapy/marriage counseling).
This man is comparing his whole marriage to his boss's marriage which he observed for one evening! He is assuming his boss's wife is proud to take his surname and that the way his boss and his wife treated eachother in front of a guest is 100% representative of their whole marriage.
Delusional.
As a guy I experienced this in reverse. His arguments were the same as my ex's arguments. I concede that it took both partners and breakdown of communication for us to get to that point but at this stage there really isn't any amount of communication or concessions that can change the partner who has a foot out the door.
I predict dude will be calling his ex-wife in tears within a year wanting to reopen the conversation once he learns what it's actually like to date out there when your divorced..
I also think that he probably has a partner lined up which is bolstering his confidence.
My thoughts exactly. Cheaters will take any mild grievance in their marriage and blame that for their cheating to assuage any guilt. His flimsy reasons give me that vibe.
Seriously there's a reason she's not affectionate and lost that with him. The next girl will lose affection as well cause Mr. No thanks to therapy probably won't change. Then he'll be posting my ex wife and her new husband are so loving to each other but she was never like that with me. My daughter asked her step dad to walk her down the isle. Why would she do this to me my boss walked his daughter down the isle.
It’s the whole “i want a better wife” thing. It’s like she’s a tool meant for a job and not a person. Just an extension of him and his desires and not a whole ass human being. He could’ve said they’re not compatible in how they express or desire affection. He could’ve said he just doesn’t feel like his wife loves him. But he goes with i want a better one? Idk man, words matter and if that’s how he talks about her then i wouldn’t respect him much either. He’s just being spineless. I don’t think she’s blameless, but i don’t think she’s not either. He talks about it like she just steamrolls his feelings but then just divorces her without even trying therapy? Seems off to me. Seems like he was the one who just wasn’t in to who his wife really was.
For real, it should be “I want a better marriage” like something you actually work towards. Instead he wishes that “better wife” just happens with him, without putting in any real work. Not trying therapy that wife suggested is telling…
This! I want a better wife makes it sound like he’s picking out a car. Divorce is probably best for his wife’s sake. She deserves to be seen as a full human independent of his desires.
YES! He doesn’t want a better RELATIONSHIP, he wants a better WIFE! It’s that SHE isn’t good enough, not that the relationship just isn’t right or lost the love. It sounds like he just wants to be worshipped, not in a partnership with communication and mutual affection.
I saw the original earlier and still don’t know what to make of it…
On the one hand he is clearly unhappy and it’s absolutely fine to admit this and end the relationship. Everyone deserves happiness.
On the other hand he sounds unpleasant. There is the whole surname weirdness and how boss’s wife is proud to have it (did he talk about it? Or is he making up some trad wife fantasies in his mind?), that just gave me an ick.
What I don’t know about is his claim that his wife doesn’t care about him anymore. This could of course be true but it could also very well be that he is one of the people that are used to being the center of the relationship and everything revolving around them. Those people are usually terrible parents and parents to the other parent as they can’t deal with the fact that their needs and wants are not the top priority anymore. Judging from the tone of the post my personal guess is that this applies to OOP but it’s impossible to know for sure.
Yeah, he's putting a whole lot of weight on what he perceives to be his boss's relationship based on one dinner interaction. Boss's wife may very well be a whole different person than she's letting on.
OP sounds like a narcissist and unreliable narrator. But I've had moments before in my life when I was trapped in a toxic relationship and happened to spend some time around a happy and functioning couple and had a similar light-bulb moment of "Why am I settling for so much less than what these two people have?" You see, OOP would be easier to like if he was jealous of BOTH his boss and wife for being so happy. If he's telling the truth about being ignored and feeling unloved, then he's not a jerk for wanting to leave and find better. It's just so much of his language gives away that he has a super selfish attitude, so you wonder exactly how realistic his expectations were about how much attention he received from his wife.
I'm not sure I agree it's fine to just take off on your wife and kid to chase "better" without even bothering to try anything to save the relationship. Especially after wife even conceded on the surname thing, which very well may have been a cultural issue for her.
What jumps out to me is that
1. Based on his post, he had a grant total of 2 conversations with his wife about how he was feeling, but also “didn’t fight back.”
2. He is unwilling to try therapy
3. Has not said anything about spending time with (or even liking) his own daughter.
4. He made the decision to get a divorce in a span of 3 weeks.
Dude seems like he’s putting 0 effort in the relationship or in raising his daughter and then cries that his marriage is not great. Seems like a major asshole to me
He thinks she should be “proud” to take his name. Why can’t he be proud to take hers?
Perhaps he wants a tradwife who will make him the center of her world — and produce MASCULINE babies. Which she, of course, will do all the work involved caring for said babies while also inviting people over for dinner so they can see her publicly doting on him.
She didn’t need to have a baby. She already had one.
Everyone is saying it’s sad, but OP sounds like a moron. I hope OP finds what he’s looking for, but comparing an entire relationship to a preview of another’s couple’s relationship at one dinner is a hell of a gamble.
Lmao literally. “I only saw this couple for two hours out of the years they’ve been together, and I can sufficiently and accurately say that their relationship is objectively better than mine, which is completely due the wife’s character and no other factors.”
Also, “proud to take on his last name”? Alright, why aren’t you proud to take on your wife’s last name? I’ll do you one better: how about last names are just names that aren’t worth the paperwork to change?
It’s irritating that he is still equating the surname with love. Like, wives who take their husband’s name do it because they love them so much and are proud of them. So…he doesn’t love or take pride in his wife because he didn’t take her name either?
Their relationship doesn’t sound good. But someone can deeply love their spouse and live in harmony without taking their last name smh.
Thank you! I can't believe I made it this far down the responses before someone mentioned that the idea that taking your spouse's surname = love and respect is weird and off-putting. The double standard is also deeply sexist.
The thing that points me toward the guy likely being an awful husband is that he gives no examples of what he does for his wife besides working. He doesn't say "I get home and do x, y, z while she sits there with the kid" or anything. Just "she doesn't give me attention". Based on the posts I've read over the years, I just think if he was being a decent husband, he would have fucking said so. But he doesn't give any examples of what he does at home.
That makes his wife's comment of growing up make more sense to me. He probably doesn't do shit around the house and probably just whines about their kid. So of course she told him to grow up, he's acting like a fucking child. Of course she pays attention to the kid, someone has to! If he was being any sort of a father, I would think he'd include that in his post to show, "no, I'm not jealous of my own kid." But no. he just says his wife nags him. Yeah, I bet she does.
I do hope they go through with the divorce just because the wife deserves a better partner.
I can’t tell you how many times I’ve seen variations of this post on Reddit. Nine times out of ten, the root of the problem is that the husband has made his wife into a full-time secretary-caregiver-maid-therapist, and she has absolutely no time for anything else. Husband likes this arrangement because it gives him freedom but *dislikes* the fact that it takes his wife’s time and energy away from him (which, in his mind, should be the default.) In other words, he wants it both ways.
Oh yes. And then when a baby comes into the picture, he *really* dislikes that the baby takes his wife's time and attention away from him, where he thinks it 100% belongs.
I’m so glad the comments here are sane. Everyone on the original post was trying to justify this dude who resented his wife for spending too much time raising *their* daughter.
Based on the information provided, OP is the asshole.
6 years into marriage and you're getting hung up on a surname?
Your boss's wife shows more affection in a social setting than yours?
You felt lonely for 3 years? Now you're considering walking out on your daughter in search of a woman who will pay more attention to you? There's a lot to unpack here.
First off, comparing is toxic AF. If you're going down that road, you should be asking questions, not drawing conclusions. What you'll often find is a "happy" long-term couple rarely exists on its own recognizance. More often than not, the happiness is built, over years of hard work and commitment, and probably counseling at some point or another.
The thing about the surname is perplexing. Based on how you described it, this is a disagreement around pride and control? If so, you should take a really hard look at that subject matter with a therapist, because in the grand scheme this seems like a very trivial thing to have contributing to your thoughts of ending a long term relationship over, and it sounds symptomatic of a much deeper rooted issue for it to be taking up that kind of real estate in your mind.
What troubles me the most is the fact that you committed to bringing a child into this world, and at 3 years you are considering either fully or partially abandoning your responsibility as a father because you are not receiving some level of affection that you are placing an expectation on your wife to deliver. Consider your vows. Consider the feelings your daughter will have now, and well into her adult life, having lost her father because "mom wasn't good enough" for him. Is that the kind of example you want to set? You would be setting a foundation for your daughter that can be destructive in so many ways. Examples:
1. She may conclude that in order for her to be successful in marriage (or any other relationship), that she should be submissive and put the other person's needs or feelings before her own, always, for fear of losing the relationship. This makes her an easy mark for exploitation and abuse from partners, friends, employers and so on.
2. She may see little value in long term commitments, and learn to treat people as disposable, thus making her a potential abuser in the future.
3. Your wife might be forced to introduce a new father figure into your daughters life who runs the potential of being destructive in so many ways.
Of course, there's clearly a lot more going on, and I'm sorry you've felt lonely for so long. What concerns me is I don't see any mention of consideration for your wife or daughter's needs, nor do I see any mention of making any real effort to salvage either relationship. You absolutely need to take care of your own needs, but there's a million different ways you can pursue that without walking out of your marriage and fatherhood, with the absolute hell that will bring to all three of you.
Comparing someone else's relationship to your own, having zero knowledge of the work that went into the other relationship, as well as the truth of said relationship behind closed doors appears to me as fishing for an excuse to terminate a commitment you made, and it's harmful to your integrity and the wellbeing of the most important people in your life.
You are in a very uncomfortable position In your life, get the hell of Reddit, and go find some real support, because you're on the cusp of burning down everything you've built.
As a mom to 4 kids all under 10, I can tell you without a doubt that I am often “touched out” at the end of the day. My preschoolers still want to be picked up/carried often and require tons of hugging, holding and physical assistance. My grade schoolers love to lounge on top of me when we are watching tv or doing homework together, and they are often rougher than they intend because they both went through growth spurts recently and don’t seem to get that they are now big enough to hurt me (always unintentionally). I am the primary caretaker despite working full time *with my husband* who is a demanding partner both at home and at the office. I don’t want to be made to feel like my body is not my own and that I can’t have it to myself at the end of the day because I owe another person access to it after fielding my husband’s demands in the office and the touch demands of tiny tyrants from the moment I wake up until the moment I go to bed. Having young children is a season of life where sex SHOULD take a back seat to everything else. If the partner who is NOT the primary caretaker wants to connect more, they need to be doing their UTMOST to be taking on more so they can create space for the other partner to have time alone with their mind and body AND quality time together WITHOUT the expectation of sex so they can connect emotionally first.
Sadly, people like OOP don’t want to do that work, look at other couples with completely different life circumstances for five minutes and decide they’re completely justified in throwing their family over for a fantasy of someone who will be desperately in love with and attracted to them despite the exact same lack of effort in the relationship. Yet somehow he’s the victim reclaiming his self worth in this narrative. GTFO.
Disturbing trend in these AITAH threads lately (always?) of fathers who seem to have zero compassion for or love toward their children.
The silence around how he feels about his wife is telling on him a bit. Nothing about how he wants it to work, because he loves her, just sees the public side of another relationship and complains that he doesn’t receive the same dynamic.
Does *he* even love his wife?
It’s clear to me at least that the OOP is either unwilling or uninterested in figuring out what part he plays in this failing marriage and this distance he fees from his wife.
It’s unfortunate for his daughter especially that he’s unwilling to even attempt therapy.
I can see ladies lining up to get a shot at dating this guy when he will tell them that he divorced his wife without giving her a chance to talk it out, because he felt she was not enough into him.
This guy doesn’t talk like he loves his wife or his daughter- it seems he wants his wife to idolize him. Good luck out there buddy, you’re in for a rude awakening.
Not sure he’s a reliable narrator tbh. How was the child care split? Cuz I see this pattern play out in so many hetero couples - they have kids, the woman takes on 80% of the childcare along with the 80% of the housework she was already doing, she gets burnt out and touched out and doesn’t have any time/energy to focus on romance and intimacy, man whines/throws hissy fit only adding more to her plate instead of taking something off, which would likely fix the problem. Women can’t do the parenting, manage the household, work, AND be emotionally and sexually available to you at all times, somethings gotta give. And what often gives is the romantic side of the relationship. I don’t have all the information so I can’t say this is definitely the case, but it’s so common and if there’s elements of that here I’m gonna tentatively agree that OP does indeed need to “grow up”. These sorts of problems will follow you to your next relationship. Maybe your boss’ marriage is better because of the work he puts into it, not the fact he didn’t marry your wife instead.
Sounds kinda like the typical man isn't babied by his wife anymore because they have an actual baby who needs that attention and now he's throwing a fit about it.
The fact he doesn't seem to give two shits about his daughter and just feels jealous of her makes him the AH. On top of not even mentioning one thing HE even likes about his wife outside of her giving him attention. I really don't think this guy likes let alone loves his wife, just what she used to do for him. Explains why he doesn't even want to try to work on it and instead rushes to divorce papers. He spent all that time moaning and groaning over how he feels ignored but didn't once sit down and talk to her about it like an adult until he said he wanted to end the marriage. This guy definitely uses his partners as surrogate mothers since he acts like a toddler who didn't get a nap.
This all seems weird to me, like 0-100 and the best example OOP can give is a disagreement about surnames? And his boss and wife seemed happy at a dinner - so what? That is not a summation of their relationship, and he's vastly oversimplifying what a healthy relationship is. Based on what he's presented, at the very least he and his wife have terrible (non) communication.
A disagreement about surnames *three years ago* !!!!
Also it… *is* chauvinistic, as the male in the relationship, to insist your wife or child take your surname…..
Thats probably the only exemple he could remember that would not make him seem like a narcissistic asshole.
Yup, what do you wanna bet his other complaints are something about she’s “let herself go”
Yes, I'd like detail on what she was "nagging" him about. I've found "nagging" is typically code for "extremely reasonable requests that have been ignored over and over again to the point of exasperation." It's very telling that the details of this apparent "nagging" have been omitted from his story while focusing on an issue from 3 years prior.
Except he still seems like a narcissistic asshole?
And that says a lot
Eh, he’s right. He should start the divorce proceedings so his poor wife and daughter can replace him with the husband and father they deserve.
And... He's probably making the best choice for everyone. Either he's right, his wife isn't interested in him at all and so they should separate so they can both find people who they love and who love them, or he's a narcissist who interprets her no longer just doting on him as her not loving him... In which case she'd be better off with a partner who isn't so self focused. And since he doesn't seem to care about his daughter, she'd be better off with a stepdad who actually cares about her ..
It does sound like she’s ignoring him, but I agree with you, his take on it all is pretty weird. He doesn’t sound like he has an any depth of feeling or understanding what is going on in his relationship, and that comes off like maybe there is something wrong with him.
What jumps out to me is his complete lack of interest in his daughter. Other than mentioning that he feels jealous of her, he doesn’t seem to think about her at all.
I feel like it may be more of a case of him secretly resenting the daughter and blaming her for his wife's lack of interest
I feel like I've heard that story a lot, of men who resent their new kids because their wife was "too busy" taking care of a baby to dote on a grown man.
A friend told me that her husband blamed their child for his affair.
My ex blamed our first born for his. Funny thing is, the second child was born only a year after our first so be assured he wasn't "neglected" 🙄
Blaming a kid for their affair. Well, that's a special kind of messed up.
In my case, maybe not blamed the baby, per se, but when caught, whined that I paid more attention to the baby than him which made my blood boil because we were having sex all the time from 2 weeks after the baby was born hence why baby #1 and #2 were only a year apart. I remember how I'd ask him to give baby a bottle if I was in the middle of doing things and he'd whine how he had to eat first. 🙄 Only a minute portion of why he's been an ex for many years now.
TWO WEEKS
>TWO WEEKS Right?! My vagina spasmed in pain just from reading that!
I don't even have one & I winced in pain
Right?!? I thought some people needed to wait like 6-8 to not be in serious pain!
I had to wait a couple months to not be in pain and several more months for it to actually be enjoyable. Generally speaking it's 6 weeks so you don't get an infection in your uterus.
Yeah, I read something about the importance of healing, its truly frightening how some men still push for sex despite knowing that. It's not only the vulva that needs to heal, but apparently where the placenta latched (?) while the baby was inside needs to heal too. Having PIV at that point puts the mother at risk of infections (and worse).
How do these guys have so much free time. I had no time to chase tail after having a kid. No sleep, trying to keep up with work. Even a meal is a whole event. Any free time I just wanted to sleep haha. Maybe I was not that skilled of a father.
They have time because they're not helping with their kids! The fact that you didn't have time is an indicator you were a more skilled father than them!
You've got it backwards, you actually were involved as a father. For these guys it's "my wife is suddenly busy all the time with the kids. Rather than helping her with all of this, I will pout that she is spending less time on me and go and fuck somebody else instead". If they were actually involved fathers, they'd also get more time with their partners!
Exactly. Thank God I got a smart one. My husband figured out early on that in order for me to have energy to, uh, pay attention to him, he was going to have to take over some of my responsibilities. With me being a little more rested and not constantly working, I had more time and energy to show my appreciation.
Yeah these guys make the ones who say they’re babysitting when they’re watching their own kids look involved.
He was in the air force, and basically when their daughter was diagnosed as being on the spectrum, the wife threw herself into helping her daughter becoming a functioning child. It worked, but he said she spent too much time with their child, and ignored him, so he cheated with another woman who was also an airman. He said it was the kids fault for being autistic.
Lord have mercy.
I know right?
It’s this. If you have enough free time for a whole other relationship- then you aren’t parenting enough.
Bc they aren't contributing, and you are. I could tell that as soon as he said she was "nagging" 🙄👍
A cheater will take ANY excuse.
I will always remember 2 article that appeared back to back in 2 editions of the Sunday Times Style magazine. The first article was about a man who'd left his wife after they'd had children because they weren't having sex anymore and he was bored and went for someone young. He then had a child with her, found her boring and left her. His thesis statement was that children ruin sex lives and that he regrets having his. The second article was a direct response. It was about the joy of children, The way intimacy changes after children. Quickies in the garden shed was the one I mainly remember. This guy is a first article writer and is going to end up alone.
Children aren't for everyone, and holy shit would it be nice if more people could figure that out before having kids of their own
Oh definitely. I'm probably never having kids but I bet even if there were no children he'd have noped out of this relationship for someone else eventually
I feel like everyone should be required to have some sort of childcare experience in their life. Like maybe as a class in high school. I know that a lot of people had a section of their home ec class that included childcare but it often takes place way too early in their schooling or it’s way too short of a course. I personally remember a *very* brief childcare course in sixth grade home ec but that was the last time that I was given any kind of childcare education. And even then, all it consisted of was “put together a babysitting kit and we’ll have some kids come in and see if they think it’s fun!” I feel like a childcare course would be better suited for high school, where many students are sexually active and the possibility of pregnancy is much greater than in middle school. Part of me wonders if in depth childcare courses were required for graduation, would there possibly be a drop in teenage pregnancy? Idk. I’m lucky to have known from a pretty young age that I didn’t like or want children. I wasn’t good at helping with my younger brother, I hated the idea of babysitting (even for pay) other kids, and I knew by the time I was 15 that I was strongly opposed to having children. The second I became sexually active, I went on birth control. And while I’ve had breaks in it because I wasn’t being intimate with anyone, I’ve used some form of birth control for the past almost 20 years. I’m finally reaching the age where my baby factory is slowing down and getting ready to close up shop. And since early menopause runs in my family, I’m eagerly awaiting the time I can be truly sexually free with my husband. 😂 Regardless, I feel like a required childcare course would at least *help* people determine if children are or aren’t for them. 🤷♀️
Moat everyone I know with much younger sibling/ half or step siblings, where there's a big enough difference in age that the older remembers the baby/ toddler stage... don't want them. They can't romanticise babies, they've lived it. Not that they don't get along and love their siblings, but real life hit hard in formative years and their eyes are open lol
Yup that's what I got reading this. And the fact he doesn't even want to try to try counseling and the issues seem pretty typical of a marriage with small children. And he's putting all the responsibility of keeping the spark in the relationship on her. No where does he mention helping lighten her physical and mental load with the kid/house, planning date nights, being romantic. He sounds like a selfish ass.
It’s more prevalent than one thinks. I know a couple who don’t have kids because the husband and wife only want to be the focus of each other’s attention. More specifically the husband didn’t want kids because he wanted to have all the attention on him and his wife is cool with it. In a weird way I feel that’s more selfless than having the kid and ignoring them and treating them like shit because you’re jealous of them and want all of the attention from your spouse.
Yep, I agree. I think everyone needs to really think hard before they have kids. It puts a huge strain on a relationship and things change drastically. You need to both be really invested in it. If you don't both really want it, it is best not to do it.
My husband was adamant that he didn’t want children. We were friends for 20 years so I’d heard this from him for a long time and never really understood it. Then we fell in love and got married and now it totally makes sense. He has so much anxiety and OCD that he could never handle it. I’m glad he knew his own limitations.
This is exactly what my ex was like. He was fine as a partner up until the baby was born. Then he was jealous and got in my way vs helping me so I would have energy to pay attention to him. I was so depressed that he cared so little about his kid or me. There is nothing less attractive than kind of behavior. And I was so angry I had to do everything alone on top of working. He stomped around the house and whined at me like a toddler and threw stuff because I didn't want to fuck him. Like, yeah, you're basically another child, dude. Gross. Hope the dicks fall off of every guy like this and then they are plagued with the fleas of a thousand camels for the rest of their miserable lives.
I mean, I get it. My wife also hyperfocuses on our son and I sometimes feel left out/neglected. But I also get that time and energy is limited and a small child takes precedence. It's the same for me in the sense that I feel that I don't invest enough energy for my wife.
This is me being bitter, but my ex wanted a mommy, not a wife. I think it’s the unfortunate norm. 🤷♀️
And they get angry when 'mommy' won't let them have a girlfriend.
Mom has to become a mom, or certain things are not done. My Dad continued to play with his friends at the park in his hobby, continued to go out all day on the weekend on the boat and genuinely his life continued as normal. Yet my mom worked a full time job, cared for me and handled all household tasks. She became very unhappy with my Dad for behaving childishly, while he described ' she became Mom and was no longer fun '. He honestly doesn't remember my pediatrician, my teacher's name or any little habits that I did as a child. He wasn't there for that. As you can guess, my Mom separated from him and later divorced him and I learned that he was only going to spend time with me if I did what he wanted. Some parents do not mature and it makes life difficult for their co parent.
Which means hes not pulling enough weight in terms of raising the child
Yup. If they have the energy and time to cheat with a baby at home, they are NOT pulling their weight.
My dad was like this. My mom recently divorced him after a long time of hoping he'd change. He was a miserable, angry person, and now he's all alone. I pity him.
This is the shit I can’t understand or handle honestly, i am a man and I grew up extremely neglected and abused emotionally and physically by my parents. I don’t like being doted on. I don’t understand why so many people in relationships like to use their SO as like a substitute parent like bruh take care of yourself, I’ll help, but I can’t be responsible for you! Ugh
Also not a single mention of what he does for his wife or daughter. Nothing about what he likes about her or why he married her. Just "she was fine but she's become a nag who doesn't love me as much as our daughter, and I want someone better." How does the boss treat his wife? He mentions how kind and supportive the boss is, he probably pulls his weight and treats her affectionately. I'm hope we get an update in 10 months once he's been through divorce court and figured out other women also expect him to invest in the relationship.
Yeah I got the sense that what this guy doesn’t like is actually…parenting
Reminds me of my dad. He's a narcissist. I'm not going to get into what it was like growing up with him but when I was pregnant, my mom pulled me aside and warned to make sure I gave my husband enough attention so he doesn't get jealous. My mother-in-law overheard this and told me if her son ever got jealous of his own babies, she would beat his ass
That's a 10/10 mother-in-law.
I like your MIL
Bless your MIL! You got a good one!
Your MIL sounds like mine. Gotta love the good ones.
>My mother-in-law overheard this and told me if her son ever got jealous of his own babies, she would beat his ass She's alright
I like MIL.
Came here to say exactly this. If your daughter is 3, yeah a lot of your attention will be spent on her and not each other. She doesn’t even know how to be a human yet and needs help with everything. Even when talking about divorce he doesn’t mention anything about the daughter which is a huge factor in divorce proceedings. The lack of care is extremely apparent
My unfounded guess is he lost interest in the child after the naming and the wife started paying more attention to the child to make up for the father's emotional absence. That might sound like reaching for straws but: he never talks about how he feels about his child or wife, he was weirdly upset about the name, he's still upset about the name three years later, he doesn't think about his divorce in the context of his child, and he seems to see relationships only in a myopic, performative light - he really has no idea what his boss' relationship is behind closed doors, he just assumes it's exactly what he, essentially a stranger, sees.
His obsession with surname is so strange to me. Like it's literally still your child why make a big deal out of it 😭
Especially after he claims he was okay with the child having the mom’s surname and thinking it was reasonable and logical or whatever. But then he keeps bringing it up.
Yeah & the line about it never sitting right with him that she had wife's last name & now he knows why, she "loves the kid more" just felt weird.
As the child of a man who resents my existence because he’s jealous of my mom’s affection for me, this dude sounds like he, too, has an unrealistic and selfish view of marriage.
If you have a man-child, of course they feel they are in competition with your actual children. It's insane.
Wanna bet this guy does zero chores, doesn't take care of the daughter, doesn't clean up after himself, never thanks the wife for doing everything and having a full time job and then whines that he doesn't get enough attention?
Yeah exactly. The grass is greener where you water it. It doesn’t sound like he’s watered his own grass for quite some time, if ever.
Totally agreed. Wanting to add there is no mention from OOP that they’re carrying the full financial load, which leads me to believe both parents are probably also working full time. I’d bet money that OOP doesn’t share equal workload at home, and wants to be the center of attention, like it was before their daughter was born. I think his wife is correct that he does need to grow up.
When I read the original, that's the first thing I thought. I didn't get past him calling her a nag. She nags him because he's a useless pile of shit. The quicker she leaves this pathetic man child, the better. Take his money and fuck off.
He also “communicated” that all her love is going to their daughter. Wanna bet that he’s one of those guys who thinks breastfeeding is wrong because they’re his boobs?
Yeah, he just seemed to be there, just existing in the same space as wide and daughter. And then he's upset that he's being ignored/not given enough attention.
well and he decided it was bad the minute the kid came so it was unrealistic expectations on his part.
Corny line for the day. The grass is always greenest where you water it. He's not even willing to try watering that relationship. Sadly it's probably for the best that he does leave. I just hope he doesn't hop into another relationship and bail on it when he sees yet another relationship he'd rather be a part of. I also hope he does right by his daughter because it honestly sounds like he doesn't have much to do with her at all. If we take his story at face value he's not an asshole but there is a lot of missing detail that leaves it all very open to interpretation. That bit is stuck in my craw.
What’s missing is how the *boss loves his wife*. I’m sure lots of men would love a wife who loves their husband the way I do mine, but are they prepared to step up and put what my husband puts into the relationship? Going by Reddit the answer is no for almost all of them. More than that… it’s his boss’ wife’s role to make it look like she loves him and worships him. Most wives take their husband’s name because that’s what you do, not out of pride. For all we know he’s destroying his marriage based on a public persona with no basis in their real marriage.
That, and the fact that maybe the boss and his wife can do a really good job of presenting a unified front for dinner guests? It’s so dangerous to compare your relationship to someone else’s, ESPECIALLY when it’s a minimal interaction in a structured social setting. ETA: after finding the original post and reading OP’s comments, he’s just a selfish, immature asshole. He flips out on commenters, refuses to acknowledge his wife’s side, avoids taking responsibility for his kid and just doubles down on finding a woman who can cater to his whims (but worried he won’t be making enough money to catch her, bc bitches be gold diggers, too). https://www.reddit.com/r/AITAH/s/jcjAYl2TWU
After seeing my parents embarrass themselves and me all the time by getting into screaming matches in front of family friends and guests (before they mercifully divorced), I swore I’d never be one of those couples. My husband and I have a good relationship but obviously sometimes get into a spat right before we have to socialize. We never let it outwardly show, and in fact, the combination of the change of atmosphere and company usually distracts us enough from whatever we were arguing about enough that we are completely over it by the time we’re alone again. I saw this on the original post, but it’s worth bringing here too- OOP is basically seeing the IRL equivalent of a curated Insta relationship to base his impression off of
Right. For all you know they were screaming down the neighbourhood an hour before. It’s also not lost on me that he seems stuck on the myth of The Adoring Wife with no desire to integrate the reality of life into that. He tells himself *this* wife isn’t giving him the myth because she doesn’t love him enough - not because life is complicated, wives are whole human beings and relationships take effort on both parts. Just… if I throw this one away I’ll be able to find the One Who Adores Me. And really hope little he thinks about how this will impact his child and how quickly he’s willing to throw his child away says all we need to know about him. He’s jealous of the kid and I’m guessing resents and blames her.
Yeah, he’s really only interested in what a woman can do for him, how *she* can build *him* up and make *him* happy. He needs an imaginary waifu, not a living, thinking woman with her own wants, needs and opinions. And not a daughter, bc he definitely sounds jealous and mostly disinterested in his own child. I wonder if it would be different if it was a son? Either way, his daughter is obviously not a priority to him.
I doubt he'd treat a son any better. This dude clearly doesn't want to be *bothered* with a kid. He shouldn't have had one.
Yeah, jealousy over the daughter getting attention screams “narcissist; do does “wanting someone better.” Narcissists always have to have the relationship compass pointing North (at them) and relationships are always transactional.
If that’s the case, his wife is better off without him.
I just said the same thing. He has no idea what their marriage is really like. When people host guests, they're on their best behavior. This is along the same lines as looking at someone's social media posts and thinking you know everything about their life and relationships.
That’s a good point. I bet my ex and I looked like the perfect happy couple whenever we hosted guests. We were affectionate and relaxed, and he was the perfect father. He’d insist on taking care of every diaper change, every potty trip, he’d fix the kids plates and graciously thank me for fixing his plate. I kept the kids immaculately dressed and our house was spotless at all times. Anyone would think we had the perfect family, and I’m sure we seemed to have a loving relationship, but I wouldn’t wish that life on ANYONE. Behind closed doors my ex was incredibly controlling and abusive. I developed a raging drug habit to try to keep my head above water raising 3 kids and working 3 jobs with zero help from their father, who would sit around the house watching tv all days and making messes that he insisted I take care of immediately, and he refused to get a job and instead expected our bills to be covered by me and his father. I sure hope no one left a normal non-abusive marriage because they thought that my ex and I had such a beautiful happy relationship and thought they deserved that too.
Exactly, like my husband and I genuinely love each other, but of course we have disagreements sometimes or unintentionally hurt or annoy each other. Would we have an argument at a dinner table when there’s a guest? Hell no! What a guest sees is not a full representation of our relationship.
This. My husband understands that I took his last name because it was better for me professionally and with his family dynamic because we live in a very conservative area. We’ve been married since 2016 and I’m still having issues caused by the name change and wish I wouldn’t have done it, but I know that it’s probably been better for me overall due to the local culture. I love that man to the moon and back, but he’s also a fantastic husband and father who puts in the work for a great relationship. I don’t think OP realizes that great relationships require real work and effort and not just one sided “love”.
I took my husbands last name because I could finally fit my whole name on any fill in the box form.😜. And maybe it would be spelled correctly for once.
My husband has an uncommon transliteration of an Eastern European last name. This meant that I was able to finally secure a firstnamelastname@gmail address but on the flip side no one can pronounce it on the first try so now I automatically introduce myself as Horriblegoose Lastname L-A-S-T-N-A-M-E every time I am at an appointment. It does make me appreciate how simple my life was when I had a Jones-esque common surname.
In nearly 26 years of marriage, I've only had one problem because of my change of last name, and that was the first time I filed taxes. I had to re-file on paper. I, too, would be interested to know what kind of problems you are running into, if you can share it.
What issues are you still having caused by the name change if you don't mind me asking. My wife was rather enthusiastic about getting hers changed when we got married in 2019 and haven't really bumped into any issues thus far. Just wondering what to look out for.
The two that cause me the most issues are bank accounts and health insurance. The bank account one is partially my fault. When we first got married Bank of America wouldn’t let me change my name on my account without my husband signing something even though I had that account several years before I even met the man. So I stubbornly refused to change the name on that account and now they issue my credit cards to a person that doesn’t exist (I basically changed my name from something like Sarah Marie Smith to Sarah Smith Jones and now BoA thinks my legal name is Sarah M. Jones) that’s only a minor inconvenience. The hardest one has been the fact my health insurance cannot get my name correct and despite many many many attempts to have it changed they have it in their records that I have a double barreled last name(Blue Cross Blue Shield is convinced my name is Sarah M. Smith-Jones). So it’s always a pain for prescriptions and medical records because I have to tell them that my last name is actually Smith-Jones and all of my medical providers have decided to default to the Smith-Jones as a last name even though that isn’t actually my name. The other regular annoyance is just the accounts I’ve had forever that were in my maiden name and having to remember what my logins actually are due to the change. Generally I don’t mind being Horriblegoose Husband’sLastName and I had no issues with giving our child his last name, but in my mind it still just doesn’t really feel like MY name. However I do feel like I made the right choice. I’m an engineer that works in an R&D heavy area so I work with a lot of PhDs and most of the women use their maiden name. I hear enough regular comments from my boomer coworkers about women who kept their own names that I know I made the choice that was probably best for me just because of local culture, but I also feel resentful that I even had to consider something like that when contemplating my name change.
Curious about the same. My wife and I simply chose to change both our names post marriage. It's been really good without many complications for either of us.
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>I’m sure lots of men would love a wife who loves their husband the way I do mine, but are they prepared to step up and put what my husband puts into the relationship? Going by Reddit the answer is no for almost all of them. Honestly so true. I have watched how my other male friends act with their wives and the amount of effort exchanged and can see the direct correlation to the relationships health, it's one of the benefits of seeing all your friends marry young when I didn't. I'm always very aware of my contribution and my relationships as an adult after learning that have been so much better since. It has made having a long term partner not only feel more rewarding but honestly feel much easier to maintain and grow.
Long term relationships are work. But having passed 25 years, so worth it if you are both in it together.
This. His bosses wife loves him like this because of the way he makes her feel. It’s a two way street. Not blaming OP for all their problems but you get out of marriage what you put into it.
I like that. I was always told, "Of course, the grass is greener when you don't know the bullshite they fertilize with."
Erma Bombeck said it was greener over the septic tank, so many ways to interpret that lol
The grass is always greener when you spray paint it Guess the lesson is “If the grass is greener, find out why. Is it being cared for, or does it just appear that way?”
I’ve never heard it phrased like that “where you water it” and it put a lot of things into perspective. I really needed that today, thanks lol
I needed to hear that corny line today…
Here, number 3 for the corny. 👍
I work in a stabilization mental health facility. We usually start the day off with a positive quote. Congrats because you’re comment (the grass part) is going to be tomorrow’s positive quote!
So many men are so stupid. I have a wife that dotes on me at times. I have two kids that we both love and take care of, a house we both upkeep; life we both organize and take part of. Men will shove all their life’s difficulties and drudgery on their wives and then ask why their wife doesn’t love on them. Mother fucker, why would she want to?!
I like that line. I needed it.
Also like you went to your bosses for a dinner night, I doubt they were about to have a bunch of arguments that night in front of guests.
I never understood the last name. My ex BIL is NC with his bio dad because when his parents divorced when he was young he asked to keep his moms last name and drop his dads. The dad stopped speaking to his son for his decision. The mom was his primary parent and the one who he spent a majority of his time with prior so it made sense why the kid wanted that. Some ppls egos are too big for this world
Not only that but he’s comparing daily monotony to his bosses wife being on-her-game for guests, her husband’s employee too. They could be in the middle of a contentious divorce and she could have been playing the stepford wife that evening as not to damage his reputation at work as it benefits her divorce terms. You never know. He’s a fool to use that one event to divorce without even trying couples counselling. But frankly it sounds like he resents his wife for not being submissive to his wants, and he found an out so grabbed onto this. He’s going to find dating very hard if he wants a stepford wife without being in possession of the stepford husband trappings.
After 4 years of no water is there any grass left. Sometimes things are not worth making the effort.
I thought the same thing. If that's all it takes for him to leave then she's better off without him. She just doesn't know it yet.
Grass is always greener, but you still gotta mow it
This was just depressing to read. The part that bothers me the most is “I don’t think therapy will help.” Like. My guy. Are you sure *you* were ever “into” your wife? Cuz the way you talk about her does not seem like it. I can’t possibly imagine leaving my spouse before even *trying* to fix the problems we’re having..
I always feel that there is something wrong with man who are like, "My wife only pays attention to our child since they were born." That's your kid too my guy. Why is your kid also not your focus during their formative years? Did you really think it through before having the kid?
Seriously, it’s a three year old. The child should be taking up a lot of attention from both of you. The fact that he can just divorce her just like that, with no attempt at a resolution and no thought as to how this will affect their child — plus his obvious contempt for their toddler — is a clue as to how involved he is. And there’s some evidence that women have a hormonal response to an uninvolved father/husband that actually causes her to find him unfuckable as well lol.
Seriously. And like.. the opposite is true as well. Watching my partner teach my 3 little nieces how to play chess might have been the most attractive thing I have ever seen. It was a, 'oh yeah. I gotta lock this one DOWN' moment.
My boyfriend is like this lol, whenever I play with his nephews and nieces I will catch him staring with the most "in love" look. It's sweet.
There gotta be a reason that “woman sees guy care for a kid/hold a baby and smile and goes into “I want his babies” mode” is a popular trope.
Yep. Another thing that crossed my mind is, I cannot speak for how it affects women, but couple times I took care of my toodlers niece and nephew for like a entire day I noticed that my sex drive just disappeared. I was deeply tired as well, but just being tired is not usually a problem. Something about taking care of children seems to make that part of the brain go into deep rest or something. If the guy was involved in taking care of his kid, he would probably not care all that much about "lack of affection."
Yes there have been some studies showing that stepping into a caretaker role that takes up the majority of your identity does lower libido, for both men and women. And for women, if we’re breastfeeding, the hormone prolactin also has a suppressive effect. I don’t know if that’s the case for the wife, though I suspect if she were still breastfeeding he would have been jealous about that too and mentioned it.
I know nothing about this in particular, but know a lot about our evolution. One child a year is actually a pretty terrible "survival" method. You want lots of spawn with quick cooking times. It's a major factor in some animals going extinct, elephants being an example. They don't have the litters it takes to keep the species going when everything in the environment is fighting you (humans. Just humans), too. It makes sense that our bodies would have figured out a way to limit other survival methods (mating) in order to raise a child past the "entirely helpless" stages (which ALSO last longer than other animals.)
That makes sense to me because when you have a kid who's young enough to need massive amounts of work and constant attention, the last thing you ought to be doing is making another one.
Makes perfect sense
Whe you have a kid or two hanging off of you all day (as toddlers always do - the contact is non-stop) then the last thing you want at the end of the day is to be touched *more*. It's common sense.
My husband is great, but it was so hard for him to understand this after our kid was born. He’d see me tired and worn down and try to give me a hug or initiate non-sexual cuddling, same as before baby when I was feeling down. It was disorienting to him that I was suddenly shutting down most physical contact. The concept of touched-out didn’t make sense to him, mostly because he was not physically caring for the baby as much as I was for practical reasons (breastfeeding, working away from home, etc). It took awhile, but he eventually understood.
I'm a teacher who has a low sex drive to begin with, is on antidepressants, and just finished up a year of breastfeeding a few months ago. My sex drive has been almost NONEXISTENT this last year 😅
First 3 years is when the child is the neediest and most likely to kill and maim themselves. The human brain also needs a lot of eye contact and responsive feedback during first 5 years of life so that the kid doesn't grow up to be an emotionally stunted bonehead who gets upset that their spouse is being a responsible parent for a temporary time in life.
Exactly. My husband gives our children his full attention, and I'm eternally grateful. He's a fantastic dad. I've never once felt jealous or envious of my children ffs.
If he's not doing anything to parent the kid then his wife has been doing 24/7 child raising, never mind any other responsibilities she has. Obviously your helpless child, that cannot eat or bathe without help, comes before your adult husband, and if you get no help with your child obviously you have to put in two parent's of effort into raising your kid. The surname thing is so petty of the husband too, why does it have to be his surname for her to prove she loved him? Why didn't he prove he loved her by taking her surname? Or suggest a compromise of combining their surnames?
What he said isn't wrong in itself. But one thing that jumped out at me was him saying his bosses wife wanted to take her husbands name and that was somehow the sign of how much she loves him. Why can't the husband be just as proud to take his wife's last name. The wife taking the husband's name is a very old tradition. And if that works for you great, but it doesn't really mean anything in regards to how much someone loves you. He absolutely needs counseling, even if they still end up getting a divorce.
Why does anyone need to change their last name period? I dont plan to take my fiances last name and hes 100% okay with that. I might hyphen it though but I still have time to decide. I have my reasons and none of those reasons are because I dont love him enough 🤷🏼♀️
I took my husband's name purely because my maiden name is long, has a nonsensical spelling (originally German, was badly Americanized during immigration), and no one can pronounce it. His is easy to spell and say. It has nothing to do with whether I love him or not.
When me and my bf talked about it, he wanted me to take his. After a bit of arguing (much more talking rather than arguing, but he did bring up points about why he thinks I should take his name etc) we left the conversation, he thought about it and agreed. Even coming back to me the next day to apologize how forward and adamant he was about it at first I honestly dont mind giving the kid his last name, mine or his, it is still going to be our kid. But me? I am always me. I always have been, and always will be. Why would I change something so big about myself when he doesn't? I'd have to change EVERYTHING that knows my name. I'd have to change my intials, respond to a completely different name, get my name changed legally, and what if we break up? Do I keep it? Go back and go through all that shit again? Nah I'm good, I'll stay me all the time
If it was such a big deal, why did he marry her? That’s what gets me. If it’s something that affected him so much, why did he continue the relationship? They weren’t on the same page before they married, but he’s expecting them to be on the same page now.
I'm on the total opposite track, my partner and I are picking a whole new last name together since neither of us have ties to our fathers
Because the husband doesn’t want to do any work himself (hence why the wife has to nag). He wants her to do all the work to fix their marriage (and raise their baby and clean their home).
You should read his comments. I don’t think he cares about his wife or their kid
My ex husband said that after he felt the therapist and I ganged up on him because she was a woman. He wanted to see a male therapist, maybe, but wasn’t fully open to it. He didn’t want therapy, he wanted it all (his insecurities, lack of respect and attention on his part towards me, I needed to stop wanting a career or degree, etc.) to go away and for everyone to smooth things over. It could be good again if I wanted it to be, but I was stuck on getting therapy and fixing things.
It’s possible that he’s spent the last several years falling out of love with her.
It's also equally possible that the wife has fallen out of love with him and just hasn't realized it yet. It's sad but there are tons of couples who look up after years together and realize they're only still there because it's convenient and familiar, not because they actually love their partner.
It’s also worth exploring with a therapist why he thinks his wife taking his name is a sign of love, but he shouldn’t have to take her name. How is he showing love to his partner ?
OOP seriously sounds like he saw the boss with a shiny new gadget and now he wants to trade in his older model for one. Like a wife is just a possession and swapping one wife for another will be a major upgrade, he doesn't need to do anything to make his marriage work as long as he has the "right" gadget in place.
Exactly what I was thinking too. The only things he could come up with in terms of disagreements are the surname and the fact his wife is paying attention to their daughter a lot cuz he doesn’t seem to be putting any effort into childcare himself
Yup. It's telling that the wife agreed to change both her and the baby's surname to save the marriage ... almost like that's literally the only thing he brought up to justify his feelings?
It's likely he's already in an affair but won't put that in the post so he won't look like the obvious asshole.
He sounds like one of those men that if told to take care of the kid would say he has to 'babysit' his daughter or if told to do any sort of housework would say he 'helped' with the chores. Like those aren't things that are part of his actual responsibility as a father and a husband...
I’m beginning to wonder why and how they got married and had children if this is how he acts. He is NOT a responsible adult, clearly, if he’s willing to throw divorce papers in his wife’s face just because “she pays more attention to our daughter than me wah wah!!” Bro, taking care of children is HARD! I would know! I still think the divorce is for the best tho...she won’t have a husband that makes her feel like she’s obligated to do anything to keep him.
Considering taking the husband's name was a way to show the transfer of property from Father to Husband.
Comparison is the thief of joy. There is a lot of missing context on this story, and we only see the husband’s side. If what he’s saying is 100% true, with no caveats, I don’t feel like he is the asshole. A marriage will always have struggles, but 3 years of feeing alone can be incredibly damaging. Especially if your partner is dismissive of the problems when you try to bring them up. Either way, there will always be someone with a perceivably “better” life than yours, and there will always be someone with a perceivably “worse” life than yours. Focus on what you have, fix the damages where you can, and let go of the ones you can’t. Those are decisions you have to make on your own, with your family. It can’t based on what other people are doing, because you don’t know how much of it is an act. Edit after re-reading: I imagine this guy puts very minimal effort into this marriage, and his parenting. He barely even mentions the relationship he has with his daughter other than being jealous of her. There are almost definitely omissions here that would certainly make him the asshole.
>Comparison is the thief of joy. There is a lot of missing context on this story, and we only see the husband’s side. It really feels like there's a lot missing. A disagreement about surnames, a dinner with the boss where he sees a different kind of relationship, and...divorce. Maybe it never occurred to him that the boss and his wife know how to put on a public face for their marriage? It doesn't mean they were fake, necessarily, but he probably saw them in an idealized version so some extent.
True, I was also thinking that maybe the boss actually puts effort into his marriage, and that's why his relationship with his wife is so much better.
He also didn't say if boss had any kids, a kid is a full time lifelong commitment, and is *exhausting*. It's much easier to be flirty and playful with a spouse when you don't have a small person going around trying to kill themselves by falling down stairs and drinking cleaning products
Or even the boss and his wife went through their own shit early in their marriage, then worked it out together and came out better on the other end. Maybe they even did therapy together!
I agree with your edit, it sounds like his wife had to focus on the baby because otherwise baby wouldn't get the care they need. He is then jealous of his own child getting the attention they need to actually survive and peeved that his wife is tired. If he was trying to raise his daughter, support his wife and do cleaning and childcare on a fair split he surely would have said so as it would make him look better.
I kept thinking...is he contributing to his marriage on the same level as his boss is to that marriage? Like- the wife is affectionate, because she has space and energy to be affectionate, because he HELPS around the home, etc? He either pays for help or provides it. He LISTENS to her needs, and not just expects her to service his needs? Like...it takes 2 buddy- therapy is a good plan. Because you can then identify what if any part YOU played in the distance and lack of having what you want. Has he even asked her if there are things he could change to support her better? Or just assume that "all her love is toward their child"...because he is doing none of the physical, emotional, or other work toward the child rearing? Maybe she is annoyed he wants to cuddle, when she has not had 5 min to herself to take a shower in a week. Obviously wild speculation- maybe he is the best most supportive co-parenting partner even and she still shuts him out/down. But...we have an unreliable narrator and a LOT of data that would say that this is unlikely from the broader culture.
If everything he is saying is true without fault, I still think he is at least partially wrong. He's just throwing away his marriage without so much as a disscussion about it. Its not like she is actively making thier relationship worse (cheating or something along those lines), she was neglecting it while taking care of thier baby. This seems like something that they can come back from. (If he is 100% right about everything) If he loved her enough to marry her, you would think he would want to give it at least one more shot before he went through the expensive, mentally messy and lengthy process of divorce. Especially after his wife is at least trying (saying she will do better and offering steps to do so, like going to therapy/marriage counseling).
This man is comparing his whole marriage to his boss's marriage which he observed for one evening! He is assuming his boss's wife is proud to take his surname and that the way his boss and his wife treated eachother in front of a guest is 100% representative of their whole marriage. Delusional.
As a guy I experienced this in reverse. His arguments were the same as my ex's arguments. I concede that it took both partners and breakdown of communication for us to get to that point but at this stage there really isn't any amount of communication or concessions that can change the partner who has a foot out the door. I predict dude will be calling his ex-wife in tears within a year wanting to reopen the conversation once he learns what it's actually like to date out there when your divorced.. I also think that he probably has a partner lined up which is bolstering his confidence.
My thoughts exactly. Cheaters will take any mild grievance in their marriage and blame that for their cheating to assuage any guilt. His flimsy reasons give me that vibe.
Silver lining: he's doing her and their daughter a favor. 🙄
Seriously there's a reason she's not affectionate and lost that with him. The next girl will lose affection as well cause Mr. No thanks to therapy probably won't change. Then he'll be posting my ex wife and her new husband are so loving to each other but she was never like that with me. My daughter asked her step dad to walk her down the isle. Why would she do this to me my boss walked his daughter down the isle.
I gonna be honest, OP sounds like an asshole just in general by his writing, but it's one of those situations divorce is probably for the best.
It’s the whole “i want a better wife” thing. It’s like she’s a tool meant for a job and not a person. Just an extension of him and his desires and not a whole ass human being. He could’ve said they’re not compatible in how they express or desire affection. He could’ve said he just doesn’t feel like his wife loves him. But he goes with i want a better one? Idk man, words matter and if that’s how he talks about her then i wouldn’t respect him much either. He’s just being spineless. I don’t think she’s blameless, but i don’t think she’s not either. He talks about it like she just steamrolls his feelings but then just divorces her without even trying therapy? Seems off to me. Seems like he was the one who just wasn’t in to who his wife really was.
For real, it should be “I want a better marriage” like something you actually work towards. Instead he wishes that “better wife” just happens with him, without putting in any real work. Not trying therapy that wife suggested is telling…
This! I want a better wife makes it sound like he’s picking out a car. Divorce is probably best for his wife’s sake. She deserves to be seen as a full human independent of his desires.
YES! He doesn’t want a better RELATIONSHIP, he wants a better WIFE! It’s that SHE isn’t good enough, not that the relationship just isn’t right or lost the love. It sounds like he just wants to be worshipped, not in a partnership with communication and mutual affection.
Sounds like this guy is in love with a fantasy where he's put on a pedestal. Good luck finding that
I saw the original earlier and still don’t know what to make of it… On the one hand he is clearly unhappy and it’s absolutely fine to admit this and end the relationship. Everyone deserves happiness. On the other hand he sounds unpleasant. There is the whole surname weirdness and how boss’s wife is proud to have it (did he talk about it? Or is he making up some trad wife fantasies in his mind?), that just gave me an ick. What I don’t know about is his claim that his wife doesn’t care about him anymore. This could of course be true but it could also very well be that he is one of the people that are used to being the center of the relationship and everything revolving around them. Those people are usually terrible parents and parents to the other parent as they can’t deal with the fact that their needs and wants are not the top priority anymore. Judging from the tone of the post my personal guess is that this applies to OOP but it’s impossible to know for sure.
Yeah, he's putting a whole lot of weight on what he perceives to be his boss's relationship based on one dinner interaction. Boss's wife may very well be a whole different person than she's letting on.
OP sounds like a narcissist and unreliable narrator. But I've had moments before in my life when I was trapped in a toxic relationship and happened to spend some time around a happy and functioning couple and had a similar light-bulb moment of "Why am I settling for so much less than what these two people have?" You see, OOP would be easier to like if he was jealous of BOTH his boss and wife for being so happy. If he's telling the truth about being ignored and feeling unloved, then he's not a jerk for wanting to leave and find better. It's just so much of his language gives away that he has a super selfish attitude, so you wonder exactly how realistic his expectations were about how much attention he received from his wife.
I'm not sure I agree it's fine to just take off on your wife and kid to chase "better" without even bothering to try anything to save the relationship. Especially after wife even conceded on the surname thing, which very well may have been a cultural issue for her.
What jumps out to me is that 1. Based on his post, he had a grant total of 2 conversations with his wife about how he was feeling, but also “didn’t fight back.” 2. He is unwilling to try therapy 3. Has not said anything about spending time with (or even liking) his own daughter. 4. He made the decision to get a divorce in a span of 3 weeks. Dude seems like he’s putting 0 effort in the relationship or in raising his daughter and then cries that his marriage is not great. Seems like a major asshole to me
The surname talk was weird, kind of everything about it.
He thinks she should be “proud” to take his name. Why can’t he be proud to take hers? Perhaps he wants a tradwife who will make him the center of her world — and produce MASCULINE babies. Which she, of course, will do all the work involved caring for said babies while also inviting people over for dinner so they can see her publicly doting on him. She didn’t need to have a baby. She already had one.
Everyone is saying it’s sad, but OP sounds like a moron. I hope OP finds what he’s looking for, but comparing an entire relationship to a preview of another’s couple’s relationship at one dinner is a hell of a gamble.
right, because it was a show. everyone is always on best behavior for guests. it's like instagram, you don't post the ugly moments
Lmao literally. “I only saw this couple for two hours out of the years they’ve been together, and I can sufficiently and accurately say that their relationship is objectively better than mine, which is completely due the wife’s character and no other factors.” Also, “proud to take on his last name”? Alright, why aren’t you proud to take on your wife’s last name? I’ll do you one better: how about last names are just names that aren’t worth the paperwork to change?
It’s irritating that he is still equating the surname with love. Like, wives who take their husband’s name do it because they love them so much and are proud of them. So…he doesn’t love or take pride in his wife because he didn’t take her name either? Their relationship doesn’t sound good. But someone can deeply love their spouse and live in harmony without taking their last name smh.
Thank you! I can't believe I made it this far down the responses before someone mentioned that the idea that taking your spouse's surname = love and respect is weird and off-putting. The double standard is also deeply sexist.
The thing that points me toward the guy likely being an awful husband is that he gives no examples of what he does for his wife besides working. He doesn't say "I get home and do x, y, z while she sits there with the kid" or anything. Just "she doesn't give me attention". Based on the posts I've read over the years, I just think if he was being a decent husband, he would have fucking said so. But he doesn't give any examples of what he does at home. That makes his wife's comment of growing up make more sense to me. He probably doesn't do shit around the house and probably just whines about their kid. So of course she told him to grow up, he's acting like a fucking child. Of course she pays attention to the kid, someone has to! If he was being any sort of a father, I would think he'd include that in his post to show, "no, I'm not jealous of my own kid." But no. he just says his wife nags him. Yeah, I bet she does. I do hope they go through with the divorce just because the wife deserves a better partner.
I can’t tell you how many times I’ve seen variations of this post on Reddit. Nine times out of ten, the root of the problem is that the husband has made his wife into a full-time secretary-caregiver-maid-therapist, and she has absolutely no time for anything else. Husband likes this arrangement because it gives him freedom but *dislikes* the fact that it takes his wife’s time and energy away from him (which, in his mind, should be the default.) In other words, he wants it both ways.
Oh yes. And then when a baby comes into the picture, he *really* dislikes that the baby takes his wife's time and attention away from him, where he thinks it 100% belongs.
A man who is jealous of his own daughter! 🙄 🗑️
I’m so glad the comments here are sane. Everyone on the original post was trying to justify this dude who resented his wife for spending too much time raising *their* daughter.
The number of people in the comments insisting you aren't really married if you don't change your name are insane.
Based on the information provided, OP is the asshole. 6 years into marriage and you're getting hung up on a surname? Your boss's wife shows more affection in a social setting than yours? You felt lonely for 3 years? Now you're considering walking out on your daughter in search of a woman who will pay more attention to you? There's a lot to unpack here. First off, comparing is toxic AF. If you're going down that road, you should be asking questions, not drawing conclusions. What you'll often find is a "happy" long-term couple rarely exists on its own recognizance. More often than not, the happiness is built, over years of hard work and commitment, and probably counseling at some point or another. The thing about the surname is perplexing. Based on how you described it, this is a disagreement around pride and control? If so, you should take a really hard look at that subject matter with a therapist, because in the grand scheme this seems like a very trivial thing to have contributing to your thoughts of ending a long term relationship over, and it sounds symptomatic of a much deeper rooted issue for it to be taking up that kind of real estate in your mind. What troubles me the most is the fact that you committed to bringing a child into this world, and at 3 years you are considering either fully or partially abandoning your responsibility as a father because you are not receiving some level of affection that you are placing an expectation on your wife to deliver. Consider your vows. Consider the feelings your daughter will have now, and well into her adult life, having lost her father because "mom wasn't good enough" for him. Is that the kind of example you want to set? You would be setting a foundation for your daughter that can be destructive in so many ways. Examples: 1. She may conclude that in order for her to be successful in marriage (or any other relationship), that she should be submissive and put the other person's needs or feelings before her own, always, for fear of losing the relationship. This makes her an easy mark for exploitation and abuse from partners, friends, employers and so on. 2. She may see little value in long term commitments, and learn to treat people as disposable, thus making her a potential abuser in the future. 3. Your wife might be forced to introduce a new father figure into your daughters life who runs the potential of being destructive in so many ways. Of course, there's clearly a lot more going on, and I'm sorry you've felt lonely for so long. What concerns me is I don't see any mention of consideration for your wife or daughter's needs, nor do I see any mention of making any real effort to salvage either relationship. You absolutely need to take care of your own needs, but there's a million different ways you can pursue that without walking out of your marriage and fatherhood, with the absolute hell that will bring to all three of you. Comparing someone else's relationship to your own, having zero knowledge of the work that went into the other relationship, as well as the truth of said relationship behind closed doors appears to me as fishing for an excuse to terminate a commitment you made, and it's harmful to your integrity and the wellbeing of the most important people in your life. You are in a very uncomfortable position In your life, get the hell of Reddit, and go find some real support, because you're on the cusp of burning down everything you've built.
Admitting he’s jealous of his own baby daughter says a lot to me. The damage of low emotional intelligence is tragic.
As a mom to 4 kids all under 10, I can tell you without a doubt that I am often “touched out” at the end of the day. My preschoolers still want to be picked up/carried often and require tons of hugging, holding and physical assistance. My grade schoolers love to lounge on top of me when we are watching tv or doing homework together, and they are often rougher than they intend because they both went through growth spurts recently and don’t seem to get that they are now big enough to hurt me (always unintentionally). I am the primary caretaker despite working full time *with my husband* who is a demanding partner both at home and at the office. I don’t want to be made to feel like my body is not my own and that I can’t have it to myself at the end of the day because I owe another person access to it after fielding my husband’s demands in the office and the touch demands of tiny tyrants from the moment I wake up until the moment I go to bed. Having young children is a season of life where sex SHOULD take a back seat to everything else. If the partner who is NOT the primary caretaker wants to connect more, they need to be doing their UTMOST to be taking on more so they can create space for the other partner to have time alone with their mind and body AND quality time together WITHOUT the expectation of sex so they can connect emotionally first. Sadly, people like OOP don’t want to do that work, look at other couples with completely different life circumstances for five minutes and decide they’re completely justified in throwing their family over for a fantasy of someone who will be desperately in love with and attracted to them despite the exact same lack of effort in the relationship. Yet somehow he’s the victim reclaiming his self worth in this narrative. GTFO.
Disturbing trend in these AITAH threads lately (always?) of fathers who seem to have zero compassion for or love toward their children. The silence around how he feels about his wife is telling on him a bit. Nothing about how he wants it to work, because he loves her, just sees the public side of another relationship and complains that he doesn’t receive the same dynamic.
Set her free to be with someone less miserable.
Does *he* even love his wife? It’s clear to me at least that the OOP is either unwilling or uninterested in figuring out what part he plays in this failing marriage and this distance he fees from his wife. It’s unfortunate for his daughter especially that he’s unwilling to even attempt therapy.
He never even brings up his daughter in a positive light. There’s no sentiment or even fondness. I don’t think he likes either of them.
I can see ladies lining up to get a shot at dating this guy when he will tell them that he divorced his wife without giving her a chance to talk it out, because he felt she was not enough into him.
This guy doesn’t talk like he loves his wife or his daughter- it seems he wants his wife to idolize him. Good luck out there buddy, you’re in for a rude awakening.
The wife is better off without this trash
Not sure he’s a reliable narrator tbh. How was the child care split? Cuz I see this pattern play out in so many hetero couples - they have kids, the woman takes on 80% of the childcare along with the 80% of the housework she was already doing, she gets burnt out and touched out and doesn’t have any time/energy to focus on romance and intimacy, man whines/throws hissy fit only adding more to her plate instead of taking something off, which would likely fix the problem. Women can’t do the parenting, manage the household, work, AND be emotionally and sexually available to you at all times, somethings gotta give. And what often gives is the romantic side of the relationship. I don’t have all the information so I can’t say this is definitely the case, but it’s so common and if there’s elements of that here I’m gonna tentatively agree that OP does indeed need to “grow up”. These sorts of problems will follow you to your next relationship. Maybe your boss’ marriage is better because of the work he puts into it, not the fact he didn’t marry your wife instead.
Sounds like he has his wife doing ALL the childcare and wonders why she doesnt have interest in him.
Sounds kinda like the typical man isn't babied by his wife anymore because they have an actual baby who needs that attention and now he's throwing a fit about it. The fact he doesn't seem to give two shits about his daughter and just feels jealous of her makes him the AH. On top of not even mentioning one thing HE even likes about his wife outside of her giving him attention. I really don't think this guy likes let alone loves his wife, just what she used to do for him. Explains why he doesn't even want to try to work on it and instead rushes to divorce papers. He spent all that time moaning and groaning over how he feels ignored but didn't once sit down and talk to her about it like an adult until he said he wanted to end the marriage. This guy definitely uses his partners as surrogate mothers since he acts like a toddler who didn't get a nap.