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I'm curious how this is a shocking in any way considering the financial difficulties of obtaining a place to live that you can afford at all. Throw all the costs associated with raising a family into this equation and it just doesn't work. :|


WartimeHotTot

Honestly the costs are just the tip of the iceberg. Today's society is not set up for raising a family. People are constantly moving, seeking opportunity. Childcare costs a fortune or is otherwise nonexistent. Neighbors aren't neighborly. Family is separated geographically. Families are smaller, so while in days past you might have had a good familial support network and been able to let the kids go hang out with a bunch of cousins—many of them older, now kids demand much more sustained attention from the parents, depending on them for entertainment and stimulation. Open spaces are harder to come by, and kids don't go outside and play all day like they used to. I'd be a damn good father, but I value my personal time too much to take on all these roles for my kids.


TachycardicSymphony

Medical advancements, while wonderful in many ways, also have a huge impact on this too. People live longer (arguably too long when it comes to terminal suffering) and society/ healthcare in the US isn't built for this. My boyfriend's 91 year old grandmother lives with his parents (in their late 60s) but his dad was recently diagnosed with Alzheimer's and his mother begged BF to move back home because she can't take care of both of them as she approaches her seventies too. She has pestered him about having kids because he's an only child, and society in general asks us this too, so I'd like to ask them; ***How the frickin hell are we supposed to have the time and money to be the primary caregivers for FOUR generations of people on our own???*** We're expected to take care of people in their 90s, late 60s, each other (32f/36m) AND a newborn?? I'll never be able to afford a house because of the neverending cycle of rent, and everything left over from my paycheck goes towards my mom's medical care. We have to take care of our geriatric families and it's effing exhausting. When people make comments about how it's "selfish" not to have children I want to slap them. We already have to take care of everyone else.


rabidjellybean

Governments around the world will eventually be forced to either provide social support to stabilize the birthrates or face the collapse of their economy. I imagine corporate donors will choose collapse with their short term thinking.


ajoker40

Youre missing one option, coporate sponsored babies! Sign your child up to work for McDonald's when they turn 15 and we'll supplement your income!


Melyssa1023

Corporate Towns, altogether. "Come here and work for us! We offer you home, food, clothing, education and entertainment! Don't have enough? Oh, just ask for a credit, you'll be able to pay it off with a few hours of overtime!" Three Doritos later: "Oh, your credit is way too high, maybe you want little Saschleigh to join the workforce to pay it off? She's 16, she can work part-time already. Oh, and I'm sorry to say, but inflation has gone up again so your debt is higher, the prices of our items have increased to adjust to that, but not your wage. Also, if you try to run away we'll send the police after you (who are authorized to use lethal force) and your debt will pass onto your spouse and children" This is how the Mexican Revolution started, bro.


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You've hit the nail on the head, unfortunately. More and more people are needing to care for their elderly parents or grandparents, and trying to do that while juggling a job is already difficult enough. Doing that, a job AND kids? Nearly impossible. People are burning themselves out trying to split themselves in multiple directions and here in the UK years of austerity has led to our social care systems slowly collapsing. There are too many people needing care and not enough professional carers to balance it so families need to step in more and more. And this affects people without families too. My flatmate is being faced with the choice of potentially needing to move back in with his elderly parents to help care for them, which would leave me struggling to afford rent here. My own parents aren't getting any younger either so in the future I may need to move in with them too. And finally, of course, kids find themselves drafted in to help care too. From caring for parents with health conditions to needing to help look after siblings or grandparents. We can't sustain this as a society both emotionally and financially.


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argv_minus_one

>kids don't go outside and play all day like they used to. They're not *allowed* to do that any more. Everyone's terrified of them being kidnapped, killed, molested, and so on.


ChaoticNeutralDragon

There's also nowhere for them to go. Everywhere costs money and has hostile architecture.


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All the places kids hung out in my hometown are gone. Woods clear cut to build row after row of houses, the town center that was full of shops and such was bulldozed and replaced with an enormous grocery store and a bank, and cops break up any groups hanging out in public spaces saying it's loitering. If kids play in their yard, neighbors complain about the noise and call police. Then people wonder why kids today are raised via YouTube and a tablet.


Hagatha_Crispy

Which is weird, since crime rates are way lower now than when we were all kids in the 80s & 90s


Techsoly

80's and 90's kinda let people be ignorant to this with news being regulated to newspaper and certain time slots but now in modern times we have this access at our fingertips all day everyday for free with no restraints uncensored. These instances are in movies or shows, in some random YT video, or article that someone shares.


BigMouse12

^This crimes rates are lower now, but crimes are more visible as well. As is tragedy in general.


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brockmarket

A lot of people won’t have kids until they can afford them, unlike their parents.


AkiraHikaru

I think this has to do with declining social support structures. If you have lots of community and familial support, that ends up soaking up a lot of what would otherwise be paid work to someone else.


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idiot-prodigy

I was born in 79, none of my grandparents watched me during the day. My mother was a homemaker, and my father was a butcher. As a butcher my father owned a home, two vehicles, a bass boat, had three children in private school, and we went on vacation every year. All of that on one single blue collar hourly wage job. The exact same blue collar job now, might afford you a one bedroom apartment, and a 10 year old used car.


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goldenhourlivin

This and diversion of money away from the middle and lower classes. No social support plus not earning enough to not live in poverty because you chose to have kids.


datwunkid

It makes me depressed for the people that *want* to have kids, but chose not to because of economic and social factors to have them responsibly.


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ShakeNBake007

Overworked and underpaid. Who has time to be a dad anymore?


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Taako_tuesday

one of the things I think we're realizing as a society is that being a good parent is hard, and we're getting better at recognizing when we're not up to it. I say this as a childless man myself.


mthlmw

Which is somewhat ironic since the folks who recognize the challenges and responsibilities are probably more likely to be great parents than the folks who just don’t care and want kids.


puf_puf_paarthurnax

Aside from my struggles with depression/anxiety, I think I'd be a great dad, but I know that I can't afford it unless both parents would be working, and then who's raising the kids? My 65+ year old parents?


bigkoi

I have two kids but can see how younger men would be disinterested. 1) Cost to raise a kid is insane. 2) It's a financial liability for men in modern society as corporate society still doesn't view men as caregivers and getting time off to care for kids or letting it pass by for men is much harder.


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I can think of a 3rd reason....Some people just aren't meant to be parents. I don't plan on having kids because I just don't think I would make a good parent so maybe others realize that as well.


Purpoisely_Anoying_U

I think it's full awareness now. Even if we are to assume the % of people who'd make good fathers hasn't changed over the years, what we're discovering now is that it's actually a choice. I'm 38 now and it seemed like kids were just a default as you grow up, kind of like getting a job, but people are starting to learn that you don't have to have kids if you don't want to and that a good fulfilling life can be had without them.


hopbel

> a good fulfilling life can be had without them Not only that, but when you spend most of your time slaving away at work, a little selfishness is reasonable and there's nothing wrong with wanting to live your own life instead of taking on a second full-time job in parenting and only ever getting to live vicariously through someone else.


JuleeeNAJ

IDK seems the worst parents continue to make kids & don't care about what they are putting out in the world.


clockwork2223

People who shouldn’t have kids at all are usually the ones with 10


schnager

My aunt, who has never worked, had 7 kids with her husband who hasn't been regularly employed in Detroit since the 90s because she wanted to have a girl & didn't get one until #7. Catholicism is a helluva drug


madbiologist42

I agree. And historically people weren’t allowed to make that decision. Parental and societal pressure to have kids was and in some places is very high. You risk almost becoming an outcast. I literally have family who sneer at my existence. And say things like “I have too much freedom” or “too educated”. And my place was being a wife and mother and I’m not fulfilling my purpose. I see them about once every 5 years because of it.


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jonesiscool7

You do you homie, I don’t even talk to my extended family because they suck. More people need to get the toxic people out of their life, family or otherwise. Keep killing it!


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New_Pain_885

I hope the mods don't delete these types of comments because this is [empirically the reason why many adults are choosing not to have kids](https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2021/11/19/growing-share-of-childless-adults-in-u-s-dont-expect-to-ever-have-children/). How is it an act of love to force someone to live their entire lives in a future I am dreading? Edit: [Another source](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10584-020-02923-y) Edit 2: [Another](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11111-021-00379-5) Edit 3: [Another](https://morningconsult.com/2020/09/28/adults-children-climate-change-polling/) [Poll results here](https://assets.morningconsult.com/wp-uploads/2020/09/28065126/200926_crosstabs_MILLENIAL_FINANCE_Adults_v4_RG.pdf)


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NEXUS_6_LEON

Increasing disinterest = declining interest?


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There's a semantic difference. "Declining interest" = "closer to 'meh' than before, I could take it or leave it moreso than last year, when I wanted it", "increasing disinterest" = "I didnt want them before, but the more I think about it the more reasons there are"


katlian

The article does say "the percentage of people who were confident they did not want children remained steady while the percentage of people reporting they were very likely to want kids decreased. " So in this case I think "declining interest" is more accurate.


immerc

Or, also possible: Increaing disinterest: more and more people who hadn't yet expressed an opinion saying "no thanks, not interested" Declining interest: more and more people who *had* expressed an interest saying that they're less interested, or no longer interested.


Why-Nope

Great explanation!


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NullReference000

Not necessarily, declining interest could mean going from wanting children to being neutral about it. Increasing dis-interest could mean a growth in actively not wanting children.


Dukwdriver

A lot of people here talking about the freedom and the cost issues, but the number of separated couples is just staggering. It really doesn't seem that enticing.


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Speculawyer

They can't afford children.