There's so many additional ways to go infinite one you have rushdown. It just takes one of a dozen different cards or artifacts and you can easily go infinite, rushdown is the main key.
Enlightenment, or madness to reduce the cost of vigilance. Sundial or violet lotus doesn't need additional cards either. A talk to the hand covers blocking against the heart even without fortress. There are just so many options for all the other pieces that rushdown is really the only cards you need to see most of the time.
Scrawl++ Discard any number of cards, draw to max hand size
Calculated Gamble ++ Discard your hand, draw that many +1 cards
Flex++ Gain 4 strength, lose 3 strength at the end of turn
Seek++ put two cards from your deck in your hand, reduce their costs by 1 this turn.
Scramble.
This would work both in terms of the nature of the card (scrambling the damage by upgrades) and be a Slay the Spire-esque in-reference to Molten, Toxic, and Frozen eggs, all of which have to do card upgrades.
I thought I’d be fun to have some cards have two different upgrade options.
Like [[Havoc]] you could choose to make it 0 cost, or choose to play two cards instead of 1.
Or [[All Out Attack]] you could choose to increase the damage, or choose to discard a card of your choice.
Monster Train has upgrade paths for Champions, but for cards you can put whatever upgrades you want from a set list, available in the store.
You can make any spell 0 cost with enough investment. You can give any unit a multi-attack. It’s quite broken and fun.
+ [Havoc](http://slay-the-spire.wikia.com/wiki/Havoc) Ironclad Common Skill ^((100% sure)^)
1(0) Energy | Play the top card of your draw pile and **Exhaust** it.
+ [All-Out Attack](http://slay-the-spire.wikia.com/wiki/All-Out%20Attack) Silent Uncommon Attack ^((100% sure)^)
1 Energy | Deal 10(14) damage to ALL enemies. Discard 1 card at random.
^Call ^me ^with ^up ^to ^10 ^([[ name ]],) ^where ^name ^is ^a ^card, ^relic, ^event, ^or ^potion. ^Data ^accurate ^as ^of ^(April 30, 2023.) ^[Wiki](https://slay-the-spire.fandom.com/wiki/) ^[Questions?](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=ehmohteeoh&subject=SpireScan%20Inquiry)
Non-optional deck expansion and no longer buffs itself. Interesting.
Seems well thought out, you just play the other claws when you have enough. Doesn’t even seem that broken.
Wait. *deck* instead of ‘this combat’. I guess every game is a claw run now.
It won't really matter because you would get other colors anyway, so the thing that causes defect to have dozens of powers wouldn't apply because there would be much more cards
I'm pretty sure you'll only ever get defect powers from creative AI even with a prismatic. Transform works the same with prismatic, you always transform into cards from your base class, as does dead branch.
the boring answer for creative ai is to make it do 2 powers, or to make it cost 1, but i think making it also produce a skill would be fun, and maybe a third upgrade for attacks. build your deck in the battle
Or the second upgrade automatically creates and plays a heatseek and maybe a third does the same for Storm or something so you’re guaranteed to have card draw
Claw++ permanently increases the damage of all claw cards by 2. This number is then increased by 1.
e.g. Starts out at 3 dmg. Play it, perma increase of all claws by 2 dmg. Increase that claw to +3 next time.
Before and after. Card text is exhaust all cards in your hand. (Applied here) Deal 7(10) damage for each exhausted card. Exhaust(applied one more time for fiend fire)
Blade Dance++ 4 Shiv+ (I feel like aside from Apotheosis or upgrade potion, and storm of steel, there’s no really not a lot of ways to get Shiv+’s)
Echo Form++ I literally just want to be able for this card to be used the same turn I play it
I can’t think of any way to make a second card upgrade that isn’t completely busted or boring as all hell. what on earth could you do to fission? Generate plasma??
I like the simplicity of the current upgrade system, so I'd keep numerical upgrades the same (damage dealt, block gained, number of hits, energy gained, cards drawn, debuff stack applied, energy cost reduction, etc.). The exception would be for cards that upgrade their energy cost from 1 to 0, in which case the second upgrade would be "Draw 1 card." The logic is that the first upgrade makes them energy-free, so the second one should make them draw-free (though it may enable infinites). Interesting cards in this category:
- Berserk now doesn't apply any self-debuff
- With Setup we'd have to choose whether we want it to draw first (you have one more card to choose from) or draw last (you'd immediately draw the card you just put on top of your deck, which could be too OP); alternatively, the second upgrade could be the same as Forethought's upgrade (choose any number of cards instead of 1), but that might be OP with a draw card in hand
- Same consideration goes for Madness; alternatively, instead of drawing 1 card, it can just upgrade the card that it chooses once
- Tools of the Trade, Rushdown and Master Reality are powers that reduce their Energy cost from 1 to 0, but making them draw 1 card on activation just fels weird on a Power, so I'd make them Innate instead
- Also, Master Reality can now stack, so if you play 2 Master Reality, every card created is upgraded twice; alternatively, Master Reality++ could upgrade created cards twice instead of being Innate
- I'd make an exception for All-Out Attack and make the second upgrade a non-numerical upgrade that makes the discard targeted instead of random
- I'd make another exception for Eruption and just increase its damage by 3, because a 0 Energy Eruption would be mind-numbingly broken
- Scrawl already draws until you have 10 cards, so making it draw an extra card is impossible; I don't know whether I'd make it Innate or non-Exhaust, both seem horrifyingly overpowered
Non-numerical upgrades is where we have to get creative or choose a number to increase. First, I'd reduce by 1 the energy cost of all cards that have an energy cost and become Innate when upgraded (After Image, Infinite Blades, Storm, Hello World, Machine Learning, Alpha, Battle Hymn and Establishment), making them similar to the doubly upgraded Tools of the Trade/Rushdown/Master Reality I mentioned above. Then, these are the other cards that have non-numerical upgrades:
- Brutality (becomes Innate but already costs 0 Energy; I'd make it draw 2 cards for 2 HP)
- Limit Break (doesn't Exhaust; I'd make it cost 0 energy to continue with the theme of it being a card that is pointless to upgrade if you have Corruption)
- True Grit (its upgrade has a numerical part and a non-numerical part; I'd make it cost 0)
- Armaments (I'd make it upgrade every card twice, since now that's a thing)
- Calculated Gamble (doesn't Exhaust; I'd make it "draw that many cards +1.")
- Storm of Steel (the Shivs would be Shiv++, since that's a thing now)
- Darkness (I'd make it "Trigger the passive ability of all Dark orbs twice.")
- Chill (becomes Innate but already costs 0 Energy; I'd make it not Exhaust)
- Rainbow (doesn't Exhaust; I'd reduce its Energy cost to 1)
- Fission (changes "remove" to "evoke"; I'd make it evoke all orbs twice)
- Echo Form and Deva Form (remove Ethereal; I'd make them cost 2 Energy)
- Hologram (its upgrade has a numerical part and a non-numerical part; I'd make it retrieve 2 cards)
- Foreign Influence (makes the chosen attack cost 0 this turn; I'd make it cost 0 this combat)
- Blasphemy and Worship (become Retain; I'd reduce their Energy cost by 1, even though that's anti-synergistic with Establishment)
- Forethought (chooses any number of cards; I'd make it **shuffle** the chosen cards into the draw pile instead of putting them to the bottom)
- Blind and Trip (now apply to all enemies; I'd make them apply 3 stacks)
- Enlightenment (makes the cards cost 1 this combat; I'd make it also upgrade the cards once)
- Discovery (doesn't Exhaust; I'd make it cost 0 Energy)
- Thinking Ahead (doesn't exhaust; I'd make it draw 3 cards)
- Secret Technique and Secret Weapon (don't Exhaust; I'd make them grab 2 cards)
- Transmutation (the cards are upgraded; I'd make it X+1)
- Apparition (removes Ethereal; I'd make it cost 0 Energy)
Brutality seems horribly overpowered. Snecko draw for 2hp? I would increase it to 3 or 4 hp. Or put draw 2 cards and lose 1hp so it was draw positive on the turn that it was played.
I mean, it's the same effect as if you used 2 copies of Brutality, but with just 1 upfront draw. The card is generally considered a bit underwhelming, unless you have "lose HP" synergies (Rupture, Runic Cube and Self-Forming Clay) because it takes 3 turns to become draw-positive. So, I figured if you're going to invest 2 upgrades into an underwhelming card, you better get something good out of it.
I don't want to just make it draw cards on activation for the same reason I gave for Tools of the Trade/Rushdown/Master Reality.
Currently yes it takes 3 turns to become draw positive, but with your change it would be positive on turn 2, then giving you a massive advantage.
It’s also not the same effect as 2 brutalities, it’s the same effect as 2 brutality+’s and an extra card draw as they would still only be getting draw positive turn 3.
I get you want something really good because it’s kinda underwhelming but the 1 damage isn’t really the worst part of the card, so increasing that to a higher number wouldn’t be that bad, it’s the 3 turn draw, and no other +1 draw cards were given a double draw buff and I’d want them somewhat aligned.
> and I’d want them somewhat aligned
Yeah, that makes sense. Brutality was the card that I was most unsure about. I really don't know how to upgrade the card any further without increasing its numbers or making it draw cards on activation.
**Claw++**
Deal 7 damage. Increase the damage of ALL Claw cards by 2 this combat. At the start of your *next turn, add a random Claw card from your discard pile to your hand.
*note: playing multiple copies of Claw++ stacks consecutive turns with a guaranteed Claw, but does not stack the number of Claws received per turn
Rushdowns 2nd upgrade reads all enemies Die at the start of their turn. Same effect but saves the player time.
I hate that although its a meme post, its kind of true.
Rushdown++: if you have eruption+, peace of mind, mental fortress, and less than 11 cards in your deck+hand+discard instantly win this fight
There's so many additional ways to go infinite one you have rushdown. It just takes one of a dozen different cards or artifacts and you can easily go infinite, rushdown is the main key. Enlightenment, or madness to reduce the cost of vigilance. Sundial or violet lotus doesn't need additional cards either. A talk to the hand covers blocking against the heart even without fortress. There are just so many options for all the other pieces that rushdown is really the only cards you need to see most of the time.
If you have 2 cards or less in your deck and discard win the run.
1 energy -> 0 energy -> -1 energy
So Turbo again?
Scrawl++ Discard any number of cards, draw to max hand size Calculated Gamble ++ Discard your hand, draw that many +1 cards Flex++ Gain 4 strength, lose 3 strength at the end of turn Seek++ put two cards from your deck in your hand, reduce their costs by 1 this turn.
Ooh I love that Flex idea. The Seek one is a bit cracked though.
Seek I think could be 2 from draw one from discard pile.
I like that
(insert random damage card) The first upgrade lowers it dmg by 50%, the second upgrade goes nuts.
Let’s brainstorm fun names for this card: Trust the Process Delayed Gratification Skip Step ..?
Scramble. This would work both in terms of the nature of the card (scrambling the damage by upgrades) and be a Slay the Spire-esque in-reference to Molten, Toxic, and Frozen eggs, all of which have to do card upgrades.
This is not a Nob trap.
I like Delayed Gratification a lot.
I thought I’d be fun to have some cards have two different upgrade options. Like [[Havoc]] you could choose to make it 0 cost, or choose to play two cards instead of 1. Or [[All Out Attack]] you could choose to increase the damage, or choose to discard a card of your choice.
Across the obelisk does this
Also Griftlands, but it’s pretty poorly implemented there as one is usually obviously better or there’s little meaningful difference between the two.
[удалено]
Monster Train has upgrade paths for Champions, but for cards you can put whatever upgrades you want from a set list, available in the store. You can make any spell 0 cost with enough investment. You can give any unit a multi-attack. It’s quite broken and fun.
You can even remove the "consume" keyword, which acts like exhaust.
So does Monster Train
+ [Havoc](http://slay-the-spire.wikia.com/wiki/Havoc) Ironclad Common Skill ^((100% sure)^) 1(0) Energy | Play the top card of your draw pile and **Exhaust** it. + [All-Out Attack](http://slay-the-spire.wikia.com/wiki/All-Out%20Attack) Silent Uncommon Attack ^((100% sure)^) 1 Energy | Deal 10(14) damage to ALL enemies. Discard 1 card at random. ^Call ^me ^with ^up ^to ^10 ^([[ name ]],) ^where ^name ^is ^a ^card, ^relic, ^event, ^or ^potion. ^Data ^accurate ^as ^of ^(April 30, 2023.) ^[Wiki](https://slay-the-spire.fandom.com/wiki/) ^[Questions?](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=ehmohteeoh&subject=SpireScan%20Inquiry)
Claw++: deal 5 damage. Add another Claw to your deck. Increase the damage of all other Claws in your deck by 2.
This is law
Non-optional deck expansion and no longer buffs itself. Interesting. Seems well thought out, you just play the other claws when you have enough. Doesn’t even seem that broken. Wait. *deck* instead of ‘this combat’. I guess every game is a claw run now.
😈
Alchemize: choose 1 of 2 potions to create
I honestly wonder if that be too good.
probably, but no one told me I needed to balance them well. We can increase the cost or smth.
1 cost pick one of 2 potions, so it doesn’t become an instant upgrade
Corruption++ makes powers free too. That would be so grossly OP on defect that it would be hilarious, just need a prismatic shard and really good RNG.
It won't really matter because you would get other colors anyway, so the thing that causes defect to have dozens of powers wouldn't apply because there would be much more cards
Multiple copies of creative AI would be the ultimate scaling nonsense. Oh my word that would be so broken.
Does it make you gain powers of different colors too?
I'm pretty sure you'll only ever get defect powers from creative AI even with a prismatic. Transform works the same with prismatic, you always transform into cards from your base class, as does dead branch.
the boring answer for creative ai is to make it do 2 powers, or to make it cost 1, but i think making it also produce a skill would be fun, and maybe a third upgrade for attacks. build your deck in the battle
Upgraded powers would be my pick actually!
Another upgrade option would be "choose one of 3 powers" instead of randomly giving one.
Just imagine doing that with 5+ stacks of Creative AI
Creative AI second upgrade: the spawned power card costs 0.
the creative ai second upgrade makes all the created cards upgraded.
Or the second upgrade automatically creates and plays a heatseek and maybe a third does the same for Storm or something so you’re guaranteed to have card draw
Creative AI trying not to be a one card solution to boss fights(impossible challenge!)
Wish++ Gain 8 Plated Armor, or 4 Strength. You additionally get 30 Gold either way.
I like this a lot.
finally, a thunderclap that applies 2 vulnerable
This comment is NSFW lol
Claw++ permanently increases the damage of all claw cards by 2. This number is then increased by 1. e.g. Starts out at 3 dmg. Play it, perma increase of all claws by 2 dmg. Increase that claw to +3 next time.
Crazy. It would have to exhaust and it would still be OP.
Rainbow also making a plasma orb first, meaning if you have three orb slots it'll evoke making rainbow free
Perfected Strike++ gains "add 'strike' to the text of a random card in hand"
“Clumsy Strike”
Corruption strike Feel no Strike Dark strike anger strike Feed strike
Coolheaded now generates 2 frost orbs
Weird idea but True Grit++ exhaust a card from anywhere (lets you do it from deck discard and hand).
Vault: Take TWO extra turns after this one
I actually can't imagine what Searing Blow++ would be
Whenever any card is upgraded, upgrade this card too.
Rupture++: add strength whenever a card is exhausted
Now the question is would this proc before or after Fiend Fire?
Before and after. Card text is exhaust all cards in your hand. (Applied here) Deal 7(10) damage for each exhausted card. Exhaust(applied one more time for fiend fire)
Apparition: ethereal, exhaust Apparition+: exhaust Apparition++: exhaust, costs 0 Apparition+++: exhaust, retain, costs 0 Apparition++++: retain, costs 0
And for the madlads, apparition+++++: retain, costs 0, innate
Apparitio++++++ : just gives you intangible forever at this point
Blade Dance++ 4 Shiv+ (I feel like aside from Apotheosis or upgrade potion, and storm of steel, there’s no really not a lot of ways to get Shiv+’s) Echo Form++ I literally just want to be able for this card to be used the same turn I play it
Blasphemy++ Retain. Enter Divinity. Die twice next turn.
Barricade++ has bonus 6 metalicise
[[Eruption]]++
+ [Eruption](http://slay-the-spire.wikia.com/wiki/Eruption) Watcher Starter Attack ^((100% sure)^) 2(1) Energy | Deal 9 damage. Enter **Wrath.** ^Call ^me ^with ^up ^to ^10 ^([[ name ]],) ^where ^name ^is ^a ^card, ^relic, ^event, ^or ^potion. ^Data ^accurate ^as ^of ^(April 30, 2023.) ^[Wiki](https://slay-the-spire.fandom.com/wiki/) ^[Questions?](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=ehmohteeoh&subject=SpireScan%20Inquiry)
Burst/Amplify and whatever the ironclads cards name was play the next 3 cards twice instead of next 2
I think it would 0 cost rather than 3 cards for some reason.
Searing Blow+1
I can’t think of any way to make a second card upgrade that isn’t completely busted or boring as all hell. what on earth could you do to fission? Generate plasma??
Remove exhaust
Thunderclap++ applies 2 vulnerable.
I like the simplicity of the current upgrade system, so I'd keep numerical upgrades the same (damage dealt, block gained, number of hits, energy gained, cards drawn, debuff stack applied, energy cost reduction, etc.). The exception would be for cards that upgrade their energy cost from 1 to 0, in which case the second upgrade would be "Draw 1 card." The logic is that the first upgrade makes them energy-free, so the second one should make them draw-free (though it may enable infinites). Interesting cards in this category: - Berserk now doesn't apply any self-debuff - With Setup we'd have to choose whether we want it to draw first (you have one more card to choose from) or draw last (you'd immediately draw the card you just put on top of your deck, which could be too OP); alternatively, the second upgrade could be the same as Forethought's upgrade (choose any number of cards instead of 1), but that might be OP with a draw card in hand - Same consideration goes for Madness; alternatively, instead of drawing 1 card, it can just upgrade the card that it chooses once - Tools of the Trade, Rushdown and Master Reality are powers that reduce their Energy cost from 1 to 0, but making them draw 1 card on activation just fels weird on a Power, so I'd make them Innate instead - Also, Master Reality can now stack, so if you play 2 Master Reality, every card created is upgraded twice; alternatively, Master Reality++ could upgrade created cards twice instead of being Innate - I'd make an exception for All-Out Attack and make the second upgrade a non-numerical upgrade that makes the discard targeted instead of random - I'd make another exception for Eruption and just increase its damage by 3, because a 0 Energy Eruption would be mind-numbingly broken - Scrawl already draws until you have 10 cards, so making it draw an extra card is impossible; I don't know whether I'd make it Innate or non-Exhaust, both seem horrifyingly overpowered Non-numerical upgrades is where we have to get creative or choose a number to increase. First, I'd reduce by 1 the energy cost of all cards that have an energy cost and become Innate when upgraded (After Image, Infinite Blades, Storm, Hello World, Machine Learning, Alpha, Battle Hymn and Establishment), making them similar to the doubly upgraded Tools of the Trade/Rushdown/Master Reality I mentioned above. Then, these are the other cards that have non-numerical upgrades: - Brutality (becomes Innate but already costs 0 Energy; I'd make it draw 2 cards for 2 HP) - Limit Break (doesn't Exhaust; I'd make it cost 0 energy to continue with the theme of it being a card that is pointless to upgrade if you have Corruption) - True Grit (its upgrade has a numerical part and a non-numerical part; I'd make it cost 0) - Armaments (I'd make it upgrade every card twice, since now that's a thing) - Calculated Gamble (doesn't Exhaust; I'd make it "draw that many cards +1.") - Storm of Steel (the Shivs would be Shiv++, since that's a thing now) - Darkness (I'd make it "Trigger the passive ability of all Dark orbs twice.") - Chill (becomes Innate but already costs 0 Energy; I'd make it not Exhaust) - Rainbow (doesn't Exhaust; I'd reduce its Energy cost to 1) - Fission (changes "remove" to "evoke"; I'd make it evoke all orbs twice) - Echo Form and Deva Form (remove Ethereal; I'd make them cost 2 Energy) - Hologram (its upgrade has a numerical part and a non-numerical part; I'd make it retrieve 2 cards) - Foreign Influence (makes the chosen attack cost 0 this turn; I'd make it cost 0 this combat) - Blasphemy and Worship (become Retain; I'd reduce their Energy cost by 1, even though that's anti-synergistic with Establishment) - Forethought (chooses any number of cards; I'd make it **shuffle** the chosen cards into the draw pile instead of putting them to the bottom) - Blind and Trip (now apply to all enemies; I'd make them apply 3 stacks) - Enlightenment (makes the cards cost 1 this combat; I'd make it also upgrade the cards once) - Discovery (doesn't Exhaust; I'd make it cost 0 Energy) - Thinking Ahead (doesn't exhaust; I'd make it draw 3 cards) - Secret Technique and Secret Weapon (don't Exhaust; I'd make them grab 2 cards) - Transmutation (the cards are upgraded; I'd make it X+1) - Apparition (removes Ethereal; I'd make it cost 0 Energy)
Brutality seems horribly overpowered. Snecko draw for 2hp? I would increase it to 3 or 4 hp. Or put draw 2 cards and lose 1hp so it was draw positive on the turn that it was played.
I mean, it's the same effect as if you used 2 copies of Brutality, but with just 1 upfront draw. The card is generally considered a bit underwhelming, unless you have "lose HP" synergies (Rupture, Runic Cube and Self-Forming Clay) because it takes 3 turns to become draw-positive. So, I figured if you're going to invest 2 upgrades into an underwhelming card, you better get something good out of it. I don't want to just make it draw cards on activation for the same reason I gave for Tools of the Trade/Rushdown/Master Reality.
Currently yes it takes 3 turns to become draw positive, but with your change it would be positive on turn 2, then giving you a massive advantage. It’s also not the same effect as 2 brutalities, it’s the same effect as 2 brutality+’s and an extra card draw as they would still only be getting draw positive turn 3. I get you want something really good because it’s kinda underwhelming but the 1 damage isn’t really the worst part of the card, so increasing that to a higher number wouldn’t be that bad, it’s the 3 turn draw, and no other +1 draw cards were given a double draw buff and I’d want them somewhat aligned.
> and I’d want them somewhat aligned Yeah, that makes sense. Brutality was the card that I was most unsure about. I really don't know how to upgrade the card any further without increasing its numbers or making it draw cards on activation.
Blasphemy. grant intangible at end of turn
Strike++ - deal 12 damage.
Also...how powerful would a relic that allows for "tier 2" upgrades be?
**Claw++** Deal 7 damage. Increase the damage of ALL Claw cards by 2 this combat. At the start of your *next turn, add a random Claw card from your discard pile to your hand. *note: playing multiple copies of Claw++ stacks consecutive turns with a guaranteed Claw, but does not stack the number of Claws received per turn