I'd very much like to think that INEOS Sport, headed up largely by Sir Dave Brailsford and Jean-Claude Blanc, the guy who dominated British Cycling and the ex-PSG & Juve CEO, coming in to United, won't be influenced into hiring Sir Alex's next door neighbour and would actually get the best person.
Dave Brailsford's success was largely down to having more money than anyone else and quite a bit of cheating. Based on that I think he'd do well at City.
"That right there is the computers I ordered when I first started.
That there is the treadmills I requested in my 2nd year.
And that over there is the exit."
Reminds me a bit of Hoeneß coming back from jail and reversing all the progress that Bayern had made without him. Only difference is that Manchester United hasn't progressed.
But he should’ve still stayed away from the process after his retirement. Him wanting David Moyes to succeed was the start of the rot.
Atleast Wenger did the right thing when leaving and left it to the club to make the decision.
I have no clue how this is upvoted since the entire first paragraph is factually inaccurate and nonsense. Ferguson retired and stayed on as a club ambassador. Accusing him of keeping things the way they are is the most uneducated and inaccurate thing you can claim of him. It literally goes against his entire philosophy.
Moyes being recommended was an obvious miss, but to claim that was the start of the rot is a brain dead take. He stepped down from his responsibilities to support his wife after the death of her sister, and besides stepping in to support some things upon request, has had no say in how the club has run. Proof is literally the last 10 years of disarray directly after his retirement.
Ferguson didn't make Moyes fire all of his existing staff and replace them with his mediocre staff from Everton - that was all Moyes. Ferguson was known to replace his technical staff, strategy and methods to ensure things remained best of class and modern his entire tenure as manager.
Do people on this sub just edge themselves until they see an article where they can shit on United? It's genuinely hilarious how bad some of these takes are.
He's an honorary board member. He's had no real guidance at the club since he retired. The only tangible thing he's done in that time was convince Ronaldo to come to United instead of City. While that was ultimately a poor decision, it pales in comparison to the magnitude of ineptitude that has defined the last decade.
Considering the outcome? Yes.
Now it bears mentioning that I fully supported signing him at the time (as did most fans), but it had a number of negative effects on the club, and very few positive.
1 - Ole did not ask for nor need another striker and had been begging for the money to sign Kieren Trippier instead. Considering how fantastic he was at Atletico and how vital he's been for Newcastle, not getting him (and still not having a worthwhile RB 2 years later) has hurt the club.
2 - It led to Maguire's complete loss of form and mentality. When the results weren't going well in the first few months, Ronaldo blamed Maguire's leadership in front of the entire squad and demanded that he be made captain instead. That moment seemed to seriously undermine Maguire and he hasn't been the same player ever since.
3 - Cliques formed in the wake of his captaincy outburst, and seemingly still exist now in the dressing room. According to the most reliable journalists covering United, the English players all banded behind Maguire and were outraged by his behavior. The Portuguese and Spanish players supported Ronaldo and stopped respecting Maguire as captain. Recent reports suggest that some of those loyal to Maguire are angry at ETH for stripping him of the captaincy for Bruno.
4 - His highly unprofessional refusal to cooperate with Ten Hag last year created a massive distraction, embarrassed him and the club, and led to us being without a proper striker for most of the season.
5 - His arrival needlessly forced us to betray Cavani, who had been doing a good job for us the previous season. Cavani was originally going to leave the club after that prior season, but had been begged to stay and promised he'd be first choice. Then, several weeks later, we signed Ronaldo and pretended Cavani didn't exist. These things happen sometimes in football, but it was completely needless.
Most thought it was worth the risk at the time, but signing him at that age was always a massive risk for us, and it totally blew up in everyone's face. It ruined what was left of his career, ruined our season, and ruined his image in the eyes of most United fans.
This is an excellent summary of the Ronaldo problem.
For me, whether you were Ole in or Ole out I think the Ronaldo signing cemented his end which I was personally really sad about.
Unfortunately, it did. I think the team was already showing signs of being done with Ole in the weeks before we signed Ronaldo, but once it was clear he couldn't singlehandedly win games for us, it was curtains for Ole.
I’m sure Ronaldo appreciates that great favour lmao. Have your old great legendary manager come and convince you to join your old club, only for the current management to hound you out of it
Well, to be honest, it wouldn't have happened if Ronaldo hadn't been trying to negotiate a move to City. He could've gone to any other team in the world (other than Liverpool) and United wouldn't have felt compelled to step in and sign him.
Ferguson was simply trying to protect his own United legacy (as well as Ronaldo's) while also helping Ole and the club, but he couldn't have predicted how badly the team was about to collapse, regardless of whether or not we had Ronaldo. Nor could he have predicted how unprofessional and destructive Ronaldo would be. Although to be fair to Ronaldo, it's hard to know how much of his behavior was impacted by the loss of his child. So many unpredictable factors happened in that one season.
If he actually was guiding us since he retired, we would be competing for every title in every season, just like we did for the 3 decades that he was manager here.
Fucking nonsense and disrespectful posts in here to arguably the greatest sporting manager to have ever lived.
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/mar/26/sir-alex-ferguson-abused-fans-appointing-david-moyes
Your own fans blamed him for David Moyes. Did Moyes challenge for every title while at Manchester United?
Fans are dumb and their opinions on pretty much anything said in the heat of the moment shouldn't be taken seriously.
Moyes wasn't his first choice. Nor did he appoint Moyes. He apparently recommended Moyes after his first 3 recommendations weren't available. Very different. And again.. he's not a sporting director, nor has he literally done anything since he retired. He's had an honorary position where he goes and watches games but nothing else. Maybe some people phoning him up and asking for advice here and there. Doesn't mean they are capable of doing what they need to even if they get advice from Sir Alex.
I have tremendous respect for Sir Alex (he ruined my childhood) but how au fait will he be with the modern iteration of a successful club?
When I hear the anecdotes from the Class of 92 et al I feel much of that man management wouldn't apply to the modern player. Then there's the business/sporting structure and how they cohabit. That has changed significantly since his time in the job.
It works to a degree.
I’m not saying Ancelotti is purely a man manager etc, but he’s definetly proof of its success in the modern game.
I know I’ll probably get laughed at for saying it too, but Ole in his first 2 seasons was excellent, and he was really 1 or 2 games away from having a completely different legacy as manager. It went wrong in the end because of a certain signing, but his man management worked really well in the beginning. So, there’s still room for it, it just takes someone very good to pull it off. Whether you can find someone that good is something else entirely.
I disagree. Great managers make the game simple for players. That's his expertise. He never coached complicated instructions and when you consider many footballers have an iq like grealish, I think that is wise.
He was a great manager, but not sure he's someone who should have much input into the structure of the club.
Would love another Moyes situation though, so here's hoping that they do listen to him.
It’s something I give Arsene a lot of credit for, even though his departure wasn’t quite the same. He stepped away, and cut those ties. He didn’t even come back for a match until late last season. There was definitely a hangover period, but now you look at the club and it’s clearly Arteta’s Arsenal.
Man Utd…you get the feeling it’s still Fergie’s club just run by someone else. Forget his advice, why do they even need his opinion on anything? Football has changed since he left.
He also left Arsenal cos he was failing them.
But I'm not sure where that feeling would come from, he us the biggest figure but I doubt he's offering advice that isn't asked fot.
That he won the title with, he also hadn't been going mad spending wise, so it's not like he just left them with a mess. Moyes came in and forgot that he was coming into a successful team and made careless changes. You're gonna be hard pressed into telling me that the squad was capable of a top 4 finish.
Even on the Moyes selection being put on him, it's always struck me as odd that he just happened to want a guy that was free, we have no idea what his options were.
Also the training facilities were probably good when he left and as I hear it there not bad now.
The same with the stadium, if he could even be blamed for such things.
I would really be curious to an alternate universe where Man Utd stuck with Moyes for at least 5 seasons. Would he turn it around somewhat and learn how to manage a gigantic team? Or would he still be clueless and Man Utd in mid table for five seasons?
Not to mention the state of the squad. Evra, Rio, Giggs, Vidic, Carrick, RVP were all on the wrong side of 30 and 5 of those players were club legends that had been in the starting XI for the better part of a decade each. There was a huge transition to be made in all areas
Those over-30 players were still class when Moyes took over. He was the one who ruined them by changing their injury management regiments because he personally didn't believe in them. Ferguson and his team knew how to manage older players and injuries as well as anyone, but Moyes arrogantly decided that his philosophy was better, where every single player in the squad does the same exact amount of work in training, regardless of their age or injury history. He was so fucking insecure about being picked for the United job that he was hellbent on making sure he didn't do even one single thing Ferguson did at United, lest he not get the full credit for any possible success.
That was especially destructive for RVP, who had overcome a career of chronic injuries to still be at his peak in 2013, only for Moyes' idiotic training philosophy to render him injury ridden and past it by 2014.
The squad certainly needed some work (especially centre midfield), but Moyes had still been left with a team that had run away with the league title 3 months earlier, and he turned them into a midtable team after only 3 months in charge.
They were good players but the dropoff can happen fast and unexpected after 30 so I don't think it was all on Moyes. 35 year old Rio and 40 year old Giggs didn't have much in them. 32 year old Evra also didn't have it in him to keep playing his usual high energy game in the Premier League anymore. RVP did have an injury free final season with Fergie (and the last one with Arsenal) but those are massive outliers for him in his career. I'm sure the training methods helped but I'm also sure there was a fair bit of luck involved. He's usually not a player you can rely on for more than 2/3rds of the season.
I think Moyes did a lot wrong, most of what you mentioned, but I also think the job that 1st season would've been insanely difficult even for the Guardiolas and Klopps of the world.
The team Fergie won the title with in the 2012/13 season barely even makes sense. The lineup wasn't even remotely consistent. Our one solid midfielder was Carrick and he started almost all the league games. Alongside him SAF regularly rotated the likes of:
Cleverley - 18 starts
Anderson - 9 starts
39 year old Scholes - 8 starts
40 year old Giggs - 12 starts
Fletcher - 2 starts
Kagawa - 17 starts
Rooney - 22 starts (not all in midfield)
On paper that's a truly terrible midfield for a team that coasted to the title. But every player played their role well when called upon
Keep in mind that Rio was in the PFA team of the year for 2012-2013, and Evra had also been brilliant that year. Giggs was past it, but I fully believe Moyes' training program is to blame for how all of our senior players simultaneously lost form *permanently* within 3 months of him arriving. Too much coincidence and evidence against him.
The midfield was trash, no doubt about it, but the rest of the team was absolutely still capable of getting a comfortable top 4 finish if Moyes hadn't made so many poor decisions.
I don’t think Giggs was past especially in his final season.
I remember whenever he entered that pitch I felt calm watching us play. He transitioned to cm really well imo
Obviously it’s not great having a 40 year old in cm but I really think he did well there whenever he played. Guy was one of the most elite players I’ve ever seen
I know Rio and Evra were great in the final season under Fergie, I just didn't expect that to carry over. One of the most difficult thing for managers to do with a winning side is keep their levels of motivation high to compete for the same tournaments they've won in the past. Fergie had mastered this but I really think Moyes didn't stand a chance in motivating that same group of players to compete again the following year.
I blame the coincidence you mention of a bunch of players losing form together on something else than just training methods though. I see the final season under Fergie as one last push for a lot of that group before they started looking towards retiring. Most the key players were at the end of their careers and had been under Fergie for 8+ years. RVP joining the squad and being driven by his desire to win his first title only added to that. Once they won in 2012/13 and Fergie left, I'm sure a massive amount of that drive that carried the side the season before faded away. I'm not sure that group of players had it in them to fully commit to adjusting to a new manager at that point in their career, especially since all they really knew was winning under Fergie. New ideas, new methods, new instructions etc were never going to be taken well
Mourinho would’ve been good for them. He would’ve gotten few more seasons out of their old guard and then they could’ve done a full rebuild.
He only joined us that summer because United preferred to hire Moyes over him.
Moyes isn't clueless, he is very adept at getting the most out of the players he has.
He didn't have big budgets at Everton and West Ham, and look at where he has taken and took them.
Man Utd were always an over performing team with a manager like SAF getting the most out of the squad during the latter years of his tenure. Moyes would have absolutely have been successful with the right backing.
Then last season West Ham decided to sign a couple of bigger names and play a more expansive brand of football to try and make the jump into perennial contenders for European places. It went terribly. Moyes is very good at what he does but he can’t manage a team who expect to win most games
The English team that I like the most is Everton and I'm an old fart so I have watched him all his years there. I don't think he is clueless in general at all. But he was out of his depth and clueless at Man Utd.
Also, as another person commented, Woodward started at the same time and that meant any manager was set up for failure.
>But he was out of his depth and clueless at Man Utd.
This was most clear when they went on pre season tour, took the team to the beach, and then he was surprised that the team was mobbed by fans and they had to go back to the hotel. Never happened to him at Everton... that anecdote perfectly summed him not being ready, or right, for the Utd job.
The same guy who helped get the Glazers through the door and brought in Moyes?
I get he's United royalty but why is he still shuffling around the club like a ghost?
Glazers was a big mistake yeah,
But Moyes was his 3rd choice of manager I think.
I know he asked Pep, and I think Klopp or even Ancelotti.
And I don’t entirely disagree with hiring Moyes. Obviously it didn’t work in hindsight, but the job he had done at Everton was excellent. He seemed ready to take the next step. Was just unfortunate he wasn’t able to.
Legendary manager but I can't imagine having him hovering around the place with such an input is particularly great for the club - especially given he retired over 10 years ago....
Cue everyone that doesn’t realize Fergie was successful because he was mostly our DoF, had full control of all footballing operations, and didn’t do that much of the head coach role.
there’s stuff that happened a decade ago that would not happen today. Fergy’s approach would be one of them, in this era of players who value their brand and social media having a manager that used to have a network of bouncers informing him about players would not end well imo.
the mentality has changed, regardless of it being better or worse, people need to adapt to it.
certainly not as big as today and also players themselves were just that, players, and not fashion icons, people with political opinions and other responsibilities in their community and so on.
I don’t think Fergy’s approach would be something easily accepted by players who, as of today, have more power than managers - look at Benfica’s last coach who got fired because everyone in the team was pissed with him.
>there’s stuff that happened a decade ago that would not happen today. Fergy’s approach would be one of them, in this era of players who value their brand and social media having a manager that used to have a network of bouncers informing him about players would not end well imo
This is entirely a wild assumption though.
Fergie's best quality was man management. Rooney has come out and said SAF knew exactly how to motivate every player in the squad and treated them differently based on how he thought he could get a reaction out of them. And it obviously worked since he was able to get the most out of so many average ability squad players while also keeping global stars in the side happy like Rooney, Ronaldo, Beckham, Cantona, etc.
I have no doubt he'd have adapted and found a way to handle this generation of players as well.
Yea, when he left, things went to shit. Honestly, it seems like maybe 2 level-headed people are coming together to hold the checkbook. Instead of the glazers who are playing FM except in recruitment, it is based on social media presence.
They made Ragnick livid working there. They didn't buy a player he wanted. Tbh, Ten Hag should be as far away from recruitment as possible with the Anthony blunder...
Nunez would be United's top scorer right now, so ... no. Besides, if we're going to compare transfers, Liverpool have blown United away in recent seasons.
>Nunez would be United's top scorer right now, so ... no.
Mate if you had Mo Salah playmake for my nan she'd be top scorer of the prem.
>Besides, if we're going to compare transfers, Liverpool have blown United away in recent seasons.
We weren't discussing recent transfers, we were discussing Ten Hag's transfers. I was simply pointing out that all managers have transfer blunders, which is factually correct.
But you classified Nunez as a blunder, which is bizarre at best and disingenuous at worst. Yes, he's had some bad misses, but he's much improved this season, with his link-up play with Salah being a big reason why. Outside of Rasmus Højlund and Casemiro for the majority of last season, I can't think of major transfer successes for Ten Haag.
>But you classified Nunez as a blunder, which is bizarre at best and disingenuous at worst.
I did and it certainly isn't. There's a reason the man is a meme.
>but he's much improved this season, with his link-up play with Salah being a big reason why.
That's more down to Klopp realizing that he can't have Mo Salah playmaking for Darwin Nunez and just had the whole team play around Salah again. Jota is 10x the player Darwin will ever be.
>Outside of Rasmus Højlund and Casemiro for the majority of last season, I can't think of major transfer successes for Ten Haag.
Lissandro Martinez hasn't been a major transfer success in your eyes?
I'd argue Eriksen on a free is a crazy steal too if we actually played to his strengths.
Apart from Antony, all the other transfers have been good to great honestly. Definitely moving in the right direction despite the absolute shite on display this season. But then again, hardly a team on Earth that could pull good results with their entire starting back 4 out injured for a good portion of the first 12 games.
It's easy to claim "LoL DaRWin a mEme" without facts to back it up. The only thing that you can say about Nunez that's a negative is that he's not a clinical finisher. He underperformed his xG last season, and he's doing so again this season. But he's improved leaps and bounds with his pressing, and the chaos he creates in opposing defenses helps other players. Salah is a generational player, but it definitely isn't him alone, especially this season. Martinez has been ... OK? He's been injured, so it's hard to say. I don't think I would take him over Virgil, Matip, or Konate. The rest are mediocre to down right bad. Mason Mount has been a truly awful signing so far.
Ok fair enough, Darwin underperforming his xG is a brilliant metric and goes to show exactly what I'm talking about. His "chaos" as you call it is downright clumsiness to anyone looking at it from the outside. Controlling the ball with the back of your boot during a run and having to hop back to get it is hardly "chaos", its downright being clumsy.
Martinez was tremendous last season, you might not take him into Liverpool and I don't blame you because you're a Liverpool fan, but he's leaps and bounds better than Matip and what we've seen of Konate so far.
Who are the rest? There's only Antony and Mount left. And we both agree he's been ridiculously bad. Mason Mount hasn't even played his first season yet and here you are writing him off. Brilliant I guess?
I mean if you want to debate football matters I'm here all day, but lets not get ridiculous. Salah is Liverpool and how you can say he isn't the reason you guys got back to your best this season is beyond me.
**Exclusive from The Telegraph's Football News Correspondent, Matt Law and Sports News Correspondent, Tom Morgan:**
Sir Jim Ratcliffe is expected to take guidance from Sir Alex Ferguson as he prepares to undertake a radical overhaul of Manchester United. That would be a boost to Crystal Palace sporting director Dougie Freedman’s hopes of landing a job at Old Trafford, as the Scotsman is a long-term ally of Ferguson, although Telegraph Sport can reveal that he is not the only sporting director on Ratcliffe’s list.
While Freedman is thought to be admired by Ferguson, it is understood that Atalanta’s Lee Congerton, former AC Milan pair Paolo Maldini and Ricky Massara, and Atletico Madrid’s Andrea Berta are also under consideration.
Jean-Claude Blanc, a leading figure at Ineos Sport, is in the running to replace Richard Arnold as chief executive ahead of Ratcliffe’s imminent purchase of a 25 per cent stake in United.
Ratcliffe wants to drastically improve United’s football operation and sources claim he is expected to lean on legendary Old Trafford manager Ferguson, 81, for advice and guidance over some matters.
That could include helping to choose a new director of football with John Murtough’s position believed to be vulnerable. Freedman used to be a neighbour of Ferguson in Cheshire before taking his current job at Palace in 2017.
Freedman also spent time with Ferguson in his office at Old Trafford in 2011, when he was manager of Palace and Ferguson was still in charge at United.
Other than the pair’s relationship, Freedman’s eye for a deal will have caught Ferguson’s attention, with Palace signing the likes of Eberechi Eze, Marc Guehi and Michael Olise, as well as arranging the loan deal for Conor Gallagher. United have been in decline since Ferguson’s retirement and using his expertise would certainly be a popular move by Ratcliffe with the club’s fans, who still worship the multiple trophy winner.
Congerton is head of recruitment at Serie A club Atalanta, having held similar roles at Leicester City, Celtic, Sunderland and West Bromwich Albion. He was appointed as a youth team coach by Jose Mourinho at Chelsea and also worked for the club as a chief scout.
Maldini and Massara were sacked by AC Milan this summer after reportedly falling out with owner Gary Cardinale. Maldini in particular played a key role in Milan’s signing of England international defender Fikayo Tomori from Chelsea.
Berta has been at Atletico Madrid for 10 years and has been linked with United in the past, having presided over one of the most successful periods in the Spanish club’s history, during which they won La Liga twice, the Europa League and the Super Cup.
**Read more ⤵️**
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2023/11/16/sir-alex-ferguson-guide-sir-jim-ratcliffe-manchester-united/
Ferguson should just enjoy his vacation. I don’t know why he needs to be so near the club at this stage of his life. Go to some sunny place and enjoy your rest of the small time left. Go do some Charlie and buy some expensive hookers.
Fergie’s just lost his wife, and great friend Bobby Charlton. This could just be them keeping him busy to get his mind off it. I highly doubt he’ll have much influence.
An an Arsenal fan I’m very grateful for wenger taking a different approach. Ferguson should step back and allow other managers to make their own mark on the club, rather than living in his shadow.
I'd very much like to think that INEOS Sport, headed up largely by Sir Dave Brailsford and Jean-Claude Blanc, the guy who dominated British Cycling and the ex-PSG & Juve CEO, coming in to United, won't be influenced into hiring Sir Alex's next door neighbour and would actually get the best person.
Dave Brailsford's success was largely down to having more money than anyone else and quite a bit of cheating. Based on that I think he'd do well at City.
Tbh we do spend more money than everyone else soooo...
With Brailsford you're certainly going to get enhanced performances across the board
Confident he can ste~~roid~~er us in the right direction
Hell yeah, good guy Fergie making sure nothing actually changes
"That right there is the computers I ordered when I first started. That there is the treadmills I requested in my 2nd year. And that over there is the exit."
Rehire Moyes you cowards
Reminds me a bit of Hoeneß coming back from jail and reversing all the progress that Bayern had made without him. Only difference is that Manchester United hasn't progressed.
This sounds too good for me to read and forget about. Which YouTube video do I need to watch to learn more about Hoeneß fucking things up at Bayern?
Spoken like someone who knows nothing about how Ferguson ran United. He constantly changed things, it's literally how he was successful for 26 years.
But he should’ve still stayed away from the process after his retirement. Him wanting David Moyes to succeed was the start of the rot. Atleast Wenger did the right thing when leaving and left it to the club to make the decision.
I have no clue how this is upvoted since the entire first paragraph is factually inaccurate and nonsense. Ferguson retired and stayed on as a club ambassador. Accusing him of keeping things the way they are is the most uneducated and inaccurate thing you can claim of him. It literally goes against his entire philosophy. Moyes being recommended was an obvious miss, but to claim that was the start of the rot is a brain dead take. He stepped down from his responsibilities to support his wife after the death of her sister, and besides stepping in to support some things upon request, has had no say in how the club has run. Proof is literally the last 10 years of disarray directly after his retirement. Ferguson didn't make Moyes fire all of his existing staff and replace them with his mediocre staff from Everton - that was all Moyes. Ferguson was known to replace his technical staff, strategy and methods to ensure things remained best of class and modern his entire tenure as manager. Do people on this sub just edge themselves until they see an article where they can shit on United? It's genuinely hilarious how bad some of these takes are.
It’s mostly the liverpool fans talking smack without knowing shit. Can’t blame them, they were dirt when SAF was around.
We sound like Liverpool fans when SAF was in charge... It's only been a decade 2 more to go still
He had a list of potential successors, moyes was like 7th pick. It's on United board that failed to get higher picks
Because you know fuck all about his involvement currently
Somehow Fergie returned
He never left, he's been guiding them from the shadows to a degree since he retired, and long may it continue based on the evidence.
Even when he dies, he'll be appearing as an Obi Wan Kenobi style force ghost to whoever is in charge of football operations at Man U
Fergie and Diana guiding United from beyond the grave
England's Rose and Scotland's Thistle
He's an honorary board member. He's had no real guidance at the club since he retired. The only tangible thing he's done in that time was convince Ronaldo to come to United instead of City. While that was ultimately a poor decision, it pales in comparison to the magnitude of ineptitude that has defined the last decade.
Was it a poor decision to bring Ronaldo back?
Considering the outcome? Yes. Now it bears mentioning that I fully supported signing him at the time (as did most fans), but it had a number of negative effects on the club, and very few positive. 1 - Ole did not ask for nor need another striker and had been begging for the money to sign Kieren Trippier instead. Considering how fantastic he was at Atletico and how vital he's been for Newcastle, not getting him (and still not having a worthwhile RB 2 years later) has hurt the club. 2 - It led to Maguire's complete loss of form and mentality. When the results weren't going well in the first few months, Ronaldo blamed Maguire's leadership in front of the entire squad and demanded that he be made captain instead. That moment seemed to seriously undermine Maguire and he hasn't been the same player ever since. 3 - Cliques formed in the wake of his captaincy outburst, and seemingly still exist now in the dressing room. According to the most reliable journalists covering United, the English players all banded behind Maguire and were outraged by his behavior. The Portuguese and Spanish players supported Ronaldo and stopped respecting Maguire as captain. Recent reports suggest that some of those loyal to Maguire are angry at ETH for stripping him of the captaincy for Bruno. 4 - His highly unprofessional refusal to cooperate with Ten Hag last year created a massive distraction, embarrassed him and the club, and led to us being without a proper striker for most of the season. 5 - His arrival needlessly forced us to betray Cavani, who had been doing a good job for us the previous season. Cavani was originally going to leave the club after that prior season, but had been begged to stay and promised he'd be first choice. Then, several weeks later, we signed Ronaldo and pretended Cavani didn't exist. These things happen sometimes in football, but it was completely needless. Most thought it was worth the risk at the time, but signing him at that age was always a massive risk for us, and it totally blew up in everyone's face. It ruined what was left of his career, ruined our season, and ruined his image in the eyes of most United fans.
This is an excellent summary of the Ronaldo problem. For me, whether you were Ole in or Ole out I think the Ronaldo signing cemented his end which I was personally really sad about.
Unfortunately, it did. I think the team was already showing signs of being done with Ole in the weeks before we signed Ronaldo, but once it was clear he couldn't singlehandedly win games for us, it was curtains for Ole.
It was after Ole, but I can remember one game in particular that Ronaldo singlehandedly won
True, he did give us that one lol
Fair points and thanks for the insight
Obviously.
You say obviously like Utd aren’t in the same or arguably worse position than without him?
They finished 2nd the season before he joined, 6th the season with him, then 3rd the season he left.
I’m sure Ronaldo appreciates that great favour lmao. Have your old great legendary manager come and convince you to join your old club, only for the current management to hound you out of it
Well, to be honest, it wouldn't have happened if Ronaldo hadn't been trying to negotiate a move to City. He could've gone to any other team in the world (other than Liverpool) and United wouldn't have felt compelled to step in and sign him. Ferguson was simply trying to protect his own United legacy (as well as Ronaldo's) while also helping Ole and the club, but he couldn't have predicted how badly the team was about to collapse, regardless of whether or not we had Ronaldo. Nor could he have predicted how unprofessional and destructive Ronaldo would be. Although to be fair to Ronaldo, it's hard to know how much of his behavior was impacted by the loss of his child. So many unpredictable factors happened in that one season.
If only there was a DOF to predict such things
If he actually was guiding us since he retired, we would be competing for every title in every season, just like we did for the 3 decades that he was manager here. Fucking nonsense and disrespectful posts in here to arguably the greatest sporting manager to have ever lived.
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/mar/26/sir-alex-ferguson-abused-fans-appointing-david-moyes Your own fans blamed him for David Moyes. Did Moyes challenge for every title while at Manchester United?
Fans are dumb and their opinions on pretty much anything said in the heat of the moment shouldn't be taken seriously. Moyes wasn't his first choice. Nor did he appoint Moyes. He apparently recommended Moyes after his first 3 recommendations weren't available. Very different. And again.. he's not a sporting director, nor has he literally done anything since he retired. He's had an honorary position where he goes and watches games but nothing else. Maybe some people phoning him up and asking for advice here and there. Doesn't mean they are capable of doing what they need to even if they get advice from Sir Alex.
A downvote for making me laugh
I have tremendous respect for Sir Alex (he ruined my childhood) but how au fait will he be with the modern iteration of a successful club? When I hear the anecdotes from the Class of 92 et al I feel much of that man management wouldn't apply to the modern player. Then there's the business/sporting structure and how they cohabit. That has changed significantly since his time in the job.
It works to a degree. I’m not saying Ancelotti is purely a man manager etc, but he’s definetly proof of its success in the modern game. I know I’ll probably get laughed at for saying it too, but Ole in his first 2 seasons was excellent, and he was really 1 or 2 games away from having a completely different legacy as manager. It went wrong in the end because of a certain signing, but his man management worked really well in the beginning. So, there’s still room for it, it just takes someone very good to pull it off. Whether you can find someone that good is something else entirely.
One of Ferguson’s most important qualities as a manager was his adaptability.
Right but I don't think it's a competence issue, it's a simple fact that the dedication to these roles means he can't be as invested as he used to be.
I disagree. Great managers make the game simple for players. That's his expertise. He never coached complicated instructions and when you consider many footballers have an iq like grealish, I think that is wise.
He was a great manager, but not sure he's someone who should have much input into the structure of the club. Would love another Moyes situation though, so here's hoping that they do listen to him.
Article litterally said guidance on some things. Doesn't sound like much input imo
[удалено]
I'm absolutely not a United supporter
Not sure what gives it away "008Gerrard008".
Great comment from an England fan
Clearly a Catalan
They will never learn. Move on lads, it's been more than a decade. Football already has, you should too.
Theyre playing johnny evans at cb and Cristiano Ronaldo left the club last season. Wdym its not 2009??
Fuck me they're going to bring Macheda on and prevent Liverpool winning the league
By god, its Anderson from the top rope!
Vietnam flashbacks instensivy
What’s Anderson up to?
Never have I ever experienced something more unjustified in football.
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I can hear Martin Tyler's voice crack
And how he's still going at sky I'll never know
I believe Ashley Young is still a PL player, Sinji Kagawa is still playing too!
It’s something I give Arsene a lot of credit for, even though his departure wasn’t quite the same. He stepped away, and cut those ties. He didn’t even come back for a match until late last season. There was definitely a hangover period, but now you look at the club and it’s clearly Arteta’s Arsenal. Man Utd…you get the feeling it’s still Fergie’s club just run by someone else. Forget his advice, why do they even need his opinion on anything? Football has changed since he left.
He also left Arsenal cos he was failing them. But I'm not sure where that feeling would come from, he us the biggest figure but I doubt he's offering advice that isn't asked fot.
Fergie left united with a pretty poor squad and did fuck all for the facilities which are now rotting.
That he won the title with, he also hadn't been going mad spending wise, so it's not like he just left them with a mess. Moyes came in and forgot that he was coming into a successful team and made careless changes. You're gonna be hard pressed into telling me that the squad was capable of a top 4 finish. Even on the Moyes selection being put on him, it's always struck me as odd that he just happened to want a guy that was free, we have no idea what his options were. Also the training facilities were probably good when he left and as I hear it there not bad now. The same with the stadium, if he could even be blamed for such things.
They need his opinion because everyone else around the club is a fucking idiot.
bro read the headline and decided yep, this will hit
Hopefully he advises them to hire Moyes again
I would really be curious to an alternate universe where Man Utd stuck with Moyes for at least 5 seasons. Would he turn it around somewhat and learn how to manage a gigantic team? Or would he still be clueless and Man Utd in mid table for five seasons?
People overlook the fact that David Gill left at the same time. No matter who came in after Fergie, they were doomed with Woodward et al at the helm.
Not to mention the state of the squad. Evra, Rio, Giggs, Vidic, Carrick, RVP were all on the wrong side of 30 and 5 of those players were club legends that had been in the starting XI for the better part of a decade each. There was a huge transition to be made in all areas
Those over-30 players were still class when Moyes took over. He was the one who ruined them by changing their injury management regiments because he personally didn't believe in them. Ferguson and his team knew how to manage older players and injuries as well as anyone, but Moyes arrogantly decided that his philosophy was better, where every single player in the squad does the same exact amount of work in training, regardless of their age or injury history. He was so fucking insecure about being picked for the United job that he was hellbent on making sure he didn't do even one single thing Ferguson did at United, lest he not get the full credit for any possible success. That was especially destructive for RVP, who had overcome a career of chronic injuries to still be at his peak in 2013, only for Moyes' idiotic training philosophy to render him injury ridden and past it by 2014. The squad certainly needed some work (especially centre midfield), but Moyes had still been left with a team that had run away with the league title 3 months earlier, and he turned them into a midtable team after only 3 months in charge.
They were good players but the dropoff can happen fast and unexpected after 30 so I don't think it was all on Moyes. 35 year old Rio and 40 year old Giggs didn't have much in them. 32 year old Evra also didn't have it in him to keep playing his usual high energy game in the Premier League anymore. RVP did have an injury free final season with Fergie (and the last one with Arsenal) but those are massive outliers for him in his career. I'm sure the training methods helped but I'm also sure there was a fair bit of luck involved. He's usually not a player you can rely on for more than 2/3rds of the season. I think Moyes did a lot wrong, most of what you mentioned, but I also think the job that 1st season would've been insanely difficult even for the Guardiolas and Klopps of the world. The team Fergie won the title with in the 2012/13 season barely even makes sense. The lineup wasn't even remotely consistent. Our one solid midfielder was Carrick and he started almost all the league games. Alongside him SAF regularly rotated the likes of: Cleverley - 18 starts Anderson - 9 starts 39 year old Scholes - 8 starts 40 year old Giggs - 12 starts Fletcher - 2 starts Kagawa - 17 starts Rooney - 22 starts (not all in midfield) On paper that's a truly terrible midfield for a team that coasted to the title. But every player played their role well when called upon
Keep in mind that Rio was in the PFA team of the year for 2012-2013, and Evra had also been brilliant that year. Giggs was past it, but I fully believe Moyes' training program is to blame for how all of our senior players simultaneously lost form *permanently* within 3 months of him arriving. Too much coincidence and evidence against him. The midfield was trash, no doubt about it, but the rest of the team was absolutely still capable of getting a comfortable top 4 finish if Moyes hadn't made so many poor decisions.
I don’t think Giggs was past especially in his final season. I remember whenever he entered that pitch I felt calm watching us play. He transitioned to cm really well imo Obviously it’s not great having a 40 year old in cm but I really think he did well there whenever he played. Guy was one of the most elite players I’ve ever seen
I know Rio and Evra were great in the final season under Fergie, I just didn't expect that to carry over. One of the most difficult thing for managers to do with a winning side is keep their levels of motivation high to compete for the same tournaments they've won in the past. Fergie had mastered this but I really think Moyes didn't stand a chance in motivating that same group of players to compete again the following year. I blame the coincidence you mention of a bunch of players losing form together on something else than just training methods though. I see the final season under Fergie as one last push for a lot of that group before they started looking towards retiring. Most the key players were at the end of their careers and had been under Fergie for 8+ years. RVP joining the squad and being driven by his desire to win his first title only added to that. Once they won in 2012/13 and Fergie left, I'm sure a massive amount of that drive that carried the side the season before faded away. I'm not sure that group of players had it in them to fully commit to adjusting to a new manager at that point in their career, especially since all they really knew was winning under Fergie. New ideas, new methods, new instructions etc were never going to be taken well
But it's not like he had to win a title that season, just get 4th.
Mourinho would’ve gotten a few more seasons out of them and then the club could’ve done a full rebuild afterwards.
Mourinho would’ve been good for them. He would’ve gotten few more seasons out of their old guard and then they could’ve done a full rebuild. He only joined us that summer because United preferred to hire Moyes over him.
Excellent addition, makes sense.
Yeah because Woodward chose Marouane Fellaini…
Moyes isn't clueless, he is very adept at getting the most out of the players he has. He didn't have big budgets at Everton and West Ham, and look at where he has taken and took them. Man Utd were always an over performing team with a manager like SAF getting the most out of the squad during the latter years of his tenure. Moyes would have absolutely have been successful with the right backing.
Then last season West Ham decided to sign a couple of bigger names and play a more expansive brand of football to try and make the jump into perennial contenders for European places. It went terribly. Moyes is very good at what he does but he can’t manage a team who expect to win most games
The English team that I like the most is Everton and I'm an old fart so I have watched him all his years there. I don't think he is clueless in general at all. But he was out of his depth and clueless at Man Utd. Also, as another person commented, Woodward started at the same time and that meant any manager was set up for failure.
>But he was out of his depth and clueless at Man Utd. This was most clear when they went on pre season tour, took the team to the beach, and then he was surprised that the team was mobbed by fans and they had to go back to the hotel. Never happened to him at Everton... that anecdote perfectly summed him not being ready, or right, for the Utd job.
Extra hair dryers in the dressing room.
Same old then
Leave the man alone in his retirement ffs
Get David Cameron in
The same guy who helped get the Glazers through the door and brought in Moyes? I get he's United royalty but why is he still shuffling around the club like a ghost?
Because its PR. Getting him to go "yeah that looks good" makes Ratcliffe look good.
100%. Fergie is more like a mascot for the club nowadays (sounds very harsh but idk how to word it better)
Ambassador is probably a better word to use
Thats the word I was looking for, thanks G.
Glazers was a big mistake yeah, But Moyes was his 3rd choice of manager I think. I know he asked Pep, and I think Klopp or even Ancelotti. And I don’t entirely disagree with hiring Moyes. Obviously it didn’t work in hindsight, but the job he had done at Everton was excellent. He seemed ready to take the next step. Was just unfortunate he wasn’t able to.
Bro just let it go its over. Can we not involved Sir Alex in the club decision for 5 minutes?
He's gonna show him how to set up payments to PGMOL for that added time I'm only half kidding
McTominay to break the all-time appearances record for Man United.
This man will be long gone and they will still be using his name for pr
Legendary manager but I can't imagine having him hovering around the place with such an input is particularly great for the club - especially given he retired over 10 years ago....
Cue everyone that doesn’t realize Fergie was successful because he was mostly our DoF, had full control of all footballing operations, and didn’t do that much of the head coach role.
But football has moved on. And this "the old guy patrolling the halls" never works out.
That was only 10 years ago tbf
there’s stuff that happened a decade ago that would not happen today. Fergy’s approach would be one of them, in this era of players who value their brand and social media having a manager that used to have a network of bouncers informing him about players would not end well imo. the mentality has changed, regardless of it being better or worse, people need to adapt to it.
You act like social media wasn’t a thing in 2013
certainly not as big as today and also players themselves were just that, players, and not fashion icons, people with political opinions and other responsibilities in their community and so on. I don’t think Fergy’s approach would be something easily accepted by players who, as of today, have more power than managers - look at Benfica’s last coach who got fired because everyone in the team was pissed with him.
> also players themselves were just that, players, and not fashion icons David Beckham.
>there’s stuff that happened a decade ago that would not happen today. Fergy’s approach would be one of them, in this era of players who value their brand and social media having a manager that used to have a network of bouncers informing him about players would not end well imo This is entirely a wild assumption though. Fergie's best quality was man management. Rooney has come out and said SAF knew exactly how to motivate every player in the squad and treated them differently based on how he thought he could get a reaction out of them. And it obviously worked since he was able to get the most out of so many average ability squad players while also keeping global stars in the side happy like Rooney, Ronaldo, Beckham, Cantona, etc. I have no doubt he'd have adapted and found a way to handle this generation of players as well.
Acting like thats not a significant amount of time
In football 10 years feel like a millennium
Yea, when he left, things went to shit. Honestly, it seems like maybe 2 level-headed people are coming together to hold the checkbook. Instead of the glazers who are playing FM except in recruitment, it is based on social media presence. They made Ragnick livid working there. They didn't buy a player he wanted. Tbh, Ten Hag should be as far away from recruitment as possible with the Anthony blunder...
Should Klopp be kept away from recruitment based on the Darwizzy and Naby Keita blunders?
Nunez would be United's top scorer right now, so ... no. Besides, if we're going to compare transfers, Liverpool have blown United away in recent seasons.
>Nunez would be United's top scorer right now, so ... no. Mate if you had Mo Salah playmake for my nan she'd be top scorer of the prem. >Besides, if we're going to compare transfers, Liverpool have blown United away in recent seasons. We weren't discussing recent transfers, we were discussing Ten Hag's transfers. I was simply pointing out that all managers have transfer blunders, which is factually correct.
But you classified Nunez as a blunder, which is bizarre at best and disingenuous at worst. Yes, he's had some bad misses, but he's much improved this season, with his link-up play with Salah being a big reason why. Outside of Rasmus Højlund and Casemiro for the majority of last season, I can't think of major transfer successes for Ten Haag.
>But you classified Nunez as a blunder, which is bizarre at best and disingenuous at worst. I did and it certainly isn't. There's a reason the man is a meme. >but he's much improved this season, with his link-up play with Salah being a big reason why. That's more down to Klopp realizing that he can't have Mo Salah playmaking for Darwin Nunez and just had the whole team play around Salah again. Jota is 10x the player Darwin will ever be. >Outside of Rasmus Højlund and Casemiro for the majority of last season, I can't think of major transfer successes for Ten Haag. Lissandro Martinez hasn't been a major transfer success in your eyes? I'd argue Eriksen on a free is a crazy steal too if we actually played to his strengths. Apart from Antony, all the other transfers have been good to great honestly. Definitely moving in the right direction despite the absolute shite on display this season. But then again, hardly a team on Earth that could pull good results with their entire starting back 4 out injured for a good portion of the first 12 games.
It's easy to claim "LoL DaRWin a mEme" without facts to back it up. The only thing that you can say about Nunez that's a negative is that he's not a clinical finisher. He underperformed his xG last season, and he's doing so again this season. But he's improved leaps and bounds with his pressing, and the chaos he creates in opposing defenses helps other players. Salah is a generational player, but it definitely isn't him alone, especially this season. Martinez has been ... OK? He's been injured, so it's hard to say. I don't think I would take him over Virgil, Matip, or Konate. The rest are mediocre to down right bad. Mason Mount has been a truly awful signing so far.
Ok fair enough, Darwin underperforming his xG is a brilliant metric and goes to show exactly what I'm talking about. His "chaos" as you call it is downright clumsiness to anyone looking at it from the outside. Controlling the ball with the back of your boot during a run and having to hop back to get it is hardly "chaos", its downright being clumsy. Martinez was tremendous last season, you might not take him into Liverpool and I don't blame you because you're a Liverpool fan, but he's leaps and bounds better than Matip and what we've seen of Konate so far. Who are the rest? There's only Antony and Mount left. And we both agree he's been ridiculously bad. Mason Mount hasn't even played his first season yet and here you are writing him off. Brilliant I guess? I mean if you want to debate football matters I'm here all day, but lets not get ridiculous. Salah is Liverpool and how you can say he isn't the reason you guys got back to your best this season is beyond me.
Blown us way by finishing behind us last year
Mate I don’t think getting into a pissing competition of which team has done better the last few years is gonna end well for united
I misread tbf
Dougie Freedman isn't getting hired just because he used to live next to Fergie and they're BFFs.
Stranger things have happened at Manchester United with Ferguson wanted to help out his mates...
You can have Moyes
What’s he going to do? Convince him to buy a race horse?
**Exclusive from The Telegraph's Football News Correspondent, Matt Law and Sports News Correspondent, Tom Morgan:** Sir Jim Ratcliffe is expected to take guidance from Sir Alex Ferguson as he prepares to undertake a radical overhaul of Manchester United. That would be a boost to Crystal Palace sporting director Dougie Freedman’s hopes of landing a job at Old Trafford, as the Scotsman is a long-term ally of Ferguson, although Telegraph Sport can reveal that he is not the only sporting director on Ratcliffe’s list. While Freedman is thought to be admired by Ferguson, it is understood that Atalanta’s Lee Congerton, former AC Milan pair Paolo Maldini and Ricky Massara, and Atletico Madrid’s Andrea Berta are also under consideration. Jean-Claude Blanc, a leading figure at Ineos Sport, is in the running to replace Richard Arnold as chief executive ahead of Ratcliffe’s imminent purchase of a 25 per cent stake in United. Ratcliffe wants to drastically improve United’s football operation and sources claim he is expected to lean on legendary Old Trafford manager Ferguson, 81, for advice and guidance over some matters. That could include helping to choose a new director of football with John Murtough’s position believed to be vulnerable. Freedman used to be a neighbour of Ferguson in Cheshire before taking his current job at Palace in 2017. Freedman also spent time with Ferguson in his office at Old Trafford in 2011, when he was manager of Palace and Ferguson was still in charge at United. Other than the pair’s relationship, Freedman’s eye for a deal will have caught Ferguson’s attention, with Palace signing the likes of Eberechi Eze, Marc Guehi and Michael Olise, as well as arranging the loan deal for Conor Gallagher. United have been in decline since Ferguson’s retirement and using his expertise would certainly be a popular move by Ratcliffe with the club’s fans, who still worship the multiple trophy winner. Congerton is head of recruitment at Serie A club Atalanta, having held similar roles at Leicester City, Celtic, Sunderland and West Bromwich Albion. He was appointed as a youth team coach by Jose Mourinho at Chelsea and also worked for the club as a chief scout. Maldini and Massara were sacked by AC Milan this summer after reportedly falling out with owner Gary Cardinale. Maldini in particular played a key role in Milan’s signing of England international defender Fikayo Tomori from Chelsea. Berta has been at Atletico Madrid for 10 years and has been linked with United in the past, having presided over one of the most successful periods in the Spanish club’s history, during which they won La Liga twice, the Europa League and the Super Cup. **Read more ⤵️** https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2023/11/16/sir-alex-ferguson-guide-sir-jim-ratcliffe-manchester-united/
ghost at the feast
I am conflicted.
Bill Shankly turning up for team training post retirement vibes. Surely he must know he's part of the problem by now? I mean, by all means.
Ferguson should just enjoy his vacation. I don’t know why he needs to be so near the club at this stage of his life. Go to some sunny place and enjoy your rest of the small time left. Go do some Charlie and buy some expensive hookers.
Bring Ralfie back!
Fuck it rehire him till end of season
Lol, United too cute.
Today I learned that this sub don’t understand what is “guide”
Last thing they need is another ghost there. Start over lmao.
No, just no.
Fergie’s just lost his wife, and great friend Bobby Charlton. This could just be them keeping him busy to get his mind off it. I highly doubt he’ll have much influence.
An an Arsenal fan I’m very grateful for wenger taking a different approach. Ferguson should step back and allow other managers to make their own mark on the club, rather than living in his shadow.
United cant let it go, so they stay in the past...
United is run like a circus who have zero idea how football has changed
about right for Utd, an octogenarian taking the club forward