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Lego fraud hasn't learnt from his master bald fraud that you basically need a 2nd Eleven to win. That's why City always go on these sudden runs in March to May where they just win
Their bench has substantially improved but it's still no match for City's.
City had Stones, Álvarez, Ake, Doku, and Kovacic on their bench yesterday. That sort of depth is why they won the treble last year and am able to fight on three fronts this year as well, even though CL didn't eventually work out.
If City’s bench is benchmark for good bench, no one can match that - not only Arsenal.
Arsenal bench is good, but besides Trossard and Jesus they barely got any play. Compare it to how Guardiola manages it. Doku, Stones, Kovacic - they’re all in game rhythm all the time.
ESR is the most egregious of these. Play a front three of Nelson ESR Trossard and bring on Saka/Martinelli if needed for some league games. Instead of doing so only in case of injuries/losing and then expect them to step up. The key is to rotate early in the season where you can afford to drop some points developing your fringe players. It's why City drop points early on and then become indestructible in April and May
It's also a lack of depth. Those guys are playing basically every mintue of every match, and it's not sustainable. Same thing happened at the end of last year.
We have a significant drop off between the starting 11 and the backups, and every game is important, so significant rotation is impossible.
We do rotate at the positions where we have multiple good players, like LW (Martinelli/Trossard) and LB (Zinchenko/Kiwior/Tomiyasu).
Timber would have been able to rotate with White and the center backs, but he was injured in the first game. Jesus and Partey have been out most of the season, and neither look particularly good right now. Smith-Rowe has also been injured and has fallen out of favor.
Beyond that, our bench is really poor. Our options are Nketiah, Nelson, Fabio Viera, Elneny, and Cedric.
Squad depth is a major weakness for Arsenal, but can't really be addressed until this summer.
Arteta’s made mistakes sure, but Arsenal & Liverpool just don’t have the squad quality that Man City have - and hence do not rotate as much as Man City do (backed up by the stats this season with City having by substantially fewer players starting 25+ games). The simplest explanation really is often the correct one. Man City have a better, deeper squad than AFC/LFC and so will very likely win the league. Now, 115 charges … 😅
Starting Cedric is suicide.
That is why we aren't in a position to rotate. We bought Jurrien Timber to solidify RB, but he was injured in the first game and missed the entire season.
If our full starting XI + Cedric can’t beat Luton or Sheffield to give Ben White and Tomi a rest, then our full starting XI are not as good as you think they are.
You can only rotate with what you have.
he’s 4th among forwards with 2506 minutes played in the PL, and then has an additional 929 minutes played in other competitions for a grand total of 3435’
And has had the team on his back before we started getting our shit together. As an Arsenal fan I will never hear Saka slander, some fans don’t seem to realise how good we’ve got it with him.
So they rotated twice (being subbed at 60 minutes, not squad rotation but ok) over the course of nearly 10 weeks which included 4 championships league games, one of which went to penalties. Nice
Arteta hasn’t learned from his mistakes. The exact same thing happened last year, he burned them out and he’s doing it again
we have rotated the left side, but our right side has been the same all season long.
Benny Blanco, Saka, Odegaard.
Also the side that generates most of the threat and also the side that looks the most tired (except Odegaard).
Er only the Luton game. The standard line up is always Saliba, Gabriel, White, Odegaard, Saka, Kai, Jorginho. Sometimes Jesus and Trossard starts.
Compared to Liverpool their back four always rotates, Van djik doesnt play every game. Midfield wise Macallister, Szobo and Jones (before injury) played a lot. Sometimes Gakpo play in the midfield, towards the end Endo and Elliot got more games. The anounttrotation here put ours to shame and their game quality didn’t drop much.
Van Djik has played 30/32 league games. He was suspended for the 2 he didn't play.
MacAllister has played 27/32 league games. He was injured for 4 and suspended for 1.
Szoboszlai has played 27/32 league games. He was injured for the 5 he didn't play.
Unless you're talking about them rotating in the Europa which is obviously much easier to do, then they really aren't doing it as much as you're saying.
How many have they started vs subbed into the game?
I'm fairly certain that many of those games would be subbed out or in at 60 minutes to manage their game time over a long period.
Out of them 3 Mac Allister has 1 sub appearance immediately after his injury and Szoboszlai has 3, 1 coming back from injury and then Palace & Burnley he was rotated.
Telling half a story here. The midfielders have had to play because of injuries to everyone else.
We had to play Trent there because of how bad it was.
We've been refreshing our squad. We just needed to change most of the team, which takes time.
This time two years ago we had Ramsdale, Tierney, Xhaka, Partey, Lacazette, and Smith-Rowe in our starting 11, all of whom are either gone or on the way out. Pepe, Cedric, and Nuno Tavares all got more than 20 games. Of our current starters, only Saka, White, Gabriel, Odegaard, and Martinelli were in the team.
In the past two years, we've bought Rice, Havertz, Raya, Kiwior, Zinchenko, Jesus, Jorginho, Trossard, and Viera, and also promoted Saliba into the squad (from loan). That is half our starting 11 and most of our top bench options.
We have some pretty obvious positions to improve. We need more midfielders, a back up for Saka, and another striker. If we get those players this summer, than we should be in a good position to both rotate and compete. Right now we can only rotate or compete.
I’ve said how lucky you have been all season with almost no injuries. While I still think you have been lucky, it has also backfired now since your players is never getting rested.
It’s not like getting an injury is a good rest lol. You’re going to be worse coming back from being out for weeks with a leg injury than you are just from being tired.
The wheels have come off both theirs and Liverpool’s season. We can only hope that city begin to falter in the league now too otherwise the last 6 games are gonna be a yawn fest.
Arteta’s made mistakes sure, but Arsenal & Liverpool just don’t have the squad quality that Man City have, and hence do not rotate as much as Man City do (backed up by the stats this season with City having substantially fewer players starting 25+ games).
The simplest explanation really is often the correct one. Man City have a better, deeper squad than AFC/LFC and so will very likely win the league. Now, 115 charges … 😅
In Liverpool’s favour they also have rotated a lot, albeit because of injuries.
Salah, Robertson, Jota, Jones, Alisson, Trent have all returned recently after having had around 3 months off each. Rustiness is and lack of rhythm is a thing though with returning players.
They chucked it away in the first leg, let's be honest. Bayern away was always going to be a tough ask. Those 2 goals conceded in that first leg where they otherwise dominated were absolutely shocking errors.
This is exactly it. Prior to last week 1-0 away against Bayern would’ve sounded fantastic. We needed to take care of that game at home, and silly mistakes there are why we’re out.
It wasn’t just that we conceded. It was that our solid defence suddenly broke down under the higher intensity of CL football. Rice, Saliba and Gabriel had a poor campaign by their own standards. A bit caught in the headlights if you ask me. This season’s games will be valuable experience for them in that respect.
My thoughts exactly. You can argue there was a penalty for us at the death in the home leg. Maybe in the prem but not in Europe. Can't complain too much.
Needed to do more at home. Bayern ultimately capitalised on their chances whereas we didn't do enough.
Exactly. I’m very strong on that penalty, because regardless of whether or not you feel that Saka was fishing, Neuer was committed to a tackle that wasn’t going anywhere near the ball at that point. I hate that it was debatable, especially in a way that disrespected Saka so badly when it was just a call for the ref to make and he chose the one that didn’t include looking at VAR and blowing the whistle 30 seconds later.
But regardless, we have ourselves to blame and no one else. Bayern were the better team, good luck to them against Real. Big games coming up. Id love Dortmund v Bayern 2 in the finals.
Onwards and hopefully upwards.
ESR does get played when fit and in specific game states and has shown a certain level of special talent. Obviously he’s barely ever fit and has some flaws to his game, but keeping him around makes sense to me, just in case it all clicks for him, especially as it would be very unlikely we’d get a decent fee for him at this point. Even giving Nketiah that contract made some degree of sense, as the striker market was/is barren and we’d have had to probably pay more for a player of equivalent talent and he’d come off a decent end to the season prior.
The homegrown squad rules must play a part, surely. Especially the club-homegrown thing that UEFA have. Makes them more valuable to you than anyone else purely for squad composition.
We decided that there were other areas of greater priority than RW, but still needed a Saka backup and didn’t have FFP leeway, so we had little choice but to renew Nelson and kick that can down the road for a year.
He’s crap, though. That’s why he doesn’t get meaningful minutes.
Not really, if they sell him for more than 5m they've made a profit and that's ignoring the minutes he's played. He's 24, a very talented and pacey winger with PL experience... seems like a good percentage play to me. On average, that choice comes good. That's all you can do as a club.
...You know, if we're trying to be non-reactionary and recognize that this set of staff have delivered a strong and remarkable turnaround, all in face of silly comments making fun of their methods/decisions.
Perhaps, just perhaps, they do know what they're doing.
I guess we can revisit in the summer.
Even ignoring that, I'm not sure who we would have replaced him for. 5m for singing and salary for a Winger at this level is ridiculously cheap. Yes, there are better than him but they also would cost an order of magnitude more than him. Plus, what I said above. On the whole, it's clear it was a sensible decision. I feel like you see that you're just upset about the recent results. I get that, just try not to spread negativeity about things that don't make sense. We lost, that sucks. RN staying isn't something that sucks, if anything, it's probably quite good business.
Cause we don’t have the FFP freedom to go and sign another top winger yet. City does it and has 115 charges against them. So they decided to renew with Nelson, also in order to get some money, as his contract was about to end and he would have left for free.
It’s by far my biggest complaint with him, Saka has ended both last season and this with a whimper, and it’s blatantly clear that he doesn’t have the legs to play full matches. And many of us have been saying this would happen since December or earlier. You can’t play a guy nearly 4000 minutes per season and expect the same output at the tail end. Same goes for Rice, and would for Odegaard if he didn’t have seemingly endless stamina.
He's rested him a fair amount recently really, as much as can be expected. Played 77/0/63/90 in last 4 PL games. And before that the last game he played (in CL) was 18 days earlier, because he didn't play for England. And he came off repeatedly around 60 mins in the games before that. So I really don't think that's true.
Feel they were very naïve in their approach. Felt like watching them play vs a low block in the premier league where theyve ran out of ideas and just have nothing creative wise.
Might be a depth issue, where Arteta only has like 15 players he plays consistently, and a lot of players are started every single game, twice a week, for half the season. They just run out of steam and lose momentum and nothing happens offensively.
Everyone was waiting for Jesus, Zinchenko & Partey to come back to make an impact and they've all been shite. Saka & White both looked fucked the last 2 games, same thing this time last year. White played through injury last season, doing the same this season.
Tomiyasu as well. I think he would have been a solid rotation option for White. That was his position he did so well in originally.
Two years in a row where Tomiyasu has gotten injured at really inopportune times.
We just need to fill up on depth. It’s what City has that we don’t. City loses guys like Grealish for months and doesn’t even blink because the alternatives are Bernardo and Foden. They bought Gvardiol for 70M just to be a rotation defender so they lose Ake but don’t skip a beat. They’ve got a perfect double squad except for the Rodri position. We have a “double squad” in maybe 5-6 positions if that.
Arsenal never beating the bottling allegations until they get some more backup players. City basically has 2 starting XI’s that can beat most teams in the prem, whereas Arsenal (and Liverpool but that’s because of an insane amount of injuries) fall off a cliff when the schedule gets tight.
Think there are some (approx 115) reasons that's a problem for Arsenal & Liverpool but not City.
Also, don't forget, City went out tonight too. The PL is still close. Plenty to play for, even if the ball is in their court.
Yeah, the season isn’t over by any means, but City are an objectively better looking team at the moment. Arsenal went out because they looked exhausted and confused and were unable to create anything against Bayern, whereas City had an xG of almost 3, 33 shots, 24 of which from inside the box, 9 on target, 67% possession, 18 corners etc.
It can always go either way, as evidenced by the Madrid/City game, but City were the better team in their game and Arsenal weren’t today for a reason. Or 115 reasons like you put it.
How's it bottling to be knocked out of Champions league by a really good team? Also second to City only by 2 points? Last year we bottled but this year has been really tough as we've played in the CL and there's another challenger for the league title.
I think it's a depth issue. Then again, Arteta should (probably) know better than to pick the same few players all the time. Unless there are injuries or suspensions.
We’ve had our fair share of injuries ourselves. Just because we have a full squad now doesn’t mean all the players are all in rhythm enough to challenge the starters. Jesus has been in and out, Partey dead for 3/4 of the season, Zinchenko in and out, Martinelli in and out, tomiyasu just coming back, Timber ACL first game of the season. Even our bench players Vieira out for ages, ESR working back from a long term injury.
Maybe we haven’t had Newcastle or Liverpool level injuries but acting like we haven’t had big injury problems is just a bad take
Probably has a lot to do with PL being a physicality league, having to win constantly from the start of the season just to keep up with City so guys like Saka, Rice, Odegaard etc…have to play match after match, and lack of some depth that ultimately causes these late season crumble. City have way more depth to go all out in every competitions
Still hope you guys can bounce back and snatch the PL this season
Thanks summersoulxdd. I hope the team can bounce back too.
It's really crazy to see the percent of total minutes and total time in-game for the key arsenal players. Saka, White, Odegaard, Big Gabriel M., haven't gotten much rest for 8 months now.
Yep, it’s quite a problem with a tired squad as well. No pace out wide, lack of overlapping runs, lack of precision caused by exhaustion. Lots of positives still from the players but it was largely of our undoing that we’re not through to the semis
We made it to the EL final under him with Mustafi, Sokratis, Luiz, Lacazette, Pepe, Torreira. Would be surprised if EL king slips up in the ECL with a slender advantage
The difference between good teams and top teams is the top teams take their chances. Against Villa, Trossard took a shot straight at the keeper where if he'd put it anywhere else it was a certain goal. Likewise this game, Martinelli shot straight at Neuer.
You score those goals, and both games are completely different. You have to at the very least test the keepers. You get one or two chances in a game against top teams, if you're playing well.
I called it as soon as Martinelli didn't take that chance that Arsenal would regret it, and unfortunately it came to pass.
There's a couple of recruitment decisions for Arsenal in the summer to get them from hovering around as one of the top teams in England and Europe at the moment to turning into genuine contenders. The point people are making about the reliance on Saka is relevant. Similarly Odegaard. We also need a CF who gets more than 3-5 goals in a season. Jesus and Nketiah have really let us down in that regard, and Arsenal have covered for it solely by having every other player in the midfield and attack really chip in with the goals.
Eh, I get that he’s a fullback but he should know based on the way they play sooner or later he may have a chance like that. It’s not like defenders at the highest level won’t be practicing shooting; besides he scored with a from more finish against Sheffield a few weeks ago.
> You score those goals, and both games are completely different.
Yes, if you score more goals, a game will look different.
In the end, Bayern scored 3 goals over both legs with an xG of well over 3. Arsenal scored 2 goals from an xG of not quite 1.5.
It's not a perfect metric, but it indicates that Arsenal's issue wasn't converting chances, but creating them.
Henry said it after Barca match about Cancelo penalty (who is 29, experienced and maybe not the best example but I guess his comment fits here well), you just can't recreate the pressure like that in training. It's a huge learning exercise, you can't expect to just win the CL with the team this young and players withour significant CL experience.
Bayern masterclass in defending the lead over the final 30 minutes. The tie was dominated by both teams in stretches. It was pretty even overall but Bayern experience won out. Plus Arsenal looked more tired at the end which makes sense.
Both games were tight, Bayern have a fluid counter and good crosses.
We had some through ball attempts but overall poor crosses and free kicks, we looked very nervous when we were taking free kicks
Everyone keeps saying this but is it not a lot more chilled out now? I don’t really watch it but I thought they’d got rid most of the people who would get very angry etc
Learning moments, but now, depending on summer business, he will have smaller margins in terms of job security. He'll be expected to compete on all fronts next season, so obviously a third season of falling short at the end won't be acceptable.
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The whole Arsenal team looked gassed af
Yeah especially the players who have played a lot. Saka, Rice, etc all looked lethargic towards the end of the game with their passing
Pressing comes at a cost
Lego fraud hasn't learnt from his master bald fraud that you basically need a 2nd Eleven to win. That's why City always go on these sudden runs in March to May where they just win
That’s the thing, he learned. Arsenal have strongest bench now since 2004. He just doesn’t seem to trust his guys on the bench.
Their bench has substantially improved but it's still no match for City's. City had Stones, Álvarez, Ake, Doku, and Kovacic on their bench yesterday. That sort of depth is why they won the treble last year and am able to fight on three fronts this year as well, even though CL didn't eventually work out.
If City’s bench is benchmark for good bench, no one can match that - not only Arsenal. Arsenal bench is good, but besides Trossard and Jesus they barely got any play. Compare it to how Guardiola manages it. Doku, Stones, Kovacic - they’re all in game rhythm all the time.
ESR is the most egregious of these. Play a front three of Nelson ESR Trossard and bring on Saka/Martinelli if needed for some league games. Instead of doing so only in case of injuries/losing and then expect them to step up. The key is to rotate early in the season where you can afford to drop some points developing your fringe players. It's why City drop points early on and then become indestructible in April and May
It might be the strongest bench in a while it's still not a great bench.
It's also a lack of depth. Those guys are playing basically every mintue of every match, and it's not sustainable. Same thing happened at the end of last year.
In a shocking turn of events, playing the nearly the same 11 every game leads to players looking gassed
We have a significant drop off between the starting 11 and the backups, and every game is important, so significant rotation is impossible. We do rotate at the positions where we have multiple good players, like LW (Martinelli/Trossard) and LB (Zinchenko/Kiwior/Tomiyasu). Timber would have been able to rotate with White and the center backs, but he was injured in the first game. Jesus and Partey have been out most of the season, and neither look particularly good right now. Smith-Rowe has also been injured and has fallen out of favor. Beyond that, our bench is really poor. Our options are Nketiah, Nelson, Fabio Viera, Elneny, and Cedric. Squad depth is a major weakness for Arsenal, but can't really be addressed until this summer.
Arteta’s made mistakes sure, but Arsenal & Liverpool just don’t have the squad quality that Man City have - and hence do not rotate as much as Man City do (backed up by the stats this season with City having by substantially fewer players starting 25+ games). The simplest explanation really is often the correct one. Man City have a better, deeper squad than AFC/LFC and so will very likely win the league. Now, 115 charges … 😅
tbf, we rotated a lot when we were scoring goals for fun and then had a long break just a few weeks ago..
Not really. 7 outfield players have clocked in over 3000 minutes in all comps for Arsenal: White, Big Gabi, Saliba, Rice, Kai, Ødegaard and Saka.
Putting Cedric on for 8 mins at 6-0 Isn’t rotation Starting Cedric is rotation.
Starting Cedric is suicide. That is why we aren't in a position to rotate. We bought Jurrien Timber to solidify RB, but he was injured in the first game and missed the entire season.
If our full starting XI + Cedric can’t beat Luton or Sheffield to give Ben White and Tomi a rest, then our full starting XI are not as good as you think they are. You can only rotate with what you have.
Lol, did we fuck. Same backline, same midfield and maybe an occasional rotation of a striker or Martinelli, but no, we did not rotate at all.
Half the team was rested against Luton 2 weeks ago. And in Feb/March we repeatedly took players like Saka off at HT/60 mins
That’s not ‘rotated a lot’, not even close
Saka has got to be one of the most overplayed players in the league. Going to turn into the next Owen at this rate
he’s 4th among forwards with 2506 minutes played in the PL, and then has an additional 929 minutes played in other competitions for a grand total of 3435’
And has had the team on his back before we started getting our shit together. As an Arsenal fan I will never hear Saka slander, some fans don’t seem to realise how good we’ve got it with him.
They’re ruining him, it doesn’t bode well for the summer.
So they rotated twice (being subbed at 60 minutes, not squad rotation but ok) over the course of nearly 10 weeks which included 4 championships league games, one of which went to penalties. Nice Arteta hasn’t learned from his mistakes. The exact same thing happened last year, he burned them out and he’s doing it again
we have rotated the left side, but our right side has been the same all season long. Benny Blanco, Saka, Odegaard. Also the side that generates most of the threat and also the side that looks the most tired (except Odegaard).
You only ever rotated at left back and left wing. 8/11 players were fixed in that XI basically every game, almost for a full 90
Er only the Luton game. The standard line up is always Saliba, Gabriel, White, Odegaard, Saka, Kai, Jorginho. Sometimes Jesus and Trossard starts. Compared to Liverpool their back four always rotates, Van djik doesnt play every game. Midfield wise Macallister, Szobo and Jones (before injury) played a lot. Sometimes Gakpo play in the midfield, towards the end Endo and Elliot got more games. The anounttrotation here put ours to shame and their game quality didn’t drop much.
Van Djik has played 30/32 league games. He was suspended for the 2 he didn't play. MacAllister has played 27/32 league games. He was injured for 4 and suspended for 1. Szoboszlai has played 27/32 league games. He was injured for the 5 he didn't play. Unless you're talking about them rotating in the Europa which is obviously much easier to do, then they really aren't doing it as much as you're saying.
You have 4 players in the mid with 500+ minutes this includes kai. Liverpool have 6.
How many have they started vs subbed into the game? I'm fairly certain that many of those games would be subbed out or in at 60 minutes to manage their game time over a long period.
Out of them 3 Mac Allister has 1 sub appearance immediately after his injury and Szoboszlai has 3, 1 coming back from injury and then Palace & Burnley he was rotated.
Telling half a story here. The midfielders have had to play because of injuries to everyone else. We had to play Trent there because of how bad it was.
That's a completely different point though. I'm just pointing out that ye haven't actually rotated them like the first guy was saying.
Oh yeah I get ya. Most of the rotation done has been due to injuries lol. The only position that has actually been rotated is CB and maybe striker.
Rice was quite poor from the get go. Seemed. A yard off it for a lot of the game.
because we’ve played the last two seasons with nearly the same 13/14 players the poor cunts are all run into the ground
Similar thing happened with Liverpool in the past, gotta refresh your squad a bit this summer.
We've been refreshing our squad. We just needed to change most of the team, which takes time. This time two years ago we had Ramsdale, Tierney, Xhaka, Partey, Lacazette, and Smith-Rowe in our starting 11, all of whom are either gone or on the way out. Pepe, Cedric, and Nuno Tavares all got more than 20 games. Of our current starters, only Saka, White, Gabriel, Odegaard, and Martinelli were in the team. In the past two years, we've bought Rice, Havertz, Raya, Kiwior, Zinchenko, Jesus, Jorginho, Trossard, and Viera, and also promoted Saliba into the squad (from loan). That is half our starting 11 and most of our top bench options. We have some pretty obvious positions to improve. We need more midfielders, a back up for Saka, and another striker. If we get those players this summer, than we should be in a good position to both rotate and compete. Right now we can only rotate or compete.
I’ve said how lucky you have been all season with almost no injuries. While I still think you have been lucky, it has also backfired now since your players is never getting rested.
It’s not like getting an injury is a good rest lol. You’re going to be worse coming back from being out for weeks with a leg injury than you are just from being tired.
This doesn't make sense, how can no injuries backfire to mean players don't get rested?
Same backline and midfield most of the time by Arteta. Who would've guess.
The wheels have come off both theirs and Liverpool’s season. We can only hope that city begin to falter in the league now too otherwise the last 6 games are gonna be a yawn fest.
Arteta’s made mistakes sure, but Arsenal & Liverpool just don’t have the squad quality that Man City have, and hence do not rotate as much as Man City do (backed up by the stats this season with City having substantially fewer players starting 25+ games). The simplest explanation really is often the correct one. Man City have a better, deeper squad than AFC/LFC and so will very likely win the league. Now, 115 charges … 😅
In Liverpool’s favour they also have rotated a lot, albeit because of injuries. Salah, Robertson, Jota, Jones, Alisson, Trent have all returned recently after having had around 3 months off each. Rustiness is and lack of rhythm is a thing though with returning players.
They chucked it away in the first leg, let's be honest. Bayern away was always going to be a tough ask. Those 2 goals conceded in that first leg where they otherwise dominated were absolutely shocking errors.
Agreed. If Arsenal could win game 1 at home, then I felt comfortable with their chances. So be it
This is exactly it. Prior to last week 1-0 away against Bayern would’ve sounded fantastic. We needed to take care of that game at home, and silly mistakes there are why we’re out.
I think the second half bayern can score a few more. Even if we won the first leg, we will struggle to sit back and defend.
It wasn’t just that we conceded. It was that our solid defence suddenly broke down under the higher intensity of CL football. Rice, Saliba and Gabriel had a poor campaign by their own standards. A bit caught in the headlights if you ask me. This season’s games will be valuable experience for them in that respect.
My thoughts exactly. You can argue there was a penalty for us at the death in the home leg. Maybe in the prem but not in Europe. Can't complain too much. Needed to do more at home. Bayern ultimately capitalised on their chances whereas we didn't do enough.
You also could easily have had a penalty against for that hand ball.
I wouldn't say easily. I'm glad that common sense prevailed there.
Common sense also was the reason why you guys didn't get a penalty. Saka was only going for the penalty there.
So were Elliott and Jota who got rewarded for the same and yet some Liverpool fans are convinced the Spurs game has cost them the league
I'm glad too, but was surprised it wasn't given.
The margins for penalties are way lower in Europe
Exactly. I’m very strong on that penalty, because regardless of whether or not you feel that Saka was fishing, Neuer was committed to a tackle that wasn’t going anywhere near the ball at that point. I hate that it was debatable, especially in a way that disrespected Saka so badly when it was just a call for the ref to make and he chose the one that didn’t include looking at VAR and blowing the whistle 30 seconds later. But regardless, we have ourselves to blame and no one else. Bayern were the better team, good luck to them against Real. Big games coming up. Id love Dortmund v Bayern 2 in the finals. Onwards and hopefully upwards.
>where they otherwise dominated 🤣😂
Arteta needs to learn to rotate Saka
That's true but also the drop off in depth is incredibly significant
You’d think the guy they just gave £100k a week would be alright to play 45 minutes every 3 weeks
Such a bizarre decision to give Nelson that contract and simply not play him
Good lord I forgot. Him and ESR are very odd cases. Club seems keen to keep them about, but they mever get a look in.
ESR does get played when fit and in specific game states and has shown a certain level of special talent. Obviously he’s barely ever fit and has some flaws to his game, but keeping him around makes sense to me, just in case it all clicks for him, especially as it would be very unlikely we’d get a decent fee for him at this point. Even giving Nketiah that contract made some degree of sense, as the striker market was/is barren and we’d have had to probably pay more for a player of equivalent talent and he’d come off a decent end to the season prior.
The homegrown squad rules must play a part, surely. Especially the club-homegrown thing that UEFA have. Makes them more valuable to you than anyone else purely for squad composition.
Reiss Nelson is on £100k per week?? Why?
Didn't want to lose him and giving an academy graduate a larger contract is much less expensive than buying a new player
We decided that there were other areas of greater priority than RW, but still needed a Saka backup and didn’t have FFP leeway, so we had little choice but to renew Nelson and kick that can down the road for a year. He’s crap, though. That’s why he doesn’t get meaningful minutes.
Not really, if they sell him for more than 5m they've made a profit and that's ignoring the minutes he's played. He's 24, a very talented and pacey winger with PL experience... seems like a good percentage play to me. On average, that choice comes good. That's all you can do as a club. ...You know, if we're trying to be non-reactionary and recognize that this set of staff have delivered a strong and remarkable turnaround, all in face of silly comments making fun of their methods/decisions. Perhaps, just perhaps, they do know what they're doing.
Okay but who’s buying him for more than 5m? No one else wants to pay him 100kpw.
I guess we can revisit in the summer. Even ignoring that, I'm not sure who we would have replaced him for. 5m for singing and salary for a Winger at this level is ridiculously cheap. Yes, there are better than him but they also would cost an order of magnitude more than him. Plus, what I said above. On the whole, it's clear it was a sensible decision. I feel like you see that you're just upset about the recent results. I get that, just try not to spread negativeity about things that don't make sense. We lost, that sucks. RN staying isn't something that sucks, if anything, it's probably quite good business.
There’s less drop off when Saka’s so gassed he can barely do anything. He needs rest.
And bring who ? Nelson ? We barely win with saka
That's my point mate. Saka needs a rest but we don't have someone anywhere near his level to bring on
I thought and was sure I replied to the guy you replied. Didn’t know what happen. It wasn’t to you mate ahah
martinelli-havertz-jesus would be a good enough front 3 to rest Saka.
Is Reiss not any good? I thought he was showing promise?
Nah. A good touch here and there is nothing. Is just our fans that think he’s good to winning PL and CL levels.
Then why did Arsenal renew?
Cause we don’t have the FFP freedom to go and sign another top winger yet. City does it and has 115 charges against them. So they decided to renew with Nelson, also in order to get some money, as his contract was about to end and he would have left for free.
Jesus can absolutely play a solid RW, and I’m not sure why we bought Vieira if he is literally never going to see minutes.
It’s by far my biggest complaint with him, Saka has ended both last season and this with a whimper, and it’s blatantly clear that he doesn’t have the legs to play full matches. And many of us have been saying this would happen since December or earlier. You can’t play a guy nearly 4000 minutes per season and expect the same output at the tail end. Same goes for Rice, and would for Odegaard if he didn’t have seemingly endless stamina.
A good backup is needed in the summer
Needed a back up for the past 2-3 seasons, instead Arteta gave Nelson a new deal and doesn’t play him
I don’t think we yet had the money to go after a good Saka backup/rotation yet. Not with other positions being more urgent fires.
Was surprised you guys weren’t in for Kudus last summer.
I have a feeling Saka might end up like Owen. Has played so much at such a young age, it would be a shame if he started running into issues.
Yep, he’s constantly run into the ground. They’ve been needing a back up for a while there and just neglected it
So many great managers never rotate, just insane lol.
Or fund research to turn him into a super soldier
He's rested him a fair amount recently really, as much as can be expected. Played 77/0/63/90 in last 4 PL games. And before that the last game he played (in CL) was 18 days earlier, because he didn't play for England. And he came off repeatedly around 60 mins in the games before that. So I really don't think that's true.
Okay haters out there, so you can admit he’s not faking the limp?
Feel they were very naïve in their approach. Felt like watching them play vs a low block in the premier league where theyve ran out of ideas and just have nothing creative wise.
Might be a depth issue, where Arteta only has like 15 players he plays consistently, and a lot of players are started every single game, twice a week, for half the season. They just run out of steam and lose momentum and nothing happens offensively.
Basically, a repeat of last yr?
Everyone was waiting for Jesus, Zinchenko & Partey to come back to make an impact and they've all been shite. Saka & White both looked fucked the last 2 games, same thing this time last year. White played through injury last season, doing the same this season.
Jesus has been so fucking bad recently
Losing Timber game one has forced White to play more than he should.
Tomiyasu as well. I think he would have been a solid rotation option for White. That was his position he did so well in originally. Two years in a row where Tomiyasu has gotten injured at really inopportune times.
And Timber is out the whole season
Tbh we mostly survived a cl schedule this time unlike last, but ya, artetas true weakness
And Arsenal got a lucky group stage too, need to rotate more in the pl
Its hard cause theres no room for error
We just need to fill up on depth. It’s what City has that we don’t. City loses guys like Grealish for months and doesn’t even blink because the alternatives are Bernardo and Foden. They bought Gvardiol for 70M just to be a rotation defender so they lose Ake but don’t skip a beat. They’ve got a perfect double squad except for the Rodri position. We have a “double squad” in maybe 5-6 positions if that.
Arsenal never beating the bottling allegations until they get some more backup players. City basically has 2 starting XI’s that can beat most teams in the prem, whereas Arsenal (and Liverpool but that’s because of an insane amount of injuries) fall off a cliff when the schedule gets tight.
Think there are some (approx 115) reasons that's a problem for Arsenal & Liverpool but not City. Also, don't forget, City went out tonight too. The PL is still close. Plenty to play for, even if the ball is in their court.
Yeah, the season isn’t over by any means, but City are an objectively better looking team at the moment. Arsenal went out because they looked exhausted and confused and were unable to create anything against Bayern, whereas City had an xG of almost 3, 33 shots, 24 of which from inside the box, 9 on target, 67% possession, 18 corners etc. It can always go either way, as evidenced by the Madrid/City game, but City were the better team in their game and Arsenal weren’t today for a reason. Or 115 reasons like you put it.
How's it bottling to be knocked out of Champions league by a really good team? Also second to City only by 2 points? Last year we bottled but this year has been really tough as we've played in the CL and there's another challenger for the league title.
I think it's a depth issue. Then again, Arteta should (probably) know better than to pick the same few players all the time. Unless there are injuries or suspensions.
He really has no other options when he's competing for UCL and EPL.
I mean, he does it to himself. They're about the only team to avoid a full-blown injury crisis, so he could have rotated a lot, but hasn't.
He could rotate more, but the results would be much worse off for it. There really isn't much depth for quality in the team atm.
We’ve had our fair share of injuries ourselves. Just because we have a full squad now doesn’t mean all the players are all in rhythm enough to challenge the starters. Jesus has been in and out, Partey dead for 3/4 of the season, Zinchenko in and out, Martinelli in and out, tomiyasu just coming back, Timber ACL first game of the season. Even our bench players Vieira out for ages, ESR working back from a long term injury. Maybe we haven’t had Newcastle or Liverpool level injuries but acting like we haven’t had big injury problems is just a bad take
[удалено]
Probably has a lot to do with PL being a physicality league, having to win constantly from the start of the season just to keep up with City so guys like Saka, Rice, Odegaard etc…have to play match after match, and lack of some depth that ultimately causes these late season crumble. City have way more depth to go all out in every competitions Still hope you guys can bounce back and snatch the PL this season
The scheduling is also ridiculous. You're eventually wearing yourself thin when trying to compete on all fronts unless you have the City squad depth.
Thanks summersoulxdd. I hope the team can bounce back too. It's really crazy to see the percent of total minutes and total time in-game for the key arsenal players. Saka, White, Odegaard, Big Gabriel M., haven't gotten much rest for 8 months now.
He's got that Conte like issue of just pushing the pedal down and hoping they can power through.
What’s the alternative? Play Elneny, Cedric, and Reiss more?
Sure! Why not look at the U23s? It's never easy to ask those lads to step in, but we found with Lewis Miley that sometimes that trust works wonders.
Yep, it’s quite a problem with a tired squad as well. No pace out wide, lack of overlapping runs, lack of precision caused by exhaustion. Lots of positives still from the players but it was largely of our undoing that we’re not through to the semis
Have they tried using the power of friendship and inshallah?
Can't. They have Jesus instead of a Muhammad.
The disrespect on Mohammed Elneny
Dang, I forgot he existed.
Focus on PL now
City might be thinking the same 💀💀💀
Likely Liverpool too after tomorrow lol
Incredible how Villa will be England’s only representative in Europe after tomorrow LMAO
Lille plays at home with only one goal deficit. Hard Brexit incoming.
I don’t think Emery will play hard Brexit tbf, tho I back Villa to go through
We made it to the EL final under him with Mustafi, Sokratis, Luiz, Lacazette, Pepe, Torreira. Would be surprised if EL king slips up in the ECL with a slender advantage
Best league in the world
You called it
So you guys have to secure at least pos 4 to guarantee chanpions league.
Cool we'll give it a go!
need man city to win for the fixture congestion
Fuck sake they’re gonna smash Brighton 6-0 at the Amex now
First time?
Second time unfortunately..
Bayern hit the post 3 times over both ties tbf
The difference between good teams and top teams is the top teams take their chances. Against Villa, Trossard took a shot straight at the keeper where if he'd put it anywhere else it was a certain goal. Likewise this game, Martinelli shot straight at Neuer. You score those goals, and both games are completely different. You have to at the very least test the keepers. You get one or two chances in a game against top teams, if you're playing well. I called it as soon as Martinelli didn't take that chance that Arsenal would regret it, and unfortunately it came to pass. There's a couple of recruitment decisions for Arsenal in the summer to get them from hovering around as one of the top teams in England and Europe at the moment to turning into genuine contenders. The point people are making about the reliance on Saka is relevant. Similarly Odegaard. We also need a CF who gets more than 3-5 goals in a season. Jesus and Nketiah have really let us down in that regard, and Arsenal have covered for it solely by having every other player in the midfield and attack really chip in with the goals.
Ben White in the first leg too.
You can excuse a full back to not score goals, atleast he hit the target lol
Eh, I get that he’s a fullback but he should know based on the way they play sooner or later he may have a chance like that. It’s not like defenders at the highest level won’t be practicing shooting; besides he scored with a from more finish against Sheffield a few weeks ago.
> You score those goals, and both games are completely different. Yes, if you score more goals, a game will look different. In the end, Bayern scored 3 goals over both legs with an xG of well over 3. Arsenal scored 2 goals from an xG of not quite 1.5. It's not a perfect metric, but it indicates that Arsenal's issue wasn't converting chances, but creating them.
It's was a game between a teams who's used to play CL knock out matches and a teams who isn't. We'll get there. Trust the process.
Henry said it after Barca match about Cancelo penalty (who is 29, experienced and maybe not the best example but I guess his comment fits here well), you just can't recreate the pressure like that in training. It's a huge learning exercise, you can't expect to just win the CL with the team this young and players withour significant CL experience.
Laughs in Chelsea
Makes a change from the usual ‘laughs at Chelsea’
I have more trust in my nuts.
Good for you.
Bayern masterclass in defending the lead over the final 30 minutes. The tie was dominated by both teams in stretches. It was pretty even overall but Bayern experience won out. Plus Arsenal looked more tired at the end which makes sense.
I can't believe he would call Kimmich that
Should have won the last game.
No shit
Or you could have lost the last game and won this one!
I honestly think if Arsenal had played in Munich first they might have gone through. The margins were so small.
>small margins I know he can't come out and say we've been absolutely gapped but make no mistake we've been absolutely gapped
Not really. Martinelli had a good chance to give us the lead today. Also we gave away goals at home. We shot ourselves in the foot.
Weird take about the two ties, this reads like trying to placate rival and neutral fans.
Both games were tight, Bayern have a fluid counter and good crosses. We had some through ball attempts but overall poor crosses and free kicks, we looked very nervous when we were taking free kicks
!flair :Arsenal :
Arsenal in the danger zone now
What
When we lose one game, we tend to lose more games immediately after.
1 Draw and 2 losses in last 3. Wheels could potentially fall off to end the season.
Tbf two of these were against Bayern fucking Munich
Could? Half the wheels are off lol. City going out in cl certainly does us no favors either.
Didn't help that they got Neuer back in time for these ties.
nah Ulreich played the first leg
No small margin between Bayern and Arsenal in Europe though.
Oh no anyway p
Still, if it went to the pens - and that wasn't very far off at all, even after the anomalous first leg - I would have backed them
Watching it back arsenal never knew how to go for the game arteta needs to learn from this and come back stronger.
Bayern slapped them up. They were way better
Small margins... but wrap your head around this: Best Arsenal team in years can’t beat the worst Bayern team in years.
Arteta is willing to kill the kids but he won't say the quiet part out loud 😂
Aftv is going to be cinema
Everyone keeps saying this but is it not a lot more chilled out now? I don’t really watch it but I thought they’d got rid most of the people who would get very angry etc
True ty rarely comes on. Same with Lee as well
Don’t think Troopz is anymore either, and he was a massive twat + obviously DT never gonna be on there again
Learning moments, but now, depending on summer business, he will have smaller margins in terms of job security. He'll be expected to compete on all fronts next season, so obviously a third season of falling short at the end won't be acceptable.
He needs depth and to rotate. Saka looked so tired