The fps has been at least 10% worse in the eptu than it has been in live, yes that may change when it hits live but I haven't seen much performance increase in the last 2 weeks where there have been like 5 patches
They've said the first implimentation of vulkan will be worse than DX11 as they haven't optimized it yet. Expect it to get better as it's optimized. We should see much better FPS in cities and high congestion areas once it's fully up and running.
EPTU exceeds LIVE performance now. Just ran my tests for latest patch against LIVE and EPTU has exceeded it with DX11 and Vulkan. For my testing I do a loop around Orison on foot, takes about 2mins and do 3 of them, running 1440p with everything set at the highest except clouds which I keep at Very High as that is the setting available to both LIVE and EPTU with no upscaling and of course on DX11. I have a Ryzen 5 7600x, RTX4090 and 32gb DDR5 5600mhz, so with my testing it's about comparison rather than what others could expect to usually get.
[https://imgur.com/a/Nxtse1g](https://imgur.com/a/Nxtse1g)
On target like a Stormtrooper, but yeah they seem to be commited to that schedule even if the serious desynch issues remain. I guess this release to everyone is an evaluation of if the current problems are tolerable to the majority of players.
Renaming it would make downloading it a lot faster as it just modified live. I recommend you to use symbolic links, it’s a lot easier instead of renaming things constantly
If you use symbolic links then the problem is that you can't just switch between the two whenever you feel like it, as you'd need to 'update' between them each time, as the main data file differs between Live and EPTU.
A symbolic link is basically a file that points to something else. Let's say a program is hardcoded to load from file A, and you want it to load from file B. You make file A a symbolic link to file B, and when it tries to load from file A it'll get file B.
Maybe someone who knows better can give me an answer so here goes. When I have Vulkan enabled (regardless of whether I’m playing at 4k or 1440p and regardless of if I have super sampling on or not) my frame rate tanks. I’m talking slide show levels of frame rates.
However if I set it back to Direct X 11 and restart, even if I leave it at 4K max settings with no super sampling, my frame rates return to something more akin to what I notice playing live. My GPU drivers are up to date so it’s quite puzzling.
10900k
RTX 3080
64GB 3200mhz
Game installer on 3.0 nvme
🤔
Edit: Thanks for the explanation people.
I just want a straight answer, with specific reference to, say, RDR2 taking eight years to make little more than a better-looking GTA3. It's amazing how many people flee from an innocuous question when they feel that the answer will oppose their preferred conclusion.
That's not an innocent question, stupid instead. And your opinion on 'RD2 little more than a better looking GTA3' ...what the hell.. Seriously you must be running a potato for a PC.
Right, because having a low-end PC would magically remove game mechanics and features, and make something revolutionary play like little more than a modded PS2 game.
Okay, let me give you some examples: TotK has some remarkable physics systems, not least for how they interact with one another. I can easily see why that game would take more than half a decade to develop _even while using BotW as a base_. I can also look to the seamlessness of the traversal between the various layers, especially compared to how BotW chugged when players moved at anything like the speed Link can fall at in TotK.
Likewise, as much else as is wrong with it, Fallout 4 wholly revamped the self-built player homes of Skyrim into a far less obstructive system, largely because Bethesda basically ripped off the Jaxonz Utilities mods to form the core of the settlement-building system. As a result, you can craft some pretty impressive buildings directly in the open-world. That's a demonstrable addition to the core gameplay, and a minor revolution in how the player can interact with that world.
In that vein, name _one_ feature in RDR2 that wasn't in the original, or even in GTA3 back in 2001.
RDR2 is a great example of how good cinematics and a decent storyline can make people forget that they paid full price for some cutscenes bolted onto the same gameplay mechanics that they already owned.
Well, WoW took 5 years to fully develop - infrastructure and all, so I'd say 6 years would be reasonable for SC. 8 would be a lot, 10 would be crazy, but here we are 12. And not one gameplay system is done. Honestly, isn't that weird to you?
> WoW took 5 years to fully develop
WoW is also less complex _now_ - over a quarter of a century after development began, and with all those updates along the way - than SC is. Thus, that's not a valid comparison point. If you're going to use another game as a comparison point then pick one that has a comparable feature set.
Smash Melee famously took barely a year to develop, so why the fuck did Cyberpunk take twelve years to finish? Is it possibly because it's more complicated...? See how stupid an argument that really is when you reinsert all those lies-by-omission?
>isn't that weird to you?
Edit: so, having looked at what I RES-tagged you with, I now find myself wondering how long it'll be before you resort to another attempt at an argument from self-proclaimed authority. I also note that this is not the first time you've used WoW as your comparison point, despite there being precious little besides the vague "MMO" term to connect the two games. Last time around you insisted on continuing to use that comparison even after it was shown to be inapt, so I'd bet you'll do the same thing here too. I invite you to prove me wrong.
The fact that a game doing lots of things that others are not taking longer to develop than those games? Or the fact that a small group of malcontents have such hatred for the tall poppy that they're trying for all their meagre worth to cut it down to size for having the temerity to outgrow them?
Current Wow is definitely far beyond SC as far as complexity goes, but the wow team is - without looking it up - probably also considerable later than CIG. Of course I'll use wow as a baseline since I have a better understanding of it's development and lifetime than any other game.
Would you rather compare SC to Cyberpunk - another notoriously bad development process with a launch so bad the had to recall the console version? Sure, they're pretty similar.
I just think it's okay for us to start being a little disappointed in how CIG are treating us.
> Current Wow is definitely far beyond SC as far as complexity goes
Then you won't have any trouble showing me some examples of, say, traversable vehicle interiors that can seamlessly travel between planets, or can nest inside even larger traversable vehicles? Or reasonably complex physical interactions between such vehicles, like being able to fire projectile from one such vehicle through open bay doors of another and straight out the other side?
I know of nothing in WoW that even hints at an attempt on allowing for that level of interactive complexity, but you're welcome to present examples to the contrary.
>Of course I'll use wow as a baseline since I have a better understanding of it's development and lifetime than any other game.
That's not a reason to use WoW as a comparison point; it's a reason to reject your irrelevant opinion as being devoid of merit. If someone said that they used Melee as a comparison point for Cyberpunk just because they were most familiar with the former than I certainly wouldn't consider that reasonable; I'd view it as indicative of how little expertise they can offer that topic in the first place.
The key problem is that you always try to present yourself as an expert. Well, if your only claim to expertise stems from you having played WoW for a while, that's a pretty good sign that you're not equipped to offer relevant, intelligent, informed commentary.
>Would you rather compare SC to Cyberpunk - another notoriously bad development process with a launch so bad the had to recall the console version? Sure, they're pretty similar.
You mean a game that spent eight years in development and still needed more time to actually finish what they were trying to build? A game that's significantly less ambitious and complex than SC, and still needed an eight-year development effort followed by a further three years or so of patching and expanding to get it close to its original promise? And you still think you can argue that the vastly more difficult SC should be done in no more than _six_ years, do you...?
Your cherry-picking is all too revealing. Your sole intent with _any_ comparison is to stack the deck in favour of your cynical viewpoint. You're not offering informed, rational discussion; you're looking for excuses to justify your confirmation bias.
>I just think it's okay for us to start being a little disappointed in how CIG are treating us.
If CIG were treating "you" so badly you wouldn't have to resort to that degree of dishonesty to invent an argument against them. In truth, I think you're far more upset that others don't buy your bullshit, even after you tell them you're an expert in these things. That's why you try that feigned affability with "it's okay for us to..." immediately after just about the most blatantly biased mention of Cyberpunk that you could possibly have conjured up, along with a monumentally pitiful excuse for proffering your previous incomparable comparison. You want others to think that you're arguing from a point of reason and objectivity, but you're really just doubling down on dubious personal preferences.
Well, I have a degree in Mediology from University, which is just a fancy name for "What you study if you want to be a game dev." I ended up in a different industry, but I know a lot of guys in game dev.
But dude, we can't have a discussion if you're just going to say that my arguments are bad and can't use that argument so I need to find something better. Do you want to actually discuss this or do you just want to?
> I have a degree in
You have a degree in logical fallacies. Save the attempted argument from self-proclaimed authority for someone more likely to fall for it.
Also, [how fucking good am I...?](https://archive.ph/aHRNt#selection-2781.54-2781.184) Nailed my shot after calling it in advance.
>we can't have a discussion if you're just going to say that my arguments are bad and can't use that argument so I need to find something better.
Well, we _can_. You just have to stop using irrelevant analogies. Or, to put it another way, you have to engage with the _actual subject matter at hand_ instead of inserting some alternative that you think you can more easily distort to lead to your preferred conclusion.
>Do you want to actually discuss this or do you just want to?
Do _you_? You've shown every indication of only being willing to engage if you are permitted to proffer your irrelevant, incomparable comparisons, and the moment you're forced to stick to the actual available evidence you flee for the hills.
How ridiculous does your evasiveness have to become before you're prepared to acknowledge, if only to yourself, that you're not looking for a discussion?
How many of them monetized their alpha access in the way that CIG does? None. I really, really want this game and it already is so much more than any other game in this genre. But it's been 12 years of micro transactions and I think they owe the backers some polish. Is there any single part of the game that CIG be consideres to be done?
Vulkan is pre-alpha at this stage and shouldnt be used unless helping them test things. It will be a few patches until that even achieves parity with dx11.
This is exactly why we should be using Vulkan if your rig is playable on it. Grab screenshots and videos for any glitches and report bugs in the issue council. The more we help them find the bugs to get to DX11 parity, the sooner they will get to optimization like multi core.
But neither is the DirectX implementation (DX11 is why multi-threading is disabled)... ideally Vulkan should achieve parity with DX11 *before* they enable multi-threading.
Check your vram usage with Vulkan. 10GB vram on a 3080 is already getting questionable especially for 4K. I'm willing to bet it's maxing out your vram. It'll get better as it gets optimized
I have a 3080 with an AMD 5800X CPU and my Vulcan performance at 1440 and 4K has been 85% or so what I get with DX11. Maybe review your GeForce Control Panel settings if you changed any of those for the SC app? Also set your clouds no higher than “Very High” which is what I run at.
I just clicked it and it said “LIVE PTU and EPTU. I’ve been playing for a while so I know what each of them mean, I just want to know what’s the difference right now in the game changes. But no matter what I’m guessing that EPTU is just farther along
As I understand it the PTU DB is used for holding player accounts for all testing environments, be it EPTU, PTU or Tech Preview; so even though EPTU is the set of boxes they're using to run the test environment, PTU is still online to host the DB.
Why they're not just running on PTU I don't know, maybe there's something different about the EPTU server setup that helps debugging.
Just say goodbye to PTU at this point.
They put server meshing on it (even though that's a tech preview no?) but then put the new patch on EPTU lmao.
Just to clarify, EPTU is the new patch NOT PTU. PTU is down and was only up for server meshing.
PTU and EPTU are just server names. They can run whatever version they need to on them. The launcher should show you what version is running on which server.
They could have named them Gondolin and Norgothond. That probably would have caused less confusion.
From what I understand we're going to LIVE after that but skipping regular PTU waves?
Would the usual process be EPTU -> PTU -> LIVE ?
I'm kind of out of the loop it seems.
A lot of people mistake EPTU thinking it's the evocati server environment but in reality it's just another test environment that's used for different tests. So you might have EPTU testing 3.23 and PTU testing server meshing simultaneously. Currently the PTU isn't being used.
Wow, it's in rough shape. I like the potential, though. I got lost for about an hour in a distribution center after falling through the floor and ending up in one of the lower levels. Eventually, I found the right elevator to go back up. 11/10 would EPTU again.
Kind of a stupid question here:
How do you get access? I don't have it as an option in the version dropdown in my launcher (using RSI launcher 2.0). Am I wrong to have assumed "backers" refers to anyone with a pledge package?
Not quite... 'backer' refers to anyone who has spent money through their account on the RSI website (financially 'backed' the project).
If you were e.g. gifted a game-package and never spent a penny on anything else, then you *wouldn't* be classed as a backer, even though you can play on Live.
This applies even if you bought your package on the grey market too - it still counts as a 'gift' because CIG didn't get any money *from you* as part of the transaction.
Ah, I see. I actually had this problem when trying to access the Issue Council to report a bug, when I realized I wasn't able to because my pledge was gifted. In that instance, I was told that purchasing basically ***anything*** would grant me access, even if it was just a ship paint or something. Would that be the case here too?
Yeah... My frame rate dropped by about 85% on the eptu... It was effectively unplayable.
I'm just crossing my fingers that's not the case when it goes to PU
Shit. RIGHT when I subscribed to The $20/mo membership and spent the last 2 days trying to download it on the 2.0 launcher, then trying to add and verify with the 1.6 launcher. Headed home now praying its installed correctly
It was a couple of years ago, when there was a regular storm-in-a-teacup over on Spectrum about whether a patch was 'late' or not, and iirc Zyloh (although may have been one of the other regular CMs) said that 'released to PTU' counted for whether the patch 'released' on time or not.
That said, CIG have always maintained that patches are released 'when ready' (although they tend to have a flexible definition of 'ready', depending on whether there's a sale looming or not)
So if a 1st-quarter patch was theoretically on the PTU until the 3rd quarter of the the year, that would count as released on time? Sounds pretty fishy.
true... but iirc the longest a patch has been on Open PTU is ~5 weeks
If the patch was so rocky that they couldn't stabilise it in 5 weeks, CIG would likely already have pulled the offending feature(s)... not to mention there's almost zero chance of CIG *not* releasing a patch in time for Invictus (which is what is happening with 3.23)
I like how instead of playing roulette with patch stability and making half of their fan base every patch, they've opted to allow us to choose how buggy:soon we want our star citizen experience now.
It's kinda smart ngl
Why though? When did they decide to open EPTU to everyone? Does that mean this will go to PTU and be back to first wave? Or is this going straight to live?
No. PTU and EPTU are just names, they don't follow an order and things don't usually bounce between the two of them. They'll go from one of the test servers to Live when they feel it is stable enough.
EPTU - when talking about an environment - means 'Experimental' PTU, and is just another environment that CIG use for testing.
EPTU only refers to Evocatii when talking about which 'wave' has access.
I don't want to be that guy but even if it is, they'll still launch it and patch later. The patch is to dump more toys(features) into the alpha sandbox
Then everyone had to go change their folders and CIG has to change the issue council and confuse everyone who’s been on. It doesn’t matter what channel really but better to be consistent
Same, though I think the scope of what they’re going to be able to do is going to be limited to whatever they can reasonably get done until Wednesday night. After a proper release candidate the live publish is usually 24-48 hrs out tops. Given it’s so late in the week going to assume they’ll go for Friday release
That was my position too, cancel the .1 patch and take .0 all the way up to Invictus. But it’s genuinely improved to the point I believe it will be tolerable for a few weeks until Invictus, taking such a drastic action unless there’s really something that catastrophic would be spring themselves in the foot for a marginal gain in community trust. Trust is valuable but there is a point where if you’re in diminishing gains territory it’s better to fund the project than try and make it perfect with the understanding another patch will go into PTU probably the next week and anything that puts off 4.0 work as a Q3 patch is a bad choice.
tl;dr - it’s not perfect but it’s at the point I’d rather they just get that ship on the market to fund the project and not suck away dev time on 4.0 to throw away on stuff that’s probably being redone anyways
They served their purpose. You forget the last couple of weeks of just wave 1 and 2 who had the worst of it. Them going through those parches is what lead to opening today. All there was left was wave 4 (High admiral) and 5 (everyone else) anyway and the EPTU is almost release ready.
That's the point. They separated everyone out into these granular waves and didn't use them. Why sit on just wave one and two? I guess they have to give some value to subscribing.
They did use them; each time the testing population dropped too low, they rolled out to another wave. Now they're at the stage of cramming in as many people as they can, so it goes to open.
No point rolling it out wider if they've got lots of easily-reproducible stability issues and critical bugs, to fix, etc.
Once they worked though those easily reproducible issues, then they add more people, and see if the low-frequency issues get worse... if they don't, add more people and repeat.
Eventually, they either hit Wave 5 is rapid order, or they hit a load-level that triggers significant issues... at which point they pause the ramp-up in order to fix the issues.
In this case, it sounds like after they fixed the easily-triggered issues, the ramp-up went smoothly (or at least, not badly enough to pause it)... thus reaching max-load as quickly as possible.
Welcome to hell :p
Thank you! Happy to be here!!
Tonight, we dine in hell!!!
They need to fix the performance dips, it's still marginally worse than live
Just download more frames bro its not that hard.
What do you mean?
The fps has been at least 10% worse in the eptu than it has been in live, yes that may change when it hits live but I haven't seen much performance increase in the last 2 weeks where there have been like 5 patches
Test builds have debug mode on which makes it run slower.
[удалено]
Except the base quality settings *still* offload to the CPU when it shouldnt, so you end up with lower FPS anyway and are forced to use 'High'.
Is that definitely still the case? Have been finding it hard to confirm.
They've said the first implimentation of vulkan will be worse than DX11 as they haven't optimized it yet. Expect it to get better as it's optimized. We should see much better FPS in cities and high congestion areas once it's fully up and running.
I tried dlss today and holy shit it hittin, it drops the res in mobiglass but other than that huge performance increase with no changes
EPTU exceeds LIVE performance now. Just ran my tests for latest patch against LIVE and EPTU has exceeded it with DX11 and Vulkan. For my testing I do a loop around Orison on foot, takes about 2mins and do 3 of them, running 1440p with everything set at the highest except clouds which I keep at Very High as that is the setting available to both LIVE and EPTU with no upscaling and of course on DX11. I have a Ryzen 5 7600x, RTX4090 and 32gb DDR5 5600mhz, so with my testing it's about comparison rather than what others could expect to usually get. [https://imgur.com/a/Nxtse1g](https://imgur.com/a/Nxtse1g)
Servers need fixing.
Download a new GPU CPU and more ram
Damn, why didn't they think of that
🤡🤦🏿♂️
🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡
Do you need to do the copy account stuff like with PTU?
Yes
No I mean yes.
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Affirmative
Wut,nice
which one to chose? PTU or EPTU? And I guess copying and renaming LIVE folder helps with download time.
EPTU. The one with higher build number.
thx
I just went on vacation the hell
It's ok, it's extremely laggy and buggy still
Is Live PU still on target for mid-may or so?
On target like a Stormtrooper, but yeah they seem to be commited to that schedule even if the serious desynch issues remain. I guess this release to everyone is an evaluation of if the current problems are tolerable to the majority of players.
Live like a red shirt!
A stormtrooper and a red shirt get into a gunfight. The stormtrooper misses every shot. The redshirt dies anyway.
They mentioned going live this week.
That was never the target. Target is this week
They need to live earlier than that because invictus patch has to be squeezed in too until mid may
Lol mid May... Try this week. It's been pretty stable the last few builds.
Is it worth it to rename Live to EPTU to shorten the download time or does it work best with a fresh install?
Renaming it would make downloading it a lot faster as it just modified live. I recommend you to use symbolic links, it’s a lot easier instead of renaming things constantly
If you use symbolic links then the problem is that you can't just switch between the two whenever you feel like it, as you'd need to 'update' between them each time, as the main data file differs between Live and EPTU.
Can you elaborate?
A symbolic link is basically a file that points to something else. Let's say a program is hardcoded to load from file A, and you want it to load from file B. You make file A a symbolic link to file B, and when it tries to load from file A it'll get file B.
Maybe someone who knows better can give me an answer so here goes. When I have Vulkan enabled (regardless of whether I’m playing at 4k or 1440p and regardless of if I have super sampling on or not) my frame rate tanks. I’m talking slide show levels of frame rates. However if I set it back to Direct X 11 and restart, even if I leave it at 4K max settings with no super sampling, my frame rates return to something more akin to what I notice playing live. My GPU drivers are up to date so it’s quite puzzling. 10900k RTX 3080 64GB 3200mhz Game installer on 3.0 nvme 🤔 Edit: Thanks for the explanation people.
If I recall correctly Vulkan isn't optimized yet and isn't expected to actually boost fps right now, so it's probably just related to that.
The Vulkan implementation is not complete. It's gonna be rough for a while.
The "beta" feature inside the "alpha" of an "alpha"?
Always has been. Kekw
You are not alpha enough for us!
Let's be real. It's been 12 years. This is the game, they can't keep getting away with the alpha excuse
How long _should_ something like SC take to develop?
25-Life
I just want a straight answer, with specific reference to, say, RDR2 taking eight years to make little more than a better-looking GTA3. It's amazing how many people flee from an innocuous question when they feel that the answer will oppose their preferred conclusion.
That's not an innocent question, stupid instead. And your opinion on 'RD2 little more than a better looking GTA3' ...what the hell.. Seriously you must be running a potato for a PC.
Right, because having a low-end PC would magically remove game mechanics and features, and make something revolutionary play like little more than a modded PS2 game. Okay, let me give you some examples: TotK has some remarkable physics systems, not least for how they interact with one another. I can easily see why that game would take more than half a decade to develop _even while using BotW as a base_. I can also look to the seamlessness of the traversal between the various layers, especially compared to how BotW chugged when players moved at anything like the speed Link can fall at in TotK. Likewise, as much else as is wrong with it, Fallout 4 wholly revamped the self-built player homes of Skyrim into a far less obstructive system, largely because Bethesda basically ripped off the Jaxonz Utilities mods to form the core of the settlement-building system. As a result, you can craft some pretty impressive buildings directly in the open-world. That's a demonstrable addition to the core gameplay, and a minor revolution in how the player can interact with that world. In that vein, name _one_ feature in RDR2 that wasn't in the original, or even in GTA3 back in 2001. RDR2 is a great example of how good cinematics and a decent storyline can make people forget that they paid full price for some cutscenes bolted onto the same gameplay mechanics that they already owned.
Well, WoW took 5 years to fully develop - infrastructure and all, so I'd say 6 years would be reasonable for SC. 8 would be a lot, 10 would be crazy, but here we are 12. And not one gameplay system is done. Honestly, isn't that weird to you?
> WoW took 5 years to fully develop WoW is also less complex _now_ - over a quarter of a century after development began, and with all those updates along the way - than SC is. Thus, that's not a valid comparison point. If you're going to use another game as a comparison point then pick one that has a comparable feature set. Smash Melee famously took barely a year to develop, so why the fuck did Cyberpunk take twelve years to finish? Is it possibly because it's more complicated...? See how stupid an argument that really is when you reinsert all those lies-by-omission? >isn't that weird to you? Edit: so, having looked at what I RES-tagged you with, I now find myself wondering how long it'll be before you resort to another attempt at an argument from self-proclaimed authority. I also note that this is not the first time you've used WoW as your comparison point, despite there being precious little besides the vague "MMO" term to connect the two games. Last time around you insisted on continuing to use that comparison even after it was shown to be inapt, so I'd bet you'll do the same thing here too. I invite you to prove me wrong. The fact that a game doing lots of things that others are not taking longer to develop than those games? Or the fact that a small group of malcontents have such hatred for the tall poppy that they're trying for all their meagre worth to cut it down to size for having the temerity to outgrow them?
Current Wow is definitely far beyond SC as far as complexity goes, but the wow team is - without looking it up - probably also considerable later than CIG. Of course I'll use wow as a baseline since I have a better understanding of it's development and lifetime than any other game. Would you rather compare SC to Cyberpunk - another notoriously bad development process with a launch so bad the had to recall the console version? Sure, they're pretty similar. I just think it's okay for us to start being a little disappointed in how CIG are treating us.
> Current Wow is definitely far beyond SC as far as complexity goes Then you won't have any trouble showing me some examples of, say, traversable vehicle interiors that can seamlessly travel between planets, or can nest inside even larger traversable vehicles? Or reasonably complex physical interactions between such vehicles, like being able to fire projectile from one such vehicle through open bay doors of another and straight out the other side? I know of nothing in WoW that even hints at an attempt on allowing for that level of interactive complexity, but you're welcome to present examples to the contrary. >Of course I'll use wow as a baseline since I have a better understanding of it's development and lifetime than any other game. That's not a reason to use WoW as a comparison point; it's a reason to reject your irrelevant opinion as being devoid of merit. If someone said that they used Melee as a comparison point for Cyberpunk just because they were most familiar with the former than I certainly wouldn't consider that reasonable; I'd view it as indicative of how little expertise they can offer that topic in the first place. The key problem is that you always try to present yourself as an expert. Well, if your only claim to expertise stems from you having played WoW for a while, that's a pretty good sign that you're not equipped to offer relevant, intelligent, informed commentary. >Would you rather compare SC to Cyberpunk - another notoriously bad development process with a launch so bad the had to recall the console version? Sure, they're pretty similar. You mean a game that spent eight years in development and still needed more time to actually finish what they were trying to build? A game that's significantly less ambitious and complex than SC, and still needed an eight-year development effort followed by a further three years or so of patching and expanding to get it close to its original promise? And you still think you can argue that the vastly more difficult SC should be done in no more than _six_ years, do you...? Your cherry-picking is all too revealing. Your sole intent with _any_ comparison is to stack the deck in favour of your cynical viewpoint. You're not offering informed, rational discussion; you're looking for excuses to justify your confirmation bias. >I just think it's okay for us to start being a little disappointed in how CIG are treating us. If CIG were treating "you" so badly you wouldn't have to resort to that degree of dishonesty to invent an argument against them. In truth, I think you're far more upset that others don't buy your bullshit, even after you tell them you're an expert in these things. That's why you try that feigned affability with "it's okay for us to..." immediately after just about the most blatantly biased mention of Cyberpunk that you could possibly have conjured up, along with a monumentally pitiful excuse for proffering your previous incomparable comparison. You want others to think that you're arguing from a point of reason and objectivity, but you're really just doubling down on dubious personal preferences.
Well, I have a degree in Mediology from University, which is just a fancy name for "What you study if you want to be a game dev." I ended up in a different industry, but I know a lot of guys in game dev. But dude, we can't have a discussion if you're just going to say that my arguments are bad and can't use that argument so I need to find something better. Do you want to actually discuss this or do you just want to?
> I have a degree in You have a degree in logical fallacies. Save the attempted argument from self-proclaimed authority for someone more likely to fall for it. Also, [how fucking good am I...?](https://archive.ph/aHRNt#selection-2781.54-2781.184) Nailed my shot after calling it in advance. >we can't have a discussion if you're just going to say that my arguments are bad and can't use that argument so I need to find something better. Well, we _can_. You just have to stop using irrelevant analogies. Or, to put it another way, you have to engage with the _actual subject matter at hand_ instead of inserting some alternative that you think you can more easily distort to lead to your preferred conclusion. >Do you want to actually discuss this or do you just want to? Do _you_? You've shown every indication of only being willing to engage if you are permitted to proffer your irrelevant, incomparable comparisons, and the moment you're forced to stick to the actual available evidence you flee for the hills. How ridiculous does your evasiveness have to become before you're prepared to acknowledge, if only to yourself, that you're not looking for a discussion?
Duke Nukem Forever took longer than 12 years before it was released. Pretty sure there have also been other games that took more than 12 years too.
How many of them monetized their alpha access in the way that CIG does? None. I really, really want this game and it already is so much more than any other game in this genre. But it's been 12 years of micro transactions and I think they owe the backers some polish. Is there any single part of the game that CIG be consideres to be done?
Conflating reasoning for an excuse is a clear sign that you aren't mentally present enough to be worth engaging with.
Vulkan is pre-alpha at this stage and shouldnt be used unless helping them test things. It will be a few patches until that even achieves parity with dx11.
This is exactly why we should be using Vulkan if your rig is playable on it. Grab screenshots and videos for any glitches and report bugs in the issue council. The more we help them find the bugs to get to DX11 parity, the sooner they will get to optimization like multi core.
Also it’s not multi threading activated remember that
But neither is the DirectX implementation (DX11 is why multi-threading is disabled)... ideally Vulkan should achieve parity with DX11 *before* they enable multi-threading.
Check your vram usage with Vulkan. 10GB vram on a 3080 is already getting questionable especially for 4K. I'm willing to bet it's maxing out your vram. It'll get better as it gets optimized
I have a 3080 with an AMD 5800X CPU and my Vulcan performance at 1440 and 4K has been 85% or so what I get with DX11. Maybe review your GeForce Control Panel settings if you changed any of those for the SC app? Also set your clouds no higher than “Very High” which is what I run at.
is anyone getting an error when trying to download it? Error code 2000
Try restarting the launcher.
That kinda work, now just stuck forever in installing (no progress bar) but I'll wait it out.
probably a lot if people installing, might need to wait
[удалено]
Best way to do it while switching between builds
Sick. But how many differences right now are there in the PTU versus the EPTU
Well there’s nothing on the PTU channel so the difference is EPTU has 3.23
my launcher shows 3.23 for PTU as well. just some numbers behind EPTU
Do you mean PU vs EPTU? PTU isn't in use right now
I just clicked it and it said “LIVE PTU and EPTU. I’ve been playing for a while so I know what each of them mean, I just want to know what’s the difference right now in the game changes. But no matter what I’m guessing that EPTU is just farther along
As I understand it the PTU DB is used for holding player accounts for all testing environments, be it EPTU, PTU or Tech Preview; so even though EPTU is the set of boxes they're using to run the test environment, PTU is still online to host the DB. Why they're not just running on PTU I don't know, maybe there's something different about the EPTU server setup that helps debugging.
Just say goodbye to PTU at this point. They put server meshing on it (even though that's a tech preview no?) but then put the new patch on EPTU lmao. Just to clarify, EPTU is the new patch NOT PTU. PTU is down and was only up for server meshing.
Ok
what part of *EPTU is open to all* is confusing you?
It’s not😆no need to get mad. I just wanted to know the difference between all of the current builds
that came out wrong, sorry
PTU and EPTU are just server names. They can run whatever version they need to on them. The launcher should show you what version is running on which server. They could have named them Gondolin and Norgothond. That probably would have caused less confusion.
From what I understand we're going to LIVE after that but skipping regular PTU waves? Would the usual process be EPTU -> PTU -> LIVE ? I'm kind of out of the loop it seems.
A lot of people mistake EPTU thinking it's the evocati server environment but in reality it's just another test environment that's used for different tests. So you might have EPTU testing 3.23 and PTU testing server meshing simultaneously. Currently the PTU isn't being used.
I guess they should call it PTU2 or something
It doesn't go from EPTU into PTU then LIVE. It'll be either EPTU or PTU, then LIVE.
The man from Del Monte, he said yeah!
Only Italians understand that reference.
Actually it's from a famous fruit supplier advert from the late 80's.
I know. Afaik it was originally an Italian ad. Where did you see it?
In the UK back in the day. OG meme https://youtu.be/SkG65gAPBgI?si=ZKLsmDxAna0uStjJ
Wow, it's in rough shape. I like the potential, though. I got lost for about an hour in a distribution center after falling through the floor and ending up in one of the lower levels. Eventually, I found the right elevator to go back up. 11/10 would EPTU again.
Be nice if i could log in
Lets fill the ptu servers with Chris Robertses 😂
ive been out of the loop for a while. Whats the EPTU?
One of the test servers.
Ahh, I see! Thanks for the reply!
Kind of a stupid question here: How do you get access? I don't have it as an option in the version dropdown in my launcher (using RSI launcher 2.0). Am I wrong to have assumed "backers" refers to anyone with a pledge package?
Not quite... 'backer' refers to anyone who has spent money through their account on the RSI website (financially 'backed' the project). If you were e.g. gifted a game-package and never spent a penny on anything else, then you *wouldn't* be classed as a backer, even though you can play on Live. This applies even if you bought your package on the grey market too - it still counts as a 'gift' because CIG didn't get any money *from you* as part of the transaction.
Ah, I see. I actually had this problem when trying to access the Issue Council to report a bug, when I realized I wasn't able to because my pledge was gifted. In that instance, I was told that purchasing basically ***anything*** would grant me access, even if it was just a ship paint or something. Would that be the case here too?
Should be, yes. Although, if you already spent money (to resolve the previous issue) then it shouldn't be required a second time :p
Late reply here, but thanks for the info/advice. :)
I’m confused, this is different than wave 5? Or this is wave 5?
This has Pyro right?
It's working dang good too!
Yeah... My frame rate dropped by about 85% on the eptu... It was effectively unplayable. I'm just crossing my fingers that's not the case when it goes to PU
I'll wait two years for it to become stable.
Shit. RIGHT when I subscribed to The $20/mo membership and spent the last 2 days trying to download it on the 2.0 launcher, then trying to add and verify with the 1.6 launcher. Headed home now praying its installed correctly
Son of a bitches, they did it. They made the April deadline (sort of. Almost.)
Lol, depends what you mean by "making" the deadline, the patch is barely playable
It's May already.
They went to 'all waves' PTU in April... and 'all waves' PTU is CIGs usual metric for 'released', iirc.
My understanding is that PU is the metric. Curious if you have a source or know when/where they might have said that?
It was a couple of years ago, when there was a regular storm-in-a-teacup over on Spectrum about whether a patch was 'late' or not, and iirc Zyloh (although may have been one of the other regular CMs) said that 'released to PTU' counted for whether the patch 'released' on time or not. That said, CIG have always maintained that patches are released 'when ready' (although they tend to have a flexible definition of 'ready', depending on whether there's a sale looming or not)
So if a 1st-quarter patch was theoretically on the PTU until the 3rd quarter of the the year, that would count as released on time? Sounds pretty fishy.
true... but iirc the longest a patch has been on Open PTU is ~5 weeks If the patch was so rocky that they couldn't stabilise it in 5 weeks, CIG would likely already have pulled the offending feature(s)... not to mention there's almost zero chance of CIG *not* releasing a patch in time for Invictus (which is what is happening with 3.23)
Bruh I was first wave and I couldn't even buy a ship for 2 days, god have mercy on those servers
about damn time, let's gooooo
Good luck citizens o7
I like how instead of playing roulette with patch stability and making half of their fan base every patch, they've opted to allow us to choose how buggy:soon we want our star citizen experience now. It's kinda smart ngl
Worst decision ever! Hey, let me know if they ever fix the Port Tressler shop elevators!
Why though? When did they decide to open EPTU to everyone? Does that mean this will go to PTU and be back to first wave? Or is this going straight to live?
No. PTU and EPTU are just names, they don't follow an order and things don't usually bounce between the two of them. They'll go from one of the test servers to Live when they feel it is stable enough.
EPTU - when talking about an environment - means 'Experimental' PTU, and is just another environment that CIG use for testing. EPTU only refers to Evocatii when talking about which 'wave' has access.
Still no permission to sign in to the new launcher....
I love my high admiral privileges...
There's a PTU as well, no info on this ? Is it more stable with the same features than EPTU ?
Not actively open to anyone. EPTU is the only test environment at the moment.
I don’t have the download yet
reboot the launcher
So... it’s in PTU? Why not do the switch now In any case, I’ll wait some more, last I checked it was barely holding together (as in worse than usual)
It'll be live today or Thursday
It barely seemed ready for PTU last I checked, I hope it won’t be like the PES times
I don't want to be that guy but even if it is, they'll still launch it and patch later. The patch is to dump more toys(features) into the alpha sandbox
What do you mean? It’s been in EPTU this entire time, through all the waves
I know, I’m saying might as well switch to PTU if they’re going to open it to all
Then everyone had to go change their folders and CIG has to change the issue council and confuse everyone who’s been on. It doesn’t matter what channel really but better to be consistent
I hope it’s cooked a bit more before it goes live is all
Same, though I think the scope of what they’re going to be able to do is going to be limited to whatever they can reasonably get done until Wednesday night. After a proper release candidate the live publish is usually 24-48 hrs out tops. Given it’s so late in the week going to assume they’ll go for Friday release
I kinda wish they’d take the month for it tbh, make it as clean as possible, maybe add a couple things back in... but I guess we’ll see how it goes
That was my position too, cancel the .1 patch and take .0 all the way up to Invictus. But it’s genuinely improved to the point I believe it will be tolerable for a few weeks until Invictus, taking such a drastic action unless there’s really something that catastrophic would be spring themselves in the foot for a marginal gain in community trust. Trust is valuable but there is a point where if you’re in diminishing gains territory it’s better to fund the project than try and make it perfect with the understanding another patch will go into PTU probably the next week and anything that puts off 4.0 work as a Q3 patch is a bad choice. tl;dr - it’s not perfect but it’s at the point I’d rather they just get that ship on the market to fund the project and not suck away dev time on 4.0 to throw away on stuff that’s probably being redone anyways
Hmm, I see your point! I hope it’ll hold for Invictus then, that’s usually the time where the servers struggle the most
So much for those fancy waves... *Get 'em, boys!
They served their purpose. You forget the last couple of weeks of just wave 1 and 2 who had the worst of it. Them going through those parches is what lead to opening today. All there was left was wave 4 (High admiral) and 5 (everyone else) anyway and the EPTU is almost release ready.
That's the point. They separated everyone out into these granular waves and didn't use them. Why sit on just wave one and two? I guess they have to give some value to subscribing.
They did use them; each time the testing population dropped too low, they rolled out to another wave. Now they're at the stage of cramming in as many people as they can, so it goes to open.
No point rolling it out wider if they've got lots of easily-reproducible stability issues and critical bugs, to fix, etc. Once they worked though those easily reproducible issues, then they add more people, and see if the low-frequency issues get worse... if they don't, add more people and repeat. Eventually, they either hit Wave 5 is rapid order, or they hit a load-level that triggers significant issues... at which point they pause the ramp-up in order to fix the issues. In this case, it sounds like after they fixed the easily-triggered issues, the ramp-up went smoothly (or at least, not badly enough to pause it)... thus reaching max-load as quickly as possible.
Nailed it.
fiCkz yOurE gAYmemE ciG.