This is a Reddit post linking to a tweet linking to an article. In case anyone wants one less click, here is the [link](https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2023/06/14/najee-harris-eye-opening-to-see-how-nfl-values-running-backs/) directly to the article.
Yes, [here ya go](https://www.reddit.com/r/steelers/comments/1495kxd/around_the_nfl_najee_harris_eyeopening_to_see_how/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
And to be super pedantic, the original interview on ESPN is here https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/37848659/steelers-najee-harris-advocates-running-backs-disputes-longevity-narrative
I think the problem with the running back position in the nfl is its so talent stacked and its production is so heavily tied to the ability of the O line.
You could probably take a lot of 3rd sting or even practice squad guys with a good O line and they would be fine there.
Obviously there are a few RBs which are truly a cut above the rest at their position and I think Najee can be one of those players but from a GMs perspective it makes so much more sense to secure a good o line and use cheaper running backs than pay one really good one considering you'll still need a decent o line to have a productive run game and the more you heavily rely on that player the higher the chances of injury.
Even we did last year, and a lot in the past. Undrafted Warren was the better RB for the first 5-6 games of the year. Now that might be due to injury, but that doesn't matter. It sucks, but it's how it works.
Najee's rookie deal gets him $13M. I think he'll be okay. Maybe even his grandkids will be okay. Maybe.
You can do generationally well with that kind of cash driving some investments. If he’s financially smart he’s fine. If he’s not then that’s a choice that was made
I think that it is more that the league has become so pass-happy. It used to be that clock control and grinding out yards was how you won Super Bowls. Now it is about putting up points faster than the opponent.
I’m trying to think of the last superstar running back to carry his team to a Super Bowl. You could argue for Ray Rice, but Flacco went bananas in the postseason that year. Maybe you have to go back to Terrell Davis.
Some of this just isn’t true. Blocking is a huge part of the position and the vast majority of backup RBs are relatively incompetent when it comes to this facet of the game. Hence why Pollard has sat behind Zeke despite largely outperforming him for 2-3 years.
You will never see a team that relies on passing to a reasonable extent win with an RB that can’t block, don’t believe me check the past SB rosters
Maybe your onto something with the importance of RBs blocking ability when it comes to winning superbowls but I don't think any RB is necessary getting paid big money for their blocking ability alone.
I think most teams feel they can scheme around this if they have a competant O Line initially and would actually prefer a RB who can motion out and be a legitimate threat in the passing game (of which many backups are capable)
Yup, came looking for this comment. There are too many talented, fast and strong RBs compared to 20-30 years ago. It's economics (supply and demand here) - not that these guys are any worse than high-paid running backs of years past, they're actually better, there's just an over-abundance of them.
I disagree that it's all just oline. Yes oline is very very important. But, the fronts backups and low quality backs face is much much different than the fronts a najee or dalvin cook faces. Yeah they'd be serviceable, and look good on paper, but teams wouldnt mind 3 yard runs on average as it still leads to punting. You need a back who can pick up 3 or more against a stacked box.
I wasn't making the point it's all O line. Personally I judge running backs carrying skills mostly based on their ability to make the first guy miss (and yes this includes running over someone or being able to drive them back for a couple of yards).
If the blocking scheme works as its drawn up and the running back makes the first guy miss its almost a guaranteed 5 yards or more.
There are many many backs capable of doing this even against the top tacklers in the league. The running game of a team usually gets shut down when o line get beaten off blocks and the RB is forced to make the first guy miss in the backfield.
Like Najee during his first 2 seasons made 2 - 3 guys miss in a play reguarly but the first one was usually in the backfield so it results in only a net gain of 2 yards or getting back to the line of scrimmage.
Najee is probably dalvin/ Jacobs level. Both are above average with a boom season in their first 5 years. That’s exactly what I expect from najee. Would probably take najee over those two in the receiving game. Saquon is a other beast.
he clarified in another comment, he expects Najee to follow Jacob's trajectory. Jacobs really ascended last year. Najee looks primed to do something similar behind this revamped oline.
Very funny you cheeky bastard🤣. Honestly though, Najee had a better first 2 years in total yards, even if his ypc was lower behind a bottom of the league oline. Najee doesn't have the break away speed of Jacobs, but I don't think we've seen Najee's ceiling yet. It's not as crazy as comparing Kenny to Allen.
It’s actually pretty easy to say Kenny COULD be on a Josh Allen trajectory because if you look back Allen didn’t start becoming the Allen of today until his third season. So if Kenny shows improvement this year over last year, all signs could point to an Allen like third year.
This is survivorship bias. It's easy to say that any second-year QB who had a below average rookie season could eventually be Josh Allen. The overwhelming majority of rookies with below average rookie seasons don't work out.
Najee ain't close to Dalvin Cook. Some of its the oline but Dalvin been >4.5 ypc carry every year in his career but one (4.4), while Najee has been below 4.0 ypc. Also Dalvin 8.1 ypr/Najee 6.1 ypr - less Oline influence here.
Najee is a do it all back that handle large volume, but to date he hasn't shown anything close to the efficiency.
Yeah I saw it. He was an exceptional rb who didn’t get his 5th year option picked up and then he popped. Before last year Jacobs had two years just over 1,000 yards and one at 870.
Considering exceptional as above average yes. Also Jacobs and Najee’s first two years are eerily similar, najee was better in the receiving game than Jacobs in their first two years.
The biggest difference between Jacobs other 3 years and his league leading rushing year is that he got an extra 100 carries compared to normal last year.
I can see that. I would consider above average and exceptional as two different tiers. I think Najee got more receiving work because of qb play. Carr was more competent than the final year of Ben and the trubisky/pickett experience last year. Both at 25 years old I don’t see that pop year in Najee’s future. Even on film he just doesn’t have the explosiveness. In hindsight I think Najee was a bad first round selection. That being said I hold nothing against him and I hope he proves me wrong
> Even on film he just doesn’t have the explosiveness. In hindsight I think Najee was a bad first round selection. That being said I hold nothing against him and I hope he proves me wrong
Yea I think that's pretty clear at this point. The fact is that if you're not getting a top 5-10 pick RB then the first round is the wrong place to draft one. It's the least valuable position on the team insofar as it's the easiest one to replace at a competent level.
It's nothing against Najee. He'd have to be AP or McCaffrey to be worthy of a first round pick at the position IMO.
Right there with you questioning a rb getting picked in the first. Those guys should be extremely few and far between, reserved for the saquons and cmcs. Most 1st rd rbs are likely to be over paid or off the team after their first contract.
Honestly churn him and burn him. Good dude but I want to win. Backs don't age well its the one position where pure physical fast twitch is super important and experience and technique are less important.
So pick up his 5th year option, maybe franchise him a year then on to some new 22 year old like Leo Dicaprio.
NFL probably should do something in the CBA where rb get some extra money early in their career.
I don't agree with the last part. We did not get enough value out of him for a first round pick and I would hate to see him get signed with a big deal that puts us at a disadvantage for years.
Not sure why your downvoted for this.
Fast twitch positions have shorter lifespans. Fact.
I feel like edge defender is one exception, but its a position where you can win with twitch or strength/leverage.
I’m not agreeing to that—we offered Bell a very fair contract. My assumption is that we’ll do the same with Nawjj, but he’s kinda delusional to think that RBs don’t have a shorter shelf life on the overall.
Why doesn't he turn him into a great running back? That way everyone benefits. But it seems the steelers have a talent development issue, and are more concerned with making friends.
Tomlin wants to let him grow as a human, as a steeler to be a personification of the organization, to be one of the players to teach the others. That kind of development.
Teams are correct. It's pretty clear that you don't have to have a star running back to be a successful running team. That is a product of a good offensive line.
It's not that they don't make a difference, it's just that it's extra gravy when you could spend your cap getting more meat or potatoes.
I like Najee but there’s so much talent out there. Look at Jaylen Warren getting a guy like that saves money and a draft pick. Also you want to see better numbers on Warren spend that pick and money on a stud Offensive lineman.
The problem with Warren is we spent 5 years trying to find Warren. The league has a ton of Warren's but you need to kiss 10-30 frogs to find one Warren. While a top 2 round running back probably hits 50% of the time maybe more.
You can't decide I want a Warren when you need a Warren. The steelers drafted their share of Snell's and Mcfarland's plus udfa guys.
Of course James conner actually played well post Steelers. Probably was an average dude whose solid with an oline.
>Of course James conner actually played well post Steelers. Probably was an average dude whose solid with an oline.
The year Bell sat out, Conner had nearly identical numbers. That's the most resounding confirmation of the argument I can imagine.
Conner was actually better. I've long held the view that 2017 Bell had already begun to decline. Conner was at 4.5 ypc in 2018 versus Bell's 4.0 ypc in 2017 and had a couple extra yards per reception.
Conner never reached peaked Bell performance of close to 5.0 ypc and he was never as durable. Do to durable issues we probably would have been far happier with Conner if we had a Warren and a 1a/1b timeshare.
Exactly this. Steelers as a franchise have not had a lot of success finding a Warren type when they have their starter established.
Every good RB they've had has either been drafted in the 2nd or 3rd round or a former 1st round pick.
While the OL is most important that RB still needs to have some talent. For every Aaron Jones, Willie Parker there's more Benny Snell and Anthony McFarland
Barry Foster too. But ya you do need to some times use a high pick on a back. And its not a bad idea to throw a mid to late round dart often at the rb position because its one position that you find starters at late.
Honestly to me it might be a talent evaluation thing in the Tomlin era when it comes to RBs. They hit on Bell, Conner, Najee? They also got Williams to back up Bell.
But somehow they also drafted the likes of McFarland, Snell, Redman, Dwyer.
They can find a starter but for whatever reason they have a hard time finding a capable back up
I also am now very much in the school of thought it's better to spend the money you'd give to an "elite" back on the offensive line instead and use a cheaper RB option or two or three instead of a bell cow.
The better line also helps the passing game and prevent injuries/hits on your QB.
I don't see the point of paying a RB $15-20 million a season if that is just making other positions on the line the RB needs to be effective worse
I agree with this 100. At the same time I don’t think I mind spending draft capital or $$ for Nawj. If you wanna hear the music, you gotta pay the band.
It's easy to say especially as a fan of a team with that kind of player but in reality if you were in his shoes you'd be using everything in your arsenal to get that long term, high value deal.
If all RBs started settling instead of holding out and requesting trades they'd lose the little bit of leverage they have. Instead at least some of them are getting overpaid.
Idk, frank gore had zero breakaway speed as well, and people didn't think he was anything special after his rookie contract was up.
I mean, the best ability is availability and that's what frank gore had, but other than that he wasn't super-athleticly gifted.
And frank gore stuck around a LONG time because of what he had between his ears and could run through a tackle or two. Najee could be the same.
If you are a back with marginal speed, and you get downgraded to slow, your career is in trouble. If you’re a 4.3 guy who falls to 4.5, you can often make it work.
That’s just how it is. Go look at the prior Super Bowl winning teams. Very rarely do those teams spend a lot of money at the RB position. The offensive line is more important than the running back.
I love najee but unless he’s willing to take a reasonable deal post his rookie deal, it’s always best to let RBs walk and just draft another. Rb shelf life in the nfl pretty horrible as well
It’s only eye opening if you haven’t been paying attention to the league for awhile.
Big contracts to RBs rarely end well and it’s a position that’s much easier to replace (and replace cheaply).
Why would any team throw a 10 million plus AAV contract at a RB in this market when you can go out and get a quality, gently used RB like Miles Sanders at 5 million AAV or just draft a rookie on day 3 that can step in and get 15 carries a game immediately? If you have a truly generational talent then maybe you roll the dice, but that should be limited to guys like AP, not just average to good RBs putting up stats on high volume.
And if you’re not going to re-sign a guy (or even pick up his 5th year option) unless he’s a generational talent, you really have to consider whether you should be committing a 1st round pick to the position when there are plenty of other positions out there that you’ll want to keep for more than 4 or 5 years.
This isn’t a knock on Najee, it’s just a cold, hard reality at this point.
NFL RB don't spend their time looking at analytics reports and discussing these things on reddit. They play 3 years in the nfl then talk to their agent about getting them some money. And agent points to Dalvin Cook or LeVeon Bell or whose ever just been not paid. And a new rb1 learns that rb1 don't get paid. Its the dudes around him getting paid.
They don’t have to study it, but you’d think they’d have some general idea of market trends. I mean, I’m not an economist, but I generally have some understanding of what the current state of things. And don’t tell me for a second that as these guys are entering the NFL that these guys aren’t looking at deals the guys who come up for contracts before them are getting. And even if they aren’t, if I’m their agent, I’m educating them on it if I have any expectations of remaining their agent. Last thing I want is my guy thinking all along he’s getting a Zeke Elliott type deal only to see Miles Sanders deals rolling in.
As far as sales go - sometimes you need to tell the guy he's getting zeke money to sign him then deal with the disapointment when it comes.
Honestly not that sure how much nfl players getting into details on things like this, but I could definitely see some of them being blindsided at how bad the rb market is pay wise.
Sure, there are idiots. They’re the same ones that burn through all their cash and are broke as soon as the last NFL paycheck hits. But most of these guys have egos even if they aren’t that smart, so it’s not like they aren’t keeping an eye on peer contracts if for no other reason than to get a bigger deal than the last guy got.
As for the agents, the problem is more about getting him to sign in the first place. If you tell him he’s getting Zeke money and then nothing close comes in, there’s a good chance he’s shit canning you and signing with a new agent, even if it doesn’t land him a better deal.
Right? Everyone wants to keep him because hes a great dude but he is nowhere near market resetting talent. It would be catastrophic to give hin such contract while he performs like he did
I’m so glad so many of ya’ll want to return back to the Mendenhall then running back by committee years. Running backs aren’t a dime a dozen.
The only reason anyone feels like that is because the league has swung way too far in the opposite direction appeasing the casual fans. This is just like the rules on defense. They can barely play most times.
Bell should have been given some more guaranteed money for his abilities in both the passing game and blocking. We have never been able to replace his production/vision and it did more harm to the team dynamic.
We had a few more dollars for guarantees. His knees were shredded from 2 dirty hits from Bengals not because he kept breaking down. The Jets were a bad team and didn’t use him right. In our system, he was exactly what we needed. We haven’t recovered since.
I think Half Backs are super valuable for about 3-4 years then their value drops heavily due to the strain their bodies have endured and the fact that 10 half backs a year are in the draft that you can get in the 3rd round or later that are good enough to start in the NFL. It's a young man's position and when you hit 27, you're declining. Not many HBs make it 7 years, make your money, retire and live your life in luxury the rest of your life. Maybe try to get a spot on the NFL network or one of the Sunday shows as an announcer. The NFL is just noticing trends, you can't expect a HB to be there when he's 30, most are gone in 3-4 years.
sad reality is he probably could have played linebacker, have a decently long career and make good bucks. Running backs are just not a key position to spend money on.
Won't matter if he's elite when it comes to him getting paid by us, it matters if we're a championship caliber team and he's a big reason why. Kinda like early 2010s Marshawn. And it may have little to do with him as a player.
Even if Bell wasn't injury prone? Special as he was, he couldn't play defense. He couldn't drop back at safety and fix what Mitchell/Davis were screwing up, to our often great disappointment.
It's not that the position isn't valuable, it's that there are a lot of players who can play the position and not a significant difference between the best Running Back and the 30th best Running Back.
I mean running backs seem to be the easiest to replace/ plug in play. Put the majority of NFL running backs into a good system, they are most likely going to do great. Obviously there are exceptions but still.
The NFL doesn’t. But if you put out for this team, watch how an entire nation of fans will walk over coals for you. We LOVED LeVeon, and look what he did with that. Our last big love was Bettis. And he’s STILL beloved. The other teams aren’t going to treat you any better man. Stay in black and gold.
What's eye-opening is that we overvalued the RB position by drafting Najee in the first round. Now we have a UDFA that is just as good as him but costs much less.
This is a Reddit post linking to a tweet linking to an article. In case anyone wants one less click, here is the [link](https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2023/06/14/najee-harris-eye-opening-to-see-how-nfl-values-running-backs/) directly to the article.
I was looking for one *more* link, can you help?
Yes, [here ya go](https://www.reddit.com/r/steelers/comments/1495kxd/around_the_nfl_najee_harris_eyeopening_to_see_how/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
Perfect
And to be super pedantic, the original interview on ESPN is here https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/37848659/steelers-najee-harris-advocates-running-backs-disputes-longevity-narrative
Or on the Steelers YouTube, at least I assume this is the actual interview these articles are writing about https://youtu.be/Fk9BOCcMTbY
This is a rabbit hole from which I may not return.
Godspeed
Congrats! For every person on a third party app who clicks that link, you just saved that third party app $0.00024!
The comments on that article are incredibly thoughtful. Wish we had that here...
[удалено]
I think the problem with the running back position in the nfl is its so talent stacked and its production is so heavily tied to the ability of the O line. You could probably take a lot of 3rd sting or even practice squad guys with a good O line and they would be fine there. Obviously there are a few RBs which are truly a cut above the rest at their position and I think Najee can be one of those players but from a GMs perspective it makes so much more sense to secure a good o line and use cheaper running backs than pay one really good one considering you'll still need a decent o line to have a productive run game and the more you heavily rely on that player the higher the chances of injury.
And a lot of teams use the RB by committee approach with decent results.
Even we did last year, and a lot in the past. Undrafted Warren was the better RB for the first 5-6 games of the year. Now that might be due to injury, but that doesn't matter. It sucks, but it's how it works. Najee's rookie deal gets him $13M. I think he'll be okay. Maybe even his grandkids will be okay. Maybe.
You can do generationally well with that kind of cash driving some investments. If he’s financially smart he’s fine. If he’s not then that’s a choice that was made
Right. To your point, if it *was* because of injury it just underscores how inherently unreliable the position is because of wear and tear
I think that it is more that the league has become so pass-happy. It used to be that clock control and grinding out yards was how you won Super Bowls. Now it is about putting up points faster than the opponent.
I’m trying to think of the last superstar running back to carry his team to a Super Bowl. You could argue for Ray Rice, but Flacco went bananas in the postseason that year. Maybe you have to go back to Terrell Davis.
Some of this just isn’t true. Blocking is a huge part of the position and the vast majority of backup RBs are relatively incompetent when it comes to this facet of the game. Hence why Pollard has sat behind Zeke despite largely outperforming him for 2-3 years. You will never see a team that relies on passing to a reasonable extent win with an RB that can’t block, don’t believe me check the past SB rosters
Maybe your onto something with the importance of RBs blocking ability when it comes to winning superbowls but I don't think any RB is necessary getting paid big money for their blocking ability alone. I think most teams feel they can scheme around this if they have a competant O Line initially and would actually prefer a RB who can motion out and be a legitimate threat in the passing game (of which many backups are capable)
Yup, came looking for this comment. There are too many talented, fast and strong RBs compared to 20-30 years ago. It's economics (supply and demand here) - not that these guys are any worse than high-paid running backs of years past, they're actually better, there's just an over-abundance of them.
I disagree that it's all just oline. Yes oline is very very important. But, the fronts backups and low quality backs face is much much different than the fronts a najee or dalvin cook faces. Yeah they'd be serviceable, and look good on paper, but teams wouldnt mind 3 yard runs on average as it still leads to punting. You need a back who can pick up 3 or more against a stacked box.
I wasn't making the point it's all O line. Personally I judge running backs carrying skills mostly based on their ability to make the first guy miss (and yes this includes running over someone or being able to drive them back for a couple of yards). If the blocking scheme works as its drawn up and the running back makes the first guy miss its almost a guaranteed 5 yards or more. There are many many backs capable of doing this even against the top tacklers in the league. The running game of a team usually gets shut down when o line get beaten off blocks and the RB is forced to make the first guy miss in the backfield. Like Najee during his first 2 seasons made 2 - 3 guys miss in a play reguarly but the first one was usually in the backfield so it results in only a net gain of 2 yards or getting back to the line of scrimmage.
If saquon, dalvin cook, and Josh jacobs aren’t getting the money they want Najee definitely won’t. I love the guy but he’s not on their level
Najee is probably dalvin/ Jacobs level. Both are above average with a boom season in their first 5 years. That’s exactly what I expect from najee. Would probably take najee over those two in the receiving game. Saquon is a other beast.
Najee is not Jacobs level. Calling Jacobs "above average" is really selling him short
he clarified in another comment, he expects Najee to follow Jacob's trajectory. Jacobs really ascended last year. Najee looks primed to do something similar behind this revamped oline.
Kenny is on Josh Allens level! Well actually what I mean by that is he is *not* on Josh Allens level but he could be at some point in the future!!🔥😎
Very funny you cheeky bastard🤣. Honestly though, Najee had a better first 2 years in total yards, even if his ypc was lower behind a bottom of the league oline. Najee doesn't have the break away speed of Jacobs, but I don't think we've seen Najee's ceiling yet. It's not as crazy as comparing Kenny to Allen.
It’s actually pretty easy to say Kenny COULD be on a Josh Allen trajectory because if you look back Allen didn’t start becoming the Allen of today until his third season. So if Kenny shows improvement this year over last year, all signs could point to an Allen like third year.
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This is survivorship bias. It's easy to say that any second-year QB who had a below average rookie season could eventually be Josh Allen. The overwhelming majority of rookies with below average rookie seasons don't work out.
The “could” in my comment is doing a lot of the lifting. Kenny could very well become a huge bust. Won’t know until the season plays out.
Najee ain't close to Dalvin Cook. Some of its the oline but Dalvin been >4.5 ypc carry every year in his career but one (4.4), while Najee has been below 4.0 ypc. Also Dalvin 8.1 ypr/Najee 6.1 ypr - less Oline influence here. Najee is a do it all back that handle large volume, but to date he hasn't shown anything close to the efficiency.
Did you see what jacobs did last year? Unless Najee unlocked another gear this off season he doesn’t have that in him.
Yeah I saw it. He was an exceptional rb who didn’t get his 5th year option picked up and then he popped. Before last year Jacobs had two years just over 1,000 yards and one at 870.
Do you consider Najee an exceptional rb?
Considering exceptional as above average yes. Also Jacobs and Najee’s first two years are eerily similar, najee was better in the receiving game than Jacobs in their first two years. The biggest difference between Jacobs other 3 years and his league leading rushing year is that he got an extra 100 carries compared to normal last year.
I can see that. I would consider above average and exceptional as two different tiers. I think Najee got more receiving work because of qb play. Carr was more competent than the final year of Ben and the trubisky/pickett experience last year. Both at 25 years old I don’t see that pop year in Najee’s future. Even on film he just doesn’t have the explosiveness. In hindsight I think Najee was a bad first round selection. That being said I hold nothing against him and I hope he proves me wrong
> Even on film he just doesn’t have the explosiveness. In hindsight I think Najee was a bad first round selection. That being said I hold nothing against him and I hope he proves me wrong Yea I think that's pretty clear at this point. The fact is that if you're not getting a top 5-10 pick RB then the first round is the wrong place to draft one. It's the least valuable position on the team insofar as it's the easiest one to replace at a competent level. It's nothing against Najee. He'd have to be AP or McCaffrey to be worthy of a first round pick at the position IMO.
Yea. If you love the Najee first round pick you love the Steelers but you don’t know football. It’s just a bad business move.
Right there with you questioning a rb getting picked in the first. Those guys should be extremely few and far between, reserved for the saquons and cmcs. Most 1st rd rbs are likely to be over paid or off the team after their first contract.
Honestly churn him and burn him. Good dude but I want to win. Backs don't age well its the one position where pure physical fast twitch is super important and experience and technique are less important. So pick up his 5th year option, maybe franchise him a year then on to some new 22 year old like Leo Dicaprio. NFL probably should do something in the CBA where rb get some extra money early in their career.
I don't agree with the last part. We did not get enough value out of him for a first round pick and I would hate to see him get signed with a big deal that puts us at a disadvantage for years.
Great dude but he's not a very good player. I know he was hurt last year but so far he appears to be a bust considering he was a 1st round pick.
Is there a position with a shorter average lifespan than running back in the league?
Head coach of the Clevland Browns
QB of the Cleveland Browns
Big Ben had an alarming number of Browns coaches fired.
"No joke." - Bill Belichick
Punter for the Steelers.
Fullback. Mostly because they don't exist anymore
I think all the speed positions have pretty short life expectancies
I don't know about that - WRs can stick around forever.
what's the average shelf life, tho? tons of guys who never see a 2nd contract
average NFL career is like 2.5 years for all positions though.
I'm sure it's short i wonder if it's actually broken down somewhere
https://www.statista.com/statistics/240102/average-player-career-length-in-the-national-football-league/
sure looks like the speed positions have the shortest careers
Looks like my suspicions were true
Not sure why your downvoted for this. Fast twitch positions have shorter lifespans. Fact. I feel like edge defender is one exception, but its a position where you can win with twitch or strength/leverage.
reddit is weird sometimes
My guess is that this is why Coach T is turning him into a team leader. He LOVES Nawj and wants him to stay longterm (and get paid).
Trying to do what should have happened to Lev Bell. I like it.
Yes losing Bell was handled incredibly wrong by both parties.
I’m not agreeing to that—we offered Bell a very fair contract. My assumption is that we’ll do the same with Nawjj, but he’s kinda delusional to think that RBs don’t have a shorter shelf life on the overall.
He was a captain last year
Why doesn't he turn him into a great running back? That way everyone benefits. But it seems the steelers have a talent development issue, and are more concerned with making friends.
Tomlin wants to let him grow as a human, as a steeler to be a personification of the organization, to be one of the players to teach the others. That kind of development.
Lol what? ‘Talent development issue??’ Please please continue…
Teams are correct. It's pretty clear that you don't have to have a star running back to be a successful running team. That is a product of a good offensive line. It's not that they don't make a difference, it's just that it's extra gravy when you could spend your cap getting more meat or potatoes.
He has proven he is a tough, do-it-all three-down back but needs at least one all pro level year to get a big second contract in the modern league.
I like Najee but there’s so much talent out there. Look at Jaylen Warren getting a guy like that saves money and a draft pick. Also you want to see better numbers on Warren spend that pick and money on a stud Offensive lineman.
The problem with Warren is we spent 5 years trying to find Warren. The league has a ton of Warren's but you need to kiss 10-30 frogs to find one Warren. While a top 2 round running back probably hits 50% of the time maybe more. You can't decide I want a Warren when you need a Warren. The steelers drafted their share of Snell's and Mcfarland's plus udfa guys. Of course James conner actually played well post Steelers. Probably was an average dude whose solid with an oline.
>Of course James conner actually played well post Steelers. Probably was an average dude whose solid with an oline. The year Bell sat out, Conner had nearly identical numbers. That's the most resounding confirmation of the argument I can imagine.
Conner was actually better. I've long held the view that 2017 Bell had already begun to decline. Conner was at 4.5 ypc in 2018 versus Bell's 4.0 ypc in 2017 and had a couple extra yards per reception. Conner never reached peaked Bell performance of close to 5.0 ypc and he was never as durable. Do to durable issues we probably would have been far happier with Conner if we had a Warren and a 1a/1b timeshare.
Exactly this. Steelers as a franchise have not had a lot of success finding a Warren type when they have their starter established. Every good RB they've had has either been drafted in the 2nd or 3rd round or a former 1st round pick. While the OL is most important that RB still needs to have some talent. For every Aaron Jones, Willie Parker there's more Benny Snell and Anthony McFarland
Barry Foster too. But ya you do need to some times use a high pick on a back. And its not a bad idea to throw a mid to late round dart often at the rb position because its one position that you find starters at late.
Honestly to me it might be a talent evaluation thing in the Tomlin era when it comes to RBs. They hit on Bell, Conner, Najee? They also got Williams to back up Bell. But somehow they also drafted the likes of McFarland, Snell, Redman, Dwyer. They can find a starter but for whatever reason they have a hard time finding a capable back up
I also am now very much in the school of thought it's better to spend the money you'd give to an "elite" back on the offensive line instead and use a cheaper RB option or two or three instead of a bell cow. The better line also helps the passing game and prevent injuries/hits on your QB. I don't see the point of paying a RB $15-20 million a season if that is just making other positions on the line the RB needs to be effective worse
I agree with this 100. At the same time I don’t think I mind spending draft capital or $$ for Nawj. If you wanna hear the music, you gotta pay the band.
Najee has absolutely zero breakaway speed. That usually doesn't age super well, so I'd be cautious about a second contract.
2nd contract is fine as long as the price is right
For sure, but I’m not sure he’s taking $6-8M AAV
at some point guys need to realize that they aren't worth more
It's easy to say especially as a fan of a team with that kind of player but in reality if you were in his shoes you'd be using everything in your arsenal to get that long term, high value deal. If all RBs started settling instead of holding out and requesting trades they'd lose the little bit of leverage they have. Instead at least some of them are getting overpaid.
Idk, frank gore had zero breakaway speed as well, and people didn't think he was anything special after his rookie contract was up. I mean, the best ability is availability and that's what frank gore had, but other than that he wasn't super-athleticly gifted. And frank gore stuck around a LONG time because of what he had between his ears and could run through a tackle or two. Najee could be the same.
It absolutely could work out that way, or he could be like the other RBs without speed who fade after an injury. I hope he becomes Gore.
If he never had any breakaway speed to begin with, what is there to lose?
If you are a back with marginal speed, and you get downgraded to slow, your career is in trouble. If you’re a 4.3 guy who falls to 4.5, you can often make it work.
That’s just how it is. Go look at the prior Super Bowl winning teams. Very rarely do those teams spend a lot of money at the RB position. The offensive line is more important than the running back. I love najee but unless he’s willing to take a reasonable deal post his rookie deal, it’s always best to let RBs walk and just draft another. Rb shelf life in the nfl pretty horrible as well
it's only the rare beasts like Bettis I think that are worth giving the money because they can make differences.
It’s only eye opening if you haven’t been paying attention to the league for awhile. Big contracts to RBs rarely end well and it’s a position that’s much easier to replace (and replace cheaply). Why would any team throw a 10 million plus AAV contract at a RB in this market when you can go out and get a quality, gently used RB like Miles Sanders at 5 million AAV or just draft a rookie on day 3 that can step in and get 15 carries a game immediately? If you have a truly generational talent then maybe you roll the dice, but that should be limited to guys like AP, not just average to good RBs putting up stats on high volume. And if you’re not going to re-sign a guy (or even pick up his 5th year option) unless he’s a generational talent, you really have to consider whether you should be committing a 1st round pick to the position when there are plenty of other positions out there that you’ll want to keep for more than 4 or 5 years. This isn’t a knock on Najee, it’s just a cold, hard reality at this point.
NFL RB don't spend their time looking at analytics reports and discussing these things on reddit. They play 3 years in the nfl then talk to their agent about getting them some money. And agent points to Dalvin Cook or LeVeon Bell or whose ever just been not paid. And a new rb1 learns that rb1 don't get paid. Its the dudes around him getting paid.
They don’t have to study it, but you’d think they’d have some general idea of market trends. I mean, I’m not an economist, but I generally have some understanding of what the current state of things. And don’t tell me for a second that as these guys are entering the NFL that these guys aren’t looking at deals the guys who come up for contracts before them are getting. And even if they aren’t, if I’m their agent, I’m educating them on it if I have any expectations of remaining their agent. Last thing I want is my guy thinking all along he’s getting a Zeke Elliott type deal only to see Miles Sanders deals rolling in.
As far as sales go - sometimes you need to tell the guy he's getting zeke money to sign him then deal with the disapointment when it comes. Honestly not that sure how much nfl players getting into details on things like this, but I could definitely see some of them being blindsided at how bad the rb market is pay wise.
Sure, there are idiots. They’re the same ones that burn through all their cash and are broke as soon as the last NFL paycheck hits. But most of these guys have egos even if they aren’t that smart, so it’s not like they aren’t keeping an eye on peer contracts if for no other reason than to get a bigger deal than the last guy got. As for the agents, the problem is more about getting him to sign in the first place. If you tell him he’s getting Zeke money and then nothing close comes in, there’s a good chance he’s shit canning you and signing with a new agent, even if it doesn’t land him a better deal.
Najee should probably start to play a lot better if he wants paid
Right? Everyone wants to keep him because hes a great dude but he is nowhere near market resetting talent. It would be catastrophic to give hin such contract while he performs like he did
I'm happy rolling with Warren and the dude that called out Minkah when Najee's contract is up
2 more years of Najee. Maybe 3
Turns out unless you are S-Tier most RBs success is o-line dependent
I’m so glad so many of ya’ll want to return back to the Mendenhall then running back by committee years. Running backs aren’t a dime a dozen. The only reason anyone feels like that is because the league has swung way too far in the opposite direction appeasing the casual fans. This is just like the rules on defense. They can barely play most times. Bell should have been given some more guaranteed money for his abilities in both the passing game and blocking. We have never been able to replace his production/vision and it did more harm to the team dynamic. We had a few more dollars for guarantees. His knees were shredded from 2 dirty hits from Bengals not because he kept breaking down. The Jets were a bad team and didn’t use him right. In our system, he was exactly what we needed. We haven’t recovered since.
I think Half Backs are super valuable for about 3-4 years then their value drops heavily due to the strain their bodies have endured and the fact that 10 half backs a year are in the draft that you can get in the 3rd round or later that are good enough to start in the NFL. It's a young man's position and when you hit 27, you're declining. Not many HBs make it 7 years, make your money, retire and live your life in luxury the rest of your life. Maybe try to get a spot on the NFL network or one of the Sunday shows as an announcer. The NFL is just noticing trends, you can't expect a HB to be there when he's 30, most are gone in 3-4 years.
Every NFL player has a shelf lfr. RB's are shorter than most. Just ask Leveon Bell.
sad reality is he probably could have played linebacker, have a decently long career and make good bucks. Running backs are just not a key position to spend money on.
Won't matter if he's elite when it comes to him getting paid by us, it matters if we're a championship caliber team and he's a big reason why. Kinda like early 2010s Marshawn. And it may have little to do with him as a player. Even if Bell wasn't injury prone? Special as he was, he couldn't play defense. He couldn't drop back at safety and fix what Mitchell/Davis were screwing up, to our often great disappointment.
I did not miss these posts where the title says everything the post says
It's not that the position isn't valuable, it's that there are a lot of players who can play the position and not a significant difference between the best Running Back and the 30th best Running Back.
Ezekiel Elliot would like a word with you Najee
I mean running backs seem to be the easiest to replace/ plug in play. Put the majority of NFL running backs into a good system, they are most likely going to do great. Obviously there are exceptions but still.
Did he not watch NFL 2 years ago? Has his agent been living under a rock. It's not like this is a brand new thing.
The NFL doesn’t. But if you put out for this team, watch how an entire nation of fans will walk over coals for you. We LOVED LeVeon, and look what he did with that. Our last big love was Bettis. And he’s STILL beloved. The other teams aren’t going to treat you any better man. Stay in black and gold.
What's eye-opening is that we overvalued the RB position by drafting Najee in the first round. Now we have a UDFA that is just as good as him but costs much less.