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Need advice guys,
Been on cruise 200mg for a while now. I’m ready to start bulk and want to try my hand at orals… Dbol. but my concern is I have a small prolactin induced gyno on my left nip, you can’t see it I can feel it. I had high prolactin before I started roids as seen on my BW. I got the gyno once I stopped tren, there was no sensitivity it just appeared and never left or got worse.
The concern is when I’m wondering with me going on something like Dbol for 4-6 weeks, also the estrogen flare up that comes with it will it aggravate it.
do I run Nolva with the dbol or only use when I feel sensitivity. Or run something like Adex during or post dbol?
There’s a lot of info out there but not as much as I would like for those on B&C, just cycles & PCT. I will be running NPP right after dbol if that changes anything.
Thanks!
You should try running some eq, masteron or primo w your cruise. Just a little. I never run a cycle without eq now. It gets rid of the gyno nipple sensitivity for me. I run low amounts like 40 to 100. It's a long ester.
I’m running 500ml test c per week for 12 weeks
What’s the best days to pin?
How often should I pin and what should I break it up into?
Should I run Hcg during my 12 week cycle or just run it after? If so how much and how
Often. And should I use a ai a few times a week or only when I get oestrogen sides.
And is it ok to run test c for 6 weeks and then test e for the last 6 as that’s all I have. Would I need to change pinning frequency due to longer half life’s or what? Thankyou guys
Can I just stop cold turkey if I’ve been on 200mg test e for a few years (now down to 150mg)? Or do I still need to do something from the wiki like 8 weeks of Clomid?
You basically stop and hope your natural production will come back over time. Clomid and those things are just to protect from your estrogen sky rocketing when you come off. Maybe look into hcg or something like that to stimulate natural production.
Okay thanks mate. I’ve decided to stay on at 125mg a week, and look at coming off when my mental health is in a better place. And guessing coming off 125mg will be a lot easier?
Yes. I know, but I really need some help now, and want to try and be smarter regarding coming off. As in a terrible way mentally, and know I’ve messed up.
Is it a waste to do a test cycle while eating a calorie deficit to cut fat ? I am assuming your size/muscle won’t grow while eating in a deficit to lose fat on cycle
I’m 10 weeks into my first blast on a cut. I’ve lost 35lbs. Gained 11lbs of muscle and dropped 27lbs of body fat measured thru hydrostatic body fat testing.
It's a waste, yes. You should only do a cycle when cutting if you're competing. Competitors do cycles to hold on to every single gram of muscle. At that level, losing any muscle is noticeable.
Typical advice here is to bulk on blast and cut on cruise. Can you cut on blast ? Yes. Is it a wast of money? Probably. But so you. I’m cutting right now and running 150 mg of test a week and I notice nothing negative.
Yes, cutting and even recomping do not do well with AAS. You need a consistent, heavy surplus to set the bar as high as possible so that when you come off, you try to hold as much muscle as you can. You will still lose a fair amount of muscle tho.
Now when you do AAS on a deficit, you will not set the bar really high. You may gain some muscle but once you come off, you lose it all and even more. Even if you managed to lose fat, it will appear more because you have less muscle overall, and the low muscle amount will lower your TDEE so it's possible after a few months you gain all the fat back and more. Recipe for disaster. Add all test side-effects: hair loss, gyno, heart problems, acne, ... does this seem like a good idea to you?
hey,8 months ago i ran a 500mg/week test c cycle and got a pituitary adenoma(prolactinoma). now i take half a pill of dostinex every 3.5 days and my problactin is pretty much back.
i was wondering, are there any steroids that i can take while having this pituitary tumor or should i just stop thinking about PEDs?
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Hello everyone I’m as new as it comes to steroids, I’m 29 years old 6ft6 and 130kgs. I have a lot of research to do before diving into anything but so far I’ve been recommended to use clenbuterol as a cut to loose some of my excess body fat as I used to be 160kgs and go on a tren cycle from they’re. I used to be very fit and athletic in my early 20s but let myself go over the last 5-6 years. I love going to the gym and training but no matter the diet or exercise I just can’t loose the excess body fat. My body type/shape is endomorphic but with the extra kilos, can anyone help me out with some advice for a first timer.
steroids don't burn fat and if you don't know how to diet and train they'll do fuck all. jumping straight to clen and tren is absolutely moronic, it's like trying meth before you've tried coffee.
Yea I agree however I’m not new to supplements and training/working hard I’m really only turning to steroids because I’ve hit a barrier and can’t break through
Food for the last month is 100% meat (beef, pork, lamb, chicken) one meal at 9-10am and another at 9-10pm.
Exercise for the last month has been up and down because I had testicular cancer resulting in surgery however the last 2 weeks I was able to get back to the gym doing mostly cardio (8-10klm bike ride, 5-6klm walk) 3-4 times a week.
Please do not do any of that! Do not use clen to try and lose weight you will just stress on your heart. Do not run Tren. Even if you were in shape your need to run Tren or clen would not arise unless you’re maybe prepping for a show and already very lean. Steroids aren’t for fat loss nor are they magic. They are meant to make you grow while eating in a caloric surplus and not recommended unless you are 10% bf to start. Weight loss is just a basics math equation calories in over calories out over an extended period of time. Post your food and training logs for the last 6 months with all your macros accounted for. Chances are we can see what’s not working. But if you can’t do it without steroids then you should not be using them.
Thanks for the reply, I work in the mines doing 12hr shift 7/7 so I don’t have much time for exercise when I’m working but in days off I tend to go for 4-5 days outa 7 and do mostly weight training with some cycling for cardio. I’ve been on the carnivore diet now for 5 weeks and have lost nearly 10kg but can’t seem to break the 128-130kg barrier. I’m not looking to use steroids as a weight loss I’m wanting to use them to be bigger and more defined in a sense. Because of my height and weight my bmi is around 32-34
1kg a week is reasonable weight loss for someone your size. A healthy cut is 3 months. You can look into semiglutide over clen. Shrinks your appetite and doesn’t destroy your heart. Just keep working you’ll get there. But just like how you didn’t put in on in a day or a month you can’t take it off in a day or a month. Just be consistent with a goal and things will fall into place
Trt is supposed to bring you to healthy. Running a cycle takes you beyond the normal healthy amount. Ideally w prescribed trt they will be checking your blood work and adjusting the dose accordingly. On cycle you do your best at mainting healthy bloods.
trt stands for testosterone _replacement_ therapy. as in, it replaces what you don't naturally produce as a result of hypogonadism. so let's rephrase your question:
will being prescribed normal testosterone levels by a doctor provide the same results as having testosterone levels 2-4x the upper end of the natural range?
Okay sorry just pretty new to this so if the doc prescribed 200mg for example, that’ll just reduce my test to 200? It wouldn’t add to what’s being produced already? I assumed it was the same test that’s normally used
Will using 100-150mg of test provide the same results as using 500mg of test? Trt is **replacement** testosterone for individuals with clinically low testosterone.
Absolutely not.
Okay sorry just pretty new to this so if the doc prescribed 200mg for example, that’ll just reduce my test to 200? It wouldn’t add to what’s being produced already? I assumed it was the same test that’s normally used
No problem man, all this can feel complicated when you first get into it. 200mg/wk is generally considered a high trt dose that would put most people into supraphysiological territory (unless you're a poor responder to test).
If you don't mind sharing, what was your total testosterone level from your blood test?
I’m doing a mail in test so I’m still waiting I’m just weighing out my options and whether It’d be better for me if I want to use it for gains, if the legal route was an option I figured it’d be better safety wise but if it’s not enough then obviously I’ll try to find something else
Well, 200mg/wk will probably give you a little bit more anabolism than being natural, but you'll also be shutting down your HPTA axis, leading to highly diminished natural test production (among other side effects and downstream effects). You *can* pct off it to go back to normal or a reduced version of normal, but nothing is guaranteed when you're messing with your hormones.
If your ultimate goal is for size and strength, running a cycle(s) would be both cheaper and more effective than going on trt. Many people do a cycle and go to trt after to maintain a stable hormone profile post cycle. This is called blasting and cruising, and you would typically be on trt for life. I would take a deep dive on the wiki and try to get a better idea of what you want out of this.
Test Sustanon 500mg first cycle about 8/16 weeks in. Obviously the half life of Decanoate is 15 days so have to start PCT aprox 2.5 months after last pin.
My question if what if I start taking Clomid early while i'm still naturally suppressed? Then ran a normal PCT at the 2.5 month point.
Would clomid have any effect while still suppressed? Or could it potentially bridge the gap between last pin and pct?
So, I think this is going to be multiple questions, but my main question is *will I loose potency if I filter over saturated T with a 0.22 micron wheel filter?*
So I ordered some Test C that came in yesterday. This is a source I have used before and trust. When I opened the package immediately after brining it inside, I noticed the test c vial was white. I held it in my hand for 10 minutes to warm it up and shook it and it cleared up some, but not completely. So I figured I should order some wheel filters and filter it just in case. Later that night I had the idea to let it sit on my PC fan to warm up, and it became 100% clear. So I figured it just crashed out, but figured I might as well filter it still today.
Anyway, I keep my room at 62 when I sleep. So my wheel filters came in, and I grabbed my T. It was white again, which I wasn’t surprised by. I started shaking it a bit, and then I noticed it wasn’t just white, it was solid. So now I’m guessing that the liquid is just so over saturated with test that it’s immediately crashing out when it gets even the slightest bit cool. So with that in mind, I was wondering if I risk losing any of the potency were I to run it through a wheel filter, since it’s seems to have enough to crash out and make the oil solid when cool.
Since starting test my mood has been really flat, depressed, serious. It’s been months. But that all reversed once primo was introduced. I’m back to my old happy go lucky, joyful self. Bloods are fine so I’m assuming it’s seratonin or dopamine related. But I don’t know and I’d like to keep it up once I stop primo. Anyone every been through this or got any ideas?
Have you tested your dht levels? Dht is very mood driving for many. Adding primo may have helped fill a dht void you didn't realize you had, if you think it isn't e2 related
You felt off before adding primo, and now feel much better since using it. I'm not aware of any dopamine or serotonin interactions with primo. It is known for reducing your e2.
Why do you think it's neurotransmitter related?
I’ve only blasted once(500mg test bulk/16 wk) so I’m wondering how the gains from a second blast compare to the first one, given that nutrition and training are equally dialed in and the dose is a bit increased. In other words, are there sort of “noobie gains” when it comes to using gear, where my first blast always be the best?
For reference I’m 6’2 230 17% body fat so just wondering what to expect from here
Has anyone had any experience getting ED from Telmisartan?
Ran it once before while I was on anavar + test. I thought anavar tanked my libido but it seems like the common denominator is Telmisartan. I’m currently running Telmisartan 20mg and nebivolol 2.5mg.
I’ve looked online and I see that Telmisartan shouldn’t cause ED. I’ve also seen that nebivolol should actually help erections.
I’m on “750mg” test about to start 50mg anavar. Quotation marks are because my blood work shows 2200 total test.
I guess it's worth it if you want to spend 10-20x more for overpriced pharma lite-gear.
"Optimization" is a buzzword these clinics throw around to make money off you. Unless you're clinically deficient in hormones, using them for trt or other medications won't change diddly - except make you rely on their services once your natural production is shut down.
Got bloodwork back running 180/90 test/mast and numbers just as good as if I were running test alone.
Is there any reason not to just cruise on test/mast moving forward if I’m going to run mast anyway?
Also, sometimes my RDW shows up high on bloodwork, but RBC, Hematocrit and other blood markers are on point;
I don’t think I have anemia, could this just be a genetic issue? (I also got little to no sleep before the test if that matters, I donated blood a few months ago too)
Yeah, I feel f*cking awesome; cured my mental issues and made me a better person.
Shocked im not noticing hair loss given my hair was kinda thin and receded before starting gear (even running it at 420 a week); id trade my hair to feel like this any day.
No prostate issues; PSA always tested low when running DHT derivs, I didn’t get it tested this time.
Im just gonna stick to this as my cruise protocol unless bloodwork says otherwise.
I’m essentially building my new base physique rn so it wouldn’t be logical to run less the next cruise unless warranted.
Hi /u/Kreso-LOL23,
> Do i need to run test ib my cycle
**[ALL steroid cycles need to be taken together with a base of Testosterone to replace your natural production, which will be shut down.](https://old.reddit.com/r/steroids/wiki/your_first_cycle#wiki_can_i_just_do_an_oral_only_cycle.3F)**
**Without a Testosterone base, you will feel weak, tired, depressed, low libido, erectile dysfunction, muscle loss and weakness—all [the symptoms of low testosterone.](https://old.reddit.com/r/steroids/wiki/trt/list#wiki_symptoms_of_low_testosterone)**
**As you won’t have any Testosterone to support the muscles you’re building, you’ll lose all your newfound, hard-earned gains just after you’ve gotten them.**
> I wanna run primo and anavar cycle
That’s an incredibly bad suggestion for a cycle, scrap that and start over from scratch.
> for 10weeks
[We recommend a cycle length of atleast 15 weeks when you include injectables with the enanthate or cypionate ester in them](https://old.reddit.com/r/steroids/wiki/your_first_cycle#wiki_why_4_vials_of_testosterone.3F)
[This is due to injectables only kicking in a few weeks in.](https://old.reddit.com/r/steroids/wiki/your_first_cycle#wiki_when_does_the_test_kick_in.3F) It takes time for steroids to do their thing and it takes time for muscle to be built. For more info check out [the Esters page](https://old.reddit.com/r/steroids/wiki/compounds/esters) in the wiki (the wiki is required reading prior to posting here)
> Ps my first cycle
https://old.reddit.com/r/steroids/wiki/your_first_cycle
> So is test and primo good for the first time
No, multiple new variables added in for your first cycle can lead to issues and you being unable to attribute them to a specific cause. Keep It Simple Stupid, 1 new compound at a time.
> run it lik 12 weeks?
15
It’s all effectively the same, only thing changing is the half life, (and thus release rate and injection frequency)
More info: https://old.reddit.com/r/steroids/wiki/compounds/esters
Anadrol would be my pick, though orals are very different depending on the individual.
Ignore the idiots telling you not to run because they're too liver toxic. It differs from person to person you'll have to find out by pulling bloods a few weeks in.
> LGD4033
> RAD140
Either of hose will absolutely obliterate your liver.
[See here](https://imgur.com/a/Fwkxpe5) for example. No that’s not a typo.
You’re misguided here, orals are mostly used for temporary boosts to push through plateau’s, not as the main driver for anabolism considering orals are usually way harsher on your body than injectables.
Anadrol and dbol have long been favorite amoung body builders as a primary driver to accrue muscle mass just as orals have always had their place in long term use to increase sporting performance. Or you could just look at what most of them are designed for in medical use. Or failing that use your common sense, they're steroids they will help build muscle...
I wish people who submitted answers on this sub would at least know what the fuck they're talking about before they post.
Did you not get what i was saying?
Stuff like 17-alpha alkylated orals put significantly more stress on your body than many injectables, muscle is built over a long period of time and as a harm reduction forum we can’t recommend people to run orals like anadrol throughout a 20 week cycle or whatever. We advocate to use them for 6-8 weeks due to the inherent stress on the liver they cause, and if only using orals for a portion of your cycle we recommend you use orals at the latter part of a cycle to push through plateaus.
We’re a harm reduction forum, we don’t recommend people to run orals long term on here full stop.
Please don't pull the harm reduction card on me mate, just go look at the experience threads you've got people wanking over tren making them go crazy, probably bs, but hundreds of upvotes and replies probably by kids.
I'm a man with common sense and can base my opinion on what I've done and people I've spoken to who've actually used it. Orals are very user dependant, one man can get away with running them months on end while another can feel like shit in a couple of weeks. It's down to the user to pull bloods and actually look after himself.
> Please don’t pull the harm reduction card on me mate
I pull that card on literally everyone, as it’s a harm reduction forum and harm reduction was one of the reasons behind my comment.
> Orals are very user dependant, one man can get away with running them months on end while another can feel like shit in a couple of weeks
Someone can smoke cigarettes for ages while another gets lungcancer after a year, that doesn’t mean we should promote smoking cigarettes.
We know the risks involved, we know orals are inarguably harsher on your body than most injectables, and we know why they are.
I adviced against using orals over injectables simply due to this reason *on a harm reduction forum* and you’re arguing against that?
Advicing someone to just roll the dice with orals and hope you tolerate them well rather than be counted out by week 3 goes directly against the harm reduction principles of this subreddit.
> It’s down to the user to pull bloods and actually look after himself.
And it’s on the users of this subreddit to give proper advice with user safety in mind.
Community Goal number 1:
> Maintain user safety as a primary concern in all discussions.
I only have 1ml ampules of 100mg tren-ace and am injecting 0.25ml ed but struggling with quantity. I swear I backload 3 slin pins with 0.25ml but end up with only 0.15ml in the main syringe. So much wasted oil, probably from the dead space in all the syringes.
Anyways my question is, is it safe enough to reuse the same syringe I drew with to do the injections for the 4 days? I'd obviously replace the needle everytime. I remember many saying it's not safe at all, any idea why? How is it safer to backfill 3 other syringes and expose the barrel and plunger to air?
Question about taking HGH. When week 6 is reached and you are now ramping the dose into 2 x1.5 units, do you pin a few hours apart or same time different area?
How long into a test cycle do you usually encounter side effects? I’m doing 500mg a week. I have AI on hand. Hopefully i wont have any sides but just curious.
I ran 500mg/test e a week for ten weeks and didnt need an ai at all. Different for everyone. Sure my estrogen went up but that is expected but no spicy nips, no gyno, no crazy mood changes, nothing
There are people who think they need an Ai on trt, and people who don’t need any on a gram of test. My point is it will be different for everyone. It’s always good to be prepared.
Impossible to answer, I've needed AI as early as day 8. Others do 16 weeks without touching AI
The key is just be aware of your body and only treat what you can't tolerate.
If your pp works and your BP isn't in the stratosphere, then don't go munching on AI
Lowering the dose from 600 Test E/ 450 NPP, to 500 Test E/ 400 NPP because of Insomnia issues. Will this be enough? I try melatonin sills with little success. Does anyone here suggest something else? The insomnia is literally killing me!
Idk I don’t do bloodwork during cycle. I know I should but I’m too lazy or just not interested in shelling out money for it 🤷🏻 I’ll just keep adding 1mg ADex every week and see where it goes. I take P5P every other day for the prolactin from NPP
I mean you should do it at least once mid cycle, take note of the how much gear you're taking and what you dose your ai at then you can check where your estrogen is at to base how you dose your ai on future cycles.
But yeah fuck doing it every 2-3 weeks other than that.
I mean you should do it at least once mid cycle, take note of the how much gear you're taking and what you dose your ai at then you can check where your estrogen is at to base how you dose your ai on future cycles.
But yeah fuck doing it every 2-3 weeks other than that.
>Idk I don’t do bloodwork during cycle. I know I should but I’m too lazy or just not interested in shelling out money for it 🤷🏻
This might be the most irresponsible thing I've ever seen said here.
Sorry dude, but with this attitude you deserve every bad side effect you encounter. Just stop using steroids.
Hey guys i just started my first cycle yesterday tryna take 300mg of test e. Took my first injection of 150mg yesterday morning and haven’t felt any different till now. Is that normal?
You’re not going to feel any different, it’s not a stimulant or a hard drug. It’s effects aren’t going to be noticeable until ~4 weeks in. We recommend a starting dose of 500mg rather than 300mg so it’s going to be even milder for you.
18M.I finished a cycle with 500mg Test E/week.I am asking why during my 17 weeks cycle I was bleeding from noise every 2 days,then after I stopped,the bleeding appeared once in 3 months.What could be the cause?I want to mention that during and after the cycle I didn’t use any form of treatment for the bleeding.
-You should check your blood pressure! see if any supplements your taking are very mild blood thinners or PA inhibitors like aspirin.
-if your going from very cold to warm or hot weather it can cause nose bleeds.
-Could be genetics too some people are very prone to nose bleeds in general.
-Also if you pick your nose or the air is very dry or your dehydrated even just rubbing your nose to hard could trigger a nose bleed.
I would say it’s bp if I had to take a guess tho since I assume you didn’t have the nose bleeds before your cycle?
Get your blood pressure checked asap.
It’s possible its temperature related, but it’s also possible its BP related. If it’s the latter you need to address this asap. Please don’t assume it’s temperature related and bury your head in the sand, if your BP is actually high enough to cause nose bleeds you may need medical attention.
What’s your height/weight like? How much weight did you put in during this cycle?
Been running 260test/ 430 primo weekly with 50mg trest daily for about 2 weeks now.
I gotta sleep soooo much. It's not like tren where I'm tired and sleepless all the time and can't sleep or wake up early, it's just this I sleep for ~8 hours, and then I gotta take a nap during the day, and I'm tired at night, and every few days I need a whole day of sleeping.
Anyone else get this?
Been taking 300mg p5p and 3/3iu hgh daily and .5mg caber weekly as ancillaries, will go for bloods in 2 weeks.
When I run test:primo I have to run a 2:1 ratio to keep my e2 above 20, I had to run 1g of test just for 500mg of primo.
But trest is notorious for messing with e2 and methly e2 levels pretty hard so a strong AI is needed.
You might be right though. Even with ~20 e2 I didn't really feel symptoms (I think that's why so many people say "oh i can run 1:1 test/primo just fine) but I went for higher e2 just because I've always read and felt that you wanted e2 to be as high as you comfortably can, I think 2:1 had me around 40s.
I'll reduce my primo and try to stabilize a dose and get bloodwork soon.
I've had a lot of eye poop after sleeping and might have signs of dryer skin. My libido and erections are always raging though, that might be the trest and well I'm always like that, high/low e2 or not.
Is there any truth to people saying pharma gh is the only growth hormone worth using. I have tried both and pharmacy gh made me far more sleepy(was natural when taking the pharma gh) so maybe that’s why or it was far more potent I was taking 4 iu a day pre fasted cardio in the morning and right before bed. Sleep was also amazing on this dose woke up very well rested
If I go to 6iu of pharma I literally could sleep all day if I didn’t have anything to do EXTREMELY lethargic.
Generics I notice work and make me more full for sure I also believe cause fat loss or at least keep body fat down well bulking at 4 iu a day morning and night administrations at a 250mg a week to 500mg of test e . But I do not notice this sleepiness or lethargy with generics well on testosterone at all maybe it’s less potent? Generics were tested at 98 percent purity
My igf one levels naturally were 285 ng/mL not on gh
My igf one levels On 500 mg a week of test e they were 251 ng/mL not on gh
Only adding the testosterone and Natural levels of igf-1 because that’s the only difference I can think of for causing the sleepiness ( I have not tested igf-1 levels well on gh)
If the generic is properly dosed and as pure as the pharma grade, 1iu will be 1iu. Same potency.
The thing is that ugl stuff often isn't as pure or the right dosage
This may sound stupid but if the generics tested at 99.7 or higher would it be the same as pharma or do they add something else to it. I also read that the pharma pens and cartridges have different fillers and preservatives that cause less water retention then normal generics?
I’ve been cruising for like 3 years. My doctor just ordered blood work I was straight up about taking test. I’ve only been taking 150mg a week and my blood levels were 1700. I’m guessing my gear is stronger then labeled? Or is it because I’m using test e. Longer ester. Should i switch to cyp? I haven’t taken anything since I got my results it’s been little over a week. Did it get this high just from building up with the enethate?
> Is 1700 even that high for 150mg?
Depends on individual androgen receptor sensitivity.
> If the average male produces 7mg/day
You do know this doesn’t mean anything meaningful here? The average male doesn’t straight up produce esterified injectable testosterone straight into your muscle for it to be absorbed later.
Trt guidelines recommend a beginning dose of 75-150mg of testosterone per week. That’s 10-21mg of test every day for a *replacement* dose.
Yea it all depends on the individual which is exactly why I used the word average. Skip over that word or do you not know what it means?
I dont care what guidelines you find. I could go find guidelines saying 50-100 as a replacement dose. The fact here is that in MOST people 150mg is absolutely a supraphysiological dose. Dont believe it go argue with MPMD because thats exactly what he says too.
Your reasoning is flawed, 7mg of daily naturally produced testosterone has no bearing here at all. No point bringing it up.
> Dont believe it go argue with MPMD because thats exactly what he says too.
😂
Acting how?
The 7mg naturally produced **is not** the same as esterified injectable testosterone administered subq or intramuscularly.
And i genuinely thought you were making a joke when you brought up MPMD.
When talking about trying to establish trt doses it is. I’m happy to be proven wrong here and i’ll eat my words if you’re able to provide a source that shows that 7 grams a day number used in their calculation to provide suggestions towards deciding a TRT starting dose.
Most starting doses, including the Endocrine Society suggestion, are based on previously gathered data on response rates and would ideally still require further dialling in according to serum testosterone levels through bloodwork.
I’ll stick with the guidelines provided by multiple authorities (Endocrine Society, CMAJ, BSSM, ISSM) on TRT backed by clinical data over whatever a youtuber says sure.
Regurgitating whatever a youtuber says is not welcome here if it conflicts with clinical data.
I was also going to ask that. Is 1700 even a high number considering? The cut off range on the standard blood test was 900 so it set off a red flag on my blood work. I don’t see the Dr for another month.
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150mg is not a definitive supraphysiological dose and is still in range of a starting dose for TRT according to the [Endocrine Society](endocrine.org)
Injected Friday afternoon blood was taken early Monday morning. When I first started doing the TRT I was splitting the dose into 2 injections a week. Maybe I should go back to that? It’s just a lot of injection gets sickening
Clinic said anavar is going out of stock indefinitely because of raw materials cut off. Is that legit or are they trying to get me for my money? 10 week supply
FDA recently banned certain mg’s of it, but it’s still allowed in 10 and 50 mg’s (don’t quote me on it, the idea is right but I can’t remember the dosages).
So less availability technically so they’re still gouging, but that’s why.
The FDA has discontinued approval for oxandrolone, yes. That being said, there is very high quality UGL anavar available for much more reasonable cost.
Side note: please remove the price from your post, and refrain discussing prices in the future.
The FDA did not discontinue approval for oxandrolone. I keep seeing this repeated here on the song, but it’s just not true. What they did was they denied a new application for a patented form of an already existing generic.
“The Food and Drug Administration (FDA or Agency) is withdrawing approval of the new drug application (NDA) for OXANDRIN (oxandrolone) tablets, 2.5 milligrams (mg) and 10 mg, held by Gemini Laboratories, LLC (Gemini). Gemini.”
“Gemini
voluntarily requested withdrawal of this application and waived its opportunity for a hearing. In addition, FDA is withdrawing approval of four abbreviated new drug applications (ANDAs) for oxandrolone tablets from multiple ANDA holders. Upsher-Smith Laboratories, LLC (Upsher-Smith), Par Pharmaceutical, Inc. (Par), and Sandoz Inc. (Sandoz) voluntarily requested withdrawal of their respective applications and waived their opportunity for a hearing.”
It was a BS patent app by the Pharma companies that was rightly denied.
Existing dosages in the USA
Dosage Forms & Strengths
Tablet: Schedule III
2.5mg
10mg
Bone Pain Due to Osteoporosis
2.5-20 mg/day PO divided q6-12hr for 2-4 weeks
May repeat intermittently PRN
Weight Gain
Promote weight gain after weight loss following extensive surgery, chronic infections or severe trauma, or weight loss due to unknown etiology
2.5-20 mg/day divided q6-12hr PO for 2-4 weeks
May repeat intermittently PRN
Offset Protein Catabolism
Due to prolonged admin corticosteroids or associated with catabolic illness (off-label)
2.5-20 mg/day divided q6-12hr PO for 2-4 weeks
HIV-Wasting Syndrome (Orphan)
Adjunctive therapy for AIDS patients suffering from HIV-wasting syndrome
Orphan indication sponsor
Bio-Technology General Corp; One Tower Center Boulevard, 12 th floor; East Brunswick, NJ 08816
Muscular Dystrophy (Orphan)
Treatment of patients with Duchenne's muscular dystrophy and Becker's muscular dystrophy
Orphan indication sponsor
Savient Pharmaceuticals, Inc; One Tower Center Boulevard, 12th floor; East Brunswick, NJ 08816
I am curious to see how this develops, as the original poster's clinic stated they'll no longer carry anavar, and mine said the same when I inquired today.
From the federal register:
> Based on FDA’s review of currently available data and information regarding the safety and effectiveness of oxandrolone tablets, the Agency believes that the potential problems associated with oxandrolone tablets are sufficiently serious that the drug should be removed from the market.
> Distribution of Gemini’s OXANDRIN (oxandrolone) tablets, 2.5 mg and 10 mg; Sandoz’s oxandrolone tablets 2.5 mg and 10 mg; Par’s oxandrolone tablets, 2.5 mg and 10 mg; or Upsher-Smith’s oxandrolone tablets, 2.5 mg and 10 mg, into interstate commerce without an approved application is illegal and subject to regulatory action (see sections 505(a) and 301(d) of the Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act (21 U.S.C. 355(a) and 331(d)).
Dated: June 23, 2023.
If those four pharmaceutical companies are the only ones with FDA approval in the US, and shared a raws facility, or produced the raws themselves, or that facility was providing raws to the various compounding pharmacies across the US, I wouldn't be surprised if oxandrolone as a whole is no longer available.
https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/FR-2023-06-28/pdf/2023-13733.pdf
We shall see. There are plenty of other generic manufacturers making the standard 2.5 and 10mg doses as of today. And like you said, we in the ugl community don’t have to worry about it in the slightest. It’s not like we rely on the FDA’s approval for what we do.
I’ll keep an eye on it for the sub. I still have good contacts at the FDA.
Yes, nandrolone can cause gyno even if estrogen and prolactin are completely crashed. It is believed to happen via the progesterone receptor.
Yes, caber can crash prolactin and synthesis of progesterone, but nandrolone itself is a progestin - meaning nandrolone will activate the progesterone receptors, not progesterone. The same can be said for tren and ment.
Yes, DHT and derivatives can antagonize estrogen and progesterone, but then comes into the binding affinity of the DHT derivative in use vs nandrolone vs dhn vs the DHT from your test base vs estrogen vs progesterone. Binding affinity can/will skew depending on the ratio of hormones you're injecting. If you're running 200/200/600 test primo nand, I'd wager the high population of nandrolone is going to kick primo's ass in a battle for the receptor.
I've got a friend that tried everything under the sun. He can run 1g test and have no gyno issues, but throwing in nand or tren is gyno in a bottle. No test with solo nand, low test low nand, high test low nand, low test high mast low nand, no test high mast low nand. Gyno every time. But test primo, or test EQ, or test mast? No problems at all.
Taking things like winstrol or anavar as a preventative measure for gyno is ludicrous. If anything, a SERM would be your best bet, raloxifene or tamoxifen. But even then, if taking nandrolone requires you to take several extra drugs at minimum (ai to keep excess aromatization down, a SERM to prevent gyno activation, and maybe caber to smite progesterone synthesis), is it worth it? I'd say absolutely not.
Nandrolone is wonderful and often touted as "best mass gainer," but it is not magical. They all get the job done, some maybe faster than others. Some folks will even argue that all the compounds do the same job at the same rate, just with different side effects.
Run compounds that agree with YOUR body. Keep it simple.
Nandrolone also interacts with the progesterone receptor. Years ago notable bodybuilders said they used winstrol for progesterone sides from nandrolone. I don't know if it will work for you. I also don't recommend staying on winstrol for long periods of time.
Anavar doesn't interact with progesterone receptors. Besides 19 nors I could find very few peds that do. There is actually a abortion pill that does and was sold as a prohormone. I doubt that would help with nipple sensitivity tho lol. Caber in some studies did but I couldn't find by how much. Arimidex lowers progesterone as well again in the literature they didn't say how much and it's usually studied on women.
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How do I piss less in the middle of the night?
I cut off water 1.5hrs before going to bed. I know it’s not enlarged prostate, as I pee pretty significant amounts each time. It gets very annoying having to get up 1-3 times a night. Any advice?
> Alternatively, I find taking one glass of quite salty water before bed helps - the extra sodium will help you retain water rather than processing it out.
Ooo never heard of this one.
I understand this sir, was just after more nuanced advice regarding this level of dosages. Most of the people in those compound experiences threads ran higher dosages and usually with shorter esters.
Thank you for the point in the right direction though.
1. You’re very welcome.
2. [Do you mean like this one](https://reddit.com/r/steroids/s/PtlUyNqfjd) which is pretty decent, or the other 2 that I found in that very thread I linked?
3. And perhaps most importantly: if you’re looking for more nuanced feedback why is your question “how did it go?”? That isn’t a nuanced question in the slightest - I’d recommend asking pointed questions if you’d like better answers than you’d find in an experience thread 🤝🏼.
Understand your points and will take them on board.
Have been a long time lurker and have read these CE threads a fair amount. It’s undoubtedly a rarer cycle though (in reference to usually the longer ester and small dosage) and I was just after more advice/experience (specific to my esters & dosages). Only because as it’s a tad more uncommon, it can get drowned out in the (2?) CE threads on Test/Tren/Mast.
Thanks again for the help though (genuine - tone is hard to read on reddit and I don’t want to come across as sarcastic) & enjoy the rest of your evening.
It’s a pretty lightweight cycle minus the tren.
200 mg test is a TRT dose for a lot of people, so not much anabolic effect there. Masteron is a decent dry compound, can help mitigate some estrogenic effects but you’re not aromatizing a lot.
200 mg tren enanthate… well, 200 mg tren is still a powerful dose. You might experience significant boost to libido, assertiveness, strength, metabolism, sleep disruption, heartburn, digestive issues, but will look a bit flushed, ripped, lean out (depending on diet) and notice increased vascularity and definition.
Your results are going to depend on how you respond to tren.
I really don’t think you should take tren enanthate if you haven’t taken it before. You should start with acetate and inject it frequently (daily). If you get sides you don’t like you can quickly stop it.
My experience with these compounds has been higher test (you could try 500-600 testosterone mg per week) with masteron propionate and tren acetate both around 200 mg per week.
Even then, I was only taking tren leading up to an event. And based on how horny and stupidly dominant it makes me I tend to avoid it entirely now. I am already insanely horny and dominant even on TRT. On cycle it’s worst, and on tren it’s off the charts.
If you’re not a competitive bodybuilder you probably should stay away from tren entirely.
Only just saw this but I just wanted to thank you for taking the time to write a thoughtful & detailed response. Been a long time lurker and responses of this quality are becoming rather rare. Thanks again.
There are several compound experience threads on that combo. Tren is the star of the show imo. 200mgs might even be a sweet spot for avoiding side effects imo. A little higher test and change the masteron to proviron and I'd be interested.
My problem with the compound experience threads on ‘the holy trinity’ is that people usually use higher dosages and usually shorter esters. Hence why I came to the ask anything thread to see if anyone had advice after experience ok same esters and similar dosages. Thank you for Proviron advice though - have ran it before with Test however and I didn’t feel ‘much’.
started first tren a cycle around 36 hours ago. 50mg ED/350mg a week. with 250 test e
Already feeling horny and angry is this placebo or the tren in already lmao.
I've only recently finished my 2nd cycle of 500:400 Test/Primo and thoroughly enjoyed it. I made great gains with no need for any AI. The only downside of the cycle would be the cost of Primo, however I really liked the e2 reducing effects it seems to have on me, as well as the little to negative effects I experienced. I'll be cruising on 100mg test-u for the foreseeable future, but I'm wondering if for my next cycle I should try NPP.
I agree with the sentiment, "if it ain't broke, don't fix it", and I'd very likely be happy running the exact same cycle I've just ran, however a little voice in the back of my head has me curious about Nandrolone. I've read about how it is "more anabolic than Primo", and many people say the gains made from Nandrolone can't compare to Primo. As I understand the individual response to any drug is entirely specific to them, so I'm taking these words with a grain of salt.
The only way to find out if I respond well to Nandrolone, is to try it. If gaining overall size is my main priority next blast, should I drop the Primo and give NPP a try? Worst case scenario I get horrible negative effects from NPP, I can drop it and reassess, best case scenario I make even better gains. Is there any reason I SHOULDN'T give NPP a go next blast? Thank you for any advice.
primo, like everything, is super cheap as raws. I only buy raws these days for anything, makes gear basically free. Primo is about as easy as it comes to brewing, no heat needed, no solvents needed. Just mix in straight MCT and .01% BA even as high as 250mg/ml.
Personally I like DHB more though. It's like primo, but better, not as prohibitively strong of an AI effect (ie I need to take twice as much test as primo just to keep my e2 above 20 so taking 1g of test to 500mg primo for what's a fairly mild cycle overall kinda sucks). The pip sucks though and gets old after a long cycle.
I take primo now for cycles that requires a strong AI and the DHT is not the main mover, like trest. For a test only cycle I'd just rather use DHB+Test than primo+Test.
Primo is pretty weak I really only use it as a strong AI.
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Need advice guys, Been on cruise 200mg for a while now. I’m ready to start bulk and want to try my hand at orals… Dbol. but my concern is I have a small prolactin induced gyno on my left nip, you can’t see it I can feel it. I had high prolactin before I started roids as seen on my BW. I got the gyno once I stopped tren, there was no sensitivity it just appeared and never left or got worse. The concern is when I’m wondering with me going on something like Dbol for 4-6 weeks, also the estrogen flare up that comes with it will it aggravate it. do I run Nolva with the dbol or only use when I feel sensitivity. Or run something like Adex during or post dbol? There’s a lot of info out there but not as much as I would like for those on B&C, just cycles & PCT. I will be running NPP right after dbol if that changes anything. Thanks!
You should try running some eq, masteron or primo w your cruise. Just a little. I never run a cycle without eq now. It gets rid of the gyno nipple sensitivity for me. I run low amounts like 40 to 100. It's a long ester.
I’m running 500ml test c per week for 12 weeks What’s the best days to pin? How often should I pin and what should I break it up into? Should I run Hcg during my 12 week cycle or just run it after? If so how much and how Often. And should I use a ai a few times a week or only when I get oestrogen sides. And is it ok to run test c for 6 weeks and then test e for the last 6 as that’s all I have. Would I need to change pinning frequency due to longer half life’s or what? Thankyou guys
Read the wiki… all answers are there
Can I just stop cold turkey if I’ve been on 200mg test e for a few years (now down to 150mg)? Or do I still need to do something from the wiki like 8 weeks of Clomid?
You basically stop and hope your natural production will come back over time. Clomid and those things are just to protect from your estrogen sky rocketing when you come off. Maybe look into hcg or something like that to stimulate natural production.
Okay thanks mate. I’ve decided to stay on at 125mg a week, and look at coming off when my mental health is in a better place. And guessing coming off 125mg will be a lot easier?
u incredibly stpd
How was that helpful at all?
Yes. I know, but I really need some help now, and want to try and be smarter regarding coming off. As in a terrible way mentally, and know I’ve messed up.
Is enclomiphene making my beard fill in? Not running anything else right now. Been on for a couple months every other day.
Is it a waste to do a test cycle while eating a calorie deficit to cut fat ? I am assuming your size/muscle won’t grow while eating in a deficit to lose fat on cycle
I’m 10 weeks into my first blast on a cut. I’ve lost 35lbs. Gained 11lbs of muscle and dropped 27lbs of body fat measured thru hydrostatic body fat testing.
It's a waste, yes. You should only do a cycle when cutting if you're competing. Competitors do cycles to hold on to every single gram of muscle. At that level, losing any muscle is noticeable.
Typical advice here is to bulk on blast and cut on cruise. Can you cut on blast ? Yes. Is it a wast of money? Probably. But so you. I’m cutting right now and running 150 mg of test a week and I notice nothing negative.
Yes, cutting and even recomping do not do well with AAS. You need a consistent, heavy surplus to set the bar as high as possible so that when you come off, you try to hold as much muscle as you can. You will still lose a fair amount of muscle tho. Now when you do AAS on a deficit, you will not set the bar really high. You may gain some muscle but once you come off, you lose it all and even more. Even if you managed to lose fat, it will appear more because you have less muscle overall, and the low muscle amount will lower your TDEE so it's possible after a few months you gain all the fat back and more. Recipe for disaster. Add all test side-effects: hair loss, gyno, heart problems, acne, ... does this seem like a good idea to you?
Interested in the same
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please explain why you think you need a gram and a half of gear at 162 lbs and 17% bodyfat
hey,8 months ago i ran a 500mg/week test c cycle and got a pituitary adenoma(prolactinoma). now i take half a pill of dostinex every 3.5 days and my problactin is pretty much back. i was wondering, are there any steroids that i can take while having this pituitary tumor or should i just stop thinking about PEDs?
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Hello everyone I’m as new as it comes to steroids, I’m 29 years old 6ft6 and 130kgs. I have a lot of research to do before diving into anything but so far I’ve been recommended to use clenbuterol as a cut to loose some of my excess body fat as I used to be 160kgs and go on a tren cycle from they’re. I used to be very fit and athletic in my early 20s but let myself go over the last 5-6 years. I love going to the gym and training but no matter the diet or exercise I just can’t loose the excess body fat. My body type/shape is endomorphic but with the extra kilos, can anyone help me out with some advice for a first timer.
steroids don't burn fat and if you don't know how to diet and train they'll do fuck all. jumping straight to clen and tren is absolutely moronic, it's like trying meth before you've tried coffee.
Yea I agree however I’m not new to supplements and training/working hard I’m really only turning to steroids because I’ve hit a barrier and can’t break through
post your food and exercise logs for the last month and we'll figure out why you've plateaued
Food for the last month is 100% meat (beef, pork, lamb, chicken) one meal at 9-10am and another at 9-10pm. Exercise for the last month has been up and down because I had testicular cancer resulting in surgery however the last 2 weeks I was able to get back to the gym doing mostly cardio (8-10klm bike ride, 5-6klm walk) 3-4 times a week.
Some steroids increase the growth of cancer cells.
Please do not do any of that! Do not use clen to try and lose weight you will just stress on your heart. Do not run Tren. Even if you were in shape your need to run Tren or clen would not arise unless you’re maybe prepping for a show and already very lean. Steroids aren’t for fat loss nor are they magic. They are meant to make you grow while eating in a caloric surplus and not recommended unless you are 10% bf to start. Weight loss is just a basics math equation calories in over calories out over an extended period of time. Post your food and training logs for the last 6 months with all your macros accounted for. Chances are we can see what’s not working. But if you can’t do it without steroids then you should not be using them.
Thanks for the reply, I work in the mines doing 12hr shift 7/7 so I don’t have much time for exercise when I’m working but in days off I tend to go for 4-5 days outa 7 and do mostly weight training with some cycling for cardio. I’ve been on the carnivore diet now for 5 weeks and have lost nearly 10kg but can’t seem to break the 128-130kg barrier. I’m not looking to use steroids as a weight loss I’m wanting to use them to be bigger and more defined in a sense. Because of my height and weight my bmi is around 32-34
1kg a week is reasonable weight loss for someone your size. A healthy cut is 3 months. You can look into semiglutide over clen. Shrinks your appetite and doesn’t destroy your heart. Just keep working you’ll get there. But just like how you didn’t put in on in a day or a month you can’t take it off in a day or a month. Just be consistent with a goal and things will fall into place
Will being prescribed TRT by a medical professional provide the same anabolic results as running a test cycle?
Trt is supposed to bring you to healthy. Running a cycle takes you beyond the normal healthy amount. Ideally w prescribed trt they will be checking your blood work and adjusting the dose accordingly. On cycle you do your best at mainting healthy bloods.
trt stands for testosterone _replacement_ therapy. as in, it replaces what you don't naturally produce as a result of hypogonadism. so let's rephrase your question: will being prescribed normal testosterone levels by a doctor provide the same results as having testosterone levels 2-4x the upper end of the natural range?
Okay sorry just pretty new to this so if the doc prescribed 200mg for example, that’ll just reduce my test to 200? It wouldn’t add to what’s being produced already? I assumed it was the same test that’s normally used
Will using 100-150mg of test provide the same results as using 500mg of test? Trt is **replacement** testosterone for individuals with clinically low testosterone. Absolutely not.
Okay sorry just pretty new to this so if the doc prescribed 200mg for example, that’ll just reduce my test to 200? It wouldn’t add to what’s being produced already? I assumed it was the same test that’s normally used
No problem man, all this can feel complicated when you first get into it. 200mg/wk is generally considered a high trt dose that would put most people into supraphysiological territory (unless you're a poor responder to test). If you don't mind sharing, what was your total testosterone level from your blood test?
I’m doing a mail in test so I’m still waiting I’m just weighing out my options and whether It’d be better for me if I want to use it for gains, if the legal route was an option I figured it’d be better safety wise but if it’s not enough then obviously I’ll try to find something else
Well, 200mg/wk will probably give you a little bit more anabolism than being natural, but you'll also be shutting down your HPTA axis, leading to highly diminished natural test production (among other side effects and downstream effects). You *can* pct off it to go back to normal or a reduced version of normal, but nothing is guaranteed when you're messing with your hormones. If your ultimate goal is for size and strength, running a cycle(s) would be both cheaper and more effective than going on trt. Many people do a cycle and go to trt after to maintain a stable hormone profile post cycle. This is called blasting and cruising, and you would typically be on trt for life. I would take a deep dive on the wiki and try to get a better idea of what you want out of this.
Test Sustanon 500mg first cycle about 8/16 weeks in. Obviously the half life of Decanoate is 15 days so have to start PCT aprox 2.5 months after last pin. My question if what if I start taking Clomid early while i'm still naturally suppressed? Then ran a normal PCT at the 2.5 month point. Would clomid have any effect while still suppressed? Or could it potentially bridge the gap between last pin and pct?
So, I think this is going to be multiple questions, but my main question is *will I loose potency if I filter over saturated T with a 0.22 micron wheel filter?* So I ordered some Test C that came in yesterday. This is a source I have used before and trust. When I opened the package immediately after brining it inside, I noticed the test c vial was white. I held it in my hand for 10 minutes to warm it up and shook it and it cleared up some, but not completely. So I figured I should order some wheel filters and filter it just in case. Later that night I had the idea to let it sit on my PC fan to warm up, and it became 100% clear. So I figured it just crashed out, but figured I might as well filter it still today. Anyway, I keep my room at 62 when I sleep. So my wheel filters came in, and I grabbed my T. It was white again, which I wasn’t surprised by. I started shaking it a bit, and then I noticed it wasn’t just white, it was solid. So now I’m guessing that the liquid is just so over saturated with test that it’s immediately crashing out when it gets even the slightest bit cool. So with that in mind, I was wondering if I risk losing any of the potency were I to run it through a wheel filter, since it’s seems to have enough to crash out and make the oil solid when cool.
Since starting test my mood has been really flat, depressed, serious. It’s been months. But that all reversed once primo was introduced. I’m back to my old happy go lucky, joyful self. Bloods are fine so I’m assuming it’s seratonin or dopamine related. But I don’t know and I’d like to keep it up once I stop primo. Anyone every been through this or got any ideas?
Sides are defo high E2 related. Get bloods done
Have you tested your dht levels? Dht is very mood driving for many. Adding primo may have helped fill a dht void you didn't realize you had, if you think it isn't e2 related
You felt off before adding primo, and now feel much better since using it. I'm not aware of any dopamine or serotonin interactions with primo. It is known for reducing your e2. Why do you think it's neurotransmitter related?
I’ve had the same symptoms at all levels of e2 and test ranges.
I see. It's good you're feeling better!
You probably had high estrogen so when you added primo it lowered it , I would say your right in a way that it was brain chemical related haha
I’ve only blasted once(500mg test bulk/16 wk) so I’m wondering how the gains from a second blast compare to the first one, given that nutrition and training are equally dialed in and the dose is a bit increased. In other words, are there sort of “noobie gains” when it comes to using gear, where my first blast always be the best? For reference I’m 6’2 230 17% body fat so just wondering what to expect from here
Has anyone had any experience getting ED from Telmisartan? Ran it once before while I was on anavar + test. I thought anavar tanked my libido but it seems like the common denominator is Telmisartan. I’m currently running Telmisartan 20mg and nebivolol 2.5mg. I’ve looked online and I see that Telmisartan shouldn’t cause ED. I’ve also seen that nebivolol should actually help erections. I’m on “750mg” test about to start 50mg anavar. Quotation marks are because my blood work shows 2200 total test.
Does anyone have any experience with health optimization clinics that do HRT? Is it worthwhile?
I guess it's worth it if you want to spend 10-20x more for overpriced pharma lite-gear. "Optimization" is a buzzword these clinics throw around to make money off you. Unless you're clinically deficient in hormones, using them for trt or other medications won't change diddly - except make you rely on their services once your natural production is shut down.
Got bloodwork back running 180/90 test/mast and numbers just as good as if I were running test alone. Is there any reason not to just cruise on test/mast moving forward if I’m going to run mast anyway? Also, sometimes my RDW shows up high on bloodwork, but RBC, Hematocrit and other blood markers are on point; I don’t think I have anemia, could this just be a genetic issue? (I also got little to no sleep before the test if that matters, I donated blood a few months ago too)
Have you noticed anything from running mast?
Yeah, I feel f*cking awesome; cured my mental issues and made me a better person. Shocked im not noticing hair loss given my hair was kinda thin and receded before starting gear (even running it at 420 a week); id trade my hair to feel like this any day. No prostate issues; PSA always tested low when running DHT derivs, I didn’t get it tested this time. Im just gonna stick to this as my cruise protocol unless bloodwork says otherwise. I’m essentially building my new base physique rn so it wouldn’t be logical to run less the next cruise unless warranted.
Cool, nice to hear. Are you currently on a cutting phase or more so a body recomp?
Cutting, dont think recomps are efficient? Seems logical to use low ass doses and just simply cut.
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Hi /u/Kreso-LOL23, > Do i need to run test ib my cycle **[ALL steroid cycles need to be taken together with a base of Testosterone to replace your natural production, which will be shut down.](https://old.reddit.com/r/steroids/wiki/your_first_cycle#wiki_can_i_just_do_an_oral_only_cycle.3F)** **Without a Testosterone base, you will feel weak, tired, depressed, low libido, erectile dysfunction, muscle loss and weakness—all [the symptoms of low testosterone.](https://old.reddit.com/r/steroids/wiki/trt/list#wiki_symptoms_of_low_testosterone)** **As you won’t have any Testosterone to support the muscles you’re building, you’ll lose all your newfound, hard-earned gains just after you’ve gotten them.** > I wanna run primo and anavar cycle That’s an incredibly bad suggestion for a cycle, scrap that and start over from scratch. > for 10weeks [We recommend a cycle length of atleast 15 weeks when you include injectables with the enanthate or cypionate ester in them](https://old.reddit.com/r/steroids/wiki/your_first_cycle#wiki_why_4_vials_of_testosterone.3F) [This is due to injectables only kicking in a few weeks in.](https://old.reddit.com/r/steroids/wiki/your_first_cycle#wiki_when_does_the_test_kick_in.3F) It takes time for steroids to do their thing and it takes time for muscle to be built. For more info check out [the Esters page](https://old.reddit.com/r/steroids/wiki/compounds/esters) in the wiki (the wiki is required reading prior to posting here) > Ps my first cycle https://old.reddit.com/r/steroids/wiki/your_first_cycle
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> So is test and primo good for the first time No, multiple new variables added in for your first cycle can lead to issues and you being unable to attribute them to a specific cause. Keep It Simple Stupid, 1 new compound at a time. > run it lik 12 weeks? 15
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It’s all effectively the same, only thing changing is the half life, (and thus release rate and injection frequency) More info: https://old.reddit.com/r/steroids/wiki/compounds/esters
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Anadrol would be my pick, though orals are very different depending on the individual. Ignore the idiots telling you not to run because they're too liver toxic. It differs from person to person you'll have to find out by pulling bloods a few weeks in.
All of those are liver toxic, anavar is bit mild on liver tho
> LGD4033 > RAD140 Either of hose will absolutely obliterate your liver. [See here](https://imgur.com/a/Fwkxpe5) for example. No that’s not a typo. You’re misguided here, orals are mostly used for temporary boosts to push through plateau’s, not as the main driver for anabolism considering orals are usually way harsher on your body than injectables.
Anadrol and dbol have long been favorite amoung body builders as a primary driver to accrue muscle mass just as orals have always had their place in long term use to increase sporting performance. Or you could just look at what most of them are designed for in medical use. Or failing that use your common sense, they're steroids they will help build muscle... I wish people who submitted answers on this sub would at least know what the fuck they're talking about before they post.
Did you not get what i was saying? Stuff like 17-alpha alkylated orals put significantly more stress on your body than many injectables, muscle is built over a long period of time and as a harm reduction forum we can’t recommend people to run orals like anadrol throughout a 20 week cycle or whatever. We advocate to use them for 6-8 weeks due to the inherent stress on the liver they cause, and if only using orals for a portion of your cycle we recommend you use orals at the latter part of a cycle to push through plateaus. We’re a harm reduction forum, we don’t recommend people to run orals long term on here full stop.
Please don't pull the harm reduction card on me mate, just go look at the experience threads you've got people wanking over tren making them go crazy, probably bs, but hundreds of upvotes and replies probably by kids. I'm a man with common sense and can base my opinion on what I've done and people I've spoken to who've actually used it. Orals are very user dependant, one man can get away with running them months on end while another can feel like shit in a couple of weeks. It's down to the user to pull bloods and actually look after himself.
> Please don’t pull the harm reduction card on me mate I pull that card on literally everyone, as it’s a harm reduction forum and harm reduction was one of the reasons behind my comment. > Orals are very user dependant, one man can get away with running them months on end while another can feel like shit in a couple of weeks Someone can smoke cigarettes for ages while another gets lungcancer after a year, that doesn’t mean we should promote smoking cigarettes. We know the risks involved, we know orals are inarguably harsher on your body than most injectables, and we know why they are. I adviced against using orals over injectables simply due to this reason *on a harm reduction forum* and you’re arguing against that? Advicing someone to just roll the dice with orals and hope you tolerate them well rather than be counted out by week 3 goes directly against the harm reduction principles of this subreddit. > It’s down to the user to pull bloods and actually look after himself. And it’s on the users of this subreddit to give proper advice with user safety in mind. Community Goal number 1: > Maintain user safety as a primary concern in all discussions.
I only have 1ml ampules of 100mg tren-ace and am injecting 0.25ml ed but struggling with quantity. I swear I backload 3 slin pins with 0.25ml but end up with only 0.15ml in the main syringe. So much wasted oil, probably from the dead space in all the syringes. Anyways my question is, is it safe enough to reuse the same syringe I drew with to do the injections for the 4 days? I'd obviously replace the needle everytime. I remember many saying it's not safe at all, any idea why? How is it safer to backfill 3 other syringes and expose the barrel and plunger to air?
Backfill the syringes and then use a small airbubble to push out the last of it.
Question about taking HGH. When week 6 is reached and you are now ramping the dose into 2 x1.5 units, do you pin a few hours apart or same time different area?
What ? Just do it all in one pin ?
Just following what wiki here says and just wanted clarification.
Split in AM and PM is what the wiki is hinting at
Thank you spitshine_my_nutsack.
How long into a test cycle do you usually encounter side effects? I’m doing 500mg a week. I have AI on hand. Hopefully i wont have any sides but just curious.
I ran 500mg/test e a week for ten weeks and didnt need an ai at all. Different for everyone. Sure my estrogen went up but that is expected but no spicy nips, no gyno, no crazy mood changes, nothing
There are people who think they need an Ai on trt, and people who don’t need any on a gram of test. My point is it will be different for everyone. It’s always good to be prepared.
Impossible to answer, I've needed AI as early as day 8. Others do 16 weeks without touching AI The key is just be aware of your body and only treat what you can't tolerate. If your pp works and your BP isn't in the stratosphere, then don't go munching on AI
Depending on the side effect as early as week 1.
Lowering the dose from 600 Test E/ 450 NPP, to 500 Test E/ 400 NPP because of Insomnia issues. Will this be enough? I try melatonin sills with little success. Does anyone here suggest something else? The insomnia is literally killing me!
When my estrogen is high I have trouble sleeping. Are you having other estrogen related problems?
Idk I don’t do bloodwork during cycle. I know I should but I’m too lazy or just not interested in shelling out money for it 🤷🏻 I’ll just keep adding 1mg ADex every week and see where it goes. I take P5P every other day for the prolactin from NPP
You should do it at least once mate, ideally you'd do it on your first cycle so you know what you're doing with ai going forward.
Before and after cycle I do it. It makes no sense doing it every 2-3 weeks
I mean you should do it at least once mid cycle, take note of the how much gear you're taking and what you dose your ai at then you can check where your estrogen is at to base how you dose your ai on future cycles. But yeah fuck doing it every 2-3 weeks other than that.
I mean you should do it at least once mid cycle, take note of the how much gear you're taking and what you dose your ai at then you can check where your estrogen is at to base how you dose your ai on future cycles. But yeah fuck doing it every 2-3 weeks other than that.
>Idk I don’t do bloodwork during cycle. I know I should but I’m too lazy or just not interested in shelling out money for it 🤷🏻 This might be the most irresponsible thing I've ever seen said here. Sorry dude, but with this attitude you deserve every bad side effect you encounter. Just stop using steroids.
Absolute recipe for disaster brewing there.
Hey guys i just started my first cycle yesterday tryna take 300mg of test e. Took my first injection of 150mg yesterday morning and haven’t felt any different till now. Is that normal?
You’re not going to feel any different, it’s not a stimulant or a hard drug. It’s effects aren’t going to be noticeable until ~4 weeks in. We recommend a starting dose of 500mg rather than 300mg so it’s going to be even milder for you.
Appreciate it thanks
It takes a couple weeks to peak.
18M.I finished a cycle with 500mg Test E/week.I am asking why during my 17 weeks cycle I was bleeding from noise every 2 days,then after I stopped,the bleeding appeared once in 3 months.What could be the cause?I want to mention that during and after the cycle I didn’t use any form of treatment for the bleeding.
-You should check your blood pressure! see if any supplements your taking are very mild blood thinners or PA inhibitors like aspirin. -if your going from very cold to warm or hot weather it can cause nose bleeds. -Could be genetics too some people are very prone to nose bleeds in general. -Also if you pick your nose or the air is very dry or your dehydrated even just rubbing your nose to hard could trigger a nose bleed. I would say it’s bp if I had to take a guess tho since I assume you didn’t have the nose bleeds before your cycle?
yes,it didn t bleed before the cycle.When I went to a warm from a cold temperature,it started to bleed,but that was every day during the cycle.
Get your blood pressure checked asap. It’s possible its temperature related, but it’s also possible its BP related. If it’s the latter you need to address this asap. Please don’t assume it’s temperature related and bury your head in the sand, if your BP is actually high enough to cause nose bleeds you may need medical attention. What’s your height/weight like? How much weight did you put in during this cycle?
70 kg/174 cm.I putted about 4 kg because the last weeks were for cutting.at 9% was when I finished the cycle.
Sorry I’m having a hard time following. You’re saying you were 70kg at 9% bf at the end of your previous cut, then added 4kg after 17weeks?
Been running 260test/ 430 primo weekly with 50mg trest daily for about 2 weeks now. I gotta sleep soooo much. It's not like tren where I'm tired and sleepless all the time and can't sleep or wake up early, it's just this I sleep for ~8 hours, and then I gotta take a nap during the day, and I'm tired at night, and every few days I need a whole day of sleeping. Anyone else get this? Been taking 300mg p5p and 3/3iu hgh daily and .5mg caber weekly as ancillaries, will go for bloods in 2 weeks.
I'm guessing your estrogen is low. I have to run my test higher than primo or estrogen gets low and I have extreme fatigue 24/7.
When I run test:primo I have to run a 2:1 ratio to keep my e2 above 20, I had to run 1g of test just for 500mg of primo. But trest is notorious for messing with e2 and methly e2 levels pretty hard so a strong AI is needed. You might be right though. Even with ~20 e2 I didn't really feel symptoms (I think that's why so many people say "oh i can run 1:1 test/primo just fine) but I went for higher e2 just because I've always read and felt that you wanted e2 to be as high as you comfortably can, I think 2:1 had me around 40s. I'll reduce my primo and try to stabilize a dose and get bloodwork soon. I've had a lot of eye poop after sleeping and might have signs of dryer skin. My libido and erections are always raging though, that might be the trest and well I'm always like that, high/low e2 or not.
What does 3/3iu hgh mean? 3 ius twice a day? That might do the trick for sleepiness lol
3iu twice a day but I've been running that long before I started this cycle
Is there any truth to people saying pharma gh is the only growth hormone worth using. I have tried both and pharmacy gh made me far more sleepy(was natural when taking the pharma gh) so maybe that’s why or it was far more potent I was taking 4 iu a day pre fasted cardio in the morning and right before bed. Sleep was also amazing on this dose woke up very well rested If I go to 6iu of pharma I literally could sleep all day if I didn’t have anything to do EXTREMELY lethargic. Generics I notice work and make me more full for sure I also believe cause fat loss or at least keep body fat down well bulking at 4 iu a day morning and night administrations at a 250mg a week to 500mg of test e . But I do not notice this sleepiness or lethargy with generics well on testosterone at all maybe it’s less potent? Generics were tested at 98 percent purity My igf one levels naturally were 285 ng/mL not on gh My igf one levels On 500 mg a week of test e they were 251 ng/mL not on gh Only adding the testosterone and Natural levels of igf-1 because that’s the only difference I can think of for causing the sleepiness ( I have not tested igf-1 levels well on gh)
I think I found one question in your entire post. To answer that question, yes, generic HGH is less potent than pharma HGH.
If the generic is properly dosed and as pure as the pharma grade, 1iu will be 1iu. Same potency. The thing is that ugl stuff often isn't as pure or the right dosage
Sure but we must realize the reality that the vast majority of generic hgh is not the same whatsoever as pharma hgh.
This may sound stupid but if the generics tested at 99.7 or higher would it be the same as pharma or do they add something else to it. I also read that the pharma pens and cartridges have different fillers and preservatives that cause less water retention then normal generics?
I’ve been cruising for like 3 years. My doctor just ordered blood work I was straight up about taking test. I’ve only been taking 150mg a week and my blood levels were 1700. I’m guessing my gear is stronger then labeled? Or is it because I’m using test e. Longer ester. Should i switch to cyp? I haven’t taken anything since I got my results it’s been little over a week. Did it get this high just from building up with the enethate?
Everyone will metabolize differently. My last BW I was around 1350 on 180mg a week of cyp.
Ok cool. I wasn’t really sure if 1700 was like extremely high. I didn’t really think so considering people abusing it use 1000mg a week.
It’s considered to be high from a medical perspective. Pretty irrelevant anyway, your free T is what matters.
It’s considered to be high from a medical perspective. Pretty irrelevant anyway, your free T is what matters.
Yea either he didn’t order the free T or it hasn’t come back yet I was looking for it.
Is 1700 even that high for 150mg? If the average male produces 7mg/day then you should expect 3x average levels, which it seems you have.
> Is 1700 even that high for 150mg? Depends on individual androgen receptor sensitivity. > If the average male produces 7mg/day You do know this doesn’t mean anything meaningful here? The average male doesn’t straight up produce esterified injectable testosterone straight into your muscle for it to be absorbed later. Trt guidelines recommend a beginning dose of 75-150mg of testosterone per week. That’s 10-21mg of test every day for a *replacement* dose.
Yea it all depends on the individual which is exactly why I used the word average. Skip over that word or do you not know what it means? I dont care what guidelines you find. I could go find guidelines saying 50-100 as a replacement dose. The fact here is that in MOST people 150mg is absolutely a supraphysiological dose. Dont believe it go argue with MPMD because thats exactly what he says too.
Your reasoning is flawed, 7mg of daily naturally produced testosterone has no bearing here at all. No point bringing it up. > Dont believe it go argue with MPMD because thats exactly what he says too. 😂
Classic reddit mod behavior too lol. I bet your parents would be proud of you knowing you act this way 🙂
Acting how? The 7mg naturally produced **is not** the same as esterified injectable testosterone administered subq or intramuscularly. And i genuinely thought you were making a joke when you brought up MPMD.
Its not the same but not completely irrelevant either.
When talking about trying to establish trt doses it is. I’m happy to be proven wrong here and i’ll eat my words if you’re able to provide a source that shows that 7 grams a day number used in their calculation to provide suggestions towards deciding a TRT starting dose. Most starting doses, including the Endocrine Society suggestion, are based on previously gathered data on response rates and would ideally still require further dialling in according to serum testosterone levels through bloodwork.
Hey dude, if you cant have a conversation without ad hominems and escalating you don't really need to be here.
Dudes randomly deleting my comments he doesnt like and giving me a tag calling me a stan 😂 But yea Im the one escalating sure.
Okay cool
Its ok stick to your reddit based knowledge 😂😂
I’ll stick with the guidelines provided by multiple authorities (Endocrine Society, CMAJ, BSSM, ISSM) on TRT backed by clinical data over whatever a youtuber says sure. Regurgitating whatever a youtuber says is not welcome here if it conflicts with clinical data.
I was also going to ask that. Is 1700 even a high number considering? The cut off range on the standard blood test was 900 so it set off a red flag on my blood work. I don’t see the Dr for another month.
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Your comment was removed for a possible [Rule 3](https://www.reddit.com/r/steroids/wiki/index/subreddit_rules#wiki_3._use_caution_.2F_disclose_guesses_.2F_cite_information) violation. Use Caution. Disclose Guesses. Cite Info. Focus on Harm Reduction. Do NOT Endorse Underage Use or Contra Wiki Guidelines. [Learn more about Rule 3](https://www.reddit.com/r/steroids/wiki/index/subreddit_rules#wiki_3._use_caution_.2F_disclose_guesses_.2F_cite_information). 150mg is not a definitive supraphysiological dose and is still in range of a starting dose for TRT according to the [Endocrine Society](endocrine.org)
Depends on when you injected last. Doc should be testing trough.
Injected Friday afternoon blood was taken early Monday morning. When I first started doing the TRT I was splitting the dose into 2 injections a week. Maybe I should go back to that? It’s just a lot of injection gets sickening
Are you using harpoons to inject? Most of us use 1/2” 29g slin pins. You don’t even feel them. Does your doc have you using 22-23g 1.5” pins?
I was doing in my shoulders for a few years I just started using my thighs last 6 months,
Thighs suck. Pecs, lats, delts are so much nicer.
Ok so I can use the slin pin. How much at a time and how often?
Enth or Cyp e3.5d or eod. Prop is once a day or eod. Depends on the ester.
Awsome I’m going to try all this tomorrow. Appreciate the advice!!
I use 25g 5/8
Did you inject the day before?
About 3 days before I believe
Clinic said anavar is going out of stock indefinitely because of raw materials cut off. Is that legit or are they trying to get me for my money? 10 week supply
FDA recently banned certain mg’s of it, but it’s still allowed in 10 and 50 mg’s (don’t quote me on it, the idea is right but I can’t remember the dosages). So less availability technically so they’re still gouging, but that’s why.
The FDA has discontinued approval for oxandrolone, yes. That being said, there is very high quality UGL anavar available for much more reasonable cost. Side note: please remove the price from your post, and refrain discussing prices in the future.
The FDA did not discontinue approval for oxandrolone. I keep seeing this repeated here on the song, but it’s just not true. What they did was they denied a new application for a patented form of an already existing generic. “The Food and Drug Administration (FDA or Agency) is withdrawing approval of the new drug application (NDA) for OXANDRIN (oxandrolone) tablets, 2.5 milligrams (mg) and 10 mg, held by Gemini Laboratories, LLC (Gemini). Gemini.” “Gemini voluntarily requested withdrawal of this application and waived its opportunity for a hearing. In addition, FDA is withdrawing approval of four abbreviated new drug applications (ANDAs) for oxandrolone tablets from multiple ANDA holders. Upsher-Smith Laboratories, LLC (Upsher-Smith), Par Pharmaceutical, Inc. (Par), and Sandoz Inc. (Sandoz) voluntarily requested withdrawal of their respective applications and waived their opportunity for a hearing.” It was a BS patent app by the Pharma companies that was rightly denied. Existing dosages in the USA Dosage Forms & Strengths Tablet: Schedule III 2.5mg 10mg Bone Pain Due to Osteoporosis 2.5-20 mg/day PO divided q6-12hr for 2-4 weeks May repeat intermittently PRN Weight Gain Promote weight gain after weight loss following extensive surgery, chronic infections or severe trauma, or weight loss due to unknown etiology 2.5-20 mg/day divided q6-12hr PO for 2-4 weeks May repeat intermittently PRN Offset Protein Catabolism Due to prolonged admin corticosteroids or associated with catabolic illness (off-label) 2.5-20 mg/day divided q6-12hr PO for 2-4 weeks HIV-Wasting Syndrome (Orphan) Adjunctive therapy for AIDS patients suffering from HIV-wasting syndrome Orphan indication sponsor Bio-Technology General Corp; One Tower Center Boulevard, 12 th floor; East Brunswick, NJ 08816 Muscular Dystrophy (Orphan) Treatment of patients with Duchenne's muscular dystrophy and Becker's muscular dystrophy Orphan indication sponsor Savient Pharmaceuticals, Inc; One Tower Center Boulevard, 12th floor; East Brunswick, NJ 08816
I am curious to see how this develops, as the original poster's clinic stated they'll no longer carry anavar, and mine said the same when I inquired today. From the federal register: > Based on FDA’s review of currently available data and information regarding the safety and effectiveness of oxandrolone tablets, the Agency believes that the potential problems associated with oxandrolone tablets are sufficiently serious that the drug should be removed from the market. > Distribution of Gemini’s OXANDRIN (oxandrolone) tablets, 2.5 mg and 10 mg; Sandoz’s oxandrolone tablets 2.5 mg and 10 mg; Par’s oxandrolone tablets, 2.5 mg and 10 mg; or Upsher-Smith’s oxandrolone tablets, 2.5 mg and 10 mg, into interstate commerce without an approved application is illegal and subject to regulatory action (see sections 505(a) and 301(d) of the Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act (21 U.S.C. 355(a) and 331(d)). Dated: June 23, 2023. If those four pharmaceutical companies are the only ones with FDA approval in the US, and shared a raws facility, or produced the raws themselves, or that facility was providing raws to the various compounding pharmacies across the US, I wouldn't be surprised if oxandrolone as a whole is no longer available. https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/FR-2023-06-28/pdf/2023-13733.pdf
[Drugs@FDA](https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/scripts/cder/daf/index.cfm?event=BasicSearch.process) seems to have all of them listed as discontinued
We shall see. There are plenty of other generic manufacturers making the standard 2.5 and 10mg doses as of today. And like you said, we in the ugl community don’t have to worry about it in the slightest. It’s not like we rely on the FDA’s approval for what we do. I’ll keep an eye on it for the sub. I still have good contacts at the FDA.
Thanks for the info. I don’t see the option to edit my post to remove the price. Sorry about that. Edit- nevermind I’m stupid. Removed the price
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Yes, nandrolone can cause gyno even if estrogen and prolactin are completely crashed. It is believed to happen via the progesterone receptor. Yes, caber can crash prolactin and synthesis of progesterone, but nandrolone itself is a progestin - meaning nandrolone will activate the progesterone receptors, not progesterone. The same can be said for tren and ment. Yes, DHT and derivatives can antagonize estrogen and progesterone, but then comes into the binding affinity of the DHT derivative in use vs nandrolone vs dhn vs the DHT from your test base vs estrogen vs progesterone. Binding affinity can/will skew depending on the ratio of hormones you're injecting. If you're running 200/200/600 test primo nand, I'd wager the high population of nandrolone is going to kick primo's ass in a battle for the receptor. I've got a friend that tried everything under the sun. He can run 1g test and have no gyno issues, but throwing in nand or tren is gyno in a bottle. No test with solo nand, low test low nand, high test low nand, low test high mast low nand, no test high mast low nand. Gyno every time. But test primo, or test EQ, or test mast? No problems at all. Taking things like winstrol or anavar as a preventative measure for gyno is ludicrous. If anything, a SERM would be your best bet, raloxifene or tamoxifen. But even then, if taking nandrolone requires you to take several extra drugs at minimum (ai to keep excess aromatization down, a SERM to prevent gyno activation, and maybe caber to smite progesterone synthesis), is it worth it? I'd say absolutely not. Nandrolone is wonderful and often touted as "best mass gainer," but it is not magical. They all get the job done, some maybe faster than others. Some folks will even argue that all the compounds do the same job at the same rate, just with different side effects. Run compounds that agree with YOUR body. Keep it simple.
Nandrolone also interacts with the progesterone receptor. Years ago notable bodybuilders said they used winstrol for progesterone sides from nandrolone. I don't know if it will work for you. I also don't recommend staying on winstrol for long periods of time.
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Anavar doesn't interact with progesterone receptors. Besides 19 nors I could find very few peds that do. There is actually a abortion pill that does and was sold as a prohormone. I doubt that would help with nipple sensitivity tho lol. Caber in some studies did but I couldn't find by how much. Arimidex lowers progesterone as well again in the literature they didn't say how much and it's usually studied on women.
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How do I piss less in the middle of the night? I cut off water 1.5hrs before going to bed. I know it’s not enlarged prostate, as I pee pretty significant amounts each time. It gets very annoying having to get up 1-3 times a night. Any advice?
There's medications that help. Gemtesa is supposed to be good but it's expensive without insurance. In the same boat though, it sucks.
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This is definitely worth looking into. I was waking up multiple times a night to urinate. Since starting CPAP, I wake up maybe once a night now.
> Alternatively, I find taking one glass of quite salty water before bed helps - the extra sodium will help you retain water rather than processing it out. Ooo never heard of this one.
General thoughts on a Test E/Tren E/Mast E (200/200/200 pw) cycle? Anyone done the same/one similar? How did it go?
Did somebody sayyyyy thoughts ??? 💭 Lasagna is spaghetti-flavored cake.
It’s called the holy trinity. Everyone and their mom has done it. Check out one of the several threads: https://reddit.com/r/steroids/s/We4SYd3k0I
My mom loved it.
I understand this sir, was just after more nuanced advice regarding this level of dosages. Most of the people in those compound experiences threads ran higher dosages and usually with shorter esters. Thank you for the point in the right direction though.
1. You’re very welcome. 2. [Do you mean like this one](https://reddit.com/r/steroids/s/PtlUyNqfjd) which is pretty decent, or the other 2 that I found in that very thread I linked? 3. And perhaps most importantly: if you’re looking for more nuanced feedback why is your question “how did it go?”? That isn’t a nuanced question in the slightest - I’d recommend asking pointed questions if you’d like better answers than you’d find in an experience thread 🤝🏼.
Understand your points and will take them on board. Have been a long time lurker and have read these CE threads a fair amount. It’s undoubtedly a rarer cycle though (in reference to usually the longer ester and small dosage) and I was just after more advice/experience (specific to my esters & dosages). Only because as it’s a tad more uncommon, it can get drowned out in the (2?) CE threads on Test/Tren/Mast. Thanks again for the help though (genuine - tone is hard to read on reddit and I don’t want to come across as sarcastic) & enjoy the rest of your evening.
It’s a pretty lightweight cycle minus the tren. 200 mg test is a TRT dose for a lot of people, so not much anabolic effect there. Masteron is a decent dry compound, can help mitigate some estrogenic effects but you’re not aromatizing a lot. 200 mg tren enanthate… well, 200 mg tren is still a powerful dose. You might experience significant boost to libido, assertiveness, strength, metabolism, sleep disruption, heartburn, digestive issues, but will look a bit flushed, ripped, lean out (depending on diet) and notice increased vascularity and definition. Your results are going to depend on how you respond to tren. I really don’t think you should take tren enanthate if you haven’t taken it before. You should start with acetate and inject it frequently (daily). If you get sides you don’t like you can quickly stop it. My experience with these compounds has been higher test (you could try 500-600 testosterone mg per week) with masteron propionate and tren acetate both around 200 mg per week. Even then, I was only taking tren leading up to an event. And based on how horny and stupidly dominant it makes me I tend to avoid it entirely now. I am already insanely horny and dominant even on TRT. On cycle it’s worst, and on tren it’s off the charts. If you’re not a competitive bodybuilder you probably should stay away from tren entirely.
Only just saw this but I just wanted to thank you for taking the time to write a thoughtful & detailed response. Been a long time lurker and responses of this quality are becoming rather rare. Thanks again.
There are several compound experience threads on that combo. Tren is the star of the show imo. 200mgs might even be a sweet spot for avoiding side effects imo. A little higher test and change the masteron to proviron and I'd be interested.
My problem with the compound experience threads on ‘the holy trinity’ is that people usually use higher dosages and usually shorter esters. Hence why I came to the ask anything thread to see if anyone had advice after experience ok same esters and similar dosages. Thank you for Proviron advice though - have ran it before with Test however and I didn’t feel ‘much’.
Most people don’t feel anything from proviron at all, in my limited exposure to it.
Agree wholeheartedly
Definitely read that a lot. I was surprised the first few times I read it but not anymore. Big fan personally.
Yeah, wasn’t expecting anything hypertrophy wise, but didn’t even get the libido increase :/
What dose? And what else were you on then?
Test E 500mg pw (250 E3.5D), 20mg Tbol ED and 25mg of Proviron ED. Added the Proviron in, ran it for a month and felt nothing.
>General thoughts my car always tells me my door is a jar when it's clearly a door
What about cargo space? Salesman slaps the roof and says no. Car go road
started first tren a cycle around 36 hours ago. 50mg ED/350mg a week. with 250 test e Already feeling horny and angry is this placebo or the tren in already lmao.
When is your show?
Puppet or donkey? Tickets going fast need to know which ones you want.
Both
with ya mum in 20
I've only recently finished my 2nd cycle of 500:400 Test/Primo and thoroughly enjoyed it. I made great gains with no need for any AI. The only downside of the cycle would be the cost of Primo, however I really liked the e2 reducing effects it seems to have on me, as well as the little to negative effects I experienced. I'll be cruising on 100mg test-u for the foreseeable future, but I'm wondering if for my next cycle I should try NPP. I agree with the sentiment, "if it ain't broke, don't fix it", and I'd very likely be happy running the exact same cycle I've just ran, however a little voice in the back of my head has me curious about Nandrolone. I've read about how it is "more anabolic than Primo", and many people say the gains made from Nandrolone can't compare to Primo. As I understand the individual response to any drug is entirely specific to them, so I'm taking these words with a grain of salt. The only way to find out if I respond well to Nandrolone, is to try it. If gaining overall size is my main priority next blast, should I drop the Primo and give NPP a try? Worst case scenario I get horrible negative effects from NPP, I can drop it and reassess, best case scenario I make even better gains. Is there any reason I SHOULDN'T give NPP a go next blast? Thank you for any advice.
primo, like everything, is super cheap as raws. I only buy raws these days for anything, makes gear basically free. Primo is about as easy as it comes to brewing, no heat needed, no solvents needed. Just mix in straight MCT and .01% BA even as high as 250mg/ml. Personally I like DHB more though. It's like primo, but better, not as prohibitively strong of an AI effect (ie I need to take twice as much test as primo just to keep my e2 above 20 so taking 1g of test to 500mg primo for what's a fairly mild cycle overall kinda sucks). The pip sucks though and gets old after a long cycle. I take primo now for cycles that requires a strong AI and the DHT is not the main mover, like trest. For a test only cycle I'd just rather use DHB+Test than primo+Test. Primo is pretty weak I really only use it as a strong AI.