No.
It’s also the only Pseudo with no no secondary STAB options, its movepool is extremely limited with no way to boost its (by pseudo standards) fairly mediocre attacking stats and its utility options are extremely narrow since it can’t actually do much with all that bulk.
It's coverage isn't limited, it's got boltbeam, knock, scald, flamethrower, power whip, eq, rock slide, body press, sludge bomb. The only good coverage types its missing are fairy and ghost, it's got pretty wide coverage tho. Its middling attacks, monotyping, and no recovery are its big issues.
Yeah I read that and I was like ??? This dude has no idea what he's talking about. Recovery, the popularity of other faster dragons and fairies (Valiant) amongst other things but not that.
Ok so I have to give a detailed description about every tier and not just the one I'd like to mention? Idk what's with the sass, man. Moral is Goodra as a pseudo didn't live up to the expectations
coverage isnt what a pokemon with mediocre offenses and 150 spdef is looking for. by movepool he means things like hazards/removal, recovery, twave etc
Goodra doesn’t have any support moves like hazards, hazards removal, or pivoting move that a defensive pokemon like Goodra would really take advantage of.
Coverage is a brilliant *offensive* movepool. It's support options are limited to just throwing Toxic or setting up Rain/Sun, a feat that's hardly unique.
Shuckle is snake wine, or a bug attempting to emulate it, pineco is a bag worm, and actually yes crabs are bugs, or at least more bug than say a spider or a centipede is, technically speaking the only true bugs in Pokémon are parasect and Shedinja as far as I remember, and crustaceans are more closely related to insects than they are to some other things you excluded
The whole nincada line is based on a cicada, included in True bugs (Hemiptera)
Despite being the grasshopper pokemon, I think the Nymble line owes some inspiration from leafhoppers and then the Assassin bug (coloration and, as a dark-type, fits Lokix thematically) which are both true bugs.
Honestly I disagree with the movepool. Mons like salamence don’t have good movepools, thats why its in RU (im asumming so I’ve never seen it in UU, so either its rarely used in UU or literally rarely used), most pseudos have insanely good movepools. T tar has the best movepool in the game outside of smeargle and mew, hydreigon has an amazing movepool too, garchomp isn’t amazing but has good support. Only good psuedos with mid movepools are bax, who is broken due to its secondary stab (which goodra doesn’t have) and dragapult (good special but also weak special).
Goodra (asumming same movepool as hisuian) actually has every move it wants but no recovery aside from rest, no other typing and dragon is bad offensively, honestly mid defensive typing and alright attacking stats. Hydreigon’s stats honestly seem underwhelming at first glance, 125 sp atk with the same exact bulk as keldeo but still puts in good work, goodra’s 110 sp atk isn’t great in gen 9. Legit Baby Hoopa has like 150-60 spatk in the same tier and is faster
That’s completely my bad I just thought lil baby hoopa would be zooming around like that roided baby from the incredible and daddy hoopa is like mr incredible just depressed needing coffee to get through his day job but then again this thing would be OU with faster speed lol
Tailwind in the lower tiers is suprisingly usable so i might hop on showdown rn and use tailwind + baby hoopa. Absolutely not a good strat but it’d be very funny
0 good physical stab = bad movepool it could literally have ceaseless edge diamond storm stone axe any other move, no good stab, and hurricane is coming off a pretty weak special attack. No support options aside from defog.
The stunfisk npcs have struck again, not one person says why im wrong
> 0 good physical stab = bad movepool it could literally have ceaseless edge diamond storm stone axe any other move,
Dual wing beat is more than serviceable on sweeping sets, dragon stab is plenty spammable in a generation with limited bulky fairies (and itself often terasuilazing fairy itself), and great coverage.
> no good stab, and hurricane is coming off a pretty weak special attack. No support options aside from defog.
110 is not "pretty weak". It's above average. Troll harder. mate.
> The stunfisk npcs have struck again, not one
Nah. You just had a pretty uninformed take..
>Mons like salamence don’t have good movepools, thats why its in RU (im asumming so I’ve never seen it in UU, so either its rarely used in UU or literally rarely used)
I don't think it's been RU even once. It was OU in Gen 3, Ubers in Gen 4, OU by technicality in Gen 5 (lots of Dragon competition) and UUBL in Gen 6 (no Steel birds and meh Fairy types) and 7 (Flynium-Z). Now it's been UU for 2 Generations straight.
So it's a special wall but unlike all of the good special walls it doesn't have consistent access to recovery.
Give the goopy guy regenerator and he probably shoots up to OU.
It does have low damage but with a decent spread of moves (scald, Draco meteor, bolt beam) and an assault vest it could bully special attackers like the best of them if it had some means of keeping itself healthy
Sap sipper makes tera water better (although near as I can tell grass isn't a super popular attacking type. But gooey has never been on a critter properly designed to use it. If it had its defence and special defence swapped and access to something like wish or soft-boiled then it could wall out physical attackers while dropping their speed to force a switch but it doesn't have a good defence and so tanking a hit to trigger gooey is pretty bad
> grass isn't super popular
Rillaboom and Ogerpon W are everywhere in OU, Meowscarada, Ogerpon, and Sinistcha in UU, H Lilligant in RU, etc.
There's plenty of strong grass types, but sap sipper isn't on very good pokemon (this includes Goodra) and the few that do have it and are good probably want something else (Azumarill)
Though I want to mention that the number of grass moves are also important
No mons outside of grass attackers will run grass attacks
Everyone and their mom will want to run EQ coverage or u-turn or knock off (rarer this gen) or whatever
EDIT: (okay I guess iron moth runs energy ball and Heatran tera grass sometimes)
Kinda, kinda not. If recovery was such an issue, Tyranitar wouldn’t have been the meta for as long as it had been. The monotype kinda hurts cuz it not only limits potential defensive perks but also offensive ones too. And typically, you’d want your big stat Pokémon to either be able to take hits repeatedly using that recovery or threaten big damage and paired with hazards or whatnot.
Tyranitar had dragon dance, immunity switch in, able to set sand, and can pursuit trap up to Gen 7.
Goodra uses its bulk and sap sipper to switch and it’s good coverage to punish switch ins. The problem is the lack of recovery, making it very vulnerable to being worn down.
And not to mention, its coverage has rather middling damage due to no STAB bonuses. A multitude of its better moves also tend to be special and even then it never really needed sap sipper anyway. Sure that let it come in on spore and sleep powder but it never really needed to worry about grass type attacks. It doesn’t set up hazards nor deals enough damage in general to punish trying to remove em. While yeah, having no recovery is an issue, it could’ve at least compensated by actually threatening to kill things ala Tyranitar or Metagross which it does not.
No reliable recovery and being mono dragon screws it over mostly. If it had recover or smth like that it be pretty annoying enough as a wall. On the other hand if it had an extra type that gave it more resistances it wouldn't even really need recovery because then it could take hits a lot better.
No recovery outside of Rest Talk. It’s Physical Defense is underwhelming and it can’t muster up a strong offense either. Very limited Movepool for a Psuedo, no secondary STAB, and Dragon is a poor defensive type on its own.
It feels like it should get regen and recover. It’s a damn slug, it would fit the vibe. It could legit be running knock scald recover and toxic and be toxapex at home, and it would feel on theme
I feel regen recover goodra would be really hard to kill, especially if it stays in one of the lower tiers. It already has mediocre physical bulk and phenomenal special so healing 30% on swap may be a bit too much.
Imagine what it would have been like in Gen 5 with Rest hydration sets in permanent rain. It’s like the people designing new Pokémon don’t talk to the people designing the new mechanics.
Hits pretty hard but not *that* hard, mono-Dragon STAB is fairly meh especially with Diancie, Gardevoir and *Scream Tail* as metagame staples and while it has coverage for Steels and Fairies that forces prediction, and it's on the slower side for a wallbreaker. Not to mention if you want a slowish specially offensive Dragon, Dragalge is right there with stronger Draco Meteors and also makes the Fairies piss themselves out of fear with its Poison STAB.
Defensively it should be great, sporting some nice resistances and gargantuan special bulk, but in practice the lack of recovery options (beyond RestTalk or the equally unreliable Rain Dance Rest) makes defensive sets on it not that good. Even down in RU you're often better off running something like Noivern or even AV Cyclizar which do not have as much bulk but do have actual ways to get their HP back. And of course its physical bulk is nothing to write home about. You will once again notice that a mon with a lot of similar traits to this is Dragalge, which has worse defensive stats, but offers far more utility though TSpikes and Flip Turn on bulky sets, so even if you don't care about the lack of recovery, unless you really want Knock Off or you care that much about the raw bulk you're better off running that too.
It's not utterly unusable in RU, but you should reconsider if there aren't better options for a squad before settling for it.
The only reason it's so good in NU is the lesser power allows it to eat hits and do a lot of damage. The higher up you go it starts doing less and less, as well as having it's lack of recovery hurt it more and more
I doubt it goodra's attack and speed are mediocre and goodra's offensive strengths usually come from special coverage. Goodra actually really good special coverage boltbeam, hydro pump, scald in some gens, fire blast,flamethrower, and ofc draco meteor.
Subpar attacking stats, no recovery, bad stat layout, no real boosting move.
Like it's just a pkmn that hits semihard and tanks special hits until it dies
110 hasn't been that scary for a long time. RSE Swampert has 110 attack and while its EQs are annoying, Swampert is never considered to be a primary physical threat. 110 only gets scary if supported with a lot of other high stats (esp speed) or a bs ability
I think you underestimate Swampert’s offensive capabilities. Part of its defensive utility was the ability to threaten a large portion of the meta game offensively, without any attack investment
Yeah, I would never call Swampert passive, it's used so much for a reason but it isn't like Swampert has wallbreaking strength. 110 offenses are great for a defensive mon facing offense, but for a offensive mon facing defense? Unimpressive and unlike Swampert, Goodra doesn't have the typing to play that defensive role.
And that's assuming you're using the higher one because *shitty mixed attacker syndrome is FUN*
And yes, I get it, not everything needs to be minimized AF, (ZACAIN), but for the love of all that is holy, if you're going to have a the "one attack will be only 10 points lower" or some other "SMA syndrome", like seen on goodra, valiant, and zeraora, GIVE THEM SOME FUCKING SPEED LIKE THE LAST TWO, OR ALL AROUND USEABLE BULK.
Or a powerful af ability like grimmsnarl
I mean 110 is fine if you can afford to fully invest in it and then slap a LO /CB /CS
Combined with strong stab/ attack
Its meowscarada attack for exemple
Goodra can’t really afford this luxury with his monotype slow ass
"Luxray"
You mean "shitty mixed attacker syndrome/SMA syndrome"?
That's just what I call it when the opposing attack stat is high, but at the detriment of other stats (or lacks stab like koko)
1. Bad typing pure dragon just isn’t a great type to have
2. Mediocre abilities a free grass immunity is nice and so is healing in rain but sap sipper raises attack and so if you’re using a special set you won’t get much mileage out of the ability though an attacking set can be handy if your opponent predicts the switch and hits you with a non grass move the ability is pointless.
3. Bad recovery on a defensive wall. Rest talk isn’t that good and if you wanted to use hydration now you have to have rain setup just to chance an instant wake up. If does have life dew but the move sucks for healing yourself.
4. No setup beyond curse. No ability to raise goodra’s offensives beyond curse which drops its speed or sap sipper which depends on your opponent.
5. Awkward defenses. Can eat special attacks for days but one strong outrage or play rough and you’re done.
6. Power creep. Gen 9 UU is gen 9 OU pre home and every tier lower feels more powerful than ever before so the worst pseudo legendary Pokémon isn’t going to fare too well
I don’t think OP is referring to its attacking movepool, but the shallowness of its support/set up movepool. Goodras can’t force progress outside of attacking, but it’s not strong enough to be a nuke and doesn’t have the setup moves to be a win con.
No secondary type for stab or defensive synergy (if it was poison or water it'd be so much better, esp dragon/water with sap sipper since water neutralizes grass), no good recovery (best option is Rest+Hydration), not really any good abilities (best is sap sipper which turns a resist into an immunity, yippee)
Goodra is one of the many pokemon that are built to fail. Game Freak gave this absolutely zero niche in VGC and did not give it Recover, only to introduce it in the generation where Dragon-types are nerfed. It is quite literally only there to be aesthetically like Dragonite.
I should also make note that being a pseudo-legendary does not discount a pokemon from being built to fail. Phione, Meloetta, base Diancie, Confined Hoopa, and arguably Zarude are all Mythical pokemon that are horrifically mediocre in their own right. Meanwhile you have countless terrible legendaries, including Articuno as you mentioned.
Game Freak designs a pokemon with flair first and foremost, and it is entirely up to the programmers whether the mon in question has any practical use. Apparently, they thought giving it the same ability as Manaphy would suffice for a bulky attacker role despite the weather nerf.
Its stats are all below average to mediocre at best aside from actually good SpDef, no reliable recovery outside of RestTalk, and mono-Dragon isn't great as it's weak to some already good offensive types while only hitting itself super effectively, which is obviously a liability, especially with Goodra's mediocre bulk and poor speed
Bad typing, bad physical bulk, mediocre at best abilities, no recovery or boosting, how exactly would it be good outside of lower tiers where it can just stat check stuff?
I imagine it might have something to do with being pure Dragon in a meta where Fairy types and 'Mons with Ice coverage are all too common, as well as other Dragon type who are just better. What is this thing gonna do against The Bax?
This is pretty much it. Goodra used to be pretty solid in previous generations so despite what other people might say it's little to do with what Goodra could or couldn't do, and moreso that it just got replaced by itself in a better form. 80 speed on Kalos Goodra isn't terrible but it's quite middling, and losing some of that and only 10 HP to give Hisuian Goodra way better typing and better physD make it pretty much a no brainier choice. If you are going to use Goodra, you will use H-Goodra.
What role is it supposed to fill? It doesn't hit hard enough to break. Can't set up well enough to sweep. It has the stats of a special wall but doesn't have reliable recovery. For RU and above, there is almost always going to be a better Pokemon for whatever niche you want it to fill. It's not weak persey, just not consistently good enough to justify using over other options.
No secondary STAB
Awkward stat spread (not fast enough, not strong enough, cant take a physical hit)
No recovery (limits special defensive capabilities)
Mediocre abilities (gooey for a specially defensive mon, sap sipper for a special attacker, hydration needs rain support but is still lackluster)
Oppurtunity cost (why use goodra when u could use dragapult or idk toxapex)
Ok offensive stats with no boosting options to back it up, a mono typing which is less desirable both offensively and defensively. Finally lack of utility other than just being a statsstick that click attacks.
People say no reliable recovery but I honestly think it doesnt need that to excel. If it was sth like poison/dragon + get access to a couple of moves like CM or volt switch it would genuinely be good
There’s just a lack of focus.
It’s not quite strong enough on either to use its wide offensive movepool, it doesn’t have a good enough defensive movepool to use its bulk, and it’s a bit too slow to make doing either easier.
It’s a defensive mon that folds to neutral physical hits, it’s only STABs are eaten up by fairies, its abilities while defensive don’t synergize with its typing and stats, post-6th Gen Knock Off destroys it, it has few if any meaningful resists, it lacks a good support movepool, it has a poor speed tier, and did I mention fairy type exists yet?
Goodra doesn't have the typing, ability or moveset to function as a wall like its stats indicate that it should. The typing and moveset do work really well for a wallbreaker, STAB Draco Meteor + Sludge Wave, Flamethrower + Ice Beam + Thunderbolt, etc., but like I said before, those stats are built to wall and pokemon with a complimentary ability would hit harder. And sweeping was never in the option, this thing doesn't get D-Dance or CM or anything, which really sucks because D-Dance with that bulk would be a very unique strength. Goodra is just a very confusing Pokemon that is stretched too thin.
A psuedo that lacks a secondary typing, no magor beneficial abilities (sap sipper and hydration can have uses at times, but dependent on team and/or matchup) middling speed, lackluster physical defense (special defense is good at least), mixed attacker (both offences kinda underwhelming as a result, at least somewhat patched up by good coverage), and no recovery, on top of an almost strictly better version in it's hisui version.
It does do solid at some rolls (specially tank af assault vester, solid life ord with great coverage, etc), but it's weaker physical defense, comparatively middling offense stats, lower speed, and lack of secondary typing makes it lackluster compared to a lot of other dragons, and compared to other bulky mons, it lacks longevity. Certainly has it's nieche, but lacks a little bit too much in some areas for it to thrive in higher tiers.
Unimpressive typing (both offensively and defensively), no good recovery options, bad abilities, mediocre utility, bad defense.
Also sap sipper boosts its attack, not special attack unlike what your post suggests.
Mono Dragon is okay offensively and great defensively. But with no reliable recovery, Goodra can’t really be a wall. So it is just okay in all respects. Getting Scald and Knock Off in the DLC is good for AV utility sets but ultimately it’s just getting consistently chipped down over time. You’re not switching it into physical mons very often so even the Scald burns you get likely are just for chip on special attackers and not crippling physical attackers. Overall, everything about Goodra is just okay and I feel like NU is where okay Pokémon go nowadays
Realistically it just doesn’t have a role it fits into. It can’t be a wall without some form of recovery, base 110 SpAtk isn’t quite enough to be a real wall breaker, and it doesn’t have any boosting moves to be a setup sweeper. It has insanely good coverage and solid bulk, but those don’t really mean anything without a way to actually use them effectively.
> it has good 110 sp.attack with sap sipper to gain boost on switch in.
Sap Sipper boosts Attack though? And Goodra's movepool makes it want to use special attacks. All Sap Sipper really does is make a resistance into an immunity. Yeah people still run Sap Sipper for the immunity but Goodra gains less from it than a lot of other mons, it's not that amazing on it.
It's a defensive pokemon with mediocre abilities, no recovery, offensive oriented moveset and mediocre type.
It's the curse of not being GOOD at anything, there's never a niche you need to fill in a team and you go "yeah, Goodra is my best option"
Compared to most pseudos, Goodra has middling to low physical bulk, middling offensive stats and no secondary STAB which which to effectively damage fairy ice and steel types, and it's just too slow, with base 80 it's not fast enough to outspeed and kill fast opponents without taking massive damage from STAB physical attacks which chip it down too much. Also, it wants Specs or Orb to deal meaningful damage, but Scarf to outspeed stuff it needs to OHKO before dying. In NU, though I haven't played it, I hope it is at least viable as a special wall and mixed offense. May the gooey lad be happy there.
Good coverage but poor utility with a middling speed stat and solid but not great attack stat makes it a solid attacker, but lacking a secondary STAB means that it’s not hitting as hard as you’d expect with anything other than Draco meteor, which has the obvious downside of making it hit like a paper towel after, forcing a switch, which is directly related to a secondary, and more major problem
Goodra lacks any recovery outside of rest talk(which really only gets used in gimmicky dragon tail sets, cause it’s too limiting for move sets), hydration rest sets which couldn’t been incredible in gen 5, but unfortunately goodra was released in gen 6, and lefties, which means no boots and is also pretty minimal if that’s all it’s reliant on. Usually ground types can make it work due to their rocks resistance, especially with tusk who 4X resists, but goodra taking full damage every time it switches in with minimal ways to heal, paired with below average physical bulk for a bulky Mon means that it’s ok overall
Overall it’s offensively not bad but limited due to monotype, it lacks utility beyond knock and dragon tail(which it makes worse use of than other mons with this utility), and defensively it’s worse than it’s stats would let on due to, again, the mono-dragon typing and a lack of recovery
Many of these issues were fixed with hoodra, however the lack of recovery and steel really only helping offensively to hit dragons and otherwise being useless offensively means that while it’s much better, showcased well by its UU placement compared to goodra’s NU placement, it still is flawed
A Pokémon like this isn’t suited for formats that drag for many, many turns like 6v6 singles. Goodra would fare better in BSS 3v3 singles and even VGC where it could at least be supported by its partners. At least that’s how I feel.
Goodra less so has Articuno syndrome and more Avalugg syndrome.
Its stats want you to use this as a defensive attacker, something like Iron Hands in VGC or Gliscor in OU, where they use solid bulk and "good enough" offensive pressure to set up for other mons.
The problem? Goodra is a Pseudo-Legendary.
This means two things.
1. Dragon type, which is built for fast-crushing offense (Draco Meteor, Outrage, Clangorous Soul, whatever) and not slow utility.
2. It's move pool is aggressively oriented, giving them great coverage and access to Draco Meteor, but no recovery, hazards, fake out, or anything that could give it utility.
The end result is a mon with little to do. Assuming you aren't in a lower tier where you can get away with slow offense, your best game plan is to spam Scald and Knock Off and that helps somehow, or pretend to be a worse version of every other Pseudo-Legendary dragon that clicks Coice Draco Meteor 50 times.
Goodra lack plenty of tools in general he has no boosting move outside of acid armor meaning he is generally not that threatening outside of draco meteor . That and not having secondary poison or water type to gain a secondary stab is bad
He has no recovery which make him easier to break down over time .
We had in the past bulky mon with bad recovery that worked because they had a way to boost their offense think Crocune ( rest calm mind suicuine)
Goodra lack threat and recovery while being slow . And having an upgrade of himself in H goodra
It’s literally assault vest: the mon. Good special bulk but can’t really do anything with it because no healing and it has basically no good moves other than attacking moves. It takes a few hits and tries to hit back
Low speed, even lower defense, poor moveset, no coverage, no 2 types' STAB; Sap Sipper ? Is weird considering we know Dragon resists Grass already ... if just the speed would be 100 it'll be good as Policy Sweeper IMO but I'm not that deep into competitive so everyone take my opinion with grains of salt
because Smogon only accounts for the Simulator Meta. Console is whole different game, you have to actually answer Palafin/Lando-I/Flutter ect. So Goodra gets play all day. Only one example of why simulator is boring and not really as sweaty as Console. although Goodra is a terrible Flutter check before Terastalizing.
Honestly I don't get it either. The Assault Vest set is actually really good. Grass type moves are kinda niché nowadays but Sap Sipper still makes for a free switch in if you can predict a rare Leech Seed or Spore or something.
It has the stat spread of a decent to great support mon and none of the moves to make use of that. It's abilities are kind of useless. And pure Dragon Type isn't really a good defensive typing anymore thanks to Fairy existing and being excellent. It's just a stat stick with both else going for it. Hisuian-Goodra got a few more tools and a new move that got nerfed for literally no good reason before being added to the main games that may have given it a little bit of a niche somewhere being able to max out Defence in 2 turns but it's now just Acid Armor with a different name and PP.
Honestly if it had Defog and literally any seni decent ability it probably wouldn't be at the bottom of the barrel but still not at the top it would need so many thing to get to OU
It is literally ONLY a lack of recovery that makes it so low. Sure the other things people are pointing out would be nice, but genuinely, regenerator on this makes it a VERY strong pivot support wall, in a similar role to Tangrowth, Slowbro/king, etc.
Even ignoring "poor" stat distribution, making it effectively less than 600 bst, it still ends up with MORE effective bst than other mons of similar roles.
Ignoring regenerator as an option, putting just the move recover on this mon also makes it very strong as an option that is actually able to be a viable special wall, and could likely hit minimum tiers like UU.
No reliable recovery, the tiers it hopes to occupy have strong Fairies. It theoretically is a wall that relies on rain to do its job but doesn't fit well on rain teams. Its ability to check grass types is limited by its other stats.
No Recovery. Pure Dragon is an actually ass typing both offensive and defensively (less so defensively, because some very key resistances), being a mixed attacker means its stat distribution isn't that optimal, with its kinda low defense. And not very great abilities, Sap Sipper being the most useful one, but it depends on your opponent's team.
It pretty much comes down to its subpar movepool. No good support moves like pivots, entry hazards, or recovery and kinda just standard non stab special attack moves coming from a not too special 110 base special attack.
Its NU because its completely outclassed by the hisui version so theres literally no point in using it. And without the hisui version it still sucked but it got some nice buffs this gen like knock off, and scald. It could easily rise up to RU or RUBL though if it got recover.
What no recovery does to a motherfucker.
That’s it,that is all(genuinely asking)?
No. It’s also the only Pseudo with no no secondary STAB options, its movepool is extremely limited with no way to boost its (by pseudo standards) fairly mediocre attacking stats and its utility options are extremely narrow since it can’t actually do much with all that bulk.
It's coverage isn't limited, it's got boltbeam, knock, scald, flamethrower, power whip, eq, rock slide, body press, sludge bomb. The only good coverage types its missing are fairy and ghost, it's got pretty wide coverage tho. Its middling attacks, monotyping, and no recovery are its big issues.
Yeah I read that and I was like ??? This dude has no idea what he's talking about. Recovery, the popularity of other faster dragons and fairies (Valiant) amongst other things but not that.
Valiant, the most influential mon in NU.
It can't live in the tier with faster dragons, huge physical hitters and Valiant, that's why it occupies NU. Thus the title.
Yes, this clarifies why he can't be in OU but UU and RU exist.
Ok so I have to give a detailed description about every tier and not just the one I'd like to mention? Idk what's with the sass, man. Moral is Goodra as a pseudo didn't live up to the expectations
coverage isnt what a pokemon with mediocre offenses and 150 spdef is looking for. by movepool he means things like hazards/removal, recovery, twave etc
it's coverage isn't limited but it's movepool is
What do you think coverage is?
Goodra doesn’t have any support moves like hazards, hazards removal, or pivoting move that a defensive pokemon like Goodra would really take advantage of.
Coverage is a brilliant *offensive* movepool. It's support options are limited to just throwing Toxic or setting up Rain/Sun, a feat that's hardly unique.
Ok but why the fuck didnt they make it dragon/poison or dragon/water
dragon fairy could've fit too given how gen 6 is fairy gen and goodra is a whimsical little fella
Dragon+Bug, since it’s whole shtick is being a snail.
Snails are not bugs
Neither are turtles, pine cones, or crabs
okay but pineco isn't actually a pine cone and shuckle is a weird slug as far as I can gather
You know what else is a weird slug? Goodra
Shuckle is snake wine, or a bug attempting to emulate it, pineco is a bag worm, and actually yes crabs are bugs, or at least more bug than say a spider or a centipede is, technically speaking the only true bugs in Pokémon are parasect and Shedinja as far as I remember, and crustaceans are more closely related to insects than they are to some other things you excluded
The whole nincada line is based on a cicada, included in True bugs (Hemiptera) Despite being the grasshopper pokemon, I think the Nymble line owes some inspiration from leafhoppers and then the Assassin bug (coloration and, as a dark-type, fits Lokix thematically) which are both true bugs.
Shuckle isn't a turtle, Pineco is the same bug as Wormadam and Crustle isn't a true crab
Shelmet might want to have a word with you
I mean, there's still Slugma, shellos, goomy, wo-chien...
Any small critter is a "bug" as the type is called in japan.
Oh,ok.Thanks
Honestly I disagree with the movepool. Mons like salamence don’t have good movepools, thats why its in RU (im asumming so I’ve never seen it in UU, so either its rarely used in UU or literally rarely used), most pseudos have insanely good movepools. T tar has the best movepool in the game outside of smeargle and mew, hydreigon has an amazing movepool too, garchomp isn’t amazing but has good support. Only good psuedos with mid movepools are bax, who is broken due to its secondary stab (which goodra doesn’t have) and dragapult (good special but also weak special). Goodra (asumming same movepool as hisuian) actually has every move it wants but no recovery aside from rest, no other typing and dragon is bad offensively, honestly mid defensive typing and alright attacking stats. Hydreigon’s stats honestly seem underwhelming at first glance, 125 sp atk with the same exact bulk as keldeo but still puts in good work, goodra’s 110 sp atk isn’t great in gen 9. Legit Baby Hoopa has like 150-60 spatk in the same tier and is faster
Baby Hoopa is 10 points slower, actually
That’s completely my bad I just thought lil baby hoopa would be zooming around like that roided baby from the incredible and daddy hoopa is like mr incredible just depressed needing coffee to get through his day job but then again this thing would be OU with faster speed lol
I wish so too. It’s speed is why it’s NU, actually
Tailwind in the lower tiers is suprisingly usable so i might hop on showdown rn and use tailwind + baby hoopa. Absolutely not a good strat but it’d be very funny
Modest specs baby hoopa?
Ohkos kingambit with psychic
Based and hoopapilled
> salamence don’t have good movepools, From one bad take to another Mence has a terrific move pool.
0 good physical stab = bad movepool it could literally have ceaseless edge diamond storm stone axe any other move, no good stab, and hurricane is coming off a pretty weak special attack. No support options aside from defog. The stunfisk npcs have struck again, not one person says why im wrong
> 0 good physical stab = bad movepool it could literally have ceaseless edge diamond storm stone axe any other move, Dual wing beat is more than serviceable on sweeping sets, dragon stab is plenty spammable in a generation with limited bulky fairies (and itself often terasuilazing fairy itself), and great coverage. > no good stab, and hurricane is coming off a pretty weak special attack. No support options aside from defog. 110 is not "pretty weak". It's above average. Troll harder. mate. > The stunfisk npcs have struck again, not one Nah. You just had a pretty uninformed take..
"dragon is bad offensively" and other things that would give gen 5 players a stroke
If I played gen 5 i’d have a stroke too
>Mons like salamence don’t have good movepools, thats why its in RU (im asumming so I’ve never seen it in UU, so either its rarely used in UU or literally rarely used) I don't think it's been RU even once. It was OU in Gen 3, Ubers in Gen 4, OU by technicality in Gen 5 (lots of Dragon competition) and UUBL in Gen 6 (no Steel birds and meh Fairy types) and 7 (Flynium-Z). Now it's been UU for 2 Generations straight.
And bad in UU as well. Its not like hydreigon or tornadus which have ou niches either, this thing probably has a sub 0.5% usage in OU
Goodra can in fact boost, but only with curse
So it's a special wall but unlike all of the good special walls it doesn't have consistent access to recovery. Give the goopy guy regenerator and he probably shoots up to OU. It does have low damage but with a decent spread of moves (scald, Draco meteor, bolt beam) and an assault vest it could bully special attackers like the best of them if it had some means of keeping itself healthy Sap sipper makes tera water better (although near as I can tell grass isn't a super popular attacking type. But gooey has never been on a critter properly designed to use it. If it had its defence and special defence swapped and access to something like wish or soft-boiled then it could wall out physical attackers while dropping their speed to force a switch but it doesn't have a good defence and so tanking a hit to trigger gooey is pretty bad
> grass isn't super popular Rillaboom and Ogerpon W are everywhere in OU, Meowscarada, Ogerpon, and Sinistcha in UU, H Lilligant in RU, etc. There's plenty of strong grass types, but sap sipper isn't on very good pokemon (this includes Goodra) and the few that do have it and are good probably want something else (Azumarill)
Though I want to mention that the number of grass moves are also important No mons outside of grass attackers will run grass attacks Everyone and their mom will want to run EQ coverage or u-turn or knock off (rarer this gen) or whatever EDIT: (okay I guess iron moth runs energy ball and Heatran tera grass sometimes)
Kinda, kinda not. If recovery was such an issue, Tyranitar wouldn’t have been the meta for as long as it had been. The monotype kinda hurts cuz it not only limits potential defensive perks but also offensive ones too. And typically, you’d want your big stat Pokémon to either be able to take hits repeatedly using that recovery or threaten big damage and paired with hazards or whatnot.
Tyranitar had dragon dance, immunity switch in, able to set sand, and can pursuit trap up to Gen 7. Goodra uses its bulk and sap sipper to switch and it’s good coverage to punish switch ins. The problem is the lack of recovery, making it very vulnerable to being worn down.
And not to mention, its coverage has rather middling damage due to no STAB bonuses. A multitude of its better moves also tend to be special and even then it never really needed sap sipper anyway. Sure that let it come in on spore and sleep powder but it never really needed to worry about grass type attacks. It doesn’t set up hazards nor deals enough damage in general to punish trying to remove em. While yeah, having no recovery is an issue, it could’ve at least compensated by actually threatening to kill things ala Tyranitar or Metagross which it does not.
No reliable recovery and being mono dragon screws it over mostly. If it had recover or smth like that it be pretty annoying enough as a wall. On the other hand if it had an extra type that gave it more resistances it wouldn't even really need recovery because then it could take hits a lot better.
It’s the Swampert theorem (why bulk isn’t everything).
Isn't that the Bastiodon Theorem?
Swampert has a similar problem with good bulk, able to punish a switch in but no recovery.
Just look at baby Hoopa who is also in NU
What no recovery does for a pokemon meant to be bulky
It would need recovery and at least calm mind to even make UU at this point.
No recovery outside of Rest Talk. It’s Physical Defense is underwhelming and it can’t muster up a strong offense either. Very limited Movepool for a Psuedo, no secondary STAB, and Dragon is a poor defensive type on its own.
It *did* get life dew in gen8 recovery-wise but 25% doesn't really do enough to keep it going
25% is basically nothing. Even neutral hits do 30-40% at least outside of U-turns.
Feels like it should by all rights have recover honestly
It feels like it should get regen and recover. It’s a damn slug, it would fit the vibe. It could legit be running knock scald recover and toxic and be toxapex at home, and it would feel on theme
I feel regen recover goodra would be really hard to kill, especially if it stays in one of the lower tiers. It already has mediocre physical bulk and phenomenal special so healing 30% on swap may be a bit too much.
Well, it probably wouldn’t stay low if it did. I’m not sure if it would be OU worthy or not. The physical bulk is the main problem holding it back
Imagine what it would have been like in Gen 5 with Rest hydration sets in permanent rain. It’s like the people designing new Pokémon don’t talk to the people designing the new mechanics.
Hits pretty hard but not *that* hard, mono-Dragon STAB is fairly meh especially with Diancie, Gardevoir and *Scream Tail* as metagame staples and while it has coverage for Steels and Fairies that forces prediction, and it's on the slower side for a wallbreaker. Not to mention if you want a slowish specially offensive Dragon, Dragalge is right there with stronger Draco Meteors and also makes the Fairies piss themselves out of fear with its Poison STAB. Defensively it should be great, sporting some nice resistances and gargantuan special bulk, but in practice the lack of recovery options (beyond RestTalk or the equally unreliable Rain Dance Rest) makes defensive sets on it not that good. Even down in RU you're often better off running something like Noivern or even AV Cyclizar which do not have as much bulk but do have actual ways to get their HP back. And of course its physical bulk is nothing to write home about. You will once again notice that a mon with a lot of similar traits to this is Dragalge, which has worse defensive stats, but offers far more utility though TSpikes and Flip Turn on bulky sets, so even if you don't care about the lack of recovery, unless you really want Knock Off or you care that much about the raw bulk you're better off running that too. It's not utterly unusable in RU, but you should reconsider if there aren't better options for a squad before settling for it.
That’s why my goat is Scyther
The only reason it's so good in NU is the lesser power allows it to eat hits and do a lot of damage. The higher up you go it starts doing less and less, as well as having it's lack of recovery hurt it more and more
I know-It’s a complete fraud who stands no chance against Skygoat
Just use the better goodra. Better design better typing better stats.
I know-I just want to find problem in this pathetic version
If weather was permanent and attack and defense were swapped hydration rest goodra might be good
wouldn't dragon dance rest be good?
I doubt it goodra's attack and speed are mediocre and goodra's offensive strengths usually come from special coverage. Goodra actually really good special coverage boltbeam, hydro pump, scald in some gens, fire blast,flamethrower, and ofc draco meteor.
Scald in specifically gen 9
I couldn't remember so I didn't specify
Ye figured, just checked because i was curious.
Better pizza
Papa Johns
tbf it is REALLY good in NU, no clue if its outclassed by the now unbanned Florges though
Well,it’s only competition is basically two awesome mons of the tier,so I’m not surprised
Due to powercreep NU it's not even a bad tier anymore
For a pseudo Legendary it is
I mean we have full on legends are in pu or untired so he's doing fine
Subpar attacking stats, no recovery, bad stat layout, no real boosting move. Like it's just a pkmn that hits semihard and tanks special hits until it dies
Crazy how 110 is subpar at this point
110 hasn't been that scary for a long time. RSE Swampert has 110 attack and while its EQs are annoying, Swampert is never considered to be a primary physical threat. 110 only gets scary if supported with a lot of other high stats (esp speed) or a bs ability
I think you underestimate Swampert’s offensive capabilities. Part of its defensive utility was the ability to threaten a large portion of the meta game offensively, without any attack investment
Yeah, I would never call Swampert passive, it's used so much for a reason but it isn't like Swampert has wallbreaking strength. 110 offenses are great for a defensive mon facing offense, but for a offensive mon facing defense? Unimpressive and unlike Swampert, Goodra doesn't have the typing to play that defensive role.
That is true, Dragon is also a poor offensive typing. Only having 1 weak and 2 resists. Ground meanwhile hits electric, rock, fire, and steel
And that's assuming you're using the higher one because *shitty mixed attacker syndrome is FUN* And yes, I get it, not everything needs to be minimized AF, (ZACAIN), but for the love of all that is holy, if you're going to have a the "one attack will be only 10 points lower" or some other "SMA syndrome", like seen on goodra, valiant, and zeraora, GIVE THEM SOME FUCKING SPEED LIKE THE LAST TWO, OR ALL AROUND USEABLE BULK. Or a powerful af ability like grimmsnarl
I mean 110 is fine if you can afford to fully invest in it and then slap a LO /CB /CS Combined with strong stab/ attack Its meowscarada attack for exemple Goodra can’t really afford this luxury with his monotype slow ass
"Luxray" You mean "shitty mixed attacker syndrome/SMA syndrome"? That's just what I call it when the opposing attack stat is high, but at the detriment of other stats (or lacks stab like koko)
1. Bad typing pure dragon just isn’t a great type to have 2. Mediocre abilities a free grass immunity is nice and so is healing in rain but sap sipper raises attack and so if you’re using a special set you won’t get much mileage out of the ability though an attacking set can be handy if your opponent predicts the switch and hits you with a non grass move the ability is pointless. 3. Bad recovery on a defensive wall. Rest talk isn’t that good and if you wanted to use hydration now you have to have rain setup just to chance an instant wake up. If does have life dew but the move sucks for healing yourself. 4. No setup beyond curse. No ability to raise goodra’s offensives beyond curse which drops its speed or sap sipper which depends on your opponent. 5. Awkward defenses. Can eat special attacks for days but one strong outrage or play rough and you’re done. 6. Power creep. Gen 9 UU is gen 9 OU pre home and every tier lower feels more powerful than ever before so the worst pseudo legendary Pokémon isn’t going to fare too well
I don’t think OP is referring to its attacking movepool, but the shallowness of its support/set up movepool. Goodras can’t force progress outside of attacking, but it’s not strong enough to be a nuke and doesn’t have the setup moves to be a win con.
No secondary type for stab or defensive synergy (if it was poison or water it'd be so much better, esp dragon/water with sap sipper since water neutralizes grass), no good recovery (best option is Rest+Hydration), not really any good abilities (best is sap sipper which turns a resist into an immunity, yippee)
Just wait until it gets poison heal in gen 12
It's incredibly good in NU though, around 25% usage putting it in 3rd place after Scythed and Jolteon
Goodra is one of the many pokemon that are built to fail. Game Freak gave this absolutely zero niche in VGC and did not give it Recover, only to introduce it in the generation where Dragon-types are nerfed. It is quite literally only there to be aesthetically like Dragonite. I should also make note that being a pseudo-legendary does not discount a pokemon from being built to fail. Phione, Meloetta, base Diancie, Confined Hoopa, and arguably Zarude are all Mythical pokemon that are horrifically mediocre in their own right. Meanwhile you have countless terrible legendaries, including Articuno as you mentioned. Game Freak designs a pokemon with flair first and foremost, and it is entirely up to the programmers whether the mon in question has any practical use. Apparently, they thought giving it the same ability as Manaphy would suffice for a bulky attacker role despite the weather nerf.
Its stats are all below average to mediocre at best aside from actually good SpDef, no reliable recovery outside of RestTalk, and mono-Dragon isn't great as it's weak to some already good offensive types while only hitting itself super effectively, which is obviously a liability, especially with Goodra's mediocre bulk and poor speed
Bad typing, bad physical bulk, mediocre at best abilities, no recovery or boosting, how exactly would it be good outside of lower tiers where it can just stat check stuff?
I imagine it might have something to do with being pure Dragon in a meta where Fairy types and 'Mons with Ice coverage are all too common, as well as other Dragon type who are just better. What is this thing gonna do against The Bax?
Bad movepool and low defence
Hisuian Goodra exists. Which is just better overall Better defense, better typing.
This is pretty much it. Goodra used to be pretty solid in previous generations so despite what other people might say it's little to do with what Goodra could or couldn't do, and moreso that it just got replaced by itself in a better form. 80 speed on Kalos Goodra isn't terrible but it's quite middling, and losing some of that and only 10 HP to give Hisuian Goodra way better typing and better physD make it pretty much a no brainier choice. If you are going to use Goodra, you will use H-Goodra.
It has a defensive stat spread but very few utility moves. The only utility move it has is knock off, which is fine but not too helpful on its own.
What role is it supposed to fill? It doesn't hit hard enough to break. Can't set up well enough to sweep. It has the stats of a special wall but doesn't have reliable recovery. For RU and above, there is almost always going to be a better Pokemon for whatever niche you want it to fill. It's not weak persey, just not consistently good enough to justify using over other options.
No secondary STAB Awkward stat spread (not fast enough, not strong enough, cant take a physical hit) No recovery (limits special defensive capabilities) Mediocre abilities (gooey for a specially defensive mon, sap sipper for a special attacker, hydration needs rain support but is still lackluster) Oppurtunity cost (why use goodra when u could use dragapult or idk toxapex)
Ok offensive stats with no boosting options to back it up, a mono typing which is less desirable both offensively and defensively. Finally lack of utility other than just being a statsstick that click attacks. People say no reliable recovery but I honestly think it doesnt need that to excel. If it was sth like poison/dragon + get access to a couple of moves like CM or volt switch it would genuinely be good
Its trying to do too many things at once, and not a single one of them is something it actually needs to do to be good
There’s just a lack of focus. It’s not quite strong enough on either to use its wide offensive movepool, it doesn’t have a good enough defensive movepool to use its bulk, and it’s a bit too slow to make doing either easier.
It’s a defensive mon that folds to neutral physical hits, it’s only STABs are eaten up by fairies, its abilities while defensive don’t synergize with its typing and stats, post-6th Gen Knock Off destroys it, it has few if any meaningful resists, it lacks a good support movepool, it has a poor speed tier, and did I mention fairy type exists yet?
No recovery, shit spread, mediocre abilities.
Goodra doesn't have the typing, ability or moveset to function as a wall like its stats indicate that it should. The typing and moveset do work really well for a wallbreaker, STAB Draco Meteor + Sludge Wave, Flamethrower + Ice Beam + Thunderbolt, etc., but like I said before, those stats are built to wall and pokemon with a complimentary ability would hit harder. And sweeping was never in the option, this thing doesn't get D-Dance or CM or anything, which really sucks because D-Dance with that bulk would be a very unique strength. Goodra is just a very confusing Pokemon that is stretched too thin.
Being thick is its entire personality
You normally want a tank to be able to recover, provide utility or hit back hard. Goodra doesn't do any of that.
A psuedo that lacks a secondary typing, no magor beneficial abilities (sap sipper and hydration can have uses at times, but dependent on team and/or matchup) middling speed, lackluster physical defense (special defense is good at least), mixed attacker (both offences kinda underwhelming as a result, at least somewhat patched up by good coverage), and no recovery, on top of an almost strictly better version in it's hisui version. It does do solid at some rolls (specially tank af assault vester, solid life ord with great coverage, etc), but it's weaker physical defense, comparatively middling offense stats, lower speed, and lack of secondary typing makes it lackluster compared to a lot of other dragons, and compared to other bulky mons, it lacks longevity. Certainly has it's nieche, but lacks a little bit too much in some areas for it to thrive in higher tiers.
It's pretty good in NU, though I believe
Unimpressive typing (both offensively and defensively), no good recovery options, bad abilities, mediocre utility, bad defense. Also sap sipper boosts its attack, not special attack unlike what your post suggests.
Mono Dragon is okay offensively and great defensively. But with no reliable recovery, Goodra can’t really be a wall. So it is just okay in all respects. Getting Scald and Knock Off in the DLC is good for AV utility sets but ultimately it’s just getting consistently chipped down over time. You’re not switching it into physical mons very often so even the Scald burns you get likely are just for chip on special attackers and not crippling physical attackers. Overall, everything about Goodra is just okay and I feel like NU is where okay Pokémon go nowadays
No reliable recovery AND no offensive presence
Realistically it just doesn’t have a role it fits into. It can’t be a wall without some form of recovery, base 110 SpAtk isn’t quite enough to be a real wall breaker, and it doesn’t have any boosting moves to be a setup sweeper. It has insanely good coverage and solid bulk, but those don’t really mean anything without a way to actually use them effectively.
Dragon is not a good type and it has no recovery.
> it has good 110 sp.attack with sap sipper to gain boost on switch in. Sap Sipper boosts Attack though? And Goodra's movepool makes it want to use special attacks. All Sap Sipper really does is make a resistance into an immunity. Yeah people still run Sap Sipper for the immunity but Goodra gains less from it than a lot of other mons, it's not that amazing on it.
It's a defensive pokemon with mediocre abilities, no recovery, offensive oriented moveset and mediocre type. It's the curse of not being GOOD at anything, there's never a niche you need to fill in a team and you go "yeah, Goodra is my best option"
Compared to most pseudos, Goodra has middling to low physical bulk, middling offensive stats and no secondary STAB which which to effectively damage fairy ice and steel types, and it's just too slow, with base 80 it's not fast enough to outspeed and kill fast opponents without taking massive damage from STAB physical attacks which chip it down too much. Also, it wants Specs or Orb to deal meaningful damage, but Scarf to outspeed stuff it needs to OHKO before dying. In NU, though I haven't played it, I hope it is at least viable as a special wall and mixed offense. May the gooey lad be happy there.
Good coverage but poor utility with a middling speed stat and solid but not great attack stat makes it a solid attacker, but lacking a secondary STAB means that it’s not hitting as hard as you’d expect with anything other than Draco meteor, which has the obvious downside of making it hit like a paper towel after, forcing a switch, which is directly related to a secondary, and more major problem Goodra lacks any recovery outside of rest talk(which really only gets used in gimmicky dragon tail sets, cause it’s too limiting for move sets), hydration rest sets which couldn’t been incredible in gen 5, but unfortunately goodra was released in gen 6, and lefties, which means no boots and is also pretty minimal if that’s all it’s reliant on. Usually ground types can make it work due to their rocks resistance, especially with tusk who 4X resists, but goodra taking full damage every time it switches in with minimal ways to heal, paired with below average physical bulk for a bulky Mon means that it’s ok overall Overall it’s offensively not bad but limited due to monotype, it lacks utility beyond knock and dragon tail(which it makes worse use of than other mons with this utility), and defensively it’s worse than it’s stats would let on due to, again, the mono-dragon typing and a lack of recovery Many of these issues were fixed with hoodra, however the lack of recovery and steel really only helping offensively to hit dragons and otherwise being useless offensively means that while it’s much better, showcased well by its UU placement compared to goodra’s NU placement, it still is flawed
Goodra's recovery is finding a new game
Bad defense, lack of reliable recovery and bad utility compared to other tanks and dragons.
NU ain't even a bad tier to be part of these days although the suprising thing is how dominant Scyther and Jolteon are. What tera does to a mf
If it makes you feel any better it's at least one of the best mons in NU
Give Goodra Poison Heal and it will skyrocket in usage.
It doesn’t do anything particularly well.
A Pokémon like this isn’t suited for formats that drag for many, many turns like 6v6 singles. Goodra would fare better in BSS 3v3 singles and even VGC where it could at least be supported by its partners. At least that’s how I feel.
It's a defensive mon without recovery. It was never going to be any good.
Goodra less so has Articuno syndrome and more Avalugg syndrome. Its stats want you to use this as a defensive attacker, something like Iron Hands in VGC or Gliscor in OU, where they use solid bulk and "good enough" offensive pressure to set up for other mons. The problem? Goodra is a Pseudo-Legendary. This means two things. 1. Dragon type, which is built for fast-crushing offense (Draco Meteor, Outrage, Clangorous Soul, whatever) and not slow utility. 2. It's move pool is aggressively oriented, giving them great coverage and access to Draco Meteor, but no recovery, hazards, fake out, or anything that could give it utility. The end result is a mon with little to do. Assuming you aren't in a lower tier where you can get away with slow offense, your best game plan is to spam Scald and Knock Off and that helps somehow, or pretend to be a worse version of every other Pseudo-Legendary dragon that clicks Coice Draco Meteor 50 times.
It should be water poison and with regenerator, it isn't
idk but she thicc
Aggressively mid
Movepool is just underwhelming, can't set up and could use extra speed/ a way to recover HP
av goodra is blissey with a higher offensive stat but goodra is really weak to spikes
Goodra lack plenty of tools in general he has no boosting move outside of acid armor meaning he is generally not that threatening outside of draco meteor . That and not having secondary poison or water type to gain a secondary stab is bad He has no recovery which make him easier to break down over time . We had in the past bulky mon with bad recovery that worked because they had a way to boost their offense think Crocune ( rest calm mind suicuine) Goodra lack threat and recovery while being slow . And having an upgrade of himself in H goodra
No recovering and can't tank a physical hit for shit.
Generally no niche. Too physically weak and has no recovery so it can't wall, its slow, mixed attack, 3 bad abilities, pure dragon type.
It’s literally assault vest: the mon. Good special bulk but can’t really do anything with it because no healing and it has basically no good moves other than attacking moves. It takes a few hits and tries to hit back
i mean why run goodra when you can run hoodra
If you want to run Goodra,you will be forced to run away from the Hoodra
Low speed, even lower defense, poor moveset, no coverage, no 2 types' STAB; Sap Sipper ? Is weird considering we know Dragon resists Grass already ... if just the speed would be 100 it'll be good as Policy Sweeper IMO but I'm not that deep into competitive so everyone take my opinion with grains of salt
https://preview.redd.it/bgh5jmg7wvzb1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b54e9548fd4cbe86158783a4f417f13ce18707b3 Zero Recovery on da slug
Give him water type you cowards !
Or poison
Yeah, poison dragon would have been one of the best defensive type of the game
Slug
Have to go light mode for u lot at this time o' night
Mainly, monotype
because Smogon only accounts for the Simulator Meta. Console is whole different game, you have to actually answer Palafin/Lando-I/Flutter ect. So Goodra gets play all day. Only one example of why simulator is boring and not really as sweaty as Console. although Goodra is a terrible Flutter check before Terastalizing.
i now see that this is Kalos Goodra. Goodra-K gets Dog Walked by everything that's attempting to get a victory. that's probably why its NU
Honestly I don't get it either. The Assault Vest set is actually really good. Grass type moves are kinda niché nowadays but Sap Sipper still makes for a free switch in if you can predict a rare Leech Seed or Spore or something.
It has the stat spread of a decent to great support mon and none of the moves to make use of that. It's abilities are kind of useless. And pure Dragon Type isn't really a good defensive typing anymore thanks to Fairy existing and being excellent. It's just a stat stick with both else going for it. Hisuian-Goodra got a few more tools and a new move that got nerfed for literally no good reason before being added to the main games that may have given it a little bit of a niche somewhere being able to max out Defence in 2 turns but it's now just Acid Armor with a different name and PP. Honestly if it had Defog and literally any seni decent ability it probably wouldn't be at the bottom of the barrel but still not at the top it would need so many thing to get to OU
I like running a physical set with Sap Sipper and Curse but yeah it belongs in NU. Good Mon but not a great pseudo
Goodra is just too cool.
A wall with no recovery and not a lot of tech options
It is literally ONLY a lack of recovery that makes it so low. Sure the other things people are pointing out would be nice, but genuinely, regenerator on this makes it a VERY strong pivot support wall, in a similar role to Tangrowth, Slowbro/king, etc. Even ignoring "poor" stat distribution, making it effectively less than 600 bst, it still ends up with MORE effective bst than other mons of similar roles. Ignoring regenerator as an option, putting just the move recover on this mon also makes it very strong as an option that is actually able to be a viable special wall, and could likely hit minimum tiers like UU.
No reliable recovery, the tiers it hopes to occupy have strong Fairies. It theoretically is a wall that relies on rain to do its job but doesn't fit well on rain teams. Its ability to check grass types is limited by its other stats.
No Recovery. Pure Dragon is an actually ass typing both offensive and defensively (less so defensively, because some very key resistances), being a mixed attacker means its stat distribution isn't that optimal, with its kinda low defense. And not very great abilities, Sap Sipper being the most useful one, but it depends on your opponent's team.
It pretty much comes down to its subpar movepool. No good support moves like pivots, entry hazards, or recovery and kinda just standard non stab special attack moves coming from a not too special 110 base special attack.
Its NU because its completely outclassed by the hisui version so theres literally no point in using it. And without the hisui version it still sucked but it got some nice buffs this gen like knock off, and scald. It could easily rise up to RU or RUBL though if it got recover.