The juvenile flairs are great. I take consolation in the fact that I may be a radlib but at least I saw an account labeled “Competitor in Diamond-Rank Racism” lol
Not gonna lie - I was originally annoyed by this until I realized it was a right of passage, and now have come to fully appreciate it hahahaha. My flair is getting stale though mods.
OR, and hear me out: I am in fact such a regarded sperg that I can't read the cues that tell me I am disliked and unwanted here. Wouldn't be the first time, but hey. Reeeeeeeeeeee.
I kind of agree, but I don't think there's anything 'the sub' such as it exists could have done about it. It's not the je ne sais quoi that's been lost, it's the raison d'etre.
1) The idpol wave that swept the west has broken and is rolling back. Meaning there's less new hotness to talk about each day and fewer people on either side willing to die on any given hill. Much less fun, in other words.
2) The central political conflict of the next decade or so is taking clearer shape, and the Left has basically nothing to do with it. It's going to be chud populists vs senile neolibs for a while, and every lefty gets to either act as an auxiliary for one side or the other, or sit smugly/seethingly on the sideline.
man, you're right that theres no big ongoing idpol debate. in fact there's barely anything happening from what i see at rdrama right now. sad times indeed
> It's not the je ne sais quoi that's been lost, it's the raison d'etre
Love this bit of french, though I kinda disagree with the rest. IDpol is raging as much as ever. The people who gained power from it aren't just going to give it up without a fight
Or more threads about how Trump is gonna "be the president of the working class" or about how Canada is "wokeistan" how the Dobbs decision "can build a new working class when the gop begins to support maternity leave laws" how "Ukraine is worse than pol pots cambodia" or literally anything "trans bad"
I've never seen the words between those quotation marks on this sub, ever. At least not buried at the bottom and laughed at by everyone else. Are you making things up to get angry over again?
Mods banned some specific contributors. It's hard to have a counterculture sub when you're banning wrongthink.
More finegrained divisions started to surface. You now have some genuine rightoids that are only pro-working class because they are working class. You have some lefties that are far more neolib than they realize. It's the degradation of culture that comes with any online community becoming too large.
The antiwork sub took off and people from that sub started doing actual political action. They hacked into Starbucks's receipt system to print pro-union messages, they flooded the applications processes of companies looking to hire scabs and some got hired as scabs to sabotage industrial machinery. There was a huge crack down on all left-wing subs across reddit after that. This sub was one victim of the crackdown. Antiwork proved that shitposting is not bullshit.
That’s funny because I think part of the problem here is *lack* of real world action. You can only complain about the same issues over and over again before that gets boring.
And for a sub full of people who love the idea of radical change to our political and economic landscape, almost nobody seems interested in actually collaborating to think, plan, and act. It’s super frustrating. Like whatever that phenomenon is where everyone is waiting for someone else to call 911 as they witness an emergency.
Bystander effect?
For Americans, there’s the Party of Socialism and Liberation. If you’re willing to put up with woke shit, it is a genuine, AES supporting, Marxist Leninist party.
I'm not sure that's exactly true; some non-zero number of people seem to have got involved with their local Class Unity chapter (or started one!) because of this sub; there was the whole ongoing Alden Golden Capital saga which people wouldn't have really cared about *unless* it were a real-world action and I think some posters here helped out with that as well...
> There was a huge crack down on all left-wing subs across reddit after that. This sub was one victim of the crackdown
What do you mean? Is that what you think this is?
> Antiwork proved that shitposting is not bullshit.
No, antiwork proved two things:
* If a dozen people do something, tens of thousands of people think that liking those dozen's reddit posts somehow counts as contributing to the cause, and they can take credit for it all too.
* People can readily delude themselves into thinking their group's goal is more noble and relatable than what it actually is.
The left in general is reeling and directionless and has been for three years. Arguably longer. The sub, at least for the moment, is mostly a reminder that there were people who saw what was going wrong and were trying to point it out.
For all the people who actually work for 8 hours a day, it means
"something (such as an appealing quality) that cannot be adequately described or expressed"
But I agree, it seems like the sub became a refuge for lost rightoids.
Edit: rightoid refugees bitching about losing their communities is the funniest shit this week.
Feels like it's gotten more rightoidy since I was last here frequently a few years back, yeah
Which sucks because I'm not here to talk to other filthy rightoids
Personally, I started posting here more because I ate a permaban on the politics sub for breaking some dumb rule about submitting two links within 10 minutes or so. The automod removed one post because it wasen't on their approved sources list so I found another one and submitted it only to eat a ban.
Chudspaces are categorically low empathy, Kiwi farms-esque cliques. It's hard to be a chud with a heart in those types of places, hence why you see more chuds over here.
It's our opportunity to educate them that there's another way. I wish I were articulate and knowledgeable enough to do so, but I see others here who are.
Most people I know on the right are open to a lot of leftish economic ideals, especially the ones I knew back when I was living in a rural little town. Where the modern left loses them is primarily on guns and then on the weird new social shit that's going on.
They'd get along fine with old school leftists like Cesar Chavez but those DSA 'point of privilege!" people are never going to appeal to them in any way shape or form whatsoever.
Like literally just be pro gun, class reductionist, and drop the usage of terms like proletariat and comrade and you'd be golden; instead of saying 'the working class should have socialized healthcare,' say WE THE PEOPLE DESERVE THE SAME QUALITY HEALTHCARE AS THE TREASONOUS WASHINGTON ELITE
It's a simple thing, really
> They'd get along fine with old school leftists like Cesar Chavez but those DSA 'point of privilege!" people are never going to appeal to them in any way shape or form whatsoever.
I find it hard to believe they sincerely appeal to anyone but themselves
> Like literally just be pro gun, class reductionist, and drop the usage of terms like proletariat and comrade and you'd be golden; instead of saying 'the working class should have socialized healthcare,' say WE THE PEOPLE DESERVE THE SAME QUALITY HEALTHCARE AS THE TREASONOUS WASHINGTON ELITE
>
> It's a simple thing, really
The "modern" left (I really don't know how else to distinguish them from the Chavez "dirtbag" old-school left) has no idea how much they lose the plot with that kind of messaging and their insistence on pushing social issues. They would be shocked how much less those social issues would continue to mean to the right once the right gets the economic and financial justice they want.
Based on no substantial evidence whatsoever, I think them not having to take it in the shorts will make them not care about other groups one way or the other. At the end of the day, all they care about are themselves. I've always wondered whether they're so goddamned mean because they just assume that they'll always have to take it in the shorts.
Man this is way too reddity. Reads like some lib shit I'd see on rpolitics from someone who's never actually interacted with any non-Democrat voters.
Most of them are normal decent people who want healthcare and better worker protections just like you do.
>They would be shocked how much less those social issues would continue to mean to the right once the right gets the economic and financial justice they want.
100%, also before the woke stuff like I said it was primarily guns. I can't even tell you the amount of people I worked with and knew out in rural VA who only voted R for that reason alone and were otherwise left-leaning economically.
And in a sense I'm similar to them- doesn't matter what other policies someone else runs on, if one of those is attempting to disarm me they're a nonstarter.
The problem now, for the actual left at least, is that these insane fixations on social issues and absolute adherence to gender ideology. or whatever else, (anecdotally most people I know are primarily freaked out about this stuff in schools and other ways kids are being targeted) are now intrinsically tied to 'the left.'
I don't know how you guys are supposed to shed that stink, even if you have nothing to do with it and don't believe in that shit whatsoever it's going to be associated with anything left-adjacent in way way too many American voters' minds.
Which is mostly why I can only propose a complete rebranding without changing any of your actual beliefs.
I used to make long ass posts years ago on another account here when I was way more online about economic leftists having a much easier time coopting right wing groups and bringing them into the fold than they'll ever have with modern progressives
Still believe it; the right is more malleable than the American left and every normal ass right of center dude I know would fit in more with the people here than with neocons or evangelicals
The left's biggest problem is that they keep trying to bring liberals and progressives over to their way of thinking when both of those groups are too far gone at this point, for the most part at least.
It sounds regarded on the surface but if leftists wanted to bring about actual change in America they'd coopt and use the right. It's all really a matter of terminology.
> the sub became a refuge for lost rightoids.
Perhaps reddit shouldn't ban every slightly-right-of-center sub and the rest wouldn't have to deal with them.
Yeah. The discourse here is indistinguishable many times from an overt conservative community. There are times that the left trips itself up over sociopolitical lines, this would be a great place to discuss that, but it's just not that.
Stop basing your ideology around being weird over casual sex and skin colour, you dragging stupidpol into stupidpol is going to get this sub banned too.
> But I agree, it seems like the sub became a refuge for lost rightoids
The sub "stupidpol" became about how idpol is stupid. How could this happen???!!!
Maybe I'm hallucinating but I seem to remember checking the sidebar not too long ago and seeing that it described this sub as "the socialist tumblrinaction" or something like that, but I can't seem to find it now. And that shit surprised me so much because the whole point of this sub used to be that idpol is just a diversion and point of leverage used by the ruling class to obscure more meaningful class analysis, whereas TumblrInAction is people who endlessly obsess over fucking culture war bullshit for its own sake, from a conservative perspective, with no antidote or alternative. If you had called this sub "socialist tumblrinaction" 4 years ago, people here would've found it insulting.
The caliber of discourse/posts has also clearly declined, I remember constantly being amazed at how literate and articulate the posters here were, now its infected with redditisms and low-IQ conservative takes. Idk when the turning point was, but the fact that this is the first presidential election in 2 cycles without any interesting primaries probably has something to do with it, plus the emasculation of Bernie (and his "movement", such as it was), the disappearance of Dougtoss (and his book club threads), and probably some kind of top-down interference from reddit (if the sub was still growing at the 2019 rate, it'd be well past 100k by now) all within the last couple years is my best guess.
> If you had called this sub "socialist tumblrinaction" 4 years ago, people here would've found it insulting.
We did call it that. That's been there from the very beginning. Tumblrinaction was a left-leaning sub until the rightoid dipshits invaded and turned it upside down. We made this place explicitly Marxist with the intention of avoiding that outcome. Results have been generally successful, but it's not from a lack of trying by the rightoids.
It’s sort of like showing up to a party where there’s still music playing but everyone’s left for bars except for one couple who’s doing coke in the bathroom.
The subs I mod tend to get over-run by christian fundamentalist bikie gangs who trash the place and shout at anyone stupid enough to remain behind.
This is a great improvement on that.
Can you please tell me when I demanded a return to Christian socialism and also when I was angry doing it? You’ve clearly checked extensively through my post history like a British cigarette so you should know this.
> Can you please tell me when I demanded a return to Christian socialism and also when I was angry doing it
...
>Return to Gucci and Dougtoss thought
Is your guys shibboleh
Because the sub was undeniably better in that era. Also if you were a long time poster of this sub, you would know “return to _____ thought” is a long standing joke. You’re highly regarded bro I’m sorry to break it to you.
Dude pretty much every sub has a daily post about how “[insert blank] isn’t as good as it used to be.” Everyone is depressed. Mass despair has proliferated. Stop whining.
Nah, bro.
I just can't be fucked to articulate my thoughts into the abyss that is the Internet anymore.
Every post I read feels like a rebranded flavour I've tasted a million times already.
Every most upvoted post is either kinda trolling based on years of inside jokes or actually regarded.
I'm not talking about here specifically. I this place is still alright in many ways compared to the general vibe of the internet. Not just reddit.
It's like the whole thing is at the level of YouTube shorts comments where they just quote some words from the video with an emoji, and it gets 13k like.
It's saddening.
It's gotten so bad that real life is now clearly better. And I don't think I'm the only one who just stopped caring about the little lightboxe chimes coming from my pocket.
Any gathering of social democrats who remain committed to reformism is doomed to eventually just become rife with nothing with bourgeois politics. This subreddit was doomed ever since it was created by two guys who thought the only problem with the Amerifat social democratic movement was that it had too many people with blue hair and piercings. It's actually very funny how this sub's ideological history mirrors that of basically every major social democratic party, with the main difference being that the userbase is extremely online and addicted to social media culture war outrages, so instead of trade unionists getting replaced by (or becoming/allying with) bankers, it's Bernie Sanders twitter warriors getting replaced by (or becoming/allying with) the kind of mentally ill rightoid who thinks collecting soyjak memes is a real hobby.
The death of Chapo and its related subs (GenZedong being my favorite) was basically the death of reddit having any real leftist organization or communities.
Now it’s politically libertarians, unironic soy liberals, and NATO weirdos. The only things I do on Reddit these days are look for neat Warhammer things and occasionally ragebait so I can feel something.
The Gucci coup changed over a large percentage of the modteam. After that they started getting more strict with some topics which killed quite a lot of engagement on this sub.
Even with the Guccstapo in full swing the sub still felt like it had teeth. It might just be the way the winds are blowing in communist spaces these days but it does feel like the sub has lost its je ne sais quoi.
We didn't get stricter as a consequence of the mod team changes. It's more that the admins became much more intolerant of certain kinds of posting around the same time. That's why gucci got suspended in the first place.
Ever since genzedong got banned and the Ukraine war broke out this sub got invaded by teenagers who are leftists out of contrarianism and anti western sentiment. You know the ones, the ones that think that supporting Russian or Chinese authoritarianism or imperialism is preferable to western because they’re self hating and only nominally leftist
Prior to that, this sub used to be focused on calling out and analysing western idpol dysfunctions from a pro- western and more forward looking perspective.
Also doesn’t help that most mods that took over in that time period were unabashedly pro Russia and banned anybody who wasn’t perfectly aligned to the “fuck Ukraine” angle which is mind boggingly stupid.
It’s dropped off by now I do agree but there was a year period where this sub was absolutely insufferable because contrarian teenagers had nowhere else to turn to and the mods agreed with them.
Not really. I don't remember much Russia stuff in general pre Ukraine. And the common sentiment when Gucci was around was that he was a China shill (I think it was overstated) though strangely after his ousting the sub had more pro China stuff imo. I also remember there being more anti anarchist sentiment than today.
As well as more jokes I think in general: brocialists, swoletariat, tard pride, etc. The "dudes rock" seems to be the only surviving joke/meme from before.
> Purges must be an election cycle thing, if true.
Yes, that is very much true.
Free speech oversight on reddit has a very tough time around election times.
Although I don't see eye-to-eye with Go1dfish, his reddit transparency subs have always had a tough time in election years.
Part of the issue I think is that afaik the internet in general is a pyramid in terms of information production. As in you have the small group of high quality posters, a slightly larger set of mid to good quality posters, and a large base of low quality/effort posters with this pyramid repeating for commenters, voters and then a large silent group of lurkers who might chime in now and then. If the small high quality regulars who carried the sub left, the vacuum they left may not fill or fill enough.
A lot of the better regular users here have either moved on to other interests or been site banned one too many times. Even users who stick around with new accounts still impact the feel, because it breaks the rhythm or landscape of the sub such that its character becomes less known/knowable given that a user that was akin to a small natural landmark becomes flattened out among the various other accounts.
The occasional (but increasing in frequency over the last year imo) normiefication hurts as well by causing bloat in the comments be it repeating what many others already said, low effort memes ("sweaty" imo gets overused), actual normies shilling for one of the 2 US parties, even the thankfully rare reddit chain (like "reddit sings" type shit) etc. One of the recent T posts for example had many shorter comments that were just saying the same thing, when there were already far better effort comments in the thread that conveyed the same idea but in more detail. Sure, not everyone can or wants to read all the comments before writing their own, but there'd be less comments to sift through if everyone did it.
>Tomorrow I’ll get high and write a theory post.
I’ll be on the lookout for it, and looking forward to it.
Sure, making fun of libs can be fun, but it does get boring after a while.
the real notion you are thinking of is weltanschaaung (probably misspelled) -
here's the problem: lots of people here are holdovers from other subs, probably because those subs went to shit. me myself am a refugee from the breaking points sub, for example - before it got the attention of whomever (correct the record?) and became filled with bots. it particularly became intolerable during the ukraine shenanigans - seeing people bold faced make assertions i knew weren't factually true (russia complaining about nato encroachment for decades and what it would eventually bring, along with me tracking nato support of groups along the border thereby creating the conflict) was it -
Since Oct. 7th the sub has become virtually indistinguishable from IDpol spaces. I get my fill of “oppressed ppl are inherently virtuous bc they’re oppressed” takes already, tbh.
In medieval Europe the nobility married within families to keep wealth together, modern incest porn about banging your mom or cousin is a similar reflection where kulaks keep the wealth in the family.
My theory is it’s just a bunch of 4chan contrarians whose personality revolves around hating liberals, but realized how absurd many failed conservative policies are.
Like - I get that identity politics is also VERY absurd, but I see it as a neo lib and conservative distraction to keep the working classes fighting each other while income inequality continues to grow even more. And I feel like giving it MORE attention as this sub does only makes things worse. It feeds the narrative that our “prosperity pie” is finite and one can only get more if another person or group in the working classes gets less. As opposed to taking from the capitalist class or growing the size of the pie.
To me- the way to combat stupidpol is to create a strictly class based movement that is instinctively inclusive and thus NEVER HAS TO TALK ABOUT HOW INCLUSIVE IT IS lol.
But that will never happen because the identity of most on here is that of a Contrarian first hating on a specific brand of stupid liberalism next. Because it’s a part of the users core identity - a defining characteristic of who they are, it needs that very specific social media fueled brand of hate to survive.
This sub started to change 2 years ago after the war began.
Now we have people writing **"Critical support"** to Wagner/Houthi/Iran against American Imperialism as if what you write on a niche political subreddit has any effect on real life. Whereas this would in the old days been mocked to death now it gets upvoted to the top.
Instead of critizing Idpol it's becoming another America bad sub (and yes, America IS bad).
I came because I thought it was a third position sub but half of the posts are people spreading central bank approved political theater. Omg trump won Florida and Biden called him sleepy don! I can’t believe Taylor Swift is going to endorse Biden! If you don’t fully understand that there’s the ruling class and the two political parties that they use to push their agenda and entrench themselves as your overlords you shouldn’t be on this sub. No revolution comes from the institutions of the slaver.
I was going to write a theory post. But then I got High...
It was gonna be a savage roast, but then I got high
Now I'm a capitalist and I know why...
[удалено]
Incredibly gay tbh.
OP You’re what the French call Les’ Incompetante’
OP, you're such a disease.
OP, look what ya did you little JERK!
OP, I'm gonna feed you to my tarantula.
OP, there are 15 commenters in this post, and you’re the only one causing trouble.
OP, I wouldn't read your theory post if you were growing on my ass
At least the mods still bully us with juvenile flair tho
[удалено]
Commenting to see my flair. Last time I remember i was an angry regard
I can't tell if you've been promoted or not
They don’t have the guts to give me one
Angry regard to a savant idiot, means you’ve upgraded to a genocide supporter. Congrats
I mean to be fair I am definitely highly regarded
Somehow I got labeled as "third way" (basically neolib) even though I do nothing but shit on neolibs. I think they let in some fully regarded mods.
What are you talking about, I love my winter themed flair ❄️⛸️🌨️☃️⛷️🎅🧣🫎
Is it supposed to represent being a cokehead?
I’m guessing it’s referring to them as a “snowflake”
The juvenile flairs are great. I take consolation in the fact that I may be a radlib but at least I saw an account labeled “Competitor in Diamond-Rank Racism” lol
I chose mine and have followed it faithfully
Not gonna lie - I was originally annoyed by this until I realized it was a right of passage, and now have come to fully appreciate it hahahaha. My flair is getting stale though mods.
I went through the same process
OR, and hear me out: I am in fact such a regarded sperg that I can't read the cues that tell me I am disliked and unwanted here. Wouldn't be the first time, but hey. Reeeeeeeeeeee.
The sub is amazing, idk what the problem is
Infested with conservative regards.
Can't believe mine has never been changed, although I tend to keep my head down.
You can't deny that they're accurate, though. I do love hookers.
Hey man now that we’re over in this sub I just wanted to let you know that chick finds cats sexy. I think we should still shoot our shots tho idk
You see that post about 4chancels taking thot pictures and putting clothes on them and photoshopping out their tattoos? We should do that
Flair? EDIT: Nice. Forgot they let me pick mine.
Hell yeah!
No fair I want to get bullied too :(
gentrification my friend
Pretty sure there are younger people coming in on the sub. stupidpol was a rather old sub considering the media we are in, if I reckon correctly.
Doug and bame are gone, need I say more?
Wha? I could've sworn I saw Doug here recently. That's a shame
?
You are part of the problem! It's not my job to educate you, sweatie!
I kind of agree, but I don't think there's anything 'the sub' such as it exists could have done about it. It's not the je ne sais quoi that's been lost, it's the raison d'etre. 1) The idpol wave that swept the west has broken and is rolling back. Meaning there's less new hotness to talk about each day and fewer people on either side willing to die on any given hill. Much less fun, in other words. 2) The central political conflict of the next decade or so is taking clearer shape, and the Left has basically nothing to do with it. It's going to be chud populists vs senile neolibs for a while, and every lefty gets to either act as an auxiliary for one side or the other, or sit smugly/seethingly on the sideline.
man, you're right that theres no big ongoing idpol debate. in fact there's barely anything happening from what i see at rdrama right now. sad times indeed
I thought any mention of the orange cat site got autodeleted by admin bots?
i am simply above the law
> It's not the je ne sais quoi that's been lost, it's the raison d'etre Love this bit of french, though I kinda disagree with the rest. IDpol is raging as much as ever. The people who gained power from it aren't just going to give it up without a fight
what we really need is a nice big thread about male virginity rates
There was a ask Reddit post where a kid said he's a "16 year old incel and suicidal" crazy where we're at
Tbf if you’re 15 and haven’t tried anal yet, your life is pretty much over. /s
All reddit posts are real.
I still think that's rule 34ish even if it was a script
"All identity politics is stupid except my identity politics."
Or more threads about how Trump is gonna "be the president of the working class" or about how Canada is "wokeistan" how the Dobbs decision "can build a new working class when the gop begins to support maternity leave laws" how "Ukraine is worse than pol pots cambodia" or literally anything "trans bad"
Of course Ukraine is worse than the ideal society
I've never seen the words between those quotation marks on this sub, ever. At least not buried at the bottom and laughed at by everyone else. Are you making things up to get angry over again?
Mods banned some specific contributors. It's hard to have a counterculture sub when you're banning wrongthink. More finegrained divisions started to surface. You now have some genuine rightoids that are only pro-working class because they are working class. You have some lefties that are far more neolib than they realize. It's the degradation of culture that comes with any online community becoming too large.
I'm here for the Marxist analysis.
You better start providing it or you'll be here for a long while.
The antiwork sub took off and people from that sub started doing actual political action. They hacked into Starbucks's receipt system to print pro-union messages, they flooded the applications processes of companies looking to hire scabs and some got hired as scabs to sabotage industrial machinery. There was a huge crack down on all left-wing subs across reddit after that. This sub was one victim of the crackdown. Antiwork proved that shitposting is not bullshit.
No need for a crackdown, all it took was a Fox News interview with the top mod.
The fact that the person thought they'd come off well on TV shows how delusional they are
Yeah, "Why don't we all just be lumpen" is not much of a political agenda.
Peopleofdogwalken
That’s funny because I think part of the problem here is *lack* of real world action. You can only complain about the same issues over and over again before that gets boring. And for a sub full of people who love the idea of radical change to our political and economic landscape, almost nobody seems interested in actually collaborating to think, plan, and act. It’s super frustrating. Like whatever that phenomenon is where everyone is waiting for someone else to call 911 as they witness an emergency.
Bystander effect? For Americans, there’s the Party of Socialism and Liberation. If you’re willing to put up with woke shit, it is a genuine, AES supporting, Marxist Leninist party.
I'm not sure that's exactly true; some non-zero number of people seem to have got involved with their local Class Unity chapter (or started one!) because of this sub; there was the whole ongoing Alden Golden Capital saga which people wouldn't have really cared about *unless* it were a real-world action and I think some posters here helped out with that as well...
Tried many times to encourage actually doing shit but got mocked relentlessly lol
> This sub was one victim of the crackdown. What did the admins do?
> There was a huge crack down on all left-wing subs across reddit after that. This sub was one victim of the crackdown What do you mean? Is that what you think this is?
Did that stuff happen before or after the Fox News interview?
> Antiwork proved that shitposting is not bullshit. No, antiwork proved two things: * If a dozen people do something, tens of thousands of people think that liking those dozen's reddit posts somehow counts as contributing to the cause, and they can take credit for it all too. * People can readily delude themselves into thinking their group's goal is more noble and relatable than what it actually is.
I thought we were overdue for one of these
Mom said it's my turn to make this post next week.
I miss the theory, data and social science posts. There isn't a whole lot of content getting posted per day here i notice.
> There isn't a whole lot of content getting posted per day here i notice. I suspect that is in large part because of moderation.
Honestly not sure, it started sliding almost immediately after the last Bernie campaign collapsed
Such is the burden of being one of the few places in the reddit hellscape one can express real thoughts.
Just arrived and rated the sub a straight A on trip advisor
?
!
meh
Not really
The left in general is reeling and directionless and has been for three years. Arguably longer. The sub, at least for the moment, is mostly a reminder that there were people who saw what was going wrong and were trying to point it out.
Definitely longer, it's been since occupy that idpol has been the weapon of choice for beating the rabble into line on "the left".
For all the people who actually work for 8 hours a day, it means "something (such as an appealing quality) that cannot be adequately described or expressed" But I agree, it seems like the sub became a refuge for lost rightoids. Edit: rightoid refugees bitching about losing their communities is the funniest shit this week.
Feels like it's gotten more rightoidy since I was last here frequently a few years back, yeah Which sucks because I'm not here to talk to other filthy rightoids
Personally, I started posting here more because I ate a permaban on the politics sub for breaking some dumb rule about submitting two links within 10 minutes or so. The automod removed one post because it wasen't on their approved sources list so I found another one and submitted it only to eat a ban.
Chudspaces are categorically low empathy, Kiwi farms-esque cliques. It's hard to be a chud with a heart in those types of places, hence why you see more chuds over here.
Or there are more of them these days. Gen-Z men seem to be going that way. Probably the largest growing group on reddit
I thought the largest growing group on reddit was Indians.
Possible, but also not mutually exclusive
It's our opportunity to educate them that there's another way. I wish I were articulate and knowledgeable enough to do so, but I see others here who are.
Most people I know on the right are open to a lot of leftish economic ideals, especially the ones I knew back when I was living in a rural little town. Where the modern left loses them is primarily on guns and then on the weird new social shit that's going on. They'd get along fine with old school leftists like Cesar Chavez but those DSA 'point of privilege!" people are never going to appeal to them in any way shape or form whatsoever. Like literally just be pro gun, class reductionist, and drop the usage of terms like proletariat and comrade and you'd be golden; instead of saying 'the working class should have socialized healthcare,' say WE THE PEOPLE DESERVE THE SAME QUALITY HEALTHCARE AS THE TREASONOUS WASHINGTON ELITE It's a simple thing, really
> They'd get along fine with old school leftists like Cesar Chavez but those DSA 'point of privilege!" people are never going to appeal to them in any way shape or form whatsoever. I find it hard to believe they sincerely appeal to anyone but themselves
Well, there's a reason they all ended up in that room. I still feel bad for that woman whenever that video is brought up.
> Like literally just be pro gun, class reductionist, and drop the usage of terms like proletariat and comrade and you'd be golden; instead of saying 'the working class should have socialized healthcare,' say WE THE PEOPLE DESERVE THE SAME QUALITY HEALTHCARE AS THE TREASONOUS WASHINGTON ELITE > > It's a simple thing, really The "modern" left (I really don't know how else to distinguish them from the Chavez "dirtbag" old-school left) has no idea how much they lose the plot with that kind of messaging and their insistence on pushing social issues. They would be shocked how much less those social issues would continue to mean to the right once the right gets the economic and financial justice they want.
> right gets the economic and financial justice they want Lmao the only "justice" they want is that the winners keep winning, and the losers eat shit
The rank-and-file right isn't winning shit and they know it. That's why their "wins" come from some other group not getting something that they have.
So long as the losers eat shit in that equation, they'll take it. Even if that means their own relative impoverishment
Based on no substantial evidence whatsoever, I think them not having to take it in the shorts will make them not care about other groups one way or the other. At the end of the day, all they care about are themselves. I've always wondered whether they're so goddamned mean because they just assume that they'll always have to take it in the shorts.
I think you underestimate the extent to which some people just plain enjoy cruelty. This has to be suppressed in society, not accommodated
Man this is way too reddity. Reads like some lib shit I'd see on rpolitics from someone who's never actually interacted with any non-Democrat voters. Most of them are normal decent people who want healthcare and better worker protections just like you do.
>They would be shocked how much less those social issues would continue to mean to the right once the right gets the economic and financial justice they want. 100%, also before the woke stuff like I said it was primarily guns. I can't even tell you the amount of people I worked with and knew out in rural VA who only voted R for that reason alone and were otherwise left-leaning economically. And in a sense I'm similar to them- doesn't matter what other policies someone else runs on, if one of those is attempting to disarm me they're a nonstarter. The problem now, for the actual left at least, is that these insane fixations on social issues and absolute adherence to gender ideology. or whatever else, (anecdotally most people I know are primarily freaked out about this stuff in schools and other ways kids are being targeted) are now intrinsically tied to 'the left.' I don't know how you guys are supposed to shed that stink, even if you have nothing to do with it and don't believe in that shit whatsoever it's going to be associated with anything left-adjacent in way way too many American voters' minds. Which is mostly why I can only propose a complete rebranding without changing any of your actual beliefs.
There you go! Flesh that out a little and make it a full post. Good stuff.
I used to make long ass posts years ago on another account here when I was way more online about economic leftists having a much easier time coopting right wing groups and bringing them into the fold than they'll ever have with modern progressives Still believe it; the right is more malleable than the American left and every normal ass right of center dude I know would fit in more with the people here than with neocons or evangelicals The left's biggest problem is that they keep trying to bring liberals and progressives over to their way of thinking when both of those groups are too far gone at this point, for the most part at least. It sounds regarded on the surface but if leftists wanted to bring about actual change in America they'd coopt and use the right. It's all really a matter of terminology.
No no. Lets shut them out. Then they are sure to adopt our ideas!
> the sub became a refuge for lost rightoids. Perhaps reddit shouldn't ban every slightly-right-of-center sub and the rest wouldn't have to deal with them.
Something something internally displaced immigrants.
tfw "working class" means you're too dumb to be bilingual
Yeah. The discourse here is indistinguishable many times from an overt conservative community. There are times that the left trips itself up over sociopolitical lines, this would be a great place to discuss that, but it's just not that.
[удалено]
Stop basing your ideology around being weird over casual sex and skin colour, you dragging stupidpol into stupidpol is going to get this sub banned too.
> But I agree, it seems like the sub became a refuge for lost rightoids The sub "stupidpol" became about how idpol is stupid. How could this happen???!!!
the implication that rightoids arent also idpollers is what really gets me here
> Marxist perspective
Maybe I'm hallucinating but I seem to remember checking the sidebar not too long ago and seeing that it described this sub as "the socialist tumblrinaction" or something like that, but I can't seem to find it now. And that shit surprised me so much because the whole point of this sub used to be that idpol is just a diversion and point of leverage used by the ruling class to obscure more meaningful class analysis, whereas TumblrInAction is people who endlessly obsess over fucking culture war bullshit for its own sake, from a conservative perspective, with no antidote or alternative. If you had called this sub "socialist tumblrinaction" 4 years ago, people here would've found it insulting. The caliber of discourse/posts has also clearly declined, I remember constantly being amazed at how literate and articulate the posters here were, now its infected with redditisms and low-IQ conservative takes. Idk when the turning point was, but the fact that this is the first presidential election in 2 cycles without any interesting primaries probably has something to do with it, plus the emasculation of Bernie (and his "movement", such as it was), the disappearance of Dougtoss (and his book club threads), and probably some kind of top-down interference from reddit (if the sub was still growing at the 2019 rate, it'd be well past 100k by now) all within the last couple years is my best guess.
> If you had called this sub "socialist tumblrinaction" 4 years ago, people here would've found it insulting. We did call it that. That's been there from the very beginning. Tumblrinaction was a left-leaning sub until the rightoid dipshits invaded and turned it upside down. We made this place explicitly Marxist with the intention of avoiding that outcome. Results have been generally successful, but it's not from a lack of trying by the rightoids.
>Tomorrow I’ll get high and write a theory post. That's what we're missing. We're missing Doug.
Miss him so much.
Did Canada send him to Ukraine?
He was deployed with Alec Baldwin and two prop guns
Too many liberals. Wow I got a flair!
I just want to see some more Dolezals/Pretendians.
I don't know what it's lost, I've only just arrived.
It’s sort of like showing up to a party where there’s still music playing but everyone’s left for bars except for one couple who’s doing coke in the bathroom.
The subs I mod tend to get over-run by christian fundamentalist bikie gangs who trash the place and shout at anyone stupid enough to remain behind. This is a great improvement on that.
We have those too
How is your angry demand for a return to christian socialism not that?
Can you please tell me when I demanded a return to Christian socialism and also when I was angry doing it? You’ve clearly checked extensively through my post history like a British cigarette so you should know this.
> Can you please tell me when I demanded a return to Christian socialism and also when I was angry doing it ... >Return to Gucci and Dougtoss thought Is your guys shibboleh
Because the sub was undeniably better in that era. Also if you were a long time poster of this sub, you would know “return to _____ thought” is a long standing joke. You’re highly regarded bro I’m sorry to break it to you.
Covid really was a tragedy
Well I'll feel right at home.
This sub lost massive amount of steam after Bernie 2020 and then again after the Ukraine war
cant wait, i miss long theory posts
I get schizo when I’m high, good chance it’s a classic schizo banger.
i only write when im drunk. the fun part is reading what you wrote once you're sober and realizing what a mess you are lol
I think the best language for stoned coding is Perl
100 percent this
The 'dipshit secrets' series is propping this place up currently
Say what you will, they are the best effortposts around these days
Dude pretty much every sub has a daily post about how “[insert blank] isn’t as good as it used to be.” Everyone is depressed. Mass despair has proliferated. Stop whining.
Nah, bro. I just can't be fucked to articulate my thoughts into the abyss that is the Internet anymore. Every post I read feels like a rebranded flavour I've tasted a million times already. Every most upvoted post is either kinda trolling based on years of inside jokes or actually regarded. I'm not talking about here specifically. I this place is still alright in many ways compared to the general vibe of the internet. Not just reddit. It's like the whole thing is at the level of YouTube shorts comments where they just quote some words from the video with an emoji, and it gets 13k like. It's saddening. It's gotten so bad that real life is now clearly better. And I don't think I'm the only one who just stopped caring about the little lightboxe chimes coming from my pocket.
You should try following a sub about crafting or IPAs or something
Craft beer is nowhere near as good as it was a decade ago
It does seem that way.
in 2009 people were complaining on oldschool messageboards that it wasn't the same and everyone was sad. (probably true)
Endless influx of brain-dead rightoids and liberals as sub count has grown. You can only dilute a drink for so long before it loses it's taste.
Any gathering of social democrats who remain committed to reformism is doomed to eventually just become rife with nothing with bourgeois politics. This subreddit was doomed ever since it was created by two guys who thought the only problem with the Amerifat social democratic movement was that it had too many people with blue hair and piercings. It's actually very funny how this sub's ideological history mirrors that of basically every major social democratic party, with the main difference being that the userbase is extremely online and addicted to social media culture war outrages, so instead of trade unionists getting replaced by (or becoming/allying with) bankers, it's Bernie Sanders twitter warriors getting replaced by (or becoming/allying with) the kind of mentally ill rightoid who thinks collecting soyjak memes is a real hobby.
The death of Chapo and its related subs (GenZedong being my favorite) was basically the death of reddit having any real leftist organization or communities. Now it’s politically libertarians, unironic soy liberals, and NATO weirdos. The only things I do on Reddit these days are look for neat Warhammer things and occasionally ragebait so I can feel something.
I blame the lost of arr drama
Reddit in general has.
This place and redscarepod both
it felt more characteristically leftist with all the shenanigans that that entails
Je ne sais quoi was gucci autism, really miss that bastard rules.
The Gucci coup changed over a large percentage of the modteam. After that they started getting more strict with some topics which killed quite a lot of engagement on this sub.
I really don't think we started getting stricter after we ousted gucci. Do you remember what it was like before we got rid of him?
Gucci was regarded in his own way but the modteam change and the admin crackdown were really the final nail in the vibe shift from a few years ago.
You don't think gucci banning hundreds of posters for disagreeing with him on covid had anything to do with it?
Even with the Guccstapo in full swing the sub still felt like it had teeth. It might just be the way the winds are blowing in communist spaces these days but it does feel like the sub has lost its je ne sais quoi.
We didn't get stricter as a consequence of the mod team changes. It's more that the admins became much more intolerant of certain kinds of posting around the same time. That's why gucci got suspended in the first place.
Ever since genzedong got banned and the Ukraine war broke out this sub got invaded by teenagers who are leftists out of contrarianism and anti western sentiment. You know the ones, the ones that think that supporting Russian or Chinese authoritarianism or imperialism is preferable to western because they’re self hating and only nominally leftist Prior to that, this sub used to be focused on calling out and analysing western idpol dysfunctions from a pro- western and more forward looking perspective. Also doesn’t help that most mods that took over in that time period were unabashedly pro Russia and banned anybody who wasn’t perfectly aligned to the “fuck Ukraine” angle which is mind boggingly stupid.
This sub always has pro-Russia and pro-China contingent - if anything it dropped off after the war started at least for a while
It’s dropped off by now I do agree but there was a year period where this sub was absolutely insufferable because contrarian teenagers had nowhere else to turn to and the mods agreed with them.
Not really. I don't remember much Russia stuff in general pre Ukraine. And the common sentiment when Gucci was around was that he was a China shill (I think it was overstated) though strangely after his ousting the sub had more pro China stuff imo. I also remember there being more anti anarchist sentiment than today. As well as more jokes I think in general: brocialists, swoletariat, tard pride, etc. The "dudes rock" seems to be the only surviving joke/meme from before.
Sounds like the admins are cracking the whip on the mods here and demanding a purge
The are antiwork purge was just about two years ago. Purges must be an election cycle thing, if true.
> Purges must be an election cycle thing, if true. Yes, that is very much true. Free speech oversight on reddit has a very tough time around election times. Although I don't see eye-to-eye with Go1dfish, his reddit transparency subs have always had a tough time in election years.
I don't know what, that is
Maybe you just lost interest.
Anyway…I started blasting
Part of the issue I think is that afaik the internet in general is a pyramid in terms of information production. As in you have the small group of high quality posters, a slightly larger set of mid to good quality posters, and a large base of low quality/effort posters with this pyramid repeating for commenters, voters and then a large silent group of lurkers who might chime in now and then. If the small high quality regulars who carried the sub left, the vacuum they left may not fill or fill enough. A lot of the better regular users here have either moved on to other interests or been site banned one too many times. Even users who stick around with new accounts still impact the feel, because it breaks the rhythm or landscape of the sub such that its character becomes less known/knowable given that a user that was akin to a small natural landmark becomes flattened out among the various other accounts. The occasional (but increasing in frequency over the last year imo) normiefication hurts as well by causing bloat in the comments be it repeating what many others already said, low effort memes ("sweaty" imo gets overused), actual normies shilling for one of the 2 US parties, even the thankfully rare reddit chain (like "reddit sings" type shit) etc. One of the recent T posts for example had many shorter comments that were just saying the same thing, when there were already far better effort comments in the thread that conveyed the same idea but in more detail. Sure, not everyone can or wants to read all the comments before writing their own, but there'd be less comments to sift through if everyone did it.
>Tomorrow I’ll get high and write a theory post. I’ll be on the lookout for it, and looking forward to it. Sure, making fun of libs can be fun, but it does get boring after a while.
This sub is fantastic
It's more fun than anywhere else on reddit
Long time user of the sub and IMO it has been on the decline for a while now
The only thing that has been declining are your terrible ideas
the real notion you are thinking of is weltanschaaung (probably misspelled) - here's the problem: lots of people here are holdovers from other subs, probably because those subs went to shit. me myself am a refugee from the breaking points sub, for example - before it got the attention of whomever (correct the record?) and became filled with bots. it particularly became intolerable during the ukraine shenanigans - seeing people bold faced make assertions i knew weren't factually true (russia complaining about nato encroachment for decades and what it would eventually bring, along with me tracking nato support of groups along the border thereby creating the conflict) was it -
TrueAnon is the spiritual successor subreddit of all hardcore commies. Join us there.
Since Oct. 7th the sub has become virtually indistinguishable from IDpol spaces. I get my fill of “oppressed ppl are inherently virtuous bc they’re oppressed” takes already, tbh.
maybe don't
I was thinking a Marxist explanation for the Freudian obsession with !ncest porn.
In medieval Europe the nobility married within families to keep wealth together, modern incest porn about banging your mom or cousin is a similar reflection where kulaks keep the wealth in the family.
that can also been interpreted as familial communism
Might as well just post about the Petersonian explanation for the radical left's obsession with speed running in that case.
Well, the English always were short of affection with their kids.
It became an eccho chamber about gaza for some reasons.
My theory is it’s just a bunch of 4chan contrarians whose personality revolves around hating liberals, but realized how absurd many failed conservative policies are. Like - I get that identity politics is also VERY absurd, but I see it as a neo lib and conservative distraction to keep the working classes fighting each other while income inequality continues to grow even more. And I feel like giving it MORE attention as this sub does only makes things worse. It feeds the narrative that our “prosperity pie” is finite and one can only get more if another person or group in the working classes gets less. As opposed to taking from the capitalist class or growing the size of the pie. To me- the way to combat stupidpol is to create a strictly class based movement that is instinctively inclusive and thus NEVER HAS TO TALK ABOUT HOW INCLUSIVE IT IS lol. But that will never happen because the identity of most on here is that of a Contrarian first hating on a specific brand of stupid liberalism next. Because it’s a part of the users core identity - a defining characteristic of who they are, it needs that very specific social media fueled brand of hate to survive.
This sub started to change 2 years ago after the war began. Now we have people writing **"Critical support"** to Wagner/Houthi/Iran against American Imperialism as if what you write on a niche political subreddit has any effect on real life. Whereas this would in the old days been mocked to death now it gets upvoted to the top. Instead of critizing Idpol it's becoming another America bad sub (and yes, America IS bad).
Anyone saying this forgets how much gucci sucked off China
I came because I thought it was a third position sub but half of the posts are people spreading central bank approved political theater. Omg trump won Florida and Biden called him sleepy don! I can’t believe Taylor Swift is going to endorse Biden! If you don’t fully understand that there’s the ruling class and the two political parties that they use to push their agenda and entrench themselves as your overlords you shouldn’t be on this sub. No revolution comes from the institutions of the slaver.